HomeMy WebLinkAbout2004-09-28 Transcription
September 28, 2004 Special Council Wor Session Page I
September 28, 2004 Special Council Work Session 6:35 pm
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Council: Bailey, Champion, Elliott, Lehman, 0 Donnell, Vanderhoef, Wilburn
Staff: Atkins, Karr, Dilkes, Helling, Matthe s, Johnson, Kelsay
TAPES: 04-55, SIDE 2; 04-58, SIDE 1 and SIDE 2
ALCOHOL ISSUES
Lehmani There are chairs set up in the lobby as w 11. Okay, we have.... this: is a rather
unusual work session. One where we are oing to allow public comment. I
would like, with the permission of Council to accept, or to receive t4e report
from the City staff, relative to the effective ess of the 19-ordinance, *nd have
some preliminary discussion on the part of the Council, prior to startip.g public
discussion, if that's permissible from Coun il? (several Council Merþbers
agreeing at once) Okay, Eleanor, the stage is yours. We received your report. If
you'd like to just go through it?
Dilkes/ Yeah, I think as you and I discussed today I'm not going to go thro~gh it in a
whole lot of detail. I think the results are £ irly non-surprising, and Áat is that the
percentage of PAULA charges (Possession of Alcohol Under Legal. ge) charges,
attributable to those under the age of 19-ye rs-old, have decreased. I'think the
other significant finding, for purposes ofth' s discussion, is that the, not only did
the disorderly house charges decrease, but he calls for service on those types of
incidents decreased, which we take to me that that cannot all be attributable to
levels of enforcement. The, and we can go through the graph in mor¢ detail if you
want, but I think those are the basic conclu ions of the report, and av~ilable to the
public, and to you, for some time. I think t e administrative sanctior\s that we've
been pursuing with the State Alcohol and everages Division, there'$ a summary
of those attached to the report, by licensee, and it's our conclusion that those
compliance checks that are being done by t e Police Department for
determination of whether the bars are maki g efforts to prevent sales'to underage
,
persons, and the administrative sanctions b the ABD are having the intended
effect, in that there is a greater, greater deg ee of compliance. Finally, I just
mentioned the PAULA charges, and set fo h what the penalties are. There's
obviously still a large number ofP AULA c arges, and I did note in the report that
we are going to be attempting to pursue se ond and subsequent offenses on the
PAULA charges because there is a license uspension. The police officers who
are on patrol are not in a position to know hether somebody's been charged with
PAULA or not when they make the charge but we have started a process
whereby my office reviews those charges t e day after they're made, checks the
court records to determine whether they ar a subsequent PAULA offense, and if
so, we seek to amend those and ask the co to impose the license suspension,
and we have seen a number of those alread . So...
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Lehmani Have we been successful in amending th m?
Dilkes/ Yes. There have been a few glitches on th t, dealing with who has eptered the
original conviction, but yes, for the most p rt.
Vanderhoef/ And that is driver's license...
Lehmani Revocation.
Vanderhoef/ Revocation, not to be confused with I . quor licenses.
Dilkes/ Right, correct. It's a $200 as opposed to a $100 fine, and the court can suspend
the driver's license for up to a year. We h ve been asking, we have been
proposing, sixty-day suspensions, and so £; r the court, in the cases where they've
imposed that suspension, they have impos d a sixty-day driver's license
suspension. We have not had any that are. . we know that there are some third
and even subsequent PAULA offenses. W have not had those come up, and in
those cases, we will recommend a longer li ense suspension. Captain Matt
Johnson, Sergeant Kelsay are here from th Police Department, and we certainly
can answer any questions that you have ab ut the report.
Vanderhoef/ Do they have anything they would ju t like to say to Council?
Lehmani You need to speak at the mic, if you wou d. And we really do need to keep the
back door clear, if we can.
Kelsay/ A long way to walk to say that I think that Eleanor's summary very much hit the
bullets of the statistics that I've been keepi g and really, unless you have any
questions, I wouldn't have anything to add.
Elliott/ My question.. .were you on the force here hen it was twenty-one and over,
previously?
Kelsay/ No.
O'Donnell/ I think he was about four years old. (1 ughter)
Elliott! Matt, were you?
Johnsonl Regrettably, yes. (laughter)
Lehmani We need to keep the door clear, please. ust move to the sides, and up along the
wall.
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Elliott! It's my understanding there was a time wh n it was twenty-one and over.
Johnson! You know, I don't have clear recollectio of that, ifin fact that's the case. The
time line just isn't clear to me.
Wilburn! It's been pointed out to us by staff be for , there was no city ordinance related to
an age of entry, but what most people are t inking of when they talk about that
was the time when, because of federal law, there was a change to twenty-one,
associated with transportation funding. Th t's my recollection, what we've heard
rrom...
Elliott! I had talked with some people who fonner y were on the force, and they indicated
that it was either literally legal, or it was th zone thing where you didn't get in
unless you were twenty-one, and they talk d about the problems they encountered
at that time. Ijust wondered if you were h re, what your recollections were of
that time.
Johnson! Don't have clear recollections of that.
Wilburn! My other understanding was that it was matter of practice, accepted practice,
individual liquor license holders, as to wha they wanted to allow at their
establishment, was my understanding and collection.
Lehman! I think back in the 80's when the legal a e in Iowa was reduced to eighteen, I
think prior to that time we were twenty-on . And then we had to go eighteen,
obviously.
Wilburn! Not legally by any city statute?
Vanderhoef! Uh-huh, I don't think so. Matt, just fì r the record, could you tell us ifthere
has been any change in the police policy pr cedure over the last year, in
particular, since that's when we've been g ·ning statistics, but how there maybe
has, or hasn't been, changes in policy and ractices?
Johnson! I think that the...
Lehman! We need to clear that back door. Either ave to stay outside where there's a
speaker, or move along the wall.
Johnson! I think that the practices have remained c nsistent. I think what has changed is
with the passage ofthe new ordinance, that has afforded additional tools for the
officers to use when they are conducting th compliance checks. One of those, of
course, would be the presence of a person i an establishment after 10:00. That
has probably been the most significant ch ge. As to practice, I think it's
remained consistent.
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Vanderhoef/ Uh-huh. While you're here, I'll just sk also, on the disorderly house, since
we have new ordinance in this past year, d you have any comments about how
that has worked for you?
Johnson! I believe that's had an effect. I don't ha e any data to support that. My belief is
that obviously people have become aware fthe fact that code compliance
meetings are being held involving housing and inspection services and the police
department, landlords, tenants, and that I t ink that has had a positive effect, not
only on those specific addresses, but in ge era!.
Karr/ Mr. Mayor, I'd just like to also clarify that i the twenty-six years that I've been
Clerk and prior to that, Iowa was eighteen nd twenty-one, there has been no
provision city ordinance-wise for twenty-o e. There has been a local
establishment that did request and set their own rules, but we have not had that
ordinance in effect. We had the legal dri ing age, the State changed, three times.
O'Donnell/ I think that's what you're thinking of.
Elliott/ Sometimes I don't know what I'm thinkin about. (laughter) Matt, I thank you
very much.
Lehman! Are there any other questions for Matt? s there any comments? Discussions?
Questions by Council, prior to.. ..we did de ide a year ago when we passed the
ordinance that we would evaluate it after a ear. This is that evaluation, and the
purpose of this meeting is to evaluate that rdinance.
Bailey/ Well, and I just want to say, I'm new sittin up here, but I was in that meeting
where we talked about this originally, and hat would be very interesting to me to
hear tonight is what, not the same argumen s that we heard a year ago and the
same discussions, but what you've done in our groups, or your organizations, or
what you've seen the effect has been in a y ar, because that's what we're really
looking at is what's the effect of the 19-or ·nance been. I think we're all aware of
the arguments pro and con, and so to adva ce the discussion, I think that that
would be interesting observations to hear a out.
Lehman! Are we ready to...
Champion! I just want to ask a question because I on't have the answer in my head right
now, but Ross, you were on the committee e organized to kind of watch the
enforcement of this 19-and under ordinanc . I know you spent a lot of trips to the
bars. Did you find that the bars that compl ed with this, things that they said they
were going to do, like were there people w 0 were actually hired to police their
bars to see if minors were drinking? What as your observations about the ideas
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that the bar owners and the student gove ent came to us, was trying to decrease
the underage drinking downtown?
Wilburn! Before I answer that, let me just modify ne thing that you said. We were
approached to fonn a group, Council did n t fonn a group. We agreed to
participate but it was not a fonnal committ e of the Council, and maybe, I was
going to ask Sergeant Kelsay ifhe could c me forward to just to help with my
recollection. Thank you. We did a survey of some of the license holders, and
there was actually a very good participatio rate. I want to say it was maybe
about 80 to 90% just on their actual practic s, and I think in implementing that
and describing that, Sgt. Kelsay went arou d and collected some of that
information. It was mixed. Some of them said they, when they answered the
question they were saying their staff does t at, their servers or bar staff, but there
were not that many, or few, that actually hi ed someone just for that purpose, that
specific purpose. In other words, they vie ed that as something that regular staff
has done.
Kelsay/ Correct. There was a handful of bars, a v ry small number, that had dedicated
monitors. The majority indicated that they used existing staff in that capacity,
either wait staff or bartenders, or doonnen, and then there were, again a small
number that said that they didn't have a ne d for that, and they have various
justification. They either consider themsel es a restaurant, or knew their clientele
well enough that they didn't think that was necessary, but as far as dedicated bar
monitors, no, there were probably less than five that had that. Probably less than
three.
Wilburn! Some of them also used some of the tec iques that were in the
recommendation from the student and liqu r license holder group that had come
up with the recommendation that included he 19-only. Some of them used the
wristband system. Others didn't. Some, d ring the course of our meetings, felt
that that may have been a cost prohibitive t e thing. In some cases, some of the
distributors were providing those tags, but believe they stopped. Does that
sound familiar?
Kelsay/ (can't understand) I'm not sure. There wa a potential cost associated with that.
There was also some cost associated with. . .one of the other things was non-
alcoholic beverages to the designated drive. Probably the universal response to
that was we exist to sell a product and mak a profit. We aren't going to give
everybody free soda. However, if it's alar e group, or if it's a group of people
who are obviously coming out to drink, an somebody identifies themselves as
the designated driver, most ofthem said th t they would do that. So, there was a
mixed result as far as, certainly the measur s weren't adopted across the board by
any bar, or liquor establishment.
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Champion! Just in your own estimate, because no we do have several bars that are only
21. I guess they wouldn't have to have the same compliance because first of all
there's nobody in their bars that's suppose to be under 21, so I guess my
question. .. .well, it wouldn't be important ecause they wouldn't need all those
compliance things. Well, thank you. I'm sking because if the bar owners decide
to come to this Council with some new ide s, I'm going to see if they enforce
what they said they were going to do last y ar. That's going to be important in
my decision. Thank you.
Kelsay/ Your beginning of a question toward the 1, actually you are right. Many of
those establishments wouldn't have had to omply with them. The establishments
that were 21 and over, also happen to be th ones that did comply with most of
them, and did adopt most of them.
Elliott! My question was, do you know about how many bars now are, of their own
volition, 21 and over?
Kelsay/ I do not. I do not. I could name the ones owntown, but.. .
Elliott/ Maybe half dozen or so, perhaps?
Kelsay/ In the downtown area?
Elliott/ Yeah.
Kelsay/ Yes, that's fair, but there are approximatel 100 liquor establishments throughout
the City, and of those, I wouldn't venture a guess, but downtown, you have
probably closer to a dozen all told in that n ne block area. Quinton's, Martini's,
Joe's Place, Deadwood.. .it's just many of he smaller places that are.. . you know,
on the popular destinations, they have mar of a niche crowd or a regular
clientele.
Elliott/ Thanks.
Wilburn! And if! can just add too, Connie, some 0 your question about that. What that
group had talked about, I think initially, an some of those members are here
present too. Feel free when we get to the p blic discussion to come forward and
state your ideas. We initially went, Regeni , you were talking about hearing new
ideas, we initially went round in circles ab ut some of the stuff that we're going
to hear again tonight, and so a lot of our di cuss ions from maybe a couple months
into it on looked at some ofthe practices in the bars that, kind of survey of
existing practices, was one of the things w talked about. We talked about the
results of the nuisance ordinance. We also ooked at some of the efforts of the,
that the Stepping Up coalition was doing. orne of the bars themselves were
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taking, some of the items that, as in terms f alternatives that were suggested, one
or two of those may have happened anywa , but no one in the community,
including individuals in that group, studen s, took the initiative to get any of those
alternative activity types going.
Vanderhoef/ A year ago, at the start of all of this, testate ABD offered free TIPS
training for the wait staff and the bars, and there was, as I understand it, a very
large number of people trained at that, and pwards of 100% in some
establishments. What's the record this yea, when it's not free?
Wilburn! That's a good question. I know that L Walding from the Alcohol and
Beverages group, the administrator, had ta ed about trying to look for grant
sources to see if that could help pay for an ther retraining for groups. As of
today, I hadn't heard any further success a out that.
Vanderhoef/ So we've had a new school year start which usually indicates a large new
group of employees in our bars, so when t ese bartenders, and if they chose to
speak about it, I would like to hear what th y have done this year on TIPS training
for all of their new wait staff, and refreshe for their repeat staff.
Wilburn! Just one other thing that I would add per onally, just in terms of how I've
looked at this and how I will continue to 10 k at this, and I would ask the Council
for you to consider, you know, there's no 0 e thing that the City Council's going
to do that's going to address all of the prob ems associated by over-consumption,
and problems associated with drinking. T ere are individuals, parents, groups in
the community who are trying to address t at with prevention, treatment, and
intervention, and I think what we had been asked to do was try to make policy
that's consistent with their efforts, and in y mind, that was having it at 21 and
not 19. So, I would ask for you all to consi er what's policy consistent with
efforts going on in the community, since n thing we can do, and nothing law
enforcement can do alone, will address all he problems associated with problem
drinkers.
Lehman! Other comments? We're going to take i put from the public for approximately
an hour. So, whoever would like to addres the Council, and you're going to have
to restrict comments to 5 minutes or less. I we have consistently one side of an
argument presented, I will ask that folks gi e the other side an opportunity to
speak as well. So, who's first?
Cohen! I'll go ahead. I'm Leah Cohen, and I did knd of put mine together just a little bit
in regards to kind of some of the changes t at have gone on, and maybe could
answer a few of those questions if you had hem. In regards to the bars, I have Bo
James and I did chose to go 21 myself a fe years ago. I think it's been over two
years ago now, maybe three, I lose track 0 time, but, and I am not in favor of
going 21 now. Lots of different reasons fo it, but we had talked a little bit in
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regards, and I'll try and go through this qu'ckly, what was asked of the bars last
year, and kind of what has gone on in rega ds to that. Dee addressed the TIPS
training. Many of us continue to do throu the police department, TIPS training.
Almost all my staff is TIPS trained. We d have a lot oftumover, so it's hard to
continually have that happen. We have tal ed to Alcohol and Beverage. I
personally have talked to them many times this year to put pressure on to try and
get funds to do it at least every couple ofy ars. We've talked to the beer
companies to try and put together training. I know Sheraton Inn is offering a class
for training trainers, sort of thing, in the ve y near future. So, that continues to go
on. The Alcohol Committee was set up. I ill just say personally that I never
heard one word from the Alcohol Committ e, and I know lots of bars never heard
one word from the Alcohol Committee. N w, whether it was up to the couple of
bar owners that were on there to pass to us, I don't know. One thing was
discussed about putting ads in the paper: 1 to socialize, 21 to drink. That sort of
thing. I was never asked to do that. I don' know if with a 21 bar I need to do it
anyway, but you know there were things t t were talked about, that were never
asked, and there were, believe it or not, a I t of people never knew what went on
down here last year. Sometimes people ar just clueless about what goes on. So,
meetings we've had, people can't believe t at nobody ever asked them to do some
of these things, but anyway, we saw the or inance go into effect in regards to two
for ones, all you can drink, two drinks per erson - those sorts of things. I don't
think we've had any problems whatsoever ith that. I think the bars have very
strictly followed those. I think that a coupl of bars were written up initially for
problems with that ordinance. I don't thi we've had any problems since that. I
think that obviously there hasn't been an e phasis on enforcing it either, but I
think that the police department, or the offi ers that are out there in the bars, will
tell you that we all have followed that very strictly. I think the big bars, and by
big bars, are mostly under 21, are followin the wristband procedure. Everyone
has some sort of identification for their ow establishment. I personally don't like
wristbands. I don't think they work, becau e they're interchangeable and they do
all sorts of things with them. We choose t use a permanent marker. So, it's hard
to ask everyone to do exactly the same thin because some of us may feel that a
different thing works for ours, but we all h ve instituted some sort of a band or
marking system for...I think that one reaso , you know we talked about
overindulgence and over-consumption in t e bars, and I will say, if it goes to 21,
we're going to see penny drinks instead of quarter, a dollar, whatever. I think
that we as responsible bar owners have...I lrmly believe that we had a drastic
problem with the Union Bar last year - wit clientele, with all sorts of things that
I don't even want to get into. We all knew that, and we did what we could. There
was little that we could do, actually. I was ery disappointed that there was not a
lot more enforcement with that sort of situ ion. We now have new owners there.
We have had very good conversations with the new owners, and have kind of
taken it upon ourselves to try and put a littl pressure on some of these people to
follow what we feel are better standards in his community. We can't do it
ourselves. So, there are lots of things that ave gone on. Just so that you know
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also, kind of in closing...I know I got to s t up, don't I Ernie? (laughter) But,
there have been six places that are either cl sed and changing ownership, or have
changed ownership in the last few months, and that.. .there's probably one big
reason for that, and that is what has gone 0 with this 19-ordinance. So there are
drastic changes that have gone on, if we ju t take a look at what it has been.
Thank you.
Lehmani Thank you, Leah.
Dobyns/ My name's Rick Dobyns, and I'm the fir t of a group of citizens that have
formed a alcohol abuse working group that are going to speak tonight, and speak
to some of the concerns ofthe citizens ofI wa City, and talk to you about some
of the things you mentioned, Ms. Bailey, a out helping Council perhaps solve
some of these very difficult problems. I'v lived in Iowa City for sixteen years. I
married and I have two daughters, the olde t of whom is 19-years-old and lives
and studies at another large state universit . I've had the opportunity to serve our
community on the board of health, as well s serve our community as a member
of various supervisory boards, citizen com ittees, and volunteer activities. I am a
family physician, and I take great pride in ot only caring for individual patients
and their families, but in taking care ofthe ommunity in which we all live. I'm a
faculty member at the University of Iowa, nd I recognize the value of our
students as citizens ofIowa City. Our stud nts are special citizens who have
many rights - the right to vote and the righ to exert their free speech. Students
have the right to an education. As a citize ofIowa City, a physician in their
community and a faculty of the University, I'm here to provide for their education
and well-being. Several years ago, I had j st delivered a baby in one of our
hospitals in the wee hours of the morning, d I was hungry and I know only one
place to go to at that time of the day to get orne food. Left my car, and I headed
to a kiosk in the Ped Mall to get myself so ething to fill myself up. Now, I'm not
naive, but what I saw was nauseating. The Ped Mall that I knew was gone.
Instead of, it was replaced by the largest m ss drunk I'd ever seen. I've worked
nights in the emergency rooms of both Me cy and the University Hospitals, and
seen the fallout of public drunkenness. Du ing the day, I work in my clinic, and
attempt to clean up the social and medical onsequences of underage substance
abuse. Over the last four years, I have bee impressed by the positive growth of
Iowa City's downtown. During the day an early evening, it is a destination for
professionals, consumers, art lovers, book atrons, and young children who love
to read, play, and get wet in our fountain. uring the night, it's another story.
Our downtown glows in the day, and it dar ens at night. As a physician who
cares for this community, I read the eviden e that Peter Nathan has compiled for
us. When compared to other universities, t e University ofIowa is at the highest
margin of negative alcohol use and advers social consequences. Go Hawks. The
arguments that some student representative offer, state that the adverse alcohol
use will merely transfer to our neighborho ds if the 21 and over ordinance is
passed. Their arguments tease the citizens nd challenge the police of Iowa City.
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I'm encouraged that the Iowa City Police epartment recognizes and accepts this
challenge. As a citizen, I'm ready to chall nge that threat as well. Your own staff
feels that the 21 and Over ordinance is a to I to overcome what has become a
legacy of adverse drinking in our city. Se ral members of our alcohol abuse
working group, a collection of community eaders, are here to let the City of Iowa
City, the University ofIowa, and many oth r governmental and public agencies
know that many tools are needed. The ord nance under review tonight is just one
step in a comprehensive strategy of educaf n, public policy, and law
enforcement. Weare made up of commun ty members who live here, work here,
and will continue to be here for many year to come. We will continue to work
together with the Council on the multiple i sues we all face regarding alcohol
abuse in our community. We will work wi h the business community, the
University ofIowa, and most importantly, ith the University students
themselves in defining and creating large, ophisticated, varied, and responsible
entertainment options where students can e joy themselves. We can't legislate
alcohol problems away completely, but we can start to minimize its effect on
Iowa City by passing the 21 and over ordin nce. Thank you.
Lehman! Thank you. We need to move away fro the door, please.
Karr/ Excuse me, before you start. IfI could just r mind you, please sign in, so we've
got your correct spelling.. .in case we need 0 contact you. Thank you.
Schutte/ Not a problem. Good evening. My name is Lindsay Schutte. I'm the Student
Government President here at the Universi ofIowa. Can you hear me? Maybe?
Hopefully?
Lehman! Yes.
Schutte/ Okay. I was wondering first if I could dis ribute packets to the Councilors, if
that would be okay. Just for you to read ov r in your free time. Just some
infonnation.
Lehman! Why don't you make your presentation, d give copies to Marian and she'll
pass them out.
Schutte/ Okay, I'll do that. Ijust wanted to highli ht a few things of the student's
position, why we're here to talk to you. W 're not coming to threaten anyone, or
anyone's position. That's not the stance th t we want to take. We're here
because we want to come up with a compr mise. We want to come up with a
plan to educate the students. Right now, th re's a problem with drinking in Iowa
City, and I don't know if anyone in this roo can say that there isn't. There is.
Like, when he was just talking about the P d Mall, it's not good at night, and
there is a problem. But what we're asking s not to evaluate the 19 ordinance
based upon some statistics that were found ver one year study, not taking enough
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September 28, 2004 Special Council Wor Session Page II
input from maybe the people who are most concerned with the issue, but to
maybe establish a system of making sure t at the City ofIowa City, the
University administrators, the Iowa City C uncil, the Stepping Up project, and all
the people who have an interest in the safe y ofthe students who are over
consuming, may have. We want to establi h a committee comprised of everyone,
to look at a way to put together a persuasiv and educational campaign to discuss
the actual ramifications of over-consumpti n. I know there are various spots in
the community that are doing that right no , but everyone's not working together,
and because of that, it's only taking away om the effectiveness of everything
that could be done. We've outlined five p orities, or five requests, that we would
like to have the Council consider in your e aluation of the 19-ordinance. We feel
that it's been an effective tool, and can con inue to be an effective tool, but only in
the matter that it's coupled with education nd cooperation. And so I'll just read
the five off, and then I'll give the infonnati n to Marian, and I'll let other people
speak about their concerns. First of all, th City of Iowa City, University of Iowa
community, and University of Iowa Stude t Government should work together to
develop a comprehensive five-year plan to educate and prevent binge
consumption. A coalition between all ofu to develop a strategic educational
campaign, that not only starts and targets c liege students, but also starts in K-12.
Work with the students who are leaving th Iowa City high schools, couple with
the University relations, the College ofPu lie Health, the Department of Public
Health, to extend the education to the entir state, in order to come up with
answers for these students who don't, who ve never been exposed to alcohol, or
haven't had that much experience with ale hol, but when they come to our
University, or other universities, they are b tter educated on how to consume.
Another couple of our proposals is that we sk that when we're setting the
priorities, when it comes to the 19 ordinan e, or it comes to a 21 ordinance, that
we observe safety first. The safety of the p ople who live in the neighborhoods,
and the safety of the students who will be c nsuming the alcohol, or don't know
that its.... You're responsible to consume the alcohol. We think that that is the
best way to try and evaluate things, and no necessarily straight statistics, and we
would also like the City to employ what yo call supply-side economics, a tenn to
try and regulate the bars more, and make s re that the students who are in there,
who are not there to consume liquor, don't ave access to them. There are a
couple other policies that are outlined in th s, and I really, really hope you can
look at it and that we can come up with a c mpromise that we can all agree on.
Thanks.
Lehman! Thank you, Lindsay.
Woodson! Good evening, Daryl Woodson from th Sanctuary. I've lived in Iowa City
almost 40 years now. You know, looking ack at the last few years, and all the
years I've been here, the majority ofpeopl who come into contact with the police
and have problems, assaults, vandals, and verything else, turn out to be males, so
I guess from that maybe testosterone is our substance problem here, but you can't
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regulate that. (laughter) I think that, you now, some of the downtown places
have shown that they're doing their best a they're working very hard this last
year to make some changes, and I don't ge down there that much because I'm
working. Couple of things I would like to emind you of, not to go over old stuff.
A change to 21 will effect the places that h ve live music and live comedy, Mike
(can't hear) keeps reminding me, because substantial portion of the door
revenue for live music and live entertainm nt, comes from people under 21. We
have 13, 14 venues doing that roughly, an that will drop. I'd also like to remind
you when you're talking about safety, I bereve it was in the last couple of weeks,
there was a death or two in Colorado. Our only death in Iowa City from alcohol
occurred out of bars at off-campus parties. They are less safe. So, I have two
things that are not going to be quick soluti ns. These are long-tenn things. They
would require Iowa legislative actions, but I think with your counterparts in Cedar
Falls and Ames, with David Skorton and t e University and Lynn Walden at ABD
pushing for them, these could assist a lot. umber one, in Iowa we have a one-
price liquor license. No matter how big th place. In many states, they have a
graduated license, based upon either the ca acity or the square footage. You've
all said in the past, and the police have sai , the larger places are a greater
enforcement problem. If they paid a larger liquor license fee, and part of that
money came back to the local authority to ssisting their enforcement costs, it
would A ~ make them pay a greater portio of those costs and the problems
they're causing; and b ~ get you some mon y, and maybe discourage people from
opening the big places. The other thing's a little more complex. That has to do
with the way liquor liability insurance in I a is figured. Liquor liability
insurance for licensees is based upon the d llar volume of alcohol sales, not
amount on the amount of alcohol sold. So, if I'm selling you a quarter beer, or if
I'm selling you a $5 beer, probably the qu er beer is going to produce higher
risk drinking than the $5 beer, and yet that roduces a lower liquor liability
insurance cost to the licensee, and cover ch rges are not figured into that mix.
Those are not alcohol sales, so a change in he way the dram shop insurance,
liquor liability insurance, is figured in low , and going to a volume standard, and
there is a federal standard in place that's us d to pay federal taxes by distributors
and whatever. There's some mechanisms t work out for it, but that would be a
big change. It would eliminate, not elimin te but reduce, some of these extremely
cheap drink specials, and would actually m an that the insurance is based upon
the amount of alcohol that the establishme t was selling, not upon what they were
charging for. That's about it. I hope you d n't do 21 because I think it's going to
hurt the live music scene. I think it's go in to hurt some of the restaurants, and I
think it's going to have some more vacant paces in downtown Iowa City, and I
don't think we need plywooded up store fr nts, at least for a while. Give it a little
longer, but stick with it for a while, folks. on't have this sort of (can't hear)
every single year because those of us who re doing our best, can't really plan for
the future when we don't know what it's g ing to be. Thanks.
Lehmani Thank you, Daryl.
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Wilmoth! Good evening. I'm Ralph Wilmoth. I' the Director of the Johnson County
Public Health, and I'm also a member oft e alcohol abuse working group, which
as Rick already indicated, includes both so e public health professionals and
health professionals and other community embers. It includes some law
enforcement people and education people. And in respect to Regenia's request of
not bringing up old information, and in res ect to the time that we have here this
evening, I want to just bring up two points. One, the County Health Department
every five years or so does a community h alth needs assessment. Five years ago,
the report that came out in 2000, identified alcohol, misuse of alcohol, to be the
number one health concern in Johnson Co nty. This year we're working through
that process again, and our report will com out in the spring, that alcohol use and
misuse has been identified again as one of he top five. We chose not to rank
them, this time around, but only to list the op five, and that's one of the top five.
So, we collectively, and we includes about sixty-five members of the community,
and the health and public health arenas, be 'eve that this continues to be a
problem, and we've not done enough to ad ress it. The second point, a new way
to address this has been the formation ofth's alcohol abuse work group, and it is a
group of interested parties in the communi , which includes public health people.
It also includes health people and educatio and law enforcement, and others that
might have an interest in this issue. We co lectively believe that there are three
pieces to this process, and it just depends 0 how you slice this, what the pieces
are, but we would identify education, polic development, and law enforcement
as being the three critical pieces. This ordi ance that the Council is discussing
this evening, and talking about this evenin , is just one piece. It's that policy
development piece. We think that a compr hensive approach has to include all of
these things, and we would certainly like t see the Council look at what the staff
has reported this evening, as you indicated ou would this year, and see what
difference it made, and consider whether i creasing that age limit to 21 would
continue to improve those numbers, which' s what you basically have to look at at
this point. Thank you.
Lehmani Thank you.
Porter/ Hi there. Mike Porter. I own the Summit nd One Eyed Jake's. I've also lived in
this community for eighteen years. Real q ick to highlight something that he just
said, I support both of the things that he tal ed about, the higher licensing fees for
the larger establishments. I own one of the larger establishments and one of the
more average size establishments, but I su port that. Also, the dram shop issue -
I spoke at a state Alcohol and Beverage meting in Cedar Rapids about a year ago
on just that subject, and that's one thing w 're pushing for on a state level, to
adjust our insurance rates based on volume But, I'd like to present a little story
to you on what happens when students sta leaving the community to have
parties. I apologize, this is a little bit gross Some will take buses, some will take
cars. Some will book parties on riverboats in the Quad Cities where staff is
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September 28, 2004 Special Council Wor Session Page 14
unprepared to deal with college age studen s. Their staff have little or no training
to deal with the responsible service of alco 01 to large groups of adults. There
will be no supervision. Many will be over served. Over fifteen young people will
get sick on the bus, traveling back after lea ing this event. Some will end up in a
hospital. Two young ladies will almost di because they are sick and on this bus,
in the middle of rural Iowa. I know there' a lot of people out there that will tell
you that that simply just doesn't happen. hat's just something we're making up.
Unfortunately, the story I just gave you is ot a story. It happened Saturday night.
Iowa City Police Report, Incident 2004053527 reads, and I'm going to read this
verbatim: Three very intoxicated female 0 bus returning from Davenport £Tom
fraternity trip. Driver is taking subjects di ectly to Mercy E.R. Request an officer
meet them there. ETA approximately 1 :45 AM. That's just one example of
hundreds I could give you, that's just one xample. We can all agree that
irresponsible consumption of alcohol is a ery serious problem. I know (can't
understand) call me if they have questions, or if I can give them any input from a
bar owner's standpoint. Pushing the probl m to other communities has proven to
be a very unsafe resolution. It's been repo ed to you that house parties have not
risen since the 19 ordinance has been adop ed. That is simply not true. Simply
not true. Off premise keg sales have doubl d since this ordinance. Keg sales
figures are fact. Those numbers are not sk wed like surveys or philosophy and
enforcement. Those are facts. Either peop e are drinking twice the quantity at the
same amount of parties, or parties have do bled. That's.. .there's just no
argument there. So I urge you to research hat before making a decision on the 21
ordinance. To answer two questions £Tom arlier, the bar monitors question. I
had answered that as our staff does the bar onitoring. We have six bar backs at
the Summit, who, as part of their job, that' what they do. I believe six people
working on it, is better than one person. T at's why we do it that way. The TIPS
training is another issue that you asked abo t. My staff has always been TIPS
trained. I've spent $20-$30,000 over the y ars having them TIPS trained. It's an
excellent program. I took advantage of it hen it was free, and we've done more
since then. I believe, I've talked to the ow ers of the Union and I think they're
going to do that as well. Licensed establis ents have the following benefits to
the community. We need help in building odes for large occupancies. Our staff
is trained by TIPS, the police department, t e rape victim advocacy program, and
internally with material that is relevant to 1 cal circumstances. Our management
passes yearly criminal background checks. We clean our facilities and the
sidewalks in front. We I.D. and wristband accordingly, or as Leah said,
circumstances in the bar, some of us use st mps. We do not allow IS-year-olds or
high school children in at night. We monit r for illegal drugs. We have
insurance. We have adequate restroom faclities. We are located in commercial
zones where noise is less of an issue. And e close at 2:00 AM. That's when
everything stops. I believe passing a 21 or inance will polarize the community
from establishment owners, force students nto unsafe situations, and eliminate
about 500 extremely high-paying jobs. I ow you guys probably don't want to
hear about economics but all of my staff m kes anywhere from $10 to $50 an
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September 28, 2004 Special Council Wor Session Page IS
hour. They make a lot of money, and they all spend it here locally. We've talked
about, as a group, we think about 500 ofth se jobs will be gone.
Lehman! Need to wind up, Mike.
Porter/ Okay. Passing the 21 ordinance will drive own the price of drinks in bars, and it
will increase, not decrease, irresponsible d ·nking. Once again, I've spoke with
the owners ofthe Union, I've spoke to the almost every day. He calls me every
day with questions, just because I've been ere for sixteen years. So, we're all
getting on the same page. I've talked to ot er bar owners, we've had meetings,
and we've made strides over the past year, and we want to continue to make
strides, but we need to have that opportuni y. We still support the 19-ordinance,
and we think everybody will benefit from joint effort with the state, City,
University, and local business owners. Th nks.
Lehmani Thank you, Mike.
Wemer/ Hi, my name is Preston Wemer. I'm just a student. I'm not with a group or
anything, but Ijust moved down here. Iju t transferred down here, and I used to
live in Cedar Falls where they don't have a 21-ordinance, and I'm 20 years old,
and I don't drink, but I'm against a 21-onl (TAPE ENDS) I'd just like to say that
since high school I've been able to walk in 0 bars and go and watch music, and I
didn't drink, and I understand that there is one em about people buying drinks
and giving them to friends and what not, b t I think that like closer, I think that
people need to look closer, like I don't thi passing a law is the right way to
enforce a different law. I don't know. Th 's all I have to say.
Lehman! Thank you.
Penziner/ Hi, my name is Andy Penziner, and I'm public health physician. I've lived in
Iowa City for about thirty years. For the p st twenty, I've lived many of those on
Bowery Street, which is the heart ofthe un ergraduate student off-campus area,
and I've for the last five years lived on Do ge Street in the 100 block, 120 N.
Dodge. So, I've kind of moved from the h art, and for those of you familiar with
anatomy, a little out the aorta, but still pret y central. (laughter) I'm not coming
to you as a professional. I'm not coming t you as a student. I'm not coming to
you as a proprietor, bar owner. I'm just co ing to you as a guy who lives in this
area of town, and I love to live on the east ide. I love the old area. I like to be
able to ride my bike or walk to work. I lik to be able to get downtown in a few
minutes, and I like living near the students. I like the energy. I like the creativity.
But I have to say that the drinking-related roblems have gotten worse over time,
by my observation, and I'm not going with data here. I'm just going with what I
see. I stay up late. Fortunately I don't hav to get to work that early. I don't
think that the major problem is at what age you allow legally drinks to be served
in a bar. I think it's much more a question f culture, and I think Ross kind of
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September 28, 2004 Special Council War Session Page 16
alluded to that earlier, as did the student g vernment president. The problems,
and I know a couple weeks ago there was ome testimony in front of you about
some violence that was witnessed. In gen ral, that's not what I witness so much.
It's trash. It's theft. It's vandalism, and it's frequent. And that's what makes it
most annoying to me, because I don't wan to have to deal with it. It's just simply
a quality of life issue for me. So, the ques . on, I think, is how do we deal with
this problem? Maybe some of the suggesfons are along those lines, and I think
we do have to share the solution as a com unity, but I just want to leave you with
the observation that it's going to be a very, very difficult solution, and I think
culture change is tough, but I think that's here we are in terms of making some
inroads to this problem. Thanks.
Lehmani Thank you. Would you give your name, please?
Switalski/ Thank you. I want to address.. ...Paul S italski. I wish to address this
ordinance from the perspective ofa colleg student, which I am. I myself would
go unaffected by the fact that bars were to 021, if that were to happen. None the
less, I do remember being underage here i Iowa City. I was ticketed by the Iowa
City Police here, twelve days before my 2151 birthday, and if it had been just two
weeks later, the police officer would have ooked at my I.D., handed it back to
me, and told me to have a nice day. Instea I was (can't understand) as immature,
and as a delinquent kid, and I received $14 ticket for this. What a difference
twelve days make, I figure, and as it turns ut, it was the only difference. In those
twelve days I didn't gamer some sudden n w ability to handle alcohol, and
personal responsibility didn't instantly ma ifest in my head at the stroke of
midnight on my 2151 birthday. So, most ce ainly I didn't magically morph from a
ner' do well punk kid to a respectable adul , but, you know, I was the same man
who stands before you this evening. The s litary difference is that I had to cross
this holy arbitrary, legal threshold by alco 01. But certainly it seems self-evident
that individuals over the age of 21 can act ·rresponsibly. There's no doubt that
many of the fights and assaults that happe and crimes committed that are directly
related to drinking, have nothing to do wit the fact that a person is underage.
Many ofthese crimes are committed by pe pie who are over 21. Conversely, the
underage drinker can drink responsibly. T ere are perfectly responsible underage
drinkers in this city who do not commit ac s of violence or vandalism, who do not
drink and drive, but they just have a coup I of beers and talk, and crack jokes, but
this proposed ordinance would turn a blind eye to those responsible drinkers, as a
gauge of an underage adult's character. In tead, some would prefer to ignore the
personal judgment and integrity of some 0 our fellow citizens, and instead would
take cold comfort in these legal fictions. T is ordinance points an accusing finger
at Iowa City's 19 and 20-year-olds. It writ s them all off as irresponsible, ifnot
outright predatory hooligans. So, that's all I have to say about that. Thank you
very much for your time.
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Shore/ Good afternoon. My name is Jason Shore. I'm the Vice-President of Student
Government. I've met all of you before. I 's good to see you all again. I'd like to
address the Council with some arguments at have not been heard yet tonight.
Obviously, you all know about what drunk driving and sexual.assaults can do if
the bars go 21. So I don't need to go over hat. Just also wanted to start out with
a quick story about someone who sent an e ail to student government, who went
to the bars this summer, and was extremel intoxicated before they got there.
Once they got there, had one or two other rinks. There were about 23 or 24, and
passed out. The ambulance came, picked t em up. They had to get their stomach
pumped, and their life was probably saved ecause they went to the bars, and
because they didn't stay in a house party were another story, which student
government received also in an email a fe days ago, was from another individual
who said their friend passed out when they were a freshman here. They're a
senior now, I believe. Their friend passed ut at a house party, and began to
throw up violently, and no one there wante to call the police or the ambulance
because they were worried about getting th party busted. So, they decided they
would just let the person stay in the bathro m and hope that they were all right,
and see what happens; and that kind of stu very much scares me, and it also
scares me to know that you'd be criminaliz'ng conduct, which means if you, and
I'm sure the attorney knows as well, it cou d hurt the future of a lot ofU ofI
students who get a ticket purely for being i a bar, even if they're not drinking,
and that could also hurt the possibility of fì ture jobs for students from the
University ofIowa. Also, as an RA my so horn ore year, I must say that I did see
more drinking in the donns my freshman y ar, as a result of the 19-ordinance, and
I believe a lot of students didn't go downto n and they just stayed in their rooms
and drank, and to me, our job is more diffi ult and I think it's a much less safe
environment when you can drink in your cl sed, locked donn room. As well,
students will pre-game. They will drink, a d then they will go downtown,
especially those who aren't 21 and know t ey can't get served. Now they'll drink
and they'll go to house parties, and you all ow the consequences of that. It
won't stop them from drinking. As Mike s id earlier, keg sales have doubled. I
mean, we're.. . that statistic should show yo already just what, a one year
difference, what that can mean. Also, one hing that really concerns student
government is the possibility of jobs being ost for students. Right now, with
tuition rising, it is really painful for a lot 0 students to go to school, and if there's
a huge loss in jobs, especially the very hi -paying jobs that the bars allow
students to have, that can very much hurt t e economics of the students here at the
University, and I'll wrap it up. I think one ear's not long enough. I think you all
should give it more time to evaluate. I me , the 19-year-old ordinance report
was pretty much inconclusive. They didn' take a specific stance. That's because
they haven't had enough time to evaluate it and I think it would be irresponsible
to go ahead and make a decision at this tim . Also, one thing that hasn't been
addressed, and I'd be interested to hear wh t the Council has thought about,
would be the Greek system, and what exac ly they would do. Would they just
decide that they're not going to go and hav events at the bars, or different
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September 28, 2004 Special Council Wo k Session Page 18
venues, or would they have those venues a d not just let the rreshmen,
sophomores, and juniors come along? Wh t would occur? Would it look
something similar to Indiana, because I do 't know if any of you have been to
Indiana, but I don't feel that it's as safe an environment as we have here at the
University ofIowa. Thank you.
Lehmani Thank you.
/ Hi, my name is Steve , pardon, 'm a little shaky. I was going to
address what somebody else addressed ab ut how live music venues are
negatively affected by the 19-only ordinan e but that has already been addressed.
Also, what also has been addressed, but no specifically, is the non.. .how not
specific, pardon me, this law is. For exam Ie, I don't know if you know the Den
of Sin, known as Masala Vegetarian India Restaurant, but they have to abide by
the 19-only ordinance because, you know, hey're obviously a party-zone. Them
and Thai Flavors on Burlington Street, but y main point, which I would like to
address really has little to do with the 19-0 Iy ordinance but instead what this
ordinance has (can't understand) in the sch me of things. I've noticed over the
past, I've only been here for two years, pri es of real estate sky rocket in Iowa
City, and the first person to speak referred 0 downtown Iowa City as an attraction
for professionals, and I'm thinking "why i my rent going up," and I saw
Councilwoman Bailey on the news, addres ing how Iowa City is becoming a
destination, but who is this destination for, is my question. We're noticing six
bars closed down, correct? And, what's g ing to come in their place? Is it going
to be another student-friendly business, no necessarily a bar. A comic book store
like Daydreams. Cheaper eater. A record tore. Another student-friendly
business, or is it going to be like those plac s which have been popping up in the
Ped Mall for the past two years, where you can get squiggly lines to melt on your
wall for thousands of dollars. Instead, wha I am addressing is I see an alienation
going on within a town council, with meas res like this which attract
professionals, which are forcing students 0 t ofIowa City, and further alienating
the students of the University ofIowa fro the Iowa City community. If you've
noticed how housing in Coralville has boo ed over the past few years, it's
because housing here, quite frankly, is too xpensive. I'm paying $1,400 a month
to live in a place, and I can ski down my b droom floor, the house is so settled. I
see this act as an act against the bars, and a ainst the students of the University of
Iowa. I'm speaking alone here. I'm not sp aking on behalf of the UISG. Quite
frankly, because it's a detriment to their in olvement in downtown, no matter
what their involvement is, and we refer to t e Stepping Up council, but I know the
University is horribly funded at the momen , and I don't see the priority in
funding. I see priority in funding academi ventures, not social ventures such as
the Stepping Up project. So further more, would just like to make my point
known that there seems to be a culture of a ienation, which I think needs to be
addressed within the City Council, focused at the University ofIowa students, and
reconstruction of downtown. Thank you v ry much.
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September 28, 2004 Special Council Wor Session Page 19
Lehman! Thank you. We need to keep.. .reminde that the doorway needs to be kept
open. Okay.
Scherer/ Hi, I'm Deb Scherer, and I am here tonig t, and I think I understand what the
problem with my business is tonight becau e I am the only club owner in town
that doesn't serve alcohol that has live ent rtainment, and I'm struggling. So, I
guess I'm really here tonight just to make statement that I own the River Rock
Music Café in Old Capitol Mall. It's calle Phase One. It's the 1,100 square foot
mural on the side of the mall, and coming' to my 6th week of being open on the
weekends. We have 7,000 square feet of s ace where we serve pop and
Starbuck's Coffee, and SoeBe, and we hav concerts on Thursday, Friday nights,
sometimes Saturdays, and I am struggling. So I think I understand tonight why,
because there's nobody in this place right ow that knows there's a non-alcohol
venue in this town. A very large, very coo, awesome place, and I guess that's
why I'm here tonight. To let everyone kn w that there is a place, and there is an
alternative, for these students to come. I h d 400 students in that place last
weekend. It was awesome to see that man kids in there, having a great time, and
not getting drunk, and it's just a choice. I' there to give the students a choice,
and I don't know how long we can stay op n because it takes students in there to
support me, to support River Rock, but I ju t needed everyone to know that there
is somebody here that's trying to make so e changes. To answer your question.
This isn't the same argument because I'm citizen who is trying to make
changes, and I know that when Dr. Dobyn was speaking about how the
downtown changes at night. Absolutely. I ve learned a lot this year that I've
been working on this project, and I don't ow where all the problems are. I
haven't done all of the investigative report' g and everything that everyone else
has done, but there is an alternative for the students to have a great time, and to
not have to swagger home. So, thanks.
Lehman! Thank you.
Fletcher/ Hello, my name is Amy Fletcher, and I a coming to you not as an alcohol
expert, but I believe I am a behavior chang expert. I'm the fitness specialist at
Health Iowa Student Health Service, and e do need to look at this issue as
different pieces to an overall encompassin puzzle, and certainly we know that
access is one of the pieces of that puzzle, d the access in the Iowa City area is
greater than it needs to be. We do have a tì derallaw. We're not here tonight to
debate that federal law, which is that alcoh 1 can only be served to those who are
21 years of age or older. Iowa City current y is an exception to that law in that we
do let those who are 19 or older into those stablishments. I believe that this is a
problem. I think it's a problem that we ne d to continue to address, if we are
going to make any changes regarding high risk drinking. I also would like to
address some of the comments that were m de earlier, regarding the proposal that
UISG has put forth, and I do not believe th t they are educated on what is
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September 28, 2004 Special Council Wor Session Page 20
currently being done to combat this proble . The Stepping Up coalition, along
with the efforts of Health Iowa, have done a lot in regards to the education,
changing, trying to address access. Also I oking at social support systems, and
this is also going to be an issue regarding t e culture of drinking in Iowa City. I
don't think we can move forward unless w take a really hard look at access to
alcohol in our community. I also think tha when bar owners come up here, and
when we are talking about making a profit at the expense of our students' health, I
believe that's an issue, and I want Iowa Ci y to thrive and prosper, but I don't
want to do it at the expense of our students Thank you.
Lehmani Thank you.
Swaim/ Good evening, I'm Jim Swaim. I live at 1 24 Woodlawn. I'm a resident ofIowa
City for about 32 years, and I'm here to sp ak in favor of changing the ordinance
to 21 and over, and I'm sorry I wasn't as a tively involved in the discussion last
year so it may be an old debate, but access is the issue, Regenia. That if we really
want to impact drinking behavior, and agai , I work with much younger than the
college students, that we have to reduce th access. That's a given. The other
thing is that I celebrate the arts and welco e the artistic community that we have,
and I want very much to not dampen the v nues that are available for perfonning
arts, and for live music in the community, ut I honestly think that if an
establishment like the one that we heard a out just two speakers ago, doesn't get a
level playing field to establish entertainme t venues for 18,19, and 20-year-olds,
we're never going to have that. So, we're 'n a self-perpetuating cycle, where the
only places that book music are the bars an so that's the only place that 19 and
20-year-olds can go for that kind of enterta nment. So, I want to speak to
changing the law to 21 and over. And my ast comment is, I don't say this in a
disparaging way about University students I think the University students are
part ofthe debate. I welcome everyone 0 them that has come here tonight, and I
especially welcome the comment that was ade by the very first student
government speaker, that we all need to w rk on this together. But the bottom
line is that we, if we don't change the acce s, we're not going to be able to impact
the amount of underage drinking that occu s in our community. Thanks.
Anderson! Hello, I am Erik Anderson. I am one 0 the new owners of the Union Bar.
I've prepared some notes here. This is my first time around. I've only lived here
for about five or six weeks now. You've h ard all this before. I really don't want
to beat it into your head, I'm sure you kno . I have met a lot of the bar owners
around town by now. Met with them the I st couple of weeks. I know that we are
all trying to do the right things. We oursel es wristband our customers. We've
recently started adding 19 to party, 21 to d ink in our advertising. I actually
heard...I talked to Judy from Alcohol and everages Division. She had heard we
were being too hard on LD.'s. I don't kno if that's the case or not, but hopefully
we are doing the right things. As far as the 19, or a 21 ordinance or whatever, it's
not just access. We all know that. It's the hole picture, and everybody's on the
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right page with that, so I applaud that. I ca 't say that I don't support your
increase in enforcement, because I probabl wouldn't live here and I probably
wouldn't own the Union Bar if you hadn't one it, but you did get one ofthe bad
elements out and I appreciate that and appl ud that. One of the suggestions that
was made by one of the other bar owners as some sort ofregistration system for
bar employees. Like we talked about toni t, those are pretty high-paying jobs
and they are pretty well coveted. If someb dy was to be caught, fined, serving a
minor, as a bartender, waitress, bar emplo ee, and they were unable to work, I
think they would be much more motivated 0 follow the rules, because right now
it's on us as bar owners to make sure our s aff follows the rules, because it's
really our neck on the line, not theirs, and e try to beat it into their heads as
much as possible "don't serve minors." Fr m our own weekly meetings, to the
TIPS training, to our (can't hear) of our 0 n employees, and (can't hear) or
tennination of them, they're not following he rules. I guess I would ask that they
have some other repercussions too, more t an what we can do. Because if we fire
somebody, they'll just go get another job a another bar. It's not a hard thing to
do. Also, I invite any of you to get in cont ct. I actually tried to contact you, Ms.
Champion. I don't know if you got the me sage. I stopped by your store, my
wife loves your store (laughter). Hopefull I can get a chance to talk to you all
some more individually. I'll take you out t lunch. I don't know what I can do.
(laughter and talking) Thank you for your ime, guys.
Lehmani Thank you.
Protextar! Hello, my name is Adam Protextar. an 18-year-old first year student here
at the University of Iowa. I've lived in thi city for 8 years, and I graduated from
Iowa City City High. I would just like to s art out by saying something that's
probably a very diché point by this point i that people at City High, when I was
a senior there, would often go to the bars. ow, these people were 18 and they
found entrance to the bars last year under t e 19-over ordinance. When these
people could not find entrance into the bar, they did find other ways to find
alcohol, and they drank at house parties, so e of which were college house
parties, some of which were not. Again, m point here is probably something
that's been quite belabored, so I'll drop it, ut that point is it's just moving the
problem. Second of all, I'd like to address something else that's kind of been
brought up tonight, only from a different v tage point, and that I am a musician
and I perfonn at bars. I am 18, however, a a perfonner, I am allowed to perfonn
in the bar and when my set is over, I leave. The problem with this is not my
entrance because I do not really care to dri in the bar. I only care to perfonn.
The problem with this is a fan base, as m y people have brought up. A 21-over
ordinance might seriously disturb the peop e under 21 that would come and see
me, because most of my fans are people th t graduated with me, or people I know
or friends of mine that talked to friends of heirs, and so on and so on. These
people are not over 21. I guess those are y two points. Thank you for listening.
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Lehmani Thank you.
Berg! Hello, my name is Ron Berg. I've been a ci izen in Iowa City for about 24 years,
and I currently work with MECCA. A lar e part of my professional career with
MECCA has been working with preventio services, whether if that's with the
school district, children out of school, pare ts, employers, and there is a lot of
activities and a lot of energy being put into prevention activities. As Ralph
alluded to earlier, prevention and educatio is just one piece of the pie. We need
to support what we're doing with our prev ntion efforts with public policy that
addresses misuse or over-use of alcohol. imiting access is one. Positive public
policy, the City Council can take to enact, hat would help support the other
prevention efforts that are going on, and I eally urge your support in the passage
of that ordinance. Thank you.
Lehmani Thank you.
Buss! I'm Anna Buss. I'm at 830 Miller Avenue. I have AB Property Management.
When all of this started forever ago, it see s now, one of the concerns of property
managers was that this would exacerbate t e problem of house parties. I'm here
to tell you that that has come true. House arties are a nightmare for property
managers. If you would like to see what it s like, come downtown any given
night on primarily Thursday, Friday, Satur ay nights, and you can drive around
town. All of us have had to fight with hou e parties at one time or another, but
now it seems to be an increasing problem. There is a great deal of money to be
made if you have a keg and you sell a cup, and you can get quite a few people in.
All you have to do is drive around town. here are designated houses that people
already know, they've been targeted. It's problem. We've had.. .I've had one
disorderly house claim already, which resu ted in the fact that we evicted a few
people, had a few problems that way, and i was totally because of this house
party stuff. Our house is not the only one. There are a lot of others, and again,
not to beat a dead horse to death, but when you raise it to 21, a lot of these kids
can pretty much work their way through sc 001 selling beer. It's bootlegging, and
nobody's doing a lot about it. I've called t e police a number of times on parties
that have happened. So, I don't put up wit it. I know a lot of us don't want to
put up with it. We don't want to deal with it, but I really believe, like a bunch of
the other people have said, that first off, yo know, I've been around Iowa City a
long time and people have been drinking h re forever, which doesn't mean it's
right or wrong. That's the way it is here. 's everywhere, but the one thing is I'd
rather see these kids in a bar than at a hous party, because if they're at a house
party, and something happens, no one is g ing to call anyone because they're
afraid, and that's kind of where that's at. here they're in a bar, at least they're
supervised. Thank you for your time.
Lehmani Thank you, Anna.
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Kruziak! Hi, I'm Niki Kruziak. I'm a student at th University ofIowa. I'm a freshman.
Right now on this issue, I stand undecided. I think obviously you're looking for
truth, so I can be persuaded both ways, but right now where I stand is I think there
is a contradiction in the bar ordinance for 21. Basically, I pose a question, most
bar owners would say in front of the city's uthorities, that people under 21 don't
drink in their bars, and 18 year olds and un er do not enter their bars. So my
questions is, why is this still a problem? 0 viously someone's not telling the
truth, or somebody doesn't know that peop e still are entering their bars. So I'm
considering that maybe some businesses ar hiring people that aren't suited to
uphold the responsibility of working in a b r. I think that even though the
direction that we need to take is ultimately ooking at the behavior of the students,
I think that we also should look at the beha ior of the employees in the places that
are hiring people, and more so enforce that Maybe, I mean, it doesn't make
sense to me how you can have a law, I me this makes sense that you can't drink
until you're 21, but why then are people sti I drinking? Obviously someone is
selling it to them, so I think maybe you sh uld talk about some way of increasing
a punishment if somebody is caught sellin alcohol, and I really think you would
find a decrease in the amount of people goi g to bars and drinking alcohol.
Thank you.
Lehman! Thank you.
Clayton! Hi, my name is Jim Clayton. I'm the co- oordinator of the Stepping Up project.
I work half-time at the University ofIowa. I'm a 2% stock holder ofthe Soap
Opera in downtown Iowa City, trying to re ire. I've been there for 23 years. I
volunteer at Big Brothers/Big Sisters; on y 3rd little brother. I'm on the board at
the ARC of Johnson County. I don't hold office there, and I'm on the DT A
board of directors, but I do not hold an of ce there. We heard from several
different groups tonight. Let's go back to t e stop policy that you listened to a
little over a year ago when you went from 1 to 19. They offered you a 19
alternative, required wristbands, 21 signs i the doorways, bar monitors, free soda
and water, mandatory TIP training, no drin special ads, a disclaimer that says
underage people are not allowed to consu e alcohol, they promised you the
10,000 hours concert although that was air ady on the books when they made that
promise. They promised you Old Capitol ovie Theatre renovation and
revitalization. A bowling alley in J.C. Pe ey space. Planet X changed to a 24-
hour hang-out. The Fit Zone open until 3: O. Bars holding alcohol-free nights.
Zoning for the downtown, and a task force. The best I can figure. is they
accomplished the 19-ordinance, the task fo ce, 10,000 hours we supported at
Stepping Up, we gave them $10,000, but t at was already requested long before
the 19-ordinance came due. So, I would re lly be disappointed if you paid too
much attention to these long-range plans 0 what we will do, because when they
walked out the door, they being the student and bar owners, with the 19-
ordinance in their pocket, they were essenf ally done. Compliance by bars has
been excellent. Troy can tell you that in gr at detail. They're doing a good job of
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not serving underage people, but underage people fonn 62% roughly of our
population at the University of Iowa. That s 17,800 people that are under 21, and
they're in those bars, and ifthere are 700 p ople in the Union Bar, you can't tell
me there's enough employees or police in he world, to monitor what happens to
every drink that's purchased legally at the ar. If I buy a drink for someone else,
the bar makes the money whether I spill it, or drink it. It's still a profitable
business. We heard tonight about vacant s aces downtown. I don't see any. I
have a lot of people that must not know ab ut our nuisance party ordinance, or
property ordinance, for the neighborhood. Doug Boothroy has told you this is
working. People are not making that seco d or third complaint when they sit
down at a compliance hearing here at City all with the Building Department.
So, what keeps the whole thing rolling? ell, it's the money, quite frankly, that
keeps the whole thing rolling. Right now t ere are 5,917 bar seats downtown in
the 21 bars that charge cover charge. Just isualize that, almost 6,000 bar seats.
Our students tell us from the college alcoh I study, we spent $101,000 in the past
two years on alternative activities. The stu ents spent $235,000 a month on
alcohol, and that's just the underage stude ts. That's $2 million per year by
underage students in these bars. This is a oney-making operation. I had a bar. I
know how the bar business works. We ha e bars that charge cover. If you do the
math, roughly 6,000 bar stools, $5 cover, 11 them all up one night, $30,000 in
cash at the door. That's $3 million if they nly do it twice a year over the course
of a year, for the downtown bars. These ar cash machines that are running down
there. We've had three bars listed for sale n the last several months. The total
listing price was $2.5 million for those thr e businesses. They've all sold. I'm
not saying they sold for full price, but I'm aying that all the buyer got was blue
sky and bar equipment. None of the real e tate changed hands. And our
downtown is now populated with business s that are paying $80,000 and $90,000
a year in rent, and there's landlords standi g there collecting that money, and as
long as we leave this great market in place for them, of all these underage
drinkers, it will continue, and we will end p with campus town downtown. It is
inevitable, because I can't afford to move i to a space that can command that kind
ofrent. The only ones that are able to pay t are the bars. There will be some pain
and suffering. No question about it, but I t ink you're at the decision point to
decide where's our downtown going to go. Are we going to be satisfied with it
becoming an entertainment district connec ed to the University, with that as the
market, or do we want to continue to try a d broaden its appeal so that it's out
there for everyone. You heard from Deb Sherer about the River Rock. How
could that person possibly compete with C ptain Morgan and a Coke for a
quarter, a block away from her front door? When the bars are charging the cover
at the door, and then putting a special up t at lets you drink as much as you
possibly can in two hours, for $2 or $3, un '1 you're totally smashed. She can't
compete with that. We were all young onc , and that would be a hard thing to
make the decision. Thanks for your time.
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Lehmani Thank you. We're going to take one mo e and then we're going to take a quick
break.
Howe/ Hi, my name is John Howe. I live at 515 eadows Street in Iowa City, and that's
a pretty good distance, over there on the e t side, but I do have rentals at each
end of the block, and I haven't seen a big arty yet. I've seen maybe a couple
people outside, but that's it, and I've owne the property for about a year. Now
the previous speaker illustrated a point tha I was going to try and make, that as
long as bars, and we've seen the bars talk t night on how they really think 19 and
21 year olds are a very important part of th ir business, and they would loose lots
of revenue ifthey were to be gone. I mean that's their big concern, is money,
and if the money isn't going into those bus nesses, it has to find other outlets.
Now other people have said they're going 0 find their way into the house parties,
where there's kegs and people charging co er at the doors, but I'm sure they will
find their way into other businesses. So, I ean, I didn't spend a lot of money at
bars before I was 21, but then again I didn' get into a lot of bars. I wasn't in this
area, and the places I was at were a little m re strict. So, I mean, I don't see why
we need to keep it access for people under he age of 21. This is mainly a big
revenue stream. When I turned 21, I enjoy d going into the bars that were 21 and
over, simply because I didn't have to WOIT as much about being involved with
under-age drinking, because if! buy some ne a drink that's underage, I'm
breaking the law. So, I guess that's the tw points I have, and I'd like you to
consider them.
Lehmani Thank you. Okay, we're going to take a reak until 8:10. (BREAK)
Knapp/ ... and I just think that Iowa City for so 10 has lived off of the students and the
University that it's going to be very hard fì r you to change it. You ask kids who
are 18 or 19 or 20 years old to go over to I q and get killed in the war. I think
the kids in Iowa City deserve some rights t o. Call it rights of passage, or
whatever you want to call it, but if you giv them more entertainment and more
alternatives to drinking, I think they will ta e them and use them, and then they
won't be doing so much drinking, and they re right. You can't legislate morality
and you can't legislate intelligence, and un ortunately God doesn't do it either.
So, I think if you'll just make the laws, enfì rce the laws, and keep the students
from breaking the laws and keep the bar 0 ners from breaking the laws, I don't
see any reason for not allowing a 19 year 0 d or a 21 year old or a 20 year old to
come into a place where there's entertainm nt, because it's just like a restaurant.
Maybe he lives for food, or maybe he lives for entertainment, but if they want to
dance, or they want to sing, or they want to hear music, you certainly shouldn't
take that away from them just because oft eir age. Not when you demand so
many other things because of their age. T nk you.
Lehmani Thank you, Jim.
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Downer/ I'm Bob Downer. I'm here this evening or I think only the third time in over
40 years, where I've been speaking only fo myself, and not for a client that I
have been representing, but I am here this vening to briefly mention a few things
that I think are pertinent as far as this disc ssion, is concerned this evening. It's
been my privilege over approximately the ast six months to have had the
opportunity to work and to get to know the two leaders ofthe University ofIowa
Student Government that you heard addres you here earlier this evening, and
these are very impressive and thoughtful y ung people, in my opinion, and people
that it's been a great privilege for me to ge to know. I am very impressed frankly
with the policy position that they put toget er, and I would encourage you to
allow them further opportunity to show the'r leadership skills in working with you
to attempt to develop a common sense and orkable solution to the problems,
which I think we all acknowledge exist. T is is clearly a multi-faceted problem.
I think that cultural change has been referr d to by a few speakers, and I think
that's clearly what it's going to take. I am ery fearful, personally, that by having
more restrictive policies in the bars in dow town Iowa City we are forcing this
activity into less regulated and less safe ve ues, and I would encourage you to
consider this in the making of the decision hat you render here this evening, but I
do think in conclusion that we have extrao dinarily good student leadership that
will be proactive in attempting to develop esponsible solutions to these problems.
Thank you.
Lehman! Thank you, Bob.
Krainl Good evening, my name is Jacquelin Krain and I'm the owner of The Siren Club,
124 S. Dubuque Street, downtown in Iowa ity, and forgive me, I'm a little
nervous. I didn't intend to speak, but of co rse I get here and there's a bee in my
bonnet, so here I am at the podium. (laugh er) Also, at the risk of getting trailed
by the lynch mob as soon as I leave, I woul like to give you my opinion. What I
truly believe that it is is an economic issue t the very root of everything. I think
the people aren't addressing that enough, a d of course, I'm an alumni from the
University ofIowa. I've been in and out 0 Iowa City for ten years. I think for
me, what it comes down to, is to see a viab e downtown solution, economically.
