HomeMy WebLinkAbout2009-01-12 TranscriptionJanuary 12, 2009 Ciry Council Page 1
January 12, 2009 City Council Budget Work Session 7:10 P.M.
Council Present: Bailey, Champion, Correia, Hayek, O'Donnell, Wilburn, Wright
Staff: Lombardo, Helling, Karr, O'Malley, Morris, Boothroy, Cate, Rocca,
Hargadine
Others Present: UISG Representative, Gunn
Airport (pg. 101):
Lombardo/ We don't have a set format for tonight. There were some questions that were, uh,
raised in Saturday's work session and we have staff and others here present tonight to
dive into some of those questions. So, at your discretion...is there something in
particular you want to talk about first.
Bailey/ Let's start with the Airport. Greg is here from the Airport Commission. Let's just start
there. And this is on page 101.
Farris/ (mumbled) The budget side (mumbled)
Bailey/ Um, in our discussion on Saturday, uh, Greg, we had some specific questions. One of
'em is, is sort of the, the General Levy support for the Airport, and some interest in
reducing that, um, we have been going...closer to $100,000 for a couple of years, and
now we're going the other direction, and then I think Amy had some specific questions
about hangar rentals and what else am I missing about the Airport...discussion. (several
talking) Okay. So, uh, let's start with the hangar rentals.
Farris/ The hangar rentals, what...those are looked at each year, uh, I'll start off by saying I have
a hanger there so I'm not allowed to vote on any of this, but I'll tell you how the process
goes, uh, generally. The...over the years before...or at least my understanding
sometimes, we wanted to put a formula together that we could do to decide in hangar
rentals, because those are always difficult things we need to explain to our, to the people
that rent the hangars, uh, why this costs and how it comes about and then they could, uh,
transparent of how they're calculated each year. So, what Mike Tharp, the Airport
Specialist does is take a, an inflationary price index that's added in there. Then we look
at, uh, area rates. We do surveys of Cedar Rapids, uh, Muscatine, around and look at the
same size hangars, because we have several different types, and survey to see what those
prices are, and then look at any, have we done any improvements. Two years ago we put
concrete in some of the older hangars. So that's a contracted improvement that we felt
that we could increase hangar rates. So those three things come about, uh, we do that
probably August, because the leases usually come around in October. We've, um,
generally probably been on the high end of hangars, but you know, we feel we have
location and other things that is important, um, we're probably in line with some of the
hangar rents in Cedar Rapids, which is a larger airport with a few more facilities than we
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have, but uh, so we're usually higher than let's say Muscatine or Washington, one of those
airports.
Correia/ What percent increase did the hangar rentals increase last year?
Farris/ I believe, at least the numbers I picked up today were 3%, which was pretty much a...an
inflation index that we put in there. Uh, sometimes that's probably overall, because a few
hangars might not have changed. I think over the last four years we've raised hangar
rates three of those years. Um.. .
O'Donnell/ And are all the hangar full now?
Farris/ Yes, they're all full right now.
O'Donnell/ And do we have like a waiting list for that?
Farris/ We have a waiting list that, um, I think it varies between maybe 20 and 10 people, um,
well, it's probably more between 15 and 20 people. We recently had a hangar come open
and we had to go through about six people to get to someone that actually was in the
market for a hangar at the time. The one thing when you think about a hangar list,
generally it's pretty much a proposed set of people that might be ready, but uh, an aircraft
purchase is not a small one and so generally they're looking for one and they don't
purchase one until they have a hangar. So even though we have a few on there, we
look...that is also something that comes in, is the list. I don't know if everyone of those
prospects on there always turns out to be someone who's ready for the hangar.
Bailey/ Okay. Other questions?
Farris/ I think some of the other things I know we...from the Commission's standpoint we looked
at the budget this year. We stayed pretty much status quo with the values that we saw in
the last year before, which of course, 2009 dollars are less than 2008 dollars, usually, so
we probably felt that we could handle, uh, some of the fluctuation that might happen
from that. I know when we look at the numbers sometimes (mumbled) the proposed
budget that we have in the numbers have changed as they get up there, that you know,
we're...the Commission's standpoint, uh, we see like $112,000 as the amount that we're
looking for. Uh, but then as we come into financing and how it comes in, I think it does
move up to the $130,000 generally. Um, the one things we are...we are looking at,
uh...things like for maintenance. As you know we had an employee that recently retired.
We're looking now at contracting through the fixed base operator, Jet Air, that's there to
perform some of those maintenance tasks that we had before. We're looking at that, uh,
in a one-year contract to see how that would work out. Uh, that of course, at the...the
outset it was looked at from acost-savings, uh, we're not sure of all the cost-savings yet
because as we move on to someone else, um, you can think of things...equipment use,
some of the things we had benefits of having a...a City employee to do things. There
were things that probably happened, uh, because of the great connections they had with
other City departments that we might end up having to pay for now. So we'll have to go
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through and see how that works out. But, in the initial part is we're reduce things like our
overhead, or our overtime budget or our temporary employee budget, that we'd had...is in
this contract, because that's how...at that point when we did the budget, um, we felt that
we weren't sure of exactly where we were going. So, there could be some benefit from
movement of things, along those lines, and start reducing some of the funds that we look
at that come in, uh, the General Levy the support that we get. It's just, uh, until these go
in place and we see how it works, um, we're not really sure if the, you know, how much
savings that (mumbled). So I think we're looking at some of those. LTh, to see ways to
reduce that funding that comes out, because it's the same...as long as we, the more self-
sufficient we can come, uh, I mean, it's better for the Airport to be able to do things.
Wright/ Greg, what's your annual hangar rent more or less, do you know?
Farris/ I pay $148 a month.
Wright/ Okay, and for the total operation?
Farris/ Oh, for like the whole, what we take in for all the hangars?
Wright/ Oh, I'm sorry. I was looking right past it, excuse me.
Bailey/ $168,000.
Farris/ Yeah.
Wright/ That is right there, isn't it?
Bailey/ I'm assuming that that's all hangar rents. That's what I was...
Farris/ Yeah, we have it split between some land rentals that, I'm using rough numbers,
the...which we might have in there, but generally it's around the $30,000 and then the
other comes in in the hangar rents. Those end up with t-hangars, the small ones that hold
one aircraft, and then also the larger maintenance, or corporate, hangars, which are not
always on that same lease schedule of October, but generally come up each year for us to
look at, and those are done...we're trying to get more into the numbers of doing square
footage for those, and then if there's amenities, like some have offices and bathrooms and
whatnot (mumbled) increases for (mumbled)
Correia/ It's interesting just when you say, it's $110 a month and I don't know the size of it, but
we're talking about increasing the monthly rental for a parking space to $80, which is I'm
sure much smaller than a hanger rental (laughter) for a plane. So, I mean (mumbled)
Farris/ Yeah. I think when you look at a...hangar rentals and you look, as I said, we take the
surveys around. Most of'em are covered space, um, generally when we first started the
Airport those weren't, they were dirt floors actually in there. So, they...they weren't the
greatest facilities, but from an airplane standpoint, airplanes tend to sit quite often and
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that's what is the...detriment of...the hangar ends up...so there's not really much in'em.
There's generally at least the ones on the north side don't, uh, have electricity in 'em or
anything along those lines, except for the door that opens 'em.
Hayek/ How many hangars are there?
Farris/ Uh, we have (noise on mic) 64 altogether, or 50...59 t-hangars, about four corporate
hangars, and then the OPL, the research hangar for the University, and then two larger
maintenance hangars.
Hayek/ One question I think with respect to hangar lease rates is how elastic is this audience. I
mean, if you raise it more than 3% a year are you going to draw people to other
communities or are they...stuck with this municipal airport if they want to keep an
airplane.. .
Farris/ I mean, that is...we, we, because I think many people have brought it up before -well,
you have a waiting list. Why don't you just rise it...raise it until you get rid of everybody
and the waiting list is gone. Um, which from a business standpoint seems like a, I think
we'd have to be cautious about doing something like, cause we could easily go way past
the bubble and everyone leaves and now I've got ten hangars open. Um, we...the, well,
as a hangar person that comes in there, I mean, most of...I believe there's, especially
when we came with a formula, and we said this wasn't some kind of, uh, pull a number
out of our hat each year. We used several things to come up with it. It became
something that was a more palatable to the people we were talking about. They'll come
back and of course anybody would as well I need services, are you going to get the snow
removed so I can get my plane out. What if my door breaks, are you going to be there the
next day. So, you know, they'll just as any consumer, they want certain things for the
money they get in, so we have to ensure we supply that. If we can keep doing that,
generally uh, inflationary type moves, um, I think are...palatable to the...the...to most of
the users. Of course there's always some that are not going to be happy with any rates.
Bailey/ But you said you're comparable, I mean, it's comparable to areas around here.
Farris/ Yes. In fact, we tried to even, if you think about Iowa City, uh, Mike made some
attempts this year to look at maybe other university towns. And if you think about it,
we're quite unique. It's hard to compare us to Muscatine or, is to find out rates. That's
difficult. You look at a Purdue, which has a large aviation community. They have a, um,
a much different airport, a tower controlled airport, as compared to Iowa City. So there's
some things in there that you have to come back and forth, and look at, but I think
generally the rates are definitely the, um, higher of any of the smaller airports outside of
Cedar Rapids. Um, but it's something that we're constantly looking at, because I mean, if
you look at a general aviation airport, there's on1y...I can get from land leases, money
coming in and then my fuel flow...flowage fees. That's the two pieces of income I can
increase, and if you look at some of the studies talking about, well, what's a general
aviation -how does it become self-sufficient? They went through and looked at, you
know, comm., or approaches, allow instrument-type approaches. Allow aircraft in
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rougher weather, like tonight, or um, amenities or what not, and they found that most of
the airports that came the closest to being self-sufficient were airports in the south that
can stay open the longest. That had, because they either had a larger number of aircraft
or with the fuel flow coming in, or maybe in some cases, a large plots of land they could
lease out. Of course the airports attempted in a lot of cases, and they're still going to
about some of our land looking for leases (mumbled). But, as you know, on the north
side we put, we sold a lot of the land and put it back on the tax rolls, but we haven't got
the benefit out of some of those that we hope (mumbled)
Bailey/ Other questions for Greg? I am interested in reducing the General Fund Levy. I think
even if we reduced it to $120,000 it would still be a balance for 2010, but you said...you
said that you start out with $112,000 so...
Farris/ That's, yeah...
Correia/ I'd be comfortable moving back down to $112,000. I mean, I think that would...
Bailey/ That would kick it out of balance.
Correia/ Well, but I mean, there is the ability, I mean, so 3%, maybe that's inflationary, maybe
that's kind of in line, you know, we're proposing an increase, parking space rental, 33%,
so I mean, I don't know if you did a pro forma what if you raised it 6%, you know, so not
an exorbitant amount, what that would do for... for rents. I mean, I think that you know,
this is a business enterprise. You know we have another department that's not a business
enterprise that's...that's proposed, recommending 19% increase in their fees, so I mean,
just in terms of, I mean, I think...you know, if we're willing to pay, there's not as much
incentive to, you know, make it a little bit more, um, so I mean, I...I'd like to go back
down to 112, um, and...
Farris/ Now...I knew before, and this is a, you know, there's some things the Airport, um, like
we do pick up, uh, a portion of the economic development, which I know is agreed on, or
I think it was agreed on sometime before. (mumbled) monies that comes in and then
goes back out, uh, would there be any reduction or a thought of in something in there, to
offset any reduction in the overall General Levy? I put that out. I have to go see,
because the problem will be is if we reduce, the monies that...what would end up
happening is, we would look at any, uh, of our capital, our kind of internal capital
improvements, like we looked at resurfacing the, uh, roadway in front of the Airport, or
uh, doing some more fencing work, you know, stuff that we don't...we don't have or can't
apply or not eligible for some of the State level grants, or aren't part of the federal level
grants. So we have usually unappropriated funds for those, each, uh, year. We try to do
some of those upkeep that we need to, to keep the facility at that size...it does. So that
would probably reduce our ability to do any of those. Um, and the only thing I worry
about is that, there is a certain amount that I agree we...that we might be able to reduce to
come in there, but I don't want to get this back to where I think we were maybe seven or
maybe ten years ago. I think the Airport had reached a point where they hadn't done
enough for the facilities; hadn't done enough for the...the air side, the runways and what
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not, and on the other side, and I think that was the detriment of the Airport. I think it
really put it in a bind.
Correia/ Is there a parking fee when, I'll just call it a parking fee. I don't know if this applies. A
special terminology on, uh, football weekends when people, alums I imagine, come in,
park their plane at our facility, and then go the game? Do, are there any fees?
Farris/ There's um, there can be for an internal, if they take it into a hangar, those are charged
in...by the, usually we whatever the hangar is, because there's someone that has a lease
on that. There is, uh, no...some larger airports would have a landing T, which is
generally not ever done in a general aviation airport, and some will have an overnight fee
for parking, um, most of these don't park overnight, um, so they're...and most of the time
that ends up that if you park overnight, and buy fuel, then you don't have to pay extra. So
it's kind of an incentive to buy fuel (mumbled). Um, in some of those I think...those are
all possible revenue generation things. I don't know how much, um, and if people would
just find other ways of, I mean, we are very convenient for a game. Uh, but generally
those aren't seen as like aone-day fee to turn on something, along those lines, but for any
time internal stuff, yes, they do have parking for that.
O'DonnelU (several talking) how many flights go in and out a year?
Farris/ Um, I think we expect, um, I'm thinking about 30,000 or is 40,000 operations, which
could be some local aircraft, but it counts all of those.
O'Donnell/ I think too many people are thinking people just come for football game and then, uh,
travel home, but the University uses this, um, our...our local businesses in the
community use this, I mean, I think it's a very valuable tool. I mean, the transplant
program, I know uses it.
Farris/ Yes.
O'Donnell/ What is the Angel, uh...
Farris/ Angel Flight Corporation, or it's an organization that flies in and out, uh, especially a lot
to, uh, the...club foot, to Ponseti, a lot of children are flying in and out of there. We have
some ITC, the recent company that set up. They have a plane and fly in, not...as I talked
to him he said, well, we didn't move here for the airport, but the airport's a great
convenience for them to have in there (mumbled) come and go, a few of those other
corporations around here use it. So, it is that, it is sometimes their first look and...and I
believe some of the things we've done on the air side, to increase the runway length and
some of those, have been beneficial for those aircraft (mumbled). Um, so yeah, I do, I
mean, I'm definitely a proponent, thinking the Airport adds a lot more than just from the
aviator (mumbled)
Wright/ This airport is definitely an asset (mumbled)
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O'Donnell/ Sure is!
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Wright/ Actually as general aviation and airports go, it's really a jewel, um...that said, I would, I
might be willing to go along with Regenia to go down to 120.
Bailey/ Just reduces the carry-over for the next year, and that's...and then if you can find some
other efficiencies, perhaps that would be back in your budget. I mean, if we're...
Farris/ And...and I believe the Commission would be, uh, you know, would definitely think, or
at least talk along those levels. The one thing that I know we would is that we want...the
City can help in the sense of some of our capital improvements. I'll always think that that
is how, with that capital improvement of the Airport let's say, larger corporate hangars so
we can put, uh, larger aircraft, increases our fuel (mumbled) which also would help the
local economy, since this is probably a company that is, you know, wants to use the
Airport to access, um, if we could make sure that we can continue to work on trying to
get as much funding as we can for some of those, and these would be revenue-based
usually generating type projects, but as we look to trying to capture, we've lengthened the
runway, we think we have some opportunities now to...to strive to get some larger
aircraft in here that, uh, would benefit the local area, plus the Airport, because of the
amount and the volume of aircraft that comes in there. In those things we look for our
federal aid, but of course they're going to want us to improve the air side before we do
any of those, so then we look at State funding, and then try to shore up as much as we
can, and then the City can help out, so I think those are very important (mumbled)
operation budget I think we have more flexibility, but some of that capital improvement
stuff is the, is the...the meat of what can create and make the Airport...strong, go for a
long period of time, but also, uh, get it closer to being that self-sufficient that everyone
wants to see - an enterprise.
Bailey/ Well, and you're talking about the match that you need for those grants...okay.
Farris/ Those match, you know, yeah, I think we've talked about that before, some of the
corporate hangar, uh, grants and some of the other stuff. So there, definitely the match
that comes on the federal side, the local match, and that's...but, uh, some of the State
side, uh, grants that we've had are looking for...for things that we can't get from a federal
grant...so I think those are the ones that we look at. That can affect us more than
movement of a...of a operational side that we (mumbled) look for efficiencies to improve
that.
Wilburn/ As you're aware, because of the way that structurally the Airport is set up that all the
City Council can really do is give you money or not. The Airport Commission really sets
policy.
Farris/ Right.
Wilburn/ And...um, a few years ago, um, also as you're aware, um there was some issues related
to just communication with the City Manager and other departments, finance, etc., etc.
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Farris/ Right.
Wilburn/ Um, and uh, we had at least discussed, it was not supported by a majority of Council,
um, as long as, um, those communication issues were taken care of, then um, there'd be
no further intention to try and change the relationship so that the Airport were directly
under the City Manager. Um, we've appreciated appearances in front of the Council, um,
at our meetings...at the formal meetings, to walk us through discussions with the Airport
Commission, and that is very much appreciated. More important though is that the
Commission is having, um, the communication with the City Manager and whatever
department heads are coming up, um, can you walk us through um, how you feel the
Commission tries to maintain those communications, or any areas, any assistance you
could use, information you could use to make sure that the information that flows, is
happening, uh, weekly, daily, you know, I don't know in terms of operations how that
goes, but that's...that's more important that that relationship is there. So...
Farris/ Yeah, L ..I think, um, the...the Airport Specialist position gives the Commission someone
that is with the City, can speak to Dale or Michael at any time, to Kevin about, you know,
operational things happening that day. We don't have anything formal set up to meet
with, um, anyone at the moment -the Chair nor the Commission side. Um, I think that
might not be a bad thing to...to set up, even kind of a status report. We probably use our
minutes as that kind of communication tool. Um, I too feel that the communication back
and forth is, uh, quite a key to ensure that there's no misunderstandings or where we want
to go, um, and would look at any opportunity like that, that we could increase what I
think, at least in my period, uh, on the Commission has been fairly, and I can't say
because before I watched a little bit of how the Commission operated with the City, and
then heard information from the past, but I think it has increased to try and ensure that,
uh, we're available, we can communicate some of the formal side might be something we
could improve on, that have, uh, I could have Michael and if the Chair needs or the
Commission, to have them more (mumbled) situations come up, or we have something to
speak about. The south area development, um, budgeting process, um, but I don't know
if we have just an informal, or excuse me, a formal you know discussion just to see if
there's anything, uh, new or what's happening or what we're looking for. I know we try
to, at least communicate I'd say with this change in the maintenance idea to looking to,
uh, fixed base operator to do some of the maintenance. We had some talks, or at least I
did and Michael did with Dale or something, just to see what they're feeling, how they
would see this process go. So I think there's some in there, but there's nothing that's just
like a scheduled monthly thing. But I don't see why it couldn't be.
Wilburn/ Um, I would encourage you to go to that more formal route, uh, hear from the rest of
my colleagues on Council here, but again, um, as you agreed with that relationship with
the staff, through the City Manager's office, is...is critical, because all we can do, uh,
if...if there's a rift as, uh, or potential rift as there had been in the past, then um, really the
Council only has a couple choices - to not give money or to try and change the structure,
so I would encourage (mumbled)
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Bailey/ Other comments or questions for Greg...Mike, Connie, Matt?
Hayek/ These are tough times. We're trying to shift a little bit here and there, and...
Correia/ Well, and I guess, I mean I think...I think part of this is setting up the framework, our
expectation of more self-sufficiency, and I think that there's definitely value and I'm not
.wanting to go to zero, you know, support. I think there are absolutely economic
development benefits, culture and recreation benefits to having a municipal airport
supported by local government, um, but I guess you know as we are looking at other
departments that are not business enterprises, and asking Transit or Parking, you know,
um, Housing Inspections, and we're getting that proposals of increasing their fees, kind of
a big amount, a big jump, right - 33%, um, 19%, you know, even if I imagine the 2010
budget that we have with your...your rent line has increased from...I didn't do the math
to see how much you estimated the increase, but if you were planning on a 3%, and that's
where we got this number, even just tacking on additional 3% of that so it's a 6% increase
in rents; however, and I'm just thinking about, you know, an additional $8,000 increase
in...
Bailey/ But if those rents are comparable, do we really want to see that? I mean, that's my
question.
Correial Well, I'm not necessarily, I mean...I, and I'm not saying maybe it's not all from...all
from rent is, you know, is there a landing fee at, for Hawkeye football games, you know,
it's...you know, whatever else might be, we can bring it down to 112 and there'd be a
balanced budget, so I'm saying find another $8,000...
Farris/ And I guess that's what I would probably say....yeah is what is there a number, you
know, is there a percentage that we're looking to take off?
Correia/ Well, I guess because you're not part of, because of the...the, or the organization set up,
we can't tell you how to do that, like...
Farris/ Right.
Correia/ ...like we're saying you are the expert, you figure out how to do it. If you were part of
us, we'd have our staff... as you know, working with parking and other departments
and...
Farris/ Right.
Correia/ ...on how to do that, and I think there's probably an array of things, but and I just have
to say, $110 a month seems pretty inexpensive, I mean, it's probably worth it to you or
somebody else to pay an additional $25 then to move it to Muscatine, when you'd have to
drive to Muscatine any time you wanted to use your plane, and you're going to use that
amount of money in time and gas. So, comp.. .
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Champion/ You don't have to go as far as Muscatine. Um, there are other airports. Um, I'd like
to cut it back a little bit, um...
Bailey/ Like I said, I'm comfortable with 120, which would still give us a balance, it just
wouldn't give the, it wouldn't give the carryover, but I would hope that you would
recognize that, I mean, there are lots of ideas out there and the goal has always been self-
sufficiency, or increased self-sufficiency and I know we'll be talking about some of these
economic development possibilities with the south aviation commerce park. That's what
I'm comfortable...I'm just speaking for myself here, but.. .
O'Donnell/ I would be comfortable with 120 also.
Champion/ I...I can support that too.
Bailey/ So, but...
O'Donnell/ I would really take advantage of...of Michael and Dale and...um Kevin and...these
are great guys, um, I mean for their expertise and...and just somebody to ask a question
to, cause there's...I'd encourage that.
Farris/ And I think the Airport does, and I thought, at least in the time that I've been there, to
look at, uh, maybe we do need to, you know, we have the strategic plan that comes out,
but maybe we look at a, what we can do and see what kind of things we can do over the
next five years to keep reducing, you know, I caution big moves, cause that's harder for
people to handle, but uh, I mean, I don't see why we couldn't have a plan that looks at,
um...
Bailey/ Well, and are some of these things that Amy's suggested, I mean, looking at those
comparable Big Tens, or even the other, um, you know, Ames and Cedar Falls, what did
those airports do on those game weekends? I don't...I think that it's great that we get that
traffic through our community, and...and I don't want to create a situation where people
are driving to the next airport for their hangars and, you know, eating at those restaurants
and doing those sorts of things. I want that to stay here, but there maybe ideas out there
and you...you all have great experts because you all fly around to different places. You
know what the...you know what the drill is in other places. So...
Champion/ How, uh, when you land at an airport, like I'm flying my airplane to go to an Iowa
football game...um, who actually pays for that landing? I mean, when I fly
commercially, I pay a fee.
Farris/ In tax, yeah. The, um...
Champion/ We do!
Farris/ Right, I mean, the...the, if you look at the federal fund that comes out, there's many fees
that get paid. I would pay some of that if I fly in to Midway, uh, a larger, some of the
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larger airports. There's some taxes and things that go along into that. When you look at
the way they set up the general aviation side of it, um, and there's quite a few talks to
look in funding the FAA with different ways from users' fees and things along that. Most
of the money actually comes out of the taxing on the fuel. If you look at aviation fuel has
a large tax on it that goes all back into the General Fund, which then usually comes back
to the Airport in runways and that's probably the majority of the funding comes from the
fuel tax, and then some from the taxes that you pay when you fly in and out of a
commercial airport. Those tend to go back to the commercial size opposed to general
aviation. So they're looking...the FAA's having problems over the years to try to find
their funding, and looking...they talked about user fees. Many people come back and
say, why don't you just keep raising the, uh, taxes on fuel, because it's a better kind of tax
than trying to track me and decide where I flew and what services I used on the flight,
um, and that's a big debate that goes on, uh, probably the last three or four years, on the
federal side.
Bailey/ Okay.
Correia/ So when we sell fuel here, we keep the taxes?
Farris/ Um, we take a percentage, 10 cents on the gallon that goes to it.
Correia/ Okay.
Farris/ The...
Correia/ When does that show up on your budget?
Farris/ That would be, uh, in the...it's about $20,000 a year and should show up in the revenues.
I don't know (both talking)
Correia/ Says "Royalties and Commissions" maybe? Is that what that is?
Farris/ Yeah, I think...I believe so that's where it is. And we've looked there too to see, uh, you
have to watch but the increasing the fuel flow percentage that we put out, um, of course
an easier way is to increase the amount of aircraft coming through, and then volume as
with everything, uh, increases that, which we did the...we did the Jet A fuel. I mean, one
side of putting a self-serve pump for the Jet A fuel, which is the one that the helicopters
use, is first it's very convenient for them. They don't have to have acall-out in the middle
of the night and...but it also increases our fuel flow rate here. Uh, a lot of the helicopters
will come here and land and fuel up, so we've seen increases in there and with the longer
runway, a little more increases.
Bailey/ Okay. Well (several talking) thank you, no that's...this is fascinating, but you know, I've
got (several talking) about airports and, which would be fun! (several talking) Yeah, we
could do that. Thanks for being here.
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Farris/ No problem at all! Thanks for the opportunity.
Bailey/ We appreciate the information.
Farris/ Thanks for the comments too.
Bailey/ Thank you.
Wright/ Thanks, Greg. (noise on mic)
Housing & Inspection Fees (pg 8 -memo dist. 1/10 and pg. 49 -budget):
Page 12
Bailey/ Okay. Next, uh, let's talk about this, um, housing inspection fees. This was in a memo,
and that was in the packet that was handed out on Saturday, page 8 of that, um, the memo
from Norm. And then, um, let's see...and the budget page is page 49. So...thanks, Greg.
Champion/ I don't actually have that.
Bailey/ Um, it's a handout from Saturday. It was probably in (mumbled)
O'Donnell/ I don't think she...it was handed out Saturday.
Bailey/ Did she get the Saturday handouts? Is that her pile? (several talking) Who's pile, is that
Mike's pile?
Champion/ Oh, I don't have it.
Bailey/ All right.
Boothroy/ Are you talking about the...I've got an extra one (several talking) yeah, why don't you
pass that down? I think...the one that Norm wrote? (several talking) yeah.
Champion/ Thanks.
Bailey/ So, just overview, um, option 1, 2, and 3 for Connie's benefit, at the bottom of this first
page of the memo...for us.
Cate/ Okay. Um, what I've done is broken down, uh, two, well, two increases and one static
option, so we have three options. Uh, the first option would be a 19.5% increase in the
rental permit fee, um, the second option is a, uh, 12.5%, um, increase (mumbled), uh, and
the third option is a, um, is no increase at all. And on the second and third page of the
memo, what is shown is how that affects the, uh, receipts and expenditures in the General
Levy, over afive-year period. Um, the way that our, uh, fee structure is set up is that
some years we do have more revenue that other years because we have more volumes in
inspections in those years. So it's not, uh, a linear projection - we do have, uh, budget
years where we are going to, uh, take in more revenue than others. So I broke it over a
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five-year period, broke it down over afive-year period, and...if we take on a 19.5%
increase in the fee, the rental fee permit, um, from FY2009 through FY2013, we would
produce a balanced budget over that time period, um, that would mean there would, over
that time period, be no General Funds supporting our staffs budget. Um, option two, uh,
reduces that fee increase to 12.5%. So over that same time period, uh, we would be using
5% of the General, uh, Funds to uh, to support our budget, the rental inspection budget.
And the third option leaves us with no fee increase and, uh, over that same five-year time
period, uh, we would be 12.5 to 13% dependent on the General Fund to support, uh, our
budget. Um...
Correia/ Well, I actually, you know, and I'm looking at option 3, right now, and I'm doing the
math. You're saying with no fee increase, and we did just do a...a fee increase when we,
um, went to two years. So it represents increasing costs (both talking) to the owner.
Cate/ Right. We did a schedule change.
Correia/ Did schedule changes, which had...is increasing their costs.
Boothroy/ But not to all rental units. Only to single family or.. .
Correia/ The ones that are going into the new...
Boothroy/ Right, so it'd, yeah, or over afour-year period, three-year period.
Correia/ The others were already every other year.
Boothroy/ Right.
Correia/ So you moved, and that...that was, I supported that and that was a good move. So when
I do the math, on option 3, no fee increase, General Levy contribution of this exorbitant
amount over five years, and I do the math, and it's $66,600 a year General Levy support,
which is half of what we're just proposing to give to the Airport in General Levy support,
and subsidizing what we believe is an important economic development contribution and
subsidizes, um, culture and, uh, recreation, as well as economic development, to...a small
number of...of people. Certainly the economic development aspects, bringing in jobs
that pay well is good, um, as well, but when I think about the number of rental units we
have, what, 15,000...
Cate/ 16,400.
Correia/ And...and I know we often think of, those are all student households and they certainly
aren't, um, that there is a, I mean, I believe that there is a place for us to be subsidizing
that, um, argument to be made, um, to subsidize that as a...as a public safety, as well as
trying not to do anything in this economy to increase rents. These costs will be passed on
to the renter, you know, census data estimates that about half of our renter households in
Iowa City, in Johnson County, have a hard time paying their rent, and their wages aren't'
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January 12, 2009 City Council Page 14
going up, um, but costs are going up. Utilities are...are going up very high, not
keeping...not keeping pace, um, and so because it's $66,000 a year, you know, this is not
a business enterprise. This is part of our public safety, um, portfolio of services. I'm
comfortable in...and can justify not recommending a fee increase. I don't think it's out of
line with how we subsidize other, even business enterprises.
Bailey/ Okay, so you're supportive of option 3, which would be different than the budget we've
got presented. Other comments or.. .
Cate/ I'd like to add something to your point, Amy, about the impact that this is going to have on
the renters in Iowa City. Um, if you'd take a typical 12-plex in town, which is a two-
bedroom unit in a 12-plex apartment building, um, the monthly impact of this 19.5%
increase is 23-cents a month on that...on that...
Boothroy/ Per unit month.
Cate/ ...per unit...
Wright/ Per apartment you mean.
Cate/ ...per apartment, um, it's 23-cents. And for asingle-family home, it's about $1.40...a
month increase, um, I mean, I think that's just...when I'm doing my monthly...
Correia/ I know, and when I suggested in the last presentation that they increase rents an
additional 3%, you know, on $110 a month it's three bucks, but it's too much to increase
because maybe people will find another airport hangar. So, um, you know, I guess L ..I
don't necessarily agree with the premise that this should be self-supporting without any
support from the General Fund at all. It's a public safety function of our city, um, you
know, we do have, um, households that have a hard time paying the rent, and even adding
$2.00 or whatever, a landlord might justify because of the increase in their costs, you
know, I...with other costs increasing and wages not increasing and people getting laid off
or hours cut, um, I...you know, $66,000 in subsidy a year, I can justify that.
Bailey/ Let's hear from some others.
Wright/ Actually that was going to be one of my questions, what that would work out to be per
rental unit. Um, given that what the number we've heard, we're talking basically about
the price of a cup of coffee per month.
Champion/ ...it's hard to find a cup of coffee for a dollar in this town!
Wright/ Dollar ninety five at the Java House so (laughter and several talking)
Champion/ Less than coffee probably! (several talking)
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Wright/ That doesn't work out to be a terribly onerous increase for the renters, and that was
really one of my concerns was what was this going to work out to.
Cate/ Again, uh, if it was a 19.5% increase for that 12-plex, that one unit in the 12-plex, two-
bedroom unit, it would be a, um, a 23-cent a month increase.
Wright/ And about a dollar for asingle-family.
Cate/ About $1.40 a month for the single-family. Correct.
Correia/ And then we certainly have a specific number of...of units in town that are developed
with low-income housing tax credits in our Home Funds that they can't raise the rent
above a certain amount, so we're increasing their costs, um, to do business, but they can't
increase the price to help offset those costs, then we put those projects in a precarious
situation.
Bailey/ Let's benchmark this for a little bit. Um, other communities, are their inspection services
for, um, rental, um, housing rental units, are they self-sufficient? Is it a General Fund? Is
it similar to the way we've been approaching it? What would you say, um.. .
Cate/ Well, um, a lot of the municipalities I have talked to...
Bailey/ In Iowa?
Cate/ In Iowa.
Bailey/ Okay.
Cate/ Are looking to be fully funded, and that's what they're getting from their City Council, uh,
to recommend to...increase the rental fees so that they can become self-sufficient, uh, not
all municipalities are doing that, uh, I think our rates are...are on the high end, now.
Bailey/ Our rental...okay.
Cate/ Um...(several talking)...comparable to Des Moines.
Bailey/ But let's talk...how bout, okay, I know I'm asking you to pull information out of the air,
but Ames also has some challenges with affordability, um, that's another...
Cate/ Ames has a different rental setup than we do.
Bailey/ Okay.
Cate/ Um, let's say that they're not as, um...not going to say as forceful, but they don't have the,
they go in and check a smoke detector and the fire extinguisher and basically.. .
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Bailey/ Okay, it's not, maybe not as rigorous, okay.
Page 16
Boothroy/ (several talking) and don't deal with neighborhood issues to the same level that we do.
Champion/ Right.
O'Donnell/ What...how do their fees compare?
Cate/ Uh, I would say they're about half of what we charge.
Bailey/ Okay.
Champion/ But I don't think our renters want to move to Ames to have these (several talking)
Cate/ They provide less services with regard to inspections (several talking). Their setup is that
they use, uh, two University, uh, interns, if you will, to do a lot of their inspections.
Bailey/ Oh, okay. All right, other questions, concerns about this proposal?
Wilburn/ The only comment that L ..I have, um, the point I was trying to make Saturday, uh, and
you may disagree with this or not. It may feel like it's a less direct impact to someone
who owns a multiplex, so that perhaps they are not going to, um, so that you don't want to
impact a renter, but if it's all coming out of the General Fund, they're going to be taxed
anyway, if you own that...if you, so you know, perhaps it feels better to not have it go to
the, and maybe it's less likely or less that a landlord will...the direct result be that they
raise the rents, but the property tax is going to go up anyway. It's the point I think that
folks years ago were, and correct me if I'm wrong, other cities that would be trying to get
their housing, um, inspection departments to be self-sufficient, is that for logistically for
the city, it reduces the pressure on the General...the General Fund, on the 8/10 fund. So,
um, I'm just, I mean, if it feels like maybe there'll be less people that would be inclined to
increase their...their tenant's rent, then I'd say that's fine, just pull it out of the General
Fund, but I guess in the end I'm just saying that's not necessarily going to be the result.
It's the pressure on the...on the General Fund.
Champion/ And I think when you say a 19% increase, that just really leaps out.
Cate/ Well, take into account that we haven't had an increase since, uh, 2000, uh, July of 2006.
We will be looking at three years, and...but (both talking)
Champion/ But it isn't that much money, I mean, that's why it...who increases their prices 20%?
Correia/ I mean, the Airport only increases 3 !
Champion/ Well, L ..it's obvious that you don't really like the Airport.
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January 12, 2009 City Council Page 17
Correia/ No, no, no! (laughter) I don't not like the Airport. I'm just, I mean, if we're going to
give this type of consideration of subsidizing a...an economic development and a luxury
service, you know, I mean, I think.. .
Champion/ It's not a luxury if you need a kidney.
Correia/ Not if you need a kidney, but.. .
Champion/ Well, you might need one some day! (noise on mic) I'm sorry, I shouldn't argue
with you but (both talking)
Hayek/ I...I agree with Ross's comments. I mean, we have a essentially zero-sum game, at least
in 2009. We can increase fees here, or not, um, if we don't do it here maybe we have to
increase fees for other services that the same people you're concerned about, um, need.
Um, or we cut services, uh, which hurts that population and the entire community, or we
increase taxes. Um, and so...I mean, the...I'm...I appreciate the concern about, uh, about
the impact to affordable housing, but I see it if we...if we avoid it here, I see it popping
up somewhere else.
O'Donnell/ Well, I think we all came with the same question tonight -how does it impact the
renter, and I...I'm just amazed that it's 23-cents. Um, I...I guess I was figuring $10, $12.
Champion/ Yeah, I was too.
Hayek/ But what if...what about asingle-family house?
Cate/ For asingle-family house, have athree-bedroom single-family house, if we raise it 19.5%
it would be $1.40 a month.
Wright/ Not much.
Bailey/ Well, and...I know that some people base their rents on costs, but it seems rents around
here are more market-driven, and...and personally I seem they seem a little bit more
arbitrary, but um, than, oh, I'm paying more. I'll raise it this 23-cents. That seems the
most fair thing to do. I...I don't think that that's what will happen. I think it, if you look
down the street and see who's...who's renting for what, and see what you can get. So...
O'Donnell/ You would spend more in paperwork raising it to 23...raising it 23-cents. (several
talking) I'm...
Hayek/ ...heck of a number.
Champion/ It is, it really leaps out!
Bailey/ Ross, you had a comment? (several talking)
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Wilburn/ I was, I mean...I mean, maybe there is some, if...maybe some property owners maybe
more inclined if the...if the fee is showing up in, uh, you know, in the permits that they
have to get, you know, maybe they don't think that...that way. I don't know.
Correia/ So can there, has there been any thought to...uh, differential fee for owners of
properties that cannot absorb, that are at their max rent, because it is subsidized through
another source?
Boothroy/ Well, one thing I wanted to mention, and there are some -you're right, because some
of the funding, at least with...the only one I'm familiar with that are maxed out like that
was the Fellowship. They have a few units that were, by the way they structured their
grants, they...they locked in, uh, a rate . Uh, most of the other non-profits that have
affordable housing are tied to the fair-market rents, and those have been going up, and I
did get a chart on that. Uh, and they go up...anywhere from uh, 2 to 4, 5% a year,
depending on what's happening in the Iowa City market. So, since the last time we raised
fees, which was in 2002/2003, the two-bedroom for example has gone up about $115 a
month increase, which you know, that's what the Housing Authority establishes as its
payment standard. So, uh, with some exceptions, uh, and I don't know how many units
we're talking about there, but...but uh, the other 500 or 600 units out there that are, uh,
available, uh, you know, there is an inflationary, uh, provision that HUD includes and it's
far greater than what we're talking about with regard to this particular increase. So I
think it's fair in that sense.
Bailey/ Would you clarify something for me? Um, because we've been talking about alternative
revenues. We've been talking about tax-exempt property. Are rental property that's
owned bynon-profits, do they pay property tax?
Boothroy/ No.
Correia/ Well, when they form an LLC they do.
Boothroy/ And maybe under some...some mechanisms, but not all mechanisms.
Bailey/ We have...we have, we do have rental units then out there that are tax-exempt rental
units.
Boothroy/ There are...I suppose it depends on how they've put.. .
Bailey/ Yes, how they've structured it. I understand that, but...but if they're getting tax, um, tax
credits (both talking)
Boothroy/ ...getting a subsidy.
Correia/ Right, but again there's...
Bailey/ They've formed the LLC, yes.
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Correia/ Right, right.
Boothroy/ And if you're looking at, I don't know what we're talking about in terms of, what 600
units or something like that, out of 16,000, uh, it's relatively small group, but it's still, it
would impact the budget if we were...I don't know how you can exempt that from.. .
Correia/ By having a policy, couldn't you?
Boothroy/ Well, I don't know if it's fair.
Bailey/ Well, actually I would suggest if we're supporting alternative revenues, fees in lieu of,
um, property taxes that the more fair thing is to charge the fees, because they aren't
paying property taxes.
Boothroy/ Exactly! I would...I agree with you philosophically on that for sure. Uh.. .
Correia/ But there's a benefit to our...to our community and to the workforce if we have people
who are working in that service industry, let's just say, that make it possible when people
fly in to go to a football game that they have servers, that they have people working in
hotels, that when those people end their shift, they can afford where they live, they can
afford the rent. They're not, you know...
Bailey/ This isn't changing the affordability of those places.
Correia/ But, in terms of being able to make, we subsidize lots of other things. I don't...that we
say provide a public benefit to...an economic development benefit to our community,
and affordable housing is one such enterprise that does support our economic
development. If we have stable workforce, then we have good economic development.
If we do not have a stable workforce, you know, we don't have, uh.. .
Bailey/ But my point about tax-exempt property, because it's been...it's been looked at as...about
the alternative revenues and something that I'm interested in, um, is those organizations,
those houses, they benefit from the infrastructure we provide, and yet are not....yes,
they're housing people, they're contributing to that aspect, but...are not also paying to the
property tax base.. .
Correia/ Right.
Bailey/ ...and so the fees are a way of getting...it's a fee, I mean, almost in lieu o£ That's what
I'm likening it to.
Correia/ There's only about (both talking) non-profit housing units.
Boothroy/ No, I think there's...close to 600, isn't it?
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Cate/ Well, we have...(both talking) Pheasant Ridge.
Boothroy/ Autumn Park, Pheasant Ridge, Capitol House...(several talking)
Correia/ Pheasant Ridge...
Boothroy/ Oh, I don't know what their (both talking)
Correia/ Pheasant Ridge pays property taxes.
Page 20
Bailey/ I think we're talking about two different things. We were talking about affordable
housing that's not...not for-profit, and Amy's talking about affordable housing (several
talking) LLC to get tax credits.
Correia/ Housing Fellowship had 100 and they're moving more towards the LLC with the tax
credits, so they're putting those back (mumbled)
Boothroy/ Ecumenical...it may be anon-profit but...
Bailey/ Yeah, I don't know about.. .
Hayek/ Maybe one way to look at this from another angle is to consider the historic levy support,
um, number...the figures, the percentages going back in time. From this memo we can
see that up until the early-2000's, it was 30 to 50% support from the General Levy. Their
action was to become self-sufficient, and that occurred, and now it's kind of swinging
back the other way again, and these proposals have various levels of...of support in mind.
Option one is zero support, but option two is only a 5% support level from the General
Levy. So it puts it into context, I think.
Bailey/ Uh-huh. Well, and our proposed budget reflects the 19.5 increase. So when we're
looking at those numbers, that's how we're getting there, and I think that that's also an
important consideration, um, as we have those in front of us. So, where are we with this?
O'Donnell/ I'm okay with the 19.
Champion/ I am too.
O'Donnell/ L ..you know, I don't think ifll even, I can't imagine somebody increasing the rent 23-
cents. I just can't imagine that. And if you...if you have 1,500 units, if you're the owner,
cost you an additional $345 a year. I mean, that's...you're still not going to do the
paperwork for that. I don't.. .
Bailey/ Ross...
Wilburn/ The only other piece that I would throw out there is, uh, as a Council if you want to
think any time, um, a rental... a, uh, dah, dah, dah, dah, dah, a permit fee goes up, then
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uh, the Council's going to be lobbied by, uh, those property owners, they will get the
homebuilders, perhaps they may get some others, so uh, what you're inclination in terms
of, um, what arguments are you going to use when we are lobbied now, again...I guess
my point earlier goes back, they're going to see an increase anyway. Are they less likely
to come and start lobbying if their general, um, if the General Levy to them, um, goes up,
or if it's specific to maybe they feel that it's targeting them and singling them out, so I
guess...
Boothroy/ Well, we've never done a fee increase without objection...from the Apartment Owners
Association. Never had the Homebuilders involved.
Bailey/ So, where are you with this?
Boothroy/ It's going to happen.
Wilburn/ Um, you know, I mean, I would be okay having it go to the, um, doing the option 3, or
if a compromise of options, but I'd be okay with option 3, but my, I guess what I'm just
putting out there is...is this something that we're going to stick to, based on do we hear
from renters, do we hear from (several talking)
Bailey/ No increase?
Wilburn/ Yeah, yeah.
Bailey/ You're with Amy on this? Okay.
Champion/ Well, I don't mind people lobbying. I mean, it doesn't bother me.
Wilburn/ I'm not saying it does, I'm just saying, if, uh, if...um, when the budget is going to be
adopted, um, I would just, if we go that route, we're probably not done with this
particular issue. That's the only point I'm saying. I know you have no problem (laugher
and several talking)
Bailey/ ...have a specific expectation of...
Lombardo/ ...the option 1, the increase, if I didn't think it was warranted, that it would cause
relatively little impact, but also then, you know, looking at the cuts that we're going to
face, I mean, any...you know, any ability that we have to increase fees, to maintain
services, I think is...is a good thing at this point. Um, we're going to be in a cut mode
here within a few short months, and anything we can do now to help ease that burden,
and not slash services, um, L ..somebody today in an interview was asking, you know, the
difference between cutting your budget with a scalpel versus a hatchet, and I'd rather not
see us in a hatchet mode, um, so L ..you know, we've...we've been I think very prudent in
where we've built in cost increases, um, and have only done that where we think, a, it's a
penalty for the bad actors, visa vie like the parking increase, but in here it's a modest
increase to individual owners.
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Wilburn/ Well, let me ask you this, I mean, um, given how you, um, made some reductions and
put the budget together, I mean, is that...where's my memo? Can you speak to the
potential impact, ramification of the, uh, over the course of five years, the...$333,000 out
of the General Levy, or I guess $60,000... (several talking)... $66,660.60, um, impact a
year on...on potential staffing cut. I mean, is that...(several talking)
Lombardo/ ...depending on which position you look at, but on average I'd say that's pretty close
to (several talking)
Correia/ Has there been any consideration, I mean, this sort of thought that came up as we were
talking about an item earlier on our...on our special formal meeting of freezing salaries
ofnon-bargaining employees, and what that would...what that would do for a period of
time?
Lombardo/ I haven't looked at it in terms of...of the dollar amount, but we get into the same
internal equity issues that, you know, we've espoused for passing or ratifying a contract
with the labor union, so um, I think it creates tremendous, um, inequities in the fact
that...in, often what you'd end up doing is incenting those that can organize to organize,
as opposed to staying outside of the bargaining unit, and that certainly opens up its own
level of...of um, expectations with future contracts. So, I, you know, it can be done, um,
but it seems like it's often the first place many jurisdictions go to, and...and I think it
raises a tremendous number of internal equity issues.
Correia/ I mean, cause we heard that, and I don't know if the State is doing that, but I mean I
heard that on the news that the State was saying, 'No pay increases,' and I imagine they
can't do that for the bargaining employees. But they must be talking about the non-
bargaining employees.
Lombardo/ Right, but many states also do things like, um, you know, uh, unscheduled, or
holidays or furlough type things where...you know, and to me they're budget gimmicks
and you end up marring the workforce and your relationships with your...your workers,
and um, and your...the typical savings on that, collectively can be a fairly large amount,
but is it really worth the harm done to labor relations, and um, you know, Iowa City's
enjoyed long-tenured employees and I think it's that way, uh, because people are treated
equitably and...you know, the challenge you get into is...is saying, well, we'll bargain
that in the future. You're not going to bargain zero percent contract.
Bailey/ Right.
Correia/ But even if we were talking about.. .
Bailey/ Can we go back to this issue at hand? I mean...
Correia/ But I mean, if we're talking about we're at a.. .
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Bailey/ Well, I...I just...
Wright/ Still got Norm and...
Bailey/ Yeah, I'd like to, and we have a couple of other...Matt...
Hayek/ Here's a question, I'm trying to understand why there's a heavy amount of support early
on and then there's actually a surplus in 2012, 2013. Is that with the coming online with
it after two years?
Cate/ We don't really see that impact of the, uh, the schedule change until FY2011.
Hayek/ Okay.
Cate/ And then, you're going to have 2011 and FY2013 as big bump years. Uh, we're going to
be doubling up on some inspections just because of the way things cycle through.
(several talking) No, I think that bump stays. Kevin, do you remember how we did that,
uh, word problem? (laughter)
Correia/ But then do we have more revenue than we have expenditures, like we have in building
inspections?
Cate/ Well, that's why, Amy, that's why I took it over afive-year period, because there'll be some
years where we're going to have a deficit and some years where we're going to have an
excess, so in that five-year period, if the 19.5% increase is agreed upon, we would have a
balanced budget over that...
Boothroy/ This is just one fee increase in five years.
Cate/ That's right.
Boothroy/ So this, if you...what we're proposing is a fee increase that would happen as effective
this July, but it would not occur again until whenever that date is on the (mumbled)
Cate/ ...you'd be looking at, uh, FY...
Boothroy/ Five years...so it's a fee increase for the next five years. So there is some stability in
that fee increase.
Hayek/ I know we don't...we don't project past 2013, but the trend would seem to suggest
substantial surpluses in 2014 and beyond, is that...I mean, I'm just extrapolating from
these numbers.
Boothroy/ I don't know how that could be, but...(several talking)
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O'Malley/ Norm and I...both agreed on his numbers, and we didn't do a thorough analysis of it,
but I gave him a word problem as to this, and he (laughter and several commenting)
toward my logic that he wouldn't (several talking)
Hayek/ No offense, Norm, but what's your logic here? (laughter)
O'Malley/ My logic was it was going to drop off, actually. It wasn't going to be a significant...
Hayek/ I think we're going to face...I think it's one thing to cover your costs, but if...I think
we're going to face some real scrutiny if we start generating a bunch of extra cash.
Boothroy/ Well, we wouldn't, uh, we can't generate extra cash. Those revenues should reflect
our costs, and I would be here immediately to change that if that were the case. We
just...but it, as Norm mentioned, we...not every year's the same. Some years we have
more business than other years, just because of the way the scheduling is.
Hayek/ Yeah.
Boothroy/ And...and of course, you know, even if the fees go into effect, this July, there will be
some that won't see that increase for two years. So, it's a phased increase, and all of this
is staggered out over time, so it's...it's not as if everybody gets hit at the same time, and
so that's what makes it kind of tricky in terms of projecting.
Wilburn/ And given...I'd forgotten what you just said about the phasing in (noise on mic) same
time, and that it's aone-time, uh, increase. I'm going to go back to Matt's analogy of
where you want the bulge to occur, given that I... so I'm going to...I've rethought this and
I would go with, um, I would go with option 1, um...cause I think there's a1so...I think
there's also going to be, uh, I mean if one position, that's a generality, but um, I think
we're going to have other pressures about positions, which equate to services and so then,
you know, that's the bulges -which service do you do without and so L ..I would stick
with this increase given that.
Champion/ But I'm correct, it's going to take five years for this to balance itself out. (several
talking) Okay.
Wright/ The plus side is of course that there's not going to be an increase in these fees for five
years, according to the table that we had here.
Champion/ Right.
Wright/ And there hasn't been an increase in three...
Cate/ That's right.
Wright/ So actually you shift...work that out it's not such a bad deal.
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Bailey/ Do you have further comments, Matt?
Page 25
Hayek/ No. I'm, you know, I map it out over the next two years, the difference between option 1
and option 2 is about $57,000 of General Levy support. That's a position (several
talking) yeah.
Bailey/ Okay. So (several talking) it looks like we hold the budget as it is. Apologize to those
who are waiting, but we're going to take a break until 8:00...(several talking)...8:25, let's
do that! (BREAD
Police:
Okay, let's, um...get started. Um, how about if we go to, um, hearing from the Police Chief
next?
Lombardo/ And I passed out...a memo, um, I think the date on it is incorrect. I think it had an
automatic date field and it was updated. This is a memo that, uh, Sam had prepared for
Dale, uh, quite a while ago. Um, in looking at the CSO positions, but uh, provides a little
bit of written background and Chief is here to...to discuss that further.
Bailey/ Okay. We had some specific questions about why five, and um, why five...(several
talking) not wireless (laughter) and then, um, so we'll just start with that.
Hargadine/ Well, unlike, um, many elements of city government, we work 24/7 and uh, we need
to staff our front desk likewise, 24 hours a day, seven days a week, holidays, weekends,
um, we never shut down, and that would allow us to staff, um, that front desk position
with one uniformed trained front desk personnel, um...a person, and um, allow rotating
through the different watches and allow for time off, as well.
Champion/ I don't have any questions about that. It maybe cause I wasn't here on Saturday.
Maybe this was discussed, but obviously you need somebody at the front desk. Um, you
mentioned the last time we met, when I was here, that it was going to be a, uh,
public...what do you call'em...the people that drive those white cars (several talking)
community service officer.
Bailey/ Five! (laughter)
Champion/ Um, I mean, why wouldn't this just be trained clerk? That's my question. That's the
only question I have.
Correia/ Well there's some good answers in here about that.
Hargadine/ The...people at the front desk will have certain clerical responsibilities, but I look,
uh, for a lot more responsibility from them as well. Um, it's a little unusual in that we
need more than just a receptionist person.
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Champion/ Okay.
Page 26
Hargadine/ We need, um, there are disturbances that...that end up in the front lobby, um, there
needs to be somebody who, um, knows everything about our operation, but also a lot of
other, uh, elements of city government as well, because often times we're the ones that
receive the phone calls about other units of city government after hours. How do I get
this done? How do I get...when are you going, you know, we get all kinds of questions.
And so it needs to be someone who ismulti-faceted to include clerical skills.
Bailey/ One of the things we talked about on Saturday is I think there is interest, um, and I'm
sure my colleagues will correct me if I'm speaking inaccurately, there is interest in
increasing, um, this department or looking at this department for increases. The concern
I think that was expressed is perhaps not in this area, and what other duties can these
CSO's perform? I mean, what other opportunities do these, uh, positions provide to us as
a community, to increase this department and its ability to do its work.
Hargadine/ I think it's going to be different, depending on the time of day, because just like other
areas, uh, other clerical areas, uh, they're really busy between 8:00 and 5:00, just with
walk-up traffic. Um, likewise, so is our records unit, and some questions that we've
fielded before is why can't records handle this? Well, they already have their specific job
duties, and those wouldn't get done in a timely manner, uh, if they were handling the
walk-up traffic. After 5:00, to answer your question, I see them as being warrant entry,
uh, and that requires, uh, state-wide certification from...from Iowa. So, it's not
somebody that can just sit down and...and um, and do it immediately. They have to go
to Des Moines for training, um...they will also be, um, answering the phone 24 hours a
day. They need to be, they know how to get a hold of me, they need to know how to get
a hold of Michael, possibly even the Mayor, just depends, um, that's just one extra.
They're also the contact person for the Fire Department. That's how you get somebody
from the Fire, usually, is come into our office after hours and say how do I get the Fire
Department, and they...they facilitate that. So...
