HomeMy WebLinkAbout1996-08-05 TranscriptionAugust 5, 1996 Council Work Session 6:30 PM
Council: Nov, Kubby, Norton, Thornberry, Vanderhoef. Absent: Baker,
Lehman.
Staff: Atkins, Woito, Karr, Franklin, Davidson, Schoon.
Tapes: 96-83, Side 2; 96-, All
Review Zoninq Matters 96-83 S2
A. Consider a motion setting a public hearing for August 27 on an
ordinance vacating a portion of Lee Street, an undeveloped right of
way located between River Street and Otto Street. (VAC96-0001)
Franklin/ A motion to set a p.h. for August 27 on an ordinance to
vacate a portion of Lee Street.
B. Consider a motion setting a public hearing for August 27 on an
ordinance amending Title 14, Chapter 6, entitled "Zoning," Article
H, entitled "Industrial Zones," Section 1, entitled "General
Industrial Zone (I-l)" to allow limited retail sales in the I-1
zone.
Franklin/ ...an ordinance amendment to allow retail sales in the I-
1 zone.
Norton/ We haven't see pieces of what we are vacating on Lee
Street, have we?
Franklin/ You will before the p.h ..... You just have to set it this
time.
Nov/
Kubby/ I have a question about the industrial zone.
Woito/ They are in there. They are just not sticking out.
Kubby/ In terms of the retail sales and having them be in more t~an
one area, does that mean there is a maximum of 1,000 square
feet of each structure?
Franklin/ No, total.
Kubby/ Is that clear in the language just so there is no problems
later? Could someone just double check? .... to make sure that
our intent is that it is 1,000 square feet total even if that
footage is divided into different structures and let them
decide if they want it all together or scattered.
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Franklin/ Okay.
Co Agreement between Johnson County Iowa, and Iowa City, Iowa,
establishing policies for development of land within the
extraterritorial area of Iowa City and incorporating those policies
in the Iowa City Comprehensive PlanQ
Franklin/ Fringe agreement and that is broken out in the agenda so
we will get to that later.
D. Public hearing on an ordinance amending the Zoning Chapter by
amending the Conditional Zoning Agreement for WestPort Plaza to
eliminate the requirement for a "cohesive, integrated development,"
and to remove the requirement for the facades of the buildings to
provide "horizontal continuity," for property located in the CC-2,
Community Commercial zone at 855 Highway 1 West. (REZ96-0010)
Franklin/ Item D. & E. are the continued p.h. on the CZA for
Westport Plaza and then first consideration of the ordinance
to amend the CZA. You have a letter in your packet from Rick
Berndt... from Shive Hattery... Bill Meardon, sorry,
requesting that this item be deferred. We still need
signatures of the CZA and are working on the design.
Kubby/
Franklin/ Continue the p.h. and defer the first consideration.
Nov/ Do we want this to August 27?
Franklin/ Yes.
E. Consider an ordinance amending the Zoning Chapter by amending
the Conditional Zoning Agreement for WestPort Plaza to eliminate
the requirement for a "cohesive, integrated development," and to
remove the requirement for the facades of the buildings to provide
"horizontal continuity," for property located in the CC-2,
Community Commercial zone at 855 Highway 1 West. (REZ96-0010)
(First consideration)
Fo Consider a resolution approving the voluntary annexation of
approximately 80 acres located southeast of Sycamore Street and
north of the South Wastewater Treatment Facility. (ANN96-0001)
Franklin/ Consider a resolution approving the ¥oluntary annexation
of approximately 80 acres located southeast of Sycamore and
north of the South Waste Water Treatment Facility. You had the
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Kubby/ Do you have a city map that has that area on it and the
surrounding areas to project? Could you bring that one
tomorrow? I have a concern about this .... adjacent to city
property... there is a whole lot of city ground on all sides
of it or on two sides of it that is city property that is not
developed yet ..... I want to develop our land within the city
before we annex ....
Franklin/ So you are focusing on where the corporate boundaries are
just in this area? Do you want the entire city map?
Kubby/ No, just southeast Iowa City.
Thornberry/
Vanderhoef/ Is this going to be a problem with our road?
Franklin/ No ....
Thornberry/ What is wrong with annexing property that you are not
going to use right away?
Franklin/
Kubby/ If we annex the property into the city, even though it has
a ID-RS zoning designation... they could come in the next
week .... development happens there .... obligated for city
services... demands for things... very expensive to take
services down that far when there isn't anything around it
that is developed.
Thornberry/ We wouldn't have to approve it but I don't think this
council would not do that. You could have the city here and
have land all the way around it and not develop it ....
Kubby/ Are we under any legal obligation if some property is zoned
ID-RS and someone comes in and says I want a designation, to
give them one or can we say no?
Woito/ You can say no if it is appropriate under other land use
considerations.
Thornberry/
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Kubby/
Thornberry/ You wouldn't have to have services out to an area
unless we were ready to do so.
Kubby/ We are not going to pick up people who live in the city or
pick up their garbage? If you annex it and it is rezoned, then
you need to provide services to those citizens.
Vanderhoef/ We certainly have areas within the city right now that
don't have services and haven't had water and sewer for quite
some time .... I don't see that that is a consideration.
Kubby/
Vanderhoef/ There are some in northeast Iowa City that haven't been
serviced yet.
Norton/ We ought to talk... about the difficulties here of annexing
out of sequence... that could put a squeeze on.
Kubby/
Franklin/ We do have a growth policy that gives you some direction
but wouldn't support your position, Karen.
Thornberry/
Kubby/ They would be in a growth area and have to adhere to a
Fringe Area Agreement.
Norton/ Double system thing would be required ....
Woito/ I thought on this piece we were anticipating growth because
we are putting a city street down.
Franklin/ We are anticipating growth in this area .... sewer service
will be available there shortly with the completion of the
connection between the two plants ..... a logical place to
annex land.
Kubby/ I am just saying I disagree with that because there is so
much land around that to the north adjacent to the city limits
that is not developed yet.
Thornberry/ I can understand your no growth policy.
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Norton/ Orderly growth.
Kubby/ That we do it in a way that is economical for the tax payers
and for the rate payer.
G. Consider an ordinance amending the Zoning Ordinance by changing
the use regulations of approximately 80 acres located southeast of
Sycamore Street and north of the South Wastewater Treatment
Facility. (REZ96-0012) (First consideration)
Franklin/ First consideration of the ordinance on that particular
property ....
H. Consider an ordinance amending the Zoning Chapter by approving
a Sensitive Areas Development Plan and changing the use regulations
from RS-12, High Density Single-Family Residential to OSA/RS-12,
Sensitive Areas Overlay/High Density Single-Family Residential for
a 2.29 acre property located at the intersection of Dubuque Street
and Meadow Ridge Lane. (REZ96-0011) (First consideration)
Franklin/ F~rst consideration of the Sensitive Areas Overlay
Zone... for Meadow Ridge Project and you do have memo in your
packet from Jeff Davidson regarding the issue of signalization
at the intersection of Foster Road and Dubuque Street that is
based on current counts at that point.
Thornberry/ He is basically saying not needed?
Franklin/ Not at this point in time, right.
Vanderhoef/ And is that not also the one there is a request to
collapse the readings?
Franklin/ Yes, there is a request for expedited consideration.
Kubby/ How many units we be there total?
Franklin/ Three duplexes... There is a single that exists there and
there is the larger outlot that has not plans at this point.
I. Consider an ordinance amending City Code Title 14, Chapter 6,
"Zoning," Article H, entitled "Industrial Zones," Section 1,
entitled "General Industrial Zone," to allow truck terminal
facilities. (First consideration)
Franklin/ First consideration... trunk terminal facilities and
number of days has been changed from 90 to 45 days in terms of
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storage issue.
J. Consider an ordinance amending City Code Title 14, Chapter 6,
entitled "Zoning," Article K, entitled "Environmental Regulations,"
Section 1, entitled "Sensitive Areas Ordinance." (First
consideration)
Franklin/ First consideration of amendments to the Sensitive Areas
Ordinance and there has been some discussion about the impact
these amendments will have on review of critical slopes. The
staff maintains... that we believe that, as drafted, this
amendment will still protect the sensitive areas that are of
concern... we alleviate some of the procedure burden that has
been perceived and express by people who have used the
ordinance to date. You have before you a proposal, from
Karen .....
Kubby/ So what happens now is if there is a critical slope, you
have to get a zoning change to get the overlay ..... I agree
that that is over burdensome if you are not cutting into the
slope .... But if you are cutting into the slope, I think you
should have to go through the public process ..... I think it
warrants going through the public process if you are cutting
into the slope and so that is what this language reflects ....
If you actually cut into the slope, you do have to go through
public process .... I still want the public process when you
are cutting into the hill.
Norton/ I talked to Bob some length today about this .... I kind of
came up with same thing ..... to have an option here to
streamline the system when appropriate and otherwise you go
through the hearings. I kind of like this modification of what
was presently proposed.
Kubby/ What do people think about that?
Vanderhoef/ There is something similar... in steep slope versus
critical slope that does use just administrative review as I
recall it.
Kubby/
Franklin/ Steep slopes are done administratively. They have been...
they still are. The critical slopes was the section that was
changed.
Kubby/ We have these three categories of slopes. One you do purely
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administratively .... middle slope either administratively if
you are not getting into it. But if you get into it you have
to go through public process and with the other one you go
through public process° So the steeper the slope, the more
process.
Franklin/ Unless you are 50 feet away from the protected.
Nov/ I think if you are 50 feet away from any slope you should be
able to do it administratively, critical or protected.
Thornberry/
Franklin/ Karen's proposal, if you were right up to the toe of the
critical slope but you weren't into the slope, you could have
administrative review. As soon as you get into the slope, you
have to go through the rezoning. With the protected, if you
are within 50 feet of that slope... you have to go through the
rezoning.
Kubby/ This is more restrictive in one sense and less restrictive
in another sense.
Norton/
Franklin/
Thornberry/ Does this also take into consideration the man-made
slopes as well as the natural slopes?
Kubby/ No, we already made an amendment to that.
Franklin/ That pertains only to protected slopes .....
Kubby/ I am probably going to move this language tomorrow night.
Franklin/ I guess I have a question about p.h. This is slightly
more restrictive than the proposal that was subject to the
p.h. on one section. The question is do we have to then re-set
the p.h?
Norton/
Kubby/ ... It is less restrictive in that it use to be that if you
were within 50 feet-
Franklin/ That still is the case with what you have drafted here.
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If you are within 50 feet of a protected slope, that is the
way it is in the draft that was subject to the p.h. So that
hasn't changed.
Woito/ It is pretty diminimus.
Kubb¥/ Will you think about that?
woito/ I will.
