HomeMy WebLinkAbout2009-04-13 TranscriptionApril 13, 2009 City Council Page 1
April 13, 2009 City Council Special Priority-Setting Work Session 5:35 P.M.
Council Present: Bailey, Champion, Correia (arrived 5:40), Hayek, O'Donnell, Wilburn,
Wright
Staff: Lombardo, Helling, Karr, Dilkes, Tharp, Rummel, Boothroy, Hargadine,
Fosse, Jennings, Goodman-Herbst, Wyss, Craig, Lewis, Davidson,
Kopping, Rocca, Johnson, Moran, Mansfield, O'Brien, O'Malley, Jensen
Others Present: UISG Representative -Gunn
Priority Setting:
Lombardo/ Before we get into the booklet itself, uh, page 35 - we noticed after, um, you received
your booklets that, uh, page 35 was missing, and so you have a copy here, um, I guess I
would...recommend we just use it as an insert, but if you'd prefer to have, um, new
bound books, we can certainly do that so that page 35 is not missing (mumbled and
several talking). Okay. So, tonight, um, I'd like to focus on the...the material that you
have in front of you, and also staff, uh, from all the departments are here to really go
through this in...in whatever level of detail you all feel you need to really come to
understand operations, uh, specific programs. Unfortunately our accounting systems do
not allow us to...to capture as granular data as we would really like to see, uh, to make
this a lot easier, and so um, tonight if we could focus on the programs and service areas
as presented, allow you to ask questions, um, engage, uh, staff in a dialog about specifics
of these programs and if there are certain ones where you would like more detailed
information, we can certainly begin piecing that together, but...but that would come with
a fair amount of...of additional work to be able to go through, um, they're not...some of
the funding is rolled up into broad account structures, and so getting at the detail would
take a measure of time and exploration, and depending on what program area we can, um,
perhaps provide guidance in terms of...of what it would take to get at the level of detail
that you might want, or...or timeframe for being able to do that. Uh, so I don't know if
you come with specific questions, uh, in advance after having read this, or if you wanted
to go through, um, kind of page by page and service area by service area, and um, ask
whatever questions you may have regarding the...the programs.
Bailey/I noticed that these are property-tax supported cost centers, except that I didn't see IT,
which I know is a charge-back center, but I assume that it's supported predominantly
through property tax. I could have missed it. I don't understand.
O'Malley/ Madame Mayor, all of the internal service funds are funded by property taxes and
charges to the enterprise funds, and it's based in relation to the number of PCs that they
have and printers, etc.
Bailey/ And so why wasn't it included in here, or did I miss it?
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O'Malley/ No, it wasn't included because it's an internal service fund, just like enterprise funds
aren't included.
Bailey/ Okay. What other internal service funds are in here?
O'Malley/ Uh, radio communications, uh, duplication, mail, and I think that's it. Oh no, the
health insurance, dental insurance, risk management...
Bailey/ (mumbled) Okay, thank you.
Wright/ I went through this several different times over the course of the weekend and...it...at
some point are we going to be receiving a recommendation from you about some
suggestions from all of this?
Lombardo/ I'm presuming...when we started this, um, the...the understanding that I had is that
Council was going to participate in, and wanted to discuss, uh, service delivery and
participate in...in a broad kind of thinking behind what...what we end up cutting. So
there are different...there are different ways of going about this. If...if you all, I mean,
we can go down that road and continue the dialog with this, if it's recommendations that
you would like from me and staff, then, you know, the conversation has to shift to broad
kind of guidelines so that we have the ability to...to be able to, I mean, we need
parameters to, I mean, because otherwise everything seems fair game and...and there's no
policy context for us to make those recommendations. So, if...if Council would like to
discuss establishing those policy parameters, what's on the table is not what, you know,
helping to kind of refine the dialog, then I would recommend we come back to you with
specific questions to help, um, narrow down that thinking so that we can then go back
and work to structure recommendations to you.
Wright/ I was thinking more in terms of...I understand what we were talking about when we
went through this, but it...at some point...I'm going to need some guidance in terms of
what are actually workable options through this. It's easy for us to sit up here
and...conjecture, but at some point we're going...we'll need some feedback.
Lombardo/ So that's the question I have from you all, is...through discussing the programs and
services here, do you intend to...to come to some conclusion about what areas are ripe
for reductions in service, or do you want to focus your time on the broad policy aspects of
this. My presumption was that it was the former that you all wanted to discuss the
programming and...and services, and then help come to the decision-making with regard
to...to what would be reduced.
Champion/ (several talking) ideas how to start this?
Hayek/ Well I...I mean, I can reiterate what I said at our last meeting. I...I think the most
realistic and efficient way to make some progress on this subject is...is the second option,
where we provide some broad policy and...and in return receive some options or
scenarios or something like that, from which we can at least begin an internal dialog at
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the Council level, um, I...I mean, I think this information is...is important and helpful,
but I'm a little bit at a loss to know exactly how to proceed with it. Um, and uh.. .
Bailey/ Well, it's data. It's not information. That's part of the problem. We need some framing,
I think.
Lombardo/ And...and...the expectations, and that's why staff are here, would be based on your
read of the data, what additional information or through a dialog with staff, I mean, to
really understand the services and...and who they affect. This is meant to help create
those questions so you can have a dialog with the departments and with me to get into a
place where you understand the breadth of our services, and...and really to help...then
begin to...to, kind of set the broad framework for where to begin winnowing this down.
So tonight is...is really to provide the opportunity to ask questions and really get to know
services on a level deeper than perhaps, you know, you currently do...or....or not. There
are some areas I would gather you know rather well and then other areas perhaps less so.
The data here is meant to foster that dialog, give you a chance to ask questions of staff,
and really come to know the depth of service and...and what the funding is there for, who
do we serve, that type of thing, and so they're here. If there are areas you want to start in
in particular, or if you, as I said, if you wanted to go through page by page, we can...staff
will come up and we can have that dialog or if there are particular questions, um.. .
Champion/ Well, I can start with one thing, I mean, this...all kind of just a lot of stuff here. Um,
the question I need to know, and I should know it but I don't...is there still any General
Fund money going into private...public transit? Do you know that off the top of your
head? (unable to hear response) Okay. So I can't find any money there.
Dilkes/ I would suggest that, Kevin, if you're going to answer your questions you come to the
table.
Karr/ We are televising live, so it is important also that people at home can hear it.
O'Malley/ Madame Mayor, there was one additional internal service fund I forgot to mention.
That's equipment.
Bailey/ Oh, thanks.
O'Malley/ It's our rolling stock. Connie, what was your question again?
Champion/ Well, I wondered if we still had money in the General Fund going into public transit.
O'Malley/ There is no tax monies going into the General Fund, from the General Fund...General
Levy (unable to hear)
Champion/ Okay.
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O'Malley/ Transit is fully funded by its 95-cent levy, and the revenue from the...Court Street
Transportation Center (both talking)
Champion/ Right. Thank you for answering that.
Correia/ (mumbled) like 8-10 levy.
O'Malley/ Correct.
Correia/ 95-cent transit levy, at the max.
O'Malley/ There's...and employee benefit...employeebenefit levy also (both talking)
Correia/ Right, okay.
Hayek/ I have a couple of just...uh, I don't know if they're typographical or...or informational,
um, clarifications. On, uh, I'll just pick one out of the pack. On page 11, um...benefit to
the community, that column -it's column H.
Lombardo/ Yeah, there was a shift there and...
Hayek/ Cause I'm seeing a bunch of Ls.
Lombardo/ Yeah. The...the columns have shifted over. Those should be shifted to the left.
Hayek/ Okay. I...okay. So should all of the columns on that page (both talking)
Lombardo/ On that page, yeah, everything should be shifted to the left. We'll provide a reprint
of that page.
Wright/ Okay, that clears...that clears up a couple questions that I had too. I wasn't sure if it was
just one cell, but it's all of'em. (several agreeing)
Hayek/ And then, while I'm at it, on page, uh, 14...column F has, toward the bottom...As and
Bs. I don't know if that's a shifted column or...or something else.
Lombardo/ LTh, no. House...um, yeah, Housing Inspection Services, if you flip to the last page
of their, um, they have a key, uh, so if you flip to page 19...there's a broader itemization
of the...the FTEs associated with that because the...the um, Doug, you're here, if you
want to explain. The thinking was that they're blended, um, amongst the different people.
Hayek/ Okay.
Wright/ Yeah, it's the bottom of page 20 (both talking)
Hayek/ All right. I didn't know if it was all cued into that... sort of glossary, if you will.
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Lombardo/ Yeah, come on up and...and speak to it if you want.
Boothroy/ You're talking about the FTEs?
Hayek/ Correct.
Boothroy/ Right, and we...we were trying to show, um, the different, uh, positions as they, uh,
relate to the various services, and so we used a...we don't have it broke down by being
able to say .5 or something. There's a lot of overlap and so therefore we just used a...a
letter categorization of the different positions that are involved in each of those services.
Hayek/ The same FTE is involved in multiple, multiple...
Boothroy/ Right. Right.
Hayek/ ...tasks.
Boothroy/ Right. People back-fill various tasks and so, yeah.
Hayek/ Okay.
Champion/ While you're there...
Boothroy/ Okay.
Champion/ ...we've had this discussion so many times, um, how much subsidy is the Building
Inspection department giving now? Do you know off hand, just roughly?
