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HomeMy WebLinkAbout1996-02-13 TranscriptionFebruary 13, 1996 Council Work Session 6:00 PM Council: Nov, Kubby, Lehman, Norton, Thornberry, Vanderhoef, Baker (6:35 PM). Staff: Atkins, Helling, Woito, Karr, Franklin, Davidson, Fosse, Winstead, Robinson, Schoon. Tapes: 96-25, All. Review Zoning Matters 96-25 S1 ITEM NO. $a. Consider setting a public hearing for February 27 on an ordinance amending Title 14, Chapter 6, "Zoning," Article H, "Industrial Zones," to allow the outdoor storage of recyclable materials in the I-1 zone as an accessory use to a recycling processing facility by special exception. Franklin/ ITEM NO. 6b. Consider setting a public hearing for February 27 on an ordinance amending Title 14, Chapter 6, "Zoning," to allow temporary real estate sales centers in residential zones. Franklin/ The second is to allow temporary real estate sales centers in residential zones. This is for within a model home that a developer would be able to have a sales center in that particular home. Kubby/ I would like to hear some feedback from neighborhood associations .... Franklin/ On temporary real estate? Kubby/ Yeah... doesn't seem like a big deal. Just to hear feedback from neighborhoods where these offices might be .... sales centers. Franklin/ It could be anywhere there is a new subdivision. Nov/ And it may or may not be in an established neighborhood. Kubby/ In general ..... to hear from feedback... Franklin/ They all get council agenda...the association. So we can just have Marcia flag that. Thornberry/ I would guess... this would be for new housing This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of February 13, 1996. W$021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 2 development. Kubby/ Norton/ I think it has to be in dwelling but I have seen them in garages. Franklin/ A dwelling... assuming is an attached garage .... That is generally what happens is they just be it in the garage for the interim. ITF~X NO. 6c. Consider setting a public hearing for February 27 on an ordinance amending the Conditional Zoning Agreement for the D&L Subdivision, located southeast of the intersection of Highway 1 and Sunset Street, to eliminate the requirement to provide access to property to the south. Franklin/ The third item is to set p.h .... ordinance amending CZA for D&L Subdivision. This is the subdivision that included Mennards and at the time we did the subdivision we made accommodation for a road to service the airport property ..... Now the airport is going to be where it is so we don't need that access any longer. Nov/ Karin, there is some potential development on airport property for commercial uses. Is this road really not going to be needed anymore? Franklin/ Yes, this road is really not going to be needed anymore. Those commercial areas are to the east. This property is at the very western extreme of the airport property and basically it is between the Willow Creek Channel and the end of Runway 6/24. Kubby/ Is there going to be access to the northeasterly portion where those commercial lots might be? Franklin/ This is only for access to the south-southwest. Kubby/ Franklin/ The easterly one which would take you from Mennards east towards Westport Plaza, that access easement is still there on the property and will allow for the continuation of that what we call backage road ..... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of February 13, 1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 3 ITEM NO. 6d. Public hearing on an ordinance amending Title 14, Chapter 6, entitled "Zoning," Article K, entitled "Environmental Regulations,', Section 1, entitled "Sensitive Areas Ordinance," Subsection I, entitled "Steep Slopes," to allow consideration of development activities within areas containing previously altered slopes. Franklin/ A p.h. on an amendment to the Sensitive Areas Ordinance. This is to allow consideration of development activities within areas containing previously altered slopes. We talked about this a little bit at your last work session. The language is in the packet ..... with a protected slope which is 40% or greater in grade, if that slope is an altered slope, it was created by either cut or fill by people ..... Then we will consider a development plan that would encroach into that slope. It still requires staff review, P/Z review and city council review as you will see in the next item. Norton/ Who decides if it is altered? Franklin/ When it comes into the staff, we will do an evaluation of that. There will have to be some demonstration that it is altered ..... very obvious or some history... The first question we will ask...whether it is a natural slope or an altered slope. We are not going to just take hearsay. Norton/ But we don't need the statement in there in the judgement of the staff? Woito/ No, no you don't. You don't want that in there. Norton/ Woito/ It would be ultimately up to a design engineer .... if push came to a shove it would be up to a geetechnical engineer. Franklin/ If there is a question, it would have to be proven. It is not going to be a judgement question. Whether it is altered or not is factual. The only judgement that comes into this in terms of the commission and the council is whether there are attributes of this altered slope that are worthy of preservation. That is the judgement part and why do you review it. Kubby/ So how