HomeMy WebLinkAbout1998-04-06 TranscriptionApril 6, 1998 Council Work Session page 1
April 6, 1998
Council Work Session
6:00 PM
Council: Lehman, Champion, Kubby, Norton, O'Donnell, Thomberry, Vanderhoef.
Staff: Atkins, Helling, Karr, Dilkes, Winklehake, Klingamon, Franklin, Boothroy, Fosse,
Long, Head, Winstead, Nasby, Barnes, Grosvenor, Davidson.
Housing and Community Development Commission: Schmuch, Gadson, Renquist,
Moraski, Kuhlmann.
Tapes: 98-50, all; 98-51, all; 98-52, Side 1.
FY99 CDBG/HOME Allocations 98-50 S1
Lehman/We are going to be doing the CDBG and HOME Fund recommendations.
Head/Hopefully you got your packet of information. It has in it a memo from the
Housing and Community Development Commission and that memo presented to
you their justifications and funding recommendations for the FY99. They have
also included for you the ranking criteria for CDBG and HOME projects ....
ranking criteria... extensive... five major categories: need, leveraging, feasibility
impact, and capacity-history of the organizing to carry out the project. Using this
form, the commissioners ranked the projects .... Summary sheet... all have
associated score with each project... requested amount and the proposed amount
for each project .... They tried to fund as many projects as they could based on
limited amount of CDBG and HOME funds .... Justifications... outlined .... reasons
for their rankings of these projects .... Overview... Last item in this packet are their
minutes from the March 12 meeting... With that overview I will turn things over
to the chair, Gretchen.
Gretchen Schmuck/
Kubby/I noticed there is only one economic development project .... Could committee
talk about why there weren't more money being allocated to economic
development?
Schmuck / Part of it was our adherence to the ranking sheet and the format that we chose
to adhere to. There were certain projects that to be funded would require money to
be put over from economic development or housing .... public facilities... ended up
borrowing from other categories .... Fact that we went to first priority down to
20th .... by just plain overall rank ....
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Kubby/You chose to not rank within category but to rank all of them.
Schmuck / Correct ....Essentially we ran out of money. 16 was the last project we funded.
Vanderhoef/
Schmuck/
Vanderhoef/ ....two of those economic development projects...
Schmuck/...difficult .... number of good requests with the amount of money that we had
to allocate... I don't think this budget presents what anyone of us individually
would have come up with .... Overall goal was to fund as many projects as
possible .... people got between 50-80% of their funding. Only two projects got
100% of what they asked for .... spread the money as far as we could.
Kubby/Some discussion.. comparing Riverview Place Apartments with... senior housing
partnership... Bob Bums... Have a discussion about how you decided between ....
money would go to the tenants, not the project... leverage other funds... Powerful
arguments to me ....
Schmuck/Part of that stemmed from the initial proposal that Mr. Bums put forth was for
tenant based rental assistance ..... Our traderstanding that you cannot have the city
administer tenant based rental assistance for a particular project in mind... real
concerns from that approach .... Opted to go by what was written .... deadlines ....
Norton/Quite a bit of discussion .... about tenant based rental systems... tenant-to-
ownership problems... tension on which way to go .... What do you say? ....
Schmuck/Part of that was we set ourselves up to look at the whole continuum... When
you have competing high priorities, it is very hard to decide which makes sense
where. TOP Program is something new. It is always nice to try something new...
TBRA, the Housing Commission said that wouldn't have been their priority if
funding the two. However.. rankings... overall consensus was we felt more
inclined to fund TBRA for meeting certain needs in the community ....
Norton/They hit a different income levels ....
Schmuck/...how you meet the needs of both groups.
Champion/I was sort of disappointed with the lack of the economic growth fund ....
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Schmuck/ISED has come back several times. They do have money to target very low
income folks .... they are still able to serve low income persons ....
Vanderhoeff Say that again... level of income ....
Schmuck/You can be very low income .... ISED does have money they can provide .... the
moneys that came from CDBG last year was for also very low income folks ....
Vanderhoef/Why then did you exclude those people that are still in the 50%?
Schmuck/As we ran out of money, we thought this agency is still able to serve some very
low income folks. They have come back to the table for five years. We had to
draw the line somewhere.
Vanderhoef/It is difficult for me to see this... how many housing projects are going on
out there and not a similar amount... I expect some support for these folks to get
into a good job and move forward. I see this as job creation in its own way ....A
way to move forward ....
Norton/Hasn't ISED had funding?
Vanderhoeff I am not sure they have the funding availability to them for this group of
people ..... That in-between group is the group that I am concerned about .... the
ones that I would like to target.
Kubby/Irony .... Precision Optics ....helping to create businesses ....
Norton/Don't they have other sources? ....
Kubby/I had some follow up questions for Jason Freedman... If you are not funded with
this program .... can they get continued follow-up? .... Need to do better follow-up
with people and longer term support... they are doing that .... and now if they don't
get CDBG moneys for those people... Are there any other ways that we can help
at least for the follow-up for the businesses that were started with the CDBG
grant .... to see them through .... I don't know where that would come from ....
Norton/Small Business Administration .... in terms of putting up money ....
Champion/...financing .... They are not going to come and see if things are going well ....
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Kubby/And trouble shooting before things become a financial problem ....
Champion/There are volunteers in town who will work with businesses .... It would
depend on the person who has started this little business to call them ....They
would have to call them.
Vanderhoeff Seems like the $30,000 request is a pretty minimal request when you look at
the size of this total budget ....
Norton/How did that total money get broken down into the four categories? ....
Schmuck/Staff does those wonderful calculations where it is based on the City Steps
priorities. That is just a guideline .... chosen.. to keep that flexible ....
Vanderhoef/How do you measure pay-back into the program?... for something like an
economic development project?
Schmuck/That is a challenging thing. We try to include in the ranking... leverage .... in-
kind things... part of what we figure .... I did notice that our second and third
priorities overall were two projects that are straight out grants ....
Joyce Morashi/We also looked at the number of jobs created .... discussed how many jobs
were created for the target population ....
Kubby/And what will the new number of employees be with the $75,0007
Long/Six.
Kubby/So we do .... monitor the income of the employees?
Head/Yeah, we can monitor it.
Thornberry/What is the difference in the available funds this year compared to last year?
Kubby/Pretty close.
Thornberry/I was just looking at the four categories .... items that got the recommendation
and requests were the same. One being the Furniture Project for Domestic
Violence, the transitional housing support, the contingency fund and $205,000 for
administration. Is this $205,000 for administration more than it was last year or
the same?
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Head/Probably a little less, the same or a little less ....11% to 12% which the CB rules...
allows... 20% for administration.
Thornberry/ ....administration got what they requested, not everybody else did.
Norton/Probably took that off the top.
(All talking).
Lehman/I suspect that was not really a negotiable figure ....
Kubby/ .... like this Project Wheel .... hearing from families that had kids participating ....
touches on a lot of different areas .... gives them some job skills .... Gets them on
the road... Seems like a really great thing.
Champion/Wasn't there a lack of participation? ....
(All talking).
Schmuck/When City Steps was put together most youth projects received very low
priority .... disadvantage in our rankings because it was not considered a high
priority population in our city .... That particular public service is down so low...
Kubby/
Schmuck/Back in City Steps... we have UAY .... needs being met ....
Norton/Did River Place get their rezoning? Some concerns were expressed ....
Franklin/We have an application in. It still has to go through the process... isn't
completed yet ..... Would be re-allocated...
O'Donnell/Could you explain a little bit on #20, Senior Housing Rental Assistance?
Schrnuck/...Mr. Bums proposed ....
O'Donnell/That seems like it should be funded.
Schmuck/The concern was the written application was for tenant based rental
assistance... cannot be project specific .... kind of a concern.
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Renquist/If you look on page 5 .... not clear who was going to administer the program.
Kubby/If Riverview Place Apartments does not get the rezoning then is it council's
discretion to say open it up again? ....
Schmuck/My understanding is you can do whatever you want .... say to the
Commission... decide to fully fund the higher rated projects ....
Lehman/I would think using the ranking system .... is something we felt was valuable .... I
wouldn't want your job for a second .... We really appreciate the effort that you put
into this .... As far as the council is concerned, if we feel .... satisfied with the
rankings and the way they did it. It is a very fair way with the criteria they were
given .... If we, as a council, feel there are certain priorities that were not
recognized, then.. it behooves us to say next year perhaps there should be a
different rating system ....
Norton/Wise... to take a look at the rating sheet before they go into the process ....
Lehman/
Kubby/We tweak it every year .... longer term ....
Vanderhoef/One thing I would like to consider .... wondered about .... One of the criteria
that is not be addressed at all here is on any of these housing projects .... whether
any of these remain on the tax roll and they affect the city .... That is something we
ought to look at carefully because there is a positive thing in creating money for
the city if this happens .... I am not saying they should all be on the tax rolls .....
Kubby/Or at least paying a payment in lieu of taxes as part of that.
Vanderhoef/And that could be a criteria ....Where did the points go in on the this rating
system for that?
Kuhlmann/Under .... projects leverages other financial reinforces. We would put that
under that category ..... did come up .... then we would have to charge high rents ....
yes, stayed on the tax rolls but then you are not serving the target population ....
Vanderhoef/Depends on whether it has a guaranteed fair rent situation coupled with that.
Norton/But to serve that lowest category is very hard to meet every goal ....
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Schmuck/ ....under the leveraging ....leverages other financial resources including in-
kind ....some of it is implicit in there... project budget ....
Lehman/After going through these ratings and evaluations, I hope you feel free to
suggest to us ....if some of the criteria are not exactly what you feel they should
be.
Kubby/
Lehman/You could adjust them... I think it is important that you are comfortable with the
criteria.
Schmuck/I think it has kept us internally consistent...
Norton/What do you do with ones that are one year... one time request? Does it give
them more points if it is one time ....
Kuhlmann/...Maybe this is the place for them to come year after year .... So this year we
tried to keep it in line ....
Kubby/I remember once UAY came in... was going to be a one time request but you just
don't know .... funding streams change... and they come back ....
Norton/
Schmuck/
Kubby/I have a last question about the two proposals that got funding that are for
profit .... public moneys to a specific business, will they have to go through our
economic development guidelines questionnaire?
Head/I hadn't thought about that particularly ....wages are in line ....
Kubby/Do we know that is true for Riverview Apartments?
Nasby/Have to pay David Bacon wages ....
Kubby/But there are other issues there besides wages and benefits .... also environmental
issues .... Want staff to look at our policies to see how they are written .....
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Franklin/When you brought up Riverview, what were you thinking? ....
Kubby/Because they are just private companies .... for profit organization ....
Franklin/It is just that the financial assistance guidelines, they didn't envision that
residential kind of development.
Kubby/I am just asking the question ..... We should treat a business owned by a low
income person the same as any business .... fall into our guidelines. We should ask
the question.
Thomberry/I have another question regarding the housing projects on acquisition and
rehab. It looks like you are buying 14 houses. Are these 14 houses that are on the
tax rolls going to be taken off the tax rolls and rented to low income families?
Head/Essentially that is correct... Greater Iowa City Housing Fellowship pays .... funds in
lieu of.
Thornberry/What percentage of taxes is that and for how long is that paid?
Head/I am not sure.
Norton/Charlie is here.
Charlie Eastham/The cashflow analysis for this project shows us paying 25% of the full
taxable amount for this particular project.
Thornberry/For what length of time?
Eastham/For the life of the program.
Thornberry/25% ....
Eastham/That enables us to meet the rent targets and have less public financing than we
would have ....
Thornberry/Could you tell me how many houses are in this program at this time? .... How
many houses that you bought that go off the tax rolls that you are paying taxes in
lieu of at a smaller percentage than what would be taxed?
Kubby/You mean for their whole program?
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Eastham/At the end of... 1998 .... complete current projects, we will own 50 units that are
eligible for property tax exemption ....
Thornberry/ ....64 ....
Norton/Without that kind of support... you can't stay within the rent levels...
Thornberry/...you could rent apartments in lieu of houses ....I have got a problem with
taking houses off the tax rolls.
Norton/Not everybody fits in an apartment.
Champion/...small percent of houses.