Boothroy/ Well, I...I...95% of our activities are funded by fees. (both talking) Yeah. So there's
about a 5% General Fund, um...we continue to look at our fees on a regular basis, and
um...um, you know, try to adjust them for inflation, different things like that. Recently
you just increased Housing Inspection fees.
Champion/ Right.
Lombardo/ And, uh, the Finance staff are in the process of...of updating, doing a fee study to
come back to you in terms of, um, possible revenue options, uh, we're focusing on the
expenditure side now, but Kevin, I don't know if you have a better idea of when that
would be...
O'Malley/ Right now we're identifying our current fee structure, and doing a historical, uh,
composition to see when the last time they've been raised, other than Parks and Rec fees,
which we...the Parks and Rec Commission reviews annually, and then we're also going
to be asking the department divisions for specific work that they do that does not impact
the general public. So, it might be for developers or people off the street, or something
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like that, to make sure that we get a cost recovery. So these are the issues for you to
decide later (mumbled) that you want to raise to help offset, uh, losses.
Champion/ And, Doug, the 5%...what, just approximately, what that amount (mumbled)
Boothroy/ Uh, $130,000.
Champion/ Oh, I got it all right here.
Boothroy/ I decided to figure that out before I came tonight (laughter) because I thought I might
be asked, so...(laughter). We have...we have a couple fees that we might be coming
back to you, uh, but it's not going to make up that difference. It's just part of looking at
our fees and making sure that they're all, uh, current. One of the things about our...our
activities and our fees, Connie, is that...is that like Building Inspection fees are...are
market-driven. So, uh, if we were to have, uh, Hieronymus Square go, uh, get built next
year, uh, we would not be seeing that 5%, uh, General Fund.
Champion/ Right.
Boothroy/ Yeah, so it's...we move back and forth, depending on the economy (both talking) and
construction.
Hayek/ So what do you all think?
Lombardo/ Perhaps this is, uh, I mean, I guess a good place, you know, we've talked about
this...this process some over the course of making budget, and maybe this is as good a
time as any to validate, um, you know, we set out, or embarked on this process because
we were trying to fix a problem with...we saw no end, that this is a...a deficit situation
that, um, extends out at a minimum of five years and...and no real clear, um, indication
of when that would turn around. Um, and...and the discussion, this was some months
ago, was...was largely many jurisdictions, you know, choose to do this on an annual
basis. How do we solve the deficit problem this year, and you manage your way through
it. We're here tonight because there was...a collective thought, at least at one point in
time, that we would try and...and solve this problem, so that we had some breathing
room in outlying years, and I guess maybe ...maybe it's important to validate that now,
um, are we still intended on correcting this so that we have breathing room, or is
there...is there a potential shift in mindset that we should try and manage our way
through this...to see, you know, if in a year, two years, three years we begin to see when
this might likely take care of itself.
Hayek/ Are you referring to the...to the commitment we made internally to the quarter million
this year and million.. .
Lombardo/ Right.
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Hayek/ ...outlying year? I mean, I can't speak for everybody. I...I think those numbers stand
and (several responding). So I think that's still there.
Lombardo/ So then it's just the process of identifying how to get there that...cause when we met,
was it last week or the week before now? (several responding) Two weeks, um, we had
discussed briefly recommendations, but that...it seemed at least at that point to me that
there was still want for broader discussions about the service end of it, and...and the
participation in that dialog on the front end. So...cause, maybe that's questions number
two now then, are...is Council, are...are you going to participate in identifying areas to
potential cut, or are we heading in the direction of your...really wanting something to
respond to?
Hayek/ Go ahead, Amy.
Correia/ Well, it seems to me, as I was thinking over this after receiving this information that I
think, I mean, I...there's a few things I'm thinking of. One is, I feel like we're in...we're
in a period of time with the, um, federal economic stimulus opportunities, that I feel like I
would like all of our, you know, for the City to be very proactive in identifying potential
revenue into the City, through the economic stimulus, and really be as aggressive as
possible, in trying to attract those funds to the City, um, so I mean, I think that's a policy
direction that we would say here are these, you know, external opportunities that we have
through the...the, you know, federal economic stimulus...I really want us, however the
organization can refocus...focus us truly on identifying those opportunities, be aggressive
about...about accessing those opportunities, as...as a potential strategy for diversifying
revenue. I mean, I think that what we've talked about in the last few years in our budget
discussions have been how can we diversify the revenue coming in, so I think that's one
opportunity that we have right now, that...that is potentially (mumbled) opportunity that
could, you know, depending on some of the, you know, some of the money could get us
18 months, but (mumbled) so I mean I think that that's...I would like to have discussion
about how that, how that gets directed, and how the organization can, um, work on that.
Bailey/ And what it would take, right?
Correia/ Right. Yeah. (both talking) What would that, right. (both talking) The other thing
that I wonder is if, you know, I think that there's valuable information in here that, but
that it's...we need to have, what I'm wondering is if departments can, so we have a target
we know (mumbled) million thereafter, that if we...if departments could give us
scenarios, a 1 % cut to this department would mean X. A 2% cut to this department
would mean, you know, this. A 5% would mean this. And then that would give us things
to respond to. So if every, if we got that from every department, I mean, then pair with
the information about things that are, you know, mandated along with ways departments,
uh, might be able to say cut this from General Fund revenue where we, um, General Fund
support. We could attempt to make up revenue in this way. I mean, I don't, you know, I
don't know how that would be, if it would depend on department, if it would be fees, if it
would be fundraising, uh, you know, those...if it would be economic stimulus, being
more aggressive about grants, I mean, I'm not sure what it would be, I mean, in each
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different department would, you know, they have their expertise, they know they're
sector, ways that they, and then we could respond to 5% cut in Parks and Rec would
mean X, or 2% would mean, you know, and then we could have that picture of, okay, this
is what these...that would mean the context of it, then paired with, um, the benefit to the
community of these different, the mandates for these different services. Then we would
be able to have that.
Wright/ And having something to respond to was what...after reading this I realized I need it.
Correia/ So it would have the numbers, the...(both talking) you would get this, but we would
lose this, you know, how would we...
Bailey/ Yeah, and fundamentally we have to make sure that we're flying on a policy level and
not aline-by-line level, is my sense. This is what we do. We redirect policy, and this
is...this is line-by-line, and um, I don't, personally, don't think that that's where we need,
so I think we need recommendations to respond to, and understand what policy direction
we're providing. Just as Amy has outlined.
Champion/ Well, as far as the economic stimulus money, that really is a good idea. I think I read
somewhere it could...some of it can be used for police and fire. I think...
Correia/ There's some funds for police and fire, exactly, I mean, I think that there are.. .
Lombardo/ We're tracking the stimulus as the funding unroll, you know, is rolled out, I mean,
we're...we're on top of it, and we're trying to understand what we might be able to avail
ourselves of or not. The, um, the funding for police and fire comes with a commitment,
um, to be able to fund those positions ongoing, um, some of them only for a year, but
even still, in a deficit situation it's kind of hard to...to suggest that we...we avail
ourselves of a funding pool without a clear strategy for how would we pay for those
positions.
Champion/ Well, with the fire, if we can fund...fire people for the new fire station, then we
could always fall back on the, uh, that other levy, the emergency levy...to continue
funding them. If we're going to get five years of funding.
Correia/ With the hope that the market, I mean, there's that...(both talking)
Champion/ ...always have that assessment...
Bailey/ Industrial, commercial property.
Champion/ We would always have that levy to fall back on, so we, if we could finance some
now with the stimulus package, and then fall back on the emergency levy to continue
funding them, cause isn't that what we talked about using before? (several responding)
Off the top of my head.
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Bailey/ No, Connie, you're right.
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Correia/ I would say, tracking is different than, we have resources to apply and to, I mean, and
I...and I think that...I think that one...one thing that we don't know, we have these
economic stimulus, we don't know what's in (mumbled) I mean, I think some things that
say 18 months support may turn out to be, there's going to be additional support
available. So I think that's what I mean about trying to be aggressive, um, to make sure
we don't pass an opportunity by that in two years there's...now there's more money to
continue these positions, I mean, we don't know, and I mean I understand...trying to be
careful at the same time. I...I think that I don't want to be too careful either. To try and
attract new dollars in.
Wilburn/ I think the caveat to pursuing stimulus funding, um, progressively is just that the
understanding that really buying some time to see what happens. If I were to, uh, if I
were a staff member and uh, you know, with potential, um, layoff, losing my job here, if
I...if we're successful with, um, certain stimulus money, then you know it gives me as a
staff member some greater choice if I know, well, at least my job is safe for another 18
months to a couple years, and then that gives me some choices - do I want to stick with it
to wait to see, do I want to use a year, a couple years to perhaps start and look around, if I
know that I'm potentially one in an area that might be subject to a layoff. Um, I would
think most people would say, you know, uh, well, I mean, a lot of our agencies that
receive grant funds, I mean, I know they live on.. .
Lombardo/ Adding staff with grant funds, um, poses questions and challenges for the years
following, uh, the grant period. Um, but we have...we have issues to solve with...with
this budget, um, and so I...I mean, I think I understand, you know, in terms of the
stimulus funding and potential use it for Fire Station #4, and that's an option that, you
know, May...May is I think when they come out with the guidelines for the next SAFER
grants and we're...we're, you know, we continue to monitor the funding for that. Um, but
that doesn't...that doesn't, I mean, that compounds the issue for future years. We still
have a deficit that we need to take care of now. So L ..I think we're mixing kind of the
dialog, um, funding for...for police and fire is unlikely, is not going to pay for existing
ones. This would be for new bodies. So...I mean, we're...we do have eyes on that, and
are going to look at how that funding is rolled out, and...and we'll be coming to you with
questions of should we be availing ourselves to that. I get in...I get a little nervous about
relying on the emergency levy, um, now when we don't really know what's going to
happen over the next couple of years, and it's different Council and...the ability to
commit to using emergency levy and it may or may not be there, it just makes me a little
concerned, um, three years out whether...whether...
Bailey/ But no decision we make here tonight will...will hold for three years out. We all know
that people, different people will be sitting around this table.
Lombardo/ Sure.
Bailey/ I mean, we...we know, that's what we know about our...
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Hayek/ But I...I mean, I agree, um, I think it's important to pursue whatever state or federal
dollars might come this way, and you know we need to track those and...and pursue
them, but...tonight it seems to me that those dollars are purely theoretical, and...and we
have a budget crunch to deal with, and I would much prefer us to, uh, act as if we weren't
going to get those dollars, uh, be conservative about it and in the event we do, great! And
we can make adjustments and...and, but otherwise, it's like buying a lottery ticket
and...and just don't know if it's going to pan out.
Correia/ Right. I mean, I guess I just want to make sure as we're going through this process that
we don't have tunnel vision, in that we're, I mean, we're taking this time. We need to...to
devote to this. We have a deficit situation, so we need, but at the same time there are
these external opportunities that we can't...aren't going to wait, that could provide...great
benefit to the city. So I mean I...I don't know, I just think that something, other...
Hayek/ But we don't...I mean, if we knew what the opportunities were.
Correia/ Yes! No, I...I know, but I just want to make sure that we're not so focused...we're so
focused on this process that we don't direct our resources externally as well, because this
is an opportunity that we...might not come around again, and then we have missed that
opportunity. I mean, that's all...as we're going through this process I...I want to make
sure (mumbled) that that doesn't get set aside because we're being focused.
Lombardo/ We...we continue to, I mean, all of the stimulus bills and the funding, we continue to
monitor regularly, and...and you know, as the...the rules and the guidelines are rolled
out, you know, we're very... staff are very quick to start thinking about how can we, are
there projects, are there things that we can use this funding for or not. The...the balance
is, this stuff comes down very quickly, uh, you have very short turnaround time, uh, we're
dealing with major flood projects, and...and there's the day-to-day. At some point my
concern is that...that staff are spread too thin and we might just have to say no to certain,
um, opportunities simply because we...we physically just can't take on...we're not there
yet, but I think in...in Public Works and other areas, it's a dialog that we have, you know,
how many more projects, how many additional things can we juggle, even if...even if we
contract that out, it takes oversight and...and so there's...there's ajuggling act to be had
there and I, you know, we'll be realistic about what we can do and...and still we want to
try and bring as much funding to Iowa City as we possibly can.
Wright/ And I think what I was hearing from Amy is that we need to keep an eye on that, and
make sure that we're not losing any good opportunities, while we're going through our
process. And I think...
Correia/ I guess what I think that means is is that means if we're going through this process and
here's an incredible opportunity that's coming down with a quick turnaround time that we
adjust our schedule around this priority, if we have to adjust two weeks, you know, for
planning...if...ifwc're trying to get information from departments, you know, in a time
table that then conflicts with oh here's a stimulus grant opportunity that there's a two
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week or three week turnaround time that we quickly know that and that then we move
that timeline -that's what I mean. I mean, our process for this can wait two weeks, where
an economic stimulus opportunity that, you know, we think will provide a good benefit to
the City can. I mean, I think that's a policy direction that we can say that we want that,
you know, we want to know about those opportunities so that then we have a context for
that. Um...I don't know how others feel about that.
Bailey/ Well, I think that makes sense. I think...and I think this process is to a certain degree
flexible enough for that. Don't others feel that way?
Hayek/ Yeah, absolutely, but you know L ..I haven't yet seen a personnel related stimulus, uh,
opportunity. Maybe they exist, but it would seem to me to be more Public Works
and...and capital intensive, um, and what we're trying to shave off is...is...
Bailey/ But, if for example we needed to use the emergency levy to cover personnel, and we cold
reduce capital...our capital, our debt service levy to provide those critical infrastructure
things that are ready to go, it's...it is a trade-off and you're right - it's a huge gamble, but
it's...it's shifting the dollars, which any...anybody understands is maybe part of what
we're going to have to do. So, I think that...
Hayek/ Well, and that makes sense, and that's what we had scenarioed.
Bailey/ Right.
Hayek/ Created a word, um, a few months ago when we...when we dropped over $2 million in
capital projects to reduce the debt levy so that we could increase the emergency
benefit...the emergency levy for personnel for the fire station.
Bailey/ And the need for these capital projects is not going to go away. We don't want to defer
these so long that we have, you know, critical concerns. So if there...the opportunities
are there, I think it's shifting but, you know, this is going to involve a lot of fancy
footwork.
Champion/ (mumbled) stimulus money, I thought there was going to be some stimulus money
for buildings. I mean, can't we get any stimulus money for the fire department, for the
fire building itself?
Lombardo/ We won't know that until, uh, summer and I don't know whether that's June or July or
August, so we...we continue to...
Champion/ And, Andy, how close are those plans to being shovel-ready? (mumbled) tax savings
for the community.
Bailey/ Right (mumbled) (several talking)
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Rocca/ Well, we've been working with Rohrback on our plans and uh, we were at 90% finished
documents, uh, we were getting ready to turn them out to 95% within the month of April.
So we could go out to bid, uh, May/June.
Champion/ And do you know anything about the stimulus package for building?
Lombardo/ There's nothing been issued yet.
Champion/ Nothing's been issued.
Lombardo/ We...just broad...
Rocca/ No, there hasn't...there hasn't been anything issued. We're watching the SAFER, as the
City Manager pointed out, which is, uh, funding for personnel, um, but the stimulus
package is what we're watching for the vertical infrastructure for the fire station.
Champion/ Okay, all right. Looking at ways we can save money for the taxpayers, and hit 'em
somewhere else!
Wilburn/ There's one, uh, across the board kind of, um, piece of information that would be
helpful forme, in terms of what we have in front of us. Um, and maybe by
department...department, um, director to get just a picture painted in terms of column M,
uh, duplicate (mumbled) serves...means of service delivery. In some cases I...I have a
clear picture of what, uh, you know, outsourcing might mean. In some cases outsources
might mean we're still paying, but it may offer some savings. In other cases, for example
I'm presuming like with under mass transit it says yes could privatize. I'm presuming that
means some other entity and then that line item just zero off our books. Um, but there's
some other cases where I'm not quite sure what that would mean. I think under Police,
law enforcement, it said that they're...yes, there are some alternate needs for criminal
investigation or police, uh, maybe if department heads could in general what does...what
does that column mean to you, um, what...is it...is it primarily outsourcing. Is there
cost...or is it a question for Council - is this a service that the City, Council wishes the
City to continue to provide. I...I don't know -are others interested in that, uh, it seems to
me a broad question that, um, I think what Amy was saying in terms of what a X number
of percentage by department might look like might help, but just in terms of guides for
department heads, in terms of what we may or may not be willing to approve as part of
those alternative scenarios, if privatization or outsourcing is a piece of that, then maybe
that might be a piece of helpful information.
Bailey/ Well, and I, can I just dovetail on that outsourcing, because it seems like one area of
outsourcing possibility, and I...I know that we said that we would explore that possibility
of outsourcing, and I'm not sure if I'm comfortable with it, but one area that's logical is
internal services where we have chargebacks. Um, I know that the UI outsourced the
equipment maintenance and those sorts of things. I mean, you hear a lot about
outsourcing these types of services, and since we don't have that information in front of
us, to what degree could some of these internal services, IT, etc., be outsourced. Would
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there be cost savings? Does it make sense...I don't know, but I mean, that seems another
area to explore that's costing each department, which could result in their across the board
cuts if we could achieve these services at a lower cost.
Lombardo/ Just to clarify it, um, I mean, I forget...I'd have to go back, but we did...we did
discuss is outsourcing or privatizing on the table, and Council indicated, at least that point
in time that that was not something you wanted us to pursue looking at so this would
be...
Wilburn/ The question that I'm really getting at, um, I'm not negating anything that Regenia has
said, but in terms of the information that's presented here, in some cases I understand
what outsourcing means and...for example, in Parks and Rec there's something about, uh,
pool instruction. Could that be outsourced or private, I forget what it says here, does that
mean we have a facility and someone, you know, it's not an expense to us. Someone
could come in and operate private lessons. I don't...I don't know, so...
Bailey/ No, Mike just corrected me. We said we wouldn't look at it. I'm sorry I brought it up.
Lombardo/ So...so, I mean, each...each instance here if there's a particular program...I mean, I
guess, which ones do you want to talk about and we'll get the department head up here
and...we've got Chief Hargadine here now if there's...police you wanted to probe in
particular, um, which page are we on and...
Hargadine/ Back to the issue of, uh, duplicate services. Our column would be "no" all the way
down.
Wilburn/ Okay. So...
Hargadine/ Victim of column shift.
Wilburn/ Okay, all right then, that helps explain that piece to it.
Wright/ Which page are you on?
Hargadine/ I've go the corrected (mumbled)
Wilburn/ Like from page 10...
Hargadine/ Page 10.
Correia/ There was a question, or something that came up during our budget discussions about
crossing guards, something that other cities don't (mumbled) don't we? Coralville doesn't
(mumbled) crossing guards. What would you...
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Hargadine/ Uh, that is...that is definitely an area that could be explored with, uh, the school
system. Uh, that's a $63,400 program that we, uh (mumbled) out of our budget, but that's
one option that could be explored.
Correia/ So there's 12, it says there are 12 school crossing. We have 12 elementary schools that
we don't provide school, secondary schools, right?
Hargadine/ That's correct.
Correia/ (mumbled) the elementaries, and that's one or two people, one for the morning and one
in the afternoons that.. .
Hargadine/ It may be the same person.
Correia/ Right, right, right, right, but I (both talking) not two people. Do you...do we have a
sense of how it came, you know, the evolution of, I mean, I certainly see (mumbled)
Hargadine/ Uh, it predates me, so I'm...I don't know that I have the history of school crossing
guards.
O'Donnell/ Were we not going to talk to the school system about that?
Bailey/ Michael indicated that he was going to.
Champion/ It's been going on as long as I've been in Iowa City.
Correia/ I mean, certainly the schools are having their own budget discussion (several talking)
something (both talking)
Champion/ ...crossing guard at Court and Muscatine for Longfellow, of course the City didn't
want to finance it, but they put it all the way stop, which has worked really well. You
know, you push the button and all the lights turn red. And then kids can cross safely.
Correia/ Oh, uh-huh.
Champion/ And so that might be an option they can look at, where we have crossing guards,
where there are stoplights. (several responding)
Wilburn/ ...some history there that...
Helling/ Well, now, guys...it's been, you know we've been doing it since she can remember, and
since I can remember. Uh, there have been discussions with the School District in the
fairly distant past, um, their position essentially has been that it's the City's responsibility
for the kids until they get on the school property, then the school's responsible, uh,
thereafter. And that's kind of the way it was left, um, in terms of crossing guards, some
of the schools have more than one, uh.. .
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Champion/ Mann has more than one.
Helling/ Hoover has two. Um, so there maybe, you know, you can't say one crossing guard per
school because that's not (mumbled)
Champion/ But being that's something we can look at, we'll save the police some money. I don't
know what it costs to put in those all the way stops.
Lombardo/ $63,000 a year.
Champion/ No, I mean for the stoplight thing. But that would work well at Dodge, and Church,
cause there's a stoplight there. (several responding) And...right, it would work for other
times too! But that's also been very effective with the University in front of the
Pentacrest. To stop all traffic while people cross there. Um...you know what I'm
saying?
Bailey/ Yeah, it makes sense.
Hayek/ See, we seem to be inching our way into aline-by-line discussion. (several talking)
...spreadsheets and...and we can do that, if that's what it takes, but I...I...I don't think it's
a good route for us to take, at least at this stage, uh...
Bailey/ We can go back to Ross' question. He wanted some further explanation about the
outsourcing, yeah (several talking)
Wilburn/ That seems to me...is a policy thing that could give direction to, say is this a direction
that Council after hearing from them what that might mean may rethink some of the
outsourcing or...or not. Um...and I'm afraid I'm going to be a victim of column shift if
I...uh, look at particular pages, but maybe I can, uh, just ask since they are here if each
department head could just come and give a commentary about, um, what...just to let me
know -yes there was a column shift or no, um, just as Sam did in his...in his
department's case, it means no, and then if there are places where it would mean
privatizing or outsource, um, what could be the magnitude of savings, because there's
some areas that have dollars here and there's some that don't. Again, just as a broad
discussion on, uh...
Lombardo/ Do you want to just start at the beginning then and...
Wilburn/ That would be fine.
Lewis/ Just to clarify, the only area that there's a column shift is in the police department. It's
just isolated to the police department.
Wilburn/ Okay. All right.
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Lewis/ (mumbled)
Page 16
Wilburn/ Um, then if I could start at the beginning, um...well, let me (mumbled). Um, the City
Clerk's office where it talks about relying on, um, I don't know that in your department
that these are necessarily going to total up to a large figure.
Karr/ You're looking at licensing and permitting?
Wilburn/ (both talking) permitting, advertising, um...that type, yeah, what does, uh, the
licensing, permit, relying on the state only -what does that mean, what does that look
like.
Karr/ That means all of our local, um, ordinances that you have passed over the past few years,
uh, that have required the local input, whether it's inspections, uh, whether it's,
uh... uh... further enhancement of the police chief s review, the DCI reports, um, all of
those type of...of things, uh, are not required by the State. And right now an applicant
for a liquor license could apply online to the State, send the fee, and not go through the
local, uh, requirement established by ordinances right now.
Wilburn/ Right, and so in that example, since we've had locally the concerns related to liquor
license enforcement, that would be an area where I would not be interested in that
particular type of outsourcing. Um, when it comes to City Attorney's office in terms
of...legal, um, I know that there are some areas where we do, uh, hire outside, uh, legal
counsel sometimes, uh, correct me if I'm wrong - it would be a matter of experience or
expertise, um, and then I suppose it's a matter of, uh, perhaps control or timeliness that
goes into figuring...
Dilkes/ No, we don't...we don't hire outside counsel much, um, we do if there's a conflict of
interest. For instance, if the police department gets sued and one of the officers gets
sued, if we identify any conflict in the...the positions of the police officer and the police
department, we're required to get a separate attorney for the police officer, that kind of
thing. Um, the other big one we've done recently is in connection with the water plant
and the beams at the water plant, and we did hire outside counsel because we needed that
expertise, but also because we had a contract term that allowed us to recover our fees.
Wilburn/ All right. So in the case of Legal, um, I mean, those are the types of things that I think
would be important to do, but I also, um, from other...sources of employment that I've
had it seems to me that it's a strong benefit to have legal in-house, in terms of access and
following our commission meetings, to have, um, a more ready response and guidance in
terms of policy formation. I don't know, uh, Kevin, in terms of, um, your department.
You've already done some, um, you gave us a picture of the magnitude of, cause there's
still...there's still cost involved with outsourcing. For example, uh, our billing and things
like that - we still have to pay for that, but can you paint us a picture for the magnitude,
cause I see that you say in terms of like accounts payable, uh, the partially or I guess what
further outsource, what's the magnitude (both talking)
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O'Malley/ Well, by law we're required to keep records and...and instead of, uh storing
everything in paper form, we outsource them to get, uh, scanned in and then keep them in
electronic form, so that's one way we save space in the building, etc., and we've done
that...many departments have been doing scanning. City Clerk's office, uh, HIS, that's
what we're talking about in, uh, in accounts payable. As far as, uh, decentralization and
outsourcing. We're looking at, uh, maybe having each individual department, uh, process
their own accounts payable and just send it through us for review versus us having
centralized accounting... accounting area. There's some risk in that, uh, in some places it
works successfully, depending upon the software, and right now we haven't got that
software deployed. So...
Wilburn/ What's the potential magnitude of say, I mean...
O'Malley/ We had two clerks, so, um, you're going to have to have somebody there to do 1099s,
pay individuals, and so you maybe able to shave a half a person.
Wilburn/ Okay.
Lombardo/ So the argument becomes then, you know, can we implement this software and get
that up and running, because otherwise you're just shifting burden to departments that are
already (several talking)
O'Malley/ It goes out into the enterprise funds and the police and fire, etc.
Wilburn/ Right. Uh, in terms of Transit, I presume that means that we would have nothing to do
with Transit, and I don't know that that's something that the community would be willing
to (mumbled) that the community would be willing to not have the City doing that, but I
just want to make sure that I'm clear on that.
O'Brien/ Yeah, my understanding is you'd have different options, um, much like, and with the
parking garages, it's the same, uh, for the garages that are actually Transit assets, uh, you
could have anywhere from just management services down the line to the entire
operation. So...
Wilburn/Okay. Uh...
Champion/ But that's aself-sustaining service.
O'Brien/ Correct, with the assistance of the transit levy and the employee benefit levy.
Champion/ So, the transit funds do not support the benefit levy, so we do...your benefit for
transit and parking are included in our, um, our assessment for health and benefit levy,
the benefit levy (several talking)
O'Malley/ ...when you said parking, that's an enterprise fund, so it does not go into the employee
benefit (both talking)
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Champion/ Okay, it goes, it provides its own.. .
O'Malley/ They have to provide their own benefits, but about six years ago when we got into a
pickle on some financing we looked at moving Transit from an enterprise fund into the
General Fund, because we were funding them with General Fund dollars anyway every
year, so we took advantage of putting them in the General Fund and getting access
through the employee benefit levy to cover their cost, and that...that along with the, uh.
Court Street Transportation made them fully funded.
Champion/ Okay.
Wright/ Can I just get a...some clarifications as we're going through, uh, talking about...talking
about outsourcing...in January or February did we...didn't we decide as a Council that
that was not a tactic we were interested in (mumbled) (several talking) I...I'm not sure
why we're spending a lot of time on it.
Wilburn/ Um, if you don't wish to, because I did ask, um, if Council is interested in just hearing
that because that was some information that was provided in front of us, just to
(mumbled) a more clear picture of what that would be if Council.. .
Bailey/ ...interested in pursuing it?
Wilburn/ Um...
Bailey/ Actual outsourcing (mumbled) information gathering. I thought there was...I mean,
that's why I backed off on the chargeback sorts of things. The internal services,
outsourcing, because...
Wilburn/ The only other area where I had a question, uh, was Parks and Rec, just so, again, so I
had a picture of...if I'm saying no, then I want to know what I'm saying no to.
Bailey/ (mumbled)
Champion/ But they probably do outsource some.. .
Wilburn/ They do, they do, but there were some other items in here so...
Bailey/ Actually some rec services that I...I noticed, yeah.
Lombardo/ And there's a distinction too between outsourcing and then the discussion around, are
there other service providers who are doing similar programming, and... and I think,
Mike, yeah, if you would like to come up, and also Senior Center. I don't know if there
are other, you know, there are other...who else...um, if there are other areas that there
maybe other service providers or not. I think that's...that's something worth clarifying as
well.
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Wilburn/ And before you go on, again, I mean if Council's not....I just wanted to know what we
were saying no to, and um, either affirming or reaffirming that policy decision, um,
because the question I'm going to come to next then, just kind of following up what Matt
was saying in terms of what we have in front of us and what to respond or ask further
from staff for, um...the question I asked at the last prioritization meeting that we had
was...if we're not going to do the line-by-line, or excuse me, if we are, um...if we're not
going to go with that staff recommendation that we had, how is this going to be different
than the budget discussions we had back in...that we typically do, just to get us, you
know, kind of moving where we're going.
Hayek/ Do you want me to answer that?
Wilburn/ Uh, sure!
Hayek/ I mean, the budget actually was a recommendation. It was, uh, many pages of
recommendations and then a recommendation with respect to requested new positions,
um, and so...and I thought that made sense. We had met some parameters within which
we operated, and we had...we knew what the requests were. We knew what the
recommendation...recommended response was, um, I mean, that's...that's why I'm of the
opinion that the same kind of approach, i.e., a set of several scenarios from which we can
pick, or at least use as a starting point to...to discuss, um, makes the most sense, versus
us trying to jump into here, uh, with 40 pages of spreadsheet information.
Wilburn/ Sure. All right.
Hayek/ I guess that'd be my response.
Wilburn/ Um, so then...
Champion/ Well, I am interested in looking at outsourcing.
Wilburn/ Okay. So, again, just so that (several talking) um, so that we know what it looks like,
so that we're either saying yes or.. .
Moran/ For recreation mostly all the rec services that we provide could they be outsourced -
absolutely. Somebody could come in and run 'em. The double-edged sword for us is that
we still own the facilities and so we still have to have supervision of the facilities, and
then that also affects our revenue. So it's a...it's whatever revenue that we lose from
outsourcing that program, but can they be outsourced -sure they can.
Wilburn/ So in terms of maintaining the facility, Mercer Aquatic Center, then we're potentially
pulling more money out of the General Fund anyway because.. .
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Moran/ You could hire a firm to do the maintenance, but you're still going to have to have
oversight and administration of the contracts, make sure they're doing the job. Same with
any of the rec programs.
Wilburn/ Right. And so...when you're putting down yes could be outsourced, um, that's kind of
what you're getting at, is that someone... some other entity could do it, but we still (both
talking) okay. Thank you.
Correia/ Well, I would say (mumbled) see if I'm saying the truth or not. I mean, I think like the
summer camp program is relatively, I mean, it's not inexpensive, but it's less expensive
than some other privately-run summer camp programs, and the City accepts State
childcare assistance funding so I mean...and we have aloes-income discount for many
programs for our residents (mumbled) benefits to providing service by the City, um, that
we wouldn't be able to provide.
Wilburn/ Okay. (several talking)
Moran/ Yeah, we generally run the lowest, uh, cost-wise program (both talking)
Correia/ Right.
Wilburn/ Okay. That's all I needed. Thanks.
Lombardo/ Other program areas where additional information is...desired?
Wright/ How many folks are interested in getting some recommendations so that we have
something to respond to? This is going to be good background, but I don't...I don't think
we're...I don't think we're able to slug through this and make any kind of good decisions,
frankly.
Bailey/ Well, and I don't think it's our role.
Wilburn/ So what are the parameters then...Amy threw out one suggestion. What's a 1%, what's
a 3%, what's a 5% by department, uh, are there other parameters that maybe helpful?
O'Donnell/ I think that was a great suggestion. And I think that would just, that would really be
beneficial to me in looking at this. You know, what...what does this save and what does
it cost, what's the expense, what's the service to the community that we look at cutting
or...or diminishing some, but I just...I think I need that also.
Wilburn/ So is the...so the potential outcome of that is whatever...and correct me if I'm wrong, a
potential outcome is that, um, throughout the organization there will be some differences
in, um, percentage cut, reduction. One department could have a 3%, one could have a
1 %, and one could have a 6%, and is that something that Council...I'm just kind of
thinking out loud, is that something the Council is willing to, uh, accept, if they have an
understanding, a knowledge, by department what each.. .
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Correia/ And I think that makes sense, I mean, I think there was...I think this was an article that
you had given us, Michael, earlier about budget...budget work, you know, that the sort
of, uh, household example of so we're just going to cut every line of our family's budget
5%. We're going to stop paying 5% of our mortgage reduced, 5% of entertainment,
where maybe you should cut your, you might want to cut your Net Flix bill first, a greater
percent of your, you know, recreation costs, you know, than you're housing costs, I mean,
I think that...that it may mean that there are some areas that depending on what the
context is and what the policy decision, and then what we feel like we can live with, um,
than just doing across the board without the context of what is that...what does that
mean. Doesn't mean it's not going to hurt, in any particular area, but I think at least we
will have all (mumbled) context and have the information, know what the ramifications
of that...those decisions might be.
Wright/ I think across the board cuts without any...any strategy involved are poor policy.
Bailey/ I agree.
Lombardo/ And keep in mind, the...this information wasn't presented so that, you know,
encourage aline-by-line detail. Certainly we can drift in that direction, but it's meant to
be able to give you order of magnitude for programs and be able to ask questions about
who, you know, if there are specific population groups that it served, or really to get to
know the depth of...of operations, in terms of helping to...to focus policy level decisions.
So I...it's not...not shift through here and piece together the numbers so that we come up
with whatever the number might be, but to make sure that...that, so that as we get into
further discussions about the policy context, you have a good grounding in...in terms of
what programs serve which constituency groups or populations, because that's going to
become important as we start to propose reductions.
Bailey/ Well, and that...that seems less clear to me in...in this presentation, and I think as we
begin to discuss the impact in that way. That would be something I'd be interested in
seeing in recommendations, if...if there are other options for our citizens in the
community to get a similar service or the same service, I think we need to be discussing,
um, should we continue that service in difficult budget times, and... and
perhaps...perhaps we only provide unique services, but I'm not sure that that's necessarily
the case. And that'd be something I would want reflected in these recommendations, as
well -are there other options for citizens. And who would, where would the gaps be
perhaps if this service no longer existed, and it's harder to get in a table. It's more of a
narrative, from my perspective. What do others think? Regarding that...if there are other
places to get similar services or same services.
Champion/ Do you have any idea what...what that might be?
Bailey/ Well I mean I think if we look in, um, I mean provision of programming, for example, I
think that that naturally comes to mind, and so...is...is there really, can we make an
impact on the budget by scaling back programming, or as our Library Director said, is
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this a time not to scale back on programming. What kind of decisions, I mean, those are
logical places that communities regularly look, provision of programming, sorts of things.
And maybe some other departments, unlikely departments, do it as well. I don't know.
Um, you know, community outreach and other departments.
Hayek/ See, to borrow Amy's analogy of housing costs versus Net Flix costs or entertainment
costs, in fairness to Michael for him to be able to come back to us with recommendations
we have to tell Michael that housing costs are more important than entertainment costs,
under that analogy.
Bailey/ Or we have to respond to a scenario that indicates...
Correia/ Right, that's what I was more (both talking)
Bailey/ And I think that that's...that's (both talking)
Correia/ ...like here's that one, three, five, how much does this get us, what does it mean,
what...what do we lose, can we, you know, is that a loss we can live with.
Bailey/ Yeah, I don't think we're all going to have our (both talking) respond to a scenario.
Correia/ Yeah, that's what I was...
Wright/ I think we'll be able to look and say we can, I think we can easily take 5% off of X, but
egad, that's just not possible over here.
Correia/ Right, exactly!
Lombardo/ I mean, to look across the breadth of this organization, I mean, that's a tremendous
undertaking to (noise on mic) for a moving target, and so anything that you can do to
narrow that down. Are there particular areas that are off the table.. .
Bailey/ What questions do you have?
Lombardo/ ...or not. Well, tonight's discussion wasn't I guess wasn't intending on going in that
direction with it, but are there particular service areas that are not to be considered?
Police? Fire?
Champion/ (several talking)
Correia/ I'll say for example...let's say for example...uh, the Police Chief says 1 % cut would
mean...recommend cutting that 1% from school crossing guards. This is what the impact
would be. This is where, some ideas where we could still, um.. .
Bailey/ This is what it costs to put in those stop...
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Correia/ ...we could do these stops instead, one-time cost, I mean, I think those are the types of
things.
Bailey/ (both talking) under those circumstances I might cut police, right.
Wright/ A 5% cut would mean this and this and this.
Correia/ Right! And...and you know...
Bailey/ So it's hard to say.
Correia/ There'd be that type of context.
Hayek/ And...and it does allow the individual department to, which by the way has the best
knowledge of the services (several talking)
Correia/ Right!
Hayek/ Yeah, that makes sense.
Lombardo/ So we have...when is the discussion for the fee study scheduled for?
O'Malley/ Uh, the middle of May.
Champion/ We have department heads here. They might have some idea right off the top of their
head...what a 5% cut would look like.
O'Donnell/ I wouldn't want to put 'em (several talking)
Wilburn/ I wouldn't say tonight, but I mean we in effect are putting them on the spot by asking
for what's a 5% reduction because if it's a service or it's going to involve personnel, so
they are going to identifying, if that's the route Council wishes to go.
Bailey/ Eleanor, you had a question or comment?
Dilkes/ I just...I hate to be the naysayer here, but I'm trying to figure out as I'm thinking how I'm
going to do this in my own department and it maybe different whether you've got an
internal support department or you've got an external service department. You know, I
can tell you right now that if you want to 3% cut out of my department, it's got to come
from personnel. I can't then take the next step and say, I'm going to reduce representation
of Planning or Housing and Inspection or Animal Control, when I don't know what cuts
are, you know, what cuts are going to come from the external services. Do you see what
I mean? (several responding) So, I think the...the, this, I mean, I kind of understand
where you're going in terms of you're trying to like say, tell us what those cuts would
look like in order to get to the policy decisions almost, but someone, we've got to
somehow structure that...dis...that, um, discussion and what exact information we're
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going to be giving you. And that may, again, be different between external services and
inside support.
Wilburn/ And that's one example of a parameter that I was, the parameters that folks wanted to
impose (mumbled) another parameter was, um, Council's not interested in outsourcing.
Bailey/ Well, you know, I was one of those people who said I wasn't interested necessarily in
discussing it, but when I look at our internal services accounts, I wonder, I mean, because
that has a huge impact on departments and that might be a way that somebody gets their
1% cut, if for example, our IT didn't cost, or some of these didn't cost as much. I...I don't
know. I'm not sure I fully understand the impact internally to departments, and so...I'm
not so sure that I wouldn't be open to having that discussion to understand exactly what
you were trying to get at tonight is what am I saying no to. If that makes sense. So...but
I don't know if others are willing to open that up, back up, because I know you said no,
you said you were interested in it.
Champion/ I'm interested in looking at anything that might work.
Correia/ And again, I think that we, I mean, I go back to the department heads and staff are at, in
the best position to be able to say we could give up doing this, or...or if we gave up doing
this (both talking)
Bailey/ This would be the impact on customer service.
Correia/ ...on customer service, on our, on our residents, on...I mean, I guess...hard for me, I
mean, we could say, so if Rec division says we could give up doing summer camp
programs or, you know, spring break camp programs, um, this would be with a savings,
but this, you know, we can, you know, they accept child care assistance, it's inexpensive,
we have, you know, Johnson County is the greatest percentage of...of parents in the work
force so they need childcare. So I mean, I think that then, those are, that's the context
around that.
Lombardo/ And therein lies...the dilemma, because...they're offering up, based on what
guidance, um, we...we think we can give up X, and then you know, it's up to you all to
determine, yeah, we can live with that or not. That...therein lies the challenge. Is that,
you know, from a staff s perspective, there is no broad framework for knowing where to
make those suggestions from. So, even in a department, such as Parks and Rec. They
have a myriad of programs. Which ones are...are reasonable to offer up, and...and from
what I'm hearing here is...any of them are fair game, but depending on the broad policy
framework that you're going to decide in the moment then, then it...that puts a lot of
burden on...on staff to be able to, I mean, so then if that's not...if that's not desirous then
what do we come back with next? So, I...I, if...if to make this happen you need
recommendations from me, then I'd like to work on the revenue side and see how much
of the gap you'd be willing to close on the revenue side, um, I...this is...this is a different
process than...than what we set out to do, and so I'd have to...I've got to spend some time
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thinking about what additional questions do I need to ask you all to answer, um, to be
able to come back with those recommendations.
Correial (several talking) you see the school district going through lots of internal processes.
They're having meetings at the staff level. At the University I know...UHC, at the
management and staff level lots of those internal conversations - we have this money
that...that we have to cut out of our budget. How do we do that, and you have then
that...those employees in those organizations coming up with scenarios. So maybe a
department says we can cut 1% if all non-bargaining employees don't...don't take a raise
over the next, I mean, or all persons...that could be something that comes internally. I
know from talking with a doc at the UIHC that's something that, you know, high level
staff at UHC are, you know, freezing salaries over a period of time to help, you know,
maintain the financial health of the organization. So I mean I think that there's a role for
departments to decide within their departments how they want to identify. We know that
we have to have, I mean, we need to cut expenses. I don't know that we can think that we
could raise a million dollars in revenue over the next five years every year to...to cut
that.. .
Champion/ And I didn't think it's always a policy decision, I mean, if we ask Parks and Rec to
cut out programs that equal 5%, those programs aren't policy. That's what Parks and Rec
decided to do. We don't approve every program. Or disapprove every program. I mean,
I think they have a right to say, well, this one isn't very well attended, um, this one's
being duplicated in the School District. Um, or privatization of...um, soccer and all that
stuff is gone huge and there's a lot of private soccer, basketball, volleyball clubs, uh,
they're expensive, but I mean I don't think that's a policy decision. We don't approve all
those programs. Senior Center, we don't approve their programs.
Wilburn/ But there are in some programs there are political implications to, for example, if
we...if, uh, the suggestion comes back to get rid of the leaf collecting program, uh, there
are both, um, fiscal things related to that. There's other areas that are impacted, uh, storm
sewer, in terms of perhaps (mumbled) in there, um, but some folks, uh, have come to
really enjoy, depend on that. If that vanishes then there may be a push to start leaf
burning again. So there are, you know, even within, uh, well, for example, the School
District is not, uh, for the most part, is not doing summer school, and so if there are fewer
Parks and Rec services that Amy was suggesting, then there...there are political, there's
political push-back to that then.
Correia/ Not...I mean, using that example (mumbled) political perspective, I mean, there's
potential negative...
Wilburn/ Consequences.
Correia/ ...consequences of not having, I mean, positively engaged in community (mumbled)
Bailey/ It will cost us in another area, is what you're saying.
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Correia/ Yes, exactly!
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Hayek/ But I would think that would all be part of the (several talking) analysis of the... and what
strikes me is that the model we're discussing here to...to reach this cost savings, is unlike
the model we follow for pretty much everything else we do as a Council, and that model
is we...we see things generally in written form that have been vetted thoroughly by
commissions, staff, and you know, the other actors who come together and...and come
up with a set of recommendations, concise recommendations, because this is a volunteer,
very, very part-time group. We're not, you know, full time commissioners, um, and then
we...we make as informed a decision as we can, based on the information provided to us,
and if there's follow up information we request that and get that, and defer the action.
Um, and I think that's one of the reasons we're, this is bogging down, because we're
departing from that general structure. (several responding)
Bailey/ Exactly right!
Champion/ (mumbled)
Wright/ Somebody'd notice!
Champion/ You think they would?
Bailey/ (mumbled)
Champion/ What about...
Bailey/ You're off mic, Connie! (laughter)
O'Donnell/ But it's a good idea!
Bailey/ For her to be off mic?
O'Donnell/ What's that? (laughter) You know, Ross brought up the leaf pickup, you know, in
priority it's what's most important we feel to the City. Um, you don't want to get in a
situation where services decrease, and expenses increase. And, you know, I'm looking, I
was looking at leaf pickup. I don't know what a animal patrol officer does, what do they
do? Just drive around and look for animals? What is that? (laughter) (several talking)
Bailey/ Misha, you're going to have to answer (mumbled)
O'Donnell/ But that's $25,000, and we...we still spend over $50,000 to kill deer. I mean, that's...
Goodman/ That's your cut right there!
O'Donnell/ What's that?
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Goodman/ I recommended that cut years ago. Um, animal control officers, animal service
officers handle all the animal complaints that come in to the City, to the police
department, to us, directly. Animals at large, welfare investigations, cruelty
investigations, um, we respond and assist the County. They pay us for that, for
investigations in the County that come up, um, impounding, wildlife management which
as noted on that can be done by an agency that currently exists in Iowa City. Um, it
wouldn't save us a whole lot of money, but it would save us some patrol time out there,
and uh, answering calls for wildlife. Um, does that answer your question, well enough?
O'Donnell/ Yeah, the patrol officer handles complaints and so forth.
Goodman/ Yes.
O'Donnell/ Picks up, okay, fine. Yes. (mumbled)
Lombardo/ So, are there any areas that are strictly off the table or would you entertain
recommendations in any area?
Champion/ Well, do we need a recommendation...we don't probably need a recommendation
from the Landfill -it's self-sustaining.
Bailey/ Well, we don't have any enterprise funds in here (several talking)
Champion/ well those things are off the table.. .
Bailey/ We're going to keep seven Council Members, right? (several talking and laughing)
Yeah, maybe five would be cheaper!
O'Donnell/ Public safety has to be off the table.
Wright/ No, it doesn't.
O'Donnell/ Well, I don't know how we...
Wright/ I think everything needs to be on the table for discussion, even if it's just what we end up
rejecting.
Bailey/ If they decide, for example, to cut the crossing guards plus some similar services like
that, I don't, I mean, I think we've talked about that being something we would explore,
so technically they're not off the table.
Lombardo/ So not general patrol.
Bailey/ It depends upon what the department said, I think is what we said. Tell us what 5%
would impact on general patrol, and then...
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Correia/ I would imagine the Police Chief s not going to use a scenario.
Bailey/ I would imagine (both talking)
Correia/ I"mean, I think that's where we're asking the department heads to give us (mumbled) it
may...I think we're, in order to make policy decision, we need to have information in
front of us of what ramifications of any decision would be. I mean, we could say
everybody has a 5% cut and then they come up with it and then that's it, or we say what
are...what is a one, three, or five or one, two, or five or however we want to be able to
have those, so that it's not across the board. We have context to, this is what a 1% cut
means here, so we can say, in this department we cannot even consider a 1 % cut, because
of public safety we can't consider that, so that...but then we have the information and the
process to be able to explain, if people say to us, somebody says, well, why'd you cut this
and not this - we can, we would have context of information and...and a foundation to
that decision. (both talking) big decision.
Bailey/ ..to take this and turn it into information that's frank. I mean, it...that discusses these
kinds of topics, and what the impact would be, broadly in the community, on these kind
of, you know, on potential cuts.
Lombardo/ So then...so then, you're looking for information from each department, uh, on
various levels of...of cuts, what that would mean for their department, as opposed to a
specific recommendation from me.
Bailey/ No. We're looking for a recommendation from you, using that information from the
departments. Aren't we? That's how we usually...I mean, the department information
could be background data, but I think you...you need to make a recommendation to us.
O'Donnell/ Compiling information.
Bailey/ yeah, yeah, we could have the compiled information, with your recommendation, based
upon that, and then we'll have that further information to be able to discuss.
Lombardo/ Lacking...a strategic plan, what I guess policy guidance am I to use in making that
recommendation?
Champion/ (mumbled) always be changed. Matter of a 4-3 vote.
Wright/ Well, and I'm thinking in terms of, L ..I'm not completely familiar with the budget, the
way the budget process works at other organizations, but um, at the University my
understanding is the various means is that here are three potential cuts. Tell us what
these mean, you know, perhaps just give us your worst case scenario, and then we can
back off from there, but I believe that information, I don't know where it's gone yet
because nothing has come up. I believe that information went to the Provost's office, for
analysis. What would be acceptable cuts, what would be, you know, what areas are not
acceptable, what's protected...
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Bailey/ Generally this Council has talked about valuing customer service, and citizen access.
That seems, I don't think that's completely off the table, but that seems to be a general
principle. Right? (several responding)
Champion/ I mean, we know we're going to have to look at something more than (mumbled)
Bailey/Yes.
Champion/ I mean, we're going to have to make some serious cuts here, but I do need to know
the (mumbled) um, what if we cut...oh, I'm sorry. What if we cut all the funding to the
Library for books? I mean, you know, what are the implications for that?
Wright/ Susan would throw a rock at you to start with!
Champion/ I know, but she's (mumbled) an example.
Correia/ Except we don't tell the Library what to do with the money (several talking)
Bailey/ Right. (several talking)
Champion/ No, we actually have a fund we give them for books.
Correia/ They have a (mumbled) set aside money we give them (mumbled)
Champion/ Well, it's in our budget, in that budget.
Wright/ They're under a Board of Trustees (several talking)
Correial ...we have this context of their budget in our books, but essentially we.. .
Karr/ Amy.
Champion/ They do what they want with it.
Correia/ ...decide how to use it.
Bailey/ Clip those on and leave those on! (laughter) It's okay! We'11 listen to you...
Champion/ So, I mean, I'm just throwing that out, I mean. If...if we cut the Library by 5%,
maybe they'll come back with, well, we're going to have that much left or...
Bailey/ We'll be closed on Saturdays.
Champion/ Or we'll be closed on Saturday, well, they wouldn't do that. They might, cause they
irritate me, but the other, you know, would...would they rather have their programs, I
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mean, because the programs are terrific and really well attended. So is that more
important than having more books, or would they rather have less programs and have
more books, so I'm just using the Library as an example. I don't have any idea of what
they would.. .
Bailey/ But then we're not having that dialog directly. Michael will decide if that's a
recommendation that he could make, to close the Library on Saturdays.
Champion/ Well, I wouldn't support that.
Bailey/ As an example...well, right! But that's what I'm saying, I mean, but that's...that's what
Mike was saying. I think it's a system that, because otherwise we're going to be...it kind
of skips part of the budget process. The departments are coming right to us. Cause I'm
trying to respect the system that we (both talking)
Lombardo/ ...there's still a piece missing, but...but to be able to get past that I think what we
need to do is...is to provide at different levels in each department what different cuts
would look like, and then use that as a point of...I still think you all need to have broader
discussions about that, in...in terms of sorting through what...what are appropriate cuts
or not. Again, my recommendation to you would be based on kind of my own thoughts
about what the community, I mean, I'm making a value judgment, and that's where I...so
I think...I think there has to be, you know, some type of an alignment. I think we can
provide you that information from which to work off of, but I'm not...I'm not certain that
the broad context for me making those recommendations is...is fully there.
Bailey/ But you have a long, a staff who has been here a very long time who can also give you
some of those, that context, of what's valuable to the community, and what has worked. I
mean.. .
Lombardo/ (mumbled) we'll step into it together. I think, yes, I appreciate that, but still
there...there are value judgments that are putting, you know, our...our judgment before
yours, and I don't want to get ahead of Council. I want to make sure that you all are part
of that decision-making. So.. .
Hayek/ I don't have a problem with...with value judgments being made at the staff level. I think
that happens every day of the week, and...and um, you know, I would...I would want
value or...or your sense of values or whoever's making these...these calls at the staff
level to inject values into, uh, into a set of recommendations, and then we ultimately have
to chose between difficult options. Um, and that, I think that's where it shifts to the so-
calledpolitical level, cause we're the ones who are going to have to...to make the
difficult, you know, final calls, um, so...otherwise we're...we're starting from whole
cloth, and uh, I just...I don't see it happening.
Bailey/ Well, and I don't...I don't think...it's not our role and I don't think it's a good precedence
to set in approaching the budget, and...or any decision.
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Lombardo/ Again, you know, this is not provided to get into line item discussions. Again, it's
meant to provide a.. .
Hayek/ No, and I understand that. I understand that.
Bailey/ Well, I think it's going to be very useful background, and we can build on this, I mean,
we'll have...we'll have the detail so when we have those questions it's right in front of us,
but I think (both talking)
Hayek/ ...this is a reference guide, I mean, that's helpful information to me. Um...
Bailey/ We need to...build up from this.
Lombardo/ I do think though having the revenue discussion is...is going to be valuable. I mean,
that really gives us some idea of...of what it is, you know, we have to do on the
expenditure side, and um, that will...we'll work on parallel tracks. I'm not suggesting we
focus fully on revenue and then come back. We'll begin this process...
Hayek/ I think one major piece of information you need is what are we doing about the fire
station. Because if that's where we're going, our number just went from a million to a
million...seven?
Bailey/ Pretty much what got us here (mumbled) getting us here.
Hayek/ (mumbled) we don't want to do this twice, right?
Wright/ I'm sorry?
Hayek/ We don't want to come up with a million dollars in cuts and then two months later
decide, oops, we need another three-quarters of a million dollars. Um...I don't know how
we fit that into this, but it seems to me we can't...we can't avoid that.
Champion/ Well, the question in my head to be asked: can we in any way, shape or form fund
nine firemen? I mean, that's going to have to be a question that's going to have to be
asked, as we go through this process. How much would we have to cut? Is it possible to
cut enough to even fund nine firemen? And that's...that's aquestion that's going to have
to be asked, and answered. (several responding)
Hayek/ Well, of course it's possible, hundreds of employees, but at what cost and what (several
talking) what's the impact.
Bailey/ Well, and are you suggesting we answer that now, or see scenarios in both cases? What's
the impact, for example. I think perhaps is a...I don't want to say easier, but a more real
discussion for us to have.
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Correia/ I think we can see, I mean, I think that it can be built into the process, I mean, I think if
given the...the extent to which you would need to cut or reduce in different departments
by a percent to get fire station at this you would have, what...what does that mean?
Bailey/ What does that look like.
Correia/ What does that look like, right. I think we...I think that's...
Wright/ We know what the numbers are.
Correia/ Yeah, we need to have that as part of this analysis.
Champion/ Can we tax alcohol sales?
Bailey/ Can we tax alcohol sales, Eleanor?
Dilkes/ No.
Bailey/ (laughter) Thank you!
Correia/ We can't really tax anything can we, except (mumbled)
Wilburn/ I have another question (several talking)
Champion/ Can we put a service fee on alcohol serving?
Dilkes/ On alcohol serving?
Champion/ Yeah. A serving fee. For every...alcohol...
Hayek/ Call that a cover charge! (several talking and laughing)
Dilkes/ I meant, what service are we providing there?
Champion/ An access fee to get to the Plaza! (laughter)
Correia/ For the business.
Dilkes/ That's creative, Connie. (several talking)
Karr/ I think one thing we talked about with liquor when you talked about alcohol and liquor
before, we've indicated before that we cannot charge for something that is not more than
what we deliver right now. What are we giving them for it? Our time is...is paid so what
are we giving them. What additional service will we provide for the fee generated.
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Dilkes/ Or what benefit are we providing, or there are some circumstances in which the
legislature gives us the authority to go beyond that. For instance, right now legislature is
debating the whole franchise fee issue. We know that's in litigation. We don't know
what the outcome of that's going to be. Legislator, you know, legislature could if we
were so lucky decide to authorize a percentage franchise fee, um, so you know, those are
possibilities out there, but generally, absent that kind of authorization from the
legislature, we're looking at what benefit do we provide, what service do we provide, and
what's the cost of that. Or...then of course there's penalties, like parking, you know,
parking penalties and traffic citations, etc.