does the staff respond to Sandy's comments about trying to have the ordinance be flexible and yet objective as This represents only ereasonably accurate transcription ofthelowa Citycouncil meeting of Februa~ 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 4 possible using standards that are very-They are there or they are not and moving towards a slightly more subjective method Franklin/ That particular perspective is one of judgement, too ..... rather than just refer to the intent of the steep slope section .... that we refer to the intent of the Sensitive Areas Ordinance as a whole ..... that is where you hit the middle ground ..... The important point .... is that there is still very close scrutiny of these projects .... Vanderhoef/ Something else .... what might be in those man-mades and how much of it is fill. How can we test for it and if we do- does this slow down the project... increasing cost to the project? Franklin/ We require that an engineer certify that this slope will be stable and the surrounding slope will remain stable if this construction is to take place. In terms of the issue of hazardous waste .... whenever you have any construction project at all. There may be, in an altered slope, in any ground that is fill. They may be in ground that is a mix of fill and never been touched. When you are in an urban area, it is very unusual that you are going to find ground that has never been touched... old farm ground will often contain buried treasures .... If we are going to address that particular issue, it is an issue that would be a concern generally in the development process and not just when we are talking about altered slopes ..... There are certain requirements now when you convey property that you have to make statements ..... environmental hazards .... I think the larger point is that it is a concern with any construction if it is a concern with altered slopes. Kubby/ So it is up to the developer to point out that it is altered and to show that... that it is an altered slope. It is not the city's onus to show that it is not a natural slope? Franklin/ That is right. Thornberry/ Again, on this issue ..... It was made very clear... this ordinance is not set in stone that you have got to do this, period .... This is a guideline, right? Franklin/ It is a law. Thornberry/ Thisrepresents only areasonably accurate transcription ofthelowa City council meeting of Februew 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 5 Franklin/ There is some flexibility in some parts of it. The attempt was to design standards that were reasonable .... balancing... With anything that we do there is some judgement that comes into play here in terms of how it applies, how strictly it applies. But it is not a guideline, it is a law .... Thornberry/ There was a conversation about that. Franklin/ The guideline part has to do with development within sensitive areas under Sensitive Areas Development Plans where there is discussion of possibilities of having narrower streets, having alleys. It was how the development would occur. Those are definitely guidelines. They are not requirements ..... There are provisions in which you can reduce the buffer, for instance .... But you have to show certain things if you do want to reduce it. So in that there is some flexibility. Thornberry/ ...given that this is a law in Iowa City and a house that is built on a hillside right now burns down, would it be able to rebuilt as another house? Franklin/ Yes ..... s.f. homes are given a lot of latitude in here. So yes, you could rebuild it. If you could look at the language that has been proposed, the P/Z Commission inserted ,some language ... we don't think it such a good idea. Page 2 of the ordinance and the bold type indicates the amended language ...... The problem is it reads, "Development activities may be allowed within areas ..... by cutting or filling activities." The troublesome language is the "including but not limited to". I talked with Bob and Bob has talked to Dick Gibson .... didn't have a problem with deleting it. What that says is that it is not just slopes created by cutting or filling activities but other altered protected slopes. We can think of an instance in which you would have an altered slope that was not created by either cutting or filling. Woito/ Karin, I talked to Sarah .... I asked her why we didn't define altered slope and she said you talked about it at staff and she was talked out of it at the time and I think that was a mistake. I think we need to go back. Franklin/ It was defined in the original in which it said "containing altered protected slopes," ..... Thisrepresents only areasonably accuratetranscription oftbelows City council meeting of February 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 council Work Session Page 6 Woito/ I am talking about put it in the definition section what an altered slope is. Then you don't have all of this muddle. Franklin/ Okay. I don't care how but I don't think this works. Woito/ I agree. I don't like it. I can answer your question, Dee, on the slope. Yes, you would bore. Yes, you will slow down the project somewhat but no more than any other grading and filling project ..... They can tell what is in there. Vanderhoef/ Kubby/ Woito/ An engineer, I am not going to tell them how to do their job ...... Franklin/ I would suggest that you continue the p.h. so we can change this and then you can have first consideration with the continued p.h. next week .... Norton/ Franklin/ Go ahead and hold the hearing continue it ..... correct language p.h. tonight but then you can by the time you end your Norton/ Franklin/ Woito/ It will be claritive. Franklin/ ITEM NO. 6e. Public hearing on an ordinance amending the Zoning Chapter by approving a Sensitive Areas Development Plan and changing the use regulations from PRM, Planned High Density Multi-Family Residential Zone, to PRM-OSA, Planned High Density Multi-family Residential - Sensitive Areas Overlay Zone for a 0.32 acre property located at 517 S. Linn Street. Franklin/ Your next p.h. is on particular circumstance in which this amendment would apply and this is a for a project at 517 South Linn Street. (Refers to overhead projector map) ..... The building would encroach into the slope ..... that would require Thisrepresents only areaeonably accuratetranscription ofthelowe City council meeting of February 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 7 excavation of that portion of the slope. This plan has been certified by Chris Stephan of MMS Consultants. The top elevation is the building that would be visible from Linn Street and then the lower elevation would be visible from the property immediately south ...... (refers to map) ..... There will be a swale that will bring water around this part of the building. There will be another one that will bring it around the back of the building on the other side. Kubby/ So then where does that water flow? From the swale to where? Franklin/ The water that is coming from this swale (refers to map) would be directed down towards the street and go into the sewer system. This swale (refers to map) .... go onto the adjacent property. the water flow... velocity .... would be less than what it is in the natural state. Chris, would you like to add to that? Chris Stephan/ (Can't hear). Woito/ You are not going to be dumping water onto the property where it doesn't already run? Are you changing the drainage on that left side? Stephan/ The drainage already goes to that south property. So it is still going there. Kubby/ Stephan/ Here we are looking at the back side of the building. I have got three cross sections here .... (Refers to map) .... It doesn't show here but the existing contours on this lot .... all the water south of this line actually goes on to the lot to the south at the present time. I don't feel like I am diverting any additional water onto this property .... In fact I am cutting off any of the water that is coming from the property north of me and falling into this driveway and being carried out to the street as well. Kubby/ Will you describe swale? Stephan/ If I may put some cross sections on the board here. (Presents cross sections on handouts). There is the swale that we are talking about .... We are going to add some fill to create the swale .... I have the two other cross sections that I can show you as well .... The drainage that is coming off of this slope doesn't run up against the building .... Thisrepresents only areasonably accuratetranscription ofthelowa City council meeting ofFeb~ua~ 13.1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 8 Norton/ Won't get tile in the bottom of that swale? Stephan/ I am sure we will have some tile around the building itself .... Kubby/ Seems like those swales will get filled up over time from soil ' erosion .... Stephan/ There isn't much disturbing activities up above it .... haven't really moved any .... Not going on anywhere. We intend on our slopes to be planting some kind of a ground cover that will provide more ground cover than is already there .... Franklin/ The plan has been recommended by staff and by the P/Z Commission on a vote of 4-0. ITEM NOo 6f. Consider an ordinance amending the Zoning Chapter by changing the use regulations of an approximate .3 acre property located at 1500 Sycamore Street from RS-5, Low Density Single-Family Residential, to CO-i, Commercial Office. (Second consideration) Franklin/ Second consideration of the rezoning on Sycamore Street. This is the 4C's rezoning. ITEM NO. 6g. Consider an ordinance amending the Zoning Chapter by changing the use regulations for a .5 acre property located at 840 Cross Park Avenue from CO- 1, Commercial Office, to CC-2, Community Commercial. (Second consideration) Franklin/ Last item is the rezoning on Cross Park Avenue from CO-1 to CC-2 ..... Kubby/ How do people feel about that? Nov/ Go ahead .... Norton/ Kubby/ You can do it tonight. Nov/ Larry has requested that we switch the agenda ..... switch the next two items ..... Thisrepresents only areasonably accuratetranscription ofthelowe City council meeting of February 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 9 Tax Abatement-Citizen Buildin~ Nov/ David- 96-25 S1 David Schoon/ On your agenda is a resolution approving the property tax exemption application for the Citizen Building Project and just a little history. In '93 the council adopted the Urban Revitalization Plan for block 62 with this project in mind. To try to understand the concept, in terms of- Let's say there wasn't a project in mind at the time. The city would have went and designated the area an Urban Revitalization Area. Then as projects came forward, they would then have to come and have to apply for that specific project. So that is what has happened. In this instance the project was