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HomeMy WebLinkAbout1998-11-02 TranscriptionNovember 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 1 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session 7:36 PM Council: Lehman, Champion, Kubby, Norton, O'Donnell, Thomberry ,Vanderhoef. Staff.' Atkins, Helling, Dilkes, Karr, Franklin, Davidson, Treeblood, Schmadeke, Yucuis, Fosse, Head, Ripley, Fowler, Nasby. Tapes: 98-119, Side 2; 98-122, all; 98-123, all. Review Zoning Matters 98-119 S2 a. Public hearing on an ordinance changing the zoning designation of approximately 10 acres from Low Density Single-Family Residential (RS-5) to Planned Development Housing Overlay (OPDH-5), to allow 36 dwelling units, for property located at Wellington Drive and Village Road. (REZ98-0012/SUB98-0021 ) Franklin/P.h. on an ordinance changing the zoning of 10 acres... Village Green area .... 36 dwelling units .... P/Z has recommended approval of this as has the staff....nothing on this that is of any particular consequence .... b. Public hearing on a resolution approving the annexation of a 4.45 acre tract, occupied by the Court Street right-of-way, for property located at the east terminus of Court Street. (ANN98-0004) Franklin/...approving the annexation of approx. 4 ½ acres that is the Court Street r.o.w .... extension of Court Street .... This will include a rezoning from the county designation... to RS-5 for the Court Street r.o.w .... and P... for part of Scott Park. c. Public hearing on an ordinance changing the zoning designation of a 4.45 acre tract from Suburban Residential (County RS), to Low Density Single-Family Residential (RS-5) and Public (P) for property located at the east terminus of Court Street. (REZ98-0015). Franklin/The rezoning. d. Public hearing on a resolution approving the annexation of a 19.81 acre tract located at the southeast corner of Scott Boulevard and American Legion Road. (ANN98-0002). Franklin/A p.h. on a resolution approving the annexation of 19.81 acres located at the comer of Scott Blvd. And American Legion Road. Kubby/I would like to see... where that road on Scott came out .... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 2 Franklin/I wanted to distinguish the annexation from the rezoning. The entire project takes place on a larger square .... There is a little portion of this property that is currently within the corporate limits. So the annexation is the 19.81 acres .... Rezoning is 21.53 .... (Refers to map). This one we have a ...60 bed rehab facility; a 9,000 square foot medical office; independent living units and then assisted living .... This is where the storm water detention facility is... exit points... American Legion here ..... Access to Scoot Blvd... initially there were two access points .... Right here (refers to map)... there is a hill .... Diminish the number of access points on Scott because Scott will be the more heavily traveled road and have their other access come offof American Legion which they were able to do .... Norton/Could you drive all the way from American Legion over? Franklin/No... there is a stop here... It is connected here (refers to map). Norton/... cut through... Franklin/That may occur but it is fairly circuitous. Kubby/Do we have any projections... what percentage of the traffic would use American Legion? .... Franklin/Both of these facilities, the medical office and the rehab facility, will be accessible to really anyone in the community .... Intuitively say... