HomeMy WebLinkAbout1996-02-14 TranscriptionFebruary 14, 1996 Council Work Session 9:30 AM
Council: Nov, Baker, Kubby, Lehman, Norton, Thornberry, Vanderhoef.
Staff: Atkins, Helling, Karr, Dollman, Fowler, Logsdon, Davidson,
Severson, Yucuis.
Tapes: 96-27, all; 96-28, Side 1.
Aid to Agencies 96-27 S1
Linda Severson/ First of all I would like to thank Dean and Karen.
They came and Naomi and several other people came to a number
of the joint funding hearings and we appreciate that. I also
want to thank Dean and Karen for spending a considerable
amount of time looking at what agencies had requested and what
we have available and that is always a challenge every year.
We would like to fund people... be able to consider funding
people at what they request but that is not the reality. So,
Dean and Karen had to make some decisions and I believe they
both compromised and reached a middle ground that hopefully
will work for everybody. If you look at your form, you see the
agencies on the left hand side listed and those are the
agencies in the first section that the city has currently and
historically been funding and as you look down towards the
bottom, we have two new requests from agencies that have not
historically received funding from the city. If we go over to
allocated FY96 that is what the city funded the agencies in
this FY. The next column if we go over to the division line we
have what the agencies requested in their budget requests. We
have what that meant in terms of dollar increase and then
percentage increase. Then our last two columns on our form are
what Karen and Dean recommend that the city fund the agencies
at and then we have a percentage increase. HACAP...did not
request any increase. They were the only agency that didn't.
Biggest increase we had was with the Emergency Housing Project
and that was a 25% increase which may seem big .... dollar
amount... just $1,500. Important to look at dollar increase as
well as percentage .... Our recommendation is to go to
$7,500 ..... as really increased programming .... early bird
program. People who come in have to make a commitment to
develop a plan to improve their lives and I think that is
really changing the make up of the EHP and is putting some
expectations on the people who use that service and I think
that is a real plus .... County...across the board 3% but with
EHP they funded them at a higher level .... Are there any
questions or comments?
Baker/ I just have a question .... Why the proposed percentage
increases vary with each particular agency instead of just
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across the board? ....
Kubby/ Because agencies are doing different things at different
levels .... But we wanted to look at each agency... Coralville
did do something funding of things .... Look at each agency
individually and the services they provide.
Severson/ .... purpose of the joint funding process is to hear what
agencies are doing and what their needs are and address those
individually ....
Thornberry/..... The county did 3% across the board and so did
Coralvzlle with zero increase across the board.
Severson/ Coralville .... did recommend funding for two agencies and
they recommended some money for Free Medical Clinic and Red
Cross .... recognition of the importance of those services ....
Thornberry/ I was a little upset that they didn't bother to show up
at the meeting.
Severson/ They both had had previous commitments .... met with them
on Tuesday.
Norton/ Are we getting any data on Coralville's actual
participation in these programs? .... I am always curious do
we have data on usage of any of these services?
Kubby/
Norton/ Does Coralville respond to that?
Severson/ .... It is always in the budget book in terms of the
number of people they serve from Iowa City, Johnson County,
Coralville and others ..... Red Cross, in terms of their
response to emergency situations. They broke out the last 2-3
years of what percentage was Coralville and what percentage
was Iowa City ....
Kubby/ I think the pressure is on Coralville... saying Coralville
you are growing, a greater percentage of people each year are
using these services... you need to respond by helping to
fund .....
Kubby/
Severson/ It was just a few years ago where Coralville never sent
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anybody .... taking a little more responsibility .....
Norton/ What is the rationale for Youth Homes routinely falling
through the cracks here?
Severson/ In terms of their request, Dee?
Norton/ They don't seem to get funded .....
Severson/ They are funded but they have never been funded by this
city .... One rationale might be they get state and federal
dollars. So they do have another source of funding as opposed
to the Crisis Center which is all donations of city county
funding .... Youth Homes... programs are fee for service
They have other sources of funding ....
Nov/ Also they did get a lot of city money for capital...
buildings ....
Norton/ ..... different varieties .... What is the rationale behind
county, city, Coralville funding? ....
Severson/ .... may be individual public officials interest in
particular agencies .... I think it is a combination of a
number of variables and what may be a hot spot this year ....
history and preferences or interests on the particular body
that is funding and community needs... hot issue.
Thornberry/ I really would like to thank Susan Horowitz for having
me on this committee. It has been some time but I learned a
lot about a lot of agencies that I didn't know about...
working with Karen on this budget, Ernie, do you want to try
next time? I did the best I could.
Nov/ This is a very tough and very involved process .... time for
new people to get involved ....
Thornberry/ .... I had to do some soul searching .... I didn't get
down to budget .... but it's not that far off budget... $723...
Kubby/ It is .05% off budget ....
Thornberry/ I know but I don't like to be off budget...
Council/ (All talking).
Severson/ I did notice one mistake while I was sitting here waiting
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to present.
$383,352 ....
25% cut ....
The final figure on that bottom line should be
Also .... we had the word from HUD .... looking at
initially the picture was more bleaker ....
Nov/
I have just one question. We had a letter from Pat Jordan
because she said nobody from the city was at the hearing for
her presentation ..... I assumed that both of you did listen to
the tapes on that meeting.
Kubby/ I did not listen to the tapes. I read the packet and called
Pat with questions.
Severson/
Nov/ The book that has been presented is always thorough but I just
wanted to know.
Norton/
Severson/ You have to have a plan... identifying resources. I think
that is a real positive move on EHP's part. Thank you.
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Transit 96-27 S1
Atkins/ The next item... have Joe come to the microphone and kind
of step you through ...transit alternatives.
Kubby/ Did you bring a map?
Atkins/ We have maps. Give us about two minutes to get set up ....
Nov/ I think it is easier to have a live piece of paper rather than
an overhead ....
Fowler/ We tried to put the options together based on what we heard
as the directive from council at the last meeting. The factors
we were taking into consideration were eliminating the
scheduled o.t. time, reduction in Saturday service and
maintain the additional budgeting framework between $80,000-
$100,000. That is what we heard .... On Saturday service there
were two different options for Saturday service. One would be
the elimination of one hour service which would be starting at
7:00 instead of starting at 6:00. Currently there are about 50
passengers riding at this hour. All routes would stay the same
under this scenario and projected savings would be $12,000.
Second option that we looked at would be to combine several of
the Saturday routes .... The combinations were to combine
Westwinds and Plaenview routes ..... Part of the service area
that is lost is (refers to map) .... This is what we did to the
night service was we dropped going into the neighborhoods ....
There has been any complaints about reducing that level at
night. The other one was to combine the Broadway and the Mall
routes and this would be a very busy trip (refers to map) ....
Mall Drive and Eastdale would be the ones that would be
affected there. The other route would be to drop the day time
Seventh Avenue and combine it with the current Towncrest
(refers to map) .... It would be similar to the current night
service on the Towncrest route.
Logsden/ It would normally run more down Muscatine Avenue (refers
to map) .... instead we have it drop down and come across ....
Kubby/
Fowler/ The inbound lsn t on this map (refers to map). It would be
the regular Saturday schedule.
Kubby/ In terms of that Broadway Mall combination, can that really
be run in half an hour? .... There is a lift on there ....
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Fowler/ That one would be 45 minutes the driver would have on that
route. But it would be a very crowded bus ....
Logsden/
Norton/ Lakeside would still be operating?
Fowler/ Yes.
Norton/ . That Mall route, couldn't
of ~%' be traded off to Lakeside?
points.
some of the Broadway parts
They actually overlap at
Fowler/ (Refers to map) They overlap in this area and serve the
same neighborhood.
Norton/ But you are not figuring to change Lakeside?
Fowler/ No.
Kubby/ Wouldn't it even out the routes to do that?
Norton/ Just thinking of trying to balance that route ....
Fowler/ Lakeside has to go all the way out to Bon Aire. The
Broadway, that is the current night service now (refers to
map) is the Broadway and Lakeside overlap.
Nov/ There were quite a few people who came to the hearing who
lived in trailer parks. I think we really have to serve those.
Norton/ I was just thinking of cutting the Broadway section south
of Highway 6 because Lakeside goes right through that section.
You guys know more about it than I do .... just looks to me
visually that Broadway and Lakeside are pretty close together
through that Grantwood section .... it is going to be tough.
Fowler/ This is the combination that works at night now is the
reason ....
Nov/ Does Saturday have more riders than night service?
Fowler/ Yeah, Saturday afternoons are very busy... higher ridership
than mid-day during the week.
Kubby/ Which gets to the questions of should we be doing this if
ridership is more because we hadn't originally been talking
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about changing Saturday service. we wanted to look at it.
Nov/ One of our original thoughts... was mid-day Saturday was as
low as night service but I am not hearing that.
Vanderhoef/ It is early morning that is low on Saturdays ....
Nov/ There is still people that have to work on Saturday.
Norton/ I went back and looked at Iowa 2000 statement and what we
are doing here is almost antithetical to everything that was
said in the transportation section ....
Kubby/ It would be good to review that ....
Thornberry/ I don't think we can be all things to all people.
Norton/ I think we have to recognize that a lot of good people
participated in this exercise and put together these things...
The transit service, frequent enough and late enough in the
evening that transit is perceived as a reasonable alternative.
And they said financing arrangements will eliminate annual
fiscal ~lnerability of public transit and paratransit. Here
we go.
Nov/ ...that is a tough one.
Fowler/ If you look at the numbers .... the afternoon ridership on
Saturday service is very good.
Kubby/ What do you think the effects will be on those busy routes
by using our current night service on Saturday?
Fowler/ The Broadway Mall bus will be standing room only bus ....
Kubby/ Is there a way to have most of the routes be like night time
service... but some of those busier routes have the regular
mid-day service?
Fowler/ The problem that we ran into was following the blanket
approach to service and so to continue service Manville/North
Dodge, places that don't have as much ridership at the same
level as the rest of the community, we had to combine the
routes that were close together .... areas with the highest
ridership.
Kubby/ Is it possible to have everything else combined and have the
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Mall and Broadway Street be separate? .....
Fowler/ One of the responses or inputs from drivers that we have
received would be the more we can keep the service similar to
what it is now, the less confusing it will become to the
public .... I will jump to the end .... We have made these
signs up through a trade agreement with the Press Citizen. We
have purchased the frames and they are doing the printing of
the schedules. So whatever alterations we do, we would like to
expand this program... where it is going to go on several
routes .... throughout the community so people will be able to
walk up to a sign and know what time of day and what day a
week service will be.
Nov/ Great.
Fowler/ We have worked on this for about six months with the Press
Citizen and so we are- $90 a sign. Funds that have previously
been used on other advertising and use it to advertise
ourselves on signs. Our advertising budget would be going
towards spreading these signs throughout the community.
Kubby/ You can see where the bus stop is a little better .....
Lehman/ Especially if you start changing routes it is all right
there. '
Thornberry/ And you have the route on the thing ....
Council/ (All talking).
Vanderhoef/ You could put a red X on the spot.
Nov/ Signs will have individual times ....
Thornberry/ Then you will know where the bus is going ....
Council/ (All talking).
Thornberry/ Where are the frames coming from?
Logsden/ They are made by , a company out of New York.
They have rubber gaskets and it seals out the moisture .....
Nov/ So this is something that substitutes for the kind of sign
that is there now?
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Logsden/ No, that will be there ....
Nov/ In addition to what is already there,
Vanderhoef/ It all goes on one post.
Page 9
okay.
Fowler/ We think any changes that are made, that doing that signing
would be appropriate and beneficial to the public.
Kubby/ So, how are people feeling about combining? Doing night time
service on Saturdays?
Fowler/ The only difference between the current night time service
and the proposal would be the Oakcrest route would remain
instead of being combined with the Westport .... And there is
no service out to the Thatcher Baculis area. Under this
proposal they would remain separate and that area would still
get service.
Kubby/ We do have some separate routes. So if we wanted to separate
out Broadway that is possible since we are already doing.
Fowler/ Then the Hawkeye was added onto this because at night there
is no service out there.
Vanderhoef/ What would be the additional cost to separate out
Broadway?
Fowler/ It is $33 an hour roughly.
Vanderhoef/ Instead of combining the two which is what Karen is
is crowded? So we are going to do it
asking about ....
Thornberry/ Saturday afternoon
all day?
Fowler/ It would be $21,000.
Council/ (All talking).
Norton/ Has the Cambus been
Fowler/
Lehman/
Fowler/
looked at thoroughly in this process?
Cambus doesn't start running on Saturday until noon.
Do they know something we don't?
They are serving a different community that maybe sleeps
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later.
Norton/ I keep worrying about any bus of ours going out Melrose ....
Fowler/ Currently Cambus doesn't go out on Melrose during the day
and through the agreement between the city and Cambus they
aren't to pick anyone up between Hawkeye and University
again ....
Leb_man/ I personally have no problem with the bus being crowded.
Norton/ Some virtue to that.
Lehman/ If they are so full that we can't carry everybody, that
concerns me ....
Norton/ They haven't been in Rome lately ....
Lehman/ ...going to have to be as lean and trim as we can be ....
Nov/
My guess is a lot of these will be crowded in the winter and
not in the summer. People are going to ride their bikes more
often. Which are the two crowded ones that you are combining?
Broadway and which other?
Fowler/ Mall.
Norton/ Is Lakeside also a crowded one? .... Refinements out of
there may still be possible because of the overlap.
Kubby/ The important part is not make this decision and six months
later change routes again .... When we put information out to
people it is not a different ball game every year or
something.
Nov/ We should think about this a bit before we actually make a
decision.
Thornberry/ Those guys are in the transit business. We are really
not ....
council/ (All talking).
Kubby/ Is it possible to reconfigure the routes so there isn't
duplication between the Broadway Mall and the Lakeside?
Fowler/ The only duplication right now is this little stretch right
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here (refers to map) ....
Kubby/ What is the longest anyone has to walk on that? (Refers to
map) .... six blocks or something?
Fowler/ Hard to tell on this. Could be six blocks from over by the
current grade school ....
Baker/ Joe, can I ask you a question about your figure sheet? If
you take both options on Saturday service, you talk about
saving $56,000. Look at page 3 and you talking about Saturday
savings and it never gets above $48-.... Seem like you should
be using the $56- figure. So the net cost, for example on #5,
would be $56-
Norton/ We are not talking about cutting out that early morning
hour, are we?
Fowler/ If you cut out the morning hour you could add $12,000 to
each of those. Our feelings on the morning hour are that there
are about 50 people riding, about 50% on those are on two
routes, Westwinds and the Hawkeye and we felt... those are
transit dependent people going to work at that time of day on
a Saturday .... So when we went to the other projections, we
didn't include that $12,000. It could be either or and both.
Norton/ When do we have to decide?
Kubby/ We have the budget figure in.
Thornberry/ I would like to save money as soon as possible .... It
needs to be looked at for sure.