there and asked for a designated area as Urban Revitalization Area and we did so with the intent of providing abatement for this specific project. Now to comply with state code requirements, you have to have that application for exemption for this specific project. Is there any questions on the process and why the council is doing this? The incentive provided under the Urban Revitalization Plan is property tax exemption and the project does comply with the Urban Revitalization Plan and in this instance the property owner is asking for 100% exemption for a period of ten years which is what was discussed with the council when the project was before it earlier. Norton/ What do you estimate that number at now? ...... Schoon/ No, I don't. I would be hesitant at this time. It was so close in getting that estimate...wait for the Assessor to determine what the actual value was added to the site. Nov/ And we have to say we are not abating 100%. Just 100% of the increased value. Schoon/ Correct. Norton/ Schoon/ It is only on the value added. Vanderhoef/ Do you know what the assessed value of the property is right now that they will be paying tax on? Scho0n/ The base value is about $440,000 ..... The resolution is an agreement between the developer and the city regarding compliance with the Urban Revitalization Plan. In it it says the property owner must provide low and moderate income Thisrepresents only areasonebly accuratetranscription ofthelowa City council meeting of Februa~ 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 10 housing and that at least 74% of the space in the building must be used for residential purposed which is what is outlined in the plan. In the packet you received...an Addendum C. and he developer has asked .... revised addendum .... the key factor is less than 25% of it is used for non-residential purposes. He has recalculated it, adding the basement floor area into his calculation. He has reassigned the laundry area to residential uses... and major entry foyer which is called the Historical Display and Common Area as part of the residential use .... it would still .... less than 25% .... How the agreement is written now is that he will receive abatement for ten years on the added value of the improvement but that he has to provide low and moderate income housing for 15 years and that 75% of the building must be used for residential purposes .... Danielson representing Bob Burns. Bob cannot make it this evening .... They are happy to leave it at the 15 year requirement. Lehman/ Is there any room for...says 75% of building must be used for residential. Is it legltimate...basement area is residential? Schoon/ At this point it is used for storage. Lehman/ I was over there last Thursday. Schoon/ In the end the City Assessor will determine what has been added in terms of value and the purposes in the building and whether it qualifies with the plan. Lehman/ Seems time, to cover our fannies, if we should somehow make a designation that we deem this to be residential use .... If it is deemed not to be residential use, far less than 75% of that building is being used as residential. There is almost 9,000 square foot in that basement. Kubby/ They wouldn't qualify. Lehman/ I think we should be very sure ..... consider this to be associated with residential uses .... Woito/ As a practical matter, if he changes that to commercial he will not be in compliance with the agreement. Lehman/ I think we need to say this is an associated use of residential so he can use it as residential .... Thisrepresents only areasonablyaccuratetranscripfion ofthelowa City council meeting of February 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 11 Woito/ We are doing it by negative implication and you are right- Have you talked about that? Saying the basement is to be designated as residential with Mark. Basically that is what you Have agreed to. Mark Danielson/ (Can't hear). Kubby/ I am assuming that if we accept Addendum C, the basement floor area is in the residential section. By approving the agreement, we are approving the basement for residential use. Danielson/ That is correct. You would be incorporating by reference the space...designated only for residential purposes or as an accessory to residential purposes .... attached to the residential .... storage facility ..... Nov/ When this addendum was first given to us it did not include any basement space. Woito/ That is what this discussion back and forth has been about and it is really the council's judgement call whether you want it for 15 years or 10 years. Kubby/ Everyone has agreed that 15 years is fine. Woito/ As it is written and you have agreed to that? Danielson/ Yes. Thornberry/ What other than commercial would not be called residential use? Schoon/ For tax purposes .... multi-family is considered a commercial tax category .... Norton/ The tax exemption is not 15, that is just 107 Woito/ Correct. Norton/ Used for that kind of housing for 15 is what we are talking about .... Woito/ It has to maintain that ratio, 75-25%. Norton/ They can't change that .... Thornberry/ There is 15,045 square feet of management office? This represents only areasonably accuratetranscription ofthelowa Citycouncil meeting of February 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Schoon/ The management office space .... Norton/ What if he adds Council Work Session Page 12 office space is also used for