Franklin/
Tom
scott/ ...it does change the process that includes a
rezoning .... would come before the P.Z Commission
automatically ..... There wasn't a lot of objection to the
administrative review approval process .... The commision
certainly did not want to give up the rezoning and review
process on protected. I would say that there probably would
be .... close vote... to impose the rezoning process on
critical slopes ....
Vanderhoef/ ...lengthening the process probably 5-6 weeks?
Kubby/ It is not shortening it ....
Vanderhoef/ ...attempt was to speed the process along ....
Kubby/ Why do you want to protect in a greater way through public
process a protected slope versus a critical? ..... I am saying
if we cut into it, we should go through the process and if we
don't, do it quick.
Norton/ I am confused now about the actual change we are
considering .... this draft from June 11 with the proposed
changes in it .... it is presumably streamlining the
process .... the change that is before us that we are
considering tonight... it doesn't change anything about the
proposed wording of 1.2.b? Or is it only 1.2.d? ....
Franklin/ It would have to be changed in b., given what Karen has
given us.
Norton/ 1.2.b. would have to be changed somehow.
Nov/ We would have to amend both of those.
Franklin/ .... you would have the exception in d. which was that if
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no development activity encroaches in the critical slope, then
you can go administrative-
Norton/ 1.2.b. would go back to its original form and 1.2.d. would
be changed to encompass an exception for critical slopes that
are not too close. Now... in paragraph 1.2.b, they refer to a
sensitive areas development plan. They do not talk about
rezoning. Usually they mention both of those matters. Why
don't they do it this time?
Franklin/ It would .....
Norton/ ...does 1.2.d give enough streamlining?
Franklin/
Kubby/ It is more than was there but not as much as what was
recommended ....
Norton/ ...It is tricky ....
Woito/ .... If it gives P/Z Commission pause as to how they would
vote on it, that means maybe you need to start over ....
Franklin/ At a minimum, you would need to have some consultation
with the commission ....
Kubby/
Norton/ We are under some pressure ....
Franklin/ Council can meet with the commission at a commission
meeting, too.
Nov/ What is the direct impact on the particular project, Dubuque
Street area?
Franklin/ That is at the Board of Adjustment and the P/Z
Commission.
Kubby/ That goes by the current rules ....
Norton/
Franklin/ I will check on that to see what the exact impact would
be. In terms of having the readings done, if this were to go
right now, you still wouldn't be done until August 27th .....
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You may not have enough to waive and adopt on the 27th.
Nov/
Franklin/ So that would be September 10th. It would be out of the
Board and P/Z Commision by then .... because the zoning is an
ordinance, this is for Iowa City Fitness Center, they still
have to go through p.h. and three readings before the city
council ....
Kubby/ ....
Nov/
.... I would like to have us consider this change and we will
think about it over night .... we would have to amend the other
paragraph also ....
Norton/
Norton/ Can we do something with the definition to define the
construction area as including storage of equipment? This has
been our main problem, particularly with trees .... It required
that you have 50 feet of space between the construction and
the .... forested area ..... I would like to be specific enough
that we are saying-
Kubby/ It wouldn't apply to College Street. Only 2 acre area ....
Nov/ In terms of construction-
Franklin/ You want construction area to include any storage of-If
there is any storage of equipment that would be included in
the defined construction area.
Nov/
Kubby/ I would like that a lot.
Thornberry/
Franklin/ You can keep it on the lot... but it has got to stay away
from the trees. The construction area is defined as a certain
portion of the lot and that is where all of the activity, the
development activity should take place. I think the issue is
if you store your equipment outside the construction area, in
an area that is attempting to be protected, the equipment will
result in compaction and it kills trees ....
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Page 11
Nov/ That is what I am trying to say. I think you could put that
into the definition section ....
Franklin/ I would like to look into it ..... take to the Building
Department to ascertain from them what the impact would be.
Thornberry/ Talk to some builders ....
Nov/
Thornberry/ Under this ordinance I wouldn't be able to build my
house anyway ....
Nov/
Vanderhoef/ I have one other possibility for addition to the
definition.
Franklin/ As we make more of these changes at this point, I think
we are probably moving toward a p.h.
Vanderhoef/ It is just that we have changed the language to talk
about regulated slopes and in the definition section we don't
have regulated slopes which actually then are three titles,
steep slope, our critical slope and our protected slope.
Kubby/ Seems like clarifying.
Vanderhoef/
Kubby/ Tomorrow night, there will be amendments from the floor
then?
Kubby/ And Linda will tell us if they trigger going back through
the process or not.
Franklin/ Are you going to make an amendment on the construction
area?
Nov/ I can do that, yes. I haven't written out... I think it should
just go into the definition.
Franklin/ That will have some impact as opposed to Dee's proposal
which is basically clarification.
Nov/ Yeah ..... It might be time to spell it out.
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Council Work Session
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Thornberry/... We are a lot more restrictive than we were.
Kubby/ ... there is a way of protecting our natural environment
while still allowing development to occur.
K. Consider an ordinance amending City Code Title 14, Chapter 6,
entitled "Zoning," Article O, entitled "Sign Regulations," to
delete the specific regulation of "political signs," and to amend
regulations applicable to all temporary signs, including political
signs. (First consideration)
Franklin/ First consideration... temporary signs,
political signs.
including
L. Consider an ordinance amending City Code Title 14, Chapter 6,
entitled "Zoning," Article E, entitled "Commercial and Business
Zones," Section 1, entitled "Commercial office Zone (CO-i)," to
allow small-animal clinics in the CO-1 zone by special exception.
(First consideration)
Franklin/ First consideration.. to allow small animal clinics in
CO-1 zones by special exception... boarding limited to those
animals being treated with no number limitation.
M. Consider an ordinance amending the Zoning Chapter by designating
36 properties as Iowa City historic landmarks. (Second
consideration)
Franklin/ Second consideration .....
N. Consider an ordinance amending the Zoning Chapter by rezoning
the following properties owned by The University of Iowa to P,
Public: 1 E. Park Road (RNC-20), 234 N. Madison Street (RM-44),
northwest corner of Dubuque and Church Streets (P~M-44), 230 N.
Clinton Street (PRM), 324 S. Madison Street (CB-2), 300 Myrtle
Avenue (RS-5), 421 Melrose Avenue (RS-5), 315 Melrose Avenue
(RS-8), 121 Grand Avenue Court (RS-8), 127 Grand Avenue Court
(RS-8), 129 Grand Avenue Court (RS-8), and 2222 Old Hwy. 218 $.
(I-l). (Second consideration)
Franklin/ Second consideration ....
O. Consider an ordinance amending City Code Title 14, Chapter 6,
"Zoning," Article J, "Overlay Zones," by creating a new overlay
zoning district entitled "Design Review Overlay Zone." (Second
consideration)
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Franklin/ The Design Review Overlay Zone Ordinance, second
consideration.
Kubby/ I have a process question about the historic landmark and
the design review. we are going to have six people here
tomorrow night, Ernie will be gone. On the 27th we will only
have six people here and I will be gone. I can see two
options. One is to collapse readings which may not be my first
option... and to pass and adopt tomorrow night or to pass
second consideration on both of these ordinances tomorrow
night and to have a majority of people to direct staff to
bring back the third reading on September 10th.
Thornberry/ I don't want to collapse without Ernie being here ....
Kubby/
Nov/ We would prefer that it not die .... If we are going to waive
second reading, it requires six people to agree to waive. We
could do that tomorrow night if all six of us agree to do
that. Otherwise we will schedule this for September 10 ....
Norton/
Thornberry/
Vanderhoef/ We want to make sure that everyone has the opportunity
to both participate and vote on the amendment ....
Kubby/ It is actually directing staff to come back September 10 to
accommodate all of that.
Nov/
Vanderhoef/ I would be fine bringing up the amendment. I want to
talk about it .... amendment... and bylaws.
Karr/ The bylaws would not be acted on unless you were ready to act
on the final consideration of the ordinance. So you defer the
resolution adopting the bylaws if you do not give final
reading to the ordinance.
Nov/ But she wants to change the bylaws .... we should discuss it
tonight and refer it back to the committee.
Woito/ It would be the same changes that are in the ordinance.
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Nov/ No ....
Vanderhoef/ ...decided it belonged in the bylaws ....
Norton/ ...proceed with second reading tomorrow .....
Kubby/ Direct staff to bring it back September 10.
Nov/
We just ask the staff to put it on September 10 agenda. We
will need a motion to direct them to do that .... It is not
something that needs a formal vote.
Karr/ For the record it would be nice for the public to know your
intent is not to vote for final consideration at your next
meeting.
Franklin/ Landmark Ordinance and well as Design Review?
Nov/ Yes ....
Vanderhoef/ (Agenda #7-Bylaws) For the Bylaws section, the way it
is presently written, it is written to have that they will
decrease their membership from 9 to 7 and of those seven they
are designating two of those members to be architects, one to
be a designer, one to be someone from the building trades .....
I am real clear that this ordinance is affecting certain
groups of people in this city and I would choose to designate
two seats on the commission. One seat for the d.t. business
district and one of the southside business district and the
commission person that I would like to see in this seat is
someone who has a ground level business .... service business
or a retail business... ground floor ....
Franklin/ Street level business owner of property owner?
Vanderhoef/ Business owner .... the owner of the building is
frequently is not the person who designs or pays for the
activity to the change there. It is the specific business ....
Naomi...
Nov/ .... don't live in the city limits .... designation as a
business owner, we may have to waive the requirement of city
resident for those two people.
Thornberry/
Nov/ o..We recently amended the bylaws so all the members of this
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co~u~ittee just live in the city limits ..... I am just saying
that it is difficult for someone who lives in the city limits
and operates a d.t. business and has an interest in this
committee.
Norton/ Seems to me we could try.
Nov/
Kubby/
Nov/ ...they should at least have a tie into that business
district .... d.t. business operator .... we just changed it to
all city residents .....
Thornberry/ It makes a lot of sense to me that perhaps that
requirement could be waived... this commission isn't involved
with housing... business owner probably spends more time at
the business than he does at home anyway ..... his business is
in Iowa City .... This group just pertains just to
business .....
Nov/
Kubby/
CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 96-87 SIDE 1
Nov/ We have gone back and forth .... other years in past where
there were people who lived outside of the city but who
operated a business d.t .....
Franklin/ These two people who are going to be business owners, who
do they replace or is this in addition to the seven?
Vanderhoef/ No, this is part of the seven.
Franklin/ What two do you want to eliminate from the bylaws as they
are now drafted? ....
Vanderhoef/ I would like one of the design professionals and one at
large.
Franklin/ It is two architects, three design professionals or
trades people, two at large. So you would end up with two
architects, two design professionals or trades people, one at
large member, one d.t. representative, one Near Southside.
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Vanderhoef/ That would be my first choice.