Thornberry/I think it is plenty ....
Norton/
Lehman/Any other questions .... Thank you very very much.
Norton/Timing here... p.h. is the 28th ....more questions by that time. Then we act on ....
May 12 ....
Head/We have to submit it to HUD by May 15.
Norton/When does your group meet again?
Head/April 16.
Norton/
Lehman/I think if we have any severe difficulties... should bring those up right now ....
Kubby/We only thought... follow up for the people... take some money out of
contingency to fund them specifically for follow-up... CDBG money.
Vanderhoef/$30,000 right now out of contingency .... That or ask them to find $30,000
out of the other... Give them the choice of where to find the $30,000.
Kubby/In the past 3-4 years, how much of the contingency has been used? ....
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(All talking).
Norton/Do you have unallocated '98? ....
(All talking).
Norton/So you have already calculated that.
Kubby/I would be friendly to what Dee is talking about.
Champion/
Vanderhoef/Adds jobs... in the future.
Norton/
Kuhlmann/ .... many of the ISED jobs are part-time .... not really self-sufficient income ....
looking at people who were going to be given job skills and health benefits ....
company that will continue to grow ....
Norton/...I have not studied the overall record.
Kubby/...get more informed about ISED and question them .... to put that out there...
possibility ....
Lehman/If we are going to individually look at this... personally helpful to follow the
reasoning used by the committee... You worked very hard on this .... I would like
the criteria that didn't perhaps choose that. I think you have already given us some
of that .... If there were a couple of reasons... If we are going to look through it, I
think we should hear your reasoning ....
Kuhlmann/...ISED overheads costs were higher ....
Lehman/Those are the kinds of things we need to hear.
Renquist/Also we have funded them for five years now ....unspoken rule ....
Kubby/We expect people who keep coming back to provide more and more service ....
Head/ISED was asked to look for alternative funding sources .... That hasn't happened.
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Champion/
Thornberry/I am sure you studied each one ....
Kubby/Last year we changed something ....
Renquist/Another thing .... Toms ....cutting edge of technology... they need that
equipment now .... If he is not given that funding, future of that business may not
be as bright.
Kubby/With this amount, will he be able to get the automatic stuff?. ....
Norton/Did we not fund them last year?
(All talking).
Kubby/It is one of the industries that is supported by our criteria ....
Norton/IfRiverview doesn't come through, then you already know where that is going to
go?
Schmuck/No ....
Renquist/When will you have an idea of when you will no when that zoning will come
through?
Lehman/
Franklin/Oh yes...probably be about a month.
Kuhlman/
(All talking).
Norton/...committee members... dissident ones are not on hand .... noticed the way the
votes moved around ....
Lehman/Thank you.
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Review Zoning Matters 98-50 S2
a. Public hearing on an ordinance conditionally changing the zoning designation on a 10-
acre tract located on the south side of Melrose Avenue and west of West High School
from Low Density Single-Family (RS-5) to Planned Development Housing (OPDH-8) to
permit an 80 dwelling unit retirement community. (REZ98-0002)
Franklin/P.h. on an ordinance changing the zoning .... This is a development called the
Melrose Retirement Community. It is on lot 117 of the Galway Subdivision... 80
dwelling unit retirement community that includes 22 assisted living units and 58
independent living units. (Refers to map) .... I have some pictures here.
Lehman/Is there a walkway to West High?
Franklin/Remember when we talked about the Galway Subdivision, the place where we
are looking at a walkway is on the next lot south in that next subdivision. I talked
to Dave Cahill who is the developer of this project and ask him if he would
commit to putting that sidewalk in... either when the subdivision occurred just
south or when the subdivision to the west occurred .... connection between the
existing Galway Subdivision and this area (refers to map). And he said yes he
would be willing to commit to that. We will put that in the legal papers for
Galway, Part 5.
Champion/
Franklin/(Refers to map). What that would do is it would take you over to the parking lot
on the west side of West High .... There is a door right there...
Norton/We talked about this the last time we discussed access ....
Franklin/The whole debate has been exactly when it would be built .... (Refers to map) ....
Norton/
Franklin/The district will open the fence there and put in a gate once we put the walk in.
Kubby/Could we talk about the sewer issue a little bit?
Franklin/Yes. The developers are negotiating with the University of Iowa to connect with
the sewer that goes through University property over to the Hawkeye lift station.
Kubby/
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Franklin/...they are having meetings... They are working on getting those agreements
taken care of to get the easements that are necessary to get the sewer connection ....
Kubby/...Sensitive Areas Ordinance...
CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 98-50 SIDE 2
Franklin/...have consulted with the State archeologist. They have received a
communication back from the State Historical Society indicating that there was
some evaluation done here with the Melrose Avenue expansion project. The State
Historical Society... will then suggest you do a full archeological survey on the
site .... One thing that we can be fairly assured of is that .... they did the review...
There are no burial sites which is the thing that stops you from doing anything ....
The developer then can choose whether to do the archeological survey or not ....
not a public project... the state cmmot require it.
Kubby/ ....State archeologists... do something on their own?
Franklin/They can do it on their own .... limited funding ....
Norton/Do the trees all come up here?
Franklin/On that front part (refers to map) .... This indicates that there would be planting
of additional trees here. How much they will save of existing trees, I can't say. It
doesn't come under the Sensitive Areas... not two acres ....
You do need to continue this p.h. to April 28. That will allow more time to work
through the CZA with the applicants as well as work out the sewer issues.
Norton/There is a CZA. Then we could incorporate in there?
Franklin/You could.
Norton/Okay.
Kubby/General point... Comp Plan only has a lowest category for density at 2-8. But our
lowest density categories are 5 and 8. Whenever anybody wants to rezone
something from RS-5 to RS-8, the Comp Plan is always going to say yes, that is
appropriate.
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Franklin/It is going to say it is possible... we still evaluate it .... whether that higher
density would have an adverse affect on properties around it .... The proximity of
this site to Melrose Avenue and to the arterial...school is just east of it... indicated
to us.. appropriate place to have a slightly high density.
Kubby/
Franklin/
b. Conditionally changing the zoning designation on a 4.46-acre tract located at 500
Foster Road from Interim Development Single-Family Residential (IDRS) to Sensitive
Areas Overlay-8 (OSA-8) to permit 35 dwelling units and approving a preliminary
Sensitive Areas Development Plan. (REZ97-0011)
(1) Public Hearing (continued from March 24)
(2) Consider an Ordinance (First consideration)
Franklin/P.h. and possibly first consideration... on Foster Road. The P/Z Commission
reconsidered this project last Thursday and they have recommended that the
council approve the 32 dwelling units with a 20 unit, 2-3 story multi-family
residential building on the site with a number of conditions... relate to the grading
plans, construction plans being reviewed and approved prior to the council's
action on this. Those should be done by April 28 which would indicate to me that
you should not do first consideration then, tomorrow night. You should defer the
consideration.
Lehman/We don't need to continue the hearing?
Franklin/
Karr/The CZA has not been signed.
Franklin/It may be signed by tomorrow. If it is not signed by tomorrow, then you will
have to continue it.
Champion/
Franklin/Grading and construction plans .... need to be done .... first consideration should
then be April 28. Prior to our administrative approval of the Sensitive Areas
Development Plan .... We need to get easements and escrow for the various things
that are listed there... Also a Tree Protection Plan ....
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Norton/...you can work with them on specific trees, can't you?
Franklin/Yes, you could. ! would have to go back- Well, I will have to talk to some of
the staff to see exactly what that was for .... That plan would need to be reviewed
prior to our administrative approval. So your concern is preservation as well as
protection?
Norton/
Franklin/Protection means protection of existing trees ....
Norton/
Franklin/It may be very specific to particular trees.
Kubby/
Norton/...I am also interested in preservation ....right where the new entrance is going to
be ....
Kubby/
Norton/I want to be sure that when we do those details, we look at those trees in
particular ....
Kubby/...environmental inspector ....
Norton/Where does that r.o.w. come out of 7. ....rock wall along there on Bud's side ....
Franklin/(Refers to map). The wall is along here ....
Norton/Does that wall come down because of the construction?
Franklin/The wall is going to be saved ....(refers to map)... gentler slope down to Foster
Road ....
O'Donnell/Is the plan to close the existing drive there now?
Franklin/At the time when Bud and Betty no longer live in the residence or Foster Road
widening project is done, that driveway would be closed, whichever of those
events happens first.
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Vanderhoef/So what happens to the wall when the road is widened?
Franklin/It should be intact .... The two other conditions .... building footprints and
exterior materials for the duplexes, s.f. and the 20 unit building have to meet the
different plans that have been submitted .... Do you want me to show overheads of
those? (Shows overheads of 20 unit building, s.f., duplex).
Norton/...what are the structures on the property to the west? How high are those?
Franklin/I have a plan here that shows the relationship between this building the existing
building.
Kubby/Do we know if this building will be taller than trees that will kept around there?
Norton/...behind the trees on the slope.
Kubby/...mature tree canopy ....
Franklin/I would think that you are not going to be seeing those trees. The trees will be
behind it .... What this shows you is the relationship between the buildings that are
proposed and the existing buildings in relationship to the grades ....the 20 unit
building is higher.
Kubby/It was at 45 and it is down at 33.
Franklin/(Refers to plans) ....
Norton/The people in these others are certainly going to see this building ....
Franklin/Absolutely... a big change ....
Norton/Karin... advantages to the city from this rezoning?
Franklin/This is one area of the community .... look at the entire peninsula .... There is
going to be a change in his area... sewer... make site developable... There is going
to be a dramatic change in this area. It is a portion of the city that is close to our
downtown, it is close to existing services .... We have talked about... how we can
get a little high density in the community so we don't have to keep going out ....
To have this RS-8... appropriate location to look at the possibility of this slightly
higher density .... people who live there now are not going to like it ....
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Norton/...open space?
Franklin/If you had lower density, you would have even more open space? ..... Are there
advantages to having a little bit higher density in this area? ....
Norton/
Franklin/We are going to have limitations as we go farther in on the peninsula due to the
fact that Foster Road is going to be our primary means of access to all of the
development in there .... We will be looking at another roadway... north... that
would go through the mobile home park .... secondary access .... future ....
Norton/Isn't that private road now?
Franklin/Yes.. private lane... development enters to the north ....
Norton/This argument about appropriate slight density increase ..... That will not happen
presumably further west? ....
Franklin/In the calculations that we have done... probably some opportunity around the
mobile home park... just have just a slightly higher density ..... 12 tops .... As you
go farther to the west and you get into Washington Park property... peninsula
property beyond the Elks Club, that is where we are looking at Foster Road being
the primary or only means of access .... going to have to keep that down at 5.
Kubby/How many bedrooms will be in the multi-family?...
Franklin/Can the developer answer that?
Allen Yates/8 three-bedroom as 12 two-bedroom ....
Kubby/Bedroom size is really relevant ....
Franklin/This project also has duplexes in it .... then there is a s.f. component in it also...
Struggled with ....garage doors ....(Refers to drawings)... garages are actually
pushed back ....pulled the unit up some... also putting second story on one half of
the duplex... carries your eye away fi'om the garage door and up to the second
story .... difficult .... trying to avoid going into the hillside .... It is a challenge.
Norton/Is there a private road in there?
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Franklin/Yes .... 20 .... We have a turn around that is available... working with Fire
Department with this all along, too ..... (Refers to overhead) .... It has gone through
the Fire Department and they feel it is adequate to service ....
Kubby/In A. of the CZA, it says "escrows for other required public improvements as is
a~ppropriate." That seems pretty non-specific. What does that mean? ....
(All talking).
Kubby/If we could clarify that .... Some correspondence from the neighborhood
mentioned something about a change in the Comp Plan and there is no change in
the Comp Plan?
Franklin/No ....It started out as a 12 ....that would have been why.
Thornberry/ .... duplexes, when they have a double garage, there is a space between the
two driveways. Is that for plantings? ....
Franklin/I see what you are talking about .... median or berm strip... distinguish between
the two drives .... a delineation between the two drives so everybody stays on their
own side .... Probably be raised ....
Larry Schnittjer/(Can't hear).
Thornberry/Can a firetruck back into somebody's driveway and turn around?...
