HomeMy WebLinkAbout2006-06-12 Transcription
June 12,2006
June 12, 2006
Council:
Staff:
City Council Work Session
Page 1
City Council Work Session
6:30 PM
Bailey, Champion, Correia, Elliott, O'Donnell, Vanderhoef, Wilburn
Atkins, Boothroy, Davidson, Dilkes, Franklin, Fowler, Helling, Karr, Logsden,
Long, Rackis, Trueblood
TAPES: 06-45 Side 2; 06-47, Both Sides; 06-48, Side I
Transit
Wilburn:
Atkins:
Karr:
Atkins:
Karr:
Atkins:
Bailey:
ODonnell:
Atkins:
Ok. As our transit. . . you guys for transit? Ok. As Steve is coming up, I'll just
point out tonight before we get started, our work session that started with the
discussion about housing has grown a little bit. So I'll just do my best to
encourage us to move through tonight's agenda. But that said, you're up, Steve.
Ok. Transit. Jim and Ron are both here, and they're prepared to take you tluough
in a little more detail, but there are a couple of things I wanted to make in the
form of observations. What you have in front of you are substantially two new
routes, and they are to be funded by small cities intensive transit grant - is that
the official name, something such as that? Ok. Tluough the federal government.
Additionally, you have the decision to make on a late night service. The other
day when you were talking about transit, there appears to be at least developing a
majority that we want to make some reasonably dramatic changes, particularly if
we want to serve that late night, I'll call it the late night workers. I think we all
know what we're talking about. Jeff has explained to me, as well as the other
staff, that we could be eligible for some federal money for that late, the late night
worker route. The problem is, we're not eligible to apply for another twelve
months. It would seem to me.
Steve, can you move your mic up a little bit? I think these people are having a
problem.
Ok?
Ok.
Ok. I have no idea where I was.
Funds, twelve months, seems to you.
Twelve months.
. It seems to me that the issues that we do have before us are we need to get some
decisions made on those new routes, we need to make a decision on the late
night, and then, if you are interested in the late worker route, it appears that we
could spend some time and develop a policy for you over the next year. We had
talked about surveying businesses and those folks, so I just wanted you to be
aWare that there's a little tugging and pulling on getting some of these decisions
made. We also learned today that our bus bids came in a little high. That's not
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12,2006
Champion:
Atkins:
Davidson:
Elliott:
Davidson:
Elliott:
Davidson:
Elliott:
Davidson:
City Council Work Session
Page 2
directly relevant to this, but that is a new expense that we'll have to deal with,
and Joe is working on that. And so, with that Joe, do you want to come down?
Steve, on this federal grant, if we decided to start the program this year by
digging into the transit funds from the parking ramp, would that damage the
possibility of getting some federal money to do that route?
In other words, if we went ahead and done it. Did it. Done it. Do it on our own,
does that jeopardize funding? Ok.
Our understanding is that, the acronym is JARC - Jobs Access Reverse Commute
- the program that Steve is talking about, and our understanding is that it is for a
new type service, that we would jeopardize our chances at those funds. I guess
they do renew it from year to year, it's not just for start-up, but they figure if
you've got it, it's competitive, we're competing with seven other transit systems in
the state, those with communities between 50,000 and 200,000 population, and
so, since it's competitive, we want to keep as much of an advantage as we can. It
is a program that's typically under-utilized. This year there were only two
applications, one from Cedar Rapids, one from Waterloo, that were both funded,
one for $300,00.00, one for $50,000.00, and there was $404,000.00 available, so
it is a program that I think we stand to receive some funding from. It is part of
our, Steve alluded to the time frame for it, it is part of our consolidated transit
application JCCOG prepares annually for Coralville, Cambus and Iowa City. I
think there's a possibility that Coralville may go after some of the funds as well,
but we do that, basically, we do the programming for it in like
January/February/March, make the applications in April, and then find out about
the funding that will begin July I".
Did you mention specific uses for which that would need to be?
Yeah. The emphasis, as the name implies, is for getting people to work and back
from work.
So this can't be combined with the proposed late night/weekend?
Oh, absolutely. In fact,
It can.
Yeah. Steve and I think Joe has also alluded to you that we're kind of in the midst
of a planning process that has commenced, and that we will be continuing. Linda
Severson of JCCOG is going to be heading it up, but we're going to be meeting
with individual human service agencies, employment based agencies, work force
development, those kind offolks, to see what the holes in the current system are,
and, I think, we have some preliminary indication already that employment that
falls outside of the regular 6am to 10:30pm either on one end of a shift change or
another is probably one of those things that's going to be identified as a need, and
so I think, Bob, that we stand a good chance for the late night service, the idea
get that second shift person home from work, we have a good chance of being
funded for that.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription ofthe Iowa City City Council
meeting ofJune 12,2006.
June 12, 2006
Bailey:
Elliott:
Davidson:
Elliott:
Davidson:
Elliott:
Davidson:
Correia:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Correia:
Fowler:
Correia:
Fowler:
Wilburn:
Fowler:
Logsden:
City Council Work Session
Page 3
But so.
Ok. And you're familiar, there is a Council ofCEOs of major employers that is
active.
Yes.
Ok. And you'll be meeting with them.
Right. Oh, we hope to meet with
I'm done now.
the people out there that are trying to get jobs, the agencies that are trying to help
people get jobs, the people who employ people. Now, the other thing we need to
be prepared for though is that if there's another, greater need identified,
something besides late night service, we may come back to you and suggest
focusing on that instead of the late night service if that's a greater need for getting
people to and from employment.
But that's.
It starts to be.
I'm thinking, if this is the same point, then I would say go ahead, but Amy's been
trying to get in.
If we know that shifts generally end at II :00, third shifts start at II :00, and our
bus service ends at 10:30, how much would it be for just the whole, our whole
operation goes to II :30? Then we would be getting people home at II :00, to
there 11 :00, without having.
The bus basically costs, each bus, $50.00 per hour to run.
Ok.
So it would depend on, as our buses go out of service, we decline in the number
of buses we have every night until we end up with like 2 buses. Ron has a survey
where they have actually called the different employers. If you'd like him to
come up and let you know what employers they have contacted and what there
response has been to an increase in bus service.
Why don't we go ahead and have him come up just to keep moving here.
Right. And I think he could address some of the issues - I'll just let Ron take it.
We tried to contact as many as we could. Some cooperated, some didn't, but, for
example, we contacted the University of Iowa and mainly the hospital. The
University of Iowa pretty much said that their hours are pretty traditional hours.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12,2006.
June 12,2006
City Council Work Session
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The hospital was the big employer, and they said that mainly their shifts were
7:30 - 3:30, 3:30 - 11:30, 11:30-7:30. ACT is pretty much during the week
normal hours. Pearson, which was NCS, 7 - 3, 3-11, and 11-7. The days vary,
Sunday through Thursday is 11-7, it depends, they vary different times of the
year depending on, like 6 months out of the year they have a lot more temps than
they do during the regular year. Oral-B, 7-3, 3-11, and 11-7. Proctor and Gamble,
6-2,2-10,10-6. Lear, 6am-2:30,7am-3, and 7:30am-4, so pretty traditional hours
there. They do have, I guess, some other shifts at various times of year, which
run 2-10:30,3-11 and 3:30-12 midnight. And they also have another shift for part
of the year from 10:30-6am and from 11-7am. CoreFlex, which is out at the Scot
Industrial Park is one of the big employers that we have a number of riders from,
is 8am to 6 and 8pm to 6. They also have, temporaries work 7-5,6-4, and 6pm to
2am. Helfa, which is another employer out there, is 6am to 6pm, 6pm to 6am,
and United National Foods, 8 to 5, 2:30 to II, 2:30am to Ilam and Ilam to
9:30pm.
Vanderhoef: So we already have some flex scheduling kinds of things happening there for
times of shifts, so our schedule is working for some of them already. So it would
be interesting to know which of those people that are on those flex shifts, how
many of them are truly using the bus right now, because it might give us an idea
of how many more we might pick up then of the traditional 7 to 3 and 3 to II and
that kind of thing.
Correia: I also think there's an issue related to people who don't take jobs. That its an
option to be a job, but then they don't have transportation, the bus doesn't run,
and so we don't, we miss knowing how many people could have been employed
that had a transportation barrier, and then didn't take that job or had to quit, or
something.
Vanderhoef: Well, I think those are more, the smaller employers rather than the big ones that
we've looked at at the present time.
Champion: Why?
Correia: I don't necessarily believe that?
Champion: Why did you say that, Dee?
Vanderhoef: I'm thinking more of food establishments and those kinds of beginning jobs, shall
we say, entering into the workforce before they are ready for some of the other
jobs that are highly competitive to get those jobs.
Bailey: So, I have a question about JARC, Jeff. Did we recently become applicable, able
to apply for this - why haven't we been pursuing this in the past? Is there
something that's changed in the environment?
Davidson: No, it's a program that, at least from my own perception began as a big city
program, reverse commute to suburban areas, and I would say, Regenia, it took
us awhile, and I have to give the city of Cedar Rapids a lot of credit, because I
was very skeptical when they first went after these funds. I can remember one
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription ofthe Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12,2006
Bailey:
Fowler:
Bailey:
Fowler:
Bailey:
Davidson:
Bailey:
Correia:
Davidson:
Correia:
Davidson:
Correia:
Davidson:
City Council Work Session
Page 5
year, they were funded amongst a bunch of cities that were over 1 million
population and there was Cedar Rapids in there and you know, Bill Hoekstra
deserves some credit for thinking outside the box a little bit. But, now that we
have an example up there of what they're doing with the Wellington Heights
service, you know, it all of a sudden occurred to Ron and Joe and I that hey, we
ought to try this for some of our service as well.
And we're thinking of running this through Transit, not through a separate non-
profit as Cedar Rapids does, correct?
Well, first of all, there was a change in the funding. It was year to year, so if you
got the money one year, there was no guarantee the next year. Now it's part of a
five year program.
Ok. Oh, all right. Good to know. Ok.
So, if you do something, you can rest assured, semi-assured, as far as federal
funding goes, that for several years it wi\l be available. We would have the
option to either run it through Transit or run it through an independent. If you run
it through an independent, that would take the necessity of running SEATS at the
same time, and this one service could do both, where if you ran Iowa City Transit
you would have to run ParaTransit, so. The one agency could do both or, if we
did it, we might have to have both agencies working.
And would it cover Sunday? Urn, because a lot of people have come to me and
said I can't, I take the bus a lot, I can't get to my job on Sunday, we don't have the
bus, so we have to use cabs.
It could.
Ok.
Is this also something we're looking at regionally, because I heard you say maybe
Coralville is going to go in, I know North, I think this is a big issue for
When JCCOG put their transportation planning work program together, both Ron
and Vicky Robrock from Coralville asked us to basically begin this planning
process.
Ok. So it could be, I mean, the, could the applicant be multi-jurdisdictional?
Could North Liberty, Coralville and Iowa City together?
Yes. In other words, it could be one system that received funding through both
Iowa City and Coralville
That served North Liberty.
Yes. And especially if it was an independent agency like they have in Cedar
Rapids, that would just make sense to do that.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription ofthe Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12,2006
City Council Work Session
Page 6
Bailey: But that would take it a little, 1 guess we have a year, but that would take a little
bit of time to get up and running. I mean, I know that, that's a separate non-profit.
Davidson: Yeah, Brad and Linda are going up to Cedar Rapids tomorrow to talk to the
Wellington Heights folks.
Bailey: I've been talking to the director there. So, Ijust have a question for the rest of us.
We've been talking about Transit, but what groups are we trying to serve? I think
if we identified what we're trying to do with this Transit, it would probably help
us make some route decisions.
Correia: Well, I'm interested in extending the times for workers that are working the
second shift. It seems like we're just meeting, we're stopping at 10:30 and there
are shifts that go until II, 11:30; if we could go to midnight on all the late night
shifts and start at 5, how much would that?
Bailey: I'm interested in the economic development aspect of transit, so when it comes to
workers and transporting them, that's, I think, my critical interest right now.
Vanderhoef: One of the things that these DOT meetings have been doing out, the last month
and a half, Ron and Amy both came to the one that was in North Liberty, and it
looks different in different areas - I went up and participated in the one up in
Decorah also, which looks a whole lot different, and everything is more like a
JARC program up there because of the low population and the many miles that
are being traveled up there. But it's, it's still the piece that many of the non-
traditional groups like Health and Human Services have dollars in their budgets
every year for transit, and we're not bringing those into a consolidated system,
and this is where an independent agency, and 1'11 be interested to see if Bill has
pulled in any of those folks that basically contract with these different federal
agencies, federal and state agencies, for those dollars to be put in to help create
more transit for everyone. And then their contract can be more specific, almost
like a ParaTransit, in that they say I've got this many people who are needing
work, they can't apply for certain jobs because of the hours that they are there and
they have no way of getting there. So those dollars are available if we can put it
together in a useful form, and it's more door to door in many of these things. I
know that Bill started out, I talked to him a number of years ago and they started
out doing door to door specifically for these identified clients and the identified
clients were coming through Workforce Development.
Bailey: Well see, and I'm more interested in taking a philosophy that our Transit System
that we subsidize is to meet worker needs in our community and see what our
ridership is. Running it 5 to midnight and seeing what that provides and enables
people to do, I mean running it to the industrial park areas and doing that.
Wilburn: Well, it seemed pretty clear from the last discussion that we had that getting
people to work, home from work, there seemed to be consensus around that and
so. But I'm not hearing any word just about the reaction to just the proposal about
the two routes, and so from there do we build on that and give the head nod yes,
spend the next year trying to put together some kind of comprehensive,
coordinated JARC applications for the purpose of that?
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12,2006.
June 12,2006
Elliott:
Correia:
Elliott:
Correia:
Wilburn:
Fowler:
Vanderhoef:
Fowler:
Correia:
Fowler:
Bailey:
Fowler:
Correia:
Vanderhoef:
Bailey:
Fowler:
Vanderhoef:
City Council Work Session
Page 7
1.
Would we need, I mean. Sorry.
Go ahead.
I'm just wondering. I think there's a need for JARC, certainly, especially
regionally, with North Liberty, Coralville and Iowa City and I think it sounds like
there are other hours of job starting or ending at 2am, and it's certainly not
economically feasible for our regular service to go to 2am, but if we're just shy of
meeting a need that's currently being operated by the bus and it's $50 an hour, I
don't know how many routes there are that end at 10:30 in terms of the ending
that go to these main areas, and I think there are pockets of areas where there are
jobs that end at II or II :30, start at II or II :30, I'm wondering.
Well, can you give us a ball park figure tonight or a total figure or anything?
We're basically running two buses at that time of night.
So that's not going to serve.
That would serve southeast Iowa City and the west side ofIowa City, basically, a
general area over there.
So does it serve UlHC and then the Industrial Park?
Yes.
Where?
The one thing would be we would need to run it longer than that, because if we
run it to midnight we could end up downtown and we need to go.
Sure.
Do another full loop.
All right. Two hours.
Right.
And so what I would like to put into the entire picture, as you study it for this
next year, the best use of our dollars, because there isn't any reason why the city
of Iowa City couldn't put a designated amount of dollars into a JARC program
that covered those same workers rather than $50 an hour for two more hours in
the evening to get people picked up at II :00, get them clear across town and
delivered home, that kind of thing. Am I not correct? Yeah, and that's what I
would like explored, which way is the best way. Amy's idea may be the most cost
effective, and then again it may not be.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12, 2006
City Council Work Session
Page 8
Bailey: But we would have data. If we expanded the hours for this next year we would
have data that would be looking, that would go into the JARC application, and so
what we might find is JARC is the more financially feasible approach because
the ridership is low or whatever we find. And so we could do this expansion of
hours and see what it yields.
Champion: But it would jeopardize our plan.
Vanderhoef: It would jeopardize our application, if we are providing those
Bailey: We're not calling it a JARC, we're just expanding transit hours.
Correia: I don't think it would though, because it wouldn't be a JARC, it would be we're
extending our transit hours to meet a certain need, but if we're going in on a
regional application to try and get North Liberty workers, Coralville workers to
and from work at 2am.
Vanderhoef: But didn't you just tell us that
Davidson: It is possible, I know other cities have tried something and they come in and ask
for money to make it a permanent change so that is a possibility, and we can
check into that.
Bailey: Well, and I would like to make it Sundays as well; I mean, that's something we're
not doing.
Vanderhoef: Didn't you say that was
Correia: Yeah, but first
Wilburn: I'm sorry, one person is going to have to talk at a time. Go ahead, Regenia.
Vanderhoef: I just want to clarify, because what I understood you to say just a few minutes
was that if we already were "affording it" during, with our regular system, that
that might jeopardize our ability to get a JARC to try a late night.
Davidson: Yeah, and to try and clarify here, I'm trying to understand this myself. What the
process that J CCOG is conducting is intending to do is between now and
September or October we have a number of preconceived notions that you have
been taking about. I have my own preconceived notions. What our process will
do is from the users' side of it substantiate those or not. From the side of the
people who are actually using the service, the people that are out there having
difficulty getting to and from work, is it going to II or 12 or going to 2am or
starting at Sam; where are those holes in the service? So we can hopefully come
back to you in September or October with substantiated evidence as to how the
service should be structured to get people to and from work.
Bailey: But if the service doesn't work for them, they're not using the service, so they're
not popping up on our radar; I mean, if they can't take a bus to work and then get
back home from work with a bus, they're probably not taking a bus to work.
They're probably getting to work some other way.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12,2006.
June 12,2006
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Correia:
Wilburn:
City Council Work Session
Page 9
What I understood them say is they've got some folks that are going to begin
talking to people to find out that very fact rather than doing something and seeing
what happens, going out and trying to talk to and reach some of the folks that
you're talking about. Is that not what I?
If we know our primary. If our primary employers are running these shifts and if
our primary goal with Transit is to get people to and from work, why wouldn't
we have expanded hours service to meet our objective, regardless of what we do
with JARC?
To me it doesn't seem like expanding our service an extra hour is JARC. It's
expanding our service an extra hour to meet the need of where our buses already
go, are already going.
And I'm not asking the question as to whether something is JARC or not. What I
heard staff say was, whether you want to cal1 it JARC or cal1 it expanding our
services, is let let's go out to the consumer and find out what's - is that not?
(Bailey and Correia: can't hear - talking at same time)
Wilburn:
Davidson:
Wilburn:
Champion:
Correia:
Champion:
Baeth:
Davidson:
Can I, can I get my question answered first, please?
Yes, that is what we intend to do.
Ok, and whether or not it was asked 6 months ago or not, I'm trying to deal with
what's here and what's now in front of us.
Wel1, a part of the problem has been that we haven't even had money to even
think about expanding the service.
But we should have it.
But now we have some money, so then we can start raising these questions that
we al1 have asked before but the answer was we simply don't have the money to
do it.
Can we reasonably expect to receive the JARC funds? Is this going to be
guaranteed?
My understanding - we haven't done this before, so I apologized, I haven't been
through the process - my understanding is, is that when the state considers our
application their going to want to see evidence that what we are proposing to
fund is in fact something that isn't being fulfil1ed by the current service. But that's
a real1y key thing. That's why we have to step through this process, which is a
little laborious, takes a six-month time period that we just can't jump on right
now, we've got to go through this process so that we can show. And be prepared
for us to come back to you in September and October and say "you know, we
found out that going to 11 and 12 real1y isn't where the hole is particularly." Or
maybe we'l1 fmd out that it's not going into southeast Iowa City, it's definitely
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12,2006
Bailey:
Correia:
Bailey:
Logsden:
Bai]ey:
Correia:
Bailey:
Logsden:
Bailey:
Logsden:
Bailey:
City Council Work Session
Page 10
oriented to the University Hospital, or it's oriented to the McDonald's and
Hardees and Wendy's restaurants, that those are the places where the jobs are that
these people need to be able to get to work. That's what we'll be able to tell you.
How often do we gather consumer data on transit?
Well, we have ridership numbers, so do we know, so let's, the bus that goes to the
industrial park area, and you're saying that that goes until 10:30. We know how
many people.
I just want to get this, I want to know how often we gather consumer data on
transit.
Surveys?
Well, whatever you.
Number of riders?
I mean, whatever would make you change a service. Enough substantiated data
that would make you change a service.
We get a lot of, people with email today aren't afraid to voice their opinions. We
get a lot of emails, a lot of phone calls. The drivers come in, we have, both Joe
and I have open door policies, the drivers, a lot of it is relayed through the drivers
as far as the distance people are walking, how they're getting to the bus, what
they could use, and a lot of the changes, the tweaks that we've made over the
years, as been said, we didn't have money to expand but we added a little bit here
and added a little bit there, and that's part of what we're trying to fix, cause we've
kind of expanded farther than our time schedule allows with the wheelchair lift
buses now. But we do surveys mainly in areas we're looking in expanding in.
JCCOG does surveys periodically for us, on-board surveys which, granted, you're
only getting current riders in doing that, but we've done some postcard surveying,
we have ridership data, we have magnetic electronic registering fare cards, or
boxes that keep our numbers so we know which side our routes are coming off of
and we can't get it to the minute or the stop, but we do, JCCOG does national
transit database reports for us, which tells us where people are getting on and off
on a summary basis.
And how often do we talk to major employers?
We've surveyed like NCS, or Pearson I should say, ACT, we get, when some of
the major employers come into town we've talked to them as far as their needs
are, trying to get like, when the industrial park was forming we talked to the
major employers out there to figure out where, when their people would be
coming and how many people they would employ and worked fairly closely with
CoreFlex when they came in.
So it's just when there's a change, perhaps?
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12, 2006
City Council Work Session
Page 11
Logsden: Perhaps, yeah.
Bailey: Ok. No matter what we do I think we should develop a system where we can do
constant sort of quality improvement or consumer responsiveness improvement
on our transit system no matter what we end up with, because I think that needs
change, as we know, and I think we should always be looking for better ways to
serve, so I, with this, I think we should develop some other systems.
Elliott: I have two observations. One, I like what Jeffhas said. I think that we can take
surveys, but I would really like to sit down with employers. I can tell you that
when I was talking with prospective employees, that the CEO might not know,
but the human resources people have a handle on how many people are applying,
and this might be to a restaurant or it might be to a major employer, how many
people are applying and asking what kind of bus service you have, so I think not
just surveys but sitting down with the major employers and having them talk with
their HR people - I think that's very important before we make these kinds of
unilateral decisions. Secondly, I like Regenia's idea of sitting down and saying
"What priority do we put on the City transit service? What priority as per our
budget?" I think Steve I asked you last time, we now supplement the bus service
between 2 and 3 million dollars a year. Is it worth more than that or less than
that? I just think we need to take an overall look. At some point I would like to
check and see how often we look at what's the difference between running loops
and running north, south, east, west? Ijust think I'd like to get back to the basics
of what are our priorities for the transit service? What are our priority customers?
How much do we think we should spend, and what do the users have to say? I
like what Jeff is talking about.
Vanderhoef: And I think there's one other way to come at some of this and Regenia has made
a point about how many people are we not reaching or getting information about?
The Human Service groups in town, they know their clients, and they know their
needs for transportation as well as lots of other needs, but a sit-down with some
of those folks to get an idea of what is out there, what they're seeing, how many
of their clients are not able to do certain kinds of things because of the
transportation and just see how many of them are out there that would be a way
of getting at least a few numbers that are different than who is riding the bus right
now.
Bailey: So.
Wilburn: And I think I heard you say that that was part of the plan, is that correct? Yeah.
Go ahead, Regenia.
Bailey: I was just wondering if that's a priority group for you. Are you talking about
human service clients to jobs or are you talking about fundamentally, human
service clients that might have other
Vanderhoef: All of it. I mean, some of them are working on GEDs and they need to get to
Kirkwood, for instance, and so, those kinds of people, how many people are not
being served for their transportation needs? Because that's part of my off of
whether we need more daytime buses versus night time, late hours of expanded
service as a total bus system versus perhaps a JARC independent system.
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meeting of June 12,2006.
June 12, 2006
City Council Work Session
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Bailey: See, if I were going to, I mean, talk about population groups that we're serving,
first and foremost, as I mentioned, I'd like to see us worrying about workforce
transportation, and then perhaps human services as a secondary.
Vanderhoef: But many of the human services are trying to get - there's a continuum, when you
come through workforce development doors and you sign in, there's many steps
that come through.
Bailey: Sure.
Vanderhoef: But it is all towards ajob.
Bailey: Right. But I don't think we should make the assumption that primary users of
buses are necessarily low income or people who are in the human service system
Vanderhoef: Well, when you look at how many bus passes we hand out to all the human
service agencies in this city on a monthly basis, it's what, 1300, 1400 a month?
Bailey: But I think that you're
Vanderhoef: So we are meeting a need partially.
Bailey: Right, but I think that if we had more responsive to getting people to their jobs,
we would see more people riding the buses if it were more convenient for people,
especially as gas prices go up. You would see more, because your discretionary
income is going away if you're spending it on gas, and we know that that will
have a dramatic impact on the rest of the community and into our non-profits.
Discretionary income from the middle class goes away, donations go down, our
arts support goes down. I think that we need to think about this in the big picture,
that you not just think that we're addressing, you know, human service needs.
This is an economic development issue.
Champion: I agree with you.
Vanderhoef: Economic development is human service's part of the big picture. It's even part of
the bigger picture.
Champion: I think the important thing is we are all interested in buses to get people to work
and home. And I'm willing to wait to do this study and apply for this grant,
because I would like to see is if we can have more money into our bus system,
increasing service. I think we have a great example of what happens when you
have frequent service with low costs is our shuttle, which is unbelievable how
many people ride that, because it runs every 15 minutes and it's free. I mean, I
know we're not going to go back to free buses, but I think part of our ridership
problem is also infrequent bus service. I mean where I live it doesn't make any
difference, because there's a lot ofbuses that go by where I live. But if you live
around Washington Park Road, you only have one option, and that bus runs
every hour. So I don't want to use money that we can possibly get from another
source to fund a program that we can maybe start with somebody else's money,
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12, 2006
O'Donnell:
Correia:
Fowler:
Correia:
Fowler:
O'Donnell:
Fowler:
Correia:
Fowler:
Bailey:
Correia:
Fowler:
Correia:
O'Donnell:
Davidson:
O'Donnell:
Davidson:
City Council Work Session
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cause I'm hoping the transportation center will make us lots of money and then
we can talk about really getting useable, functional bus service.
I don't see how we can do anything until you do your survey. Amy asked a
question about ridership on the industrial park late night. Do we know what that
is?
Well and what I was wondering was if we knew how many people were using the
bus around the time to get to those shifts, like 3 :00, that would be an indication
that those folks get to work on the bus and then have to figure out some way else
to get home, then that could be a source of estimating some of that later night,
extended hour need.
Right now we don't go to the industrial park area at night. That was part of the
That's the new part.
Right, that was part of the changes.
What time. Ok.
So, what we have right now is we have people who get off at Bon Air and walk
from Bon Air to the industrial park.
At 3, or around that time?
No. We have service out there in the afternoon. It's people that are going out
there later at night, after 6:30,7, 11:00 at night, they're getting off and walking.
Gotcha.
So we have those numbers.
No, we don't have scientific, we just know it's occurring, we don't know how
many.
Oh, ok.
In our survey that we do to the corporations, is one ofthe questions potential
ridership or interest in ridership?
Yeah, that was a question, wasn't it Ron? In the survey we just did, the most
recent one was for Pearson and ACT. Yeah, right, if service was increased would
it encourage you to ride a way, if it was later in the evening or something. I think
weekends was another option we gave.
That would be a very interesting number to me as we talk about this.
Yeah. In the, I have to be honest with you, in the case of ACT and NCS, there
was not a lot of interest generated.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription ofthe Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12,2006.
June 12, 2006
Bailey:
Davidson:
Bailey:
Correia:
Bailey:
Davidson:
Correia:
Davidson:
Correia:
Davidson:
O'Donnell:
Correia:
Davidson:
Correia:
Davidson:
O'Donnell:
Fowler:
Bailey:
O'Donnell:
Logsden:
O'Donnell:
City Council Work Session
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Well they don't have late. Did you say that, one of them had late night, did either
of them?
Pearson does.
Pearson. Right.
Well how many people responded to the survey?
Statistically significant?
A relatively low percentage.
Right. And was it.
We sent it to everybody.
To everybody. But, do you know if the folks who responded do the shift work, or
are the more traditional 8 to 5 workers?
I don't think we had any way to
That's what we have to know.
I think that we should know that. Were they temporary employee?
We try to keep it really short, one page Amy, because there's definitely a
correlation between the longer you make it and the people that respond.
Right. No, I know. Maybe focus groups next time.
Yeah, and Pearson in fact didn't even respond to our request to send it out. ACT
did send it out.
I'd like the question asked to Larry at Proctor & Gamble and the major
companies - I'd like to see what the potential ridership is.
I think actually some of them that Ron contacted expressed no interest in having
bus service.
Did they say why?
That's a pretty important thing to know.
A couple of their responses were that employees were expected to come when
needed, and they needed to have a car accessible to them as one of their
conditions of employment.
Wow. That's bad.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12,2006.
June 12,2006
Wilburn:
Fowler:
Wilburn:
Fowler:
Bailey:
Fowler:
Bailey:
Fowler:
Wilburn:
Fowler:
ODonnell:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Bailey:
(laughter)
City Council Work Session
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There you go. Are there four of us that are willing to give a nod to these two
routes, the information gathering from a variety of sources, with the purpose of
that informing us both whether to put some type of JARC application together or
possibly lead to more information about potential needs for transit service? Are
there four of us? One, two, three, four. Ok. Do you need anything else from us
now in terms of?
I guess to summarize what we just did was establish the east side and west side
route that were proposed. Then the combined service at night so that we can get
out to the industrial park.
Correct.
And on further out on North Dodge Street, and that was basically what our
original proposal was. That we would write a summary memo to you saying what
we were going to do and the date it would be implemented, which I believe is
August 14, and then also include in that memo what we were going to do as far
as pursuing the JARC and then, if there's, if we get anything wrong you'll let us
know at that point.
You're going to put a timeline in there too, right?
Yes.
Because will we be reevaluating these new routes at some point?
Yes. We should be coming back, probably in 9 months, knowing what the
income is from Court Street in addition to the JARC money, but also having the
Court Street money available to make additional changes.
Then we'll have some more decisions to make.
Yes.
At least we'll have some facts to make decisions.
Yeah - let's gather all the data.
Now this will probably come up when we talk about the schedule of pending
discussion items, but I think it's important for us to have another meeting to talk
about financial and ridership priorities and philosophies about the transit bus
system, so that when we ask them to do some studies they know where the
philosophy and the priorities are.
But Ross I think summarized that most of us, I think the majority, is interested in
getting people to and from work. He wanted to get them home; I was just
interested in getting them to.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting ofJune 12,2006.
June 12,2006
Wilburn:
Bailey:
O'Donnell:
Bailey:
Champion:
Davidson
Champion:
Baeth:
O'Donnell:
Baeth:
Correia:
O'Donnell:
Bailey:
Baeth:
Dilkes:
Wilburn:
Dilkes:
Wilburn:
Baeth:
City Council Work Session
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What 1 was also suggesting is that as they talk to individuals and riders that there
may be some other issues or needs that come up and then we would have further
policy discussions.
I would really like to put a sort of exclamation point on looking at Sunday
service. I've heard that from plenty of people. People work on Sundays, people
want to travel around on Sundays - I think we need to look at that, and I don't
know if that comes under JARC, or could, but I think that that would be
something significant.
Does Cambus run on Sundays?
No.
No.
It does.
Oh. It does.
Yeah, not late.
How late?
No, it does, no it does run on Sundays.
It's just that one route, right, Mayflower?
You really weren't sure.
You really drive, don't you?
I do know. No, it does run on Sundays. I remember as a freshman I came back
from the Hotglat, got a ride back to the dorms. I would like to hear Council's
thoughts on, at least in the future, establishing a late night bus route to
downtown.
I'm sorry. Can I interrupt you for a minute? Can we get a head count on the
Sunday service please? Is that something four of you were interested in doing?
Looking at it? Yeah.
Thank you.
Go ahead.
I'm not sure if you saw my letter, but I would like to propose a cheaper way to
test out a late night but route downtown, and that is by eliminating the Thursday
night bus service from the plan. I've also bee in contact with Brian McClatchey
from Cambus who says they are willing to provide the ParaTransit service for
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meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12, 2006
City Council Work Session
Page 17
this route. Now, with these two combined changes it would reduce the cost by
more than half, and I would like to see if Council is interested at some point in
the future, in at least having a test run of what a late night bus service could do
for the City. What ridership would be, whether or not we have problems - I think
that's really the only way that we can tell if this could be a valuable route to the
City and whether we could apply, say, future JARC funds towards it.
Bailey: Well, I'm interested in expanding our hours, as I think I indicated.
Elliott: I think that Jeff said that would be a part of his study, that he indicated the late
night/weekend would be a part of the conversation, the study, the surveying, that
sort of thing, which would take this fall out of the picture, but it would.
Baeth: Right, but if we're studying only businesses, we need to remember that another
component is getting downtown for entertainment, for restaurants, things like that
and how are we going to study that?
Bailey: Well I think that should be part of the study. If we're studying businesses, I think
we should decide, I mean, it should not just be our larger. I mean, obviously we
talked about industrial park, but there are lots ofbusinesses.
ODonnell: I thought part of it was to study food establishments.
V anderhoef: Well, businesses.
Baeth: But not only workers of the food establishments but patrons.
Bailey: Yeah, but if we have a bus that runs, we're not going to say "are you a worker or
a patron."
Baeth: Right, but there'd be a lot more patrons than staff at these restaurants, for
instance, if you're going by pure numbers.
Champion: I think there are at least four of us that are (can't hear)
Bailey: I'm interested in expanding hours, period. I don't care who rides it, as long as
they pay.
Wilburn: I'm not, I'm not going to
Vanderhoef: The Downtown Association could be tapped for, you could almost consider the
downtown as a business, in total. A center, like the industrial parks are a center,
or ACT and Pearson is a center, a population center of jobs, and so if there were
something done as a total picture of the business district, that would be great, to
have that information to put in there.
Wilburn: Did I miss some correspondence from Cambus directly about their willingness or
interest? I believe you when you say you have some, but I guess what I'm getting
at is, to not try and discourage you from, you know, nudging or lobbying the
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meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12,2006
City Council Work Session
Page 18
Council, but I would really need to hear directly from someone from, a decision
maker from Cambus about their interest. I mean, I would need to hear.
Bailey: Yeah, a letter to Jeff as he's doing this JARC survey would be very helpful, I
think.
Baeth: I believe Ron too is in contact with Brian McClatchey as well.
Vanderhoef: And making it official that they would consider doing the ParaTransit for the
City if we were doing late night hours.
Champion: Good.
Vanderhoef: Thank you for contacting him and doing your arm twisting or whatever it looked
like.
Consent Calendar Additions
Wilburn:
SILOs - School Infrastructure Local Option sales tax.
Karr:
Mr. Mayor, before we start, and I apologize, we want two additions to our
consent calendar tomorrow night, two resolutions, one dealing with
(cut off - end of tape)
Karr:
a previous resolution appointing Dan Clay on the Airport Commission. Just
wanted to make you aware that will be posted late. You'll get more information
on that tomorrow. You got some tonight.
Wilburn:
Ok.
Champion:
Ok.
Karr:
Just FYI for the 24 hours.
Elliott:
Were those the two items you gave us tonight?
Karr:
Yes.
School Infrastructure Local Option
Wilburn:
Ok. The School Infrastructure Local Option sales tax. I think from this discussion
tonight, if I'm not mistaken, the School Board is going to make a decision, a
formal decision, tomorrow night at their meeting as to whether or not to have this
take place on the ballot. Without getting into the intricacies of how the
mechanisms all work and things like that, it would seem to me that we as a body,
if we are interested in making a request at the School Board should they place it
on the ballot, of whether or not we are interested in requesting from that a portion
of that penny, and I guess my take would be that it would involve a letter from
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June 12,2006
City Council Work Session
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me to the School Board making such a request. So, I'll put it out there for
discussion.
Elliott: First question is how many are interested? I am.
Champion: I am.
Vanderhoef: I am.
O'Donnell: I am. That's four.
Wilburn: I am as well.
Bailey: There you go. I have here concerns that I think others have heard, that some
people are not as supportive if the City is going to share in this. They're
supportive of the penny for schools, or for the kids, and I just want to put that out
there.
Elliott: And I think that's a legitimate decision that the School Board will make, whether
it's in their best interest.
Wilburn: The point being that that will be their decision.
Elliott: We are, we would like to indicate that if they so desire, and I would think they
would, because the School Board is as good as the City and the City is as good as
the schools are, and I think we are inexorably combined on that, so I think it
would benefit the School Board to have the City benefit from the Local Option
tax, but that's their decision to make.
Vanderhoef: And on the flip side, Regenia, a lot of the people that I have visited with are more
interested in it being the possibility for the City to have some, in that it keeps all
of the money in the community instead of sending part of it out.
Champion: After (can't hear)
Correia: Was there
Vanderhoef: Well, after half the time period, what the length of the bond is.
Wilburn: You had a question, Amy?
Correia: Was that in the memo that? Was there new legislation that passed, that for the
first five years the school keeps all of it and then the second five years they keep
a certain number dollar amount per child.
Bailey: A thousand dollars.
Vanderhoef: Sixty percent.
Bailey: 527 per child.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12, 2006
Correia:
Dilkes:
Correia:
Dilkes:
Elliott:
Dilkes:
Wilburn:
Atkins:
Wilburn:
Elliott:
Wilburn:
Elliott:
Bailey:
O'Donnell:
Elliott:
Champion:
Elliott:
O'Donnell:
City Council Work Session
Page 20
527 per child and then the rest.
Correct. But I don't think, whether or not the City participates does not determine
whether the money goes out or stays in the County.
So after five years they would have.
If we participate, our percentage would go down after five years as well.
If it's a ten-year plan.
Yes. All I'm saying is, there's been, I think there's been a misconception that
more money will stay in our area if the City participates, and that is not the case.
Ok. Steve, can you help me put together a letter tomorrow and I'll come and take
a look at it?
Sure.
All right. Thank you.
And I think the letter would indicate that we would work with the School Board
as to how the City's portion of the funds would be used if we were to be included.
I think what, that two will be a decision for them to make, but I initially hearing
from them we just need to.
But we aren't asking that we would have a unilateral decision of how our funds
would be made. We are not asking them to sign a blank check. We will tell them
that we would like to be included and we will work with them as to how the
City's portions of the funds would be used.
That's for us to decide.
That's our card.
Well, the School Board might, if! were on the School Board, I'd say "Well, first
tell me how you plan to use the funds, because we're not going to sign a blank
check." There may be some way that you'd use the funds which.
They're not signing the check. The citizens are.
No, but if! were the School Board, they're the ones that will determine whether
or not we'll be included, and if we decide one use for the funds the Board might
say "no." and if we decide another use for the funds, the board might say "we
agree. "
But I think the purpose of tonight is just to let the School Board know that we
would like to share in that.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription ofthe Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12,2006.
June 12, 2006
City Council Work Session
Page 21
Bailey: There's a majority.
Baeth: And by the same token, voters are more likely to vote for it if they know where
their portion in the City is going.
Champion: Exactly.
Dilkes: It's required by law that they know how the money will be spent.
Elliott: Yeah.
Vanderhoef: It's on the ballot.
Correia: On the ballot.
O'Donnell: It has to be stated on the ballot.
Kemper / Farmers' Market
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
O'Donnell:
Wilburn:
Atkins:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Ok. Kemper Farmers' Market. My understanding is that there were enough who
were interested in, and correct me if I'm wrong, just some type of check into one,
whether our farmers' market policy was followed in this particular instance, is
that accurate?
Mmm hmm.
Ok.
Well then I just, our policy states that any party aggrieved by the decision of the
Director to grant or deny authorization, blah, blah, blah has ten calendar days to
appeal and then goes to the City Manager and then there's a hearing before the
City Manager. And I just want to know where we are with that process, and if
they have requested an appeal, are they appealing, or can we just put an end to
this "he said" "she said" back and forth letter writing by following our process
that we have in place.
My understanding is they haven't (can't hear).
Well, maybe at least we, I know we can answer the first part.
The first question is no, I haven't received any appeal.
Ok.
So what would it take for them to officially appeal? I mean, I know that, I don't
know if we're, within these ten calendar days I don't know when that clock starts,
but, I guess, I consider the initial emails complaining of the decision sort of an
appeal type of process, but what is the official procedure for an appeal.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription ofthe Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12,2006.
June 12, 2006
Atkins:
Bailey:
Correia:
Bailey:
Correia:
Atkins:
Bailey:
O'Donnell:
Correia:
Bailey:
Trueblood:
Bailey:
Trueblood:
Bailey:
Trueblood:
Bailey:
Trueblood:
City Council Work Session
Page 22
Having never done one, I've done it for annuals, but not for Farmers' Market
issues, I would make the assumption that it's simply a letter addressed to me
appealing a decision of the Director and identifying what that decision was. Terry
is here - does that pretty well do it? Terry says yes to that.
Ok. And so, none of this has happened. Ok.
Regenia, what are you reading from?
I'm reading from the City Code.
Ok. So, have they received a copy of that when we knew that they were upset
about?
I don't know.
Terry?
It's public information.
I know, but I (can't hear)
Someone should guide someone through the process if there's a problem. If we
have a grievance procedure, I think at least we need to make citizens aware of
what the procedure is.
To my knowledge they were never given that information. They never asked if
there was an appeal procedure. As a matter of fact, any, any decision I made, I
didn't make any decision, frankly, but there isn't a decision to be appealed.
Well, there was apparently some concern about some leaving off the waiting list
or something.
The intent of this appeal thing is just, if our farmers' market manager and
subsequently me would be to deny someone from being a vendor at the farmers'
market, then there is an appeal process. A denial such as ok, they want to sell
something they shouldn't sell.
Right.
Or they want to, or they're a full restaurant owner and they want to sell their
hamburgers or whatever at the market or something like that, where we say no,
we can't let you in on that. This is a situation where they were on a waiting list
last year, were not on a waiting list this year, and they're claiming they should
have been on a waiting list.
And what is the current status of the situation?
They're on the waiting list. Both waiting lists. Matter of fact, they were a vendor
this past Saturday morning.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12, 2006
Correia:
Bailey:
Trueblood:
Champion:
Trueblood:
Bailey:
Trueblood:
Bailey:
Trueblood:
Bailey:
Trueblood:
Bailey:
Champion:
Trueblood:
Bailey:
Trueblood:
Bailey:
Correia:
Elliott:
Trueblood:
Elliott:
City Council Work Session
Page 23
Ok.
So if they feel that you've made a decision that they want to appeal, someone
should make them aware of this process, correct?
Ah, yes, but then again, that's not the type of
Appeal.
That's not the type of situation.
So what is the process if somebody is unhappy with something that's going on in
your department?
Depends what it is. There's always
Well, this situation, for example.
There's always a process. You know, I mean if someone is unhappy with one of
our employees they have the option to go to that employee's supervisor. If they
don't get an answer there, go to that employee's supervisor, etc., right up to me. If
they, they're not happy with my decision they go to my boss. If they're not happy
with his decision, they go to you.
Right. And that seems to have occurred.
Yeah.
Since I'm getting phone calls at home.
We all have.
Sometimes Parks and Recreation (can't hear) suggested too, that that's another
option, depending on what the situation is.
Ok. So, but, for all practical purposes, this situation has been resolved?
For all practical purposes, yes. I believe so.
All right.
Do
So. At the time either they were told or after this they will be told that from you.
this is the final decision, if you would like to appeal that here is the process you
go through and here is how you do it.
We can very easily tell them that.
Yeah, ok, this also provides
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting oOune 12,2006.
June 12,2006
Dilkes:
Bailey:
Dilkes:
Wilburn:
Correia:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Correia:
Trueblood:
Bailey:
O'Donnell:
Correia:
Trueblood:
O'Donnell:
City Council Work Session
Page 24
I think Terry's right though, that there's a big question here and this is, I've not
been asked this question before, but I'm just sitting here reading the code right
now and I'm not sure we're falling within that provision.
So, that was my question. Does it fall into this grievance procedure per se or, you
know, what happens I guess is the question?
I don't, I mean, I have not read all the various correspondences from the
Kempers, so in order to determine whether it fell into this I imagine I would have
to do that, but just on its face, as I'm reading it now, it appears to be what Terry
has said, if someone is denied the authorization to be a vendor, not when but
whatever your rules are about things have to be homemade or whatever those
rules are, that seems to be more what this is directed to. Because there is also,
you can revoke somebody's authorization, for instance, if they've misstated
something in their application, they're operating in violation of the terms of the
farmers' market, that kind of thing, then you can revoke that and they're required
to a hearing. And that would be consistent I think with the circumstances under
which one is entitled to that type of hearing, so.
They were told
Is there
Excuse me. They were told if there was a policy related to the farmers' market
that wanted to have considered for change, that if there were enough City
Council members that would be willing to review that policy, that it could be
done at a work session, and I informed them of that.
Ok.
So is there a process, when someone's interested in being a vendor in the farmers'
market, is there a written application? Do they fill out a written application and
then submit it? Or is it more, they come in, or they call and they ask to be put on
the list and then their name and number is taken down?
It's somewhat informal. I, I honestly can't answer you right now as to whether
there is an application to get in. I know that Tammy has received requests in
mail, email, phone call, in person. You know, and of course, for years it's been
full, so all we can do is put people on waiting lists.
Right.
What's the numbers (can't hear)
It just seems
We have 50 some on Wednesday and 70 some on Saturday
Ok, and beyond that you go on a waiting list. Seems fairly
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meeting of June 12, 2006.
...._...-~----~_..__._._,--_..,._~-_._.._._---_._-_. ,.._-------------~._---------_.._------_._---
June 12, 2006
Elliott:
Correia:
Elliott:
Champion:
Correia:
Champion:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Vanderhoef:
Bailey:
Vanderhoef:
Wilburn:
Correia:
City Council Work Session
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Well, I was just
Yeah, I just wonder if
I was just going to say this is unfortunate but it's an opportunity. I would like to
see the farmers' market significantly expanded. It seems to me that there is room
for a significant expansion, either in the present location or maybe in a different
location. This could be even a larger event than it is now, so, it's sometimes you
look at an unfortunate situation, hey, we struck a nerve and here's one of the good
things, a good thing that can come out of it.
I think the problem getting into, I mean, I agree with you, it would be great to
have the farmers' market at City Park, for instance. They have art vendors there,
and food vendors and produce makers and bread bakers - whoever wanted to be
there, a theme market, farmers' market. It could really be fun. The problem is, I
don't think most of the people in the farmers' market are really interested in doing
that. They would probably have to purchase a canopy of some kind and they like
being under the.
There's more room under there, though.
But they also want parking available.
See, we are getting beyond the scope of what I
Can we add farmers' market to our pending discussion, rather than, my intention
in bringing this forward was to just check in where this was, to double, to see
what this policy of appeals applied to and just really focus on this situation, but
can we add it to our pending list?
I would like to send it back to Parks & Recreation who make those
recommendations to us to take a look at some of that stuff and look through
whether there should be applications and that kind of stuff.
I would certainly like. to see the process formalized, but when it comes to talking
about Bob's, you know, possibility of expansion, if you've ever been to Des
Moines farmers' market on a Saturday morning, you know that it's a destination
event. And I think that, perhaps we couldn't do something like that, but that's
something to aspire to.
Well, I think there's some interest in it and let's send it back to Parks & Rec. and
let them talk about it and bring us some recommendations for the next season.
Ok.
And I think there's a formalizing the application process. I know in Des Moines
too, on the Des Moines website there's a written application, you have to submit
it, you get a letter back, I think that could, so that confusion of did I get on the
waiting list or did I communicate that, if there was that written and they got a
letter back documenting you're on this waiting list.
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Trueblood: It may very well be already formalized. I don't handle it myself, I don't koow if
there is or not. But I do koow anybody who requests to be on it is told yes,
they're on the waiting list, there are x number of people, you koow, Tammy
communicates with all those folks very well.
Bailey: But there isn't a formal application. I mean, I looked on our website. The policies
are certainly there, but there isn't the opportunity to say, download the
application or apply.
Correia: Download the application.
Bailey: Or even communicate with Tammy to get on the waiting list, and that would give
you the paper trail and the date stamps I think that would be beneficial for some
of this kind of confusion.
Dilkes: We can, as you mayor may not remember, but this farmers' market chapter in the
code came into being when we did that big rewrite of Chapter 10.
Trueblood: Farmers' market was never in the code until one or two years ago when that was
done.
Dilkes: And so, but I actually think it is a good idea to have a formal, and then we can
have a letter that references the appeal and we can certainly work with you on
that.
Vanderhoef: Put it on the website.
Bailey: Yeah. I think a little bit more transparency would circumvent these kinds of
confusions.
Wilburn: There was a request, well actually a suggestion might be to have Parks & Rec.
explore the possibility if there's interest. Do we want to send this back to, at
request, Parks & Rec. about expansion.
Correia: About the expansion.
Elliott: That would be my suggestion.
Trueblood: Ok, I'm unclear as to what you're sending back to Parks & Recreation.
Wilburn: I believe what's been suggested is a request for Parks & Recreation to consider
the possibility of expanding the farmers' market, I presume in terms of numbers
and possibly location.
Bailey: Based upon consumer interest rather than vendor interest, because I think we're
being really responsive to vendors and not necessarily to consumers. And in
addition I would like Parks & Rec. to look at this more formalized process and
come up with a suggestion.
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City Council Work Session
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Vanderhoef: Yeah.
Trueblood: We'd be happy to look at the whole program if that's what you want, and even
involve some of you in it. But, as far as not being responsive to vendors, we
haven't had any complaints from them.
Champion: That's what we're saying.
Correia: No, about
Bailey: But
Trueblood: No, not being responsive to patrons, I'm sorry, that's what I meant, we haven't
had any complaints from patrons.
Bailey: No, I'm not suggesting that patrons aren't being responded to. But, I mean, when
I talk to somebody about expanding, the vendors weren't interested in expanding.
Well, naturally, I wouldn't be interested in expanding if it meant for competition
for my baked goods or whatever it was, so I think that we also have to look at
who uses it and if there would be some interest in making it more of a destination
event. Even if it's just the Saturday event.
Trueblood: In fairness, and I don't mean to be argumentative, but the vendors when they first
met, their biggest concern was about parking, and then when we at the staff level
decided look, we have to expand this on Saturday morning, we ran into no
opposition from the vendors.
Elliott: Yeah.
Bailey: Well let's keep moving.
O'Donnell: How many farmers' - do we have 3 farmers' markets now?
Trueblood: We have, we run Wednesday evening and Saturday morning.
Bailey: We also have Sycamore, North Dodge, Coralville
O'Donnell: Sycamore
Correia: Coralville
O'Donnell: In Iowa City alone we have 3 different.
Bailey: It's great.
O'Donnell: I don't know - ours has been going this way for over 30 years and been very
successful and.
Bailey: Go to Des Moines.
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June 12,2006
City Council Work Session
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O'Donnell: I would not like to see it changed. if making it larger means that we move it, I
would not like to see it moved from where it is. It's a great spot.
Vanderhoef: There might even be discussion about having a second one in another location.
Bailey: Well, we could also take it to the second floor and close College Street, you
know, on Saturday morning.
Wilburn: We're getting into the discussion of being (can't hear)
(laughter)
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Elliott:
Wilburn:
Elliott:
Bailey:
Really?
Commission to look at this, so do you have enough direction?
I think.
Are you clear what to take back to.
You've found a couple people, Terry, if you'd like for us to come in and talk to
you we'd be happy to do that.
Well, I think you've
(all talk. can't hear)
Wilburn:
Last chance, Terry. Let's come back at 10 'til.
Planninl! & Zoninl!
Franklin:
Franklin:
It just means that it's a property that's been subdivided previously and now we're
reconfiguring it.
h) CONSIDER A RESOLUTION OF INTENT TO CONVEY THE
RIGHT-OF-WAY IN AN ALLEY IN BLOCK 27 LYING
BETWEEN SOUTH CLINTON AND SOUTH DUBUQUE
STREETS TO THE NORTH OF BENTON STREET, TO
JOHNSON COUNTY, AND SETTING A PUBLIC HEARING ON
SAID CONVEYANCE FOR JUNE 27, 2006.
Item h is then a resolution of intent to convey the right of way to an alley; this is
the alley that is being vacated for the County. This is the resolution of intent to
convey it, setting the public hearing for the 27th.
I) CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE CONDITIONALLY REZONING
11.36 ACRES OF LAND LOCATED EAST OF SOUTH RIVERSIDE
DRIVE FROM GENERAL INDUSTRIAL (1-1) TO HEAVY
INDUSTRIAL (1-2) (REZ05-00005) (SECOND CONSIDERATION)
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Franklin:
I is a second consideration on the rezoning from I-I to 1-2 for the salvage
operation on old South Riverside Drive across from the fairgrounds.
j) CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE REZONING PROPERTIES
ASSOCIATED WITH THE UNIVERSITY OF IOWA TO
INSTITUTIONAL PUBLIC (P2) [THESE PROPERTIES INCLUDE:
511 SOUTIl MADISON STREET AND 620 AND 624 SOUTH
MADISON STREET FROM INTENSIVE COMMERCIAL (CI-1) TO
INSTITUTIONAL PUBLIC (P2); LOTS 14 AND 15 IN GRAND
AVENUE COURT ADDITION AND 320 MELROSE AVENUE FROM
MEDIUM DENSITY SINGLE F AMIL Y RESIDENTIAL (RS-8) TO
INSTITUTIONAL PUBLIC (P2); LOT 4IN MELROSE COURT
ADDITION, 223 LUCON DRIVE, 609 MELROSE AVENUE, AND 3
OAK PARK COURT, FROM LOW DENSITY SINGLE FAMILY
RESIDENTIAL (RS-5) TO INSTITUTIONAL PUBLIC (P2); 322
NORTH CLINTON FROM PLANNED HIGH DENSITY MULTI-
F AMIL Y RESIDENTIAL (PRM) TO INSTITUTIONAL PUBLIC (P2);
430 AND 530 NORTIl CLINTON FROM HIGH DENSITY MULTI-
F AMIL Y RESIDENTIAL (RM-44) TO INSTITUTIONAL PUBLIC (P2);
AND OLD CAPITOL MALL FROM CENTRAL BUSINESS (CB-10)
TO INSTITUTIONAL PUBLIC/CENTRAL BUSINESS (P2/CB-10).]
(REZ06-00008) (SECOND CONSIDERATION)
k) CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE REZONING PROPERTIES
ASSOCIATED WITH THE CITY OF lOW A CITY AND THE
IOWA CITY PUBLIC SCHOOL DISTRICT TO NEIGHBORHOOD
PUBLIC (PI) AND THE IOWA NATIONAL GUARD TO
INSlTUTIONAL PUBLIC (P2) [THESE PROPERTIES INCLUDE:
BENTON HILL PARK, WHISPERING MEADOWS WETLAND
PARK, OUTLOT ASSOCIATED WITH EAST HILL SUBDIVISION,
OUTLOT ASSOCIATED WITH LONGFELLOW MANOR, AND
OUTLOT ASSOCIATED WITH WALDEN WOOD FROM MEDIUM
DENSITY SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL (RS-8) TO
NEIGHBORHOOD PUBLIC (PI); PROPERTIES ASSOCIATED WITH
GLENDALE PARK, HUNTER'S RUN PARK, WINDSOR RIDGE
PARK, GRANT WOOD ELEMENTARY SCHOOL AND IRVING B.
WEBER ELEMENTARY SCHOOL FROM LOW DENSITY SINGLE
FAMILY RESIDENTIAL (RS-5) TO NEIGHBORHOOD PUBLIC (PI);
PROPERTIES ASSOCIATED WITH WEATIlERBY PARK AND TIlE
SYCAMORE GREENWAY TRAIL FROM INTERIM DEVELOPMENT
SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL (ID-RS) TO NEIGHBORHOOD
PUBLIC (PI); PROPERTIES ASSOCIATED WITH COURT HILL
TRAIL FROM MEDIUM DENSITY MUL TI-F AMIL Y RESIDENTIAL
(RM-20) TO NEIGHBORHOOD PUBLIC (PI); AND PROPERTIES
ASSOCIATED WITH HARLOCKE HILL PARK FROM OVERLAY
PLANNED DEVELOPMENTIHIGH DENSITY MUL TI-FAMIL Y
RESIDENTIAL (OPDIRM-44) TO NEIGHBORHOOD PUBLIC (PI);
AND FIRE STATION #4 AT TIlE INTERSECTION OF SCOTT
BOULEVARD AND NORTIl DODGE STREET FROM RURAL
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June 12, 2006
Franklin:
Correia:
Franklin:
Correia:
Franklin:
Correia:
Franklin:
Correia:
Franklin:
Correia:
Franklin:
Correia:
Franklin:
Franklin:
City Council Work Session
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RESIDENTIAL (RR-I) TO NEIGHBORHOOD PUBLIC (PI).
PROPERTY LOCATED ON THE NORTH SIDE OF MELROSE
AVENUE, WEST OF HIGHWAY 218 FROM NEIGHBORHOOD
PUBLIC (PI) TO INSTITUTIONAL PUBLIC (P2).] (REZ06-00008)
(SECOND CONSIDERATION)
Itemj and k
I have a question about that. It says expedited actions requested.
Yes.
For that, this is the property that had been not in compliance with their current
zoning. Are they in compliance now?
Yes.
They are. They're up.
They have completed those items which were necessary for us to go forward with
this and then as this project is completed and they put in the plantings for it it will
come into full compliance with what we are requesting for now.
For now. Ok. But they're in full compliance with where they are before then.
Right. There were certain things that we told them they needed to do before this
rezoning would even be considered.
Ok. And they've done it.
That's been done.
Ok.
J and k are rezonings to the public category, various properties, and this is just
making it consistent with the new zoning, so those are second consideration.
I) CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE VACATING THE ALLEY
LOCATED NORTH OF BENTON STREET BETWEEN CLINTON
STREET AND DUBUQUE STREET. (VAC06-00001) (SECOND
CONSIDERATION)
L is the vacating of the alley that we're setting the public hearing for, this is the
second consideration, so on the 27th you will have the final reading on the
vacation ordinance, the public hearing on the disposition of the property, and the
resolution to dispose of it to the County.
m) CONSIDER A RESOLUTION APPROVING THE FINAL PLAT
OF CARDINAL RIDGE - PART THREE, lOW A CITY, IOWA.
(SUB05-00022)
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meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12,2006
Franklin:
Franklin:
Bailey:
Franklin:
Bailey:
Franklin:
City Council Work Session
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M is a resolution approving the final plat of Cardinal Ridge - Part Three, which is
in the area generally that is shown on the screen. This is Part Three, which is just
a portion of Cardinal Ridge. This is the piece that we needed to get a little sliver
of ground - there's my arrow - a little sliver of ground over here that had been
severed and annexed to Coralville. We needed to get it back to be part of the
street. It was just you know, when we finally got down to where it was
engineered and we knew exactly where the street was going be, there was this
little sliver in Coralville. So this is ready to go know.
n) CONSIDER A RESOLUTION APPROVING THE PRELIMINARY
PLAT OF HOLLYWOOD MANOR, PART 9, lOW A CITY, IOWA.
(SOO06-00005)
Item n is a resolution approving the preliminary plat of Hollywood Manor, Part
9. Hollywood Manor, Part 9 is at the end of Wetherby Drive and Tofting Avenue,
right east of Wetherby Park. It is a twelve-lot subdivision. Most of the discussion
regarding this subdivision has focused on compliance with the sensitive areas
ordinance and the regulation of groves and the preservation of trees, and we've
worked with the developer on this to get it to a point where we have maximized
the preservation of trees, particularly those which are specimen trees. The
recommendation from Planning & Zoning is to approve this, as is the
recommendation from staff to approve it.
Can you talk a little bit more about preservation of the trees and then that access
to Wetherby Park?
Ok. Well, the preservation of trees is under the provision of the sensitive areas
ordinance, which addresses groves.
Right, but there were some letters of concern that too many trees were being
taken out.
Ok. The x's are the trees that are going to be taken out, and I've brought a paper
version which I'll let you pass around, because then you can see the trees that are
being saved. We went through a number of iterations of this with the developer
to try and get the preservation of the trees that have been preserved. And
understand that there are some of these trees, such as the two in the cul-de-sac,
that the ordinance does not apply to, even though they are specimen oak trees -
the ordinance does not address specimen trees. It addresses groves of trees which
are explicitly defmed within the code. So the first thing to do was to define the
groves, which are those little bubbles or clouds or whatever one would want to
call them. And then, within those areas there were certain trees that were to be
taken out and generally speaking, in a subdivision, in an RS-5 zone you can
remove 50% of the trees in a wooded area. With a grove of trees, the code just
says to minimize the number of trees to be taken out, and so the idea is to try and
balance the actual development and allowing development to occur, with the
preservation of as many trees as you possibly can. What happened with this is the
Wetherby Drive cul-de-sac was pulled to the east as far as it could go, and that
was to try to keep it away from the grove that was just to the west of there.
Tofting Circle, as you'll notice, is kind of an odd shape, and that was to preserve
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those trees that are shown right in the center of the circle, since those were
identified by Terry Robinson as specimen trees, which also are in a grove.
Bailey:
But you're taking out of, talk about those trees
Franklin:
I'm not taking any of them out.
(laughter)
Bailey: You can mince and we can mince.
Franklin: Yes, we could mince.
Bailey: Talk about those trees at the top.
Franklin: Those trees at the top, I guess I would ask that tomorrow the developer's
representative will address some of this, but the argument that we have been
given is that it's necessary to take those out in order to get the road in and get a
buildable lot there, and I think it's probably particularly for lot 4, not for lot 3,
and for lot 3, it's a matter of those that are going to be in the right of way, and
when you construct the road are going to get taken, and then somewhere in there
in lot 3, you're going to have a driveway. Even if you kept the driveway to the
northeast, you probably still would only save maybe one tree before you're
getting into lot 4, where they're being taken out in order to get a buildable space
toward the front of the lot. So, that's the only way I can explain it.
Vanderhoef: Something that this brought up, and I spoke to Karyn about earlier today, that
setbacks on a cul-de-sac and the requirement for frontage and how we measure
frontage sometimes doesn't make a lot of sense for the size of the lots because
they become so deep there. And then when you talk about say a twenty-foot
setback, if you look at those lots and think about if the Toft Circle were a smaller
circle and the setbacks could be 30 or 40 feet on those and be consistent around
the circle, that there ought to be some way that we could create some options for
the placement and measurements on our zoning code specifically for cul-de-sacs.
I don't know whether anyone else is interested in having them take a look at that
but.
Champion: You're going to have a lot of driveways if you do that.
Vanderhoef: You may and you may not.
Franklin: What happens here is that Tofting, one of the things that needed to be done with
it was to elongate it in order to get sufficient lot-width on these. Wish it wouldn't
do that - on these lots as you go around the circle. If you pull that in - if you pull
this line in _ what happens then is these lots get narrower as you go in if you pull
that line in. And so then at the IS-foot setback, it does not meet the lot width
requirement for the code. Now, obviously you can only go in so far and then your
lot gets so narrow you wouldn't even have room to put a driveway in, and it does
mean that the majority of your lot width then is going to be taken by your
driveway, and you have to have a longer driveway to have it setback. I don't
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June 12, 2006.
Elliott:
O'Donnell:
Franklin:
Elliott:
O'Donnell:
Franklin:
Elliott:
Franklin:
Correia:
Franklin:
Elliott:
Franklin:
Elliott:
Franklin:
Correia:
Franklin:
City Council Work Session
Page 33
know. You have to trade off what you get or lose if you were to do that, and it's
going to be different with every single circumstance and probably a matter of
judgement in every circumstance as to which is better. That's what we've got
now.
I have two more requests for definition. Specimen tree - how does a specimen
tree differ from a tree?
Big.
It's really really big. No. Usually, I don't know, I'm not a forester, but it would be
a tree that had either significant age to it or it was of a species that was unusual
for here, and I can not remember what one of them is that's in Tofting Circle. It's
a palm tree in here or something, I don't know.
So the attractiveness, it doesn't have anything to do with whether it's a nice
looking tree or?
They're all nice looking.
I don't know, Bob, whether - I'm sure the condition of the tree is part of it, but it
would be a tree that would be unusual, that would be of a species you wouldn't
normally find, possibly, or that it is a very old tree that is in good condition.
Ok. And then, second, how many trees make a grove?
I was afraid you were going to ask that.
A bunch.
A bunch. I don't have the code in front of me.
Do we get, I don't need to know, we're talking about whether it's a grove or just
single trees, and I thought it would be nice. I can find out later from Karyn, that's
fine.
I'd have to look it up; I don't have it in my head.
I'll check with you later.
Ok. So anyway, the Commission is recommending approval on this. There are
some folks in the neighborhood who are concerned about it whom I'm sure you'll
hear from tomorrow night.
And how, so, how do we make sure that all the trees that are slated to stay
actually stay? Do they flag them? I mean, how does all that get communicated
with everybody?
Well, it'll be on the plat so that when the building permit is issued that these
should show up, there should be checking of this.
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June 12, 2006
Bailey:
Franklin:
Bailey:
Franklin:
City Council Work Session
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And who checks it?
HIS.
Ok.
Right, Doug? Yeah, he's back there snoozing. Yeah. Julie does it, Julie Tallman.
Ok? Move on?
0) CONSIDER A RECOMMENDATION TO THE JOHNSON
COUNTY BOARD OF SUPERVISORS FOR APPROVAL OF
REZONING OF 4.34 ACRES OF PROPERTY LOCATED IN
FRINGE AREA A ON THE SOUTH SIDE OF LINDER ROAD NE
FROM R, RESIDENTIAL TO COUNTY A, AGRICULTURAL.
(CZ06-00001)
Franklin: Item 0 is a recommendation, and is regarding a County zoning, and it is for some
property, 4 acres on the south side of Linder Road, from R, residential to County
A, agricultural, and it is to enable the expansion of the Agudas Achim Cemetary.
Because this is within our 2 mile extraterritorial jurisdiction, you are enabled to
comment on the rezoning and make a recommendation to the Board of
Supervisors. The Commission is recommending that the comment be for
approval of this rezoning.
Vanderhoef: With parking.
Franklin: Pardon me?
Vanderhoef: With parking.
Franklin: Yes. There's something in the letter that's to that effect, yeah. Ok. That's it on the
P & Z items. There is an item that Dee asked me about this afternoon, if! can
kind of, it's sort oflike a Council Time sort of thing. How about if! start talking
and you can yell at me if! can't say anything?
(laughter)
Al!enda Items
Franklin:
Bailey:
Franklin:
It's about the letter in the packet that is relative to sidewalks on Dubuque Road.
Good. Thank you.
First of all, we did an upgrade of that road in '86 or '87 that is from North Dodge
on the west leg of the Dubuque Road loop. It's a loop that goes in and comes
back out on Dodge Street, ok? By the Hy- V ee. Ok. When that upgrade was done
there were sidewalks that were included in that project but it was as an
assessment. The property owners protested the assessment, and the Council took
the sidewalks out of the project. There are sidewalks that exist in parts along
there; on the west side there's a sidewalk that's by the Hy-Vee property, and then
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....n____.__.___.___________.__..______~_~,._.._~._.__
June 12,2006
Correia:
Franklin:
Bailey:
Correia:
Franklin:
Elliott:
Bailey:
Correia:
O'Donnell:
Champion:
O'Donnell:
(laughter)
Atkins:
O'Donnell:
Wilburn:
City Council Work Session
Page 35
as you go farther up, when you get to Oaks Drive there's a sidewalk on that
corner lot, and that would have been required as part of the Hy-Vee development
and part of the Oaks Drive subdivision. On the east side there's about 200 feet
that were required when a subdivision was approved; I think it was in 2000 or
somewhere around in there for about 5 lots on the east side of Dubuque Road,
and there's a sidewalk in there. And then there's one lot at 1710 Dubuque Road
that has a sidewalk in front of it, which, I have no idea why.
I'm confused with where you are now - where are we?
On Dubuque Road.
By Moss's Dairy, go behind Hy-Vee up by Moss's Dairy, where it used to be.
Got you.
Ok. Yeah. And then, when you get to Bristol on Dubuque Road, the condition of
the road changes. The improvement project just went to Bristol, and then from
there on it's a rural cross-section. As the five plex is being built on the corner of
Dodge and Dubuque Road, that road will be improved to their driveway and
sidewalks will be placed on the west side of Dubuque Road in front of the five
plex, but that's the sidewalk situation on Dubuque Road.
I would just, for whatever it's worth, at least a year or two ago I had a couple of
people who live there wanted me to work at getting sidewalks along there. Then
they called back and said we just found out something will happen if sidewalks
go in and we don't want the sidewalks there. I forget whether it had something to
do with school buses picking up children or something like that, so there's - I'll
get back to you and see what the deal was.
That's usually what happens.
Shoveling, maybe?
One of the problems up there with that construction on Dodge is that it's such a
tangled mess a couple times during the day. The people are taking back roads
because of the bypass, so there's considerably more traffic on it, which is going
to eliminate itself as soon as we get Dodge finished.
And when is that going to be done?
Sometime in 2028.
'27.
I stand corrected.
Are those comments related to (can't hear) Karin?
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June 12,2006
Franklin:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Franklin:
Bailey:
Franklin:
Bailey:
Champion:
Franklin:
Champion:
Franklin:
O'Donnell:
Housim!
Wilburn:
Franklin:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Franklin:
Wilburn:
Elliott:
City Council Work Session
Page 36
Yes.
Thank you.
You said, wait, I'm sorry. You said there are sidewalks on Oaks? Oaks Drive?
Yes.
Because that's where the letters are coming from. They're coming from the
sidewalked street.
Right. And they want to connect it down to, along Dubuque Road down to Dodge
Street. And we've heard that before. I think probably it would be agreeable to
everybody if it was a City project.
That's mostly how things work, isn't it?
That would be across the street like behind Hy- V ee, go you know 5 or 6 blocks
(can't hear) future City park.
Where are you talking about?
On Dubuque Road.
It was requested by the neighborhood that we make it a City park when we were
looking at an affordable housing project up there.
They want more open space up there.
Ok. Housing.
While we have a lull, can I tell you what grove of tree means?
Yes.
Oh, terrific.
Enlighten us.
Thanks for asking, Bob.
10 or more individual trees having a diameter of at least 12 inches and whose
combined canopies cover at least 50% of the area encompassed by the trees.
Wow.
Thank you. Next will be a gaggle of geese.
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meeting of June 12, 2006.
.----~-_."~---------_._-------------
June 12, 2006
O'Donnell:
Elliott:
O'Donnell:
Elliott:
O'Donnell:
Wilburn:
Elliott:
Wilburn:
Elliott:
Wilburn:
Elliott:
Wilburn:
Champion:
City Council Work Session
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I used to have (can't hear)
Really.
It died.
Thanks.
It was quite a specimen.
Housing items. There is in IP2 a summary of a City Manager's understanding
where there seems to be some concurrence. We had hoped to continue working
our way through the recommendations from the scattered site task force in the
current information packet, IP.
Which date? June I? June 8?
June 8.
Thanks.
IP2 is his note and on the back of that is the - you're looking right at it.
Thank you.
Yep - there you go. My understanding, there's been some phone calls about
people asking us to stop and not have discussion policy. My communication to
folks was that we as a Council are reviewing the recommendations, we're asking
questions of each other for understanding and we are trying to assess where there
seems to be some type of concurrence or agreement that we may want to put
together something, whether it's policy or procedure, at a future date. I told folks
that that's great, if there's other groups that are out starting to work on issues
related to this and work together, but that there was enough Council Members
who had indicated an interest in some type of public discussion to hear those
types of things, but that we, the past Council had appointed this group and that
we had the recommendations, the recommendations had been out, and we're
going to continue working our way through these, but that we would still be open
to a discussion. I had that we left off at number 9. Ijust wanted to make sure I
didn't miss one. Is that correct? Let's see. #9 being that the City should ensure
that the needs of our assisted housing population are adequately met by the
community's service providers. The City should avoid imbalances between the
level of need and the ability to meet that need through human and social services.
The City should collaborate with public and private partners on comprehensive
services to those in poverty. Assistance in the areas of transportation, childcare,
housing, education, counseling - I'm sorry - education and employment can help
families become and remain self-sufficient. Any reactions to, what are the
reactions to that recommendation?
Can somebody boil that down for me into two sentences?
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City Council Work Session
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Correia: It doesn't seem to me that it's so much of a recommendation but as sort of an
observation and really a statement and we, what we do as part of City STEPS,
and what we do when we're assessing for the Aid to Agencies funding.
Vanderhoef: And certainly we have the collaborations going with the School Districts in the
neighborhood centers and working with neighborhood centers that are
independent of schools. So I think we're meeting those as we move along. I think
we recognize those needs in that it is a goal of ours to make sure that we
collaborate.
Correia: I mean and I trust that that, that's what our service providers the City is funding,
are doing.
Bailey: Well and, so I would ask the question though, is there more that we could be
doing to assess if the needs of the assisted housing population are adequately
met? I mean, what kind of, I mean how do we do that?
Champion: Well, I think the ultimate outcome of all this discussion, this scattered site
Council policies and review is to meet those needs, to make sure we're meeting
that need. (can't hear)
Bailey: I think this is more than housing needs, though, I think they are referring to more
than housing needs, so how do we review that is my question.
Correia: I think, sort of an example of how we, how the City is doing that is with, within
the public housing program, the family self-sufficiency, recognizing the needs of
folks within public housing for additional work supports and finding the funds
through federal HUDIRoss grant to provide those services, and they've done
credit counseling workshops and affordable home ownership workshops and
have a caseworker work individually with folks helping them break down the
barriers, working with Goodwill and other providers to make that happen. So I do
think that.
Wilburn: When we first, when we first started this discussion, Steve gave us the walk-
through and there was more of a conversation about an affirmation that yes, this
was something that the City should be doing because there's, there certainly are
some representatives in the City, people in the public who would disagree with
even what's on here, so I guess I'm just looking at it as maybe just an affirmation,
yes, these are things we should continue doing. So - go ahead, Dee.
Vanderhoef: Last time I talked about the continuum in the need and types of housing. I take
this one as this is continuum of care that is all-inclusive of housing and other
needs.
Wilburn: Any other reaction, comment on this one? I presume there's more nodding of
heads that there is affirmation that this is something that the City should be
doing.
Champion: Yeah.
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June 12,2006
Wilburn:
City Council Work Session
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Yes, yes, we're good. #10. The City should encourage low and medium-density
rental housing, such as duplexes, town houses and the like to be developed in
currently under-represented areas of the community. At present most rental
housing is confined to only
(cut off - tape ended)
Wilburn:
O'Donnell:
Correia:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Wilburn:
Vanderhoef:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
O'Donnell:
Champion:
. . . make it easier for families to compete with students for such housing.
You know, that's a real nice thought, you should encourage that, but what you're
going to have to provide is some type of incentives, and I don't really know what
that is, but it's, you know, that's a nice thing to say, but how do you reach that?
You have certain money you put up for taxes, payments and so forth, and you
know, I don't know that you can encourage it, but what are the incentives to make
it happen?
Well, and I also think we have neighborhoods that are built. I mean, when we're
looking at the census blocks we're looking at neighborhoods that already have
houses there and there's no lots for new development. You know, there may be
an infilllot here and there, but one small lot on North 7th Avenue is probably not
gonna be a place for an apartment complex.
And didn't we try to do some of this though through the zoning revision? I mean,
to create the opportunity to build duplexes and town houses in particular zones?
Yes.