the firm 48 more units on the back of the building sometime? Does that change the building? Schoon/ We would have to look at it as a whole. He would submit a separate application for the improvements on that addition .... It would just be more residential .... Thornberry/ I have one other question. This is residential but it is an apartment type building. Is that correct? That is not commercial? Schoon/ Yes, it is assessed as commercial. Under that commercial category for tax purposes, state code makes a distinction in that which is used for residential purposes and that which is used for non-residential purposes. Nov/ The residential purposes must be available for low and moderate income for 15 years. Norton/ Nov/ Schoon/ Do you want me to stay around for this item at the meeting? Lehman/ .... Basically we are re-affirming what we agreed to do earlier? Is that correct? Schoon/ It complies with the plan. Lehman/ So basically we have a commitment? Thornberry/ You are talking we as a city as opposed to we as a city. Lehman/ ...The city made a commitment to Bob to induce him to do this project and this is just fulfilling the things that we agreed to do. Thank you. Kubby/ His whole financing, this was just part of it. Nov/ Thank you. Thisrepresents oniyareasonably accuratetranscriptlon ofthelowa City council meeting of February 13,199~ WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 13 First Ave. and Muscatine Reconstruction Design 96-25 Sl Rick Fosse/ With me is Rob Winstead who is most familiar with the project. Also Terry Robinson, City Forester, and Jeff Davidson, Transportation Planner. We have prepared a couple of strip maps .... Nov/ Put them on the floor. Kubby/ Lots of people from the neighborhood here. If there is room, can people come and look at the map? Nov/ If it is on the floor .... Rob, can you move out from the desk a little bit? .... Thank you. Fosse/ What we have prepared here are two models of the corridor. One with a 3-lane option and one with a 4-lane option. As a part of this re-evaluation we did re-evaluate the impact on the trees and we got Terry Robinson involved .... We learned some things. Terry was out last Friday and Monday and re- evaluated the impact on the trees .... You need to look at things on a case by case basis. In summary, if we do nothing, Terry anticipates losing about 18 trees in that corridor over the next 5 years .... 3-lane option we will require removal of 29 trees and 4-lane option would require the removal of 43 which is the total of the trees in the study area. Important thing to note on segment that we anticipate to get federal funds on from Muscatine north, they have clear zone requirements. So when we get done, any tree that remains cannot get any closer than 3 feet to the back of the curb .... Over life of project we cannot plant trees closer that 10 feet from the back of the curb. So it makes it a little more difficult to reforest that corridor through there because of those clear zone requirements .... I would like to open it up to discussion and questions .... Nov/ Maybe Terry will start by telling why he is going to predict the loss of trees. Robinson/ About three years ago... significant number of trees along the old Senior Pablos property .... that should not have been planted there years ago .... up into the wires... wrong species... five there. There are five more south of Muscatine on the east side that are also under wires... large trees that are growing up into the wires .... There are three trees on the west side that fall into a group that have been in decline... getting to the point .... removed to replant something or just removed period .... Whenever I heard the initial information Thlsrepresents only araasonably accurate transcription ofthelowa City council meeting of February 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 14 going on about the potential business .... The 3-lane proposal .... I thought would be a lot more conducive to the trees along there and it is not quite as much as I thought is was going to be .... it helps some. Kubby/ 29 and 43 are different numbers .... Robinson/ I expected it to even be more .... Vanderhoef/ It was fewer than what you initially thought it would be. Robinson/ No. The 3-lane proposal I thought ~t might even be less than it is. Norton/ Its tree advantage isn't as much, the 3-lane over the 4 .... Robinson/ There is one thing in either proposal that is important to point out. The intersection point here, at Muscatine Avenue (refers to map). We have eight crab apple trees- CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 96-25 SIDE 2 Robinson/ Turning lane there. So that is a significant number... It is something to be taken into consideration. We have .... two large ash trees .... (refers to map). Those are the really big trees in this group ..... (Refers to map). Norton/ I would like to ask what the implication is that you are not going to be able to re-plant or have new trees? Fosse/ For that area that is north strict about their clear zone curb, back 10 feet ..... of Muscatine, the DOT is very requirements... from back of Kubby/ The r.o.w. is going to be so narrow .... Fosse/ Winstead/ It will be about 10 feet (refers to map). Kubby/ Does that mean you also have to take trees out that are in that corridor? Vanderhoef/ And would you be able to re-plant in either scenario? Fosse/ We need to comply with the clear zone