Nov/
The effective date should be July 1 because that is when the
effective date of the price of the ride changes .... My
preference that we make this decision at least six weeks ahead
of time and do six weeks worth of good publicity and education
for those who are riding.
Norton/ But in terms of putting this budget we got to get a number
in there if some kind.
Nov/ We put in the $100,000 last week and the specifics of how to
allocate it among routes is just something that we have to
decide.
Norton/ .... just want to soak a little bit on this.
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Nov/ I prefer to not make any decisions tonight.
Atkins/ I want to step through the financing with you .... Let me do
a little summary for you.
Rubby/ What would happen if we said get a committee of Steve,
transit management, transit maintenance people and transit
riders and see if there is a way to save $50,000 without any
noticeable changes of services to people? What would that be
or how close could you get to that? ..... put your heads
together and figure out a feasible way to save X amount of
money .... Maybe they would come up with $25,000 worth of
savings.
Norton/ Tough if personnel decisions are implied though ....
Kubby/
Norton/ But you are asking people in some ways to cut their own
throats.
Kubby/ My suggestion was finding a way to save X amount of money
without any noticeable change to the customer. Is it possible?
Norton/
Kubby/ Then what I am suggesting then is things that aren't
personnel related.
Nov/ They did ask the drivers for opinions on this ....
Atkins/ Let me step you through. Take this handout (Handout: City
of Iowa City Transit Fund FY97-FY99 Schedule YY 2/14/96). Some
old information. You can see the bottom line where it says
total expenditures ..... Here is what we did .... We adjusted
the SEATS contract, the $550,000 from the $448- that we had in
the budget. That number is in this. That is not fixed yet ....
Remember it was $600 and something. Secondly we assumed that
the rate increase would go into affect on July 1. The original
budget you had on January 1. That is a net increase in
revenue. Thirdly, we added $80,000 in services added back ....
Now, you will see under ending balance FY97, $196,891. As you
read across the ending balance declines in '98 and in '99 we
are in the hole. With no changes, making those adjustments,
that will be the financial position of this fund in '99 .... to
do what you want to do we can fund for two years. It is the
third year that sneaks up on us.
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Kubby/ That is assuming that we are not successful in our lobbying
to Congress to restore federal operating funds.
Atkins/ But there is another element, you will see our revised
General Fund cash balance numbers, $6.1 million, $5.4 million,
$4.3 million. Those are less than, because you have to come up
with the $80,000 somewhere, than in the budget proposal. My
concern is not so much for '97 and '98. But making the F¥99
decision of $4.395- plus the sale of the peninsula put you at
$5.5- We do dip below that 20% number that I like to maintain.
So, there are risks involved... Any reductions you make
anywhere else in the budget .... improves that financial
position ....
Kubby/ Isn't it in FY99 or 2000 where we are going to have six
officers that are being paid for by the federal government...?
Atkins/ That is correct and what I would be proposing to do ....
since we don't know what the state is going to do. We do have
available to us that Tort Liability Levy .... our cost of
insurance is a separate tax levy... that is sitting out there.
Norton/ Conceivable that we weren't going to totally add six ....
attrition ....
Atkins/ The original grant called for eight. We chose to hire six.
We have built on that we have attrition planned on or around
year 2000 ..... fourth year of assumptions .... know where you
are going.
Norton/ Don't want to make it look like transit if carrying this
whole burden ....
Atkins/ .... You are always going to have constituent interest
groups .... Loads of conflicts. I wanted you to have some idea
of the numbers. That that is where you are.
Vanderhoef/ .....
Atkins/ That $90,000 is extended and thought to be part of this
financing. Now, we have not dealt with the issue of
parking ....
CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 96-27 SIDE 2
Vanderhoef/ Transfer that $90,000 in the year '99 ....
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Thornberry/ I think we should be talking to Coralville... as far as
seeing- I am sure they are looking at the same thing ....
Atkins/ Their problem is a little different. Use it or lose it.
Rate structure, they don't have city wide. They have different
policies ..... Jeff gave it to me the other day. They did a
consolidation study back in '90 and I will give you a copy of
that .... (Handout: Transit Consolidation Study for the Iowa
City Urbanized Area May 1990).
Kubby/ ...figure out .... with different purposes still work together
well.
Atkins/ My reading of it is the issues are very relevant in today's
circumstances even though it is five years old.
Vanderhoef/ Do we have any figures to tell us the salary line in
total with their benefit package of bus drivers and so fourth?
Atkins/ We just approved a three year contract. Our salary projects
are going to be right on ....
Vanderhoef/ Both cities are going to be paying the same?
Atkins/ I would suspect that Coralville is generally not going to
be way way off from us .... Biggest concern would be a huge
aberration in health insurance or something ....
Vanderhoef/
Atkins/ Hour per hour is higher than theirs, our wage ....
AFSCME .... I am more comfortable with these numbers than I
have been in a long time because of... three year contract.
The thing I think you need to know is that we use up-If you
read across to the Reserve position, we have kept it in the
$200,000 range. You get yourself through two FYs .... 99 is the
one that I am nervous about.
Norton/ It really isn't prudent to let ourselves let that reserve
drop down that far. We have got to cover our fannies.
Atkins/ The overall cash reserve for the General Fund .... other
decisions have a direct relevance on what you do with this
service .... I think you have to consider the whole fund as
well as the Transit operations .... If you do make service
reductions, then we change those numbers ....
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Kubby/ .... we configure the routes to still have that philosophy of
blanket coverage ....
Davidson/ If council wants to keep the policy as you put it blanket
coverage .... If council chooses to change that and go to more
of identify where the potential ridership is the highest and
focus the service in those areas, possibly have some low
ridership areas that don't have service, then we need to go
back to the drawing board.
Kubby/ There is not a more efficient way than what we have already
got of where the buses go?
Baker/ With a blanket policy.
Norton/ What you are saying is Coralville doesn't have a blanket
policy?
Davidson/ Coralville focuses their services on the areas where
there are apartments .....
Thornberry/ Higher ridership areas.
Davidson/ North of 1-80 which is the higher income area, Coralville
has very little service ....
Norton/ I do think we have to look at it ....
Thornberry/ If we went down and just made arterials ....
Kubby/ You would find a lot more people, for example in my
neighborhood, riding SEATS ....
Thornberry/ First Avenue is an arterial ....
Kubby/
Thornberry/ I am just thinking of looking at all new routes and
maybe looking at something other than a blanket. Surely go to
the trailer parks, go to the Broadways where ridership is
highest.
Arkins/ There are always ways of looking at it .... bottom line is
you are in the midst of a budget review. You have to decide if
this $80,000 of services you want back in the budget .... That
you want this rate increase to go into affect .... you can
approve the budget ....
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Nov/ We don't need to design the routes today.
Atkins/ We will be back at you real quickly on this .... We need a
lot of publicity to make this thing work ....
Kubby/ Is it possible .... peak time is important... Is it possible
to have a future system where you end of with peak time
blanket, day time-...?
Davidson/ ...All areas of Coralville have peak hour service. The
off peak night and Saturday service is just to high ridership
areas .... .
Kubby/ .... The overtime is a small percentage of the budget and
one of the effects of not having the planned overtime .....
having part time positions ....
Norton/
Thornberry/ When you start paying people .... then talk to me about
scheduling overtime... If you start scheduling overtime you
are asking for trouble.
Kubby/ We cannot do overtime and not make what are currently full
time positions part time positions. I don't want them to take
people who are currently full time positions .... and to make
it part time position. I think it is important to have full
time positions.
Thornberry/ If you can pay for it that is fine.
Fowler/ Part of the problem on the full time positions is the
length of service that we currently have because we are
running like just an hour longer than two full time positions.
To eliminate the overtime, you would have to either cut the
service back of cut those into two part time positions so that
each one was getting paid straight time for that extra hour.
It also have to do.. using interchange as transfer points...
drivers at the end of their shift .... Several factors that
come into play ....
Kubby/
Logsden/ As a rule it is about 15 minutes and 45 minutes. It is
about four routes that has 45 minutes at the most scheduled
overtime per day ..... Usually on Saturday that is broken
down... Monday through Friday you have four routes with about
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45 minutes ...... For the contract we have to pay them for
driving time from the Transit facility d.t .....
Thornberry/ I see a problem with scheduling overtime, period. If
you can't schedule your bus drivers to work within an eight
hour work day you need a new scheduler. You can do that.
Kubby/ I don't want to change what are currently full time
positions into part time positions .....
Thornberry/ Karen, it is not either part time or overtime. I am not
saying that. I am saying full time but no overtime .... Full
time isn't exactly 40 hours .... Maybe they are wrong. Maybe
they could schedule differently and have them full time
without overtime.
Kubby/ Is that possible?
Thornberry/ That is possible.
Nov/
Thornberry/ I am not saying it is simple.
Baker/ I agree with you in theory .... consequences are minuscule.
Thornberry/ Are they? ....
Norton/ 1.4% of the budget ....
Thornberry/
Baker/ I have always said the function of city government is not to
provide employment. It is to provide service .... We are doing
a service ....
Thornberry/ If we are going to be changing routes, if we are going
to be changing the amount that we charge our customers ....
let's change the policy where we don't pay any overtime.
Baker/
Vanderhoef/ We have a lot of scheduling that goes on with people
working four day weeks and working longer hours and still only
doing a 40 hour week .... Over a two week pay period you still
are only putting in your 80 hours .... may not look like a
traditional 8 hour day .... We could schedule a 40 hour week
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without overtime and still accomplish the same thing.
Thornberry/ Do you pay every two weeks? Can you work someone 45
hours one week, 35 hours the next week and not pay overtime?
Helling/ No, that is not union contract. That is federal Fair Labor
law ....
Vanderhoef/ As long as we go 40/40, we are okay.
Thornberry/ You can't go 45 and 35 ....
Fowler/ Our current contract is anything over 8 hours in a day is
overtime unless there is a side letter of agreement that
everybody would agree to. The other thing that we put in the
memo is that after you establish the hours that you want us to
operate the system, then we can go back and look at the
schedules of the employees ....
Kubby/
Fowler/ If you give us the guideline and then you tell us what you
want and we will put together the best package what we can and
come back and show you.
Thornberry/
Nov/ Let's get to the point where each of us will go home and study
this and try to come back with a decision and we will meet
again. I can't make a decision today.
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SEATS 96-27 $2
Kubby/ There are two other things that we didn't really get to last
time .... SEATS ..... explicit decisions about fare, tax, hours
of operation, eligibility requirements .... haven't made
decisions about those.
Nov/ .... I think we have done as much as we can for today. SEATS
Atkins/ I wanted to have some idea of what you wanted us to do with
the county ...general direction .... We just need to find how
hard you want me to push ....
Kubby/ I think we should bargain as hard as we can .... I know that
the figure of $550- with a increase up to our fair share ....
It is our obligation to negotiate as hard as possible.
Atkins/ If you tell me to negotiate as hard as possible I am
assuming you are saying I can pull out as many stops as I
want.
Kubby/ What does that mean? ....
Arkins/ We need to suggest to them it may be better .... everything
is open.
Vanderhoef/ There has to be a consequence or you are not bargaining
for power. I am sorry.
Arkins/ If we bargain we have to accept certain consequences ....
Kubby/ One of the things that may change my mind about wanting the
county to run the service .... these fiscal changes .... As
far as we have information and that if Iowa City would run the
paratransit service for the metropolitan area, the
possibilities of using the smaller vehicles for the night
service might change these numbers for FY99 .... could help us
evolve into a different kind of program.
Arkins/ ...for us to schedule as we see fit .... type of vans we
have.
Kubby/ ..... you could still have blanket service but have
different kind of vehicles doing it.
Arkins/... as long as the service is available.
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Kubby/ That could change what we decided. It may have an affect on
how I look at the policy decisions ....
Atkins/ We have $550- in this budget, inflation adjusted at 3.5% a
year. Do it is $550-, $580-, $600- in this budget ....
Norton/
Nov/ What we are dealing with in SEATS is a cost that
at far greater than any other cost that we have
budget. The rate is just terrible.
is going up
in our city
Lehman/ .... I really don't think anybody knows exactly what the
costs are. We are basically negotiating from a position of
ignorance. We gave them some criteria that we would like for
this year. We got information back .... We are going to have
some very very credible information. I agree totally with
you... I would like to see us have a contract with SEATS that
is fair .... And I think we need to work our fannies off... to
see if we can't put together a combined system of Coralville
and SEATS and run our own.
Norton/
Lehman/ If we can possibly combine Iowa City Transit and Coralville
Transit and SEATS, I think that there would be a substantial
savings.
Norton/ We are pretty well committed to that .... where is our focus
right now?
Lehman/
Kubby/ Set a goal at try to be at $500,000 to $550,000 ....
Lehman/ I don't think that we have the information to say that ....
You will be able to tell us more about what we could
reasonable expect to get from SEATS .... We have not
information .... We don't know how accurate it is ....
Fowler/ I think the major thing is when they go to their
computerized system, we can then say go back to our original
idea of dedicating vehicles to the urban areas and say okay,
instead of funding a percent of 11, we want to fund 100% of
five and they show us what kind of service with this
computer... do a day's service and see what kind of service we
are going to get and then go with six. I think maybe we can
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February 14, 1996 Council Work Session Page 21
look at can the number of vehicles be
number, done through the computer ....
actual facts .... level of service that
reduced... realistic
Be able to have some
can be achieved.
Nov/ Do we have a person, a programmer that knows how to do that
kind of program? ....
Fowler/ The system the county just bought with the funds that were
left over several years ago will do that, yeah.
Kubby/ ....
Fowler/ Balance where we can get the best deal for us .... best deal
overall.
Baker/
Atkins/ My understanding, Larry, is the $600,000 plus that
originally went in. They came back...okay, we will do it for
$550-
Norton/ Why did that drop?
Lehman/ I have no idea ....
Kubby/ I think they saw what a huge increase that was and that we
were bulking at it.
Norton/ $636- or something was the original numbers. $670- counting
the cab ....
Vanderhoef/ Are we planning as a council to look at policies on the
ridership for some of these? .....
Baker/
Lehman/ They are based on last year's policies .... No changes.
Fowler/ If we would go to the county and say we are only going to
pay $500,000 instead of $550-, I would assume they would
reduce the number of vehicles doing the service .... They will
make the adjustment in service to you.
Thornberry/ But you wouldn't go in with that attitude, right? .... I will go with you.
Norton/ Why don't we consider the policy issues... because, for
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Council Work Session
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example, if we say we are going to charge $1.50 per ride,
period, that changes the game somewhat doesn't it? And then
say... we would hope that you could come up with a contract
below $550- I ~hink we ought to make those changes first ....
We have to decide on those, don't we?
Kubby/ Naomi is saying maybe not today.
Nov/
I would be happy to make that decision today. I think the
price per ride ought to be $1.50 and I think if the price per
ride were $1.50 there would be some people who have the choice
of riding on fixed route bus who would make that choice.
Kubby/ Also talked about a sliding scale waiver versus a flat zero
waiver because 50% of the riders are using the 100% waiver and
I think we all kind of agree that that wasn't appropriate
anymore°
Nov/
I would say a waiver might be available only for those who
bought a pass or a strip ticket and the cost per ride is the
cost per ride, period. I think we have to get to the point
when we are talking about a low income waiver, we justify it
based on income and we do it similarly to what we have talked
about on the fixed route... low income waiver on a monthly
pass. Not on a single ride.
Vanderhoef/ I go with that.
Thornberry/
Nov/
Kubby/ It is especially difficult sometimes for people with
disabilities even though they might have a job that pays a lot
of money. They might have a lot of medical expenses that
aren't covered by insurance or they have a lot of extra
expenses because of assistance that they need ....
Thornberry/ Karen, I think you can always find exceptions to
everything .... we can't cover everything.
Kubby/ I think we should have a sliding scale waiver for rides,
too, because the amount of twice as much.
Norton/ Is this the day to make those decisions and what is the
list because it does include the age thing? ....
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February 14, 1996 Council Work Session Page 23
Nov/ ...He obviously feels that anybody who has lived 55 years is
entitled to a free ride and we don't agree with that.
Kubby/
Vanderhoef/
Nov/ Let's start. Steve, do you want to begin.
Vanderhoef/ I am definitely supporting $1.50 for all riders. I like
the strip ticket with the savings that you can get from having
this. I would like to see age not be a criteria for a ride on
the bus unless there is a disability documented then I choose
to ask them to ride the regular transit.
Kubby/ How do you feel about grandparenting in the folks .... four
people who currently ride who are older who do not have a
disability?
Vanderhoef/
Kubby/ We know who those four people are. There are only four
people who ride SEATS who qualify only on the age eligibility.
Baker/ One of them is my aunt, She is 85 .... she would never be
certifiably disabled.
Vanderhoef/ When I say disabled... there are certain maladies with
congestive failure and such like that are not apparent when
you see someone walk a short distance. And it can be
documented easily by a physician.
Kubby/ That is what the SEATS folks are telling me there are four
people who don't have any of that who are currently getting
it. I am suggesting we grandparent those four people .... They
know who they are. So it is not a nightmare.
Vanderhoef/...straight out, go and get it documented that I
physically cannot do it.
Thornberry/ The SEATS bus isn't picking them up to take them over
to the tennis courts.
Kubby/ We don't judge where people are going.
Thornberry/ If those follr people were going to the tennis courts
everyday, I would have a problem ....
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February 14, 1996 Council Work Session Page 24
Baker/ Ernie says it may not be legal.
Norton/ I don't see any reason to have a particular category ....
Kubby/ I am talking about providing them rides,
SEATS rides with a discount. I think maybe
about two different things.
not giving them
we are talking
Lehman/ I still think it may not be legal. That is discriminatory
against everybody else who is over 60 that we don't give rides
to .....
Kubby/ .... We could ask our attorney if we wanted to do it ....
Nov/ We could say if someone is over 75 they don't have to document
a disability ..... But it would apply to everyone over 75 ....
Norton/
Baker/ Raise the age and let it go ....
Thornberry/ I think we should eliminate age. I don't think age
should get you in.
Nov/ I know people at 80 and 85 who walk a few blocks .... other
people... they don't walk a few blocks.
council/
Nov/ Do you have anything to add to what she said?
Thornberry/ No age requirement.
Nov/ Dee Norton, do you have anything to add to what she said?
Norton/ I don't know what the strip ticket cost is. $1.50 ride is
fine to me. Age out and some kind of process for defining
inability to use the bus. I don't know what we are doing on
the low income side of this. Are people going to qualify
somehow?
Thornberry/ Just because they don't make very much money they can
ride he SEATS?
Norton/ Not disabled or-
Thornberry/ Yeah.
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February 14, 1996 Council Work Session Page 25
Norton/ Low income policy like we have in other areas is all I am
wondering about.
Nov/
So we are saying if you are eligible for SEATS and are low
enough income, you can have a discount on a strip ticket. What
do people think about a discount on a monthly pass?
Kubby/ Of course .....
Logsden/ Right now we have a monthly pass. They are twice what our
regular monthly pass are for fixed route. They are $36 and we
have a ten punch card that is right now is only $10 .... would
go to $15. If you discount the punch card, you could discount
the monthly passes. We don't presently have strip tickets for
paratransit.
Nov/ We will take out the word strip and we will put in punch.
Kubby/ I think we should also have a sliding scale. We are going
from zero to $1.50 for every ride .... makes it more
expensive ....
Thornberry/ This isn't going to go in affect until .....
Nov/ July 1st.
Thornberry/ Let them know right away and they can save $.50 a week
and they will have enough for two strip tickets by July.
Kubby/ I think we should have a sliding scale waiver for the-
Atkins/ The fixed route system is about a $1.50 per ride. SEATS is
about $9.00. So keep in mind proportionately what you are
spending to subsidize the operation to begin with ....
Baker/ I have no problem charging the people who are qualified the
$1.50 .... low income policy .... I feel comfortable saying ....
75 ..... I know some people who are over 75 who are not
disabled but they are not functioning in such a way that they
could take advantage of a fixed route system ..... anybody over
75 ..... eliminate a lot of people.
Lehman/
Baker/
Thornberry/ I know two ladies who go to bridge every week riding
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Council Work Session
Page 26
SEATS and I can go on and on and on .....
Kubby/ By looking at them you can't say they don't have a
disability that would prevent them from using the fixed route.
Nov/ ...Are you assuming that they could walk to a bus?
Council/
Kubby/ Is there anyone else who is interested in having a sliding
scale waiver for the $1.50 fare?
Lehman/ Yeah, keep it simple.
Baker/ Very simple.
Kubby/ Right now, 50% of the people who ride pay nothing because of
the zero waiver. You go from that to $1.50 per ride for
everybody.
Lehman/ Coralville charges every single rider and they get along
pretty darn well .... obviously we have been missing the boat.
Nov/ Also Coralville does not have monthly pass...does not have a
punch card. They just collect the money each time somebody
gets on.
Norton/
Kubby/ It would be based on income and there might be two
scales ....
Vanderhoef/ At this point I would be more interested instead of a
sliding scale just have just a half price .... doing with Parks
and Rec..~ to be real consistent. So that if they show their
card, they know exactly what it is .....
Thornberry/ I will stay with the punch card and the $1.50 a
ride ....
Lehman/ There are some people who can't afford that.
Thornberry/ You are right. Where are they going? .... Are they going
down to the doctor or are they going down shopping?... I
understand you can't ask them .... You are still looking at
$9.00 a ride.
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February 14, 1996
Norton/ Might as well be consistent.
Nov/ They have to spend at least $1.00.
policy any less than that.
council Work Session
Page 27
I cannot go for a discount
Kubby/ We got four people to do a $.75 half price fare.
Norton/ If that is consistent with our other discount policy.
Nov/ Okay and they are going to have to show that they are on food
stamps or some other... listed programs.
Kubby/ What is our current policy that gives them 100% waiver?
Logsdon/ It is the same as a utility. If they have a Medicaid or
Title 19 card, if they are in the Assisted Housing Program and
have an annual income of less than $10,000 ....
Council/
Nov/ Go for consistency. The list that we had for utilities was not
exactly what he said because we didn't ask them what income
they had .... food stamps or social security or something like
that.
Kubby/ I would suggest that we make it the same qualifications that
it is currently ..... For every city service ....
Norton/ I thought we agreed on five categories for water and for
some other.
Atkins/ We are trying to make it all under one-
Norton/ ...Would that not be appropriate for the SEATS customers?
Atkins/ I think you have financially well off people who may be
disabled.
Norton/ I mean in terms of the five qualifications .....
Atkins/
Norton/ If not, we ought to expand that other list to make it
consistent.
Arkins/ I don't have a hard and fast answer ....
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council Work Session
Page 28
Kubby/ The qualification will be the thing that we come up that
makes it consistent throughout the city ....
Lehman/ I really disagree with 24 hour cab service. Cab service
should run the same hours as SEATS bus.
Kubby/ .... it is only to work.
Lehman/ We don't do it for anybody else that can't ride a public
bus... but we let them ride taxicabs and I think that is
wrong.
Baker/ If we use this criteria for SEATS and they have employment
at odd hours, I don't have any problem with us helping.
Lehman/
Baker/ Talking about disabled here. What about any service to
disabled, period?
Lehman/ I don't know. I think it needs to be consistent. I really
don't see us paying for a cab ride at 2:00 AM .....
Norton/ We spent $38,000 on cab fare last year.
Kubby/ That has gone up incredibly ....
Fowler/ Currently the cab rides after the SEATS hours are $2.00.
You can set any fee that you want to because that is not
during our transit. That is a supplementary service. So if you
would like... you may want to look at $3.00 or $5.00 ..... or
any kind of scale that you want to ..... outside of regular
hours. So you can do whatever you want to with it.
Lehman/ I would like to know how many rides occur during that
period of time that SEATS does not run.
council/ (All talking).
Nov/ If we are doing this according to what we absolutely have to
do, we would not have anything running later than 10:00 PM and
we would not have anything running on Sunday. We are offering
far more wide service than we need to offer on a paratransit
system. So do we want to go back to no service when fixed
route is not operating?
Kubby/ No. I would keep Sunday service.
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February 14, 1996
Council Work Session
Nov/ Okay. Why do you want to keep Sunday service?
Lehman/ ... church .... that
Norton/ Socialization.
Page 29
is the only way they have ....
Nov/ Do you think that if there were not a SEATS bus... the folks
who belong to the church might pick up the elderly?
You probably have a good point ....
Lehman/
Kubby/
.... That was not my sole reason ....
CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 96-28 SIDE 1
Arkins/ Sundays,
participate
I want to make sure people have the opportunity to
in living independently ..... increase... more
people are riding it because more people with disabilities are
getting more involved in the community economically through
jobs and shopping, recreation, social groups... hanging out.
Thornberry/ I don't think we need to have SEATS for people just
hanging out.
Vanderhoef/ .... I don't know anyone who belong to Iowa City groups
who would say no to giving a ride to someone.
Kubby/ If you have a big electric wheelchair, I can't pick that
physically up .... It is not as easy to say ....
Nov/ Even another kind of wheelchair is difficult to get in and out
of an automobile.
Baker/ Can we do a different rate structure? .... than our regular
fixed route schedule?
Nov/ We could...for nights as well.
Norton/ I think we ought to keep something for Sunday ....
Baker/ Let's keep it for Sunday but I would like us to talk about
the rate structure.
Thornberry/ If the ride
$10.00 .... I am saying
be more ....
is $9.00. What, charge them $8.00?
it should be more not less. It should
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February 14, 1996 Council Work Session Page 30
Norton/ It ain't going to be ....
Nov/ I am h-arlng higher rate for both Sunday and nights.
Thornberry/ ...and cabs?
Lehman/
Thornberry/ Why is the amount that we are paying for cabs so much
higher than it use to be?
Kubby/ Because we are trying to funnel people away from SEATS ....
Thornberry/ ..... they sure as heck found the taxis.
Fowler/ The current policy of saying no ride is what is increasing
the cab because when they call and want to schedule and SEATS
has every vehicle full at that time, they automatically put
them in a cab if they are an Iowa City resident.
Lehman/
Nov/ It happens regularly and we can change that policy.
Vanderhoef/ How many do you suspect a day?
Fowler/ Over 20 a day°
Nov/ There is no reason that we have to supply 20 cab rides a day.
This is a policy that we can change.
Norton/ Where are we? I guess I am lost. I think we are getting
lost here. Where are we? Have we decided on cab service or
not? Have we decided on Sunday or not?
Kubby/ We said we are going to keep Sunday service. We are going to
talk later about maybe a higher fare and what that should be.
We are going to keep after hour cab service for work purposes
but maybe a higher amount. But we haven't decided what those
amounts are.
Norton/
Nov/ We have decided something higher than the $1.50 but we did not
say anything more specific than that.
Vanderhoef/ For cab and Sunday I can look at right away and say
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February 14, 1996 Council Work Session Page 31
double, meaning at least to $3.00.
Norton/ Me, too.
Vanderhoef/ That would be a minimum place to start and I would talk
about higher than that.
Lehman/ What would you estimate the impact on our contract with
SEATS if we did in fact charge for every ride except for those
folks who qualify for half price ride? ....
Fowler/ We figured out-What about? $50,000 more, Ron? We are
currently getting about $25,000 in credit.
Logsdon/ They are figuring under this proposal (can't hear) .... If
you went to $1.50 .... increase the amount of money .... costs
are going to go down because of your cab service or you are
going to get more money in your fare box (can't hear).
Thornberry/
council/ (All talking).
Norton/ Not trivial what we are talking about ....
Thornberry/ What I would like to see them do is funnel the people
from SEATS and the cab into the buses if at all possible.
Nov/ That is why I think we ought to charge them regular fare
because that will encourage them to get on the bus ....
Kubby/ How to provide incentives... educating people about what
your options are .... do you know that you can catch such and
such a bus at this corner at this time that will cost you
$.75 ....
[ON BOARD: SEATS
$1.50
sliding scale fare/waiver $.75 fare
strip ticket
age not criteria
disability documentation
monthly pass-discounted volume purchase
low income policy consistent with city policy
Sunday service - different rate structure]
Thornberry/
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Baker/ What else do we have on the agenda today?
Nov/ Let's at least get something else done.
Arkins/ Can I say something in summary fashion? In all my years
here... frustrating.. this issue.. sense it in you all. We
have five separate systems if you want to think about it:
Cambus, county SEATS, Coralville Transit, Iowa City Transit
and a cab company.
Kubby/ And Bionic Bus.
Atkins/ Make it six.
Nov/ We got school buses.
Atkins/ We got at least three political bodies: Coralville city
council, Iowa City city council and the Board of Supervisors
and Regents are in there... plus impact of variety of private
contracts. Have we reached the point where we are just simply
going to have to tell ourselves ..... we may have to become
very very political aggressive about this issue and just
simply say this is crazy ..... There has got to be some
overriding policy statement and sometimes you may have to
create a different target .... Got to be a better way to do
this .... You are wearing me out because we spent so much time
on that one issue ....
Kubby/ Conversations have to start now... I got appointment with
Cambus people so I can better understand their funding
system .... What I am trying to do is we should be initiating
informal and formal discussions now ..... so that we can start
pushing to say .... come to some community decisions... we are
going to have a metropolitan service. We can start doing
incremental changes .... so that when physically we come
together it is not so difficult.
Nov/
.°.There is going to be a different city council here... and
in Coralville... We cannot say what is going to happen in five
years ....