The, but what jumps out at me is rental.
Except one of the things that we did in revising the zoning was limit the zero lot
lines to only comers in some zones or at least one zone, which I thought didn't
make much sense and seems to fly in the face of what this says.
Well, but we also
RS-5.
And RS-12 is the kicker.
We also said that we would try and encourage the RS-12, to actively look at it.
And we haven't seen any requests for rezone to RS-12 and we did talk about
doing, being more open to rezoning to RS-12 as people came with requests, but
we haven't seen that yet.
That's right.
We might see some of that now that the housing market is falling apart, that
might be a positive thing for affordable housing, because I don't think we can
build anymore half a million dollar houses. I mean, you can build them, but I
don't know if there's anybody else left to buy them. So I think maybe the
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June 12, 2006
City Council Work Session
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economic times and the amount of building we've had in Iowa City may help that
cause and people will start to look for something to build that they can sell. I
think, like Mike, it's going to be difficult. I do know that the Home Builder's
Association is also thinking about this. Though I don't think we know how to do
this. I think it's going to take a lot of people from the community to help us find a
way to write a policy to get this done, provide incentives for how we're going to
get it done, but we simply have got to do it. We've got to move our lower income
housing out into the community, where it's healthy. So, I don't have any answers,
but I think there's got to be some way to do it. Other communities I think are
addressing this problem too.
Elliott: Just so we have, just so we have zones that a builder knows, I can build a zero lot
line, a duplex, town houses in this zone. I don't have to say I have to meet these, I
can just go in there and build a town house, b~ild a zero lot line. Period.
Champion: And I think one of the thing we did on the east side with some of those big
developments where we've allowed apartments and town houses around the
development. So, I don't know why we couldn't do the same thing with other
developments, as to around the development put some lower priced housing or
some lower income housing.
Correia: Right.
Bailey: Well, what Glen was talking about the other, a couple of weeks ago with that
new development now that passed
Champion: Cardinal Ridge.
Bailey: Cardinal Ridge. I mean, that was a nice, potentially a nice mix. I know that they
haven't determined
Champion: Right. The perfect idea, to do something in there.
Vanderhoef: To be proactive, truly, being receptive, as Regenia said, of changing some zoning
if someone comes in and requests the RS-12, which we haven't seen yet, but the
other thing we have to be aware of is, as we annex a new zoning comes in. We
may have to work with the property owner at that time to make sure we have the
mix of zones in the new annexed areas. Because we can't wholesale go out and
change the zoning for.
(ringtone - laughter)
Bailey: We need a sign.
O'Donnell: Stand up and salute.
Vanderhoef: I think it behooves us to.
Wilburn: I'm sorry. Just the fact that Dale has that.
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June 12,2006
Bailey:
(laughter)
Elliott:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Champion:
Elliott:
Bailey:
ODonnell:
Wilburn:
Correia:
Bailey:
Correia:
Champion:
Bailey:
Correia:
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Not what I would have picked for your ringtone, Dale.
Well, I don't have to have music accompanying my remarks, but I am very
pleased, and from what you are saying, I am very pleased that the builders,
developers and housing authorities are getting together and talking and will be
bringing us some observations, recommendations from their point of view, so
that we're not just sitting talking among ourselves. We're getting some
information from the actual users of it and how we can best meet these needs. I'm
pleased that they're doing that.
Well maybe our response to this one could be more of just a question to those
groups - how?
How do we encourage. Right.
Because I'm in favor of what we need to do is scattered encouragement, not
requirement.
Well, I think we need to have a combination of both.
No, but the emphasis is on encourage first, require as a last resort.
But I keep coming back to this rental housing thing, and I don't fully - I think that
would be a good follow-up question. Why did they specifically identify rental? Is
that, I mean, to get a more affordable rental? Ijust think that would be a good
follow-up question, if we can possibly do that.
I think if we're looking at how? what can we do? how can we participate? what
do you expect of us? Because that's what it's going to come down to and I think it
might still (can't hear). Because if we're going to provide, it's going to be a major
factor in making this happen.
So, beyond the City's role, what are others' role?
I think this is also an issue of, it's talking about rental
Dispersing rental.
Dispersing rental, because of the statement it's only (can't hear) 31, but I think
this is also an issue of where does it make sense for rental housing to be located.
If you want to rent it you have to be able to see the Capitol building.
Or the Law School or the Medical School.
Or to be near to schools or transportation and services and all that type of thing. I
think that's also a consideration to be made. You just don't scatter because you
want it to be scattered. You need to figure out where does it make sense for
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription ofthe Iowa City City Council
meeting ofJune 12,2006.
June 12,2006
Champion:
Wilburn:
ODonnell:
Correia:
Vanderhoef:
Bailey:
Correia:
Bailey:
Correia:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Champion:
Correia:
Vanderhoef:
City Council Work Session
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persons that are in need of rental housing, affordable rental housing, for it to be
located as well.
Exactly.
Ok. So I think there's more of a question mark there. I think Steve's back there
taking notes but I don't even have to look back to see that he is. The City
should,#II, the City should take additional steps to increase sustainable home
ownership among its population earning less than 80% of area median income.
Additional steps. Home ownership. 80% of median.
I don't know what that means.
I think. I think the City is doing a good job of that. Maybe we can expand what
we're doing. I mean, family self-sufficiency program, helping people save
money, doing collaborations between the City and realtors to get information out
to folks. The Tenant to Owner Program, the Affordable Homeowner or whatever
that, Dream, Affordable.
Affordable Dream.
Affordable Dream Home.
It seems like we're doing quite a breadth of.
So what would additional steps look like?
That's what I mean, expansion of current.
Well is there something we're not, is there something we're missing? I don't
know.
Iffact,
Probably what we need is more money to put into it.
That's why it would be expansion.
Well, being very aggressive about purchasing units up front as we have done
before to stay on top of all new projects that are coming before us, providing and
so forth that we're selling enough houses. And as I understand it there is still only
a small percent of people that will qualifY for the loans, even though we're doing
the secondary loan. But we're keeping the secondary loan, which is allowing us
to make sure that that stays into the housing stock and be sold again the next time
to an 80% and below home ownership. So I think that's our best opportunity to
get into these units and I guess what I would say, this is one of the education
pieces that I'd like us to get out to the contractors. That when they're building say
20 units or 30 units and stuff, to talk with us right away about putting I or 2 units
in there for us to purchase up front. And certainly, that has some advantages to a
contractor if we purchase up front, because that's cash that they aren't borrowing
at that point in time.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12,2006.
June 12, 2006
Correia:
Bailey:
Vanderhoef:
Bailey:
Vanderhoef:
Bailey:
Vanderhoef:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
City Council Work Session
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We could direct staff to
Well, one of the things I think we do overlook, I mean, if you look at 80% of
median in Iowa City it can go from 60 to 80%, a lot of people wouldn't identify
themselves as somebody who would come into housing authority or access
services, and so perhaps there are additional programs. When I was at Iowa
Womens' Foundation, we always did a Women and Money program about home
ownership that was just open; perhaps there are additional educational programs,
because when you look at this, there are probably people who work in those non-
profits who are serving people who have challenges with housing who wouldn't
identify themselves as having housing needs who may want to get into a home,
and how are we reaching those people? Because our median income is very, very
high. And so people don't necessarily identify themselves as in need of services
or looking into housing authority or other housing services, so what are we
broadly doing to communicate about programs that are available.
(can't hear) does a bunch of advertising about some of these programs.
But, ok, that really, I'm talking about me, you know, when I was working in the
non-profit sector I would have never accessed housing authority, because that
doesn't fit my, my self-identify. I don't identify myself, I just identified myself as
not being able to get a house yet. And what are we doing more broadly I guess is
the question in that whole education point is we have to look more broadly if
we're talking about housing at different price points in our community, there are
teachers, fire fighters, people in non-profits, who don't access human services or
service programs that need this kind of information, and is this something that the
City could partner with, not through Housing Authority but at other, maybe the
library, where these people would naturally access that information.
I think before Steve came, the previous director, had some education, some
education materials around and I think she took it around to all the banks,
because that's where people go to see what they would qualify for for bank loans,
and then that's where they were getting some of that information out to families
who say you know, I want to buy a home but I don't have enough for the down
payment.
But what would it take
What would my payments look like if I were to buy this priced home and so
forth, and so certainly doing more education with our lending institutions is one
place to do it.
And they are doing it now, I mean. At several of the banks I've seen, they've got.
Well I mean, there are some realtors who partner with banks.
Yeah. In fact, on, what day is that, the 19th, on Monday, June 19th at 2:00, that's
where the realtors and I, on behalf of the City, are accepting that grant.
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Bailey: But I think what we have to acknowledge is that affordable housing in our
community is also an issue of our shrinking middle class. I mean, if you identify
as middle class, you may not necessarily try to access services. You just might
put off purchasing a home for a longer period of time, and so the City, maybe
publicizing and partnering with some of those programs to get that information
would be part, could be part, of an education campaign.
Champion: The other program that we have, and I think it's really a good one, we have low-
finance loans for housing rehab for people in this income bracket, which is really
I think a nice program. And I think the other thing we've done to keep our stock
of housing that we have is, I think our conservation neighborhood have really
preserved things, and a lot of our older neighborhoods have affordable housing,
and I think all those things are very important, but people do need to be aware
that they're out there. Once in awhile the City puts something in the water bill,
too.
Bailey: See, that's what I'm saying. When, maybe we can partner with the Association of
Realtors to help them better publicize some of their programs that they have
broadly targeted to community members. I don't know. I mean, I don't know if
that's a way to do it.
Vanderhoef: It doesn't hurt to keep re-educating the community on what we have.
Bailey: Right. Or who's doing it or promoting.
Correia: Well, I think there's other communities that have done some sector efforts, so,
some communities that have targeted, let's target police officers to get, living in
the community where they serve or thinking about Iowa City, you could do
teachers in the first five years to help you know, get, you know, young teachers
to stay here we can assist in getting them into affordable home ownership. I think
there are probably ways to partner with.
Bailey: I think that's a good idea, to do some sector focus. Because we have a lot of non-
profit workers, we have a lot of artists, we have a lot of, naturally, we want our
teachers living in our community. I mean.
Correia: And staying.
Bailey: And staying, yeah, so I think that makes a lot of sense.
Elliott: I suspect Steve knows already, but I'll be talking to him. One thing I'd like to
know is, probably realtors could tell us this, bankers could tell us that. What is
one of the largest stumbling blocks to starter homes? Is it ability to get the down
payment, so if we could make loans for down payment? Or the need for a second
mortgage, is that it? I'd kind oflike to know what the needs are. Because at least
when I was younger, it was a need to be able to obtain money for a down
payment. After the down payment, the home, the home payments had been lower
than we had been paying in rent. So find out what the stumbling blocks are, see if
we can find ways to address that.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12,2006
Bailey:
Correia:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Atkins:
Wilburn:
Elliott:
Atkins:
Champion:
Bailey:
Correia:
Bailey:
City Council Work Session
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And there are lots of programs from what I understand from attending all of
these, that can address that as well.
Especially for first time home buyers.
Yeah.
I have a question, Steve. When we did have the economic coordinator part time,
Steve Nasby, when he would talk with potential new employers coming into
town, did we provide information about some of these other programs, you
know, the housing rehab, those types of.
Generally speaking, the answer is yes. Usually when we would be recruiting a
company, one of the things that they asked is the availability of employees, and
that's a big definition, because the availability of employees, depending on what
they're going to pay per hour, do we have an adequate housing market that's
going to draw those, it's a bigger definition to me than simply that human being
that's going to perform labor for that company, and we would generally try to
provide that information, yeah.
Ok. Thank you.
Regenia was talking about economic development earlier and I've known in my
career some employers who were willing to provide loans, the employers were
providing loans, so that their employees couId be able to afford a home, because
they knew if you're going to buy a home here, the chances of you staying are
greater than if you're renting. So there are just a number of things to look at in
that respect.
You can also guarantee loans. You use the good offices of your finance, a big
company, like ACT, which probably has a number oflarge bank accounts, can
simply call upon those and say we will pledge that particular asset, and then it's
really up to the individual to go out and secure the loan. It's just that there's a
guarantee provided for it.
We also though, we're talking again about home ownership, but we also need
some affordable rental, combine the two. Some people don't want to own a home.
Right. Well, I kind of thought that was what #10 was maybe looking at was the
affordable rental, and then #11 moves on to sustainable home owners, and it
sounds like, from what Bob said, it would be helpful for #11 if we gathered some
additional information and understood barriers. I'm sure that information is out
there, and really get a better understanding of barriers to getting a home, and I
suspect it's the down payment.
I think there's probably credit issues.
Well, and that's another thing too that we could think about when it comes to. I
mean, what are our schools comprehensively teaching people about money
management? And I mean, just beginning to think about.
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Elliott: They're not.
Bailey: 1 know that the University has had some programs for VI students.
Elliott: They're not teaching them much about use of credit cards, I can tell you that.
Bailey: But I mean, I think credit card debt is also a barrier to a lot of young people who
want to get into a home.
Correia: And student loans.
Wilburn: Getting back to your, your rental question, to a big barrier for some folks is they
may have gotten a job where they can pay the rent, but they can't afford that first
month rent and the security deposit. And off and on there's been some small-time
programs to do that, but.
Bailey: Yeah, all the deposits to get yourself situated in a rental, even if you have a good
job, it's not going to pay you a pile of money the first month.
Wilburn: And one of the issues that was pretty, immediately came to the front for people
that were relocating after the tornado was the place where they were renting
currently would tell them the rent they could afford now, getting ready to transfer
over those, those deposit things were big issues for folks.
Bailey: You know, teachers don't get signing bonuses, unfortunately.
Champion: Not in Iowa City they don't.
Wilburn: Ok. I guess maybe just to sum up that was maybe some consensus in looking at,
more of an affirmation of what we're doing and potentially looking at expansion.
Is that fair?
Vanderhoef: Ok.
Atkins: I think you need to put the word in a lot, educate, educate.
Wilburn: Educate, yeah, yeah.
Bailey: Well and then really identify those, barriers, I mean, so we're clear on what the
barriers in getting into sustainable home ownership. I mean, because sustainable
is the key word here.
Wilburn: Ok. Next one - #12. The City should develop a mandatory inclusionary zoning
policy with incentives for new housing developments. An inclusionary zoning
policy holds great promise for affordable housing at minimal cost to taxpayers.
Vanderhoef: I'd like to defer that one until such time as we hear back from the collaborative
group.
Elliott: Hear. I agree.
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Wilburn: Steve?
Atkins: I'm fine with that. I was just going to say, do we all understand inclusionary
zoning? Or do we need to
Bailey: How about if we agree upon a definition sitting around this table so we know
what we're talking about?
Elliott: Sounds good.
Vanderhoef: That's fine.
Wilburn: Karin. Do you have a definition we can use?
Champion: I think we all have a different one.
Franklin: Were you all going to share (can't hear)
Bailey: No, you're going to give us the official one, because you'll give us the official one
eventually, right?
O'Donnell: I'd like it written down.
Vanderhoef: On your forehead or on your arm?
Elliott: Do you feel like a dictionary tonight?
Franklin: Typically, an inclusionary zoning ordinance, and then we're talking about
requiring. There's been discussion about incentivized, I think that's a word,
inclusionary zoning, and that's not what I'm talking about. Inclusionary zoning as
an ordinance typically has a requirement that with any development, that a
certain percentage of the units be at a price point that is determined based on the
local market. I think you probably find them most often in very high markets, in
which you will have half a million, two million dollar houses, and there will be a
requirement that there be some $250,000.00 houses in that development. So,
that's how it's reflective of whatever the local housing market is and what you
want to have in it, or what the community decides is appropriate. There can also
be requirements that there is, instead of the actual unit being provided, that there
is a fee in lieu of, which then is put into a housing fund, which is used then to
fund affordable or assisted housing. So there's variations, but the overall concept
is for the right to develop that there is a requirement that a certain percentage of
the units that are going to be created be for affordable housing, whatever that is.
Wilburn: Ok. There's your definition.
Correia: I have a report that I actually got off the internet from the Center for Community
Change Inclusionary Zoning which also looks at different communities that had
voluntary inclusionary zoning and then moved to mandatory inclusionary zoning
and sort of what the difference was in terms of number of units that were
produced and the required, sort of best practices around what elements should
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12,2006.
June 12,2006
Bailey:
Champion:
Bailey:
Correia:
Wilburn:
Correia:
Wilburn:
Correia:
Bailey:
Correia:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Champion:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Champion:
Wilburn:
City Council Work Session
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good policies include that are worked together with developers and the
development community to make sure that it.
How long is that report?
If you could get copies of it.
Yeah. I think we should include it as part of an info. packet and then people will
have that.
And there's examples, like examples in there too.
Does it give examples of time frames for implementation in there or not?
I'm not sure about that.
That's all right.
But I think that we could definitely, some of the jurisdictions that they give as
examples of successful inclusionary zoning policies include Montgomery
County, Maryland; Fairfax County, Virginia; Irvine, California; Santa Barbara.
So.
Are there any comparable size cities?
Boulder.
That's still bigger.
Ok. Couple folks wanted to hold off on this until we hear from.
But could we include that information in an info. packet? Then it would be
widely available to the community. It might be a jumping off point for
discussion, or not.
I'd be happy to have a copy.
Yeah, I'd like to have a copy too.
Ok.
So beyond that, do the rest want to hold off until we hear our recommendation
from this other group?
I don't mind holding off. I'm definitely for inclusionary zoning, but I don't have a
definition of that. I have your definition, but how you do it, I'm not so sure about
how you do it.
Or how it might apply to this community.
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Champion: Or how it might apply. I don't want to put a $35,000.00 house in the middle of
Walnut Ridge, for instance, but.
O'Donnell: But that's inclusionary zoning.
Champion: Not necessarily.
O'Donnell: Well, I think, I think we did it at The Peninsula, basically.
Correia: I think, well, I think some policies include different things of, fees in lieu of that
go into a housing trust fund. I think there's lots of ways to create an inclusionary
zoning policy that reflects the issues in the community in a way that makes sense.
I don't think there is one only way to adopt an inclusionary zoning policy.
Champion: Right.
O'Donnell: Did we not say at The Peninsula that 20% of the properties should be for 80% of
the median income?
Correia: Or 10%?
Elliott: I think an answer is forthcoming.
Bailey: I think you should just sit up there.
Franklin: In The Peninsula, the way the agreement is with the developers, that 10% of the
units must be made available to a local affordable housing entity, or something to
that effect, so there is no income guideline put on it, but our local affordable
housing entities, such as the Housing Authority, Housing Fellowship, people
such as that, would be the entities that these units need to be made available to
them.
O'Donnell: We do not have for 80% of median income? It does not have that?
Franklin: No.
O'Donnell: Where did I get that? Figment of my imagination.
Franklin: You don't want me to tell you.
Vanderhoef: We own that land, so we did that in a conditional agreement when we sold the
land. But I have a question for Eleanor. Just this little piece of hearing them say
money in lieu of. Would you give us opinion on what is even legal in the state of
Iowa, since.