Correia/ Is the question, or part of your question, or is this maybe just a new question, um.. .
Bailey/ That's okay to...
Correia/ Okay. Having, because dispatch...so dispatch services are moving to the Joint
Comm.. .
Hargadine/ There's a dozen employees leaving that...
Correia/ And so...does having these five employees, the work that they would be doing mean
that our uniformed officers' time is freed up, and they would have to cover potentially
some of the things that these officers would be doing. So I mean, is that kind of.. .
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Hargadine/ There are departments that staff their front desk with either an officer or um,
sometimes they'll have desk sergeant. Go to NYPD, uh, they have desk sergeants there,
so...um, I wouldn't recommend that, uh, that's kind of why we, um...
Correia/ Cause that would be a higher level position.
Hargadine/ Much higher.
Correia/ Somebody that otherwise would be out on the street or...so that this is...(several
talking) right, so it essentially...this and our ability to have our uniformed officers out
doing the work (both talking)
Hargadine/ Correct. All of the those things that dispatch does for us now, uh, answering the
phones, and a lot of them maybe, um, their calls internal to the department that don't
necessitate a call for service. How do I get in touch with the investigative commander?
How do I get a hold of the Chief? These kind of things, so, um, the main number to the
Police Department is still going to stay at the front desk.
Correia/ Right.
Hargadine/ Um, that won't go to the new dispatch center. (several talking)
Lombardo/ I think the way Chief described it to me is that the level of discretion and albeit some
of it is clerical, the level of discretion and...and the work they do rises above the base
level, uh, clerical person that he would need to do it, and...and I think there's some
desire, once we upgrade our computer system, to have staff that can run reports for all of
us for decision making and that's going to require, you know, the data that we're talking
about is somewhat more advanced than an average clerical, um, position would warrant.
Hargadine/ That's correct, and, that this person will also function as a complaint taker for the
new dispatch center. It's going to be entered in to the system, and hit the return key and
it'll be shipped out to the new, uh, dispatch center for the call to go out. But they will
enter calls just like a complaint taker out at the new center will.
Correia/ That would be if somebody calls the non-emergency number when it's really maybe an
emergency that needs dispatch (mumbled)
Hargadine/ Absolutely.
Wright/ Or, if it's just somebody calling for a party or...
Correia/ Right, that requires call for service.
Wright/ ...parking job or...(both talking
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Hayek/ You know, I have a question about, I don't doubt the necessity of these CSO's for those
positions in light of the structural changes that are going on, but you know, those...those
five positions are recommended, the additional patrol positions are not recommended,
and so under the status quo as it's been presented to us, we fund those CSO's but we don't
fund any additional patrols...patrol officers, and I'm...I'm sure lots of people share....that
I'm very concerned about crime and...and the severity and degree of it and...and, um,
if...so maybe a question would be, um, you know, if you got five positions, um, would
you allocate all of them to this CSO roles, and none of them to...out on the street?
Hargadine/ It's an apples and an oranges question, and I wish I could talk you into giving up
something else so I could have two more officers, but...I wouldn't sacrifice them at the
expense of these five. These were actually approved for fourth quarter of this year, but
because of delays in the construction of the new center, there's no point, um, so it's a
necessity...and it's dependent upon whenever that new center goes live. I need these
folks in place, trained, a month before that happens.
Wright/ And this is basically we need these folks in order to maintain afull-service department,
correct?
Hargadine/ That front desk.
Wrightl Yeah.
Correia/ I do think there's an expectation that you walk in here at any time and go up to that
(several talking) yeah!
Champion/ No, I don't have any problem with staffing that front window. I've used it several
times and it's really important.
Correia! I mean, I think you answered the questions that we had about why a community service
officer versus...
Hargadine/ Matt makes a good point...
Bailey/ Right.
Hargadine/ I would talk you into anything to get more officers, but I wouldn't sacrifice those
five.
Bailey/ Any other questions for the Chief? Five, or any (several talking) random.. .
Champion/ ...ask now, because I wasn't here on Saturday, I'm sorry, but on the page 41...on the
Police financial plan, I want an explanation...maybe Imissed reading it, on the benefit
levy, cause it seems to jump, it goes down in 09 and jumps way up...
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Lombardo/ That's largely set by...the State sets a rate of increase for, um, the police benefits, and
it's 17°/a.
Champion/ Okay. Okay. (several talking) Thanks. I just had a big checkmark on it. That's
because they're, for the retirement funds you mean, right?
Bailey/ Do you have any comments for us?
Hargadine/ No, Ma'am!
Bailey/ Thanks, Sam.
Lombardo/ I'll only add, you know, I'm sensitive to the desire for additional police officers and
um, as Chief and I have discussed, uh, over the first half of this year really examining the
department and looking at our capacity and how we, um, cover shifts and...and respond
and deploy and...and it's something, I think, um, based on expectations for heightened
police services, that in future years you likely will see requests for, or proposals for
additional officers. I just need a little bit of time to better understand what we have
capacity to do and cover now, what...what changes are possible, what are not, and that's
going to take a little data gathering, um, and time, but it's something I expect to
(mumbled)
Hayek/ And I think...I think the data are important to gather and analyze, but I also think that the
public is clamoring more at any time than I can remember for, uh, for more police
presence out on the streets with...with sophisticated crack operations and...and cabbies
being pistol-whipped and guys holding up cars in the north end with handguns and whole
lots of other...lots of other things, I mean, there is real interest in the community to, uh,
to crack down on that and nip it in the bud, um, and those may not...that sentiment may
not have the patience for the data. I mean, that's my concern.
Bailey/ Well, and I don't want to go, well, I will, because I've mentioned this to Michael, and I'll
mention it to you. I'm also interested in exploring some cost sharing or something about
the crossing guard situation, I mean, it just seems a little, I mean, we've got this situation
and we're funding crossing guards, important, don't get me wrong, but um, it seems like
we could have some 28E agreements with some...intergovernmental sharing so we can
get to the place where we can address some of these other issues.
Hargadine/ You would be my secretary's hero! (laughter)
Bailey/ That's something to aspire to! (laughter) That's for sure!
Lombardo/ You have that extra discretion now. It's the road...
Bailey/ Well, I mean, you indicated that you haven't had an opportunity to talk to the School
District, although this budget doesn't go into effect until July 1st, I think it's warranted.
Of course I don't want to overlook our positive relationships with our...our other
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government in the county, but I think this merits a discussion. I mean, we go from that to
this, and I would rather see us having more presence on the street, not in crossing guards.
Correia/ Do you know if Coralville and North Liberty police pay for crossing guards?
Hargadine/ They do not.
Correia/ But they have.. .
Hargadine/ They don't have 'em to the extent that we do.
Lombardo/ The challenge too is not just the direct funding, but then the expectations that when,
um, when a crossing guard is...calls in and is not able to respond and be there, there's an
expectation that we'll fill that with a police officer, and I...I have a lot of problems with
that. On a lot of levels.
Champion/ How many do we have?
Wilburn/ I'm just visualizing, uh, all parents (mumbled)
Champion/ I don't know how the City ever started paying for it. (several talking)
Bailey/ It's not so much that I object to crossing guards. I just object to, uh, providing the check
for them.
Wright/ No, I agree with that. I certainly don't object to crossing guards...
Correia/ Our children's safety (mumbled)
Hayek/ Is there a memo that I've missed, or is this just...
Bailey/ It's just on page 45.
Hargadine/ But Michael and I have been asked to help, uh...they have amulti-million dollar
safety and security grant that they're...need help (mumbled)
Bailey/ They also have a local option sales tax.
Hargadine/ Yes they do. (several talking)
Bailey/ Probably not, but I think that they have ability to.. .
Hayek/ Do these crossing guard numbers reflect our internal estimate of the expense to the City
to cover these requests? Do I have that right?
Hargadine/ Covered with part-time employees. (several talking)
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Lombardo/ We hire out annually.
Hayek/ Okay. Sorry for being dense.
O'Donnell/ ...not participate at all in this?
Bailey/ I don't see any fund transfers.
O'Donnell/ Well, they certainly should. (several talking)
Wright/ ...definite point of discussion.
O'Donnell/ Yes.
Bailey/ Oh, I thought we were discussing it. (several talking) Oh, yeah (laughter)
Wright/ We can discuss...
Champion/ The other thing...
Lombardo/ ...taking the lid off of the box (several talking and laughing)
Champion/ Why don't we use those, um...
Lombardo/ Can somebody grab his notes in the back there (several talking)
Page 31
Champion/ All-stop walk signs, kids...like they do for the Longfellow School. They (mumbled)
crossing guard. The City put in, and um, those all-stop stop signs, and there was...never
been a complaint about it. (several talking)
Lombardo/ ...opportunity to really go down that (several talking)
Champion/ Muscatine and Court. That's a busy intersection.
Bailey/And now it's a better switch too.
Champion/ And it comes from different angles too, so I think ifd be a really dangerous
intersection, but they all stop. Everybody gets a red light. (several talking)
Correia/ Certainly every place that people, kids cross there's not a light or a stop sign. I mean,
like at Grant Wood, they're crossing Sycamore at like...they've got a, I mean, there's no
stop signs, or stop light.
Bailey/ I don't think any of us are suggesting that those children cross the street without crossing
guards.
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Wright/ I don't want to take away the crossing guards, but I certainly would like to have a
conversation with the school system about chipping in (several talking) a lot.
Hayek/ We're not going to solve that issue tonight.
Bailey/ No, but Michael's going to, um, talk to Lane it sounds like.
Lombardo/ You could solve it in some ways, and create problems in another by taking it out. I
would recommend that you leave it in for this year and let me have that discussion with
the School District.
Wright/ Oh, yeah, I.
Bailey/ Well, I mean, even if, but here's the thing. Even if we took it out, there's plenty of lead
time for the next school year. I mean, this is January...
Correia/ Let's see, we cut the Airport $10,000; let's cut it $10,000 and ask them to make it up.
O'Donnell/ You've got to get over the Airport! (laughter)
Correia/ I'm just saying (laughter)
Bailey/ Let it go! Let it go! Let the plane go, let it go!
Correia/ ...children's safety walking to school, I don't know.
Bailey/ Okay. Thank you, Chief. All right. Let's talk Fire Station 4 (laughter) um, and Andy is
a pilot if you want to get any digs in.
Correia/ He's taking lessons, I heard! From John. (several talking)
Fire Station #4:
Lombardo/ (several talking) discuss timing, uh, of Fire Station 4. We had...did you have
specific questions or did you want to talk about general...you guys are welcome to come
up in case there's questions to answer, but um, we...we talked a lot about general timing
of this, and um, optimally and... and I don't want to put words into Andy's mouth, but in
our conversations, you know, he would like 24 months of lead time to train staff
appropriately. We don't have that kind of time, unless you want to delay construction of
Fire Station 4. As we have this budget, and what we anticipated going in is that, uh,
we...if this is approved, we would begin letting contracts this spring, and Kumi can speak
to, uh, the construction phase. It's at a minimum a 14 month build and you know, if...if
we start that this spring, then July 1 Chief would have the ability to, um, to bring his staff
on and train them and give them about a 12-month window to...to do that. It's not ideal.
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It puts a lot of pressure on the department to train more staff, but you know, we think
it's...it's doable based on that time and space.
Correia/ This spring? Of 09?
Lombardo/ We would start letting contracts and starting construction.
Correia/ And then on July 1...
Lombardo/ It would be more like the latter half of...Kumi, why don't you walk through, you
have the handout (mumbled) walk through that and that might be a little bit easier to
follow than me. I have to admit myself today I talked myself into a circle and thought for
some reason that the cycle was...was going to push the build off to...to the end of 2011,
and I was just...was not in a good place and they talked me off the ledge quickly and I
got back on the right fiscal year and all is well.
Wright/ Certainly none of us have ever been in that position! (several commenting)
Morris/ What I'm showing you is what I received today from the architects that we're working
with on Fire Station 4, um, you see the red line that runs down the, um, about I guess
about almost half of the document, that's January, um, where we are today. If we, um,
what we're looking at is, in the ideal conditions in an ideal world for the fire station
would be to get it out on the market by the, um, by late spring. Um, due to a number of
factors. Um, right now what we're finding is that the bid climate is, um, is hungry for
projects. We've seen that in a number of projects I have out presently, especially small
projects. Um, this is not a small project, but in terms of things that we see that are
coming up on the horizon, um, in my, um, master bid list that comes through, that
documents which projects are...that we're seeing on the horizon, and we see a lot of
University projects coming up in the fall, um, that will also be, um, looking for the same
market that will be able to bid this project. So, what we're looking at here is if we are
able to go through the resolution process and award by, um, May 19th, um, we're looking
at about a 14-month bid period, or building period, where.. .
Champion/ May 19th? Wow!
Morris/ In terms of construction, the best time for owners to get the best amount of benefit for
costs, and um, contractors to, uh, in terms of bidding optimally, is to bid it as early as you
can in spring, and to get the whole summer season to get everything in the ground in
terms of structural things. So we're talking about foundations and footings and so forth,
and ideally if you can have...in Iowa to have your building, especially a masonry
building, if you can have that building, um, enclosed by December 1st, you're looking at
internal work for the remainder of that winter season. And so, that's ideal. If you can get
that out on the market by early spring, you have the most ideal condition in terms of, um,
in terms of bidding climate. So, the further you push that out, the more contingencies
that the contractor makes, in terms of tacking on prices of not knowing what kind of
winter conditions if he's going to be able to get that building closed in and be able to
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have, um, finishing work done during the winter months. If we look at putting this out
until fall, um, what we're looking at is getting masonry on in March, because that would
be what winter would hold for us, and that's what we saw with Fire Station 2. Um, that
sets up the City to see, um, an increase, a possible increase...in costs, in moving that out.