Atkins/Yes, they can. They will go where they have to go to get there.
Thomberry/To turn around to go back?
Atkins/I have paid one truck yard damage in my life.
Franklin/...we try to make sure that that doesn't have to happen ....
Thornberry/
Norton/Karin, the second paragraph on the CZA, says 35 dwelling units. Shouldn't it say
32?
Franklin/You should have a revised one .... Okay ....
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Karr/I got the handouts out here because I didn't know where everybody was sitting.
Franklin/You will get ....
Kubby/I would like to continue the p.h. We are not going to vote on it this time
anyway ....
Lehman/I have no problem .... 28th .... if there is a little discussion... agreeable to council
to vote that night after we close the hearing?
Kubby/
Lehman/But no one would have a problem with voting that night? Close the heating and
vote .... If we close the hearing tomorrow night, we wouldn't vote until the 28th
anyway ....
Kubby/
Lehman/
Vanderhoef/We have it on the agenda for tomorrow night that we were closing the p.h.
and doing first consideration.
Franklin/But I asked you to defer.
Vanderhoef/I see no problem with doing then on the 28th ....
c. Conditionally changing the zoning designation on approximately 41 acres located
between Lower West Branch Road and Court Street extended, approximately 4/5 miles
west of Taft Avenue from Low Density Single-Family Residential (RS-5) to Medium
Density Single-Family Residential (RS-8) for 29.1 acres and Low Density Multi-Family
Residential (RMo12) for 11.9 acres. (REZ97-0019)
(1) Public Hearing
(2) Consider an Ordinance (First consideration)
Franklin/The next item- Continue both a. & b. p.h.s. Item c. is the Windsor Ridge
Extension and the CZA is signed. This is already to go .... You can go ahead and
close the p.h. and have your first consideration tomorrow night.
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Kubby/ ....You were going to ask the developer... postponing the rezoning until the NE
Planning District ....
Franklin/I did talk to him about that. He would prefer not to. What he is trying to do with
this is to get some zoning in place before the s.f. development... comes too far
north .... As people buy lots in the northern part of the existing Windsor Ridge,
they know what the zoning is going to be in that area and they are on notice .....
Whole principle is supported in the Comp Plan .... In the NE Planning workshops,
the first set ....it was hard getting people to go east... So far away from where they
are now ....
Kubby/Thank you.
Champion/This doesn't deal with that Court Street Extension ....
d. Changing the zoning designation on approximately 24.12 acres from Interim
Development (ID-RS) to Sensitive Areas Overlay-5 (OSA-5) and approving a
preliminary Sensitive Areas Development Plan for property located at the east terminus
of Hickory Trail. (REZ97-0007)
(1) Public Hearing
(2) Consider an Ordinance (First consideration)
Franklin/Next item is the extension of Hickory Trail.. east of the existing First and
Rochester Subdivisions .... rezoning .... to OSA-5. The staff has recommended
denial on this as has the P/Z Commission based on secondary access question .... It
is in the CZA agreement that was signed with First and Rochester, Part 4. We do
have over 20% of the property owners that are within 200 feet of this property
protesting the rezoning. So it will require six out of seven of you to vote in favor
of the rezoning. Are there any questions about the secondary access policy at this
point?
Lehman/I think that was pretty clearly spelled out.
e. Consider an ordinance approving the preliminary OPDH plan for Walnut Ridge, Parts
6 and 7, a 66.68 acre, 20-lot residential subdivision located at the north terminus of
Kennedy Parkway. (REZ98-0001) (First consideration)
Franklin/The Walnut Ridge Subdivision, first consideration. It is ready to go ....
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f. Consider an ordinance amending Title 14, Chapter 6, "Zoning," Article E,
"Commercial and Business Zones," Section 2, Neighborhood Commercial Zone (CN-1)
regarding size restrictions on restaurants. (Second consideration)
Franklin/The restaurant issue in the CN-1 zone. Expedited consideration has been
requested. I would like to talk about that fee issue. It was requested that the fee for
the special exception be waived .... Special exception application would be made
by the property owner, Mr. Glasgow, in this case, not John Streit .... Currently Mr.
Glasgow has a lawsuit out against the City of Iowa to which we have expended
considerable time, therefore money, to respond to this lawsuit over the Board of
Adjustment's action... We would strongly recommend that you not waive the fee
unless Mr. Glasgow agrees to withdraw this lawsuit. We have been notified by his
attorney that he does not intend to withdraw the lawsuit. So we would suggest that
you do not waive the fee for Mr. Glasgow.
Thornberry/I think that is petty.
Lehman/I don't.
O'Donnell/Had this fee been paid twice already?
Lehman/What she is saying... the lawsuit is going to be pursued and we would consider
waiving the fee if the lawsuit if withdrawn .... Is the lawsuit regarding the-
Franklin/The lawsuit is regarding the Streit property and the Board of Adjustment's
action in regards to the Streit property.
Thornberry/
Lehman/
Dilkes/I think there is another issue here .... I think if you decide to waive the fee, you
have to articulate your reasons for doing so and I think that has implications for
the lawsuit .... a problem .... I recommend you do not waive the fee.
Kubby/
Thornberry/
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Dilkes/I am going to interrupt you here. I want to also say that if we are going to get into
this much further, then we can do it in executive session. I think there are
ramifications for the litigation...
Kubby/If we have a different reason or rationale for wanting to waive the fee, do we gain
control over this issue by stating we want to waive the fees for the following
reasons and there are reasons .... So that it is clear why we are doing it.
Dilkes/Perhaps but that would have to be done very carefully.
Kubby/
Lehman/Should we choose not to waive the fee and at some point in the future we should
decide that that would have been appropriate, we can always refund the fee .... It is
not something that is irreversible ....And your recommendation is to not waive the
fee at this point?
Dilkes/That is right.
g. Consider an ordinance amending the approved preliminary Sensitive Areas
Development Plan for Lot 51 of Walden Hills, containing 2.9 acres and located within the
OSA-8, Sensitive Areas Overlay Zone at the northeast comer of Shannon Drive and
Irving Avenue. (REZ97-0018) (Second consideration)
Franklin/...amending the Sensitive Areas Development Plan for Lot 5 .... second
consideration. The applicant has requested expedited consideration on this item.
h. Consider a resolution approving a preliminary plat of a Resubdivision of Lot 51,
Walden Hills, a 2.9 acre, 25-1ot residential subdivision located at the northeast comer of
Shannon Drive and Irving Avenue. (SUB97-0030)
Franklin/H. and i. are plats for lot 51 of Walden Hills. So the order in which this needs to
occur is that you need to expedite consideration of#g. If you do that, then you can
go ahead with #h. If you approve #h., then you can approve #i.
Kubby/
Franklin/They came in at different times. H. has been around for awhile ....
Kubby/
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Franklin/...H. and i. are resolutions an we expect the legal papers on i. to be on Tuesday.
Norton/ ....question of traffic calming is not going to be brought up?
Franklin/
Vanderhoef/I would look at it if someone else would.
Kubby/Part of the rationale for agreeing to it in the first place ....
Thomberry/Does a resolution need three readings?
Franklin/No.
Thomberry/
Franklin/This resolution should be considered only upon the approval of item g ..... for
which expedited consideration has been requested ....
i. Consider a resolution approving a final plat of a Resubdivision of Lot 51, Walden Hills,
a 2.9 acre, 25-1ot residential subdivision located at the northeast comer of Shannon Drive
and Irving Avenue. (SUB98-0004)
j. Consider a resolution approving a final plat of Westcott Heights, an 84.12 acre, 31-lot
residential subdivision located in Johnson County on the west side of Prairie du Chien
Road, ¼ mile north of Newport Road. (SUB98-0005)
Franklin/A resolution for final plat of Westcott Heights .... in the county .... A project Jim
Anderson is working on .... Recommendation of the Commission is for approval
subject to approval of the legal papers which also will be done tomorrow... issue...
has to do with these two cul de sac (refers to map) ....What is being suggested here
is that we have a 50 foot r.o.w ....very short streets ....unlikely we are going to
annex this ....sensitive areas... having them narrower is prudent. Public Works is
in support ....
Thomberry/...P/Z .... took hills and configuration of other ground under consideration ....
Norton/
Franklin/
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Review Agenda Items 98-50 S2
1. (Agenda #14-Exterior signage at 112 South Dubuque Street.)
Kubby/Exterior signage .... Is that there is not a decision about the light or the dark?
Vanderhoef/They recommend the darker background so the lighting doesn't shine
through and make it too bright.
Lehman/
2. (Agenda # 8-Southgate Avenue and Waterfront Drive paving improvement and west
Pepperwood relief sewer project.)
Lehman/Rick, is it Waterfront Drive paving. Does that include a sidewalk to Hilltop
Trailer Court?
Fosse/Yes, I believe it does ....sidewalk on east side of Waterfront Drive and then along
the north side ....
Kubby/People will be so happy because of the bus stop.
Lehman/
Fosse/We still have a stretch along Southgate to the east that is already paved... We will
need to figure out how to get them in there ....
Norton/
Fosse/That is how you ultimately get to the bus stop ....
Lehman/
Norton/But you are going to put the sidewalk over the Gilbert along the northside?
Fosse/Yes.
Norton/
Fosse/Do you want us to follow up on that missing part?
Lehman/I think we really need to .... to get to a bus stop ....
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Fosse/I will see what our options are for getting that installed.
Lehman/
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Melrose Avenue 98-50 S2
Lehman/Proceed with Melrose Avenue.
Davidson/Last council meeting you did the final reading of the ordinance allowing us to
add a right turn lane to Melrose Avenue at the Hawkins Drive intersection...west
bound movement here .... correspondence back to last fall .... We connected the
Melrose Avenue Neighborhood Association .... Rick has just recently been able to
negotiate a deal with the University Hospital... agreed to pay half of the
installation .... Memo in your packet from Doug Ripley explaining how we came
up with the dimensions .... One of you did ask to have it placed on the agenda
tonight... discussion of how large we are making it and how large we could make
it .... If you want to direct us to do it any differently, now is the time. I think Rick
has a board showing a layout of what we are proposing to do ....
Fosse/
This is actually a strip map that was developed probably about four years ago .... I
just superimposed on top of that the right turn lane... 165 feet in length and will
require moving six of the trees back behind the sidewalk ....Building does not
come this far to the west ....
Kubby/They are at a stage where their survival rate ....pretty good?
Fosse/We hope so... They are under warranty ....
Norton/University is sharing in the cost of this?
Fosse/That is right... University .... doing much of the project administration .... We are
just paying for the design... Shive Hattery. University will administer the
construction of it ....
Vanderhoef/I am the one... I was trying to get a feel for the 165 foot length .... what the
traffic flow was there ....turn flow... I was concerned that the 165 was not long
enough ....
Davidson/165 gives us storage space for eight vehicles .... There is certainly justification
for more than that .... You can justify capacity-wise a four lane street or five lane
street .... We went through that whole process .... From a capacity perspective we
certainly could use more capacity from strictly speaking a traffic flow
standpoint... This does, for that west bound traffic, it does reduce the average
delay per vehicle from 60 seconds to about 20 seconds .... 20 seconds you are still
going to notice... Definitely a big improvement.
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Lehman/Are you satisfied with the length of that turn lane?
Davidson/It is the minimum .... Strictly speaking, from a traffic flow perspective, no. We
could definitely use more lane storage space. But factoring in the process that we
went through the neighborhood and University Heights, I think it is very much an
improvement that is reasonable.
Lehman/It is appropriate.
Thornberry/...Take that whole green strip there and make it turn lane ....
Lehman/
Fosse/It is a T-intersection and will be allowing a right turn on red ....
Davidson/Having that right turn on red is a tremendous help .... Please don't tell us to
take that red turn on red out ....
Vanderhoef/Doug was giving me some figures about 70% of the cars headed west in the
AM traffic are turning right ....
Davidson/One of those 30% that are going straight stops and then that right turn on red
capacity does us no good... this will alleviate that up to a point ....
Vanderhoeff In the PM it is that in reverse.
Norton/...this is going to be a big help ....
(All talking).
Davidson/We could justify 600 feet ....
Fosse/The initial traffic study had four lanes and a right turn lane.
Davidson/600 feet... takes you down to Grand Avenue ....
Thornberry/...would you point to Melrose Court?
Fosse/(Refers to map).
Thornberry/What is the solution to Melrose Court?
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Davidson/This Thursday .... Marcia, I and Doug are meeting with Melrose Avenue
Neighborhood Association .... 7:00 PM at Roosevelt School. We are going to
discuss what we feel... whole issue... Have some suggestions... Important to have
the neighborhood buy into those ....at least be able to report to you how the
neighborhood feels about that ....
Thornberry/ ....I will get with you later.
Kubby/
Lehman/How many will be going to that meeting?
Norton/...only two or maximum three.
Kubby/
CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 98-51 SIDE 1
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NeiEhborhood Service Evaluation 98-51 S1
Lehman/Neighborhood Service Evaluation ....
Kubby/ ....read what we got ....
Lehman/...Are we being asked to make a decision tonight on something?
Franklin/No.
Lehman/This information that we have gotten in the last couple of days .... At some point
in time we are going to give an indication to staff as to what direction you think
we should go.
Franklin/This is something we have been chewing on for over a year. The expectation is
not that you are going to make a decision tonight. I think that you are going to
want to hear from some more people .... stop and think about all of this .... Get the
topic out before you .... We will need direction... at some point.
Lehman/...try to take input... I think what we are most interested in now is an explanation
of your memo.
Norton/We had the Buss letter.
Franklin/First of all... couple of things that this discussion is not about. It is not about
cost and it is not about getting rid of neighborhood associations. What we are
trying to do is look at what we have done .... over last 8 years and evaluate it .... Go
back a little bit to why it was that the program was devised in the first place. We
wanted to encourage better, more effective participation between the people of
Iowa City... and the city and set up some kind of communication that was going to
enable that to work better ..... a service delivery system .... We could make decision
about how to provide services where they were needed most... third thing... more
neighborhood planning .... address changes in a more positive manner ....
What we have found .... number of associations have formed .... then they have
languished .... It is very difficult to devote time to the place where you live .... if
there aren't any burning problems .... Iowa City is a pretty nice place to live in...
We don't have a lot of the problems that big cities have .... Takes time out of
people's lives .... Consequence... Number of associations that have continued to be
very strong and active but they are few .... Our goal was to try to get neighborhood
associations throughout the community... ongoing communication .... The
communication aspect of it has basically been through conversations .... or
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leadership with people in neighborhood... through their newsletters... do not go
out regularly .... Newsletters are very much the purview of the associations .... They
decide what is going to be in those newsletters within limits .... We also want to
get information out to people .... use those newsletters... A lot of time Marcia
spends is working with Public Works on pre-design meetings .... frequently there
is no association that is active where we can count on being able to send
something... and getting everybody that is in the affected area .... Lack of
consistency with the newsletters .... lack ofpervasiveness of the newsletters has
inhibited out ability to communicate in the way that we would like to ....
The service delivery system has not gotten off the ground at all .... 1- In order to do
this... we need to know what the demands are city wide .....have very limited
information about the city. Marcia has the map there ....You can see the size...
When we are trying to talk about service delivery .... We can't get a good picture
of the whole... difficult to gather information on that scale ....
Norton/...service delivery system... I can't tell what it means.
Franklin/Steve ....would you like to explain service delivery system?
Atkins/It is a fairly commonly accepted term .... like to do .... Our Police Department has
beats and RJ is able to measure incidents of activity by beats ....I want to make it
city wide ....Rick has a sidewalk program... If we have this ....allows everybody to
report from the same geographic area... neighborhoods would learn a lot more
about themselves .... Application of services and policies becomes more uniform
and fair .... Comp Plan .... based around...
Franklin/...Planning aspect of it... We try to do a neighborhood plan in one of the
neighborhoods .... Got through certain parts of it... real hard .... takes time and a lot
of energy .... hard to get excited about .... If you are dependent upon on motivation
and initiative... not necessarily there to plan for the future .... Effort to do
neighborhood planning has really- not coming up from within the
neighborhoods ....When we set up the system, we set it up based on it being a
grassroots effort ....energy... come from people within the neighborhoods ....That
just isn't there ....I am not blaming anyone for this ....I can't expect people to get
excited things... Our question is whether those goals are still things that the city
wants to try to achieve: communication network, service delivery system and the
planning aspect ..... Our suggestion is to look at possibility of this concept of
neighborhood service and planning districts .... Whole district concept ....
Thomberry/How was the size of a neighborhood association determined?
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Franklin/By the people who want to form the association .... encourage people... go and
meet with as many people in the neighborhood.. they would determine the
boundaries of their neighborhood .....Consequence ....have fairly small spaces that
are the neighborhoods ....
Thornberry/These are different sizes than the neighborhood watch areas ..... Seems like
the city is cut up in so many different ways .... Is there anyway-
Franklin/That is part of the proposal, Dean, is to try to bring some of this together ....
Neighborhood Watch .... works is if you can look out your window and you can
see down. It is how far you can see on a block that really defines neighborhood
watch area ....
Thomberry/Neighborhood Watch areas ....
Franklin/My point is that there are some things that can't function at the larger level ....
What we are trying to do in terms of... communication, service delivery and the
planning is look at this from a district perspective ....What it means is that we do
not focus our efforts and resources on organizing ....Marcia would still act in that
function as the connection between associations or individuals... district
representatives .... to the city .... We will step back. We will take responsibility for
communicating information to this district. And if associations wish to include
some things in this communication, we can do that .... insert that the association
does .... Newsletter communication that goes out to the district .... Goes out
regularly ....
Atkins/
Franklin/We would tailor district newsletters to the district .... Comp Plan planning
districts .... They would all have newsletters .... One level of communication. Other
is we would continue to have a person with in the city staff that people could call
to make the connection .....
Service delivery system .... within larger areas we could look at consolidating
some of the district kind of distinctions we have drawn .... It would be identified
by district .... Have information about each district .... We would know how many
zonings... subdivisions, building permits ....information that would be available to
the people who live there...
Lastly, we would do... planning by district ....
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Kubby/As a neighbor .... what role do I play? ....
Franklin/You can play that through an association or generate your own organization ....
There is nothing that would preclude activism ....We think we need a weaning
time ....So they can put out their own newsletters ....It would be that you would
have your district newsletter... get that information about city functions .... Only
everybody would get it .... Activism... still do it ....
Kubby/It is a shift from the city kind of facilitating and supporting that activism ....
Franklin/We support activism through information ....
Kubby/Through that flow of information ....
Franklin/They would still have access to that information ....by a call from Marcia or
whoever is in her position ....
Norton/ .... suppose I am a commissioner from a district .... How are they going to get in
touch with the people in their district? ....
Franklin/That whole thing... how the neighborhood council evolves, we want to work
with the existing neighborhood council to look at that transition to a district kind
of council.
Norton/...Barbara Buss makes a lot of good points in her letter ....tend to work with
people more in your immediate neighborhood .....
Franklin/That is not precluded at all by this proposal. What this proposal doesn't do is
for us to spend a lot of time trying to get people to go to meetings ....
Norton/
Franklin/
Norton/There is going to be ebb and flow ....
Franklin/
Vanderhoef/The district allows you even a broader perspective than your own little
neighborhood ....
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Norton/Bridge on Summit Street affects the whole region .... Just the mechanics is who is
going to really get in touch with this district group ....
Kubby/
Norton/I like the neighborhood council ....I wish there were more neighborhood
associations ....
Lehman/Karin .... with the district proposal, everyone within a district will be notified of
events occurring within that district ..... If we do the district thing .... at least for
present time, we will still be working with neighborhood associations ....
Franklin/Yeah, we talked about continuing with newsletters with the associations for
maybe a year or so .... to see how this works .... What we were trying to achieve...
we got it for a little bit of the community ... only parts of it... It doesn't seem to be
growing...
Lehman/...good idea... as far as... notifying ....important ....This would notify everybody
within a district of the same things ....All having received the same information. I
think there is merit to that.
Franklin/One thing, it would not have it the kind of spontaneous mailings that we do if
something comes up ....
Thornberry/...You would do separate mailings by district?
Franklin/Yes ....
Thomberry/
Franklin/It is sent out in bulk mail... association newsletters and notices are sent out in
bulk mail...
Thornberry/
Franklin/With district concept... talking about sending this to many many more people ....
quarterly ....
Thornberry/...Longfellow ....
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Franklin/About 5-6 times a year .... Longfellow is one of our more active associations ....
Thomberry/
Norton/
Franklin/Without the financial support ....
Thomberry/Would the Longfellow Neighborhood Associations .... it would be everybody
in their district .... Could they get a one pager or two pager and have an insert?
Franklin/Yes ....It would be when we sent this out .....
O'Donnell/There are 21 associations... 5-6 that are active .... I think this is an attempt to
bring more people in .... really only about 5 active ones ....
Norton/...does not speak very well to the issue of getting information in.
Atkins/I think ....very unique circumstance where policy and management clearly meld
together ....If you did not want to do the district planning ....As your manager, use
districts for collection of data and information .... I think we can do a better job in
our service delivery .... We have to draw lines somewhere .... I fully tend to proceed
with data collection and management function ..... by districts .... When we had the
adoption of the Comp Plan .... trying to do this with existing resources ....Have the
neighborhood involvement ....
Lehman/Steve, are you expecting reaction from districts as mailings go out? ....
Atkins/I am not so sure ....reaction is ....I want them informed ....Policy and management.
In theory, we could step back from the planning process ....just allow us to go
ahead with our management information .... We also need to know what all the
other departments are involved in.
Lehman/If you send this out to the district on a quarterly basis ....assume a no reaction...
district must agree with what we are doing...
Kubby/A dangerous way to go about it ....
Atkins/It is a matter of information ....
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Franklin/I think we need to talk about how we get information now ..... One of the
concerns is how are we going to get something back.
Norton/Or even a reaction to the proposal you make .....
Klingaman/In order to get information in, I have to get information out .... At this point...
weekly mailing contacts .... up to them... get that information out to the
neighborhood ....Getting information back... one person contact me .... With the
district concept ....continuing ....number of people who are interested in
planning... be on a list that they will receive the information .... They won't have
capabilities to get that newsletter out ....There will be data information flowing to
them ....
Champion/...active groups are getting more information .... more attention .... I like the
idea of changing what we have but I also like the idea of keeping what we have ....
Nice that we have some active groups ....
Thornberry/I think when we have these districts... people that live .... When you get this
newsletter for the whole district... piques your interest ....district commissioner ....
I think activism will still be there ....
Norton/Feels a little bit like the old ward system ....
Atkins/That is a political question ....We have broken out these ten districts ....
relationship ....
Kubby/...I want to try to keep my judgment loose ....
Thornberry/...I think we can combine the two.
Kubby/Do we want to keep the same purposes? .... Maybe... some of those purposes are
still relevant and some of them aren't .... How do we motivate the activism ....
Maybe we should interact with the system differently instead of changing the
system ....
Vanderhoef/Possibility of knowing that everyone got the same newsletter... important
thing .... As a person in a neighborhood .... When I get a district letter .... all
working with the same information .... It allows a larger choice for all of our
citizens when they have all of the same information and right now they are not
getting it.
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Lehman/
O'Donnell/I think it is an attempt to communicate with more people.
Lehman/I have one concern... zoning matters .... If these appeared in a quarterly
newsletter, most of the folks... find out about them after they are over.
Franklin/We are going to continue with our regular notification process... evaluating
ways to expand that notification process and the cost of it .... legal obligation ....
Lehman/ ....concern ....
Atkins/Don't get time fixated on the thing .... A good bit of what I want to do is a
management issue .... community that I grew up in... nine districts .... district
council... I think you need to take time... evaluation. I think... bring the thing back
to you for further discussion.
Kubby/ ....Karin, you said... we are kind of imposing ....If we go to districts ....not
changing ....
Franklin/Only thing that changes is neighborhood planning... our decision was if the
neighborhood doesn't want to do it, we are not going to do it .... choice of
associations whether that planning is done or not. What this proposal does ....is
saying we have to plan for this district, we would like you to be part of it ....But
we are going ahead and planning for the area.