Di1kes: Well, fees in lieu of are going to be trickY in Iowa. But I can't, until I know how
this, the structure that we'd be developing and how we might be working that, I
couldn't give you a conclusive opinion, but they will be trickY in Iowa.
Vanderhoef: That's kind of what I thought.
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meeting of June 12,2006.
June 12,2006
O'Donnell:
Bailey:
Champion:
Elliott:
O'Donnell:
Elliott:
Champion:
Elliott:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Bailey:
Elliott:
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So.
So I don't want to hold off completely in discussing this. I'm willing to hold off
on discussing a policy implementation, but if we can look at this article and
discuss it a little bit more so we increase our understanding of what inclusionary
zoning is and isn't, I think that might be helpful in moving things forward a little
bit. Would that be an ok compromise position, Bob, Dee?
Yes.
Yes, I think so, I think one of the things you need to look at, I can remember
when I left the Housing Commission, that I left, I think a part of the memo was
that the price of housing in Iowa City hurts us both, at both ends. It hurts us in
starter homes, because we have fewer starter homes because of the higher price
of those homes, but it also hurts us at the high end, because people who want to
spend a million dollars for a home are going to get more for their money if they
build it outside of Iowa City. So, when you say inclusionary zoning, you're also
saying that the price of the other houses in those areas are going to increase.
I don't think they're going to get more if they build outside of Iowa City. Do you
have a specific
Oh, I know they do.
If you have (can't hear) dollars to spend, you might get one half ofa (can't hear)
for a bathroom.
I know that some people have built houses outside because they can get more
house for their money. All I'm saying is every time you ask a developer to, and
I'm not saying we shouldn't, but I think when we keep in mind, when we ask
them to defer some part of it, that that increases the cost of everything else.
But if we increase our understanding of what incusionary zoning is and this
collaboration comes forward and talks about what their perspective is, I think it
would be helpful to have that understanding. I mean, we obviously understand
that it's hard to control material costs and land costs that go in too, but there have
to be some ways to look at how could we get to that? Could we even get to that?
And maybe if we just keep moving our understanding a little bit forward, I'm not
talking about making some policy decisions, but reading this article and
discussing it a little bit more.
I couldn't agree more. I'm just saying, whenever you do one thing it's, physics
says you're going to cause a relationship to everything else around, and I think
we need to be aware.
Well, I want to ask the land development physicists if that's actually the case.
Oh, they are great physicists.
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(laughter)
Wilburn: Ok. So that.
Bailey: So we read our homework and.
Champion: (can't hear) start with that
Bailey: Well, I mean, we may think:, I don't know, we may think Santa Barbara was
wrong. We can talk about that.
Champion: They probably are.
Bailey: Yeah.
Wilburn: Ok.
Karr: Ross, just to clarifY. You want to hold to implement it until the recommendation
is received from.
Champion: No, we're going to.
Karr: You're going to get the, you're going to discuss policy and get the article and
review that, you're going to hold.
Champion: We're going to do something with inclusionary zoning, but not a policy.
Bailey: Not a policy development necessarily.
Correia: An educational process for ourselves.
Champion: For ourselves.
Bailey: I'm giving us the assignment so I actually do the work.
Karr: The collaborative group you're referring to is the?
Champion: We don't know.
Vanderhoef: The home builders.
Elliott: Home builders, developers, Housing Authority, that sort of.
Bailey: They're going to write us a letter, right?
Wilburn: Yes.
Elliott: Yes.
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Wilburn: Ok. All right. #13. The City should expect owners and managers of all rental
housing to manage their facilities adequately.
Champion: Well that's a silly one.
O'Donnell: I don't know what that means, either.
Correia: Don't we have that in the nuisance ordinance or something?
Bailey: Absolutely.
Vanderhoef: Let's go to the next one.
Wilburn: Ok. The
Bailey: Do we just affirm that?
Wilburn: The entire thing, or?
Bailey: Yes.
Elliott: No, actually we want them to manage it ineffectively, really.
Bailey: We don't want to enforce it.
O'Donnell: We control that through inspection. Of course we do.
Wilburn: Can't I finish reading the?
Bailey: No.
Champion: Boring.
Correia: # 14?
Wilburn: No. #13.
Correia: Oh, you're reading the whole thing.
Wilburn: I really haven't finished reading it.
Elliott: Ross is throwing his weight around here.
Wilburn: The task force encourages vigorous enforcement of existing policies, as much
public opposition to assisted housing results from deficient maintenance and
management of unassisted tenant populations as a mere 1,150 of the
approximately 15,000 rental units are assisted, it is important to monitor all rental
facilities. Now what would you like to?
O'Donnell: How many did you say were assisted?
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Wilburn: 1,150 of approximately 15,000 rental units.
Correia: One percent? One half of one percent?
Elliott: But they say the word mere. I think that one out of every, anywhere from 12 to
15 is not a mere number.
Correia: Isn't that like 1%?
Wilburn: It's about 10%.
Atkins: 10% is 1500.
Correia: Oh, ok.
Bailey: No, it's 7%.
O'Donnell: It's 1500 out of 15,000.
Baeth: 1,000.
Bailey: 1,150.
O'Donnell: 1,150. Ok. I stand corrected.
Correia: 7%.
Vanderhoef: Past your bedtime?
Bailey: Needs a cup of coffee.
Correia: Is this something to trigger just looking at the nuisance ordinance?
Atkins: You know, we have the task force, the housing task force, which really did a very
good job of identifying. We may need to pull that report out, go back through it
agam.
Correia: What report?
Atkins: It preceded you and I think Regenia as well.
Bailey: It did.
Atkins: on the City Council. The housing assistance task force where the, it was an
attempt to understand many of these issues, particularly with neighbors
concerned about the parties, remember all of that?
Correia: Right.
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Atkins: We had a pretty extensive report written which you might find helpful. I'll
Correia: But wasn't there policy? I mean, I remember policies
Bailey: Well, here's a question.
Correia: Let's look at how that policy is being implemented or enforced.
Vanderhoef: How about instead of how it's being enforced, let's get a report on how many
complaints that we have had to do. We haven't had an update on that for.
Bailey: That would be helpful.
Atkins: Yes. I think that's a good idea, prepare another report.
Bailey: Or, or, also looking at, everything, this particular ordinance is complaint driven,
and the inspection or problems with rental housing, regardless if it's assisted or
not, they're all complaint driven. We could be a little bit more proactive if we
have ordinances on the books such as the grass, that carne up last month. We
could be a little bit more proactive as a community and decide to do so, and it
doesn't have to just target rental units. It could target, you know, these kinds of
ordinances. We don't, they don't have to be complaint driven. I mean, I don't
know. That could be a step. I don't really think that people who are mowing the
grass or following ordinances should have to take the time to complain about
other people who aren't. I think if a City worker or somebody is in the
neighborhood and notices a violation, I think we should encourage them to
enforce those ordinances.
Vanderhoef: Turn it in.
Bailey: Yeah. To follow the regular protocol. I'm not saying.
Vanderhoef: It just has to get turned in so that they can send the letters.
Bailey: Yeah. But it shouldn't have to be, you know, a complaint-driven sort of thing.
Champion: I don't know. That's too much of a big brother for me. I don't.
Elliott: Well, one of the things that, for instance, when I first came on the Council, I
believe we had in excess of a hundred City-owned residential properties. It's now
down in the 80s, but I know, I spent some time with Steve Rackis and his staff
and I realized that those City-owned properties that are rented are maintained
quite well.
Champion: Very well.
Elliott: Which caused me to kind of suffer my concerns about City-owned property a bit
and if the other non-City-owned rental properties, if there's a way to get at them
the same way the City does, so I'd certainly like to look at a way of monitoring
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Bailey:
difficult property situations more effectively than, and address them more
effectively than we're able to do now.
In our neighborhood association we have one person who calls in and calls in a
lot of the same properties over and over and over. I mean, that person takes time
to do that. It seems to me if a property has proven itself to be a challenge,
whether it's rental or owner-occupied, there should be some other way to be more
proactive about keeping it in line.
Atkins:
I think you'd be surprised the number of you that call me or Doug with just
routinely, pick up the phone and say could you check ]23 Street.
Bailey:
Yeah, but.
O'Donnell:
That's complaint driven.
Atkins:
Yeah.
(laughter)
Vanderhoef: Our complaint driven ordinance - of course we do drive-by assessment.
Bailey: Yeah, but I mean, City workers, if they're in the neighborhood, can do the same
thing - it's not targeting particular neighborhoods, it's, you know, look around,
notice.
Elliott: We have two groups of employees, City employees who are in every street in our
town almost on a weekly basis, the police and the, and the garbage retrieval
people.
Champion: And the water people.
Elliott: And the water people. There's three.
Atkins: Yeah.
Bailey: We have a lot of opportunities.
Elliott: I just think when they see something it's appropriate that they
Bailey: Follow up. Yeah.
O'Donnell: But I, I think that happens on a regular basis. I don't, I don't know what we're
trying to change.
Atkins: Yeah. Our folks
Bai]ey: Well, part of it is, telling citizens that that ordinance is enforced by complaint,
and you have to file a, you have to complain. Somebody has to call in. Instead of
a police officer driving down Church Street and seeing that somebody's grass is
too long, Ed Moreno had to call in and complain about that.
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meeting of June ]2,2006.
June 12, 2006
Champion:
Bailey:
Champion:
Bailey:
Elliott:
O'Donnell:
Bailey:
O'Donnell:
Bailey:
O'Donnell:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Bailey:
Correia:
Bailey:
Correia:
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But you know, my problem with that is, if my neighbor's grass, I don't know,
just, just, this is probably not a good time for this discussion. My neighbor's grass
is too long, and the water man comes down and he calls it in, or maybe I walked
over to my neighbor's house the night before and told them I would appreciate
they mow their grass, they were going to mow it that afternoon, so now they got
a complaint from the City. I mean, I don't know, it just seems to me if you have a
problem with your neighbor you go and talk to your neighbor.
Sometimes that works and sometimes that doesn't.
But if it doesn't work then you have to do something else, I agree. But that's my
problem.
But you can spend hours working on these kinds of problems. In a neighborhood
that has a lot of rental properties, and some of the landlords don't necessarily live
there, and some of the tenants are not necessarily responsive to neighborhood
requests. You can spend a long time. If it's a chronic problem house, I don't know
why neighbors have to spend the time, when they could be mowing their lawns
and doing other things. I don't know. I think we could be a little bit more
proactive in this department.
Next.
What do you do afternoons?
I drive by your house and make sure it's all up to speed.
Don't mention my tree.
I saw that stump.
Did not.
Did too.
Ah, taking it we're just moving on through this.
Are we going, can we do something that's more proactive than only complaint
based ordinance enforcement?
This did come up at our last meeting.
I'm not talking about big brother, I'm just talking about if you notice it.
If we notice it or you're talking about City staff notice it?
City staff.
So now if City staff notice it they don't do anything?
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June 12, 2006
Atkins:
Correia:
Atkins:
Bailey:
Atkins:
Bailey:
Atkins:
Correia:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Correia:
Atkins:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Atkins:
Bailey:
Dilkes:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Elliot:
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I think they do.
You think they do.
I think they do, yeah.
I can't imagine that that's consistently done, but.
When you have 600 people, is everybody going to do it? No. Are those that are
out and about that see something is offensive, yes.
Then why are we telling people it's complaint based?
I'm not telling anybody that.
You can't ensure that somebody is going to see it, staff.
I don't sense.
Ifwe've had an ordinance on the book, we should, books, we should be more
proactively enforcing them. I've said that for, I don't know, 2 1/2 years and I'll
keep saying it.
Well, can't we just, take some time to review the current ordinance and how it's
being, what the complaints are.
Yeah, the
I believe she's talking about allover, she's talking about more beyond
No, I'm talking about housing, I'm not just talking about, no, I'm talking about
housing ordinances generally, not just the results of the housing task force.
Let us get you that update on the task force. I think that would be a good
springboard for that discussion. We'll do that, I mean, this Summer for you.
And we are going to change the ordinance on
When we're talking about the task force, you're talking about the process we went
through where you got the, it looks like we're talking about housing ordinances in
general and then the process that we go through where we hold co-compliance
meetings, ifthere's been 2 violations and that kind of thing?
Yes. Yes. Yes.
Can we just get a report? Do we have to read all the memos? I mean, I've read
them.
That was the sofas on porch thing.
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meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12, 2006
Karr:
Atkins:
Elliott:
Dilkes:
Elliott:
Champion:
Elliott:
Champion:
Atkins:
Bailey:
Correia:
Champion:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Atkins:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Champion:
Wilburn:
Champion:
Wilburn:
Champion:
Bailey:
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That was (can't hear - all talk)
This is a little more, far more extensive, you know, we have.
No,I.
Sofas on the porch was one of the things that was talked about as that code was
being established.
That's the thing that triggered my memory.
It might be helpful to have the minutes, not the minutes but the summary report
from that group.
Yeah.
Because they covered a lot of things.
They did a good job with that, I thought they did a good job.
Can we just get a report?
How long.
It wouldn't be all their minutes and all that.
I believe Steve did say report.
We'd get an update - that's what Dee asked for, right?
On the complaints, yeah.
You ask for an update, we can either do it verbally or prepare a report or both.
Written, please.
Ok, that will be taken care of. I've got 14 and 15 here.
How late are we staying?
What's that?
How late are we staying? It's midnight.
We've got 2 more here.
Oh, it's only 9:00.
2 more items here, and then 1,2,3,4.
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June 12,2006
Wilburn:
Correia:
Bailey:
Champion:
Correia:
Champion:
Correia:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Correia:
Champion:
Correia:
ODonnell:
Wilburn:
Correia:
Atkins:
Correia:
Atkins:
Correia:
Atkins:
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#14. In conjunction with its review, the consolidated plan City STEPS, the City
should provide for a yearly review of fair share data so that the matrix provided
with these recommendations is updated and conditions within block groups
change. The task force recommends that City staff, HCDC coordinate this annual
task.
Well, I have problems with the fair share data matrix, so I don't think I would
support.
I agree with that. I have a lot of problems with that. So. I don't think an update is
going to provide me information that.
I don't like that word, fair share. I don't think it would have to be done on a
yearly basis, because things just don't move that rapidly.
Well I just have, I have a problem with using the fair share data matrix,
generally.
We don't have to use it.
What?
Well that's the recommendation.
That's the recommendation.
That's the recommendation, that we use the fair share data matrix to make
decisions on.
What would we use to make decisions?
What the need is in the community, does it make sense, is it affordable, is it a
good project, are they accountable for public funds, is it well-designed.
Sounds better.
I would guess that
That's what the Housing Commission does when they.
That's virtually case by case.
Well, but they do case
I understand.
They receive the applications and they evaluate them with their criteria and they
make the recommendation.
I understand.
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Correia:
We wouldn't do that; I mean, we would
Elliott:
Are you saying you agree with the scattered site philosophy?
Davidson:
So we are looking at the full range of two
(cut off - end of tape)
Champion: . . . we can change the terminology, because it's, the fair share, well I don't know how
we can do it. I'm trying to think how you could do, what would be acceptable to
me.
Correia: Inclusionary zoning.
Elliott: The way I look at it, personally, is I look at sections of town and what's
happening in those sections or neighborhoods and particularly, what's happening
in the schools in those neighborhoods.
Champion: Ok. So how else are you going to explain that, with the terminology fair share
matrix, what I don't understand why people don't like that.
Correia: You know, I, I
Vanderhoef: I still think it's a case by case that we
Correia: But you know, yeah I do, and I think. Bob, if we are thinking about, because
Grant Wood gets thrown up a lot, so if there's, whatever the percentage of free
and reduced lunches - it's in here - but the percentage of assisted housing is very
low, 10% or something. So if the free and reduced lunch is 40% those 40% of
kids on free and reduced lunch are not living in those assisted housing units, so
assisted housing is not what is, is, contributing to school issues. Some of the
things related to schools is the boundaries that the school district draws and what
they, how they make decisions. Kids that live in Pheasant Ridge get bus passes,
bussed past Thorn. Thorn has very low free and reduced lunch. Roosevelt has
higher free and reduced lunch. So some of those things have to do with policies
that the school district has related to how they draw their boundaries and less to
do with where assisted housing is. And some of the issues related to schools that
are struggling a little bit with this achievement has to do with kids moving in and
out. Not so much that they're on free and reduced lunch, but they're in unstable
housing so they don't stay in the same school through the year because their
family is trying to find stable housing, but they don't achieve as weB in school,
and that creates problems in the classroom. So if we increase housing stability in
any given neighborhood, it's going to help those children and that school.
EBiott: But clearly the schools you mentioned are the schools that draw from the areas
that have the largest number of assisted rental units.
Correia: But even in some of those, in some of the block groups, where we looked at
assisted housing, we had affordable home ownership houses in that block group,
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. City Council Work Session
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and the families that lived in those houses make too much money even to be on
free and reduced lunch, so we're counting that unit as an assisted unit
contributing to a free and reduced lunch issue at that school when that family
isn't eligible for free and reduced lunch. So those numbers don't really mean
anything to what we're trying to.
Champion: I'm not looking at assisted housing in neighborhoods. I'm looking at free and
reduced lunch in schools. Because that's a great definition of the economic
viability of the kids that are going there.
Correia: Well, what I'm saying is it doesn't have anything to do with assisted
Champion: It could very well not.
Elliott: Oh, I would not agree with that.
Correia: Not to the extent of what we're trying to say
Champion: You don't even have to have a child to live in assisted housing, for one thing.
Correia: Right.
Elliott: T here are some districts and sub-districts within the school districts that aren't
problem areas, but the school district in general has a lot of students in, whether
you are looking at assisted rental housing or whatever it is.
Correia: I think we asked the wrong question. I'm sorry. I think we asked the wrong
question. I think when schools are not, in more meetings when I'm talking to
folks in schools where some of the issues are happening is it has to do with
numbers of new kids coming in in the middle of the year, leaving, going
somewhere else, coming in. It's less, and, then there may be a correlation,
because those families are struggling because they can't find a place to live that's
affordable all year long so their kids can get stable in the classroom.
Champion: Or they move in and out of town.
Correia: Right.
Champion: I wouldn't just blame the housing market for that. I mean there are other issues to
do with that problem.
Correia: Right. It's the transiency issues.
Champion: Transiency, that's right.
Correia: Yeah. Not so much
Vanderhoef: And certainly we have housing stock that is built that is in different price ranges
in different school districts and certainly we still want our kids as much as
possible to go to the neighborhood school. So if we have the working poor that
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have purchased some of our Housing Authority's houses, if we still own some
there, if there are other housing groups that have purchased houses there because
it's in the affordability, because their budgets are such that they're going to buy as
many units as they can to provide for as many families. So we're not going to
change that housing stock. There's nothing we can do about it. The school district
can, as you say, change boundaries, but it defeats a lot of their other purposes of
walk-in availability for the students and to build community with those people
who do live in that area.
Correia: Except for they
Vanderhoef: But 1 think we are spinning our wheels having this conversation. 1 think, as 1 read
through all of the minutes of the Commission that worked on this, they struggled
mightily with this, trying to put this into some sort of perspective and it truly
wasn't possible, other than that they had identified problem areas of this more
housing stock that serves lower income folks but the rents are lower.