Norton/
Franklin/ The business
professional ....
owner could also be a design
Thornberry/ ..... somebody on that committee is from the area of
the people that are affected by the ordinance .... right now
there isn't ....
Vanderhoef/
Kubby/ You end up with only one at large person ....
Nov/ We could move to nine people ....
Thornberry/ That is too many ....
Norton/ One at large.
Woito/ Are you going to send this back to the design review
committee?
Nov/ I think so .... They have to recommend they would prefer nine
people or they would prefer seven ....
Woito/ I think this is a substantive change that should go back.
Franklin/ Are those the only bylaw change that is proposed?
Thornberry/
Vanderhoef/ The other change that I have is for the ordinance
change.
Franklin/ In the ordinance, not in the bylaws.
Venderhoer/ In the ordinance which will affect the activity of the
committee and that is what is on your desk tonight that Linda
put together. (Draft from Vanderhoef #4(o)). My concern with
the process ..... mandatory compliance .... is that a simple
majority may be forcing an owner to comply to something that
the owner chooses not to have happen. What I would like to
see... if there is not a negotiated agreement and the motion
to approve is denied .... then it would have to come back
around-
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Woito/o.. a rebuttable presumption... It would be presumed approved
until you had a supermajority vote to deny ....
Vanderhoef/ I am asking for a super majority vote ....
Woito/ Which would be 6 out of 7 for 7 persons.
Vanderhoef/ To force compliance.
Nov/
Woito/ I took that language out of Zoning Ordinance for a
protect... you could change it to 3/s of a quorum. That is not
the way it is written.
Vanderhoef/ .... that is not my intent.
Woito/ ...it is up to you.
Norton/ I am reluctant to start putting in these super majorities
Vanderhoef/ ...on something that is such a subjective kind of
action .... I have had the examples ....
Thornberry/ To be mandatory... the group has got to say gee we as
a group don't like this.. or like this .... I don't think it is
going to come down to a split vote that close like we usually
have with a 4-3.
Nov/
Norton/ I don't like to set the precedent .... safe guard is come to
the council ....
Vanderhoef/ Because we are taking this to the experts... this is
why I come back to this ....
Nov/ It is only a disapproval that requires~
Kubby/ ...people will talk it out ....
Vanderhoef/ It is a process that could be strung out .... I want to
be real clear that we are not forcing a lot of things onto
businesses ....
Kubby/ ...the second sentence needs to go, "In the absence of an
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affirmative 3/4 disapproval vote, the application is deemed
approved." That is too confusing for it to be acceptable to
people. I think it needs to be stated differently.
Nov/
Thornberry/
Norton/ ...make it 60% .....
Kubby/ People think about it .....
Nov/
Kubby/
Norton/ 6 out of 7 is too heavy duty.
Vanderhoef/ I do have support from
people ....
one of the missing council
Franklin/ There will be an amendment from the floor and this is the
second consideration, right.
Woito/ This is more protective of the property owner and less
onerous on the property owner. That is why I don't think this
needs to start over. Are there four for the 60% or the 3/4s?
Norton/ I can never go 3/4s.
Thornberry/ I could go 3/4s very easily. You have got to have
representation of the people that the ordinance is
affecting .....
Norton/ 6 out of 7 is too heavy duty ....
Thornberry/ It is so subjective ....
Kubby/ I predict that we will never see this... Why put this on
here?
Thornberry/ ....
Vanderhoef/ I expect the business people will see this as the
council looking out for their interests.
Kubby/ Gets back to a political philosophy that
is not
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 19
reconcilable ....
Nov/ ..... may not be able to get 7 people at a meeting every time
you have that short of notice .....
Kubby/ It is only for disapproval ....
Norton/ I couldn't consider anything more than a 60% majority ....
Nov/
Thornberry/
Norton/ What is going to happen tomorrow night... We should think
about the voting pattern here ....
Vanderhoef/ If we do not have four votes .... right now, then the
ordinance vote will have to come at time of third
consideration.
Nov/ You would amend it on the third consideration instead of the
second?
Vanderhoef/ Unless we have four votes right now for it.
Nov/ Doesn't look like it.
Thornberry/ I hate to restrict people ....
Norton/ ...This is in the interest of the whole community including
d.t .... to enhance the activity and to enhance the d.t .....
Thornberry/
Kubby/
Norton/
Nov/ We will just bring it up tomorrow saying that we are thinking
about this type of amendment and bring it up on third
consideration.
P. Consider an ordinance amending the Zoning Chapter by
conditionally rezoning a 2.32 acre tract from I-l, Industrial, to
CI-1, Intensive Commercial, for property located east of Sunset
Street on the south side of Highway 1. (REZ96-0006) (Pass and
adopt)
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 20
Franklin/ Pass and adopt on a rezoning ....
Q. Consider a resolution approving a final plat of Galway Hills,
Part Three, a 21.29 acre, 53-1ot residential subdivision located
south of Galway Drive and east of Highway 218, Iowa City, Iowa.
(SUB96-0014)
Franklin/ Galway Hills, Part 3 should be deferred to August 27.
R. Consider forwarding a letter to the Johnson County Board of
Supervisors recommending denial of an application submitted by the
Detweiler Family Revocable Living Trust to fezone a 1.58 acre tract
located in Johnson County in Fringe Area 4 approximately mile east
of the Iowa City corporate limits on Lynden Heights Road from A1,
Agricultural, to R2, Two-Family Residential. (CZ9628)
Franklin/ A letter to the Board of Supervisors recommending denial
on an application to rezone a property .... This is a
circumstance on which a housing unit was essentially being
used as a duplex but was not considered as such in the county
because it was owner occupied and part of it was being rented
out. They wish now to change it to a R2 zoning to allow both
parts of the house to be rented out to people who do not own
the property. This is inconsistent with the Fringe
Agreement .... recommendation from the staff and P/Z Commission
is that you send out a letter suggesting denial.
Thornberry/ What would they do?
Franklin/ They would be able to use their preperty as a s.f. house
of farmstead as it is zoned.
Nov/ Or they could. o.SUbdivide it differently so the lot would be
larger?
Franklin/ They would have to... they could subdivide the property
and make two lots out of it... they couldn't put in a duplex
regardless .... not without R2- zoning.
Vanderhoef/
Franklin/
Thornberry/ These people...want to move...
Kubby/ The current use is against the code, right? So they are
using their property against the code.
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session
Thornberry/ Is it existing non-conforming,
are they doing that?
Kubby/
Scott/ They established it after
conforming ....
Woito/ It is illegal.
Nov/ It is just plain illegal.
Thornberry/
Page 21
grandfathered in? How
county zoning .... illegal non-
They didn't get a permit.
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 22
Fringe Area Agreement 96-83 S2
Franklin/ You received back in June a memo from myself to P/Z
Commission along with a redrafted agreement that pointed out
changes between when this originally started in March 1995 to
now. You have a memo from George Starr indicating a couple of
things that the P/Z Commission wished to changed which were
basically clarification and also the issue of a two mile
extraterritorial review that be changed at any time which
seemed to be reasonable. I guess what I would ask rather than
going through the whole agreement again .... if you have any
questions about the agreement, if you are ready to vote on it
tomorrow night. There will be a p.h .... and a resolution is on
for adoption.
Norton/ You had no problem of that suggestion that future
development word being put in there?
Franklin/ No, I think that was a good idea ....
Norton/
Franklin/ Fringe Area A is not an area in which we anticipate
annexation ....
Kubby/ Couldn't that outlot in the future become open space? In B
or C? .....
Franklin/ When it is platted, the outlot will have a designation.
You have to say what an outlot is going to be used for and if
at that point, when we look at the plat, it will say either
open space, agriculture or future development upon annexation.
If the choice is for open space, then it means it is for open
space until it comes back through a review and allows that use
to change ....
Kubby/
Franklin/ I would refer you to page 3, third paragraph down, at the
end of that paragraph.
Norton/
Franklin/ If we do designate a growth area if Fringe Area A which
we are contemplating with the revised Comp Plan to get that
700 acres. At that point we will need to do an amendment here
that will refer to the city's growth area in Fringe Area A as
it refers to it in Fringe Area B and C.
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 23
Norton/
Kubby/ Is there anywhere where the word consultation is
defined? .... I just want to be really clear with the county as
to what their role is ....
Woito/ It is not defined in here but it certainly defined by
Webster's.
Franklin/ Page 5, Section C.3... city will take county's response
under advisement when determining the extension of
extraterritorial review.
Vanderhoef/ Advisement...at top of page 3, also under annexation
C., in both places we are talking about review and comment
prior to p.h ..... The experience .... previous agreement...
city and county have this time where they can review and
comment but it has no value.
Franklin/ That is why we are going through all of this .... It is
changing in the intent. I think the words have always meant
just that. That the authority is going to rest with the county
for zoning. It is going to rest with the city for annexation.
And that authority is given by the state and we cannot change
that authority without the consent of both bodies ....
Vanderhoef/ ...there is a recourse that has not been followed up to
this point with the previous agreement ....
Franklin/ There is not an expectation that things will be the same.
Norton/
Franklin/
Nov/ We have been dealing with County Supervisors who believe this
was a guideline rather than a contract and we have been saying
that we consider it ia contract ....
Kubby/ Other recourse.. to say within the whole two miles it is
city urban standards ....
Vanderhoef/ Why are we even going through this exercise? .... We
could take it upon ourselves to do these things and protect
the things we want to protect ....
Kubby/ Bottom line is we didn't have four votes to be assertive ....
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 24
It is something that we can do... monitor .... ask staff... how
have they gone ....
Franklin/ This is a three year agreement as opposed to the previous
one which was longer.
Norton/ Are you satisfied, Karin .... with clustering .... ?
Franklin/ Yes. The previous document relied on county zoning
ordinance to achieve that clustering ....
Kubby/ Has the county indicated that they are interested in, with
the increase in density, the 50 and 80%?
Thornberry/ The county has seem this and likes it?
Franklin/ Yes. They are scheduled to vote on it Thursday.
Norton/ It has been hammered out. It deserves a try .....
Kubby/ Maybe we should show up at their meeting Thursday night ....
Vanderhoef/ .... Karin is talking about a 18 month review of th~s
and if we see that the contract is not being lived up to by
either side, what is our legal possibility of breaking the 28E
agreement.
Woito/ You have the same remedy you have with any other agreement
but you have to decide that you are willing to fight it .....
court .... We talked about this at length .... we have moved
this far. But you do have remedies...
Council/ (All talking).
Nov/ Why do we have to designate what these areas were... in terms
of numbers? This is a new agreement. Can we just go with it
and forget about what formerly- I think it is time...? I would
like all the formerlies out of there.
Franklin/ We can take those out ....
Nov/ They don't mean anything to most people at this stage .....