Lombardo/ That would delay opening then, it would be late in the year, uh, of that year, early
next I think would be the timeframe that...
Hayek/ So under this approach, or this assumed timeline, how much time do you have to train?
Is that...
Rocca/ I think we're still looking at that 14 months (both talking) window. I mean, we can do
that.
Lombardo/ Well, he was bringing them on in July and...and this would likely be open on or
around July or August, and we can, you know, if he needs another month or something,
you know, we can work within that. It'd give him at least 12 months, uh, is what we're
thinking.
Bailey/ Our goal is never...or, has always been to have a building that's staffed from the
beginning, not to build something that we can't staff or isn't staffed or...but it sounds like
this would work.
Rocca/ I think, as you know, as soon as we've got the time schedule, we agree to it, and funding
in place, it's just a matter of us, uh, hiring up when we have the green light. Everything
in order to do so.
Champion/ How are we going to pay for this fire station?
Bailey/ Capital expense. (several talking)
Hayek/ We'll have that conversation, Connie. We had a little bit of it on Saturday.
Bailey/ Which are you asking about? This is operating.
Champion/ I'm talking about the concrete, the brick and mortar.
Bailey/ And the estimate is?
Lombardo/ We...we haven't fully landed on that. There was...for the capital costs, the capital
construction, um, we have a few options, um, one would be to, uh, to um, internal loan
from Landfill, and then structure the payback. The other would be pay it out of...of our,
um, fund balance, or what likely...Kevin and I have been kicking this around a little bit,
we...we need to look at debt service and project that out and understand it a little bit
better, to know what the right balance is, but I...I'm likely to come back with a
recommendation for a...a split of some form, some fund balance...
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Champion/ For some reason I thought we'd put it on the ballot.
Bailey/We talked briefly about...
Champion/ Cause I think it would pass overwhelmingly.
O'Donnell/ Under what guise...how would you put it on?
Bailey/ And there is a memo from Eleanor, by the way, regarding language.
Page 35
Karr/ And I'd like to note the same thing. I know Eleanor just did that memo. Again, the date on
it is May 20, 08...I know that must be an automatic, but it was just done today.
Champion/ I kind of looked quickly at the (several talking) at the memo...um, it seems to me
that you would just put it on the ballot.
Correia/ Well, one of the things...can I just say, if we're looking at this timeline, if we waited to
put it on the ballot.. .
Champion/ You couldn't do it!
Correia/ Right. If we waited to put it on the ballot, it would delay it a whole construction season.
Champion/ You could have a special election.
Bailey/ Which costs (several talking)
Correia/ $100,000 for a special election?
Bailey/ $130,000?
Karr/ Yeah, it's over $100,000 depending on the time of year and the windows.
Correia/ Might as well just spend that on the building. (laughter)
Bailey/ Or operations.
Lombardo/ It would clearly delay the project. We would not, I mean, we would not let contracts
and start the bid process until (several talking) yeah, and then hiring would be delayed.
So you're looking at, into 2011, before we would...
Wright/ That's based on winning. (several talking) Positive outcome.
Bailey/ Part of the issue that we talked about on Saturday, not to sort of...I'll briefly recap is, if it
would be defeated, this Council has been committed to building this Fire Station so we
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ignore the results of a referendum, and come back and say, well, that was an interesting
exercise. And so that's the challenge. We talked about, um, we talked about structuring
the question for how we pay for it.
Champion/ Yeah, I saw that.
Wright/ But we can't...we can't obviously do it the way we were talking about on Saturday,
according to the memo from Eleanor.
Correia/ Want us to pay for it this way or that way.
Bailey/ Right. Exactly. (several talking)
Lombardo/ And, I'll be candid, um, I put a fair number of ballot issues up for consideration, and
this is a pretty narrow window we have to educate the public and do a good job putting
information out there. Usually I like at least 12 to 18 months lead time to be able to
really develop the material and to be able to...to disseminate it, get out there to groups,
explain the cost structure and...and uh, you know, the points around it. Um, and...and
you know, we walk a fine line between, uh, putting educational materials and
campaigning for it, and that takes some doing to get the materials right and...and the
presentations right, um, so that we're not crossing any lines administratively or...or we
can't participate.
Hayek/ Does, um...does the timing of it, uh, this year versus next year, in terms of construction,
um, play out differently on our budget...would it be advantageous to push this out an
additional 12 months before we started construction, uh, allows more, uh, training time,
um...
Lombardo/ I don't think the costs are ever going to be lower than doing it now, um...
Rocca/ Inflation factor kicks in and the unknowns of construction materials and contractor
availability, I think all those are the unknowns (both talking)
Lombardo/ ...in terms of training component what's bare minimum and he says, well, you know,
six months we could probably do it...if you had to, I mean.
Rocca/ If we had to. It'd be real snug. It'd be a challenge, but we would figure it out.
Lombardo/ That's not...I wouldn't advocate for that. I think 12 months gives us a good amount
of time to train people, and then he can look at who's going to staff what departments.
Bailey/ And we're also including this, I mean, in this whole list everybody's asked to develop
these economic stimulus lists, and this is on this, the list. Because we can be...it will be
shovel ready, as per required.
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Hayek/ Okay, but let's say we don't get a stimulus package for a while or it comes in various
components, and we've already started the (both talking) and it's already, we've already
started our construction, and something comes down from on high in Washington, does
starting it too soon impact, and you're probably guessing as to that, but I would hate to
have some available federal funds that we (both talking)
Lombardo/ ...guess that's there's probably not, uh, not...you can't supplant local funds. If it's
already been appropriated, you probably can't use federal funds to supplant. That's fairly
typical, um, you know, we...the challenge, I mean, there's a real timing issue here
because anything out of stimulus package, they want to be ready to go, we need to
develop the bid documents. We need to develop the bid documents based on the
assumption that we're going to do this project within six months or less would be optimal,
but you could push out a little bit further. Otherwise, you have to go back and...and you
know, redo...make sure that your design work and everything else is...is accurate and, it
just...waiting on federal funds...it's problematic. I don't...I don't know.
Bailey/ Andy, you've been successful...
Wilburn/ The other piece to that is, in terms of unanticipated costs...when, you know, if and
when the stimulus includes bricks and mortars projects, uh, everybody's going to be
going after supplies, uh, if there's a shortage of supplies, the costs are going...are going
to go up. Had that a few years ago with, because overseas there was a shortage of
concrete. (mumbled)
Hayek/ Yeah.
Bailey/ And I was going to ask the Chief -you've been successful in grant applications. Are
there capital grants out there for fire stations?
Rocca/ Not for fire stations. The (mumbled) grant that we did with Joint Communication Center
and others is not for new fire station facilities.
Bailey/ They're more equipment grants...okay.
Rocca/ ...rolling stock (mumbled) things like that.
Bailey/ Well, it's something.
Wright/ It seems to me in a number of respects, this is actually a fairly good time to go after this.
Champion/ Oh, I think so too!
Wright/ Both in terms of our community's need, um, you know, we've got another subdivision
coming out, that's for approval in that part of town. I was looking at the P&Z agenda this
week. Um, contractors are looking for work, essentially, right now. I think there are
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some advantages to us in that, um, I...I don't really want to playa "what if' game,
waiting for the stimulus package to fall into place.
Champion/ Right. Isn't Ross going to Washington? You know...
Wright/ Yeah, could you come back with a check? (laughter)
Bailey/Yeah, don't come back unless you guys bring money! (laughter) I was talking about the
inauguration. (several talking)
Hayek/ If...if, from a capital perspective starting this year versus starting next year doesn't, you
know, if delaying until next year doesn't really provide any advantage, and in fact has
some disadvantages to it, then the real question is paying for the staff, and that's where
we need to focus our energy, as it relates to this project.
Lombardo/ That's the question.
Wright/ Got it in front of us.
Champion/ Well, we have to also pay for the building.
Bailey/ (several talking) You two will get together...
Lombardo/ The building doesn't concern me, I mean, we have a mechanism to do that. It's just
looking at what...what the optimal structure would be, but uh, that's...the construction,
the capital piece of it's the easy part.
Bailey/ The capital piece has always been the easy part. For this project.
Correia/ I like the timeline.
Champion/ This project has got to get done.
Wright/ Agreed!
Champion/ And Pm willing to cut some of my favorite things to get it done.
Correia/ Like what?
Champion/ Oh, when we start talking budget cuts I'll tell ya!
Correia/ Oh, okay.
Wright/ When we start to talk about what?
Bailey/ We can talk.
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Champion/ Talking budget cuts.
Bailey/ So, when you presented this, I mean, how were we thinking of operational and paying for
this? What were your thoughts?
Lombardo/ What do we propose?
Bailey/ Well, you didn't propose, I mean.
Lombardo/ No, what we propose is a mechanism to fund it that we can see is the...is the
emergency levy.
Bailey/ Right. So raising taxes simply does...that's it?
Lombardo/ The challenge with, well, the challenge with, um, decreasing expenditures in other
areas is that we're already going to be in a reduction mode immediately following. We
had talked Saturday, Connie, about a...a prioritization model and it needs to happen. The
projections for the next five years, at a minimum, are fairly significant deficits, and my
recommendation is going to be that we start this year reducing services to make sure we
don't find ourselves in a situation (both talking) so you're talking an additional, um, you
have the updated numbers in front of you. I don't have it, but uh, $600,000, $700,000 a
year (several commenting) um, but, you know, SOO...the Delta, um, in the first year...it's
about five hundred odd thousand each year. So we would have to find an
additional...cuts in existing services, and I, you know, I'm not advo...that's certainly a
way to approach it, um, and if we're ready to do that, then I'll lead us through a process to
get us there.
Bailey/ Can we, I mean, it...I don't know what's helpful for other people to look at. What's
helpful for me is to see the...an updated levy sheet that's on page 14 that would
incorporate that into it. That would be helpful.
Lombardo/ ...to work that out.
Bailey/ ...would help others see it, but that would help me get a sense of what that tax increase.
We talked a little bit about it on Saturday.
Champion/ Well, my concern is already the height of our property tax, and so I'm not against
using this emergency levy, but then I want to back off somewhere else. I mean, I think
we're getting to the point where our property taxes are going to start to damage who
wants to live here anymore.
Wright/ One thing we could do is, if we went with the 22-cent levy for the first year, and we
were able to make some strategic cuts over the course of the next year. We can back off
the amount of that levy...in subsequent years.
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Lombardo/ You know, another option...and, to work towards, would be a local option tax for
public safety, uh, to supplant (several talking)
Bailey/ There's a referendum for ya!
Champion/ Yeah!
Wright/ I think we can start with a 22-cent levy for a year and see where we are at this time next
year.
Champion/ Well, I certainly want it staffed and I want it open, so I'm willing to hear all ways of
doing it.
Lombardo/ It's 22-cents and then it rolls back to 15-cents, um, for the year two and beyond. It's
just that initial...until the University payment kicks in (mumbled)
O'Malley/ ...interject that there was (mumbled) 30-cents, and depending on how you do the
mortgage, it may not roll back.
Wilburn/ Kevin (several talking) where was the emergency levy years ago before we dropped it?
It was about four, five years ago.
O'Malley/ Let's see (both talking) we had the fu1127-cent levy about four years ago.
Bailey/ Yeah, when I came on Council, I think we were at the limit.
Wilburn/ The max...27 is the max (several talking)
Wright/ For what project is that?
Bailey/ For the emergency levy, and we were (several talking)
Wilburn/ We were at...it was, we were at that, and um...
O'Malley/ And then we had good valuation increases and so we dropped it down.
Champion/ Uh-huh.
O'Malley/Back about four years ago.
Hayek/ Well, I'm...I'm, uh, open to some use of the emergency levy for this, because I don't
think there's any other way to get it done, but...but I think in this...in this year of all
years we've got to show some cuts to get there. We've got to show a reduction in costs
elsewhere to fund this, um, that's my thoughts.
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O'Donnell/ It's the same place we are every year! Every year, it's been that way for the last six or
seven years. It's what do you cut, what do you give up, um...what can you do without.
Correia/ Right, so what if we...what if we, going back to sort of an earlier, considered dropping
the increases to non-bargaining employees of salaried to like 2.5% in the fiscal year 10,
thinking that that's our goal, as we're going into budget negotiations that you know we
could sustain...
Lombardo/ I could provide you numbers (both talking) we'll...probably for the next budget work
session what a, you know, 1 % and a half percent increments would mean in terms of raw
dollars. I don't have that information.
Bailey/ That's not where I'd start. I wouldn't start with our people.
O'Donnell/ No.
Bailey/ I...it's just not where I'd start.
Correia/ If we're talking about.. .
Bailey/ We don't start with our people when we talked about the bargaining units. Why would
we start with our people when we talk about (both talking)
Correia/ ...wanting to be in a position when we're opening bargain...or bargaining, our
bargaining units...
Lombardo/ What we do to non-bargaining will have almost zero impact on bargaining units.
Correia/ But in order...but in terms of being able to say we can't pay, I mean.. .
Lombardo/ They are in the driver's seat, not the non-bargaining (several talking) and so um, I
don't...I just don't see that, that argument typically doesn't hold up because they realize
that they're protected class, and they have ability to bargain beyond what we set for non-
bargaining as a... as a matter of course.
Champion/ They have the ability to bargain for what you can't afford either.
Wilburn/ I certainly wouldn't object to seeing some figures about what those increases would
mean.
Hayek% I just don't...I don't think we can fund the whole personnel side of this with a tax
increase. (several talking) I don't think we should, um, L ..realistically we can't do it
with...with none of that.
Lombardo/ If...if you're contemplating reducing services in the 2010 budget, then the sooner you
let us know that, I mean, we have a lot of...
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Bailey/ So yeah, what are you, where are you looking. That's, I mean, we're going to have to
run, I mean, they're going to have to run some numbers and...