Bailey: I don't' agree though that it's spinning our wheels to point out to the school
district that some of their boundaries are problematic, just as they brought this
problem to City Council that it's a housing problem. But if you are bussing the
Forest View trailer kids to Mann and Shimek is actually your closest school with
a low level of free and reduced lunch, I would suggest that the school can make
some changes. If they're asking us to make changes, I think we can talk to
another entity about making changes as well.
Champion: (can't hear) and part ofthe reason that they might do that, I mean, the reason that
it might be done is English as a second language may be the problem.
Bailey: Sure.
Champion: Also, another condition would be that when they move kids out of a community,
like out of Pheasant Ridge, or out of a specific trailer park, when they're moving
those kids out of there, they want them to move as a group, so they have to have
a school that they can move as a group, because they want them to keep their
neighborhood.
Bailey: Right, but Shimek is the closer school when you talk about that example.
Champion: But it doesn't, Shimek may not have
Bailey: Right. It might not have that many spots, but, I guess, I think that we have as
much right to talk to the school districts about what their policies are and how
they can change their policies to achieve some of our community-wide goals.
Champion: Right. I agree. And I know one time when we moved kids out of University
housing it was because one of the schools was beyond what we could have for
free and reduced lunch, and so we were forced to move, we chose to move a
group that could stay together at least at that neighborhood, so the school district
also deals with that.
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Bailey: Right. Well I grew up (can't hear) four schools in four years.
Champion: I think what you're asking are valid questions, very valid questions, I really do.
Bailey: Yeah, and I think that we can talk about this because this is a community-wide
issue, and the school board did toss this in the Council's lap, so.
Champion: It's a good question. Somebody should ask them that question.
Bailey: Well, I wanted to have a, I indicated I think there's an agreement that we would
sit down with the school board
Elliott: You bet.
Bailey: and talk about these kinds of issues once we had worked through some of this
and I think that that should be a question for discussion that come up.
Elliott: Yeah, I think that's, the school board has said they have some concerns about
what the City has done and might well continue to be doing. We have just
expressed some concerns about what the school board has done and might
continue to be doing, plus a point that you made at the last meeting, Connie is, as
much as we value zoning, one of the things that zoning has done is to decrease
diversity.
Champion: Diversity (can't hear)
Elliott: Because we set aside high income and high-end houses and lower-end houses
and we continue to de-diversify our City.
Wilburn: This item's been a very rich discussion. I'm not sure that we're gonna be able to
address that one tonight. Do we take the next one, a short one, or do we want to
move on to maybe a quick break and then finish up the agenda items?
Champion: We have tomorrow to finish the agenda items, don't we?
Correia: Well, and 15 is related to 14, so.
Bailey: Yeah. 14 and 15 are related.
Wilburn: So, want to move those 2 to tomorrow?
Bailey: Next time. Or tomorrow?
Wilburn: Tomorrow or the next time.
Bailey: What, are we carrying over the housing discussion to tomorrow I guess would be
the question.
Vanderhoef: At the end. Just make sure we get through all the other stuff.
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Atkins: We're scheduled.
Champion: We're meeting at 5:30.
Atkins: Yeah, you're scheduled for 5:30 tomorrow. Is that still your plan?
Elliott: Yeah.
Atkins: Also keep in mind that you'll be speaking from the dais. So when you're having
your discussion it'll be a little more formal.
Wilburn: It'll be a little, yeah.
Bailey: Are we going to try and get through any of these other items tonight?
ODonnell: We can get through them tomorrow.
Wilburn: Well, urn.
Elliott: I need a break if we are.
Wilburn: What I was suggesting is take a quick break, and at the minimum
Bailey: I'd like to chop off (can't hear)
Wilburn: Do we need to talk about the Council appointments tonight, or save that one for
tomorrow?
Bailey: I think we can talk about that tonight. That won't take too long.
Champion: Ifwe're meeting at 5:30 we only have Council
Vanderhoef: And let's check ifthere are many agenda items that we want to do tonight.
Correia: Yeah.
Wilburn: Ok.
Bailey: Yeah.
Wilburn: Let's take 5.
Bailey: Well, we have to do the schedule of pending discussion items, which may take
some time tomorrow too.
Champion: That's fine.
Wilburn: Take 5. 5 minutes.
Elliott: Dave Brubeck.
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Wilburn: Yeah, that's right.
Wilburn: You know folks, if we, if we press on here and if we table those final 2 housing
items, if we press on here then we won't have to come in until 7:00 tomorrow
night. Is that what folks want to do?
Correia: That sounds like an incentive.
Elliott: I'm happy either way.
Champion: Will we have people here, though? 1 mean, if somebody shows up here.
Bailey: Yeah.
Correia: It says only (can't hear)
Vanderhoef: Yeah, the housing
Council ADDointments
Wilburn:
Correia:
Wilburn:
Champion:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Bailey:
Yeah, and so, it wasn't necessary. Council appointments. There was a Historic
Preservation one, I think.
Tim Toomey.
Tim. Is that all right?
Tim Toomey is an architect, right?
Yeah.
One candidate for one position sounds good to me.
Ok.
Seems to work out.
So we will make that appointment tomorrow night. The next appointment is for
HCDC. I have a conflict of interest and cannot participate in discussions so, it's
all yours, Regenia.
Ok. So we have an opening for one unexpired term plus a three-year term, and
then one unexpired term ending September 2007 and we have applicants for both
positions, so let's talk about.
Now, McCormally applied for just one of the positions, right?
Yes.
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Vanderhoef: Mmm hmm. That, that might be kind of easy if, I'm very impressed with him for
that position, so.
Elliott: However.
Correia: Now that we have 6 males and I female serving right now, I was looking for
some, to create some gender balance and appoint two women.
Elliott: I like.
Correia: And I liked Holly and Kara.
Elliott: I would go along with that except I like Marcy DeFrance.
Vanderhoef: So do I. I think she's.
Champion: Well, then how about Holly for the unexpired term and Marcy for the other one?
Correia: Marcy didn't.
Champion: Holly applied
Bailey: Holly applied for the other one.
Correia: Oh, right right right.
Bailey: So, do we for Marcy, do we have for the unexpired plus three year term? We
have 1,2
Elliott: Dee, for Marcy?
Bailey: 3.
Elliott: No. Mike, Connie, Dee, Bob.
Bailey: Oh, did you? Ok, I didn't see Mike. Ok. So Marcy for the unexpired term plus
three year term. And for the other one you said Holly, Amy?
Correia: Mmm hmm. Who else for Holly?
Champion: Well, I'm tom.
Bailey: I'm supportive of Holly.
Vanderhoef: How many for McCormally?
Champion: Well, I kind of like the idea for gender balance on that, also.
Vanderhoef: Well I don't disagree with that, but I think he's the best candidate we've got.
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meeting ofJune 12,2006.
June 12,2006
Correia:
Champion:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Correia:
Elliott:
Correia:
Bailey:
Vanderhoef:
Bailey:
Correia:
Elliott:
Bailey:
Champion:
Bailey:
Champion:
Elliott:
Bailey:
Champion:
Bailey:
Champion:
Bailey:
O'Donnell:
Correia:
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Well also, in terms of having somebody who.
I can support Kara over Holly.
Is kara the student?
Kara is unemployed and disabled, you said.
She's also
She
Oh, receiving rental housing assistance, and that.
She wasn't the MSW student.
No, that was Rebecca.
Ok. Sorry.
I think that's in the area, constituency area, having someone that's receiving rental
assistance. Lori Bears was that, obvious, (can't hear) and lower income.
Kara had lived in Iowa City three months. Rebecca McMurray has lived in Iowa
City two years. She's a social work grad student.
She's the MSW student, right.
Well, that's the one I thought was.
Holly has lived here for quite some time, and is a renter, but not necessarily
living is assisted housing, from what I recall.
Right. But she's low income, isn't she?
I think she'd had experience in that area.
She, actually, she self-identified as lower income.
Right.
And then, the question of handicapped and disabled.
Ok. I'm for Holly.
That's three. Do we have somebody, one other person? It would be good not to
defer this one again, so can we get some consensus on this, please.
I can go for this Rebecca.
Who is the other one, (can't hear) or more people that I.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12,2006
Bailey:
Correia:
Elliott:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Correia:
Vanderhoef:
Champion:
Bailey:
Correia:
O'Donnell:
Elliott:
Bailey:
O'Donnell:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Bailey:
Di1kes:
Bailey:
Dilkes:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Correia:
Elliott:
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There wasn't. We haven't.
Oh, I thought
If Marcy DeFrance on the first one
We've got the first one taken care of.
And now we've got three for Holly, those persons who.
I think Holly deserves, I mean, I think, she identifies as lower income, she has
She puts a question mark.
Yeah.
She does have some physical conditions.
She, in her, she has a condition where she can't sit, she's lived in Iowa City a long
time, has perspective on the issues.
Did you say, did you say Marcy DeFrance?
Yes. For the first one.
Yeah. We've taken care of Marcy.
Marcy's (can't hear)
Yes.
Now, have we decided that it's a conflict of interest for someone?
It looks like she has resigned. Until recently I served on.
What's the question, Bob?
Yes.
I think she resigned.
She indicated until recently she served on that Uptown Bill's Board.
Ijust, Ijust wondered, have we decided it's a conflict, an inappropriate conflict of
interest if a person on the Housing Commission is involved with anything that
the Housing Commission over which it has authority?
She doesn't serve on the Board anymore.
No, I'm just asking the question.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription ofthe Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12,2006.
June 12, 2006
Dilkes:
El1iott:
Correia:
Dilkes:
El1iott:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Correia:
Dilkes:
El1iott:
Bailey:
Champion:
Bailey:
El1iott:
Bailey:
El1iott:
Bailey:
El1iott:
Bailey:
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Yeah, wel1 the opinion has been that if you're affiliated, Board of Director
employee of an applicant for funding from the commission, then you're
conflicted on the al1ocations and that's a big part of what they do, so it's probably
not a good idea to appoint a person.
But if someone just lives in assisted, rental assisted housing, no.
No, that's ok.
We haven't done rental assistance, no. We haven't, no.
Ok.
And she doesn't indicate that she's in assisted housing. She indicates that she's a
renter.
I think if we were to confirm that there's no conflict of interest, I could support
Hol1y.
There's no conflict of interest.
No, I don't think it's a problem with Hol1y.
Ok.
So we have four for Hol1y. So we'l1 be appointing Marcy DeFrance and Hol1y
Hart to the Housing Commission. That wil1 achieve some gender balance, which
I think is a good thing, given that the people affected.
That Commission hasn't had good gender balance for a long time.
Right, and, wel1, women are more impacted by some of the issues they address,
so.
Eleanor, I'm, one more question. We do ask if they're a member of an ethnic or
minority organization, that's, apparently those things are appropriate to ask in this
circumstance, is that correct?
They can fil1 out this voluntary response - we have it cal1ed person of color.
Wel1, I think even when it's voluntary, because they're applying, they may wel1
feel that they are either encouraged or wil1 not be judged fairly if they don't fil1 it
out.
We've appointed people who haven't fil1ed it out.
Yeah, I was just asking. Obviously you've cleared that. Ok. Good.
It's Eleanor, Bob
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meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12, 2006
Elliott:
Bailey:
(laughter)
Champion:
Dilkes:
Bailey:
Al!enda Items
Wilburn:
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What did I say?
obviously she's cleared it.
Are you sure about that, Eleanor?
(can't hear)
Thank you.
Agenda items.
Consent Calendar 4 d(4) and 4 d(5)
Champion:
Correia:
Bailey:
Correia:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Correia:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Correia:
Champion:
Atkins:
Dilkes:
Champion:
Well I'm going to talk a little bit about the Wal-Mart thing.
I had a question about that too.
We're pulling that out of, the
We are?
Can we pull those two items out of the Consent Agenda?
It's done.
Ok.
It has been done, or you're doing it?
It's done right now.
Good.
Excellent.
Now my question was, I understand the memo, but one of the two items that
pertain to that.
Two items that pertain to that, one, go ahead, Eleanor.
No, there's only one, Steve's memo dealt only with one item, and that was the
request for an extension until the appeal is resolved. The other item is their
request to purchase about an acre of additional land on the east side.
To build?
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Dilkes: No, they've figured out where they're going to put there, just when all the
platting, the final plat hasn't finally come through, and when they've been
working through all of this they decided they needed just a little bit more land.
And even though the purchase agreement says 21.76 acres or something,
approximately, we thought that was too approximate to go without getting more
compensation so we put it on the agenda at the price that the remainder of the
property is being marketed at. So that's a separate issue from the extension of
time.
Champion: Ok.
Vanderhoef: And that one I think we should not pull. You know, whether we they, whether we
choose to sell or not, choose to have a public hearing and extend, that's a whole
different discussion, but since we have not sold any of the property I think we
should have a public hearing. Set the public hearing for the sale of an additional
60 feet, roughly, is what Karin told me when I talked to her about that. The other
then I think should be pulled and we'll vote the way we want to vote on that.
Champion: Well, I want that pulled too.
Bailey: Oh, no, I want to pull both of them.
Champion: I want both of them pulled.
Wilburn: There's no, it's not consent now, so.
Vanderhoef: Ok. So we'll vote on each of those separately.
Bailey: Separately.
Dilkes: And these are the settings of the public hearing?
Vanderhoef: Mmm hmm.
Champion: Right.
Vanderhoef: There wouldn't even be a public hearing if we chose to vote no.
Wilburn: And folks can make that decision tomorrow night when we (can't hear)
Vanderhoef: Right.
Bailey: Is that all you have to post?
Champion: Yes.
ITEM 10. AUTHORIZING A LEASE AGREEMENT FOR THE LEASE OF THE
BUILDING LOCATED AT 2401 SCOTT BOULEVARD TO IOWA
VALLEY HABITAT FOR HUMANITY.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12, 2006
Bailey:
Elliott:
Champion:
Bailey:
Atkins:
Bailey:
Atkins:
Bailey:
Dilkes:
Atkins:
Bailey:
Dilkes:
Bailey:
Atkins:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Dilkes:
Vanderhoef:
Atkins:
Dilkes:
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1 have a question on item 10. Clause 7 in that contract. Why are we designating 6
days a week between these time periods?
Item 1O?
Can you repeat your question?
It's item 10, it's the Habitat for Humanity contract, it's clause 7, use of premises.
Tenant shall use the premises for the conduct of tenant's operation of the ? office
and any activities reasonably related thereto, and we've limited it to 6 days per
week between 9 am and 5pm, and they'll secure the premises during all other
hours. I don't understand why we're putting that in the contract, and I don't
understand why it's limited to 6 days or these time periods.
If I recall, I thought that was Habitat's idea. I can check for you.
But I mean, will that limit the business hours of?
Of Restore, but not the other activities on the recycling center. That's how I
understood it.
Well, did this come from the tenant, people?
I'd have to ask.
Yeah, same here.
Because I think that that's constraining
Oh,I
If they wanted, for example, there was something special and they got a run on
things and they wanted to,
A Sunday afternoon sale.
a Sunday afternoon sale and it's contractual.
I agree.
Some of the information has come to us from staff and some from the tenants, so
I'll just ask Mitch where that came from.
I would suggest that there might be the opposite, that we want to be sure that it's
open on Saturday.
Yeah.
Yeah. I think that's where it came from, and it should maybe be at least, to ensure
that they're going to be open 6 days a week.
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Champion: So "at least" needs to be put in there.
Elliott: I think that would be important to me.
Bailey: That's, that's much, yeah, because I'd like to give them the flexibility if they had
staff or the ability to extend the hours to meet the needs of the community and
their needs as well.
Atkins; So this needs to be amended by adding the term "at least".
Dilkes: Well, I don't know. Let me check it, because if you look at the last part of the
sentence, it says "and shall secure the premises during all other hours." I don't
know. Let me see what the intent there was.
Bailey: Ok.
Vanderhoef: And why does this lease say June I instead of July I?
Bailey: Right.
Dilkes: Because they, you approved an early occupancy agreement. They're in there
cleaning up now.
Champion: They need to get in there.
V anderhoef: Yeah, I knew they were in there, but I didn't know we were making a retroactive
lease here.
Dilkes: Well, I mean, once they take possession, it just makes sense to make the lease
prior to the possession date.
Bailey: That's all I have.
Wilburn: Other agenda items.
ITEM 25. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION A WARDING CONTRACT AND
AUTHORIZING THE MAYOR TO SIGN AND THE CITY CLERK TO
ATTEST A CONTRACT FOR CONSTRUCTION OF THE 2006
ASPHALT OVERLAY PROJECT.
Atkins: There's one I want to point out to you on our bid for our asphalt overlay. We've
gone over this, and I'm really reluctant to
Elliott: Item 25, Steve?
Atkins: I'm sorry. Item 25, thank you. I'm really reluctant to recommend it; I'm also
reluctant to postpone it. I had the staff go through our list of streets and we can
pull out? Street Way and No Name Street, which we think are still in reasonably
good order. That reduces this by $105,000.00, so we can award $456 minus $105
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12,2006
Champion:
Correia:
Elliott:
Atkins:
Wilburn:
Vanderhoef:
Bailey:
Elliott:
Atkins:
Correia:
Vanderhoef:
Correia:
Vanderhoef:
Champion:
Correia:
Champion:
Atkins:
Correia:
Atkins:
City Council Work Session
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_ there are just some streets that we just need to get at, and I'd like to recommend
that tomorrow night.
Ok.
So why would, why did we just get one bid?
That was my question also.
They're the only game in town.
They are, they are the only game in town.
For asphalt.
For asphalt.
Nobody else.
There's nobody else.
Waterloo
Well, it's getting more costly for them to bring their equipment in.
Oh, sure.
So they're not bidding it.
Oh, I think they're a very reputable company.
No, I was just wondering why there's just one bid.
I do think that everything is getting more expensive, so that's very expensive
right now, blacktop's very expensive.
Concrete we do better, there's several concrete in town, but when it comes to
asphalt, they're it.
Oh, in the area.
But they always give us
(all talk - can't hear)
Wilburn:
Karr:
Champion:
Other agenda items.
So what are we going to do with 25? I'm sorry.
He's going to offer it.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription ofthe Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12, 2006
Atkins:
ITEM 24.
Elliott:
Wilburn:
Elliott:
Wilburn:
Elliott:
Champion:
Dilkes:
Atkins:
Helling:
Elliott:
Helling:
Elliott:
Helling:
Elliott:
Atkins:
Fowler:
City Council Work Session
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I'm going to, I'll walk you through it tomorrow.
CONSIDER A RESOLUTION APPROVING THE V ANTAGECARE
RETIREMENT HEALTH SAVINGS PLAN, A RETIREE MEDICAL AND
DENTAL EXPENSE REIMBURSEMENT PLAN.
I had item 24. I checked with Sylvia today, because it represents what people can
do for a health savings plan and it mentioned eligible accrued sick leave, vacation
leave and I think I'm ok with it, but I've got some more thinking to do, because,
it's my understanding that you can accrue, HR tends to do this, 192 hours. My
first question - how many days is that, because most people think of vacation
days.