Woito/ 1995 Code instead of '93. That is how long it has take, two
years ....
Kubby/ Can we ask staff in 18 months to give us a listing of each
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page
of the fringe area development and how both sides have
up to the agreement? .... It is half way through ....
Thornberry/
Franklin/ There is enough requests for rezonings ....
Nov/ Based on construction season
Franklin/ Don't worry, we will be keeping an eye on it.
Norton/ I want to go out on this on a positive note ..... good series of discussion ....
Nov/ A pat on the back for Karin.
Vanderhoef/ Karin, a typo on page 3, #3, case by case .... #3, same thing.
25
lived
It was a
page 4,
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 26
Relocation of CRANDIC/Iowa Interstate RR Interchanqe
Jeff Davidson/ We have had a proposal brought to
96-87 S1
us by two
railroads that operate in this community. Just real quickly
the Cedar Rapids and Iowa City Railway operates between Cedar
Rapids and Iowa City .... Hills .... They also operate a line
between Cedar Rapids and Homestead .... Iowa Interstate Railway
operates over the former Rock Island line .... east west
carrier .... between Omaha .... Illinois .... Both railroads are
an important part of our economic vitality in this
community .... The proposal that has been brought to us is
related to the problem of rail crossing blockages... in south
Iowa city .... For Iowa City it is principally the crossing
blockages that are related to those two railroads
interchanging cars with each other .... and the interchange
trackage that they use .... located between Kirkwood Avenue and
Highland Avenue ..... this is trackage that both railroads
connect to .... slow moving traffic... annoying to motorists.
These railroads block three very important arterial streets in
south Iowa city, Gilbert Street, Kirkwood Avenue and Highway
6 .... forecast .... is for even increase railroad traffic
And it is starting to cause us some problems .... This is the
problem... The forecast is for it to get worse. What is being
proposed is to relocate that interchange trackage and what
Iowa Interstate and Crandic have done is worked out a
proposal .... to relocate that interchange trackage to a place
out by Homestead where the two lines interlock out there. They
have indicated to us this should not be considered lack of
commitment to this community ..... They encourage more traffic
to their shippers here .... The proposal then is to eliminate
the interchange traffic of Iowa City... this would eliminate
.... majority of the interchange traffic between the two
railroads ..... This would very significantly, not eliminate,
very significantly eliminate crossing blockages in south Iowa
City. The proposal is estimated right now to cost between $1
million - 1 1/2 million and the railroads have said they
cannot pay for it .... It will not happen if they have to pay
for 100% of it. What they have asked is the City of Iowa city,
Coralville and the University .... are you interested in this
enough that you are willing to participate with us.
Thornberry/ In other words, pay us $300,000 and we will switch our
cars outside the city.
Davidson/ Not exactly. They have done .... is enough leg work with
IDOT to determine that there is a reasonable potential for us
to obtain a grant for the Clean Air Program of IDOT that would
pay up to 80% of the proposed expenses to do this. The first
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 27
question is that grant program can only be accessed by
municipalities, not by railroads. So they want to know if
either Iowa City or Coralv~lle are willing to sponsor that
application because of the benefit that would be accrued ....
Kubby/ Does it make it a more powerful application if we jointly
submit it to Coralville?
Davidson/ .... makes it a more powerful application if everybody is
on board with it, that includes the University ....
Kubby/
Davidson/ First question is are you interested enough to be the
sponsoring party for the application? .... Question #2 is are
you willing to participate in any of the estimated local
match .... $200,000 to $300,000. The railroads have said they
have got some money for the local match ....
Kubby/ Does local match include in kind contribution like staff
time?
Davidson/ The time and expense to put application together is not
eligible .... Our staff time is not a possibility. This
application involves some real complicated calculations about
the amount of different types of emissions that are
reduced .... That is something we have never done before. It is
going to take us a while to put all that together ....
Kubby/ What would have to be rearranged in the current JCCOG work
plan in order to accommodate this new project?
Davidson/ We have time built into our work program for these types
of things when they come up ..... hopefully there is no
deadline item, Karen, that we would have to defer in order to
get to this .....
Norton/ Would this involve actual removal of tracks at some point?
Davidson/ It could, Dee. I would imagine the two railroads want to
preserve the interchange trackage down there because .....
hopefully they can be minimized... I am sure they want to at
least preserve the ability to exchange cars somewhere in this
community ....
Nov/ Tell us what involvement do they have? Are they actually
constructing new track? Where does the $1 million come from?
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 28
Davidson/ Most of that expense is in acquiring the property and
then constructing the interchange track.
Nov/
Davidson/ ...there may be additional property that they have to
acquire ....
Kubby/ So are they taking agricultural land or places where people
are living? ....
Davidson/ It is in an agriculture area .... I can find that out.
Vanderhoef/ Don't they still have a working grain elevator operator
that would have some site? ....
Davidson/ Most of Crandic's interest in the Amana Colonies is the
refrigeration.
Thornberry/ ... you are saying the railroads might pop for some of
the $300,000?
Davidson/ I think they will definitely pop for some of it.
Rubby/
Thornberry/ I don't think we can expect too much from
Coralville .... We will ask .... I really think we ought to do
this.
Kubby/
Thornberry/ I think we ought to consider sponsoring this thing.
Kubby/ And they can pay the 20%, the railroad?
Thornberry/ They can pay maybe a portion of the 20%.
Kubby/ They are already on the public dole for 80% of it. Why
should we add another percentage to that? They are getting a
huge amount of public subsidy.
Thornberry/
Kubby/
Norton/ I would look at virtues for us ....
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 29
Davidson/ A lot of those crossings are related to shippers down
there ..... Those aren't going to presumably disappear ....
Norton/ I would be for it but I do think we ought to look to them
for the majority of the 20%.
Vanderhoef/ Yes, I think we should continue with the exploration of
this ....
CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 96-87 SIDE 2
Vanderhoef/ I have one other question that I would like answered..
Would this then eliminate the storage of trains engines,
running engines, that come in our south part of town?
Davidson/ It will not eliminate those .... because one of the things
that Iowa Interstate does down in that area around Dodge
Street .... they put trains together .... They will still run
their railroad operation out of the back area .... What will
change is the interchanging of cars between the two
railroads .... There will still be trains operating in that
area ....
Vanderhoef/ My biggest concerns are the trains that sit there
idling for a whole weekend .... Is there any other place that
the engines could be stored? ....
Davidson/ I will express concern to the railroad .....
Vanderhoef
Kubby/
Davidson/ Can you indicate to me whether or not absolutely no
participation in the local match or possibly but we are not
willing to say exactly right now?
Thornberry/ There you go.
Norton/ Some.
Thornberry/ Some, that is right.
Nov/ I would go for some financial participation ....
Council/ (All talking).
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 30
Kubby/ ...the question is who should pay ..... They are getting 80%
from public funds. That is more than enough. They should take
responsibility for a mere 20% ....
Davidson/ Would it be fair for me to say a majority of council this
evening that expressed a possibility for participation of
local match? .....
Norton/
Council/ (All talking).
Kubby/ .... costs us money.
Davidson/ Maybe at out meeting on the 28th I can indicate... look
at work program .... Our deadline stuff I think is in good
shape. Thank you.
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WS080§96
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 31
Buildinq Plans, Old Librarv Parkinq Lot 96-87 S2
Kubby/ We didn't get anything about the Old Library Parking Lot?
Nov/ No, we did not.
Vanderhoef/
Nov/ Who has the building plans for the parking lot?
Franklin/ Jim Clark and Joe Holland and Kim Schmidt would like to
present to you tonight our preliminary design plans for a
project on the Old Library Parking Lot. A condition of sale of
that property was that any building that was erected on that
property needs to have approval by city council of the design
as opposed to design review ..... What they would like tonight
is some indication from you as to your likes or dislikes about
what you are going to see. These are not final design plans.
You will have a resolution before you at some point .... If we
can get to the August 27 meeting with that, Mr. Clark would be
very happy .....
Nov/
Joe
Holland/ I represent Jim and various enterprises since about
1980 including a number of buildings in Iowa City .... This is
a building .... contemporary... different color scheme .... try
to compliment existing buildings in the area. The brick is a
lighter color. There are some samples back here .... More in
the lighter color range .... rose color .... (refers to brick).
Thornberry/ Why do we have to approve the brick?
Woito/ The agreement that you signed years ago said that the city
council had design approval of this.
Holland/ That dealt with when the lot was sold from the city...
there was that agreement attached to it. This is looking at
the property from Gilbert Street .... It is actually two
buildings .... This is the College Street elevation... The
first floor is commercial all the way around...same color
scheme... blue accents .... roof is copper color .... brownish
green... Finally is the alley elevation .... parking
entrance... traffic would come in off of Gilbert Street ....
other end of the building is the service area for electrical
service, dumpsters .... This alley runs east west between linn
and Gilbert...
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session
Kubby/ What is the relationship of height
surrounding buildings? ....
Page 32
of building to the
Holland/ I think it is in a comparable range to the church ....
taller than the existing public library .... World Market, it
is slightly taller than that. It varies because .... 7 foot
drop in elevation ....
Norton/ What is setback from the street?
Holland/ You can't see it. On Gilbert Street it is a 5 foot setback
and on College Street there is... 12 feet .... (refers to
plans) ....
Norton/
Holland/ There are balconies... It is essentially all flush ....
Nov/ Is there any grass between the sidewalk and the building?
Holland/ I assume there will be .... I don't know .... on Gilbert
Street side there was all those pavers that were put in ....
(refers to plans) .... The sidewalk sets outside the lot
line ....
Nov/
Holland/
...grass .... small shrubbery.
Nov/ ...something green ....
Thornberry/
Kubby/ What is the square footage of the commercial space?
Holland/ About 20,000 square feet on the first floor for commercial
space.
Kubby/ Do you have any nibblers on that space already?
Holland/ There have been nibblers ....
Nov/ How many parking spaces?
Holland/ There are 64 parking spaces ..... 150 (bedrooms).
Kubby/ Previous building .... 1 1/2 floors of commercial space and
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 33
99 apartments .... previous proposal that New Pioneer was
involved in. Was it more than 20,000 square feet? ....
Holland/ .... They are saying the square footage is
anticipated .... There is approximately 20,000
feet on the first floor.
not what they
usable square
Norton/
Holland/ Assuming the Board of Adjustment grants a special
exception, 74 (parking spaces) ..... In CB-10 zone it specially
says that residential use above first floor is encouraged ....
Kubby/ .... Will there be some indication to tenants that parking is
basically not available?
Holland/ I think that is the intention ....
Thornberry/ How many bike racks and where will they be located?
This is a business ..... had to have bike racks by a
business .... Since the first floor is commercial, does this
need bike-
Nov/ I think to fit the code, it needs bike racks.
Franklin/ It is not required .... as it does not require parking.