Kubby/
Franklin/But we are not going to depend on the associations to decide ....
Kubby/
Franklin/
Thornberry/It was suggested again... putting something about an agenda in the paper on
the specific page ....
Atkins/One of the ideas .... thought about purchasing .... page in paper .... public notices ....
It is ours .... I don't know yet ....
Lehman/
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Atkins/We would like to bring this back to you in a month or so.
[Council Break]
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EntrancewayRegulations 98-51 S1
Lehman/Marian... taping this and it is very difficult to understand when more than one of
us is talking ....
Champion/We don't want it printed.
Karr/
Lehman/One of the ways you can insure that it will not be printed is everybody talk at
the same time ....
Franklin/Entranceway regulations .... regulation of private property along the
entranceways to Iowa City .... debated at P/Z Commission. The Commission has
recommended that if the city council is interested in instituting an entranceway
overlay zone, that you appoint a taskforce to work with the staff to do it... First
question is: Do you want to pursue the regulation of private property along
entranceways? .... And if you do, do we appoint a taskforce?
Champion/
Franklin/An example... when we did conditional zoning for Westport Plaza, we impose
certain regulations there that were beyond the zoning ....two free standing signs...
landscaping... buildings... continuity in their design ....Rather than doing by
conditional zoning .... having these requirements for any private development
along the entranceways that is commercial, not residential.
Norton/Is that the first place to start? ....I looked at 13 entrances, 7 are major ....Do we
have the information? ....
CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 98-51 SIDE 2
Norton/...to take each of those entranceways ....and try to identify what is happening ....
And see what we need ....
Franklin/Okay, for instance that Hwy 1 and Hwy 6 are commercial corridors and
Riverside Drive is a commercial corridor and they would have undeveloped
properties along both of those entranceways ....those three... would be ones in
which you could see some impact.
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Norton/But they would be very different...Melrose, North Dodge, Gilbert Street, Sand
Road. I think you need to kind of get a view of what is the situation on each of
them .... Maybe it would lead to a need for an overlay zone ....
Kubby/Instead of...us saying we want an entranceway overlay and taskforce, figure it
out. Say look at these entrances to the city.
Norton/I need a study report on the entrances .... and if you want to put on there
somebody from P/Z... P/R and somebody from Project Green... Chamber and the
developer and away you go.
Kubby/So this first task would be to determine whether there was a need.
Norton/To bring us up to date on the statuses of the entrances and potential need. It
would be three paragraphs: what is the current zoning, what is the private action
that is going to happen or projected and-
Franklin/I am not sure we need a taskforce for that. It is all factual information that you
need ....
Champion/
Franklin/Only when the property is being rezoned. If the property is already zoned and it
is vacant or it is vacant or it is redeveloped, then we do not have any mechanism
to control it. But if it is rezoned, then we have that mechanism through the
conditional zoning agreements.
Norton/My proposal would have after you do the study on those three things, then you
would identify zoning changes needed: general, specific or overlay and you would
identify Code changes-
Franklin/Could I just have your outline, Dee?
Vanderhoef/If the assessment of the areas, I don't know if that needs to go to a
taskforce .... It shouldn't take but a couple of meetings to look at what is there ....
Lehman/Is that an assessment that staff can make?
Franklin/Yes, it sounds like he just wants factual information.
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Lehman/Could we request from you that information and then, based on that
information, decide whether or not we want another taskforce?
Kubby/...Do we want to control what our entranceways look like? ....
Thornberry/I have a little problem with the control aspect. I don't think government
should control an individual business .... other than what we have got within our
regulations .... What would the taskforce do specifically?
Franklin/The taskforce would decide how to address this question .... If there is a majority
that right now says we do not want to control the entranceways, then that means
we do nothing.
Thomberry/I would like to see them look nice ....
O'Donnell/What can't you control now?
Franklin/Building design, landscaping .... There are certain requirements that are in the
Code right now .... Our original proposal to P/Z was to look at the individual
things: landscaping, how parking areas were designed, building design, signage
and they decided against that because an overlay zone requires that you notify all
the property owners .... They felt that was a more fair way to approach it ....
Thornberry/I would like to have the entranceways look nice but I don't want to put an
additional burden on a property or businessowner .... and have a lot more
restrictions on that particular business .... But I would like it to look nice.
Kubby/Maybe we go forward with something, see what it looks like and you reject it
with a vote if it is too restrictive.
Thornberry/I don't want to have big city government saying to a little business .....
Kubby/As a business you have an advantage in an entranceway ....
Thomberry/You pay for that in your cost of property.
Norton/We have a commitment in the Comp Plan and it was in the Vision 2000... that we
are interested in attractive entrances to the city ....I think we need to know what
are our problems ....
Thomberry/....junkyard, how pretty can it be ....
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Lehman/Dean, I think you are doing the job of a taskforce right now.
Champion/I want nice entranceways to this city .... I am not against this idea but I am
against what Dean says. Maybe we need more feedback on how it could be
done .... easements along certain roads .... I am not against it but I am not for it.
(All talking).
Vanderhoef/Can we agree to have her bring back information to us and then look at the
information? Then we will decide whether we want to go forward with something
else.
Kubby/And maybe a column of things we can control now .... and a column of things we
cannot control ....
Lehman/Can do and wish we could do. Can we do that, Karin?
Franklin/Dee Norton, can I have your outline?
Lehman/She is going to do that and we are going to go to Court Street.
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Court Street Project 98-51 S2
Lehman/Mr. Fosse... and Rob ....
Fosse/We wanted to give you an overview of the Court Street project and then talk with
you about a couple of the design issues and perhaps get some direction on this...
The Court Street project takes us from its east end out to the west edge of
Windsor Ridge Subdivision and included with the paving is storm sewer work ....
and water main (refers to map) .... extending the sanitary sewer up and across
Court Street .... we had a pre-design meeting on this project for December 10 ....
heard... not see the street extended .... Heard these trees (refers to map) are very
important to those adjoining property owners ....We heard that it is difficult to get
across Scott Blvd. at certain times of the day ....They don't want to see a stop sign
go in ....noise ....We also heard about the sight distance issues ....With regard to
the trees... move the sidewalk in closer to the back of the curb ....remain at four
feet in width through this first block and then we go to our eight foot walk for the
rest of it .... So our overstory trees will be planted on the southside of the roadway
and the power lines will be moved to the northside .... Major feeder line...
overhead... But all the service lines... those are below ground.
Sight distance... two types... Stopping sight distance .... also intersection sight
distance which allows you to make a decision on whether or not to enter a
roadway .... get into traffic .... Specific to this project are three issues: 1-stopping
sight distance in the crest of this curve (refers to map) is fight at the minimum for
the posted speed of 25 mph .... Typically we like to put our design speed at 35 ....
This is at the minimum for the posted. The intersection of Scott Park Drive (refers
to map) .... adequate for 24 mph .... At Elmira...down to only 20 mph for
intersection sight distance .... three issues... leaves three options .... First is to do
nothing, extend the roadway on out as it is .... The DOT uses a policy that if the
stopping sight distance is adequate then theoretically you can bring a side street of
driveway in at any point along that vertical curve .... Since we at the bottom of the
posted speed limit rather than at the mid-point for the design .... comfort level is a
lot lower .... Not a good option. The other option is take this road out to almost
Scott Park Drive and change that vertical curve .... has some significant impacts on
adjoining property owners .... (refers to map) This driveway here and this driveway
at this location .... impacts were really greater than we were comfortable with ....
Also these are driveways coming out onto an arterial street which is going to busy
someday .... A third option is to make Elmira Street a fight hand only so the issue
of coming out and pulling onto Court Street isn't an issue. You don't do that .....If
we make this a right in only, all of our service vehicles can get in and go on
through here ....less inconvenient for the property owners ....(Refers to map) .....
Again, the stopping sight distance down in here is better ....What staff is
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recommending is to make Elmira a right hand only .... see if you concur with that
decision... Also recommend for the p.h. tomorrow night that we vote to extend
that p.h. to the meeting of the 28th... gives of three more weeks to incorporate
design changes into this ....
O'Donnell/
Fosse/That is right, we would leave the grade alone on the existing portion of Court
Street.
Champion/If it is right hand, you can't come out that way?
Fosse/Yes but it will be two way here (refers to map) ....
Thornberry/It is not a one way street. You just can't go out ....
Lehman/
Kubby/The design... the only thing we are talking about different is traffic control?
Fosse/No design came out of the pre-design meeting, only ideas that we heard about ....
Kubby/
Fosse/In the early part of our design... figuring do nothing... Became less comfortable...
Felt it was warranted to do something in addition to that ....
Kubby/What are we doing besides the traffic directional things with the design?
Fosse/That would be it, just the right hand only at Elmira and the stopping sight distance
is adequate for the curve. We will post that fact that there is an intersection over
the crest of the hill there .... Street would be posted at 25 mph...
Kubby/Seems like low level intervention.
Norton/Have you had reactions from neighbors yet for this proposal?
Fosse/We have been talking to some of them this evening .... Rob.
Winstead/We have visited with a couple of them tonight .... leaning towards
recommending Elmira the one way in .... I was going to follow up with the rest of
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them tomorrow. The mailing that went out to them stated that we were still
looking at the sight distance issue and a possible solution might be to lower the
road .... what came out of that was a letter that you all received.
O'Donnell/How much were you going to lower the road?
Lehman/Way too much.
Winstead/At the crest of the hill it would be about 1.5 foot and as you go each way from
the crest, it would get less and less and less until you match back into the existing
pavement .... slopes of the driveways are just too steep ....
Lehman/It would appear that this addresses the problem with a minimum inconvenience.
Kubby/How many houses...have driveways that go onto Elmira? ....
Lehman/Could be six ....
Kubby/
Winstead/We do know one of the property owners is against the one way in thinking of
the inconvenience of having to leave the subdivision on a different route. There is
some concerns that this road is steep (refers to map) ....
Kubby/
Thornberry/Any thought of traffic calming before you get to the crest?
Fosse/That is something we really want to avoid on an arterial street ....don't want to
discourage traffic from using arterial streets ....
(All talking).
Fosse/Also the emergency vehicles... have a problem.. This may be a bus route someday.
Lehman/Do we agree with the recommendation of the Engineering Department for now?
(All talking).
Lehman/Hold it, one at a time.
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O'Donnell/Can you do anything with speed control so you don't have to make that a one
way?
Fosse/...I think realistically people will be driving faster than that ....
O'Donnell/IfI lived on that street, I would really like it to not be a one way street.
Fosse/Right... only one way in and to get out you have got to go this way .... This comer
can be difficult (refers to map) ....
Lehman/
Fosse/
Norton/We can continue the hearing ....
Vanderhoef/Can you show us what that intersection would look like to discourage people
from sneaking out the wrong way?
Lehman/...spikes... puncture tires.
Lehman/It would look something like that .... crest of the hill is over here.
Vanderhoef/So you will narrower it down at that end.
Fosse/Crude drawing .... Here is a revised comment to reflect continuing the p.h.
Lehman/I think we got that... So your recommendation tomorrow night ...making Elmira
a one-way entrance ....
Kubby/
Thomberry/When they built that street, they just didn't think it was going to go through
ever?
Fosse/I don't think that the sight distance was seriously looked at ....1990-91 ....It is very
unfortunate ....
Lehman/Okay, thank you.
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Tenant-To-Ownership Program 98-51 $2
Lehman/Doug, you are next.
Boothroy/In your packet there is a memo from Maggie and I concerning the Tenant to
Ownership Program... point out that tomorrow night... acting on a resolution to
convey the second home. Also set a p.h. for the future conveyance of a third
home .... We will have three homes in the process of being sold .... tentatively got a
closing on the first one you did two weeks ago for April 17 .... I want you to know
that each of these families, this has had a very significant positive impact on their
lives .... This has really been- I can't tell you how important the dream of
homeownership is for families. And all of these families are working families.
They have earned their ability to own their own home .... We have... minimum a
commitment from HUD to sell 20 homes... We have got three that are sold ....
Another goal of the homeownership program is that we use these funds to reinvest
them in additional homes that can be sold for homeownership opportunities ....