When Vilsack, excuse me, Governor Vilsa k and the Vision Iowa project talk
about brain draining Iowa, one of the reaso s they talk about that is because
people leave for other places, you know, c lturally, whatever, there aren't enough
options for them to stay here, raise their fa ily, there's not a downtown, there's
not an urban feel. I think that what's happ ning now with many of the projects
that are going on downtown, is a reclamati n of the downtown, and that doesn't
slight students, but what it does is, you kno , make a better downtown for the
entirety of the Iowa City population, and I hink that that is something that should
be addressed. There will be a correction in the market. There will be a correction
in the real estate market. There will be pai and suffering, with rezoning or
whatever option would possibly happen, b sides the 21 and over law, or excuse
me, statute, but I think that what needs to b addressed is the long-term viability
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of downtown Iowa City, and what do we i tend to do, where do we intend to be in
five years, in eight years, and how do we g t there? Thank you.
Donovan! Hello there, my name's Christian Dono an. I'm a sophomore here at the
wonderful University ofIowa. I'm probab y the least qualified person to be
talking. I don't have any stats. I didn't co e prepared with anything. I just saw
an article in the newspaper about it and de ided to show up, see what was going
on. Basically everybody is talking about d fferent solutions for this problem, and
everyone knows that there is definitely a p oblem. Before I came here, in my four
years of high school I didn't take a single rink, and sorry to say, I guess, as soon
as I came to Iowa, what do you know? It appens. That was basically the only
social outlet, whether it happened in the do room, whether it happened in the
bar, it's going to happen somewhere. If yo change it to 21, it's going to happen
in the bar, but you're just going to have m re people running around with fake
LD. 's, other person's LD. 's, relative's LD. s, or you're going to have more house
parties, and I don't know, basically I appla d the City Council for what they're
doing. I applaud the police force, or the la enforcement officials, because I've
seen what they can do. A lot of my friends have had tickets. I've been lucky so
far and hopefully my luck will continue, b cause I'm not going to lie. I go to the
bars. I'm underage. I'm only 19. I get aw y with it. Yeah, I'm guilty, but
basically I don't.. . yeah. ..I don't see that t ere's a plausible solution, because the
problem is just going to move from one ar a to another, and basically, I hate to
put it so harshly, but I think everyone's jus wasting their time and effort, and it
should probably be focused somewhere els , especially when you're talking about
the money that's being spent on the differe t programs to educate people. By the
time somebody comes to the University, th y're going to be 18 years old. The
decision is already made whether they're g ing to drink or not, and basically if
you try to educate someone, we've all seen the (can't hear) Jr. High, we know
about the DARE programs, the rocket prev ntion and everything, and obviously
the decisions already been made. Tough 1 k, that's it, basically.
/ Hello, I'm Derek , and I'm a thir year student here at the University of
Iowa, and I apologize if I'm not as refined speaker as some of the people we've
had up here tonight, but I would like to, ki d of like the speaker previously before
me, talk to you from my view of this issue, and this is from my experiences here
at the University ofIowa. I don't have a 10 of stats, and there's probably stats
that go against my argument, and what I'm going to say, but this is from what I've
heard from friends who are freshmen. I ha e relatives who are freshmen here. I
was once too underage, and I'm now 21, s I know how it is to be a 21 year old
also. One of the main points tonight that w heard about tonight was access, and
how access if a big point and how you wan to limit the access. In my experience,
one 21 year old buying a keg of beer and Ii uor is a lot more access than doing
downtown to a bar, where one 21 year old an only buy two drinks at a time, and
this is under the watch of staff and police, nd believe me, everyone knows that
the police go around the bars, and they're a ways looking over your shoulder, or if
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September 28, 2004 Special Council Wor Session Page 28
you're a minor, and you know, you don't ant to get in trouble becàuse you know
they're there. So access in my experience s a lot easier outside the bars, and that
also starts to bring in safety issues, where ouse parties are not as safe, I believe
(TAPE ENDS) .. .men and women alike th t I've talked to, especially females it
seems like, feel a lot safer downtown at th bars, where it is regulated. There is
staff. There is police. People aren't afraid to call or talk to the appropriate people
to get help ifit's needed, and again, it does 't have to do with drinking
necessarily, because it is hard for underage people to drink downtown, and a point
that hasn't been brought up, and I apologiz ifit's not relevant, but are drugs.
Drug use, I believe, will increase because i 's another form of entertainment, and I
personally don't use drugs, but I know wh t will happen. It's another form of
entertainment. Parties will be moved to m re discrete locations and houses, and
drug use will be more accessible and easie , and in my three years here at a bar, I
have never, ever seen one ounce of a drug, nything suspicious of drug activity in
the bars, and that's from what I've seen. I ow you may know different, but
drugs are not a problem downtown. The c mmunity, if they, whether they like it
or not, it will spread. I believe it will go in 0 all our neighborhoods, and this, you
know, provide...I wouldn't want rowdy co lege kids around my house either, but
it's going to spread into the community an move outward. So, basically, my
point is that college kids are going to drink whether you provide them with
options or not, it's their choice. Like the s eaker said before me, it's their choice.
Their mind is already made up in most part and so what I'm saying is if underage
drinking is one of the main issues, then I'd eep the bars downtown at 19 and
over, because this is an outlet that provides the least amount of access legally, and
it also provides a social outlet for entertain ent, dancing, music, all those types of
form, and yeah, in my experience, the bars re the best way to enforce the 21 year
old limit on drinking, because there are so any staff and police that are around,
and that's it. Thank you.
Lehman! Thank you.
Green! I'm Nate Green, 231 Woodside Drive. I w s up here last year when we had this
debate about the 21 ordinance, and one, I g ess, resounding message I took from
the Council after last year's decision to go 9, was that along with the 19
ordinance, you know, we want results. We want to see something happen. We
want to see changes start to take place, and I guess over the last year, I've seen
those changes. I mean, we started with the alcohol and bar committee. We had a
committee of diverse opinions, diverse per pectives, you know, bar owners, a city
council person, other city business owners, students, so I mean, we had a lot of
people come together to discuss a lot of dif erent issues, and I thought that type of
organization was a good broad base from hich a lot of ideas came. Building on
that, I think we've seen a lot of what I wou d call the problem bars downtown
start to disappear, or at least there's startin to be some accountability there for
those problem bars, and they've gotten san tioned, and they know there are
consequences to not adhering to the City's aws and regulations. In addition, the
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police department came out with their rep rt, and the PAULA's are down, not
significantly but they are somewhat down. Overall though, I see kind of a
changing downtown bar scene,just kind 0 an atmosphere that's changing. But
one of the problems that I hear from those ho are pro- 21 is that they want
something absolute now, it has to be now. When we went to 19, or when the
Council went to 19, they saw it as a means to "let's try this out, let's see ifit
works." Well, I think it's starting to work. We started to see some alcohol
alternatives even popping up. The 10,000 our Show, the River Rock Café. I
just talked to Deb Scherer from River Roc Café and she said, she told me in an
email that they've had great attendance at t eir last two shows. A lot of people
are going to their concerts. Well, ifthese t ings are starting to work, let's give 19
a chance. I think that one year isn't really nough time to say "this is going to be
the solution" or "this is going to be the pro lem" especially when we've seen
some positives come out of it, and I think e need to look back, we only need to
look to other situations at other campuses. Two campuses in particular, more
recently at Colorado. One instance at Uni ersity of Colorado, one instance at
Colorado State University, both where stu ents overindulged at house parties in
unregulated environment, and they died be ause ofthis. In that state, legislatures
and the councils in those particular commu ities, are saying well, how could we
let this happen? How could we have these unregulated house parties where
there's no accountability? And that's what I fear is going to result in Iowa City,
and then so I guess for a more direct exam Ie, in our own state, at Iowa State
University at the Veisha celebrations last y ar, there was a house party that was
actually, it wasn't just a house party. It wa more like six house parties together,
that became a major riot, and ended up fio ing into downtown, and thousands
upon thousands of dollars of vandalism ha pened downtown. People were
injured. Policemen were injured. That's hat I fear when we go to house parties.
That's what I fear when life goes through c mpuses, and we go 21, and we force
our students into an unregulated environm nt. Thank you.
Lehman! Thank you, Nate. Okay, that concludes t e public portion of our meeting.
Council discussion?
Wilbuml I have a question ofSgt. Kelsay, ifhe co ld come back in. Ijust wanted
another bit of infonnation, if you.. . either a ecdotally or statistically. We've
heard examples of some of the concerns fo ks have about ifthere were a change
away from the 19 to 21, about you know a saults, or date rape, other problems
associated. We just heard about a riot. Ha e we not had those examples in the
downtown area in the past couple of years?
Kelsay/ Yes, they are occurring right now downto n and not downtown, but a lot of
them do end up with, you meet somebody hether it be at a party or at a bar,
maybe your friends are with you, maybe th y aren't, but that initial introduction
does happen often times at a downtown ba .
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Wilburn/ And was there not a essentially a riot inv lving fifty or so people this past
summer, that ended up from downtown ov r to University Hospitals?
Kelsay/ Yes.
Wilburn/ Okay, I guess the reason I bring that up i not to say that one is better than the
other, but an argument is being made that i 's a controlled, regulated environment
downtown, and while again through compl ance checks the liquor license owners,
their staff, have done a better job with the ompliance checks, these issues are still
happening. Some of them still within the ar, others in the Ped Mall, on the way
home, in cars, and so I guess that's the onl reason I bring that up for Council.
O'Donnell/ Did we not on Lucas or Johnson Stree , also have a house party that got out
of hand, several years back?
Kelsay/ Yeah, we've had some more recent than t at where we've received calls. By out
of hand, I'm not sure what you meant. We had one, maybe you're referring to the
one where there was actually an officer ass ulted at it, but those continue to be
problems. There continue to be problems owntown. There continues to be
problems where there is access to alcohol. One ofthe speakers said that if you
have persons over 21 who are irresponsibl , and persons less than 21 who are
responsible, that is true. Where there's ace ss and where there's a large number
of people, I believe the Mayor was quoted n saying, I don't know ifhe used
irresponsible as the word, but that's what e're dealing with, and in the end it
somewhat boils down to maturity, and by t e very nature of it, not always, but by
the very nature of it the majority of the tim ,a 21 year old is going to be more
mature than a 19 year old.
Wilburn/ And again, I guess the only reason I brou ht that example up was that the
questioning about how regulated, how safe how responsible. Some, not all, not
again, there have been good jobs with com liance checks. I've seen some good
practices down at your establishment. I've also observed at a couple places, some
of the bartenders, now the owners probabl aren't aware ofthis, but some ofthe
bartenders and staff, doing shots during the time when they are controlling and
regulating the environment.