requirements. For Thisrepresents only areesonably accuratetranscription ofthelowa City council meeting of February 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 15 those trees that are already there, they can be as close as 3 feet... any pre-existing obstruction that is closer than 3 feet, you have to get out of there .... Vanderhoef/ If they are within 3 feet of that curb, what are the chances of those trees living with their root systems? Robinson/ This is something that Rob and I and Rick talked about ..... It is important to remember that end of finish product if the tree is within 3 feet of the back of the curb .... the paver will use up another 2 feet during the construction process .... our construction may have come within 1 foot of the base of that tree... isn't good. Kubby/ That is with status quo construction... that we can ask people to be sensitive to that. Fosse/ Typically .... slip form paver... takes even more room.°. On Kirkwood .... required a form riding paver which requires less room. .... Robinson/ It is important to note that on Kirkwood...decisions...we were dealing with trees that were a lot more large .... We were trying... to say gosh, we don't know if this is going to survive but we are going to give it a shot anyway. On this one there are situations .... the distance from the curb is fine but the tree is actually growing towards the road .... the growth affect is going to bring it out so close to the road .... Where we can we would be much better off transplanting and getting something back in there .... Kubby/ I like the way we have started this conversation .... trees .... other things that Dee wanted us to consider .... Nov/ Is there a chance of burying the wires so the trees will have a better chance without being severely trimmed? Fosse/ We have been investigating that on Melrose corridor .... I don't know what the cost would be through here... To underground it you are putting it in a vault system .... disturbing the roots quite a bit .... expense of undergrounding it .... another expense... converting all the overhead services that are in place to underground services ..... Robinson/ (Refers to map) .... sidewalk...impact. And those trees have the overhead wires also. Thlsrepresents only areasonebly accuratetranscription ofthelowaCity council meeting of Februa~ 13.1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 16 Vanderhoef/ Do you have any idea what might go in there that would not make us look like we had just had a war zone .... ? Robinson/ In the 3-lane proposal .... clear zone, I didn't think about it... plenty of room. In the MuscaTine to Bradford area we would be going back in with a typical understory tree, smaller trees .... The crabapple, Hawthorns, amur maples ..... because of the overhead wires .... Vanderhoef/ And the area there would support a large deciduous tree if we had the wires under? Robinson/ If I have measured it right, yes it should .... assuming that we don't have a 3 foot wide concrete vault underneath .... That cuts down our underground space ..... up above the ground isn't nearly as important as down. Vanderhoef/ This is one of my concerns .... that we would save ourselves time and grief and have a better looking product in the end if we re-planted immediately and planned for what we would have in there. Robinson/ The initial blow whenever you take them out is really bad. But going back in and doing something right with the right species is much more important .... Vanderhoef/ Kubby/ If these issues are true, have a 3- lane or 4-lane .... do we want .... we need to deal with whether we help us talk about .... what road Vanderhoef/ I don't see that much difference the 3 or 4 versus the tree situation. That is my own personal summation... Yes ... do something about trees and landscape for them .... Nov/ Go ahead...anything else you want to add about the... the reasons you are concerned about having a 3-lane street? Vanderhoef/ I have got three major concerns .... concerns for neighbors. I am real concerned about the long range impact on traffic and capacity of a street that has always been considered an arterial .... 2- Cost of doing this project .... and they are telling me, the engineers, that the life span of this concrete is 25-30 years. And in my own assessment, we are going to be over capacity long before 25-30 years. The things that have influenced my concerns are the change of patterns of This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the iowa City council meeting of February 13, 1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 17 traffic on east side .... put a very large mega grocery store there .... with that store the other grocery store on the north end of First Avenue will no longer be there .... It will change patterns for all the people on the east side of how they travel .... With Saturday's announcement that the grocery store at the mall is closing, this leaves one grocery store for east side. With the building of Scott Blvd and annexation of land east of Scott Blvd and south of Highway 6 ..... Also building a new .... in the county, there is a new industrial park being built on the east side of town .... recruiting industrial .... create traffic to those new jobs. We also have a growing population and we have a city park that is very heavily used .... Mercer Park area .... There is also a possibility of adding an additional space onto