Atkins/ We haven't done anything for 6-8 years .... The federal
government has caused the crisis .... Folks, I personally
believe we have reached the point where there has to be two
Iowa City council members and two Coralville and so fourth...
put them in a room and say what can we agree on .... what is
the agenda that we can agree on. Then put up the list of the
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February 14, 1996 Council Work Session Page 33
things that we are going to fight about and fight about them
until we can sort it out .... What really did it to me was when
you came back from the county and said by the way, it is not
$600,00, it is $550- .... There is something terribly wrong is
those numbers can be thrown around ..... tells me that that was
a political decision on their part and that we have got to
make difficult political decisions ....
Norton/ ...We all at various times expressed interest in a
metropolitan transit authority of some kind .... we have also
got to deal with this short term issue ....
Atkins/ ...next year or two has to be very productive years ....
Norton/ Those cuts are going to hit them. It is going to hit Cambus
and it is going to hit Coralville.
Atkins/ I just encourage you to find someway of having a discussion
or debate amongst yourselves ..... we have to change the way we
are doing business ....
Kubby/ It is a big change in policy saying you can't ride for free.
That is a huge difference ....
Atkins/ Coralville .... says we are not going to do that. Coralville
charges them to come into our town. We ship them back for
free. There is something wrong with the system ....
Kubby/ But why should we all do the least common denominator?
Atkins/ I don't know what the least common denominator is. What can
we agree on?
Lehman/ ..... they need to know to expect. The more consistent we
are the better off we all are ....
Thornberry/ If there was a metro-system .... all the rules would be
the same.
Atkins/ Certain public system .... that lend themselves to some
other way of doing business .... We always agree on
Halloween .... We agreed on an animal shelter. This one we
have millions and millions of dollars at stake. I think we
have to be very aggressive politically.
Vanderhoef/ I agree and I think when we put out any new figures ....
have to be real clear that we will be in deficit in '99 unless
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we change something ....
of some description ....
at this price.
looking for providing a metro-system,
these services are going to disappear
Atkins/
Kubby/ Then your numbers go so low that you can't justify the tax
base to subsidize them ....
Thornberry/ Naomi, I think it was a good idea that Steve had to set
up this meeting with Coralville and Iowa City and the county
to start with. I would like to see that set up.
Nov/ I think we can do that and I think it is the kind of thing
that we ought to first read the 1990 study and then think
about that.
Atkins/ Read this before hand ....
Nov/
Thornberry/
Atkins/ It says it won't work. However, you
you have to be politically aggressive.
make it work.
can make it work but
Operationally we can
Nov/
We have at least started to talk to Coralville .... so that we
can discuss this rationally. Coralville has already said that
they want $1.00 fare by July 1, 1997 .... still have our bus
pass accepted on the Coralville bus the way it is today. Are
Coralville people going to come to Iowa City d.t. and buy a
bus pass and use it in Coralville? ..... Is this the way to
operate?
Kubby/ .... sometimes the conclusion we draw is that we should go
that high ..... that we should not let Coralville's highness
dictate what we do for our system ....
Thornberry/ What we would like to do and what we can do may be two
different things.
Norton/
Nov/ Do you want to start something else?
Kubby/ .... Why don't we go to Larry's memo?
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February 14, 1996 Council Work Session Page 35
Atkins/ I wanted to thank all of you that did give me memos .....
makes it easier to come into these things. Thank you .... Gives
Us a better agenda to work with. We did not discuss parking
today. There has been some interest in seeing those fees go
up .... the way I left it there was one issue left on the
Boards and Commission and that was Housing and Community
Development Commission wanted $50,000
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February 14, 1996 Council Work Session Page 36
General Budget Discussion 96-28 S1
1. Atkins/ The way I left it there was one issue left on the
Boards and Commission and that was Housing and Community
Development Commission wanted $50,000 for services .... Life
Skills, etc.
Kubby/ For supported housing, you mean?
Atkins/ Yeah... they wanted $50,000.
Kubby/ Would this be to Life Skills to work with our Housing
Section 8?
Atkins/ My impression is they want to see an appropriation to the
Commission hopefully administered by staff on your behalf .....
They wanted money to do that ....
Thornberry/ There was some problem with that agency ....
Atkins/ They want to be able to help these folks put together a
package of services ..... We were aware of some of the concerns
and complaints. Deal more with the services. Do we as a city
want to provide these services?
Nov/ I don't see where the money will come from.
Kubby/ I think the Public Housing Authority gets a lot of
certificates back in because people are having trouble finding
property .... I think it would save people coming back through
the system again and again in providing some of those skills.
Nov/ Can HUD money be used to contract for those skills?
Atkins/ ...says family self sufficiency .... no money on a part of
it as I recall.
Norton/ I thought there were other grant sources...
Atkins/ I think .... The Commission .... they wish the city to be
more aggressive about it. These agencies exist ....
Kubby/ dabl h ing '
...other affor e ous issues ....
Nov/
I like the Housing Fellowship because they do this as a
group .... for people they house. And HACAP does this for the
people that they house. So I am not sure how else to handle
this.
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February 14, 1996 Council Work Session
Kubby/ So there aren't people who are interested
would like to do
Norton/ ... but where
going to do with
Atkins/ I was the verbal
Norton/
Arkins/ It does become
Agencies budget ....
some amount.
is the document...
it.
presentation .....
Page 37
in any amount? I
that says what they were
Linda Murray.
indirectly an expansion of your Aid to
Nov/ ...CDBG proposal .... the Commission could grant that money to
them, could they not?
Atkins/ The Commission cannot grant money. Your commissions are
advisory. Only you can grant the money.
Nov/ Could a grant proposal for this service go to that commission
and then they could fund that agency or not?
Atkins/ Yeah, if you made that decision.
Kubby/ But it most likely would come from the public services
category which is a maximum of 15% and we use a bunch of that
for Aid to Agencies ....
Nov/ This would have to come out of that 15% rather than the
general-
Kubby/
Arkins/
Nov/
Kubby/ So it sounds like we are saying no at this point.
2. Norton/ Take $10,000 out of ICAD.
Atkins/ .... ICAD, you wanted is separate discussion on that. The
appropriation is $50,000 ....
Baker/ This may be the last year ....
Atkins/ You did indicate a separate discussion ....
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February 14, 1996 council Work Session
Page 38
Kubby/ ...If we are going to have that policy for any group ....
Nov/
They are in the process of re-evaluating their structure. I
think even before we got there they were in that process ....
I have not gone through the details ..... I have not gone
through the ICAD stuff yet.
Kubby/ I would feel fine about doing $40,000 for ICAD this year.
Lehman/ I think I would certainly support the $50-.... looking for
economic development. I don't know how effective they are. it
is very very difficult to evaluate ....
Baker/ One of the things I would like to talk about is taking a
comparable funding amount for Iowa City development .... Iowa
City area development .... Their obligation is for Iowa City
development ....
Nov/ This is going to take a large chunk of time on another day.
Atkins/ The money is in the budget at $50-.... I think we owe them
some lead time to tell them that we are going to change
that ....
Kubby/ We give them 25% of their budget... I think we should have
a regional thing .... Doesn't mean we have to pay 25% of their
budget to do good stuff.
Nov/ We are certainly more than 25% of the county population ....
Kubby/ .... lots of ways we can look at it.
Baker/
Baker/ This is going to be an easy one .... When we had the
Conference Board meeting when we had a meeting about the
salary study. I went to talk to Sylvia after the meeting, if
you look at the hours worked, your statement that they were
already at the top of the salary range of comparable city
positions .... They exceed the salary range for comparable city
positions. I do want us to have serious discussions about all
this talk about consolidation and this is an area that we have
a lot more control over than transit .... I think a salary
freeze for the office is appropriate .... serious about
reviewing that office.
