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Council Present: Cole, Mims, Salih, Teague, Taylor, Thomas, Throgmorton
Staff Present: Fruin, Monroe, Andrew, Dilkes, Fruehling, Knoche, Havel, Reichart,
Sovers, Bockenstedt, Hightshoe, Bollinger, Ralston
Others Present: Lenkaitis (UISG)
Discuss Request for Resolution Endorsing the Energy Innovation and Carbon Dividends
Act IP3 :
Throgmorton/ So I think I should probably say a few words about this for the benefit of
whoever's watching on television, and maybe some people in the audience. So we
received a request to endorse the Energy Innovation and Carbon Dividends Act, which is,
um, House Resolution 763. We received this request from Jamie McCoy, who was
writing on behalf of the Iowa City Chapter of Citizens Climate Lobby. So Jamie
reminded us that almost two years ago we adopted a resolution calling on Congress to put
in place a carbon fee and dividend program. He also indicated that computer modeling,
uh, reveals that high .... House Resolution 76.....763, the Act that we're .... we will be
discussing, would mark a significant step toward carbon -free economy, while also
stimulating economic growth. It would place a progressively rising fee on carbon fuels
and return the revenue to households as monthly dividends. So Congressional
negotiations have resulted in this new bill, HR763, and the new bill includes several
differences from the one we endorsed back in 2017. So we're being asked to endorse
House Resolution 763. Uh, I think you know I strongly believe we need.... such, uh, such
legislation, primarily because I don't see how we can achieve our 2050, Iowa City's 2050
goal, without something.... without the federal government enacting something like this
bill. Uh.... beyond that I think we've all now had a chance to read the written material
from Jamie, and I know, Susan, you asked us to defer so that we could have a chance to
do that. So, whatda y'all think about the request?
Mims/ I'm happy to support it. I think ifs .... what I find interesting is there's bipartisan support
in the Congress, which is unusual these days. Um, so hopefully we can get some things
done. I think it gives us a .... a different model to try and address, uh, some of the climate
concerns that we have and hopefully one that will, uh, really provide some of that
motivation and incentive for some of those changes. So ... I think there's, you know,
there's going to be a lot of details to work out. This is ... this is complex. There's lots of
moving parts to it. Um, but I think it certainly is a .... is a good process and, uh, with the
number of people, different political backgrounds that are working on it, and I'm really
happy to support it.
Taylor/ I agree and I think the aspect of it, uh, about simu... stimulating the economic growth, uh,
with the dividends returning to the individuals, I think is ... is, uh, very, uh, good point.
Teague/ I think the dividends returned to the individual, that was good but I was a little worried
about the impact upfront. Um, and so I think with ... you know, the dividends returning,
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that made me very comfortable. Um, I think I would agree with the Mayor when he says
that, um, in order for us to achieve our climate action goals, we're gonna have to get some
help from the federal government, and so endorsin' this I think is the right step for
Council to do, and so I'm definitely in support of it.
Salih/ I agree too, yeah. Since we have goal for 2050, we need to, like some kind of support
from the higher level so we can achieve our goal too. Yeah. (mumbled) support it.
Thomas/ Yeah, I support it as well and um, it seems like this .... this area of legislation is still
evolving, um, as we're seeing there were changes from when we approved the previous
version. I was looking at some of the, uh, presidential campaigns, and it's still somewhat
open-ended, as far as what candidates are supporting. Um, but I suspect this is, you
know, this is moving in the right direction. I think at this time it's a good thing to
support.
Cole/ I agree, and we've been very careful as a Council to sort of pick and choose which sort of
state and federal and international issues we get involved with, but I think this is a perfect
one for us to be able to support in terms of that, at that level of the resolution. I think the
proponents have done an incredible amount locally in terms of ground work and reaching
out to us individually. I know I've gotten a lot of phone calls from Jamie. Haven't
responded to all of 'em but .... been callin' a lot. Uh, and in the past, uh, we've had a lot of
good conversations on that. So I think this is precisely the sort of, uh, thing that we
should be supporting, because Jim's right, we're not gonna achieve what we need to
achieve, not without the help of both the state and federal government.
Throgmorton/ Very good! Sounds like we have a unanimous judgment about this. So could we
ask our staff to put together a resolution for us, based partly on what Jamie's submitted to
us and maybe partly on the one we adopted back in 2017. Y'all figure that out, and....
we'll move from there!
Fruin/Yes!
Clarification of Agenda Items:
Throgmorton/ Okay, super! So we can, uh.... congratulations, Jamie! Thanks for your hard work
on this. So we can move ahead to the next, uh, part of our work session agenda, which is
clarification of agenda items.
91 Lucy Barker & Salina McCarty: Houses Into Homes' request
9.j. Houses Into Homes: Shannon Hammen Miner, Tia Perez, Natasha Wendt
Salih/ Uh, Item number .... 9.i. and j. It is a request from House Into Home for immediate grant
of $25,000 to support their work. I just wanna know that should we just talk about this
now or pull it out of the agenda or .... how this work?
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Throgmorton/Well it's.... it's just a communication requesting funding. So we can't formally act
on it. But we can (both talking) indicate if there's something we wanna do, like support
them (both talking)
Salih/ ...sure, that's really what I'm asking, I wanna see if there's support from the Council, so we
can give the City Manager to write a letter of recommendation or whatever the process is.
Throgmorton/ Well, they've certainly done their homework, and they've certainly worked pretty
hard in getting letters supporting their request for some initial funding. Uh, but I think
we need to hear from Geoff, uh, about .... what staff thinks in terms of the request.
Fruin/ Sure, urn .... so ..... uh, our staff has been in conversations with Houses Into Homes for, uh,
some time right now. Um, we're having active discussions with them to see if we can
obtain some waste diversion funds, so our Landfill and Recycling staff is working with
them and .... and while we don't have anything firm right now, we're optimistic that we
maybe able to access, uh, some, uh, state grant dollars, uh, for the mattress recycling
effort, uh, which again would be waste diversion, so part of what they do, obviously,
keeps, uh, products out of the landfill, uh, which aligns with our goals and hopes with
that operation. Um, we think, uh, what maybe possible thereabout $10,000 and we'll
continue to work towards that. We think, uh, we think that would be a .... they would be a
worthwhile partner in our waste diversion efforts. You know, periodically throughout
(sighs) throughout the year we'll get funding requests like this at the staff level. I'm sure
you probably get it in .... in just day-to-day Council interactions, uh, from non-profit
agencies, and there is no shortage of non-profit agencies in .... in this community that
could use additional funding, be it for staff or be it for .... for some operational purposes.