Kelsay/ We routinely, we, the police department a d the downtown foot patrol, routinely
deal with persons who are, they've come d wntown with friends, and now
they've gone inside and they've become in oxicated, and their friends have
brought them outside and deposited them 0 a park bench, and left them there
until they go in and finish socializing, or u til the bar closes. I mean, we
routinely deal with that. We take people to the hospital or to jail, if. . . depending
on what the options are, but sometimes tho e persons are intoxicated to the point
that they don't know where they're staying Those people end up at the hospital
short-term and usually at the jail long-term.
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Champion! There's a couple things that were said onight about the girls on the bus.
Well, they were from Iowa City and it was we are 19. So, you know, we did
have somebody die in a fraternity from alc hol abuse and we are 19 and we're not
21. Those things happen with abuse of alc hol. It doesn't make any difference
what our laws are going to be, whether 19 r 21. There are fatalities in Iowa City
from alcohol. They may not be daily, but ere's a lot oflong-tenn fatalities in
Iowa City from alcohol. Alcohol is not jus bad once. It has a lot of health
repercussions, over a life time. I'm disapp inted that the bars did not hire
somebody to supervise who was drinking i their bars. The gentleman that got up
before said all of the people in his bars are 'n charge of doing that, and yet the
PAULA's in his two bars account for over 0% of the PAULA's, in the past year,
and I'm very disappointed in that. I expec ed the bar owners, all of them, to
follow through on what they said they wou d do, and I think I need more
discussion on this, on whether we're thinki g of going to 21 or not. I'm not ready
to make that decision tonight. I know we' e not supposed to be ready, but I need
to explore some ofthese things that I thou ht would help the situation. College
students will drink, and frankly, I don't ha e any problem if they drink a little bit.
I'm .. .my problem is with the abuse of alc hol that we have in this community,
and the culture that abuse is good. I have r al problems with that. I think it
effects your life for a long, long time, and am willing to go 21 if we can't come
up with some solution that's going to corre t this problem, because I think we've
got big trouble.
O'Ðonnelll Well, I've heard over and over tonight about excess, and excess with lack of
enforcement is the problem. I've heard ke sales increased for neighborhoods,
and you know, it would be very easy to go 021 and move this problem to another
jurisdiction or address the problem today. was very impressed with our student
body representatives, and I'm willing to gi e this more time to work out. I do
understand that there is a problem, but I do believe the problem has not gotten any
worse, and I'm willing to give 19 more tim , but I would like to see a group
fonned to try and resolve some of these pr blems.
Lehman! I would agree with you, Mike. The prob em probably hasn't gotten any worse.
The reason we did it was because we had a problem, but it really hasn't gotten
any better. There are two factors from eve y report I've ever seen, that have more
to do with alcohol abuse than anything else . One is availability, and one is price.
Access and price. We have the most acces ible alcohol in this community than
probably any community anywhere. Whe you have that kind of accessibility,
obviously the price of alcohol is, it's cheap We have a big problem, and Ross,
you (can't understand). We have several tì lks in the community, County Health
Service, University of Iowa administration, and the College of Public Health, the
public school system - they're all telling u we've got a big problem in this
community. We know that, and sitting her and doing nothing isn't changing
anything. Now we did a 19-ordinance, and the results of that ordinance have
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been, I don't think, negative, but they cert inly have not come up with the kind of
results that I would hope they would. I w Id be interested in discussing this
further, as I think, Connie, you had said. I think if we ask the folks in the
community, and they're working on this, I think they deserve the cooperation of
the City in making the regulations that we ive by. There's a state law in Iowa
that says you've got to be 21 years old to 'nk, except in Iowa City. Everyone in
Iowa knows it's okay to drink in Iowa Cit when you're 19. Come here from all
over the state. You can't in your bars in C dar Rapids, or Ames, or the Quad
Cities, or Davenport, so come to Iowa Cit . We'll let ya in. And you're coming
in for hamburgers, we've got cooks puttin alcohol in the burgers because the
kids are getting drunk. It's not why they g in the bars. I don't think that's what
we need to be known for, and I would be v ry interested in discussing this further.
I'm not convinced that this is working at a 1.
Elliott! I, tonight I've sat here, and I have been ext emely impressed. I wrote down the
names of everyone who came to the mic, a d I've got a list, I won't count it, but
there must be at least 25 people. Every sin Ie person, whether it was based,
whether their comments were based on si ificant research or personal
experiences, have been I think they've sai what they feel. What they've said has
been very worthwhile. What they've said as been meaningful, and I'm very
impressed with the decorum, with the ma er in which the people have addressed
the Council. I talked this morning to a cla s at City High and they all asked, we
spent an hour talking about the alcohol pro lem. Obviously, they were interested
in the alcohol problem, and I said, one thin you have to remember, is we're just a
bunch of regular people. We're going to si here and we'll try to do what's right,
and we may do what's right or we may not but at least we'll try. I am not
convinced that I am interested in changing 't from 19 and over. A year ago when
I was not on the Council, I thought it was a very reasonable compromise, and I
still feel that way. We've spent a lot ofti e tonight talking about access. I don't
think that going to 21 significantly limits a cess because you're going to find
access some place else. I think it is not im roper to say this is somewhat
analogist to the national prohibition, when hey decided earlier in our country that
alcohol is bad. Let's outlaw it, and we all ow that was a terrible, terrible thing
to do, but I think we have learned from m ing mistakes. I think it would be a
mistake to go to 21 and over, at this time. would be interested, however...I
wrote down a number of things that I think we should do. We need to look at
possible zoning in the downtown area, to li it the number of bars. We need to
investigate the possibility of an ordinance t limit size, whether it's square feet or
the number of people. That mayor may n t be legally possible. We need to look
at lobbying the legislature to make fines m re meaningful. I think we have come
to a place where $100 or $150 fine someti es is not terribly meaningful. We
need to consider, perhaps, bars using came as to swipe LD. 's, so that if a fake LD.
is used, the bar can at least go back and 100 , and see if it was used because quite
often someone under age will get into a bar using a fake LD. When they're
tapped on the shoulder, they don't show th ir fake LD. because the fine there is
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higher, and that leaves the bar at risk for s mething that they've made a good faith
effort to enforce. We need to revisit the U iversity sending letters to students
who are picked up. I just think that the U 'versity needs to be very much
involved with this. We need to encourage ars to develop programs, or rewarding
people for surviving a sting. There were s veral other good comments tonight
that I think were made. I'm not ready to c ange from 19 and over at this time. I
think it is a very reasonable compromise, ut I think we have heard some very
well informed, very respected people tonig t talk on both sides, and in the past,
and I'll shut up in a minute, Ernie. In the ast, I have hunted out some of these
people. Some who disagree with what I ju t said, and I sat and had coffee with
them and listened, and I am certainly not u impressed, but I think that at this time
to change, we aren't limiting accessibility ignificantly, but we are changing the
area where the access is available, and tho e areas are significantly more
dangerous than our downtown bars. I'm d ne.
O'Donnell! Well said. And, Ernie, I want to make one comment. I certainly hope you
weren't suggesting by your statement that was saying we should do nothing.
Lehmani No, no, no, not at all. I'm just saying the problem is still here.
O'Donnell/ Well the problem is here, but the way ou resolve a problem is to get together
and work on it, and that's what I'm sugges ing.
Lehmani That's why we're here.
Bailey/ Well I think unfortunately, I think, Mike, ou made this point. The problem isn't
an age problem. The problem is an excess roblem, and we are asking one
question, and that's why we're here tonigh , it's very specific, about how the 19-
ordinance is working, but the real problem 'n drinking in Iowa City is excess, and
irresponsible drinking. I would be interest d in actually stepping out a little bit
and exploring that problem, and if there ar some incentives and some things that
we can put together, to look at that issue, b cause the people I've heard talk about
moving it into the neighborhoods, and that's a real concern where I live on the
north side. They don't point fingers about ge. They point fingers about excess,
and the after-hour parties, and the people o are coming through our
neighborhoods very loudly at 2:30 in the m rning. That's the problem we see.
And that knows no age limit. A couple we kends ago, what we saw on the streets
ofIowa City, that wasn't about age. That as about excess. That was all ages,
and so I think that perhaps getting together and working on that problem a little
bit, and I don't know exactly what those an wers are, would help us address the
real problem that we have in Iowa City abo t drinking.
Vanderhoef/ One of the things that crossed my mi d, I hear excess but I also hear access,
and both are problems in my mind. I hear bout moving out into the
neighborhoods, and driving issues. It strik s me as interesting that when you get
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down into the statistics, it isn't just our Un versity students, and I've said that all
along that the problem that we have here ith excess and drinking, is a far larger
problem. I think drink specials are one of he huge draws to this community. So
when we talk about moving it out into ano er city if we go to 21, I'm thinking
"well and maybe if it wasn't as accessible ·n Iowa City, we wouldn't have all of
these young people from Ames and Des Mines and Davenport and all the other
places around for 120 miles, that are comi g here because of access, nobody
knows them, if they get picked up it isn't e en in their hometown paper. It's a
real problem to have a reputation in this cit that you can get it someplace. You
can get alcohol somehow. This past week visited with City administrators and
City Councilors from seven different colle e communities in the state ofIowa.
We all gathered to talk about it at our State League of Cities meeting, and
everyone was wanting to look at what low City had in the way of ordinances. I
came back with the Ames' ordinance. Du uque is in the process right now of
addressing this because they feel that they ave a huge issue that's just getting
larger and larger, and they want to put som ordinances in place. We talked a
little bit about noisy parties, and nuisance arties, and litter in the neighborhood,
litter in the downtown. I can speak for our business in that you can sweep the
sidewalks before you go home at night, but you certainly have to sweep again in
the morning, and your business hasn't bee open. So, it isn't just in front of the
establishments when the students, or excus me, the patrons leave, whoever they
may be, come out. I don't feel that we've ade much progress this past year. I
feel like there may be something that we c n look at, certainly we haven't had an
increase in nuisance parties. I think that's real positive. I hear the report on
kegs. I would be willing to investigate a k g law. While there certainly are states
across the nation, and I have talked to coun ilors from many states, who have put
in state keg laws. That's one of the things hat would be most useful in my mind
to do in the state ofIowa, not just as a city ne, and certainly I would look at
lobbying for higher penalties for underage rinking, whether they're caught with
it in their hand, we have Breathalyzer's so nyone who breathes alcohol could
possibly be charged for alcohol but I think 'm certainly leaning towards 21 at this
point in time. I think access is part of the p oblem, and it shows up in some of our
studies that fewer accesses will decrease th amount of alcohol that reaches our
underage drinkers.
Lehmani Do we want this put on a work session fo ..all right. Steve, if you would
schedule it. All right, folks, thank you for eing here this evening. Thank you,
Council.
Elliott/ Thanks again to all the folks who spoke to ight.
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