Franklin/ Is that part of your plan in your application for the
Board of Adjustment to have some parking spaces in the
underground parking for bicycles?
Holland/ Not at this point ....
Kubby/ ...It would be a real amenity for the apartment building to
have bike covered secure bike racks.
Holland/ .... Board of Adjustment... parking plan has been revised
multiple times .... and until the Board of Adjustment deals
with it, we don't know what will be down there ....
Kubby/ ....
Hol land/
Norton/ Between you and the library, will that still be an alley or
will that be green space? ....
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 34
Holland/ That is a public alley ....
Norton/ Access off of College...
Holland/ That is going to disappear .... there will be green space
between this building and the 01d Library ....
Kubby/ Is there potential to have some amenities in that green
space? ..... benches ....
Holland/ It is fairly small and it is shared green space with the
University .....
Nov/ University is a tenant .... Tell us what the roof is made of.
Holland/ Roof is asphalt shingles ....
Nov/
Holland/ .... There are a number of buildings that have peaked
roofs... A flat roof building would probably lo0k out of place
in that area .... they leak ....
Council/ (All talking).
Nov/
Kubby/ Ask the architect, how does it relate in your mind to the
building just to the west?
Kim
Schmidt/ We can always say a lot of things .... straight
forward... address problems that are always relevant to d.t.
Iowa city: parking, commercial space, residential space ....
bring those together in one building. As far as relating to
buildings that are around there, we looked into the materials
that are there .... predominantly... brick .... high pitched
roofs .... picked some basic building shapes ..... As far as
taking a specific building .... that wasn't the forethought ....
Thornberry/ That half circle up near the peak, is that a room up
there?
Schmidt/Holland/ No, there are no rooms above the fourth level ....
Trying to blend it in. It would be a louver in the attic
space ....
Norton/ What is the separation between the two buildings?
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WS080596
Schmidt/Holland/
Vanderhoef/ Will
Schmidt/Holland/
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session
Schmidt/Holland/ 21 feet ..... It is really a
court yard space.
Norton/
Schmidt/Holland/ The arch is at both ends .....
Norton/ (Refers to plan).
Schmidt/Holland/ ...... Until someone
space... flexible on bow that is
Norton/ The ground floor could be one unit?
Yes, it could be .....
there be access to that area?
Page 35
light and ventilation
says we want the whole
going to be divided.
membrane roof material ....
There will be limited access .... The reason for
separating the buildings is to get natural light .....
Nov/ Isn't there a path between the two buildings... walkway?
Schmidt/Holland/ There will be an elevator .... from that area, you
can meet at that level ....
Nov/ Can a person walk between the buildings?
Norton/ Only at the ground floor.
Nov/
Schmidt/Holland/ Not now we don't know who will be using that
space ....
Norton/ Could it be decided that the roof is glass? .....
Kubby/ Can we get 8 1/2 by 11 copies of this? .....
Schmidt/Holland/ We can reduce the copies .....
Kubby/ Something that I can carry ....
Schmidt/Holland/ ......
Vanderhoef/ Tell me about your balconies there and access to them
and will they have the compressors and stuff on the balconies?
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 36
Schmidt/Holland/ Each of these balconies are recessed into the
apartment so they do not project out... yes, there will be a
small compressor serving each apartment .....
Schmidt/Holland/ The compressors are here .... they will be behind
the railings .....
Holland/ earlier today Jim met with Larry Baker .... that was talked
about and there are ways to disguise those a little bit
better .... It is a color that blends in .....
Norton/ Each compressor serves how many units?
Holland/ One. Each one has central air ....
Norton/
Holland/ You have to dissipate your heat .....
Schmidt/... that is the most efficient... I am also interested in
the appearance of them .... We feel that this is a
compromise... accessible for maintenance...have air
circulating around them ....
Kubby/ Is there a way, when it comes back for final approval, to
have a blow up sketch on one of he units and what the railing
and the patio and... compressor would look like. You don't see
them in this drawing at all ....
Schmidt/Holland/ The Compressor is just like many of the other
apartments .... 18-24 inches in diameter .... if more of a
detail is needed ....
Vanderhoef/ How big are the balconies? .....
Schmidt/Holland/ They are a little bit over 6 feet wide .....
Vanderhoef/ .... Heat generated off of those, I wonder who is going
to be using the balcony.
Kubby/ It is hard to see .... those facilities aren't shown ....
Schmidt/Holland/ Those balconies are only on the public parts of
the building, only on College Street side .... We can provide
a blow up or detailed drawing to better show what is
happening ....
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WS080596
August 5, 1996 Council Work Session Page 37
Holland/ One thing I can suggest if you want to see how these
things look .... Burlington Street building... has these
compressors on the balcony ..... look at those and see how they
look .... the plan this time is to paint the covers... same
colors as balcony railings ....
Nov/ What are you going to do about the compressors for the
commercial areas?
Holland/ I assume those are going to be located somewhere out in
the center of the building in that open area on the roof .....
I think what you see is what you are going to get on College
Street ....
Kubby/
Thornberry/ On the apartments are those sliding doors? ....
Schmidt/Holland/ Yes ..... one side is fixed .... each has it owns
heating and cooling unit.
Nov/ You have to vent it somewhere ....
Holland/ One thing I would like to address is to try and move this
through the process as quickly as possible ..... complicated
buildings .... going to take almost a year .... needs to be
available for occupancy approximately next August 1 ..... Like
to have approval as rapidly .... so that construction can be
started ..... get a better product when it is warm outside .....
We would like you to act on this as soon as possible.
Woito/ This is the alley facade?
Holland/ College Street... (Refers to plan).
Woito/ If that is the alley facade, then that central thing with
the round...does not go through to the alley.
Holland/ It runs from Gilbert Street to the west .... All it is is
open space ....
Vanderhoef/ .... how the building will 10ok after we have the
commercial spaces in there .... I don't know how we address
that kind of question at this point ....
Thornberry/ Where would the signs go if this were commercial
spaces?
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Holland/ Signage would be back... under the arches .... covered
walkway in front of the building .... (Refers to plans). It is
a covered walkway all the way along Gilbert... College ....
Norton/ (Refers to plans) ....
Nov/ You are not being picked up on the microphone ....
Nov/ It does not extend around the corner but it shows up on both
sides.
Schmidt/Holland/ .... it is set back in .....
Norton/
Kubby/ I want to go back... curb
sidewalk and some space and
right?
and some space and then public
then the commercial sidewalk,
Thornberry/ The space between the sidewalk and front of building
will be covered by the apartments above, okay.
Norton/
Jim Clark/ Actually there is a 10 foot walk under this area (refers
to plan) .... You have not only your public sidewalk but a 3
foot area that you can place grass ..... (refers to plans)...
have 10 foot area that you could walk along College Street ....
Kubby/ Is there still continued discussion with New Pie?...
Clark/ No ... Rochelle called .... I ask her if she wanted me to
keep her posted... So we don't know where we stand at this
time .....
Kubby/ With the parking, there is no access onto College Street?...
Vehicular access is only off the alley?
Clark/ Limited use on that alley anyway ....
Kubby/
Vanderhoef/ I have a concern about cars coming out of the alley and
trying to make a left hand turn going north across on Gilbert.
Is there any conversation... to make that a one way alley? ....
I can see where you would sit there for a long time ....
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Clark/ .... I think that students become very smart about this .....
Vanderhoef/ So you wanted object if this became a one way?
Clark/ .... You also have two stacking spots ..... striping down the
middle .... We have accommodated some of this. If there is a
problem, I would have no problem with a one way ....
Norton/ Your intention is for the parking for the commercial
space?...
Clark/ Both ....
Nov/ If these apartments were rented by students, wouldn't they
walk to the University, wouldn't those cars just sit there?
Clark/
Kubby/ Very few of the tenants be able to have a parking space
there ..... expensive commodity ....
Norton/ The middle section can really be exciting with a glass
roof ....
Holland/ .... making certain things vandal proof .....
Kubby/ I would be interested in seeing some detail of the College
Street side... compressors... I will go look at the new
building on Burlington ....
Clark/ We have same concerns ..... shading compressors to .... blend
in ....
Kubby/ I would hope that you would consider creating some space for
bike racks in the underground parking area as well as above
ground
Clark/ ....
Norton/
Clark/
Thornberry/
(refers to plans).
CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 96-88 SIDE 1
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Kubby/ ...initial reaction... across from Trinity... seems to blend
very well with Trinity... I like all the windows... It would
be nice if New Pie... for this to be a spot... I have never
been on that board.
Nov/ Okay, any questions? Thank you all.
Thornberry/ What is the time frame on the expedited thing on this?
Kubby/ Does it go to Design Review?
Thornberry/ ...What is the first step, second step, third step?
Franklin/ They are doing Board of Adjustment. That is August
14 ..... It is not required to go through Design Review.
Kubby/ We could request to get some recommendation from them ....
Thornberry/ Oh Lord, let's hold them up for-
Kubby/ You could meet in between so it doesn't hold them up .....
Thornberry/ ..... All I am saying is they requested expedited thing
and if we are going to do it, why not?
Norton/ You can do that and do it at the same time.
Nov/ But we cannot vote before August 27th, right? Do we need a
formal vote?
Franklin/ You need a formal vote. There can be a resolution on your
agenda 27th of August.
/ (Can't hear).
Norton/ We have gotten some good suggestions on a couple of other
projects without slowing them down.
Thornberry/
Nov/ We aren't changing anything. It is just a recommendation.
Norton/ I understand there is some agreement .... of what the
council can consider in the case of this building. What are
our limits and what can we do visa vis this building? Are
there some existing agreements about this space?
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Atkins/ My understanding that you are operating under you must
approve the plans for the building. I think it is very
general.
Norton/ ... I hear some concerns being expressed about the density
question ....
Atkins/ To my knowledge, as long as that building meets zoning
requirements ....
Woito/ No, we have some control over the design. It is in the
agreement between GWG and us and we don't even have a copy. So
we need to get a copy out so we can look at what-
Norton/ ...my question... the building .... walls come right out to
the lot line. The set back is only on that ground floor...
does crowd the place ....
Nov/ He said there is a set back from the lot line but it is only
five feet or three feet ....
Norton/ I am talking about the walls of the building.
Woito/ You need a lot more information before you can assess it.
Norton/ Looks to me like the walls do come out pretty far .....
extend right to the lot line .... I just want to know what
degree of the agreement do we have to comment on this thing.
Arkins/ I just don't know.
Woito/ You need the elevation to see how it is going to fit in with
the Old Library.
Arkins/ It is separate from the Old Library.
Woito/ That property is tied into that whole sale of the Old
Library... there were restrictions on that.
Kubby/ We haven't seen anything in writing... We should look at
that agreement ....
Woito/ You certainly need more information...
Arkins/ But the property owner of that library is in no obligation
to keep that building ....
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Woito/
Nov/ It was intent to somehow tie in visually with the Old Library
Norton/ ...I don't know what our ground rules are .... as to what we
can investigate .... ought to be careful about crowding ....
Nov/ As far as the density, doesn't it just have to meet the Zoning
Code?
Woito/ I don't know. I haven't read that agreement in like five
years ....
Nov/ I am talking about the density... as long as it meets the CB-
10 code... I think that is the only thing that is
addressed ....
Kubby/
Nov/ I don't think the density has to be addressed.
Thornberry/ If someone wanted to tear down the 01d Library, they
could do that?
Atkins/ Yes, as far as I know.
Kubby/ It should be a landmark so it is protected.
Norton/ How soon can we see other elevations?
Woito/ Whenever you want them.
Norton/ I would like to see other elevations ......
Woito/ I can call Joe Holland and tell him.
Arkins/ I just think you get them by making a demand for them ....
Norton/ I sure would like to see them ....
Nov/ They do not have a footprint... they don't have any of the
surroundings ....
Thornberry/
Norton/ I will find a footprint.
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Atkins/ Let me make the request for you.
Kubby/ I think it would be good to get it before the Friday before
the decision .... so people can look at it ....
Atkins/ I will check it tomorrow for you.
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Family Buss Pass/Family Swim Pass 96-88 S1
Fowler/ Family bus pass... Ron and I have talked about a lot .... It
is something that council has asked us to look at. We haven't
been able to come up with a real good solution for a family
bus pass. Our current policy,.. allows a bus pass to be used
by any member of a family when traveling separately ..... They
are already transferable... and children under five currently
ride free .... Stumbled on... what is a family. How do we
define what a family is .... We came up with two alternatives
that we think might benefit .... one child rides free with each
adult during non-peak times .... Other solution was a
discounted student pass .... at a lower rate .... We did take
into consideration the swim pass that is used by Parks and
Rec .... that is designed for four people .... These were the
best two alternatives that we could come up with ....
Kubby/ Use the philosophy of family swim pass but change the
numbers? ..... First incremental price is for two people and
then would pay an incremental price more but not a full fare
more for each person added on
Fowler/ That is why we came up with a student fare.
Norton/ What would be a student? ....
Fowler/ High school and younger .... discounted pass for youth ....
makes more sense ....
Norton/ .... seems to me fairly straight forward ....
Fowler/ .... require I.D ..... student pass... indicate that it was
for youth ....
Thornberry/ A question... University of Iowa to sell student
semester transit passes... older than high school.
Fowler/ This is a different program.., You also asked us to look
into getting University of Iowa students to ride more... We
have been working with the University...
Thornberry/ Would this be the same price as a high school or junior
high student?
Fowler/ That would be up to council ....
Thornberry/ ....
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Norton/ ...I like the idea for youth ....
Nov/ What about offering a student... a reduced single fare rather
than a pass ....
Fowler/ We will do whatever you want.
Nov/ I think there would be more use than having to buy a pass
ahead of time... kids riding this east side loop ....
Atkins/ What is the intent here? Is the intent ridership or more
money?
Kubby/ Ridership.
Atkins/ The more human beings we can take the bus ....
Thornberry/ ... It is some of both ....
Arkins/ If you want to get human beings on to improve ridership,
then the issue of offering discounts, to me, makes sense ....
If you simply want to make money .... we know... that block of
riders... you can kind of go after that .... Something like an
I.D. and reduced fare is very very simple .... Concept... on a
family... difficult to administer ....
Kubby/ I don't get that... you go into the swimming pool .... it is
paid for up front... you have a laminated pass ....
Fowler/ It is not hard to administer. What we are looking for is a
fair and equitable way to price it so that a non-traditional
family can benefit as well as a group of four .... looking for
a way that a single parent with one child .... so they also
receive some benefit...
Atkins/ ...Does that simply there is some inequity in the way we
administer the swim pass, particularly a family of five? Or
the family of two?
Fowler/ One of the reasons we also put in ride free with a parent
with a pass ..... There are different ways .... the family pass
would serve the people who rode a lot .... Who do we want to
serve and how do we break those groups down? ....
Thornberry/... student pass... good for a year...
Kubby/ That is hard on lower income families ....
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Nov/ I am suggesting show an I.D. and get a reduced fare.
Thornberry/ If they want that rate and then they have got to show
their I.D.
Nov/ If they went to a reduce pass .... break even .... I think there
are a lot of non-traditional riders... twice a week .....
sometimes you car pool .....
Norton/ I like the adult fare, youth fare and free fare .... easy to
administer.
Nov/ ... you would have to show an I.D.
Norton/
Atkins/ They have them but they don't carry them all of the
time .....
Council/
Kubby/ So people now talking about not having a pass but having
discounted fare for youth?
Vanderhoef/ I think this is easier for the user ....
Kubby/ Do you want to say five to sixteen? What about seventeen
year olds? .....
Vanderhoef/ I would rather say an age than a grade.
Thornberry/ I would rather say if they are in school and they have
got a high school pass, they can ride it ....
Vanderhoef/ You have to show the I.D.
Thornberry/ Show the I.D., you get a discount .....
Counci 1 /
Atkins/ Remember, it is a service that you offer. You can't make
them do anything ...... It won't take long. If you show an
I.D., you get to ride the bus cheaper .....
Norton/ You are not talking six year olds?
Thornberry/ Could they also buy a year pass?
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WS080596
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Nov/ They are not likely to be along on the bus at age six .... I
would have no objection to selling them a discounted pass if
they referred .... I know a lot of them are buying the regular
pass now.
Kubby/ So would this be a yearly discount for a pass or a monthly
pass?
Nov/ ...monthly.
Arkins/ I think monthly.
Fowler/ There are a lot of young jr. high or high school riders
that ride in bad weather .... also run into the problem is you
issue a pass for a year and it is lost, how do you determine
whether you are going to replace it .... difficult to deal
with.
Arkins/ Joe, is there a way we could market this thing a little
more aggressively? .... Depends on the schools cooperating. I
think if you make it really convenient ....
Fowler/ We could send the infomraiotn to the schools and they could
distribute it to the students. And then Econofoods, HyVees,
all the banks, they all sell them .... pass that was marked
youth pass .....
Council/
Vanderhoef/ Back to school night might be an option.
Thornberry/
Norton/ So you are talking about a youth fare and a youth pass?
Council/ ((Yes).
Norton/ And somebody will figure out how to price it?
Atkins/ Yes.
Fowler/ You want a single ride and a monthly.
Kubby/ Is this an exclusion or in addition to the one child rides
free concept?
Norton/ Instead of that .... Why not go with this?
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Arkins/ The sooner you can get young people in the habit of riding
the bus, the longer they are going to stay riders .... The
sooner you can get them on, I think you have a greater chance
to keep them on.
Thornberry/ Do you understand the program?
Atkins/ We will write it up in a summary memo and send it out to
you.
Fowler/ Remember, we currently get state... and federal funding
based on ridership .... it does reflect to some degree in our
funding ....
Kubby/ The more people we can get on them ....
Vanderhoef/ I am interested in the University pass.
Norton/
Atkins/
Council/
Nov/ Tell us, are you going to definitely do the University student
pass?
Fowler/ As definitely as we know. We have met with the
University... cashiers office. Everybody has agreed to it ....
Dave Rickets .... Have we sat down and worked out the last
final details? No but they have agreed to do it...collect
funds and pay us for it.
Kubby/ .... get to people at the Orientation .... next summer.
Fowler/ The University has a pamphlet of other ways to get to
school .... biking, bus .... This program would run in
conjunction with car registration ..... We are doing as nuch as
we can.
Kubby/ ...Who is the person we should call to say rah, rah, we
should do it?
Fowler/ Dave has been the point person at the University ....
Norton/ Tell our student council people.
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Fowler/ Dave has worked real hard to put this together for us.
Nov/ Is Dave trying to get one in Coralville, too?
Fowler/ I don't know.
Nov/ ...need to do more coordination there.
Vanderhoef/
Fowler/ Start the end of August ..... give them their first pass...
mail pass each month ....
Nov/ Will they send you a list of names once a month .... ?
Fowler/ Yes, for our mailings, we will be able to verify. We will
also offer this to Kirkwood .....
Kubby/ Sounds like the road to some increased ridership .....
Fowler/ Okay .....
Thornberry/ About those swim passes. A family of two pays more-
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W$08059 6
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Water Impact Fee - Future Direction 96-88 S1
Nov/ Water impact fees. What we really need is a direction from
council that this is something we really want to do and a
realization that it is a very complex issue and staff is going
to spend a lot of time on it ....
Kubby/ And we are going to discuss this when two council members
are gone? ....
Nov/ I just want everybody to think about it .... We need direction
to staff .... that there are four people who really want this.
Kubby/ ...minutes of council meetings where this was talked about
so people could see it in the context of the overall water
plant decision. There was a memo by Throgmorton that was
fairly articulate about what it is for and maybe a couple
paragraph description about what it entails .... what its
purpose would be.
Thornberry/ I am starting to get a lot of phone calls.
Woito/ It was in the Gazette. Did you see the article in the
Gazette on Sunday?
Thornberry/ Yes .... They have all been negative... contractors.
Nov/
Thornberry/ They say it is not something... It costs more to live
in Iowa City .... another fee that you are going to be hit
with.
Norton/ But who pays? How do you share in the cost of these
facilities? .... Everybody has got to share in the cost of the
capital improvements .....
Thornberry/ .... An impact fee of any great magnitude is going to
make it a little more expensive to move to Iowa City ....
Kubby/ Building a water plant ....
Thornberry/
Kubby/ .... see what the whole scheme was... to spread it out in
different ways ....
Woito/ If you do an impact fee .... you may want to look at your
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current rate structure because you have to spread the cost of
that future growth among current users, future users as well
as the impact fee.
Kubby/ That was what the balance was.
Norton/
Woito/ Steve and I haven't talked about what impact that has on the
revenue bond for your- how far into the future you have to
have those rates set.
Nov/ ...applies to commercial development... and industrial...
competing with a neighboring jurisdiction ....
Thornberry/ ...different scenarios of an impact fee .... They were
taken to court.
Kubby/ Maybe what we need to do is tell staff what kind of
information we need in order to make this decision ....
Norton/ .... extremely complicated.
Kubby/ .... and not of us may have it all together in one file ....
Maybe just to get all of that... have it available ....
Norton/ .... complicated matter on how you adjust your present
rates.
Woito/ We are not that far from finishing what we started if we can
just get some idea from the council at some point that you
want to go forward ....
Atkins/ I think we can package it fairly quickly.
Norton/ I think we need to go forward far enough to know if we want
to try it or not ....