Uh, at a staff level, we .... we funnel those through the Aid to Agencies process, and
you've been through the Aid to Agencies process a number of times. You know it's
extremely competitive and that there's always pressure to increase those funds or increase
the number of people, uh, receiving those funds. Over the years, uh, you've taken action,
you've created emerging, in, emerging funds, you've set aside some of those for .... for
new organizations, to help get them started. Uh, this past year you doubled the Aid to
Agencies budget, uh, so that there were more funds to access. I don't personally like, um
.....going one-off requests like this. I don't think that's a good practice for us to be in,
because you're going to get a lot of requests, if you don't already hear those already, you
certainly will from other agencies, again who do great work, just like Houses Into
Homes, um, but that, uh, but that could use additional dollars, whether it's to keep their
doors open or to expand operations or whatever the case may be. So, um, that ... that
would be my .... my caution to you is .... is you need to consider what the precedent is that
you're setting with this, and you need to....to think about, um, how that is, um, how that's
received by those agencies, that .... that go through a very detailed, thorough process in
your Aid to Agencies program, where they have to justify their needs every year and
report and have Commissioners visit their site. Um....they.... they go through a lot to
access those funds and, um .... for other agencies to come in and just access them without
going through that process, uh, is, urn .... would raise some questions. If you decide you
do want to fund them, um, I encourage you to use existing revenue sources, and you've
heard this from me before, so I would, um, first tum your attention to our affordable
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housing dollars. Uh, with our new, um, disbursement model that .... that you approved
several months ago. There was a set-aside for opportunity funds, and based on the
current affordable housing budget that you .... you have this fiscal year of a million
dollars, I believe it's $75,000 are .... are set aside for those opportunity funds and those
were really left undefined and ... and, uh, for Council to ... to determine how .... how really
you want to do that. Those were kind of the .... meant to address, um, situations that come
up throughout the year that ... that, um, maybe we haven't been able to address as well as
you would have liked in years past. So if you decide to go down that path, I would
encourage you to look at those opportunity funds and draw down those first before you
move to reserves or contingency funds.
Salih/ Have they apply for anything or get anything before from us or...
Fruin/ Uh, I believe that they've received either emergency funds or climate action. (both
talking) They have.... small $5,000 climate action grant they've received.
Cole/ I .... I guess my ... oh, go ahead! Maz.
Salih/ I just wanna say that, you know, uh.... I don't like the idea that we can take from affordable
housing for this. There is many money sources that .... as a city manager you can approve
up to 25,000, right, without even .... coming back to us? Is that true?
Fruin/ Yes.
Salih/ And how much is your budget now left for the year? Do you have that 25 there? (both
talking) Like from (mumbled) approve, uh, like some money for anyone, like more
than ... less than 25,000, where that money come from? You have a budget? I ... I don't
remember.
Fruin/ Well there's a number of different line items that you may be thinkin' o£ We have, uh, like
a sponsorship budget, for example, that we usually do 2 or 3,000 sponsorships. If you
have a .... a conference coming into town or you have a special event and we get asked for
that, we have some discretionary dollars there. Um, the larger pot that you may be
thinking of is the economic development discretionary funds. Um, and we use those, uh,
and .... and that kinda goes thru the EDC process. We've used those for business support,
um, and for arts and culture events, uh, so for example at the last EDC meeting there was
consideration for a .... a new film festival in town, and those dollars were really
specifically designed for .... those events that bring in tourism and support businesses
directly that the non-profit support pot is really all that Aid to Agencies, those Aid to
(both talking)
Salih/ Yeah, I understand that (mumbled) but now this is come after the Aid to Agency, you
know.
Fruin/ Correct.
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Salib/ This is something like come suddenly, not been planned for maybe. And that's why I
thinks we, there is many other sources.
Fruin Yeah, you (both talking)
Salih/ ...besides affordable housing.
Fruin/ You can use (both talking)
Salih/ ...that we can take out, and there is saving. We have a lot thing. I really don't like the idea
that we ... each time we need something we have to take it from affordable housing, as if
that's not item very ...good thing that to save for.
Fruin/ Well the reason I suggest that is obviously this impacts the quality of housing that .... that
people have and you have a discretionary pot of money, uh, for affordable housing. So I
think it's a natural fit, but clearly you can choose to use general fund reserves or
contingency dollars.
Mims/ (several talking) I guess before we even talk about a source of funding, I think we need to
talk about are we willing to do that, and .... and I'm really concerned, um, you know, about
the process. We .... we have a very specific process in place for non -profits through the
Aid to Agency application, and I think, you know, as Geoff alluded to, one of the things
that's really important about that is we've got a whole commission that looks at a fairly
detailed application about what the agency is doing, what the services are, you know,
what their funding is, you know, etc., how they're doing things; high, intermediate, low
need, etc., and ranks them and then makes those determinations. And so for me, I look at
this and yeah, there's like eight or nine letters of support, but .... there is absolutely
no .... real detail, you know, in terms of...yeah, there's some numbers of how many they've
served, etc., but not the sa.... it doesn't allow us, nor do ... are we taking the time, I think, to
do the kind ... same kind of analysis that is done through the Aid to Agencies, and so one, I
think it's important that it go through that process so it gets the same kind of vetting that
all the other non -profits do. Secondly, I'm really concerned, and ... and Geoff mentioned
this, we have .... we have more non -profits in this community than we can possibly ever
fund, and a lot of them are doing a lot of really, really good work. And I think by taking
a .... a one-off application like this, that doesn't follow the other procedures that we have
in place, one sets us up for, uh, a lot of applications out of the Aid to Agencies sequence,
and number two, I think allows for, urn .... some very unfair decisions, and certainly the
perception of unfair decisions by other non -profits. Take a non-profit who, you know,
last year went through that Aid to Agencies process or is going to go through it again this
year and doesn't get money, and then like, wait a minute, how'd you just drop 25 grand on
an agency that didn't even go through the same due diligence process that we went
through, but we didn't get anything. Um ... and I also think in looking at the letters, I'm
concerned that there's .... and I .... and I've talked to some of you. Maz, you and I talked
about this at the listening post. I know, Bruce, you and I have talked about this. I'm
really concerned about.... the.... the increased number of non -profits in our community
without .... any kind of coordination of who's doing what and how much overlap there is
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and how they're being funded, how much is being spent on, um, like executive directors
or overhead or .... I think .... we need to do that. There's not unlimited amounts of
resources, whether it's volunteers, public money, or private money. So while I think
they've been doing great work, I think the timing is wrong and I think the procedure is
wrong. I think the timing, it ... to me it needs to go through the Aid to Agencies process,
and we somehow have to get on our calendar a mechanism to do an evaluation of the
non -profits in our community and how they are coordinating their efforts, so we're being
as efficient pro... as possible with all of our resources.