This accomplishes two things: If we take the money and reinvest it at this time,
we... provide additional opportunities to sell houses... Also able to develop some
continuity in the program .... Could go through... long period... no public housing
to be sold .... We contacted Southgate Development Company .... to see if there
was any interest in Mace working with us .... Mace built the public housing for the
Housing Authority about... 13-14 years ago... Broadway Apartments... He has an
interesting and innovative development that is going on in the westside ....getting
some pre-construction discount... He said there would be... build into the
affordability of this unit for low income family. It provides the program with
continuity and a lot of flexibility...meets the goal of additional affordable housing
units.
The money that we would use on the front end of this would be the money that we
already have available from the Broadway .... Have over $300,000 in that
particular reserve... there would not be any draw-down from the General Fund in
order to front end the cost of this. As we close on these houses, then we will be
returning the money into the system ....
Kubby/What is the Broadway money suppose to be used for? ....
Boothroy/The disposition plan that was approved by HUD committed the funds to be
used to build more public housing. go in order to use that fund for something
other than public housing .... we would have to amend the disposition plan.
Kubby/ .... if we use the Broadway money to build public housing that then gets sold ....
then that money... goes into new housing .... indirect ....
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Boothroy/Yes, that is one way of handling it ....
Kubby/Shuffling paper .... Why not make it cleaner and change out disposition plan?
Boothroy/It took a lot of time and effort to get that disposition plan approved. HUD
didn't want us to sell Broadway... they denied me three times .... I finally ended up
going to the Secretary of HUD to get it approved ....HUD has changed .... re-doing
themselves ....
Lehman/These homes will be acquired specifically for re-sell?
Boothroy/Absolutely .... for homeownership.
Lehman/Not designed to increase the housing stock of the city?
Boothroy/They go back into private.
Lehman/These are new homes... no maintenance ....
Boothroy/...Constructed such that they are all vinyl ....
Champion/I really like the idea of buying new units that are interspersed through the
community ....
Boothroy/This is the first that we have actually provided any on the westside.
Champion/Terrific idea ....
Boothroy/...opportunity to provide some affordable housing on the westside ....
Vanderhoef/You are saying that these units will never be rental units?
Boothroy/That is correct.
Norton/...what is losing momentum?
Boothroy/In 1993 we approved this program. It has taken a long time to get to a point
where we are actually- We have got staff on board that has learned the
process...advertised... finally got lending institutions to understand what we are
trying accomplish and wanting to be involved .... to get to the point where we
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are .... in order to move this forward. When we don't have any houses to sell .... it
could be six months to a year before we would have another house to sell unless
we built or bought new ones ..... We maintain visibility .... also maintain the
expertise .... Plus we are also meeting the goal of providing additional affordable
housing... Things are continuing to go...
Norton/...new houses .... buy existing homes ....
Boothroy/The houses that we have bought and rehabbed .... We spent a lot of money
rehabbing them .... by federal funds...
Norton/
Boothroy/...One of the goals of the homeownership program is if we put people that are
poor in there, their cash reserves are limited ....Better to have systems that are in
good shape.
Norton/New ones go to pot, too.
Boothroy/Do get a five year window of opportunity? ....
Vanderhoef/You and I had a conversation... My question was is there any other use that
we can make of these moneys and still follow the HUD guidelines?
Boothroy/As far as the Tenant-to-Ownership Program is concemed, we are mandated by
agreement- HUD front ended to City of Iowa 20 houses .... if you promise to sell
20 houses .... I see what we are doing tonight... reinvesting in that program ....
There is question about what about potentially the million dollars we get from the
Broadway sale .... Are other things that can be done with that money. We intend to
come back to you with a plan ....
Thomberry/So we are not reducing our stock of city owned properties?
Boothroy/We are in the processing of reducing it .....
Thornberry/Explain to me how we are reducing our housing stock by building new
ones? .... What you are saying is you are selling the Tenant-to-Ownership house
and you are taking that money and building another house for a Tenant-to-
Ownership Program .... Is that what I am heating?
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Boothroy/Under the plan that you approved... said we are going to sell public housing
stock.. and the resources that you get from that, you are going to reinvest it for
other homeownership opportunities ....
Thomberry/Other homeowner opportunities could be rehabbing the other houses that are
still owned by the city...
Boothroy/We don't need to do that. We have been doing that for three years .... $600,000
that has been reinvested.
Kubby/People who live there aren't qualified.
Thomberry/We are not reducing the number of houses the city owns.
Boothroy/With this action that we are asking you, that is correct. But the plan does call
for the reduction of number of houses by a minimum of 20 .... All the s.f. housing
that the Iowa City Housing Authority owns are included the Tenant-to-Ownership
Program ....All of those could be sold ....But we are not going to sell them
overnight.
Thornberry/And what do you do with that money? .....
Boothroy/Under the plan that you got approved from HUD, it indicated that you were
going to reinvest that in additional affordable housing units for home ownership
opportunity .... Under Section 5h. Program .... it still has to go back .... some kind of
affordable housing program .... could be rehabbing.
Kubby/
Thomberry/
Boothroy/
Norton/Suppose a person were in a city owned house, renting... the house that they are in
could be sold ....
Thomberry/We sent out applications to everybody in our public housing units .... to try to
find people that could qualify. We came up with a limited list .... You can't sell
public housing units to somebody that doesn't make an income to buy .... Our
focus... always looking to find a tenant and a house that we can match ....for
families that can buy .... look to market that house to sell it ....
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Lehman/With the waiting list you have for subsidized housing, it is realistic to think you
are ever going to have an empty house for sale?
Boothroy/I can't answer that... possible... Have to get to... point in time... list ofpre-
qualified people .... Now we are going to have to go out and advertise for even
those units we have in public housing... so that we have 10-15 families that are
waiting for a home .... Until we get to that point... situation .... vacancies... can't
afford to let that house set empty ....
Lehman/...look at the total number of publicly owned housing units... Maybe we are in
the business more than we should be. I do not oppose buying these three
properties... We do need houses that we can sell .... It jumps starts a subdivision ....
We have to have a long term plan .... reduce those units .... Need to decide what
level we expect the city to own property .... What is an adequate number of
publicly owned units? .... As long as we have a waiting list the way we have it
now, we are not going to have a house for sale.
Boothroy/It is not going to move very quickly .... We had approached HACAP about the
possibility of buying the eight units on Muscatine for transitional housing .... The
federal government gave the money to us .... They gave it to us for affordable
housing ..... got to use it for some purpose that has to do with affordable housing ....
We are not buying public housing with this proposal tonight.
Thornberry/Dee .... Tenant-to-Ownership Program... haven't reduced your stock ....
(All talking).
Thornberry/ .... starter homes are not going to be empty .... We don't need more of a
socialistic society in Iowa City ....
Boothroy/Tenant-to-Ownership Program is taking steps in the direction that you are
talking about ....
Thornberry/ ....you can explain to me how we are reducing our inventory stock.
Vanderhoef/...How you are marketing these units to people who are not presently living
in public housing? ....I would like to know what your plan is that allows those
people to get into this .....
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Boothroy/Obligation under the program is 80% median income. Most of the people in
public housing are below that. We would advertise in the newspaper .... for
families that make 80% median income or less. Then we would go through a
process by which we would qualify them .... All kinds of things ....There are more
extenuating circumstances than just income.
O'Donnell/So we do not have three people lined up to buy these three houses?
Boothroy/
O'Donnell/My problem is-
CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 98-52 SIDE 1
O'Donnell/
Boothroy/
Lehman/Mike... We are talking about a subdivision where a number of these homes are
going to be built. We may have three that will be sold to people 80% or less. The
rest of those are on the market for everybody to buy.
O'Donnell/Did we not make some kind of agreement that the city wasn't going to buy
anymore property?
Kubby/There has been no official action ....
Boothroy/You made a contract with HUD that you would invest these moneys.
O'Donnell/
Boothroy/We are not buying the property to own. We are giving first time homebuyers...
they are going to get a helping hand by the federal government through the city...
to own their own home...
Kubby/If we go out and advertise .... shopping for people.
Boothroy/...These three units, because they were never public housing units to begin
with, we have that latitude. But even under the Section 5h Program... first level
was to advertise to public housing folks, second is to people in Section 8 Program,
and third is to open it up. We are following those steps ....
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Champion/... a lot of people don't know these programs are out there.
Norton/...Why don't people just go to Mace and buy the house?
Boothroy/...They get assistance with their down payment.
Thomberry/...We could still give them down payment assistance.
Boothroy/Down payment assistance was going to be greater ....
Kubby/Let's go.
Boothroy/...in-line with things that you have already agreed to go forward with.
Lehman/Do we have four people who would favor us for investigating this? ....
Boothroy/The resolution would be on your next agenda to authorize a staff person to be
able to sign a contract. Okay?
Lehman/Go. Next.
Boothroy/Thanks.
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KeE Ordinance 98-52 S1
Lehman/Who is going to talk about the Keg Ordinance? .... A year ago ....We had a party
in town that resulted in some inappropriate behavior... to of line... We would look
into an ordinance... restrict those sorts of parties from occurring again .... tapper
ordinance .... Sarah worked on that... Keg registration ordinance has been proposed
by the Stepping Up Program .... Eleanor... Sarah... written model ordinance...
significant difficulties with the ordinance .... I think what she asked .... We need to
tell staff what it is that we would like to control .... Let staff look at what we would
like to do and see whether or not that can be achieved through... whatever
ordinance that is necessary to elicit the kind of behavior that we think is
necessary .... Until we tell them what we would like to do, it really is very difficult
to write an ordinance.
Champion/...I could not consider any kind of ordinance that tries to regulate people's
behaviors ....
Lehman/Talking about the types of behaviors that are unacceptable.
Champion/ ....public nuisance, we already have that ordinance ....
Lehman/
(All talking).
Lehman/Hold it, one at a time.
Champion/
O'Donnell/I think it is unenforceable.
Lehman/Our focus needs to be not a keg ordinance or tapper ordinance. It needs to be
focused on the kind of behavior that we wish to control .... no drunks ....
Atkins/I am not so sure I understand registration of kegs .... tapping of kegs. One thing I
do understand .... Let me just explain... We had 100s of people packed in a
house ..... a police officer assaulted... beer bottles at fire truck .... neighbors calling
me saying I am afraid... My concern .... How do I control, on behalf of those
neighbors, that kind of behavior?... I don't know the ordinance issue .... I think
neighbors are entitled to reasonable peace and quiet and not be afraid to come out
of their house and city employees do not need to be assaulted when they are
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simply carrying out their day to day responsibilities. That is my concern and I
don't know how to get at that.
Kubby/
Arkins/...difficulty is there weren't enough people... to be able to disperse that crowd ....
Only takes one incident... gets out of hand .... We had another party... We ran a
bluff... You will have porta-potties .... or else and it worked .... The thing was we
are not out to tell folks, no, you can't have a party ....
Winklehake/ ....also there was a closer of a public r.o.w .....
Atkins/We will work with you .....
Kubby/With the permit...
Dilkes/When public property is involved, that is a whole different issue.
Vanderhoef/Permit thing gets at ....directs responsibility onto a name, a person ....speak
for the actions of the group ....
Dilkes/...we only permit the use of public r.o.w ....
Lehman/Eleanor, if we had an ordinance that required the registration of kegs, someone
has a party... party gets out of line or a minor has a beer... Can the owner or the
person who registered the keg be charged if he can show that he used reasonable
care? ....
Dilkes/You would have to write your ordinance fairly tight ....
Atkins/Ernie... I am not so sure the underage drinking is the issue .... It is people being
afraid to come out of their houses ....They can't get out of hand ....That last party,
people got hurt ....
Kubby/What... big party but they don't have a keg?
Dilkes/That is the problem ....
Atkins/
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Kubby/I have a fund-raiser... wine, beer, sparkling water. Am I going to have to have a
porta-potty?...
Norton/We don't need to invent the wheel here... I think the keg registration thing...
feasibility for tracking the person who is responsible .... gives you certain way to
track and who is involved .... We must have plenty of laws on the books ....