Lombardo/ I've squeezed $3.5 million out of this budget already, um, finding a couple hundred
thousand is not going to be small task, and we need ample time to really...and the
challenge I have is I don't have any prioritization mechanism to know where to go.
There's no low-hanging fruit.
Champion/ I'm really sorry I wasn't here on Saturday. Did you, you talked in your original
memo about a hiring freeze. Did you guys discuss that?
Lombardo/ We're not...and, as a matter of course, I'm going to put out a memo indicating to
departments that as positions become open, I want to scrutinize every position and...and
make a determination internally of whether or not, um, they need to be funded. Chief has
a couple, um, firefighter positions that...that retirements. He already asked me about
them, and I...it seems counterproductive to what we're accomplishing with the proposal
of a new fire station. The whole firefighter positions open, and I don't think public safety
is an area (mumbled) but there maybe other openings throughout the organization that I
feel differently about. So, there likely will be some savings. There will be retirements.
There will be people who leave for other jobs. Um, it's hard to predict how much
and...and in this economy, people may hunker down and not move. You know, it's hard
to say.
Wilburn/ I would suggest, I'm sorry...were you...
Champion/ No, no, go on.
Wilburn/ I would suggest, um, I'm looking for a parallel example. I hear the concern that you're
saying about, uh, you know, uh, raising taxes, uh, if we jump back a few years just before
the Library, and some of the cuts that we had then, um, and then with that, uh, before the
referendum even happened, we were presented with a plan that was going to take us
above our self-imposed debt service levy for, uh, a few years, but we were going to
manage our way through that time and we were going to bring that back down, and we
have evidence that that's what we did - we brought ourselves back down. I would
suggest, we've got...we're in a similar situation. The proposal is, yes we're going to do
this levy, uh, we're going to do it for a year. In the meantime, there's a plan to go ahead
and go through that prioritization process, uh, we'll get the go with that right away. Let's
give the City Manager and the staff a chance to manage our way, which you know, it's
not aself-imposed tax limit, but the concept is similar that um, we would either be
reducing, you know, here's...here is the prioritization as it occurred over the course of
this year. Now we can reduce the emergency levy by blank, or uh, blank in...in other
areas. So I would suggest that, um, that's the approach -we'll manage our way through
this, through that prioritization process. It's gonna, um...(both talking)...to get that done.
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Lombardo/ There's specific, um, time horizon and benchmarks do you want to see us hit, uh, we
certainly can, you know, approach it with that in mind.
Hayek/ (several talking) Hold on, here's the thing. I...I agree the prioritization process makes
sense and it's something we have to go through, but...but anything we can do now gets us
a jumpstart on that, and...and if, if we can even come up with $100,000 or $200,000 or
something, uh, presently, uh, that's just that much less we have to cut a year from now,
and it seems to me, and this is only my second budget, but budgets are in a sense a time
for prioritization. It's, you know, the outcome is how we've prioritized the City's needs,
at least through our own perspectives, um, and that...that's why I think making at least
some progress toward that this year would be such a good idea.
Wilburn/ I'm suggesting that plan, uh, manage our way is a way to go about doing that, because
Mike is right. It always comes back non-agreement as to what...I'm not saying that that
can't happen at all, but I'm just saying, um, that uh...in fact, I'm thinking back. Again,
we had a Council Member that was dead-set against going above the 25% self (mumbled)
philosophy (mumbled) and...we ended up doing exactly what we said we would do. So
I'm just suggesting that, uh...
Lombardo/ And the point I was trying to make, Matt, was that...that with the reductions that
we've already realized, and...and built into this budget, anything additional that...that, I
mean, outside of a few thousand or something here and there, would have you know
impact on services that...that taking $100,000 from somewhere or $200,000, we're
starting to talk about bodies, um, and that's where it's going to get a little challenging and
you know, we need to do a lot of work in a very short period of time, if the expectations
are that we're going to accomplish that with this budget, because that...that prioritization
does not exist. (several talking)
Wilburn/ The $3 million that you already reduced, uh, I recall you having meetings with your
departments and staff, that occurred over what period of time?
Lombardo/ Uh, August till now. I'm, you know, essentially. They prepare their budgets in
August, so...November, early November.
O'Malley/ November, and early December.
Lombardo/ Six to eight weeks.
Hayek/ I understand the time...time crunch, I mean, this was not your recommendation anyway,
and we're, you know, seems like we're going to instruct staff to proceed with the Fire
Station this year, which (mumbled) um, but to fund all of the personnel costs with...with
the emergency levy, every last penny, um, and on top of that the employee benefits levy,
which we have no control over but which...which kicks in as well, without at least
starting the process of...of making room for that. Um, in this year of all years, seems like
a pretty (several talking)
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Bailey/ ...suggesting starting? That would be.. .
Wright/ ...draw down reserves, temporarily.
Champion/ No! They're already down. (several talking) and that's another concern of mine, is
we draw down those reserves, and they get down pretty low in this three-year budget, um,
then you...you lose more money and so you're just...making it worse every year.
Hayek/ I mean, there's going to be a lot of pain over the next few years. I don't think there's
much doubt about that. Why not start some of it now, and... and have less to deal with in
a year or two?
Bailey/ But where are you suggesting starting? I mean, that's the question. I mean...
Hayek/ I know, that's the age-old question (both talking)
Bailey/ But I mean, you are interested in pursuing this. Where, I mean, the two of you, where
are you suggesting, I mean...
Champion/ Well, I was thinking I could even give up $50,000 in public art for a fireman, but we
probably fund that with bonding anyway so that's not going to help, but it would help
reduce taxes.
O'Donnell/ How much do we put in our economic development fund?
Champion/ That comes out of (several talking)
Bailey/ ...disspite your face! If you don't invest in economic development, in three to five years
we're going to, I mean...that's investment! (several talking)
Hayek/ I mean, I'm on the Committee with you, but one of the ration...one of the many reasons
behind the fourth fire station was to spur economic development on the north end. If you
want to make the connection you can do so.
O'Donnell/ There is a connection.
Wright/ Well, let me just throw out one question, something...I just know this is kind of a big
line. We, uh, in this budget have a capital outlay of $221,000, I'm looking at page 112,
$221,000 to PC replacements. That's a heck of a lot for...
Bailey/ That's capital, right? So, it's not operations. It's in our CIP?
Lombardo/ No, that's not in the CIP. That's, uh, cash...(several talking)
Wright/ Page 112 - it's a capital outlay.
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Lombardo/ Um, you know the challenges were already on, I think it's afive-year replacement
program for our PC's and...and technology. And so...and we have enough that if you get
behind the eight-ball and you start stretching that out, you're going to have to pay the
piper.
Wright/ That was going to be my question -are we on a five-year total replacement cycle or.. .
Lombardo/ On PC's and then hardware, I think depending on servers often don't last even as long
as that because they're doing high-duty work.
Wright/ I wouldn't even question the server replacements.
Lombardo/ Uh, PC's and...and laptops is five years currently we've scheduled them.
O'Malley/ Right, and this schedule is not only for the General Fund, but all the enterprise funds
also.
Champion/ Uh-huh.
Bailey/ Well, and I think to get to what we're talking about, we're going to probably have to cut
service levels, so are there any that...that's what Michael was saying. We cut service
levels. And I'm not saying we shouldn't throw things on the table...
Champion/ We could close the police station and fire station for five hours a day (laughter)
Wright/ There's a swift idea! (laughter)
Champion/ You can't have anything going on during those five hours!
Rocca/ Get that crystal ball out and figure that out.
Lombardo/ ...I provided you five pages of headlines from, and many, many, many jurisdictions,
and I don't know if it's included in those or not, but have been looking at four-day work
weeks and that's not something I absolutely will not propose. I mean, we're in service to
the public, and...and I think many of them would argue we're not open enough hours.
Um, it's something we can look at. I do not advocate for that.
Champion/ But when the School District was asking for afour-day school week.
Bailey/ Yeah, well, and I thought was particularly interesting was this article about priorities
about, you know, how not to cut and I, you know, I get concerned. It's not that I'm...I
know that we're going to have to make some tough choices, but I tend to agree with Ross
is that a process for making priorities and making cuts makes a lot more sense to me,
unless somebody has an answer that they want to, you know, put out tonight that, I mean,
there are cuts that I've been interested in since I got on Council that I'm still interested in
looking at, but I would rather instead of tossing these out again.. .
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Champion/ We know what they are.
Bailey/ Yes, thank you...go through this process and see if others agree or if...if there are other
ways to look at it. I think that that's a more...rather than, you know, you giving up your
favorite, I give up my favorite, we get, you know, the $200,000.
Champion/ I think you're right, I think you're right!
Wright/ I'm afraid if we do off the cuff cuts, essentially, that's a way of (both talking)
Wilburn/ ...way to make an informed choice, and we're giving the direction now, so in my mind
we are addressing it...now.
Lombardo/ And...and...
Bailey/ But I would like to see us make a commitment to the timeline...hold to the timeline that
Kevin and Michael have suggested about by May really looking at this, and that will
mean a commitment to some meetings and some hard discussions, and potentially
looking at some things that all of us, or each one of us will find difficult, but I would...I
don't want to come around to September or October or November and be talking about
this again, and we haven't done this priority discussion, and we're in the same boat. And
then we can't manage our way, and we're still at an emergency levy of whatever.
Lombardo/ The $3.5 million, I...I would also suggest comes at great pain, and...and perhaps it's
not as evident, you know, because you...you weren't at...for hours trying to find the
mechanism, and so I...I just want, you know, this organization is suffering considerable
challenges as a result of the budget that's proposed, and...and that's not as evident.
Hayek/ I don't know if I've seen this number. Have you, and assuming the budget as proposed is
enacted, so no new fire station, none of those...um, what...how, is there a dollar amount
in terms of service cuts or...or, uh, essentially General Fund shortfall that we're looking
at in 2011?
Lombardo/ 2011 based on your projections shows only a $200,000. I would argue that's
artificially low, because we can't maintain this budget, um, as projected for two years,
and so...if you look at year three and out, I think that's a more accurate reflection of
about a million...quarter million and a half deficit for each of those outlying years, um,
for...years two through five. And I would...I would suggest that that's probably, uh, on
or about the magnitude that we should be looking for in cuts.
Hayek/ So if you assume that the present budget as enacted would see us 12 months from now
looking for a million and a half in cuts (both talking) rough numbers. Then...then not
doing any cutting now means we're adding another almost $600,000 to that number. So
now we're doing $2 million plus next year.
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Wright/ Well, that's assuming we try to, that we back off the emergency levy 100%. Correct?
(several responding) That's probably not realistic.
Hayek/ No, and L ..I'm not saying it is, but...but, I'm just trying to make the case for some
symbolic movement toward that.
Champion/ Well...
Wright/ We're going to have a lot of symbolic movement over the next four months.
Champion/ We're going to need more than symbolic (several talking)
Lombardo/ Kevin, do you know at what point.. .
Champion/ ...that, um, with that levy. That's going to drove sky high...sky high. That's going to
add another $200 or $300 a year to people's property taxes.
Lombardo/ If the budget is passed, um, with the tax increase in it, for the full amount, at...are we
obligated to levy that increase, or if we make cuts throughout the summer, can we...once
it's set it's set.
O'Malley/ Once it's set, it's set. I mean, you can go...once it goes to the County Auditor, and
goes through the State process, they start collecting July 1st. You can't lower it.
Wright/ Would you remind me, repeating, Michael, the figure for $100,000 to this 22-cent levy?
Lombardo/ I think, um, on a...if my memory serves, um, we're talking 30-cents on, so it'd be $30
per $100,000.
O'Malley/ Right. For a...for a commercial property. For residential property, it'd be
about... $14.00 per $100,000.
Wright/ I think that's a pretty wise investment, to get this off the dead center.
Champion/ Oh, I want us off dead center, I'm willing to do whatever it needs to get it done.
Wright $30 per $200,000 house...
Champion/A lot of people don't live in a $200,OOO...are there $200,000 houses in Iowa City?
(laughter) I'm just joking! I meant, can you find one for $200,000.
Wright/ I live in a $200,000 fixer-upper, so...(several talking)
O'Donnell/ You know, I'm sure we'd all like this to be as...as painless as you possibly can, but
I...I don't know...we're just spinning wheels here now. Why doesn't everybody just
come up with three or four ideas for the next meeting and what we could.. .
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Bailey/ The problem is the next meeting is...is in a couple of weeks, and if we really want to see
numbers, I think we have to provide direction to staff so when we come to the next
meeting we have...
Champion/ I thought we had a meeting on Thursday.
O'Donnell/ We have a meeting Thursday.
Bailey/ It's capital...it's CIP. I mean...I mean, we can still (mumbled) but I think CIP
presentations will, and we haven't talked about CIP yet, so...
Wright/ And we've already taken $3...$3.5 million out of the budget.
Bailey/ Michael...
Wright/Before we...
Bailey/ ...staff has, yeah.
Wright/ ..essentially from our operating expenses.
Champion/ Out of a proposed budget.
Wright/ The budget that we're...$3.5 million.
Champion/ I know that.
Wright/ (several talking) I don't think we're likely to come up with enough in good options over
the next few weeks to make this up.
Hayek/ Well, I mean, out of a...out of a multi-tens of millions of dollar budget, have to think we
can find a couple hundred thousand.
Bailey/I gave you 63,000 with crossing guards, but you didn't like it (laughter)
Lombardo/ I guess...
Hayek/ I just feel like we're going to sit here 12 months from now thinking wow, it's even harder
now because we didn't do it then.
Wright/ No, if we give staff a direction...to prioritize and come up with some cuts over the next
few months, I think they're going to...
Bailey/ Bring us some recommendations or some suggestions and...
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Champion/ I think also the hiring freeze that Michael has talked about. We'll be looking at this
issue if we really need to...do we need to replace them (several talking)
Bailey/ Well, and one of the things Michael mentioned, and I don't know how rapidly this could
occur, but is the whole concept of animal services being privatized, and I'm not...I don't
know if this would necessarily be a bad thing for those who are interested in that
particular service in our community and in our county. So that presents an opportunity - I
don't know how rapidly that could take place, but there are things out there that will take
some time.