Throgmorton/ So John.... John and I met with, uh, Lucy Barker and Salina McCarty about this
topic, I don't know, two weeks ago, John?
Thomas/ Yeah.
Throgmorton/ Roughly, yeah, and .... as a part of that conversation, I said basically the same
things you've been saying, Susan, that ... but I also said send us a request. We'll see what
the Council chooses to do, cause I didn't wanna say yes or no cause I don't have the
power (laughs) to say yes or no. Uh, but ... I did make it very clear that ... there's a process
we want agencies to go through and this is outside the process, and therefore that's...
there's gotta (laughs) be some really special reason why ...why we would, uh, provide an
exception basically for this.
Cole/ But of course we have done individualized funding and terminations of other non -profits to
the tune of a million dollars. So, um, so this notion that every non-profit goes through the
same, I .... I don't think is necessarily true. There's the Aid to Agency. I view this as
economic development, because I view when we have low access, a low barrier to entry
for homes, these are future employees. So I don't .... this could fit under the Aid to
Agencies label, but in my view this is absolutely economic development, um, because
we're helping provide, and they are helping to provide, furniture for people whose homes
are empty of any furniture at all, and I think that they have made their case. In terms of
the source of funding, I think ultimately it'll probably be a decision for the next Council,
but I guess my recommendation would be a preliminary recommendation that staff
further investigate possible funding sources at the level of 25,000, subject to the next
Council's review on that. So I .... I think we should support it. Um, I think we do need to
be as consistent as possible, but on the other hand I think that they've made their case and
I think it is a particularly urgent issue that they're dealing with, um, in terns of low cost.
I mean there's a lot of people right now watching hopefully on the TV, um, but don't have
any furniture in their homes, at all. Um, and it's .... it is a crisis and we talk about
emergency funds, um, whether it's emergency fund or whatever, I think it is an
emergency and I think we should at least make that preliminary recommendation, subject
to (both talking)
Throgmorton/ Pauline, John, whatda ya think?
Teague/ I wanna make a comment about this (clears throat) So, you know, I hear what Susan is
sayin', and I agree that there is a process that, you know, we should be hold ... behold our
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agencies to, but like what .... what Rockne just said, there's a lot of agencies that haven't
gone through that process. Beside that point, I really believe that we're looking at the
human dignity of people within our community, right now today. That we cannot wait
until July or whatever, you know, the case, um, may be. Right now as a Council we're
bein' asked to support the mission of this agency. I 101 % supportit. When you go out
and you find children layin' on the floor, without a bed, that's basic need. Sleep is
essential, and so for me I think that it is somethin' that Council should jump to, cautiously
(laughs) but still jump to and support, and I understand there might be other people with
other thought processes about this, but, um, about other agencies that is doin' this, but
right now we have the opportunity to help this one agency, Houses Into Homes. If you've
ever gone out, which I've done, and go into a house that's empty, it....it changes your life!
So for me I am definitely supportive of it, and I don't the ... I'm not gonna, uh, promote the
contingency on another council. I'm gonna, uh, maybe make the proposal, which I ... I
guess we have to get onto a future council to, um, even, you know, put it on the next
agenda, is what I would propose, so that we can figure out where 25,000 come from.
Taylor/ Well I .... I agree with Susan as far as ... and that was my first impression when I read this
request, uh, was that the process was kind of backwards and, uh, why didn't they go
through the process. We didn't really wanna set a precedent, uh, with one group versus
another, but the more I thought about this particular group of, uh.... uh, non -profits, their
mission is a little bit different than I think some of the agencies that apply for the Aid to
Agency funds are. Um, as Bruce mentioned, the human dignity part of it and getting
furniture for the folks, uh, and .... it also I think has some very positive aspects as far as
Geoff had mentioned, there are other means that .... that we could look at as far as the,
uh.... uh, waste diversion funds and the mattress diversion, uh, those kinds of things. We
can help them, uh, get those funds. We wouldn't necessarily maybe have to do 25,000,
but at least help them out with .... with getting those kinds of funds too.
Thomas/ Well I, um, as Jim mentioned, uh.... he and I both met with .... with, um, you know, Lucy
and, uh (both talking) Salina and while I certainly would prefer that this be handled
through our process, uh, I was really impressed with the organization. I was, uh, I felt
they had identified a need and fulfilled it, that I didn't even know existed. Uh, and they're
doing it, you know, with all the support documentation in a way that, um, is
extraordinary. They modeled their organization after, uh, one they had found in
Minneapolis. I mean I really felt they understood what they were getting into, and they
had a ... a gap in their finances. Uh, and .... you know, it seemed to me a .... a small bet to
make, uh, that serves, you know, an important need. Uh, they had I think an
extraordinary range of support, including from some of the groups and agencies,
organizations, that are funded through our Aid to Agencies. So, uh, that too I thought,
you know, this... yeah, I don't know that the precedent aspect of this is .... is that critical. I
mean I think we as a council have the ability to evaluate.... proposals as they come to us
and decide whether or not they're acceptable or not and how they affect our overall
process, urn ... but, yeah, I .... I think foremost I was just really impressed with what they
were doing and how they presented their proposal.
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Salih/ I just wanna ask one thing. You know, I don't know if you guys have a first hand
experience with the people who receiving the furniture. I do! And I know how happy
those people are when they get like bed for their children and how happy the children
were, and you know this .... this project is really amazing project, uh, and I thinks
we .... we, I understand that they just come out of the blue to ask for this. There is, uh, no,
like for the Aid to Agency has already passed and everything, but sometime we have to
look at the value of the project itself, when it suddenly come. This is not gonna be the
last project. We're gonna (unable to understand) sometime, but we have to look at that
something we really to just do it because it have a lot of meaning, as Rockne said like
economic development and social justice and all this kind of things. Uh, I really
definitely support it and support the whole 25,000 (unable to understand) from the
economic development fund.