Winklehake/Disturbing the peace... tapping ordinance... conversation from a Sergeant
from Ames.. enforcement of that .... Ordinance for having only one keg tapped at a
time really doesn't become an issue anymore... one tap at a time... brought in
cases .... Only allowed to have one keg tapped at a time. What it does is slows the
flow of the alcohol down .... However .... when they go to the large parties, there is
one keg tapped. Everybody else is drinking cans .... Starting to do some work...
start doing some things with keg registration... track who bought the keg ....
Talking to a lot of these other places... Madison, Lehigh, Delaware .... Vermont ....
They have a variety of different kinds of ordinances ....none of them look at any
one particular ordinance as being a cure for anything .....Aimed at reducing the
amount of alcohol that is consumed to where people aren't getting into fights ....
Trying to reduce the underage alcohol consumption .... tools that you look at with
none of them really being the cure for all of it .... deal with issues as they come up.
Kubby/...examples ....
Winklehake/Ames. They have a public party nuisance ordinance .... Fixes the
responsibility for the person that hosts the party ....The first time that is going to
court is April 27 .....
Dilkes/I don't know where it originated ..... disorderly house charge... imposes... charges
against the owner .... expands that .... owner.. is responsible .... all sorts of different
conduct they are responsible for.
Champion/...my children are taught that they are responsible for their behavior .....
Lehman/I think that you have got to make the person who hosts the party responsible ....
Champion/
Norton/
Dilkes/They can disperse the party... close their doors.
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(All talking).
Vanderhoef/Do we have some other tools that are on our books right now? ..... What else
is there? ....
Dilkes/I think... disorderly house is the one that is used most often ..... It has to be a
disturbance to the neighborhood .... Open container, public urination, public intox.
Thomberry/ ....they are not called unless there is a complaint filed?
Winklehake/Disorderly house .... someone has to call for that ....allows the police officers
to check those things ....Before if you have a loud party, basically you have to
have a complaint. The police officers themselves cannot be the victim on a
disorderly conduct.
Dilkes/Because of the way it is written.
Kubby/...our Code or State Code? Could we do things to our noise ordinance to make it
enforceable? .... change disorderly .... Are there ways we can change what we
currently have to make sure that there is a balance? .....
Dilkes/I think it is should of what the Ames nuisance ordinance does.
Lehman/That is a good ordinance.
Norton/I talked to people on northside who are afraid to call in because then there is
retribution issue ....
Helling/Talked about the criminal issue of keg registration .... In talking with some of the
bar owners .... They will draw the parallel between a bar owner who maybe had
opened a small bar... no such kinds of restrictions .... Not only is there the behavior
of these folks .... but also there is always that threat of some civil litigation against
anyone because they now become responsible for that beer .... one of the issues...
make the person who buys the keg responsible for their actions with that keg ....
Somehow or other there is a risk there .... Civil kind of responsibility ....
Thornberry/If I am going to have a big party... I got the place, you bring the beer ....
everybody brings a keg .... I can say they didn't get drunk off of my keg ....
Champion/ ....I want to make people responsible for their own behavior ....
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Dilkes/I don't think anyone is suggesting that you wouldn't also charge the gentleman
who is urinating next door. It is just that you would charge the person who had the
ability to get those people out of their house as well.
Thornberry/I agree with the enjoyment of your property ..... You also got some rights as a
homeowner to have a party .... Maxie's .... I got closed down because of the noise
ordinance in Iowa City .... They said...when we get complaints from the other side
of Sycamore Mall .... indication that it is a little loud .... I had a band permit but I
didn't have a music permit ....
Karr/It was the amplified sound ....
Champion/ ....wedding in my front yard ....neighbors ....
Vanderhoef/I would like to see the ordinance from Ames, the nuisance ordinance. And I
would like to see the disorderly house ordinance that we have .... come back to this
subject.
Dilkes/Do you want us to- We could send out Ames and copies of what we already have
on the books. Then you could go from there.
Lehman/I would like to see us evaluate the Ames ordinance in view of what happened
here in town .... things we would like to control... How it would have helped our
Police Department to enforce the situation as the one that happened last year ....
Do our present ordinances enable us to enforce the kind of behavior that we are
objecting to and if not, will that ordinance from Ames help us... nuisance and ....
Karr/Kegger registration ....
Dilkes/They have a registration.
Lehman/Both one pagers. Can we do that? Get an evaluation of that? I think we need
input- You do, Eleanor, in drafting this .... nothing is any good if we can't enforce
it .... It has got to be reasonable.
Winklehake/...You also have to have something in place that you can keep them from
growing to the point that you have 1500 people.
Dilkes/As I understand it then, the behavior that you want to control is the type of party
that got out of control, not necessarily underage drinking at a private party.
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Lehman/Unless it is out of control.
Dilkes/Unless it is out of control like this party was. Is that accurate?
Atkins/We already have underage drinking laws.
Dilkes/The keg registration ordinance .... is aimed largely at-
Norton/...seems like you might want to have in conjunction with the ordinance that you
are talking about.
(All talking).
Dilkes/...The keg registration ordinance deals with kegs. The behaviors that you are
wanting to control can be caused by a number of other alcoholic beverages.
(All talking).
Dilkes/
Norton/Let's focus in the Ames thing then.
Vanderhoef/
Lehman/That is a starting point ....Important thing is how the Ames ordinance differs
from what we have .....
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TCI Liquidated Damages 98-52 S1
Lehman/TCI.
Helling/Liquidated damages. I sent you everything we had including the history of the
alternatives that were proposed by TCI .... Franchise agreement allows for $250 a
day liquidation damages. TCI proposed two alternatives .... take that amount,
calculate it out to August 31... divide that by number of subscribers and rebate ....
Alternative, they proposed to cut that in half... $1.30 .... to the customer .... You
really have several alternatives. One is to impose the liquidated damages. Other is
to rebate that amount in some form back to the customers or something in
between. Cordell Jeppsen, chair of the commission is here ....
Cordell Jeppsen/At the time that we considered this matter as a commission, the option
that we understood... was the fine .... recommend to the council to impose the
maximum fine possible, $250 day. We still think that TCI is responsible to make
good on the promise they didn't keep. We as a commission thought that their
alternative of supplying something to rebate customers and also something to
cover the cost of the city pursuing damages was a good idea... more constructive
alternative .... money ahead... This would assume that the maximum penalty was
based on a August 31 deadline. The one concern... original proposal seems to
have closure on August 31. We have had enough experience... deadlines keep
slipping. We wanted something that would continue to provide an obligation to
them if they went past the August 31 deadline. The way it stands now is that the
$46,000 calculated to be equal to the penalty...given... If they go past August 31,
the assessment continues to accrue at the rate of $250 a day. So the very same
thing is accomplished. We felt... more constructive way to deal with TCI... also to
represent the issues of the customers ....
Lehman/Thank you.
Norton/I see the pros .... people who are manifestly inconvenienced are the subscribers ....
I also don't want to call the part we get a grant, an aid .... a penalty is what it is ....
$1.30 ...makes it look like they are giving back something ....I could go either
way.
Lehman/I have an opinion .... I appreciate very much TCI's efforts .... TCI is working very
very hard locally to improve that image. However, they signed an agreement with
us that provided for completion of a job by a specified time .... they waited for a
considerable period of time before that project was started. The liquidated damage
portion of that contract is the penalty for complying with they agreed to comply
with. To me .... that is rewarding non-compliance with a contract .... This is turning
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into a sales promotion tool .... I visited with Arlene and Jon... I am very
sympathetic to them... They represent a view that is not necessarily commonly
held by TCI in the past. They are very sincere in trying to do something for the
community to improve their image. I just think this would be rewarding breaking
a contract and I cannot support a rebate to the customers as opposing the fine ....I
don't think most of them will even notice.
O'Donnell/I think a contract is a contract ....
Lehman/
Norton/It is a matter of how it is paid back ....
Lehman/I just think that it represents as to what was agreed to at the outset of the
contract. This is a penalty for failure to perform .... If... good faith effort... There
would hot have been any damages. There was not a good faith effort to perform
until late in the game .... It does not absolve them of starting the project when it
should have been started.
Norton/Does your fine terminate when the rebuild is complete?
Lehman/The contract says so much per day until it is done ....
Helling/...It is not the same total money if they complete before-
Norton/...if they pay $1.30 per customer .... same total money as $46- But if we go the
way Ernie is talking, they could cut there losses by getting it done.
Lehman/
Kubby/
Lehman/
Jon Koebrick/I just want to mention... I understand what your concem is about living up
to the agreement. One of the things that we are offering in terms of the plan ....The
contract has a liquidated damages clause if we don't meet the terms of the
agreement... Also has an opportunity to cure .... We are also trying to operate
under the terms of the contract as well by offering a plan. The other thing .... In
addition to the amount of the rebate and the amount to the city, we are talking
about exceeding .... Our option does exceed what the liquidated damages would
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be .... Second part of that .... As we add programming throughout the system,
nobody is going to see any charges on that programming tmtil the entire system is
done... That amount is going to go well beyond what just the damage assessment
would have been ....
Vanderhoef/Could you do that even though you were just paying the regular damages to
the city?
Koebrick/We can.
Vanderhoef/Which is your choice ....
(All talking).
Norton/What is your concern? ....
Lehman/My concern has nothing to do with dollars... a matter of good faith .... There was
a commitment to the people of this community... commitment to this council.
They signed a contract ....They waited well into the contract period ....Forget the
money ....
Vanderhoef/
Lehman/
Kubby/
Helling/Is there an option to cure? Part of the agreement is they have 30 days to present
an option, a proposal to cure and that is what this is.
Kubby/And that is up to us to accept it?
Helling/Sure.
Champion/I agree with Ernie .... People would like to see the council get rid of it totally...
Lehman/Question is, do we want to accept their proposal or do we want to impose the
liquidated damages?
Norton/I want to go with the recommendation of the committee.
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O'Donnell/I don't want to go against the committee but I think they should live up to the
contract.
Lehman/Is that saying you support the liquidated damages?
O'Donnell/Yes.
Kubby/I have a question .... I don't want to offer them a freebie promotion .... When we
are saying we are following the contract, they are following the contract.
Lehman/
Kubby/
Lehman/The contract... it would have been finished by 26th of February.
Champion/
Kubby/I guess I ultimately agree with you.
Vanderhoef/Yeah... yeah means what I have been hearing...delay in starting the project...
arrogance... I expect other people to hold up the contract ....
Champion/I agree .... with what you said.
Thornberry/...I have always had service .... When I sign a contract, I live up to that
contract ....I think we ought to adhere to the contract and not really take their right
to cure ....
Kubby/The community hears of our decision .... ultimately less money is coming out of
TCI as a penalty .... That we created a decision that have them paying less.
Lehman/Do we care what they pay as long as they adhere to the contract? I would love
that they didn't pay a penny.
Kubby/
O'Donnell/I think it is an incentive to get the job done quicker ....
Norton/
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Lehman/Jon... believe me it is nothing personal...
(All talking).
Koebrick/Right from the get-go .... we tried to get our letter to the commission detailing
what we had done... trying to do something... We are really trying to do it ....
Lehman/...I appreciate that ....What we have just done is save you money .... Thank you.
(All talking).
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PATV Move/Channel 4 Move 98-52 S2
Lehman/We are talking about in the near future the plans for the relocation of PATC and
Public Access TV... Give us where we are, Dale ....
Helling/...third floor addition .... start looking at property for a joint programming
facility .... Cable Offices, Channel 4 Government Access will be out of the Civic
Center. Your last meeting you chose to wait and make a decision on third floor
and also not make an independent decision regarding Channel 4 out of the Civic
Center. The real need that Channel 4 .... they simply don't have enough space up
there anymore... By making that decision not to authorize us to go out and look
for property, I am in a position where I can't go out and try to negotiate a deal...
There is one property that is available .... We had some difficulty in identifying
these kinds of properties particularly for sale .... PATV position is this summer,
they have to leave the library... They are prepared to go out and find space but
they would like to proceed with a joint facility as well .... At least this would give
us the opportunity... to negotiate ....The status quo would leave PATV to basically
have to find their own.
Vanderhoeff They need word one way or the other.
Helling/
Vanderhoef/From the city's perspective you are saying it is very advantageous to us to
have a joint facility?