Woito/ I need an inclination from Public Works and Howard R. Green
so we can move forward on it.
Vanderhoef/ How much time do you think it will take you once you
get the information?
Woito/ Steve and I and the rest of the group have a meeting
scheduled for the 13th and I assume Ralph Russell can have the
information by then.
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Atkins/ We can ask him .... within a reasonably short period of
time, we can frame the issue for you .... This is really some
what of an administrative matter .... I think we can frame it
fairly quickly. If you are telling us to do it, maybe what is
best is for us to frame the issue in a fashion, tell you the
six or eight or ten major elements to the thing and use that
as the instrument to express your policy on. I can do that.
Nov/ .... installation fee and an impact fee...
Atkins/ .... this will be considered a new fee .....
Nov/ Do we really want to add a new fee?
Atkins/ It is another fee...
Kubby/ How do we want to spread this out .....
Norton/ ..... equity ...between rates and impact fee ....
Atkins/
Norton/ ...adjustment of rates ....
Atkins/ If you are going to revisit rates, then you had better have
this in front of you .... I don't have that on my things to do,
revisit rates, yet ....
Norton/ Doesn't this impact other capital improvements as well? ....
Atkins/ No .....
Nov/ We have done this on wastewater ..... it has been a very simple
kind of thing.
Woito/ We have parking impact fees... open space.
Atkins/ Water development fee .... we do that now .... $350 per acre
as a water .....
woito/ A figure that Chuck came up with... based on
distribution ....
Atkins/ Cost of the distribution system ..... If you want us to
frame the issue, I hear reasonable consensus you want us to
that ..... We can do that... We will frame that and bring it
back.
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Karr/ So do you want the minutes and Throg's memo and things out to
you folks, again?
Nov/ I like the memo but the minutes won't be of any use .....
transcriptions maybe.
Kubby/ .... it might shed some light...
Atkins/ We will prepare a packet of information for you.
Counc i 1 /
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Council Aqenda/Time 96-88 S1
1. Vanderhoef/ (Agenda #4m- Iowa City historic landmarks). On the
historical designations .... worked very hard to get
information out to people and property owners to let them know
about the historic designations ..... section that maybe a
brochure... questions and answers... As I read through it ....
I found this little insert .... from the Code of Formal Protest
of Rezoning Action ..... I feel that this particular piece of
information should go into question and answer brochure ....
Als0 each letter that goes out some reference to the office
and the phone number of where to get the paper for a formal
protest .... Just including this information up front .....
2o Vanderhoef/ I also had a phone call about a traffic problem that
may be coming into a pattern .... use of Walnut Street going
east and west between Dodge Street and Summit Street .... now
that the stop sign has been moved .... people cut off on Walnut
Street... unprotected corner of Walnut and Lucas...
accidents .... They are asking ..... I don't know whether there
has been a traffic count in the area or not.
Norton/ .... It is in my neighborhood .....
CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 96-88 SIDE 2
Norton/ Lucas and Walnut... accidents... somebody ought to be
looking at it.
Atkins/
Vanderhoef/ You can look at it.
Vanderhoef/ In the packet... talking about Hwy 965 at JCCOG
meeting on 28th. It really wasn't clear whether they were
expecting a vote at that time. Do you know Karin?
Kubby/
Atkins/ .... we will pay our share... you probably should vote on
this pretty soon.
Vanderhoef/ I don't know if we are ready to vote on it on the 28th.
Atkins/ No, I don't think you are ready to vote on it until you
have the results of that study and then I think you have said
to them we have a commitment that we will make a choice, set
a policy .....
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August 5, 1996
Norton/
Atkins/ ...You sent us
Kubby/
Nov/ It says the
August 20.
Council/
Vanderhoef/
Council Work Session
back to do follow up work ....
page 55
consultant should be ready to give us a report
Kubby/ The individual bodies will decide.
Norton/ Will it be on our agenda the 27th? .....
Karr/ That is what staff had indicated .... staff action ....
Atkins/ So there is a possibility the meeting of 26th you could
have a discussion item
Norton/ That would be nice ....
Atkins/ I will check with Jeff.
4. Vanderhoef/ Impact fee .... what do we pay the collection people
like HyVee where they collect-
Atkins/ A percentage and I don't know what it is. I will find out
for you.
Vanderhoef/ The question is how much do they get for doing this
service for the city, collecting the water and refuse
bills .... ?
Atkins/ I will find out for you.
5. Thornberry/ (Agenda #13- ) I was really disappointed seeing this
letter from Chris Randalls resigning from HCD Commission and
the reason for her resignation and the follow up letter from
Linda Murray. It is important .... who we appoint to these
things. Is there, Linda, a legal problem with Charlie Eastham
being on this thing?
Woito/ The memo is from Eleanor and me and the other three
attorneys in my office. There is a clear conflict of interest
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August 5, 1996 Council Work Session page 56
for Charlie Easthamwhen his organization is an applicant for
money.
Thornberry/ Not just that but any other applicant that gets
money ....
Kubby/ .... it is a really big tension .... getting people on there
who know the agencies and can participate... We do need to be
careful.
Thornberry/ What do we do with this now?
Woito/ It is not just the expertise. Some of it is personality and
there is not anything you can do about that.
Thornberry/
Woito/
Thornberry/ There is nothing we can do now because has been
appointed ....
Nov/
I would like to recommend from the council to the committee
that one of the paragraphs from the report from Linda be
adopted into their bylaws. It says, "A commission member
should not vote or participate in funding discussions if such
members affiliated with an applicant for money or affiliated
with an applicant which is in competition for moneys .....
without regard to the amount of money sought by the applicant
with which the members affiliated or the amount of money sold
by the applicant which is in competition for money." I think
this is something that ought to be in the bylaws of a
committee like this and I would like us to recommend ....
recommended from our Rules Committee .... Also we have a
recommendation to change the application form. I would like to
not ask about does this affiliated group apply for funds but
I would like to say that all applications would ask the people
to list the agencies which which they are affiliated and note
on every application that this is to clarify a potential
conflict of interest and we will do the clarification rather
than j%lst putting it just on the application for one
commission.
Thornberry/
Nov/ Just this one paragraph would work,
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Thornberry/ Then it would be up to us .....
Norton/ We really have to think about this .....
page 57
Dave Purdy ....
Karr/ I believe you will be hearing from Mr. Purdy on that.
Norton/ We ought to be careful ..... I have been reading about the
conflict of interest for a long time .... I find it very
difficult. It comes up on other commissions as well .....
BTC ....
Kubby/ But there is a conflict statement on the bottom of the
application ..... we need to gather more information ....
Nov/ ... We should say list all the groups that you have been
affiliated with or currently affiliated with .....
Norton/
Kubby/ We need to actually figure some of this out tonight ....
Thornberry/ My next comment was going to be about the application
for the Airport Commission... John Penick .... good choice for
the Airport Commission .... No conflict other than we own a
plane together.
Nov/ I personally would like to see a non-pilot on there.
Kubby/
Thornberry/ I think we should be very very very careful .....
Woito/ You have the conflict, not he .... You couldn't vote for his
appointment.
Thornberry/ The last person that was appointed to the Airport
Commission .... Be careful when we say there are five women on
this and no men and we are going to leave it open.
Kubby/
Thornberry/ What I am saying is
here with five people on
women... or five men. It
Discrimination.
Kubby/ We are
even to say there is a commission
it .... five whites... or five
doesn't make any difference...
focusing right now on conflict of interest issues.
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Thornberry/ .....
Norton/
Kubby/
Council Work Session
I have a problem... several issues ....
.... Are some pinpointed groups...? What groups .... ?
page 58
Woito/ ...This commission is unusual .... conflict of interest ....
Nov/ I would prefer to have this question on all of the
applications rather than singling out this one.
Woito/ I agree.
Norton/
Nov/ Staff will have to evaluate ....
Kubby/ And you can choose to appoint that person knowing what the
consequences are.
Norton/Kubby/
Woito/ I tried to write an opinion that would have permitted some
flexibility .... Commission did not like that opinion... make
it more clear that if there is a conflict on any one
application regardless of the applicant pool and the amount of
money, they have to abstain. I am not particularly comfortable
with that but that is what the commission wants.
Norton/ Are you suggesting that it is okay with us to take their
affiliations into account?
Woito/ You have to because the law requires that they abide by-
Norton/
Thornberry/
Karr/ We would send it to staff and staff would review it prior to
being submitted to you.
Norton/ It is a matter of degree... almost always.
Vanderhoef/ ...Just because we have an applicant doesn't mean we
have to accept them ..... That has to be real clear .....
Woito/ Construction and finance, those people are not on there
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right now.
Kubby/ .... Maybe we need to pinpoint which seats are for
finance .....
Vanderhoef/
Norton/
Kubby/ ... We call and get that information from people ....
Vanderhoef/ And what the make up is of the present committee.
Karr/ We could get that from staff. Staff could furnish you that.
Vanderhoef/ I would like that ..... might be someone who won't be
appointed. Linda, you also mentioned in the memo... conflict
of interest .... recommending that that person leave the room
when that discussion is going on... Is there any guideline
that has to be done or should be done?
Woito/ My office always recommends that .... I am not going to say
that people have to leave ....
Nov/ Those who are not going to leave have to sit still and be
quiet.
Woito/ Right, that they can't participate.
Vanderhoef/
Woito/ Much of this hopefully one has a chairperson that can deal
with it... human nature... common sense ....
Norton/ We are going to take it explicitly under consideration ....
6. Norton/ I want to ask council to support a request to staff for
some... report on status of parking d.t. I am interested in
utilization of the ramps .... I would like to know how they are
being used.
Atkins/ We just finished the financials ....
Norton/ We see so much misinformation... I think we need the
fact .... I want to know the percent utilization by time
period, time of year, ramp and lot. I will give you a whole
list.
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August 5, 1996 Council Work Session page 60
Thornberry/ Lost the amount of time or the number of hours that the
handicapped spaces are used in both ramps and the d.t.
Norton/ I know they have good counts ....
Atkins/
Norton/ I will put this together for you tomorrow .... In general...
we need to understand .... parking problem d.t ..... Most cities
you can't afford flat
Thornberry/
7. Norton/ I was interested
parking ....
in this BTC letter ..... how to proceed
visa vis community programming ....
Atkins/ Council's direction was to have BTC put together a list of
recommendations on the $.50 pass through. That is done.
Assuming there are no objections .... If you feel that you want
to beat it around for a while and have it scheduled for
discussion, I will just put it on for the 26th.
Norton/ Seemed to me fairly significant moves ....
Atkins/ The issue is the $.50
moneys ....
Kubby/
pass through... appropriate those
Norton/ ..... And we have never talked about it at all.
Nov/ We talked about it.
Thornberry/
Atkins/ Then we ought to schedule it for your discussion.