Cole/ So I will agree with Bruce's position in terms of the timing of it. Um, I had talked about
not wanting to tie the future council's hands, um, but I think you have persuaded me,
Bruce, in terms of the urgency of it, so I would second Bruce's position.
Throgmorton/ So it's clear that there's support for providing 25,000 in funding, but, Rockne, in
your first statement you suggested that we, um, direct staff to come up with suggestions
about how to provide that 25,000 in funding, right?
Cole/ I still think that would be a good idea, yeah.
Throgmorton/ So, uh.... uh, that makes sense to me, because you've already identified.... some
potential sources of funding, which, uh, could amount to, I don't know, 10,000 or so. But
in any event, I'm clearly hearing support for.
Teague/ I know (both talking) affordable housing, but I would be .... I think this would be a great
opportunity.
Salih/ This economic development. This have nothing to do (both talking)
Teague/ (laughing) Okay! Okay!
Salih/ Is really killing me when people take from affordable housing and we are not doing
affordable housing yet. There is many .... this only 25,000! You can find (both talking)
many sources of that, and (unable to understand) for that too (both talking)
Throgmorton/ ... why .... why don't, let's defer that debate to some future time, but right now we're
deciding, yes, we want to provide 25,000 in funding to this particular organization,
Houses Into Homes, and, Bruce, I was really impressed with the description you just
provided... about why this matters, from sort of a moral, ethical point of view, and that's
(mumbled)
Mims/ I'd like to make one .... final comment, because I .... I truly believe that .... (sighs) I truly
believe that as a council .... to do our work effectively and fairly .... we have to have
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procedures in place that we have agreed on that make sense and we ... and that we follow.
And ... and I'm not sure who you were talking about, Rockne, if I might ask, who got a
million dollars.
Cole/ No, I'm not gonna publicly identify other non -profits, but in terms of capital projects with a
TIF, I ... I mean so I don't (both talking)
Mims/ ...went through a process, I mean that ... that wasn't an Aid to Agencies process (both
talking)
Cole/ ...sitting on the Economic Development Committee, we have seen requests from non-
profits for appropriations, um, that did not go through Aid to Agencies. They were non-
profits, and so I'm saying is as between the two, if we're talking about arts, entertainment,
which I'm very supportive of and I'm very -but then we're talking about putting beds and
furniture in people's homes, I think in terms of our priorities, our priorities should lie
there first, um, as opposed to those.
Mims/ Okay, but my point is in both cases we have a process (both talking)
Salih/ (mumbled)
Mims/ ...we have a process for them to approach us either through economic development, and
we have done things because we believe that some of those non -profits really impact our
economic development, arts, entertainment, etc., and we have our Aid to Agencies, but in
both cases, we have processes that we use .... to, and I think that's important. I think the
more we deviate from those, I think the....as I said earlier, I think the more the potential
for us to be unfair and for agencies to feel like we're being unfair that they're not getting
the same opportunity. I don't feel that the same kind of, urn .... review and due diligence
of what that organization is doing is taking place. It's being based on, you know, a single
letter and in a num .... from them and then obviously the letters of support, but certainly
not the same kind of due diligence that is done through the Aid to Agencies process. Is
the work they're doing important? Yes. Is it more important than others? I .... I would bet
that Prelude, who's dealing with people who are on the verge of dying of. ... of, uh, drug
issues or Shelter House who is dealing with homeless people who are still homeless, um,
and are not getting housed and are not getting furniture, urn .... so to say that this is the
most important one and is critical, I think is .... is insulting to a lot of the other (both
talking)
Teague/ I'm actually insulted by you right now. Because what you're saying is that our decision
that we've made, as Council Members, is saying to other agencies that they don't matter,
and that's not what we're saying. What... that's what I feel. It ... right now I feel it's
insulting that you're.... we've made a decision as a Council to move forward, given Geoff
direction. I understand you want to make one last plea, you know, to state for the record
that as Council, you're right. We're about processes. I would agree! But at some point
we have to go with what our heart says. That may not be all in agreement, and we may
be outvoted. Sometimes where our heart really feels a certain way. But allow Council to
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make a decision and don't come back and make us feel bad about that, decision. This is a
great opportunity. For the people in our community.
Sahh/ (several talking) I see clear support for this. Many times when I speak after people
support you ask me to say, hey, Maz, I see clear support. Let's move on. So ... please, let's
move on here because it .... I will (unable to understand) people have a decision, we
should move on, because you told me that before. (both talking)
Mims/ ...spoken afterwards (several talking)
9.c. Steven Rohrbach: 2021 IECC Proposal — CE264-19 Zero Code Renewal Energy
Appendix [staff response included]
Throgmorton/ ...get into this too deeply. So, uh, I think you've been very clear, Susan, about
your view on that point, and others have expressed their views as well. So ... we can move
on. So, other agenda items? I wanna mention something that connects to the climate
action work. So another piece of correspondence, Item 9.c., which pertains to an email
from Steve Rohrbach concerning the 2021 International Energy .. IECC, whatever that
acronym stands for. It's a .... it's a zero code renewable energy appendix, but this is a way
of...coming up with, uh.... um, international energy standards that... typically eventually
get applied in the state of Iowa, adopted by the state of Iowa. So anyhow, Steve
Rohrbach, uh, says we're urging that this certain appendix be applied, which would en...
would enable states to adopt state energy codes that give local jurisdictions the discretion
to adopt zero energy standards. And that matters, and I ... if I remember right, Geoff,
we've already signed on to that, or at least I know we exchanged some emails about that,
and signed on to it in terms (both talking)
Frain/ I believe that's the case. I'd have to double check (both talking) Staff is certainly plugged
in to those conversations and we do have votes on those matters. So...
Throgmorton/ Yeah, that's a better way to put it. But I wanna praise Steve Rohrbach, in any
event.