24.
It's 24 days.
Right.
I think vacations are made to be taken, basically. Now depending, maybe only
take half of them, but saying, I just accrued sick leave, I think sick leave is for
sick leave.
That's old-fashioned. That's old-fashioned.
Well, let Dale address the sick leave, because
Sick leave is a separate issue.
Sick leave that we're talking about, that's applicable, is always that applies to
employees who were here before July 1 ,t of '85, I believe, where there was a sick
leave pay-out that was a portion of the accrued sick leave.
That's right. Sylvia did say that, it's no longer applicable
Since that time, nobody accrues compensible sick leave accrual, so it's just to
cover those people who have some money coming when they retire because of
that benefit we used to have.
The only thing now is the vacation time. I just need to give a little more thought
to that.
Ok. The vacation accrual, that is all negotiated. It's in our labor agreement.
And, it's, you can, after you've accrued 24 days. Anything over that you can take,
but at the end of the year you lose it if you don't take it.
Correct.
Correct.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription ofthe Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12,2006
Correia:
Bailey:
Fowler:
Dilkes:
Correia:
Di1kes:
Elliott:
Correia:
Elliott:
Atkins:
Vanderhoef:
Atkins:
Dilkes:
Atkins:
Dilkes:
Vanderhoef:
Atkins:
Dilkes:
Vanderhoef:
Bailey:
Atkins:
Vanderhoef:
Atkins:
City Council Work Session
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So then what eligible vacation leave can go into this.
Your accrued.
Your accrual.
Let's say you terminate, and you've got 3 weeks of unused vacation pay, the City
pays you for that, and you might choose to put it into this health savings plan.
Right. So at the end of the year if you haven't used your vacation time, you can
do that?
No, no. Only if you terminate.
Termination. Yeah.
Oh.
And you get paid at the rate you were making at the time you terminate.
Correct.
But you can accrue the, the sign up period though, the 60 day sign-up period, it's
available to everyone the way I read it. All employees.
It's available to all of our employees.
Well you can defer wages.
You can defer wages.
Doesn't have to be sick or vacation pay.
But they may choose to use that knowing that they may lose those days at the end
of the year. If they haven't their sick leave, this is one way of being paid for their
sick leave.
No.
No no no.
Ok.
No. It only applies to people who have compensated sick leave.
There is a very limited number of employees who are eligible for that.
To use the sick leave.
Right.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting ofJune 12,2006.
June 12,2006
Elliott:
Atkins:
Champion:
Bailey:
Atkins:
Vanderhoef:
Atkins:
Vanderhoef:
Elliott:
Bailey:
Vanderhoef:
Atkins:
Dilkes:
Atkins:
Dilkes:
Elliott:
Correia:
Bailey:
Vanderhoef:
Elliott:
City Council Work Session
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It's grandfathered.
Thank you.
Grandparented.
Grandparented.
That's what I said.
So, what the majority of employees would be using is their vacation time.
The majority of employees, I would suspect, particularly those that are about to
terminate through retirement, wi11likely accumulate the 192 hours at the time of
their, then would cash them out, deposit them, and then it's done. That's what
most folks will do.
But they can't do this as a
The way I did it.
But vacations are meant to be taken, Bob.
savings account that they pay into every year.
No. It's termination, termination.
That's upon termination. The wages are going to be an ongoing.
Yeah, wages they can do that.
You could choose right now to put 10% of your wages into the, the thing is, it's
unrevocable, so it's like, you better be sure that there's nothing going to change in
your family's wage situation that you might need that. But in terms of what, in
terms of putting vacation pay, it's going to be the pad you're going to get upon
termination. You're not just gonna pick up a bunch of vacation, two weeks of
vacation I want in my health savings plan.
No.
Gotcha.
Got it.
That's not the way I read it.
Item
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription ofthe Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12,2006.
June 12,2006
Dilkes:
ITEM 15.
Elliott:
Champion:
Elliott:
Champion:
Correia:
Bailey:
Trueblood:
(laughter)
Trueblood:
Bailey:
Trueblood:
Bailey:
Trueblood:
Bailey:
Champion:
Trueblood:
Champion:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Trueblood:
Bailey:
City Council Work Session
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And so all you're saying is, look, the employee can decide whether to take 5
weeks of vacation payor take 5 weeks of vacation pay and put it in their health
savings plan. That's the only decision.
CONSIDER A RESOLUTION ESTABLISmNG DAILY FEES FOR THE
THORNBERRY OFF-LEASH DOG PARK.
Item IS, the daily fee for the dog park. That's for the day, right? Take the dog out
in the morning.
Only if you don't have a pass.
Take them out in the morning, come back in the afternoon, come back again in
the evening.
Yes.
That's a lot of going back and forth to the dog park, though.
Well that's like if you're visiting, right?
Yes.
As long as they keep their rip off tag, it's good for the day.
So that's really, you know, somebody is visiting or has infrequent use of, right,
that's the market, right?
Right.
Because the price for a annual pass is going to be $20
It could be as low as $15 or a maximum of$25.
Yeah, so.
That's an expensive potty break, $5.
I'm sorry?
That's an expensive potty break.
Hey, the dog is off-leash, man. That's worth it - priceless.
Have a good night, Terry.
It was already shot, I'm sorry.
Well, we're spending it with you, too.
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(laughter)
Consent Calendar #4d(2) CONSIDER A RESOLUTION OF INTENT TO CONVEY 426
BAYARD STREET, AND SETTING A PUBLIC HEARING ON SAID
CONVEYANCE FOR JUNE 27, 2006.
Elliott: One more item on the consent calendar, item 2. Would any other people on the
Council, I don't. I personally would not like to receive the recommendation on
what to do with the property before we have the public hearing.
Bailey: What are you talking, I'm sorry?
Atkins: Which one now?
Elliott: #2. The property that was condemned, will be purchased, will be sold to one of
four people who would like to buy it. We are now to get a staff recommendation
on which property, on which applicant can buy the property, but we're to get that
before the public hearing. I'd like to get it after the public hearing. Somehow, to
get the staff recommendation before the public has had a chance to comment on
it doesn't seem appropriate to me.
Vanderhoef: We get them all the time on
Elliott: I know, I just don't like the idea.
Dilkes: I think it really changes the, it changes the comments you're going to get, because
if staff is recommending one over another.
Atkins: That's all we're doing.
Dilkes: There's a reaction to a staff recommendation at times.
Bailey: They're responding to something instead of responding just broadly to it
Elliott: I guess I've always felt it inappropriate when we hold a public hearing and
immediately we act on it, which gives the public the idea that we didn't pay
attention to what you said.
Wilburn: Are you asking for it to be removed from Consent Calendar?
Elliott: I think no one else agrees with me, so that's fine.
Bailey: Well, are you asking that we,
Atkins: You don't have to vote on it that night.
Bailey: We could do the public hearing on the 27th and we could set that public hearing,
but are you asking for the decision to be made the next meeting? Could we do
that?
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meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12,2006
EJliott:
Atkins:
Champion:
Atkins:
O'DonneJl:
Bailey:
Correia:
Bailey:
EJliott:
Bailey:
Dilkes:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Atkins:
Karr:
Wilburn:
Karr:
EJliott:
Karr:
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I would prefer.
I'm sure, can't imagine why not.
But the whole idea is the public's going to be able to respond to the person
buying the property. Isn't that correct?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Right.
WeJl, they're going to decide who's gonna
I don't have a problem separating the public hearing from the decision dividing
those up, but this is a resolution to set the public hearing, so I don't know if you
want to remove it or not from the Consent Calendar.
If no one else has concerns.
Can we do the, keep that in mind with the agenda at the end of the month in July,
right? Can we do that?
You just want to, just understand from Doug or from the people who are wanting
to purchase it what the timing issues are in terms of, because we're in
construction season.
What are we doing?
Separating the public hearing from the, actuaJly awarding.
Yeah.
Our typical response would be for every public housing, as directed by Council
previously, we provide you the opportunity to act that same evening. You do not
have to act. You could continue the public hearing, you could close the public
hearing and defer action. But our direction from Council was that you wanted the
ability, ifno one would come or there was a timing issue.
Ok.
So we put it on the agenda. Now.there's interest on Bob's part to potentiaJly not
close the public hearing or, close the public hearing but not act that evening.
No. I like, I like your explanation and I have the opportunity to recommend that
we defer decision.
That evening.
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Elliott: I can do that at the time if I would like to and if other people agree we can do it.
That sounds fine, thanks. Good idea.
Bailey: That sounds great.
Wilburn: Any other agenda items?
ITEM 17. CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE AMENDING TITLE 8, ENTITLED
"POLICE REGULATIONS," CHAPTER 6, ENTITLED "PERSONS
UNDER EIGHTEEN YEARS OF AGE," BY REPEALING SECTION 1B
BECAUSE THE STATE HAS ENACTED A MORE COMPREHENSIVE
EDUCATION PROVISION. (FIRST CONSIDERATION)
V anderhoef: Yes. 17. Eleanor's opinion is just fine, but then when we get into the second page
of all that, also from Eleanor, on the inspection fees. And your comments had
been that we couldn't charge for them, so my question is what is the inspection,
because you had alluded to the fact that the inspection could be for occupancy or
for some other thing. And you say here that it's your understanding that HIS and
Fire are no longer charging for the, the inspections. So what are we gaining by
that inspection or are we still looking at these two other things that we could
charge for?
Dilkes: I think the answer is yes. What my determination was is that the only
authorization for an inspection right now that is being done right now is in
connection with liquor licensing. Ok, but, Fire is in the process of, for instance,
putting together a inspection process for occupancy for various high hazard
occupancies, one of which is liquor, involves liquor, and that is distinct from the
licensing process. And so, when, I wouldn't have a problem with them making a
charge for that. But that program isn't in place yet.
Vanderhoef: Ok. So why or what does this inspection entail right now, that we're doing free of
charge? Because it has to do with we're doing inspection because this is when
they're getting their new liquor license. We used to charge for it, but what were
they truly inspecting for at that time that they were charging for?
Dilkes: They, both Fire and HIS, as required by our liquor licensing ordinance were
doing an inspection of the premises to make sure there were no fire code
violations or building violations.
Vanderhoef: Ok. So. If we change the name of the inspection, and we happen to do it at the
same time as they apply for a liquor license and we call it the
Dilkes: That's not what we're going to do.
Vanderhoef: Well, you said that they were working on a different
Dilkes: Yeah, but we're not going to call it a different name - it is a different thing. It is
not as part of the liquor licensing application, and therefore I don't think this
decision controls it and we can charge for it.
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meeting of June 12,2006.
June 12, 2006
Vanderhoef:
Karr:
Dilkes:
Correia:
Dilkes:
Karr:
Dilkes:
Vanderhoef:
Champion:
Karr:
Bailey:
Vanderhoef:
Dilkes:
Vanderhoef:
Champion:
Karr:
Dilkes:
Vanderhoef:
Bailey:
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No, 1 understand that, but what I'm trying to say is, why the devil are we out
there inspecting?
The inspection hasn't changed, Dee. The inspection that we're doing before we
charge and the inspection we're doing after hasn't changed. Weare looking for
the same building and safety issues. We're just, and so
The ordinance requires us to do an inspection. The ordinance right now required
us to do an inspection when we do a liquor license application.
Our City ordinance.
Yes, our City ordinance, as many City ordinances do. Weare going to be coming
to you next
The 26th.
The 26th with a number of, because of a number of changes that have been
occurring in the liquor licensing thing, and we are going to make a change to that
inspection provision, partially due to this decision but partially because we think
we can, we may be able to use the results from the fire inspection in the liquor
licensing, so, those changes are coming next time.
And then we can charge again for the inspection?
No, they don't charge for the.
That's off the table.
Not in conjunction with the liquor license, but we can charge for the inspections
regarding occupancy, because that's a completely separate issue.
The Fire and. 1 understand that, but.
We would be doing those regardless of whether someone was applying for a
liquor license, and we wouldn't, the granting of the application would not be
contingent on that inspection.
1 understand that. But the safety inspection we are going to be charging for.
No.
The Fire.
The Fire occupancy inspection we are going to be charging for.
That's what I'm saying, that's exactly.
But that's not the fire inspection that all businesses get.
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Champion:
No, they don't charge. They come to my store for fire inspection - they don't
charge me. Why should they charge for a Fire?
Bailey:
But they don't do an occupancy inspection for your store, because it's not a high-
risk: although I know that it's always packed.
Dilkes:
It's not a high
Champion:
Well I hope not.
(laughter)
Dilkes: Is that clear, is my?
Vanderhoef: Ok, so, well, we'll get an inspection fee for
Dilkes: In connection with the Fire Occupancy
Vanderhoef: The Fire and Occupancy.
Dilkes: I have the program that they will be implementing.
Vanderhoef: So we're going to have a short time in here that we are not going to be getting our
inspection fee.
Wilburn: Any other agenda items?
Vanderhoef: There was something else on one of the letters.
Consent Calendar 4f(9) Preservation of Montgomery-Butler House
Correia: There was a letter in correspondence about the Montgomery Butler house
preservation.
Vanderhoef: Colette Pogue. Colette writes us a letter annually.
Atkins: Somebody wants to buy it and live there and pick it up. Didn't you tell me about
this?
Correia: What?
Atkins: Karin knows about this.
Correia: No, but is it, it sounds like.
Karr: f9
O'Donnell: Thought she was saying good job.
Correia: There was a letter.
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Bailey: I've got the letter.
Correia: And I was just recently at the Water Works prairie and I did not notice this
house.
Wilburn: It's been
Bailey: Not, it's back in.
Vanderhoef: It's in the woods.
Wilburn: Yeah, it's on the west side of Dubuque Street up on top of the hill. It's been
mothballed.
Franklin: It's been secured.
Wilburn: It's been secured
Correia: Is there anybody at Johnson County Historical Museurn?
Franklin: We've tried that. When we first secured it, mothballed it, we looked at whether
there were other organizations in the area who might want to take it over and use
it as an education facility. And nobody had any money to do it. There is an
individual who is interested potentially in buying it and living in it and restoring
it to its original whatever.
Bailey: We didn't get that letter, did we?
Franklin: No you didn't. That's just been a conversation so far. And we're looking into
whether that's possible or not. I mean, there'd be all kinds of strings attached.
Champion: I think you should see a doctor.
(all talk - can't hear)
Consent Calendar 4f(l5) Thatcher Mobile Home Park
Correia:
The other thing was the correspondence about McCollister, the Thatcher Mobile
Home Park resident.
Bailey:
Yes?
Correia:
About the placement of
Wilburn:
I think there's been a staff response prepared for that.
Atkins:
We wrote Miss Stem a letter, it's in your packets, walking through most of the
issues that she raised.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription ofthe Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12, 2006.
June 12,2006
Correia:
Atkins:
Correia:
Atkins:
Bailey:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Correia:
Atkins:
Franklin:
Atkins:
Wilburn:
Elliott:
Franklin:
Wilburn:
Atkins:
Wilburn:
Franklin:
City Council Work Session
Page 85
My packet?
No, the upcoming packet, no, I'm sorry.
Oh, ok.
You have not received it. We just put it out I believe today.
Is that your Op-Ed?
No, no, it's a different letter.
Well she wrote an Op-Ed that was pretty clear.
I saw that.
Yeah, and Karin wrote an Op-Ed piece that was.
Which I was invited to do by the Press-Citizen because they had these other
letters and then I feel like I was ambushed. So that won't happen again.
Yeah.
It was very well prepared.
Welcome to the club.
Yeah, really.
But there's another staff response specifically to this letter that's going to be
going out in the next packet.
Yeah. In the next couple of days you'll have it.
Say good night, Karin.
Good night, Karin.
Consent Calendar #4f(2) Proposed sidewalk cafe at 100 S Linn St
Vanderhoef: Bob Bums' letter about the new cafe on the comer of.
Correia: Too little too late - came after we had the vote.
Vanderhoef: Yeah, but I think we should keep a good watch on that, see what the noise level
is on the Washington side and how it effects that ramp, because the ramp is right
next to the building, isn't it?
Bailey: Yes.
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Atkins: Yes.
Bailey: I also think we should conununicate to them, ifthere's a noise problem they
should cal1 the police department like, wel1, al1 of us.
Vanderhoef: Complaint driven.
Bailey: Wel1, that's what.
V anderhoef: Yeah. Since this particular location has an opportunity to have one on either
street.
Correia: They do just have it on the one side, though.
El1iott: No, it's going to be on both sides.
Vanderhoef: That's what this is.
Elliott: As I recal1, there's plenty of room between the fence and the curb.
Bailey: Wel1 they (can't hear) in, which surprised me.
Dilkes: There's regulations that they have to comply with in terms of space.
El1iott: That doesn't seem to me a place that
Bailey: So is somebody going to respond to that letter?
Vanderhoef: I don't know whether there is anything we can do at this point.
Bailey: No, we should indicate that the regulations have been met, because there is ample
space to walk, and that there
Atkins: I'll prepare a response.
Bailey: Yeah, if there's noise, it's also part of downtown living. Gabe's doesn't bother
them?
(laughter)
Vanderhoef: There's at least a few fire stations between Gabe's and the
Correia: There's some groves, maybe.
(laughter)
Bailey:
By definition of a grove there aren't groves.
Wilburn:
I reconunend we do Council Time tomorrow night.
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Vanderhoef: I agree.
Karr: Are we going to schedule these pending
(cut off -tape ends)
Wilburn:
Bailey:
Correia:
Wilburn:
Bailey:
O'Donnell:
Bailey:
Champion:
Bailey:
Karr:
Bailey:
Correia:
Karr:
(laughter)
So please do that tomorrow?
We're going to do pending tomorrow night too?
Were we coming at 5:30, or?
Yes, we will do pending.
What time do you want us here?
At 7:00?
Will we do this in Council Time? Schedule?
Sure, because that agenda should go pretty quickly tomorrow night.
Marian's point, about telling everybody about when you're
I really, I would really, I guess, my only thing is, you get 31 items. Ijust think,
on something that's rerun. to sit here and say I'm going to be out of town.
I agree with you.
Yeah, I don't want to do my calendar.
It's probably not a good idea. I mean I love it, but I just
Bailey: That's what I'm doing.
Karr: And I've heard from people when they call, and they'll go would you tell them
they shouldn't be talking about this on television when they're going to be out of
town.
Bailey: It probably isn't a good idea. We're such a transparent
Vanderhoef: And when they break in I'll say "surprise, I'm home".
Karr: If you have a security system we can talk about it.
Champion: I'm hoping they'll come back.
Wilburn: Well, let's try this. Can people.
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June 12, 2006
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Vanderhoef: 6:30.
Bailey: 6:30.
Champion: 6:30.
Elliott: 6:30 is fine.
Wilburn: 6:00, 6:30.
Bailey: With calendars.
Elliott: 6:30. Calendar in hand.
Wilburn: Ok.
Champion: Can we do that? Is that legal?
Correia: Cause we're continuing this.
Wilburn: Yes.
Baeth: Can I also have dinner?
Bailey: No dinner.
O'Donnell: Good.
(all talk)
Wilburn:
Good night.
This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
meeting of June 12,2006.