Lombardo/ As I stated before, Matt, you know, um, certainly on a $50 million budget...$47
million, $48 million...
O'Malley/ $48 million.
Lombardo/ ...budget, um, you know, there's any number of things you can cut. LTh, what I
would need direction on is some idea of priorities and where to start looking.
Champion/ That'd be nice if we had (mumbled)
Lombardo/ Because I...I, yeah...(laughter)
Bailey/ Wouldn't have been done by now anyway! (laughter)
Lombardo/ Yes, you are correct, Councilor! (laughter)
Champion/ It helps eliminate some of those questions. Um, well, anyway, we're just wasting the
Fire Chiefs time here. (several talking)
Bailey/ Yes, thanks.
Champion/ We're certainly going to let him build his fire station. We're going to staff it
somehow.
Bailey/ After you leave we'll talk a little bit more about the referendum...no!
Rocca/ No, you said don't leave until Council adjourns (laughter)
Bailey/ So, do we have any more questions for the Chief, or comments or...do we understand
this timeline? (several responding) Regarding the referendum, are we clear that we are
not taking this issue of the fire station to referendum? (several responding) Okay. Any
other lingering concerns out there, Chief?
Rocca/ No. Thank you.
Wright/ We'll get there yet!
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Rocca/ I'm sure we will!
Champion/ Now don't brag to the Police Chief (laughter)
Rocca/ Wouldn't think of it! Thank you!
Bailey/ Thank you. Thanks, Kumi.
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Lombardo/ (several talking) occasionally that John Grier did finish top of his class, uh, at the
Law...maybe you have heard that and, uh (mumbled)
Rocca/ And Class President.
Lombardo/ And Class President (laughter)
Rocca/ Thanks again!
Other Issues:
Lombardo/ Kevin, you did pass this out?
O'Malley/ Yes. Uh, I passed out some information tonight. As we were discussing on Saturday,
I think it was in your old packet, page 4, the annual building permit valuations over the
last ten or eleven years, um, that I thought there was an anomaly in 2008 that our, uh, our
building permits went up so much over 2007. Uh, looking at the economy, so if you go
back to page 4, in that handout, remember that handout that we (mumbled) Seems like it
had the agenda and...(several talking) That's it right there, Ross. Page 4 in that (several
talking) It's the one with the tables, not with the PowerPoints. (several talking) Right.
As I put some of this stuff together in preparation for Saturday, I had thrown this table
together with the data, and I didn't have much chance to analyze and when I was making
a graph, it stuck out that it didn't seem right that 2008 with the economic activity that I
saw on the ground more or less match, so then, uh, about Friday afternoon, just before we
put this together, it dawned on me that we had a lot of activity, flood activity and we
issued a bunch of permits for it. And so I thought I better go back and clean up those
numbers, cause really that's not new valuation, even though our building permits show it
that way. So I got the information out of housing inspection services, and the new page
4, so to speak, the little title that says building permits without flood permits is a true
representation of our building permit valuations, I believe (several commenting) That
shows quite a dramatic drop in new growth in building permits, which further solidifies
the argument that if you're living on property tax valuations you're going to end up with
some low numbers in two years out. So, since we have 68% of our eggs in this basket,
and this basket's getting lighter, I think our financial situation is getting more critical than
what we thought we had on Saturday. Page 2 is a visual representation of that, which
quickly points out that our valuations are dropping, and the third page is just our cycle
showing how long it takes for this stuff to go through the pipeline. So instead of just a
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one or two year problem, I think we have like a three or four year problem, uh, facing us.
So I wanted to bring that to your attention. The other thing I did not get done was the
TIF roll-off. The only thing we can see is one area coming online in about a year, but
Wendy's out with a broken ankle and we're going to try and piece that together...
Bailey/ Shattered!
O'Malley/ Any event, um, sorry to paint any blacker news, a blacker picture, but that's what you
have in front of you.
Champion/ Welcome to the rest of Iowa (several talking)
O'Malley/ Exactly.
Champion/ Only we don't have a sales tax, but this is what communities have been facing. Long
before we did.
O'Donnell/ (mumbled)
Champion/ I know it.
Hayek/ Well, I think that's all the more reason not to put the fire station on a referendum,
because I think we only have so many bites at that apple and if.. .
Bailey/ I promised Andy that we would not talk about this after he left. (several talking)
Hayek/ Oh, I'm not saying (several talking)
Lombardo/ I don't think it would pass...not even for a fire station. I really don't.
Bailey/ Okay, are there any other items, I mean, I'm going to give you one last crack at it. If
there's something you want to put on the table and see some projections. I mean, I could
put Senior...Senior's programming on the table, but I mean, you've heard that all before.
So...
Hayek/ In terms of what...coming up with some cuts to pay for some portion of the personnel
costs?
Champion/ Combining it...
Bailey/ Combining with Parks and Rec and Library. And doing programming through those
entities, but I mean, I think...
Hayek/ I think we've looked at that. That wouldn't actually generate savings.
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Bailey/ That's what they've been...we've been told by the Senior Center Commission, but I
mean, I think that's something that we can talk about in prioritization, as well.
Wright/ Yeah, I think that's certainly legitimate, and we're paying (both talking)
Lombardo/ ...now and February when you have to set the public hearing, I think would be
(several talking)
Bailey/ Right. No, you know, we've heard that all before (several talking)
O'Donnell/ I think we did. We looked at Terry and the (mumbled)
Bailey/ I think it'll be re-examined.
O'Donnell/ ...and we both agreed there was no savings there.
Bailey/ Fresh eyes. I'm confident he'll find it. (several talking) Anything else?
Hayek/ Well, I don't know. I mean, I think I'm in the distinct minority in wanting to look at
some specific cuts to...
Champion/ No, I totally agree with you.
Bailey/But okay, then give us some specific things that we can respond to.
Hayek/ L ..I haven't gone through to cherry pick some stuff. But I'm...I would say everything's
on the table to get there, and if we want to have a conversation now or later, um...
Bailey/ Well, we better have it now, timing wise.
Hayek/ But if there's not enough interest in it, you know, I want to fund this fire station.
Correia/ I just have...I have, so this is, I mean, I love the Library, love it, love it, love it. So, in
the capital outlay it has $480,000 for buying adult materials for 2010. Like if that went
down $150,000 so it was $320,000, like is that not a good amount of money, does that
not give us a...
Bailey/ That's a question I have about all the, our...all of our departments that have foundations.
The Library has a foundation, the Senior Center has a foundation, animal services has a
foundation, um, but can't, I mean, can some of those foundations be doing more, and
what are the restrictions for example, in materials, I mean, I think that's a good example.
I love, love...how many times did you say love? (several talking) I plus what Amy said,
the Library...
Champion/ What I was thinking that we did give an extra staff last year to open on Friday nights
and something else and...
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Bailey/ I don't want to, I really don't want to see hours cut back because one of the things that
was brought up on Saturday is, you know, in difficult economic times people turn to that,
but material wise, and I'm not suggesting that they don't purchase this. I'm suggesting
that they find another way.
Correia/ Well, right, that...right...
Bailey/ Would that be a...
Lombardo/ I think that Susan Craig is probably in a better position to answer the effects of that
kind of cut on...on her operating...
Bailey/ She sat here all day Saturday and we didn't bring it up, and now...
Lombardo/ I mean, if there are folks you want to engage in, I mean, we're happy to ask the
questions, get the information, and have them present to...to engage in the debate.
Champion/ I think that's a legitimate question.
Bailey/ I would like...I think that would be (several talking)
Champion/ I mean, we've been very generous with them, and it's...it's just bad, and they do have
money. They do have money.
Lombardo/ So...
Champion/ And they're able to raise money.
Lombardo/ So, Library, Senior Center?
Hayek/ I exclude nothing. Um, but I've...would certainly include those, so...
Lombardo/ In terms of, and just so I make it clear - I'm not...I'm not suggesting that...that we
shouldn't make additional cuts, um, what I'm suggesting is, either you all have to
determine what you're willing to support and tell me where to go find it, or give
me...give me the prioritization structure that I should use to go back and find it. Because
I'm not...I'm not in a position, I don't feel, to make recommendations for service delivery
cuts without...without that level of input.
Champion/ No, I agree.
Hayek/ We...we might or might not be able to this year reach a consensus as to some sort of like
public safety versus everything else prioritization, but I'm not even sure I even speak for
myself on that. Beyond that, I don't know that this group is...is ready to create apre-list
if you will.
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Champion/ I think there are things to look (mumbled)
Bailey/ Well, and you know, this is not...this is not $150,000 - something I mentioned on
Saturday about the Senior Center paying for this TV equipment through a franchise fees.
That was agreed long ago that they don't, but once again, how about their foundation,
and, I mean, it's $4,500. It's not a lot of money, but once again, Park and Rec equipment,
their capital outlay too could be examined from a possibility, as well. Um, it's only
$29,000 but you know.
O'Donnell/ What did we decide on the crossing guards? With the schools....are we going to go
to the schools...(several talking and laughing) at least split that with'em.
Correia/ That's what I was just thinking.
Bailey/ Yeah, I think (several talking)
Wright/ ...open the conversation with the Schools.
Hayek/ You gotta have more lead time on something like that.
Lombardo/ I had every intent (mumbled) early fall, but it (mumbled)
Karr/ Michael?
Bailey/ (several talking) He really just doesn't want to be recorded on this issue.
Lombardo/ It's true! Um (laughter) I'm not denying it! Um, the reality is, I just, you know, I
didn't have time in preparation of....really to sit down with Lane and talk it through and
it's not something I was hoping to surprise him with, but I know...read about it now. I'll
give him a call and indicate that I want to have, you know, just a conversation with him
and Ross has some ideas about where he can find the funding for...(several talking and
laughing) I intend to talk to him about it, it was just not something that has happened yet.
Bailey/ I...I think, I think that's a great place to look.
Champion/ Did you talk about other places to get money? Remember we talked about tacking a
dollar on to (mumbled) parking fines, uh for public safety or, talked about adding a nickel
to something, parking ticket or, what did we talk about that one time we were looking at
(several responding)
Correia/ ...33% in the parking.
Helling/ I think that was a nickel a beer that we talked about (laughter)
Champion/ That would be more than a million dollars!
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Hayek/ ...lower consumption (several talking and laughing)
Bailey/ Any other thoughts?
Champion/ Something about parking or parking fines or.. .
Bailey/ Those are increasing.
Champion/ We could...can we add a public safety charge to public intox? That probably
wouldn't be enough for...(several talking)
O'Donnell// Did we not do White Buffalo this year? We didn't do White Buffalo, did we?
Bailey/ Yes we did.
Wright/ We cut it last year, but it's still here.
Bailey/ Yeah, it's cut. Yeah.
O'Donnell/You know, we could...we could use local hunters on that.
Wright/ No!
Correia/ No! (laughter)
O'Donnell/Now wait aminute -it's $100,000.
Bailey/ No, it's not...it's $50,000. (several responding)
O'Donnell/ We spend a half million culling the deer.
Bailey/ We cut it. It's 50.
Helling/ You cut it to $50,000 last year for this year and that's what (several talking) that's
what...the total's $50,000.
O'Donnell/ No, since we started doing it.
Helling/ Oh, I'd have to figure that out. I don't know (several talking)
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O'Donnell/ $400,000 or $500,000 (several talking) and this is what we do...(several talking) it's
time to go home.
Bailey/ Okay, anything else that's...that we actually want staff to spend time on?
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O'Donnell/ I hate deer!
Champion/ I love deer tenderloins! (laughter)
Bailey/ Okay.
Hayek/ We're not providing any specific direction on (several talking)
Bailey/ We would like to talk to Susan.
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Hayek/ Somebody...a client of mine in Washington talked to me the other day, essentially with
the Library down there, and they...they bragged that their foundation has raised twice the
money Iowa City's has.
Bailey/ Their foundation has done a great job down there.
Champion/ Well, Iowa City has probably raised a lot more money, but it doesn't all go into the
foundation. That might be the difference. When you give money, well, you're right -
never mind!
Wright/ But we don't know what the foundation...can put up, but it's definitely a question to ask.
Lombardo/ I had asked the animal shelter foundation, uh, when we were contemplating having to
build the new animal shelter, and the reason why they're going back into the existing
shelter, at least in part, is timing, but also then...I engaged them specifically to start a
capital campaign (several talking) Their response to me recently was, well, I hear they're
going back into the old shelter, and so we're not going to do a capital campaign. I'm like
you know you need to start a capital campaign now, so we have money to build the
shelter that you all want. Uh, and if you don't, then...you know, we can try and keep you
down there until you flood again. I, you know, it just...
Karr/ I just wanted to note that with your schedule you've got CIP's, uh, this week, and then your
next regularly scheduled budget session is with boards and commissions and community
events. So you will have the Library Board and Senior Center Commission, and some of
those representatives here on the 28th, if...I don't know if you wanted to work that in to
that...but that communication could go to them to use their time (several talking)
Bailey/ Yeah, they do need the heads up (several talking) so we're at 1:30 on Thursday.
Karr/ 1:30 to 6:00.
Bailey/ 1:30 to 6:00. Okay.
Karr/ And before you leave, I think there's another handout for CIP's as you adjourn.
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Lombardo/ Oh, yes! We didn't want to give you the fun stuff, figuring you wouldn't focus on the
other (laughter)
Bailey/ Other...
Karr/ I think on Thursday's pictures. Thursday's pictures (several commenting) That's it -
spacing.
Lombardo/ I think they have good experience with this Council (several talking)
Bailey/ Adjourned? (several talking) Are we adjourning? Move to adjourn. Okay. We are
adjourned. Stop chatting about these things.
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