9.k. Greg Shill: Dangerous, possibly unlawful obstruction of wheelchair users and
other people [staff response included]
9.1. Donald Baxter (0): Burlington and Madison Pedestrian Crossing Concerns
Thomas/ I had (clears throat) some questions on 91. and 9.1. on the Burlington, Madison
intersection. Um, Geoff, what .... what's the status on that? I'm looking at the photos that
were included in the submittal. You know, the pedestrian accommodations were ... were
pretty compromised. So I (both talking)
Frain /This is, uh, Jason, this is the Burlington, Madison fence that was put up for the University
project.
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Havel/ Yeah, so this .... these messages were in response to the traffic control at the Burlington,
Madison intersection. It's related to work on University projects. So we've reached out
to them, um, visited the site, taken a look at things, and it certainly looks like there's, um,
some additional signage that's needed. I think what you were seeing in some of those
pictures are people that are choosing to go around the fencing that's in place, so we're
hoping to get some additional signage, get some additional measures up there to help
them get through that area correctly. Uh.... um ... the area in question is going to be, uh,
dug up here shortly if it hasn't already. Um, there's some storm sewer work and some
additional work that has to happen right at that intersection. Typically we like to keep
those, um, curb ramps and the curb ramp areas open so that all four corners are
accessible. In this case it's just not feasible. U, due to the depth and the location of the
work they need to do, we're gonna have to close that .... that, um, quadrant of the
intersection. Uh, unfortunately it's in an area where it's pretty difficult with pedestrians,
just given what we have for other crossings, you kn ow, especially just to the west of
there you have the river and so it's .... we're workin' through that, but um, we're in contact
with the University. Their, uh, design consultant has sent out additional information,
requirements to the contractor, so we're hopeful that that signage will be up here shortly.
Throgmorton/ We definitely need better signage. I was down there earlier this afternoon and
while I was standing at the corner, the northeastern corner of that intersection, two young
women came up and they were talking about how to get across the street and how to walk
down the sidewalk, and one of them started laughing, ran out in the street, and walked on
that really narrow strip of concrete that runs on the southern edge of the sidewalk going
west, you know, the north sidewalk going west. The other woman stayed back and was
saying no, I'm gonna go the way they want us to go (laughs) but we need to have better
signage (both talking)
Havel/ Yeah, and one .... some of the feedback we've given to them is to actually have detours out
there so it will direct people, based on their destination of choice, which direction they
should be going, cause it is a little confusing. You kind of get off ..sort of off the beaten
path a little bit. It's tough to tell if you're actually going the right way or not. So
hopefully here in the very near future there'll be much more signage to help people with
their directions.
Thomas/ What I've often seen is, you know, where you have this sort of work being done, and...
is that the .... if ...if you have a parking lane you convert the parking lane to a, you know,
pedestrian flow, uh, with .... with barriers to protect it, and we don't have parking, but in
this case, taking a travel lane. You know, if you're working in the area that would
normally be used for pedestrian circulation, if that's taken out of commission, provide
....provide that detour, but it's not .... it's consistent with the, you know, what would
normally be used for pedestrian circulation, and protect it with a barrier, uh, but
sometimes, I mean, if the detours are too .... too much (laughs) of a detour, you know,
people aren't going to comply with it.
Havel/ And we had looked at that (mumbled) The concern that's there is there's going to be a fair
amount of trucks coming in and out, and I think there was some concerns with having to
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cross truck traffic with pedestrians (mumbled) unsafe situation there. So it was
something that we had looked at and I think in this situation we just didn't feel it was the
best solution.
Information Packet Discussion (October 17, October 24, October 311:
Tbrogmorton/ Any other questions for Jason? On this topic. Thanks! Any other agenda items?
Okay, I'm not hearing any. So let's turn to the information packets. How bout the
October 17 packet. Was ... it was pretty light.
Mims/ Climate Action Expo, uh, November 21st, 5:30 at Big Grove.
Throgmorton/ Yeah, so ... um, Ashley, can you give us a quick synopsis of what's gonna happen at
the Expo? Come on! Spur of the moment! (laughs)
Monroe/ Um, so the Expo is going to be a great opportunity to, uh, celebrate, I think, what steps
come next. So next week we'll release our 100 -day report to Council and uh, so we'll talk
a little bit about that at the Expo, but also have, uh, speakers from the City and from the
community, and uh, everything from non-profit agencies to, uh, business to provide, um,
just some context about what has been done so far and what projects or programs or
initiatives kind of lay ahead for everybody and, uh, engage the public in further ways that
they can get connected, either through services that are provided by the City or other
agencies, um, and people might want to sign up for an energy audit at their home, those
kinds of things, and then enjoy some nice food, urn .... that we'll provide. We'll provide
the food!
Throgmorton/ Will net zero carbon beer be made available? (laughter) It's a joke! Never mind!
(laughs) Okay. Uh, any other items on that .... uh, info packet?
Taylor/ IP2, it was nice to see the email from Mark Signs acknowledging recognition by the
Iowa Chapter of the American Planning Association for our affordable housing action
plan. And so kudos to staff for ...making that plan.
Throgmorton/ Okay! Let's move on to the October 24th packet. I wanna mention IP #4, is an
ard.... two articles or whatever, concerning our new Community Outreach Assistant,
Daisy Tones, uh, and then there was a headline article in, what, The Daily Iowan? Yeah.
So, yeah! Um .... welcome aboard, Daisy, if you're watching (laughs) I mean it's really
exciting that you're joining us. Daisy, for those of you who don't know, is a 22 -year-old
Spanish-speaking grad from the University of Iowa, who majored in criminology. Uh,
she's from Chicago, I think. So, uh, I really look forward to meeting her. Uh, I think
Captain Denise Brotherton has arranged a meeting... thanks to Geoff s help, for me with
Daisy. So I'm looking forward to talking with her and learning a little bit more about her.
Salih/ Yeah, I would like ... I was trying to do the same thing. (mumbled) Iowa City Police
Department. Yeah.
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Throgmorton/ Yeah. Any other items on the 24th packet?
Salih/ The (mumbled) IP .... IP5? No, that's 31 st. I'm sorry. (several talking) Yeah, sorry. Yeah.
Throgmorton/ Okay, we wanna move ahead to the October 31st packet. The Halloween packet!
I wanna ask John a question, with regard to IP #4, which is .... has to do with the pending
work session topics. The second item, you know, is consider a plan for rubberized
surfacing at park playgrounds. I think you were the person who asked to have that on the
pending work session list. Do you still want it to be there?
Thomas/ Well I .... has any .... any discussion taken place with say the Parks Commission on ... on
that item?
Fruin/ Yes, I think, uh, I think Juli's ready for that discussion when the Council is. The Parks
Commission, uh, I think it was July or August had some deliberations on it.
Thomas/ Okay.
Throgmorton/ Okay. So much for that.
Fruin/ You want us to remove that? Or do you want us to schedule that?
Throgmorton/ Well I guess we could just keep it on there until we have that discussion, or until
the Council.... yeah. Okay, uh, IP 45, on the October 31 st packet. That's, uh, has to do
with the memo about speed limits on Dubuque Street. So I know staff needs direction
about this, uh.... would you or Jason....
Council Direction needed on the following items: 1. (10/31) IP5 - Memo from
Transportation Planner and City Engineer: Dubuque Street Speed Limit:
Fruin /I think Kent or Jason (both talking) prepared to walk you through the memo and the
analysis that they performed.
Ralston/ Yeah, good evening, Kent Ralston, Transportation Planner. Uh, just for ...by way of
some background, uh, at your August 6th City Council meeting, uh, the Council directed
staff to perform some additional analysis on Dubuque Street, uh, approximately between
Kimball Road and .... Ridge Road. Uh, as you know, as part of the recently completed
Gateway Project on Dubuque Street, the speed limit, uh, prior to the project was 35 and
then it was reduced to 25, uh, mile per hour. Uh, that posted speed limit was established
as part of the design elements, uh, that you all approved, uh, back in 2014, or Council
approved back in 2014. Uh, and that included things like lane widths, uh, location of
crosswalks, widths of sidewalks, uh, so on and so forth, and one of those items was also
the posted speed. Uh, given the corridor's relatively high pedestrian volumes, the intent
of those design elements I think was in part to calm traffic and have a more pedestrian,
uh, friendly environment. Uh, despite our best efforts, uh, vehicle speeds remain higher
than desired. Uh, and in your packet I included some data that was collected, uh, with
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respect to, uh, vehicle speeds, uh, and 85th percentile speeds that were collected, uh, the
week of September 9th, uh, ranged roughly from 36 mile an hour, uh, to about 41 1/2, uh,
mile an hour, so .... so, um, suffice it to say much higher than the 25 mile per hour posted
speed limit. Uh, in addition to collecting vehicle speed data, staff also observed
pedestrian activity in the area. Um, both the east and west sidewalks, uh, the trail on the
west, the sidewalk on the east have about 200 or so pedestrians a day. Uh, so we were
right that it is a ....a very pedestrian intense corridor. However, we did note, uh, during
our .... our observations a lot fewer pedestrians actually cross at the mid -block crossing, at
the Mayflower, than we had anticipated. And I think that's just a result of folks, uh,
choosing to use the east side walk, uh, heading south and then crossing at the controlled
signal at Park Road. Based on the, oh excuse me, uh, we also reviewed collision history,
uh, since completion of the project, and there have been no bike or ped, uh, incidents
reported, and there's really not been a discernible change in, uh, number of collisions or
severity of collisions since the .... the project was complete. Uh, based on the vehicle data
collected, pedestrian observations, and confirmation that the design of the roadway can
support a 35 mile per hour speed limit, staff is recommending, uh, that get changed back
to 35 mile per hour. Um, and if you choose to, uh, change that back to 35 mile per hour,
there's no Council action needed, because in the code it's still notified, or it's still
codified, excuse me, as a 35 mile per hour corridor. So I'd be happy (both talking)
questions.
Cole/ ...it is discretionary. There's nothing requiring us to go up to 35. And at 25 there's nothing
that, um, the engineers would say that it's sort of inconsistent with the design, so this is a
discretion and a choice on our part, correct?
Ralston/ Yeah, I think that's safe to say. Um, there are some parameters we look at, one is the
85th percentile speed, like we talked about, um, but certainly there's more discretion than
that.
Havel/ I think one thing I would add is basically this is, as we've gone through and done this
analysis, our professional, uh, opinion would be that it would be, 35 would be the
appropriate speed. So, I mean certainly there's... different arguments that could be made,
but when we look at the data, look at kind of where we're at today, that would be our
professional opinion.
Salih/ I have a question for you. I just wanna ask you, if we increase the speed limit, will they
increase... will this increase or decrease, have any affect on the probability of traffic
accidents? If we increase it or if we left it at (both talking)
Havel/ ...were to increase the speed limit, would it affect the likelihood of accidents (both
talking) I...
Ralston/ No, I don't think it would because the 85th percentile speeds are already at 35 or
actually higher. So I would say that if anything it may actually make it safer, because in
our industry we want folks to travel at the same speed, regardless of what the... regardless
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of what corridor it is. Um, differentials in speed is sort of, um, well it's something that
we try to avoid.
Salih/ That's great point. Right now is 25 and the average speed is 33. Do you think if we
increase it, they gonna go like, more like 40? Because now it's 25 and they actually
moving an average of 33. That means we don't have to do anything and they still gonna
move like over 30.
Ralston/ Right. So the theory behind the 85th percentile speed is that's what the .... the public
will travel at, because they feel safe doing so. Um, you could post it at 65 mile an hour,
but the likelihood of people going that fast isn't very good because they're not going to
feel comfortable for the conditions. Uh, in this case they feel comfortable traveling
between 35 and 40, so that's what they're doing. That's sort (both talking)
Salih/ ....driver and... including me (laughs) speed is 30, I'll go little more than 30, 32, and that's
why I'm just like... concerning if we put it 35, they will drive like 37, 40. Now it's 33.
They will drive like 43 or something like that, and also the distant is not really that long.
It's very short distance, uh, you know, from (mumbled) but this short distant have a lot of
car (mumbled) directions, uh, I don't know, but this is...