Woito/ Well, you will have to approve the agreement.
Norton/ ... council ought to discuss it a little bit ....
Kubby/ ...govern by silence .... We are so inundated with issues...
slip through the cracks... I get nervous by that style of
government ....
Norton/ I think a quick look would be Jn order.
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August 5, 1996 Council Work Session page 61
8. Norton/ (Agenda #2f(1)-) I want to know how we are to respond to
Deb Liddell's questions about cemetery expansion ....
Kubby/
Nov/ Seems to me they %~ere going to reco~m~end against it each time
we talked about it.
Norton/ Do we want to answer her? .....
Atkins/ You got several ways to answer her .... You could do it at
your goal setting session ..... 2- Simply instruct me to make
it a matter of a budget issue .... There is a number of ways to
go at it.
Norton/ I am just wondering should we answer her? Do we want to
hear from them about what they reco~mend?
Atkins/ Prepare your recommendations based upon the judgements of
Parks and Recreation .... If that is what you want I will
simply say we want a recommendation for you and it will be
considered in conjunction with other issues.
Norton /
Atkins/ I will tell them to prepare-
9. Norton/ I suppose to do anything with play vehicles proposal?
Woito/ No .....
10. Norton/ I know you will be hearing from Larry about the
evolution of a d.t. plan and some comments in that regard ....
11. Norton/ (Agenda #2f(3)-) I worry about the sidewalk on Kimball,
between Kimball and Park Road ....
Atkins/ Chuck brought it to my attention ..... number of little
issues. I will get you something.
Vanderhoef/ Do we plow the trail on the west side? ....
Atkins/ That is ours. I suspect we do.
Kubby/ Can we get back to the person who sent the letter.
12. Kubby/ (Agenda #11-RESOLUTION ON UNCLASSIFIED SAL~RIES AND
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COMPENSATION FOR FISCAL YEAR 1997 FOR THE CITY ATTORNEY, CITY
CLERK, AND CITY MANAGER). I had thought that we had talked
about putting.. salaries and compensation .... Larry had
requested and I echoed having the City Attorney's be a
separate resolution.
Thornberry/ I don't think there were four people that were in favor
of it.
13.
Kubby/ (Agenda #8- WILLIAMS PIPELINE COMPANY, A DELAWARE
CORi~ORATION, REGARDING CERTAIN OBLIGATIONS INVOLVING REMOVAL
AND RELOCATION OF A PIPELINE FROM LAND OWNED BY THE CITY.) I
am going to go out tomorrow and look at the aerial photograph
of where the pipeline relocation will be... Is there any
archeological work necessary? ....
Atkins/ To my knowledge there is not. I will confirm that for you.
Woit0/ There is that entire area we're negotiating with the Army
Corps of Engineers and state Shippo .... covers both peninsula
and Butler farm site .... lengthy .....
Vanderhoe f / ....
Atkins/ I thought we did a brief survey out there...
Bear Creek ....
Woito/ We have to negotiate with the Army Corps of
Atkins/ I thought we had done some work... We will
Vanderhoe f /
funny name...
Engineers ....
find out ....
Kubby/ The reason I want to look at aerial photograph...
to see how much .....
Thornberry/
...area of destruction ....
I thought they were going to flush it and leave
They may do that .....
we could use it for conduit ....
Kubb¥/
Norton/
Atkins/
Nov/ Said
Council/
I wanted
it.
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14. Kubby/ (Agenda #2c(6)- ) Are we going to talk about Bushnell's
at all?
Nov/ Do you want to?
Kubby/ Yeah .... memo from Marian .... staff is going to look at new
regulations about outdoor service areas.
Nov/ We had directed this to be a situation that would be evaluated
again .... outdoor service areas were going to be discussed
again ....
Karr/ Sidewalk cafes have a one year sunset clause. This is an
outdoor service area which is on private property. But you
also ha~ a request from Fries earlier this year to do
something .... make it less confusing.
Kubby/ .... trying to figure out how to make this not so
difficult ....
Karr/ Karen, I don't believe at this point the recommendation
indicated raising it a half a foot because there were some
staff members who really want to take a look at the fencing
requirement and maybe even raise it more than that ..... Our
recommendation is to leave the fence alone with the exception
of adding the gate and then we come back to you with some
different regulations .....
Kubby/ If we approve this tomorrow night on our Consent Calendar it
means that the current fence height is okay until we look at
the regulations .....
Karr/ With the understanding that he does put up a gate.
Nov/ Has he agreed to put up a gate?
Karr/ He has heard that and he does not want to put up a gate.
Nov/ I will vote no if he doesn't put up the gate.
Karr/ That would be staff's recommendation.
Kubby/ For tomorrow night, how do we know if he is going to put up
the gate or not?
Karr/ I spoke to him... I can talk to him tomorrow. I can follow
up... He indicated other establishments do not have gates ....
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August 5, 1996 Council Work Session page 64
Thornberry/ We need to make all of the d.t. areas where they serve
beverages outside alike.
Karr/ I don't know if we can make them all... private or public ....
Thornberry/
Kubby/ What about the gate in the mean time? .... It is a lot less
intrusive than what we were asking him to do a month ago and
he is still refusing .....
Thornberry/
Karr/ The issue of the fence was not just the height of it ....
everyone else has a gate .... All of the outdoor service
area ....
Council/ (All talking) ....
Karr/ They have private parties that go much later.
Nov/ We can say no liquor outside or we can give him the same
restriction that the cafes on public properties have ....
Woito/ No, you can't do that ....
Karr/ You can't regulate the hours of the state liquor license.
Nov/
Karr/
Kubby/ Can we have an affirmative vote tomorrow night on the
condition that there is a gate?
Karr/ That would be staff's recommendation that-
Kubby/ I would like to be able to vote yes...
Nov/ We can do it effective after the fence ....
Karr/ The way it is written is that staff recommends approval
contingent upon a gate .... I would not sign off the
application without a gate .... If you concur with that. That
memo is attached. We certainly could clarify that tomorrow
night .... contingent upon the fact that the gate is installed
is that is your wish.
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August 5, 1996 Council Work Session
Council/
Karr/ We have to sign it either denying
the outdoor service area we would
page 65
it or approving it .... On
recommend denial because
they did not conform with our ordinances ....
Vanderhoef/ My question is why we don't have a gate there no matter
whether we are or are not serving liquor... fire.
Karr/ For Fire Code .... it is an opening. You can get out and in
very easy... It is a regulating question ....
Nov/ ..We are going to say there will be no liquor license without
a gate.
15. Kubby/ We are slated to have a resolution on August 27 to
accept or change the Economic Development recommendations from
the Ad Hoc Committee and I would like to request that we do
that on September 10 ..... postpone that ....
Nov/ I would have no objections to delaying that to September ....
16. Kubby/ Do we know at this time what affects the new Clean Water
Act will have?
Atkins/ We will put a call in and get the bill.
Kubby/ .... also some grant moneys.
Atkins/ It appears .... small... rural district.
Kubby/ As soon as you know will you send us a memo saying how it
changes ..... how we proceed ....
Arkins/ ...I don't think it will have a big
Drinking Water, do you mean? Okay ....
Kubby/
Atkins/ It was intended... revolving loan ....
17. Kubby/ Tenth Anniversary of the Peace
the Ped Mall, to make sure we rehab
should be on the list of rehab items.
18. Thornberry/ Ped Mall.. got two calls...
night ....
impact on us .... Sate
I will check...
March .... When we redo
the Peace Pole .... It
people d.t. on Saturday
upset with the ...people sleeping on the benches...
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August 5, 1996 Council Work Session
bums .... people around that they felt
with .... We use to call them bums ....
congregating in Iowa City .... Also paper,
page 66
very uncomfortable
street people ....
writing with chalk
on Ped Mall, dog manure .... several dogs ....
CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 96-89 SIDE 1
Thornberry/ It is not a pleasant place to be ....
Norton/ ...A vision for d.t., we are going to try to deal with
that ....
Council/
Arkins/ I was d.to on Saturday night ....
Vanderhoef/ College Street area... do not feel safe down by the
fountain ....
Vanderhoef/
Kubby/ Trees ....
Vanderhoef/ They cover up every sign ....
Thornberry/ .... trees ....
19. Kubby/ Getting tired of... of our local paper bashing us as a
group .... We all work hard .... I would like us to think about
responding .... Sometimes I would like it to be the mayor ....
respond to the Press Citizen... constant bashing ....
Thornberry/ Sometimes it has been complimentary .... I agree with
you to a certain degree .... I started seeing letters from
councilors in there about other councilors .... petty ....
Kubby/ If there is no response... us to participate a little but
more about development in the perception .... Most of the time
I want to say let it go ....
Nov/
Norton/ The parking thing .... Clear date about these kinds of
things ..... Like to get some of the data on parking... reality
of our parking°..
Kubby/ In eight months none of us has responded .... Maybe a
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preemptire thing ..... based on reality... information ....
viewpoints ....
Thornberry/ ... individual council members .... very petty ....
Kubby/
20. Nov/ Steve, do you know what kind of equipment the Police
Department is going to buy if they get this grant?
Atkins/ Computers .... entitlement ....
21. Nov/ Travel policy is in the process of final revision. We will
get something out next week.
22. Nov/ I spoke to Becky Lynch at Kirkwood College about the house
on Lower Muscatine .... too wide and too tall .... taking the
house apart in order to reconstruct it .... Salvage for Salvage
Barn.
23. Nov/ We have a request from Lisa to please save and return the
envelopes and covers for these books and hardware ....
24.
Nov/ Iowa League of Cities is meeting in Cedar Rapids in
September. Marian would like us to turn in our forms. Also we
have a letter from the president who is trying to reorganize,
revitalize the Urban Mayors. They are going to meet on 19th of
September .... issues... like me to take to that meeting ....
long list... proactive ....
25. Nov/ Leach is having a meeting in Coralville tomorrow afternoon
at 2:30... library... open to the public.
26.
Nov/ We have a letter endorsing the request to IDOT from the
Monday Forum... different... So everybody has a copy of the
letter .... read it and I am going to sign it tomorrow unless
I hear ....
27. Nov/ We have scheduled
September 4 .... Steve
meeting ....
a joint meeting with the Library Board
would be willing to facilitate that
council/
Atkins/
Nov/ If it is okay with us, I will contact the Library Board ....
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Thornberry/
Atkins/ I am going to prepare a memo for you outlining some of the
issues up front to think about it ....
28. Norton/ What meeting was changed to the morning?
Karr/ 17th. 8 to 1:00 on 17th is Goalsetting.
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August 5, 1996 Council Work
A/gpointments 96-89 Sl
Airport Commission - John Penick
Board of Appeals - Gary Haman
Adjourned: 11:30 PM
Session page 69
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