Champion/ So there's no way we can tax or have a fee on.. .
Dilkes/ Don't even say tax! Because tax is, we can't tax.
Champion/ Okay! On police services for establishments that serve alcohol. It takes a lot of our
police time. (mumbled)
Bailey/ So, are you suggesting that our liquor license, the cost of our liquor license goes up to
reflect some of our costs of (several talking)
Dilkes/ The liquor license cannot. That's been litigated. The second Des Moines tried that, and
Supreme Court said no. So we can't tag on another amount of money to the liquor
license.
Karr/ The State does liquor licensing and they establish the fee. The cities don't liquor license.
Champion/ Okay.
Dilkes/ You know, I do think that, I think Cedar Rapids, as I understand it, recently has gone
through a fee analysis of...are there services that we're providing that we are not...that
can, you can link up to a particular cost that we're not charging for, and so I think there
maybe some and that presumably will be part of the fee study.
Correia/ The one they talked about was the fire.. .
Bailey/ ...fire business inspection.
Correia/ ...for commercial businesses.
Bailey/ ...brought that up.
Champion/ Uh-huh.
Dilkes/ Certainly fire inspections that are not...that are not connected to the liquor license.
Correia/ Right.
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Bailey/ And you'll be looking at that on the revenue side. (mumbled) Okay.
Wilburn/ Another question for Doug, if you...could, um, this is, um, borderline getting into line
items again, but just for my information, um, how are we coming on the...um, I think it
was ahalf-million for loan program for, uh, A2 sprinkler. Are we getting applications for
those? Is that being.. .
Boothroy/ I believe we've approved three applications, is that correct? Um...
O'Malley/ Correct. We've got one more in the pipeline.
Boothroy/ One in the pipeline, and I talked to, um, somebody, uh, recently and...and should be
coming in this summer, uh, for another one, so...uh...
Wilburn/ Okay, all right.
Boothroy/ So what...we're doing okay, and I think that, uh...the most recent one was just, uh, on
Washington Street. They were tearing the street up for, uh, 620, uh.. .
Bailey/ 126.
Boothroy/ 126, excuse me.
Correia/ Is that why they're tearing that up, for the sprinkler?
Boothroy/ They're, uh, expanding that business and they're...they're taking over the upstairs and
they're sprinkling the entire building. So...
Wilburn/ And was that General Fund that we pulled that out of?
O'Malley/ That's actually a loan from the Landfill, and it'll be paid back on the fees on
(mumbled) on these loan fees (mumbled) from the individual.
Wilburn/ Okay. All right.
O'Malley/ Passed through the General Fund.
Wilburn/ All right.
Lombardo/ I think I have enough to get us started. Um, maybe questions along the way as we're
working through this that I'll want some direction for as we work through it, but um, I
think the revenue piece is going to be a big piece of the next kind of thing we discuss, and
then other clarification type questions as we...we start refining.
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Wilburn/ I would have another question for, uh, this would be for, just department heads in
general. Um, if this is the route that Council's going to go, in terms of um, a percentage
cut, in your department what it might look like. Are there any parameters that you are
needing guidance on, that would be helpful for you, if any...any department head, uh,
Eleanor started getting into...how she would...how she would even go about doing that,
so I guess just open it up - is there any...guidance you would (mumbled). Okay.
Boothroy/ I would assume that...that you could do fee increases to offset the 1%, 2%, or 3...or
5%, as an alternative. So it's not just cutting. It maybe generating revenue.
Wilburn/ I guess that's a question for Council then. Is...if Council's not willing to consider in
housing.. .
Boothroy/ It'd be a recommendation (mumbled) do you understand what I'm...
Wilburn/ I understand what you're saying, yeah.
Boothroy/ Some services, such as like the police department or even...even our services,
are...are mandated services. So, and then there are some, like the zoning ordinance, that
are not, but...um, I would like to be able to have as much flexibility in terms of looking
at either fee increases or just different ways of getting there. Not just cuts.
Champion/ I'd look at anything (mumbled) (several talking)
Bailey/ (mumbled)
Boothroy/ Be as creative as possible.
Wilburn/ Thank you. (several talking) (laughter)
Champion/ Come on! Be brave!
Wilburn/ And I...I realize this is...um, uncomfortable exercise, but I appreciate, you know, if
there's further clarification.. .
Craig/ Well, I've been sitting back there thinking about, you know, 1%, 3%, 5% and I just...I
mean I...what I wanted you to think about, and I'm sure Kevin is sitting here running
numbers in his head because he knows them all, I mean, does 5% get you where you need
to go?
Champion/ We don't know.
Craig/ And if it...if it doesn't, when we're talking a 5% cut, we're talking personnel, and I'm
going to have to go to my staff and say okay, whose job's on the line, and that raises the
anxiety level quite high, and if it's just an exercise...I just want you to understand what it
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special priority-setting work session meeting of April 13, 2009.
April 13, 2009 City Council Page 36
means, within the organization, to go do that, and if that's how we get to where we need
to be, that's my job?
Bailey/ Well, I'm assuming that Kevin and, you know, along with the City Manager will look at
if those kinds of scenarios will get us, and will give you all some broad parameters before
you go in...this is not...this is not a drill!
Craig/ Right!
Bailey/ And so I'm assuming that the guidance and the number crunching will occur, before you,
I mean, were others assuming similar -before the, you know, you all go into your
departments? Because you're right - we have to know (several talking)
O'Malley/ Off the top of my head, I think it's about 2% to balance the budget (several talking) to
get to the $1 million.
Wright/ To get to the $1 million (several talking)
O'Malley/ ...the fire station you're talking another percent and a half.
Bailey/ Okay (several talking) so I think, yeah, I think those broad parameters, before you know,
once again...
O'Ma11ey/ ... a combination of revenue and expense (mumbled)
Bailey/ Eleanor?
Dilkes/ But, but I think what Susan just said gets to my point earlier. Do you want us to say a
3% cut in my department will require personnel, or do you want us to then say, and I...if
I had to cut personnel would cut...now you're going to say it as a particular service, but
that service is likely identified with a particular individual. So that...that's why I don't
think we're clear...what, how far down we're going. I mean, I'm assuming if Susan says
a 3% will require a cut in personnel, and then you...we come back to you and or to
Michael and you know he's got 3% from t he Library requires personnel, and 3% from
City Attorney requires personnel, and 3% from fire requires personnel - then is he going
to recommend some scenarios to you, that then you're going to pick from, and then we're
going to decide what particular services or jobs go, or is that all part of the first question?
I don't...I don't know how, I've never...you know, I don't know how this all is supposed
to work, but...
Champion/ I don't know either, Eleanor, but I'm telling you that we can't do a 3% pay cut, I mean
a 3% budget cut, without getting rid of some personnel.
Dilkes/ I understand that. I understand that, but...and I'm just trying to be clear about what we're
doing.
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April 13, 2009 City Council Page 37
Correial I guess L ..I would think, I mean, and I certainly am sensitive to the difficulty of this for
all the departments, and I...I... and don't want it to be something that is an exercise that
we do nothing with that creates all sorts of upheaval, for nothing. I mean, I think that that
is not...not something that I think we want, um, to...to be doing. Given that, you know,
we have this $1 to $1.5 million to cut, I mean, I think that that means that there will be
decreases in the organization and decreases in staff, and I don't think that departments
want us to say this, identifying which particular service or staff from a hat. I mean, I
think that I want to know what...what a scenario is...3...3.5% cut means, you know, a
cut that on some level is identified at the department level what would go. Community
Planning and Development, I mean, I don't know what...um, if that's an example, I
don't...I mean (mumbled)
Dilkes/ So what you're...it sounds to me like what you're saying is you do want that second
level. You want, that will be a personnel cut, and I would likely cut, chose this particular
service. L ..I think we just want to know what it is (both talking)
Correia/ I think...I think so.
Wright/ I think we have to go down to that level of specificity.
Dilkes/ I think we can do it if we know what we're supposed to do!
Champion/ Well, it's going to be...it's difficult, but it's even more difficult for us when we don't
even know if (mumbled) 5% cut, I don't know what you're going to do about it. It might
be something I'm not willing to give up, or we as a Council, aren't willing to give up.
(mumbled) Susan says she's going to close the Library on Saturday, oh she would never
say that, but we probably would not support that, and don't say it because you know I
won't support it! (laughter)
Bailey/ But I think we...I think we do have to understand a very specific impact, and therefore, I
think...we need to understand that level. (several responding)
Champion/ What if we cut somebody out of Planning and Zoning, I don't know what
implications that's going to have! I mean, building things are way down, but I know they
do a lot of other things. Will we have to give up district planning for a while, I mean, I
think we have to have something to react to. We're really not professionals. We're not.
We're just lay people here trying to make a decision. And I could make cuts in my
business. I do it. And sometimes it's a job that I'm cutting out.
Lombardo/ Other questions of staff?
Champion/ But until we have something to react to, this is a waste of our time. Ten years!
Hayek/ I don't have any further questions. (several responding)
Bailey/ I don't either. I appreciate all the preparation that went into this, staff!
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
special priority-setting work session meeting of Apri113, 2009.
April 13, 2009 City Council
Wright/ Thank you very much. This is useful. It was not for nothing.
Bailey/ Yeah, it's a beginning of (mumbled)
Hayek/ Thank you.
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This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council
special priority-setting work session meeting of April 13, 2009.