Mims/ I look at it (both talking) I'm sorry. I look at it as .... it is an arterial coming into the city,
off of the interstate, and .... and it's .... it's well-designed. I think it's, you know, you've got
the space. To me....one of the reasons we're seeing so .... that 85th percentile where it is,
is ... is a combination of two things. It's designed that way, it's designed to be safe at 35
miles an hour, and .... till you get down to Foster Road you're headed downhill, right? I
don't think because we increase it to 35 that you're gonna see a huge increase in the
speed. I think people are going what they see as it being designed for and safe for. One
thing I'm really pleased to see is that we're not seeing a lot of pedestrians crossing at the
Mayflower, that they're actually taking advantage of that sidewalk on the east side, and
that we're not seeing as many during the peak hours as we had originally thought,
because then there's just less chance for conflict between vehicles and pedestrians. Um,
I'm in favor of raising it to the 35. I think it .... I think it makes sense. I think having it
25, and having people go that much higher, either we need to enforce it, which means
we're going to be wasting resources out there, or as you said, Kent, you've got people
more variation in speed because you've got those who are going to strictly follow it and
those who aren't. When I come in on Dubuque, it is inevitable that you get to those
electric signs and all of a sudden there's braking, and to me that's .... a better chance for an
accident than having a speed limit that matches the design of the roadway.
Throgmorton/ Well I don't agree with that, but I agree with everything else you said, pretty much.
I wanna ask you all a question about, uh, the, uh.... well about the topic we're discussing.
Right before our work session we got a couple emails, one from Donald Baxter, who you
all know well, and the other from Greg Shills, who you know well, and they both
objected to reducing the speed limit, or changing the speed limit to a higher speed.
Wonder if you've had a chance to read those, cause we ... we, I didn't really have time to
read them. Um....
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Ralston/ No I didn't.
Throgmorton/ Maybe... could y'all take a look at'em (laughs) I mean, you know, and then we can
have further conversation,but I....
Salih/ And I really don't know, is this something gonna increase from like climate actions point
of view, that the .... the faster you drive, the more fuel you used, and this is .... is this
something (several talking)
Throgmorton/ Yeah, I doubt that that would be (mumbled)
Teague/ I guess for me, uh, you know the road itself it doesn't feel 35, I mean it doesn't feel 25,
and so while you're driving, and many people that I've talked to, they're all in favor of the
35, um, miles per hour. So I .... I'm definitely for it. I think, um, it doesn't feel natural at
25. I think I feel safer at, um, I .... I do the speed limit (laughs) but, uh, but I feel safer
going 35, you know, in that area. So I definitely would be .... in support of an increase.
Cole/ Kent, have we noticed a spike in accidents? Before it was 35. The argument is is that it's
safer. Now we're at 25. The argument is that it will be safer if we go back up to 35.
Since we've gone down to 25, have you seen any statistically significant increase or any
increase at all in either motor vehicle collisions, personal injuries, with the lower speed
limit?
Ralston/ No, and in fact it's been hovering, uh, for about the last five or six years at about the
same number of accidents and about the same severity. So we're (both talking)
Cole/ So it's neutral safety -wise?
Ralston/ Right, and this is what ... I mean staff struggled with this one because I think most of us
would like to keep it slower if we could but to be honest there's just no compelling
reason, um, for us to keep it at 25, in terms of staffs opinion.
Taylor/ But along those lines, if people, as Mazahir's alluded to, do tend to go faster and are
going 40 to 45, that could increase the chance of accidents. I think the only way that I
would be supportive of this change is if we could continue to have the speed, those speed
monitors up to keep track, not necessarily the flashing light that says you're going 25 or
35, but the monitor system, uh, that the police have (both talking) and if we find that 85%
are now going 45 miles and hour and accidents are increasing, uh, I think we would have
to go back.
Ralston/ Yeah, we can certainly revisit the topic. Um, and to be clear, I don't think changing the
speed.... increasing the speed limit will.... increase the number of collisions, but it....it
could increase the severity of collision, I mean there's always that piece of it, but I think
in terms of just raw volumes of collisions, I don't think we're going to see an increase.
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Uh, faster you travel, if you get in an accident, usually it's worse, um, statistically. So
just to be kind of clear (both talking)
Cole/ What about this question of the likelihood of serious injury, I mean we know the laws of
physics in terms of the likelihood of a fatality between 25, 35, 45. None of that's
changed, right, even though we think it's exceedingly low probability that we'll have a
collision with a pedestrian, if we have a collision at 25 versus 35, the likelihood of
serious injury or death is significantly increased, is it not?
Ralston/ It is, yeah.
Cole/ Okay.
Throgmorton/ On ... on that point (both talking)
Ralston/ ...folks are traveling about that speed now, and that's the ... that's the tough part, you
know, folks are already traveling at 35-ish, um, so I don't, again see much difference
there.
Dilkes/ I wanna inject a couple things here. The reason that you asked for, or I believe that you
asked for the study, or the investigation to begin by, urn .... by Jason and by Kent, is
because the state code requires when you're setting a speed limit that the Council can
choose to set a speed limit contrary to the standard speed limit set in the code, but it has
to be based on a traffic and engineering study. There are also liability sections in the code
that say if there's a claim that our design of a road, or our setting of a speed limit, etc.,
etc., has caused an accident, we have immunity from that claim, if it's based on a
generally recognized engineering, generally recognized standard. My .... one of the
suggestions offered in the memo was that if you wanna engage the design consultant to
do an engineering analysis of what the .... what the speed limit should be on that road,
I .... I think you can do that, but I don't think .... the law allows for Council to just ... because
of things .... it thinks about speeds, etc., to set the speed limit, and that ... that's my concern.
Maybe the law has not caught up with .... with (laughs) you know, what we think about
speed limits, etc., but that's what the law says.
Throgmorton/ On these points my main concern going back to .... the first moment we set a speed
limit. I don't even remember what the year was. Uh, has to do with Mayflower. And it
had to do with people crossing Mayflower, and I can remember having discussions on our
Council then about whether it should be signalized, whether there should be ways of
really highlighting the fact that people are trying to cross the street there, and I was really
quite worried that people would be driving too fast and that the kind of accidents that, uh,
I guess, Rockne, you were referring to, would actually occur because people would be
doing 35 to 45 miles an hour instead of 25 to 32 miles an hour. Uh, but it appears that's
not the case, and .... it .... setting that aside, I'd say it's very clear to me that people are
driving the speeds they're driving because the roadway is designed for them to drive
those speeds. And to have a lower speed limit now, given the fact that people are not
crossing the street anywhere near as much as we thought they were gonna cross it, tells
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me we should just.... recognize that fact and say, okay, it's a design road. Let people drive
35 from that .... from that new point that you've referred to. It's not my ideal scenario, but
I think that's what we oughta do.
Thomas/ Well the .... the other area of concern, Jim, uh, going back to when this was in design
was the Mayflower crossing and also, uh, in the environmental assessment the .... the, uh,
the team looked at collision rates, and the collision rates at the southern end of the project
were considerably higher than what normally would be expected on a street of that type.