the aquatic center for recreational facilities which will add more traffic ..... This evening news... bond issue soon... middle schools... they have no numbers... they said my assessment ...more families traveling on First Avenue... Our nearest arterial, north south arterial .... is 1 1/2 east of First Avenue .... We also have our first crossing on the RR tracks... that is going to be Summit Street. That is the only way they can get north south... request right now from Summit Street people requesting that some change of traffic pattern be happening over there in Dodge Governor area to relieve any cut through traffic .... several neighborhoods making requests for stop signs .... traffic on First Avenue... I want to get fast once in a while... cut through... Those are my big concerns... I was elected to be a council person at-large. I understand and I hear citizens in the immediate neighborhood .... It is going to impact .... I am going to be involved with in .... I would request that the design of First Avenue and MuscaTine corner be re-considered as a 4-lane, with turn lanes, and further, that it be considered as an agenda item very soon with plans to go along with the extension to Bradford Drive .... Norton/ Dee, can I ask you a couple of questions? To what extent that what happens to First Avenue north of Rochester come into your thinking? Do you see it connecting to Highway 1 or Scott Blvd? .... Vanderhoef/ It certainly is a good possibility .... I am also looking and hearing neighborhood on North side ...Dodge and Governor and Highway 1 situation. My personal philosophy... if we have 3-4 arterials... maybe we can keep congestion down .... Norton/ Given the present slope just beyond Rochester, does it seem reasonable for that to be an arterial all the way out to Thisrepresents only areasonably accuratetranscription ofthelowa CiW council meeting of Februa~ 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 18 Highway 17 .... If it was going to go beyond Rochester, maybe you are going to have to go 4. Vanderhoef/ There is certainly this possibility and I would be willing to discuss with all the council. Kubby/ There is a whole other way to think about how people move around .... saying... also make sure we have a viable bus system .... bicycle commuting .... increasing occupancy per car .... That we find different ways of moving people around .... When you have a 3-lane road that minimizes concrete .... Vanderhoef/ I would like to see figures that are available on safety because those are Something that I have not seen. Norton/ Crossing a 4-lane as a pedestrian is going to be more sticky .... Vanderhoef/ With crossing lights .... I taught safety .... That is a responsibility that I took as a parent with my child .... Lehman/ Vanderhoef/ It is definitely going to take some traffic safety kinds of things .... Children are going to have to be taught. They are responsible young people .... Thornberry/ ...it is going to be a whole lot busier with a HyVee there than it is now .... Vanderhoef/ I would like to ask Jeff, in your best judgement, will we beyond capacity in 10 years with the 3-lane? Davidson/ Yeah. When Rick and I met with you in December, what we indicated was that for the short range we would be, for the 3- lane option, we would be improving the existing situation .... We were not confident that we would be in a situation that with the delay levels that we like to see... we would not be over capacity. We do forecast that we would be over capacity and we have showed you the trade-offs between the two options. The question that came up earlier about the accident rate was ... difference between 3-lane and 4-lane option. When we did the Melrose Avenue Environment Assessment ..... individual.. research on types of streets and accident rates... he indicated to us that comparing a 4-lane street and a 3-lane... you would see approximately a 60% lower accident rate with the Thlsrepresents only areasonablyeccuratetranscrlption ofthelowaCi~ councilmeeting of Februa~ 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 19 3-lane facility and what that indicates is that on average .... you would see a 60% lower accident rate. It doesn't mean for any individual street ..... on average .... Reflects the rear- end collisions that you get with the 4-lane streets ..... That is where the higher accident rate comes from. Lehman/ Jeff... if it were 4-lane, Muscatine is 3-lane each way, First Avenue is 3-lanes going north, how much added capacity are we going to have if we dump 4-lanes into an intersection that has 3-lanes going the other three directions? Davidson/ Clearly, anytime you have the intersection of two arterial streets .... is a big capacity constraint .... The most constrained portion of this whole corridor is that intersection. Lehman/ How much do you increase capacity if you go 4-lanes into an intersection that is basically serviced by three 3-lanes? Davidson/ .... Street capacity... you do gain a lot of capacity with a 4-lane street .... Lehman/ But if you are going north and a 3-lane goes down to 3- lane, how close to this intersection? Fosse/ That wasn't part of the- 4-lanes through the whole corridor .... from Bradford to D Street. (Refers to map). Norton/ You are not going to leave it at 4 just at this one section, are you? Davidson/ Rick and I and Rob have been encouraging you, to adopt a consistent-Between D and Bradford .... consistent design throughout that corridor .... as council, to adopt a Vanderhoef/ And we meet with 4-lanes at Bradford. Davidson/ Ernie, at D proceeding north then, the character of the adjacent area changes .... residential... It is possible, you could at that point achieve a change in design to a 3-lane .... You could realistically do that. in the portion south of D you have got commercial area, small residential area and then commercial area again .... Kubby/ With 4-lane south of Muscatine .... 3 households would have to be gone .... Thisrepresents only areasonably eccuratetranscripfion ofthelowa City council meeting of February 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 20 Fosse/ The 4-lane option there are 3 households that have r.o.w that just out further than the others... 4 lots, 3 houses. The city currently owns this one (refers to map). The sidewalk .... Winstead/ .... we can do things with that sidewalk like move it closer to the street and just weigh where all the snow is going to get plowed in the winter .... it would be 5-6 feet. Kubby/ You are saying those households would be more adversely affected than others. Not that they would have to be removed? Fosse/ Correct. Vanderhoef/ Any possibility that a design would be better to put that overwide sidewalk on the west side of the street versus the east side. Fosse/ Probably not because of the location of the junior high school. Vanderhoef/ .... putting it on the side where Hoover is .... It's a trade-off. Norton/ I don't understand to what extent we are talking about a section here without thinking about the whole First Avenue .... Davidson/ To clarify for council .... The JCCOG Arterial Street Plan .... in the Iowa City Comp Plan .... does show First Avenue extended up to Highway 1 .... new arterial street. When we discussed CIP with the former city council, there was no interest in that project .... not even reflected in the 7 year plan for CIP. Norton/ .... talking even to Rochester .... Kubby/ It is an arterial .... Norton/ Davidson/ Functionally the arterial segment stops at Rochester... at either end of an arterial street you got to have an intersecting arterial and there is none further north of Rochester right now. Baker/ .... I do not see us extending First Avenue very much further north. I don't want to see it connected up to 1-80 .... Thisrepresents only areasonablyaccuratetranscriptlon ofthelowaClty council meeting of February 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 21 haven't been convinced that Highway 1 is even a possibility .... Talk about Scott Blvd being extended but not First Avenue. Thornberry/ ...what does over capacity mean? .... Davidson/ That is a measurement that we use, Dean, ... a ratio, volume and capacity ..... we calculate that... target delay level... A certain amount of delay that is considered acceptable. Right now, during peak periods, that is being exceeded in this corridor right now .... Th rry/ ' th light ornbe .... is at two s worth? .... Davidson/ During peak periods that does happen in this corridor right now at the intersection. Kubby/ What is the difference between 3 and 4 at that 10 year period out...? Davidson/ We show that you would still be under capacity with the 4-lane street. Kubby/ I am saying what about the 3? The difference between what level we are at in 10 years? Davidson/ ..confidence in our predictions up to 10 years .... Kubby/ How much longer will people have to wait at the light during peak times between the 3 and 4-lane? Davidson/ With either one of these projects you would see an immediate improvement in that .... continue in short term future ..... Kubby/ In 10 years out...? Davidson/ In 10 years out we predict ourselves to be in about where we are right now .... Kubby/ As long as people keep their current behavior patterns .... That is what I really want to get us... help motivate us... to have a different vision of how we get out bodies around. Nov/ Jeff... intersection south of Muscatine is going to remain at 3-lane? ..... Thlsrepresents only areasonably accurate transcription ofthelowa Citycouncil meeting of Februa~ 13,1996. WS021396 February 13, 1996 Council Work Session Page 22 Fosse/ From Muscatine to Bradford. Nov/ Just intersection .... (Refers to map) .... Fosse/ ..... that is addressing that area just from Muscatine north. Whatever we decide for the corridor between D and Muscatine, is probably what we should do for the corridor to the south as well. Nov/ Fosse/ At the intersection if we have a 3-lane corridor, we would add a right turn lane so you would have 4 right there (refers to map). Key to making the 3-lane option work .... is to put the right run lanes in on each of the four legs .... Davidson/ ...take off right turn prohibition. That adds more capacity .... Kubb¥/ I like the 3-lane option .... (refers to map) .... Vanderhoef/ Karen, I would agree with you until we put in a new grocery store... that has changed the flavor of this whole neighborhood and the combination of that plus what is happening at the junior high... Mercer Aquatic... Mercer Park and increased growth that we are seeing in Iowa City. Nov/ Two minute break and then we are starting the formal council meeting. Vanderhoef/ Thank everybody for coming and talking and doing the extra work. Adjourned: 7:30 PM Thisrepresents only 8reasonably 8ccur~etranscrlptlon ofthelowe Citycouncil meeting of February 13,1996, WS021396