Helling/Very advantageous, I don't know what that means. There are some advantages
and we have looked at that for a number of years... That joint facility could come
now, it could come in the CenterSpace concept of an expanded library concept ....
That is a decision that you all have to make ....
Norton/Isn't it true that Cable 4 is cramped in their present quarters? ....
CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 98-52 SIDE 2
Norton/You are looking at a project even no matter how things go with the
Library/CenterSpace issues .... I would think we ought to get the thing together
and to wait very long because PATV is facing a July deadline .... We ought to get
the two of them together and get them out looking.
Helling/We have been looking.
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Lehman/We talked about the expansion of the Civic Center and we have given them the
go ahead to go ahead and do the plans. We have made no indication whatsoever as
far as our time table... Something is going to have to happen sooner rather than
later.
Thomberry/
Kubby/If we end up not expanding the Civic Center and Channel 4 and PATV have a
joint facility, there are lots of other things that could use that space ....
Helling/I think we would want to come back to you with some proposal there ....
Lehman/Do we all agree?
(All talking).
Vanderhoeff Go find us a spot ....
Thornberry/Find us a spot somewhere.
Vanderhoef/Check this one out or whatever.
Norton/It won't constrain PATV to be in bed with those folks, will it?
Lehman/If we don't get moving here, we are not going to be in bed with anybody.
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Appointments 98-52 S2
Lehman/Planning and Zoning Commission appointment, we have three applications for
two vacancies.
Kubby/I have a question for Eleanor about one of the applicants ..... r.o.w. ordinances,
will that go through P/Z?
Dilkes/When we look at our r.o.w. ordinances?
Kubby/In terms of the use ofr. o.w. and payments for use ofr. o.w.
Dilkes/I don't believe so.
Norton/You mean there would be a conflict of interest?
Dilkes/I think that is going to be the purview of BTC... and Public Works. That whole
issue is sort of decided by the Legislature soon anyway.
Lehman/
Norton/I like Pam Ehrhardt.
Lehman/Pam Ehrhardt, we have four people .... Dean Shannon .....
(All talking).
Lehman/We had three applications...
Thomberry/...Dean Shannon and Pam Ehrhardt ....
Lehman/There is one for Historic Preservation ....We did it.
Planning and Zoning Commission - Pam Ehrhardt & Dean Shannon
Historic Preservation - Michael Gunn
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Organizational Issues 98-52 S2
(No discussion)
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Council Agenda/Time 98-52 $2
1. O'Donnell/I had a call this week about the person who parked in the Holiday Inn
ramp. He was afraid to walk down Dubuque Street to have a lunch date. All the
people downtown. He was asked once or twice for money. The second time it was
more of a demand. I think we have to address that downtown ....
Thornberry/There was a council prior to me that put forth an ordinance... resolution or
something saying that it was fine to panhandle downtown. Isn't that not right? ....
Dilkes/We have an ordinance... First Amendment issues are implicated here only if there
are things accompanying the panhandling such as threats, assaults, that kind of
thing.
Thornberry/And they can't follow you and pester you and all of that stuff, right? Can
they ask once or can they ask twice or what?
Dilkes/I would have to look at the ordinance again. There is some invading your space
kind of elements to that. It can't be just sitting there asking for money. They have
First Amendment fight to do that.
O'Donnell/
Lehman/We have police patrol downtown ....
Thornberry/Is inappropriate language covered in the First Amendment?
Dilkes/Yes for the most part. There are certain exceptions to the First Amendments...
obscenity is a very narrow.
Champion/I don't think we have ever arrested anybody for using obscenities downtown
and it is terrible, it is constant.
Dilkes/I don't think obscenity is the way you think it in terms of-
Champion/What is obscenity? Exposing yourself?.
Dilkes/
Norton/
Kubby/Foul language is different from obscene language.
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O'Donnell/Do we not have a harassment law?
Champion/What is obscene language?
Thornberry/I am not sure where the difference is either ....
Dilkes/I would have to get you the exact definition. It is something that appeals to the
prurient interests and it has to be very offensive .... It is not just use of foul
language at all .... When you are talking about the Plaza and you are talking about
the kind of difficulties that people are experiencing, you are going to have some
real tough First Amendment issues when it comes to doing more regulation than
we do.
Champion/The only thing that controls it is a police presence.
Norton/
Lehman/That is something we are going to have to address when we are investing that
kind of money in the downtown.
O'Donnell/...people are afraid to go downtown. We have got to address that.
Dilkes/The downtown group that David Schoon had put together has been talking about
these issues.
Norton/We got to do something about it in terms of police presence... or something ....
We got to do something.
Champion/
Lehman/
2. O'Donnell/...the fine. Going to the Board of Appeals .... I thought as council we told
him we were going to waive that charge.
Lehman/We really can't discuss that outside of executive session.
O'Donnell/We have already said this.
Lehman/
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Dilkes/To do that waiver, you are going to have to have that formal resolution and if you
want to pursue that- If there are four of you who are still inclined to do that, then I
think we are going to have to have an executive session.
Kubby/
(All talking).
Dilkes/Let's see, your next meeting you will probably do the final reading on that
ordinance. And then at that point they would be in a position to make their
application for their new special exception. So I think we could do the executive
session next time.
Lehman/All right.
Karr/They just requested expedited action.
Dilkes/Then you can do the final one tomorrow. So I guess maybe we would have to
have- Because they would be then in a position to do their special exception
application after tomorrow.
Thornberry/! will definitely be requesting the waiver of fees.
Lehman/Do you want to get together at 6:30 tomorrow night for an executive session for
one half hour?
(All talking).
Karr/The only way we could do it would be the emergency section.
Dilkes/I don't think so.
Kubby/Can we at least let the applicant know that if they apply for it between now and
the next meeting that they will have to pay the fee. But if they will wait ....so we
can have the executive session, then there is an option.
Thornberry/
Lehman/The important thing is that he does not pay the fee. Streit does not pay the fee.
Bruce pays the fee. Is that correct?
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Dilkes/I believe it will be Plum Groves that will be the applicant.
O'Donnell/It has been paid twice.
Lehman/Fine, we will talk about it-
(All talking).
Dilkes/I really do caution you about this because we have been sued and we have to
answer these allegations in court and I don't want to have to deal with any
admissions that we don't already have to deal with.
Thornberry/I don't want to have to come back and talk to you again.
O'Donnell/I am not going to say another word.
Lehman/Promise?
3. Kubby/The downtown spring clean up over a period of time .... good idea but I have
two questions... Is there any volunteer component to this?
Atkins/No .... We will still offer volunteer programs in the downtown. This is spring
cleaning, big time ....
Kubby/I see a trend with our household/hazardous waste clean up days moving away
from volunteers. Downtown, it seemed like we were moving away from. Some of
the aspects of the Neighborhood Services things are getting away from people.
Atkins/Household, Karen, we couldn't get volunteers last time ....
Kubby/I had people who called ....
Atkins/We put it out for everybody.
Kubby/I think it is important to have some volunteer component in our downtown. If
employees from Forestry and Parks are doing this, it means they are not doing
other preparations for outdoor things. What is not going to get done in exchange
for this? I want to understand...
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Atkins/It is difficult to measure... We just simply called upon it as a priority to get it
done...
Kubby/I would like use to monitor this spring ....
Atkins/A couple of things we are going to do this year...start steam cleaning the plaza at
10:00 tomorrow night .... super-duper job .... There are some trade-offs ....
Kubby/We should just monitor .... If we are neglecting other things... understand what
that trade-off is.
4. Kubby/We got a letter from Marsha Boyer about the Airport. If we can have someone
explain to her what our process is .....
5. Kubby/The pollution from the coal gasification plant. Saying don't do anything means
no soil erosion control. We know there is some soil erosion going on. We know
we are going to have to re-do that bridge at some point .... We advertised the
Ralston Creek Clean-up .... legitimate safety question.
Atkins/
Dilkes/Rick just sent down some proposed language about signing that area to start with.
We are going to work in getting those signs out.
Kubby/Do we know how far down it is unsafe to be in contact with the water?
Atkins/I am sure there was a limit to the study.
(All talking).
Kubby/Can we find that out before April 26 which is the Ralston Creek Clean up .... How
do we pursue liability?
Dilkes/I think we are getting as much information as we can get .... starting calling
people ....
Kubby/Other issues .... air samples from the apartments .... There were some levels of
things that really should be there ....Multiple hours a day of unhealthy air quality
in your home ....
Vanderhoeff Has it ever been updated?
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Kubby/
Atkins/
Dilkes/Do you do the Ralston Creek clean up downstream from that point?
Kubby/...go from New Pi down to Animal Control .... We need to get a hold of the
organizers ....
Dilkes/...the water issue would be downstream from that point. We will check it.
Atkins/We will find out.
Kubby/Theresa Carbrey is one of the major organizers from the Coop. Thank you ....
6. Vanderhoef/Another letter .... concerning the CN-1 zone at Scott and Court. Just seems
that there is some misinformation that perhaps they ought to have a letter ....some
confusion.
7. Norton/I just want to check how many people are going to that meeting on the Senior
Center on parking...Wednesday (4/8).
Vanderhoef/I had said I would go.
Thornberry/I said I would go.
Norton/
Thornberry/There is at least four, Marian.
Atkins/
Norton/There will be at least four of us.
(All talking).
Lehman/Connie is going, Dean is going, Dee is going. That is it.
Norton/Let those three go.
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Lehman/That is fine ....
8. Norton/I have a little list of railroad crossings
9. Norton/...What is the status of the maintenance building in the park?
Atkins/I will get you an update.
Vanderhoef/
Norton/
10. Thomberry/I would like to know what the response from the county was to sit down
and talk about SEATS. I want to get this thing done. I would like to have a
meeting tomorrow.
Atkins/I called them this morning. I talked to Steve Lacina this afternoon ....he had
indicated Thursday. He had not spoken with Joe yet...
Thornberry/When they tell me they want to be meet, I will be there.
(All talking).
Thomberry/Thursday sometime during the day.
Vanderhoef/That is the day from 8:00 to 4:00 1 am not available.
Thornberry/
Vanderhoef/Can't we do it Wednesday.
Atkins/I need to find out when you two are available.
Thornberry/Whenever they say we will meet, I will meet.
Lehman/I think it is imperative that we meet with the county as quickly as we possible
can .... I will be happy to sit in ....
Vanderhoef/I can do it Wednesday morning and I can do it Friday morning.
page 74
Lehman/
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April 6, 1998 Council Work Session page 75
(All talking).
11. Lehman/ .... We need to plan a session to talk about sales tax .... We are going to have
to do some work sessions ....We do need to set a time ... to talk about sales tax...
sometime soon ....
(All talking - schedule discussion).
Lehman/13th at 2:00PM ....
Karr/Monday, 13th, 2:00.
Lehman/I would hope we could limit that to a couple of hours.
12. Karr/Public Art By-laws. Do you wish to meet with the Public Arts Committee on
27th. It is on your Consent Calendar.
Lehman/...It was our recommendation .... look at that commission as an advisory
commission, not to make decisions relative to acceptance of public art.
Vanderhoef/It is all advisory as far as I am concerned.
Lehman/We then said we would like to send it back to the committee with our
recommendation that the by-laws be written in such a fashion to indicate that this
is an advisory board. Are we in concurrence on that?
Kubby/In terms of what... policy or specific pieces of art?
Lehman/Probably both to some degree.
Kubby/Could we get some reference from the City Clerk, some transcript of our
discussions to find an appropriate place to give us discussion?
Lehman/We are looking at rules that have been given to us. Are we interested in that
commission making advisory things for the council or not?
Vanderhoef/I want them to make recommendations.
Norton/The question is what do they make recommendations on ....
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council
meeting of April 6, 1998
WS040698
April 6, 1998 Council Work Session
Thornberry/We didn't bless the University's bridge ....
(All talking).
Karr/I am sorry, is that a yes or a no? They have requested a joint meeting. It is on your
agenda. That is why I am bringing it up.
Lehman/
Norton/We should see them briefly.
Lehman/6:30 on 27th.
Karr/6:30, I will communicate that with them.
(All talking).
Adjourned: 10:45 PM
page 76
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council
meeting of April 6, 1998
WS040698