Thornberry/ ... where they are in the salary range, I agree with
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you.
Baker/ Then we can talk about the other issues. Start with that.
But we have to agree to it .... then county and school
board ....
Atkins/ (Can't hear).
Nov/ What was that? I didn't hear.
Arkins/ They are not represented by a bargaining unit .....
Nov/ I think we also have to remember that if we go for a GIS
system it will affect the operation in this office .... We
have to keep this in mind ....
Baker/ Also I know we have talked about a low income policy change
a couple of weeks ago to allow us some flexibility in the
future. A freeze here would also (can't hear). I think upon
work done and salary range of comparable jobs, a salary freeze
is appropriate.
Lehman/ That is two.
Vanderhoef/ I will look at it.
Norton/ I would go with that. It will send a fairly heavy message.
Arkins/ The next Conference Board meeting is-
Karr/ 26th and it is the p.h. on the-
Baker/
Nov/ This is a difficult issue. They may have an option to say we
will work 40 hours and we will keep our office open an extra
hour a day or whatever it takes because they do have some
autonomy in that respect.
Baker/ .... offer to keep the office open for a pay increase, that
was then and this is now .... negotiate very hard for the whole
structure of the office.
Nov/ I don't feel that strongly.
Baker/ I see three hands.
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Norton/ One, two, three.
Kubby/ I would be another vote in that direction although I am not
firm in it ....
Baker/ That I should go ahead and talk to them? But we don't have
a majority yet.
Lehman/ I would like to know a little more about it.
Norton/ What is the discussion tomorrow...? getting together?
Baker/ Dan wants to sit down with at least three council members.
And I have a series of questions for him that go into his
memo .... regardless of that I have no problem with the freeze
based upon the current salaries ....
Thornberry/ Still got to be coordinated with the county and school
board ....
Baker/
Nov/ Council's position is not all that clear.
Norton/ What are the implications for us taking on a freeze?
Lehman/ If you were the city assessor and all of a sudden out of
the blue you get your salary ..... needs to be some
dialogue .... I really think, if you are going to freeze my
salary, let's talk about it ....
Baker/ Do you want to have
or?
Lehman/ I think the guy has
from.
another meeting with Dan as a council
to have some idea where we are coming
Baker/ Do you want to have a council meeting or an informal meeting
with a minority of council?
Atkins/ Just an observation.
..... You are still one
You are only one of three supervisors
vote out of three.
Council/
Nov/ Dan might be quite able to persuade the county and the school
board to vote on his side ....
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Vanderhoef/ I would like to hear some more.
Norton/ Why can't a little council subcommittee meet with Dan and
see where we are at?
Nov/ Or we can invite him to come here on the 20th ....
Baker/ All right, can I go ahead and set up a small group meeting?
Nov/ Steve, what do you think?
Atkins/ I am fine on that if you want to do that. I do think the
actions of freezing are dramatic and it sends a message which
is-I think you have to be very very careful about the moral of
the operation ..... Because I don't have direct supervisory
responsibility of his-Dan.. we need to come aside, we need to
talk. I don't have that authority to do that ....
Council/ (All talking).
Norton/ Who is the little committee?
Nov/ Let's set a committee. Larry, Ernie, somebody volunteer. Who?
Vanderhoef/ I am okay with it, too.
Thornberry/ I will do it if .... I will be an alternate.
Atkins/ You make those arrangements. If you need something from me
you will tell me. Larry is leaving.
[Baker leaves 11:50 AM]
4. Atkins/ I would like your permission to prepare some sort of a
memo about the transportation .... just a think piece.
Nov/ I was about to say if you don't, I will.
Atkins/ I would like to do something .... I don't like to be stuck.
Council/ (All talking) ....
Atkins/ This is so much an issue of policy as it is finance .... I
will prepare something.
5. Kubby/ There were just a few small things on my memo that I
would like a chance to go through. One of them is the another
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Council Work Session
Page 42
Police Department thing. Common sense tells me where we need
more help is in the records .... versus administration ....
Atkins/ I did not ask him a priority... ask him to get that back to
me very quickly.
Nov/ Kind of thing we should know is what priorities.
6o Kubby/ The other thing was #9 on page 2 about Solid Waste.
Atkins/ That is out, forget it. It is not going to happen. Floyd
and I talked about it .... we wanted to prepare something for
you separately. We will bring it back to you separately .....
o
Kubby/ #5 The labor management council thing. I asked Steve to
give us some kind of written update because last year at this
time we directed management to initiate the discussion about
healthcare cost containment measures.
Atkins/
Kubby/ I assume we are going to get kind of an update report on
what happened at that meeting. Then there was a side agreement
last year to talk about childcare and that could have big
budget implications. I would like us to direct staff... to
initiate discussions about that. We have a side letter of
agreement .... Why don't we initiate that discussion?
Atkins/ We do have a new bargaining agent, too. Jan gone, we have
a new person ....
8. Norton/ Did we defer discussion on ICAD?
Kubby/ I think there was at least four people who wanted to stay at
$50,000 in the budget.
Arkins/ I will prepare a little summary memo .... so you will kind
of have an idea of what is hanging out there ....
Kubby/ There was two other things about transit we didn't get
to. We talked about having a child fare .... idea about a
family package.
Atkins/ We have, we haven't prepared something for you... bottom
line concern was if a person buys a pass and I give it to
another member of my family .... haven't got an answer for you.
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February 14, 1996 Council Work Session Page 43
10. Kubby/ Other thing... having a citizens committee about
transportation .... such a big percentage of our budget.
Atkins/ Proposed it with SEATS and never got anywhere with the
county ....
Kubby/ ...that maybe we have one ....
Atkins/
Kubby/
Council/ (All talking).
11. Nov/ Marian, did Karin Franklin give you the Fringe Area
information last night.
Karr/ Yes, she did and I just sent it up to her this morning
because you didn't ask for it last night. Yes, I can get it.
Nov/ I was hoping you would bring it ....
Karr/ I can run up and see.
Nov/ We are going to talk about the Fringe Area next week and there
is a little stack of information. We could read it between now
and the 20th .... Get it now. It gives us a little more time to
think about it .....
12. Kubby/ ...figure out a time frame about deciding about First
Avenue and Muscatine.
Atkins/ We are in up to here. I need to have some confirmation .... I would like to know sooner than later ....
Kubby/ I know Larry said three lane for sure. I am three. Dee, you
are for three?
Nov/ I am inclined to stay with three.
Kubby/
Norton/ You caused me to think very hard...
Thornberry/ I went back and drove it.
Vanderhoef/ The cost of doing it now and in ten years to redo it
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February 14, 1996
Council Work Session
13.
is, well, inefficient.
Atkins/ Just to let you know, Bette Meisel has
Page 44
resigned ....
Marty has taken a job in Washington D.C ..... June ....
Nov/ We will start advertising and get somebody in by the July 17
Atkins/ We will do all the things that have to be done ....
Kubby/ That will be a very sought after position.
14. Vanderhoef/ Who wants to go see the Citizen Building besides
me? ... Three.
15. Vanderhoef/ We had this other invitation that we were going to
(Water Festival)
Norton/ Is this until the end of March?
Kubby/ It is, the Water Festival.
Council/ (All talking).
Thornberry/ Let them
Kubby/ We will cover
Nov/ I have only one
tell her I will
Adjourned: 12:00 PM.
know that we will have it covered.
it but details later.
time that is open. So I will call Genelle and
be there at that time.
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of February 14, 1996.
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