So that in my mind when I was looking at it raised some concerns. I mean I .... I was a
resident at the time who felt that based on .... on the mid -block crossing and the fact that
the incidents of. ... of collisions was higher than we would expect, and I think one of the
key issues that we haven't mentioned is the fact that you have driveways and Kimball
that ... that's the section where the collisions are highest. And so it's not so much the
through traffic. It's the fact that at that southern end you have cars that are trying to get
into traffic from side roads and driveways. And that's where.... that's where the trouble is.
And it's even true south of Park Road, I mean where you enter into the grid and you have
all these streets, uh, intersecting. Between Park Road and Church there are lots of
collisions as well. So .... like Maz was saying, I am concerned and I think it's in either
Donald or Greg's memo that if we ... if we do increase the speed limit, uh, there's a
possibility that the speeds will increase further. Um, I mean I .... I would not be surprised
if that were to happen, and .... and it's .... urn (laughs) you know, maybe we go the route
that Eleanor was suggesting, but one .... one thought I had had was.... given that our
typical approach with speed limits is we .... we post say 25, but we're basically designing
for 30. That we raise the speed limit to 30 miles per hour, which when I drive it, you
know, 25, because the lane widths and everything else are conforming to a higher speed,
it....it does seem out of sync. When I drive it 30, it ... it's closer to what I think would be
an acceptable speed, as a posted speed, uh, and then there's the issue of what do we ticket,
because we are designing.... this is what really frustrates me, um, we have designed the
road to encourage, you know, the .... 15% of the ... the speeds are higher than the 85th
percentile speed. Um, so .... you know, how do we ticket a situation like that? There are
15 out of a hundred cars that the police department has the discretion to ticket, even at 35
probably. Um, that's a very high number. So I ... that may be a separate issue, as to
what ... what triggers a ticket on this corridor, but .... um, I am concerned that we
raise ... raise the speed limit we're gonna see higher speeds.
Throgmorton/ Pauline offered a solution to that problem.
Thomas/ Yeah, right. So we ....we could test doing it and see what happens, um .... but keep in
mind to say that we are, this.... collision rates are no higher than they were before, they
were higher than we would normally expect before. So that's not a .... you know, that's
not necessarily a good thing.
Throgmorton/ So, John, what's your bottom line?
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Thomas/ Bottom line I would say is, urn .... we.....we could do as Pauline had suggested, see
what happens with the speeds, and then I .... I .... so, yeah. That alone to me suggests that
we .... we need to make sure .... see what the feedback is on ... on raising the speed limit.
Throgmorton/ So .... so I think what I'm hearing is four people in favor of following the staffs
recommendation to increase (both talking)
Salih/ ....four people? (mumbled) three (several talking)
Throgmorton/ There's one (several talking) John, I mean one, two, three, four.
Salih/ Pauline, she said just like (both talking)
Teague/ Yes, and Pauline said if we monitor, which I would agree with.
Salih/ Are you adding Pauline or not? (several talking)
Throgmorton/ I wasn't but she is now saying if you do the monitoring (both talking)
Salih/ ....it's only three. (several talking)
Throgmorton/ No it was four, Bruce, me, Susan, John.
Salih/ Okay.
Cole/ Pauline (mumbled)
Throgmorton/ Okay. Sounds like we have a decision.
Salih/ Is the decision now just to monitor and make sure (both talking)
Throgmorton/ Well it's to raise the speed, as they recommended, but also continue the speed
(both talking)
Salih/ ...monitoring. Okay.
Throgmorton/ ...and if it's .... if it, people are startin' to drive faster (both talking) we need to
know that (several talking) or more accidents, then we need to know that.
Salih/ Sure!
Council updates on assigned board, commissions, and committees:
Throgmorton/ Okay, any other items on the, uh, on the Halloween packet? If not we could move
to the Council updates on assigned boards, commissions, and committees. So we could
start with Rockne and move to the left.
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Cole/ I don't have any update on mine.
Salih/ Nothing.
Throgmorton/ Bruce?
Teague/ Um, no committees to report.
Taylor/ Uh, I did fill in for the Mayor at the CVB meeting, uh, and there was .... there was, uh,
quite a bit of discussion on whether we've reached our density on hotel, uh, as far as, uh,
available beds, available units, and uh, whether they are gaining or losing as far as on the
financial end of that. Uh, there was .... I believe they probably have the study that people
can, uh, look at their web site and .... and see what they found out on that. Uh, they also
talked at great length about the, uh, Eastside Sports Complex, which I didn't realize that
we as a Council had come to much of a conclusion about where we were going with that,
so, uh, but they were talking about it out in the community, uh, as far as that goes. They
were all very excited about the progress on the, uh, arena in Coralville, and uh, so ... um, I
think they're hoping that the sports complex will kind of play into the .... getting folks to
use that complex too. That's about it.
Throgmorton/ Yeah, good. Susan?
Mims/ Um, Access Center is continuing to move forward. Um, we had a full-day meeting last
week with, uh, representative from Amazon Web Services, discussing, um, kind of (sighs)
how you pull this whole thing together and how you serve the clientele, um, and kind of
what .... what the mission is, how you market that, how you show people what it is you're
trying to do. It was ... I'm not doing service to the exercise that we did. Crissy's here in
the audience and she was there as a part of that. There were about 10 of us, and it was a
really, really good process, just talking about, you know, what's .... what does the client
see, what are the issues and pressures for them, for the frontline, uh, providers, etc., and
so just trying to pull a whole lot of things together, um, and having.... having the
individual there who helped run the meeting, who, um, can't think of the term I want,
but ... not moderated but kind of. ... facilitator for the meeting, uh, was absolutely excellent.
Um, the executive committee met today. I was not able to make it, to have some further
discussion on names, um, so I'm not exactly sure where that meeting went today. I
couldn't be there. Um, so we're moving forward and I know they're ... uh, they were also
going to have some discussion at that meeting on the progress of the 28E agreements. So
my work prevented me from being there today. So....
Throgmorton/ (mumbled) movin' on. John?
Thomas/ Nothing for me.
Throgmorton/ Okay, nothing for me either. So it sounds to me like we're done with our work
session for tonight. Okay. We'll reconvene at 7:00.
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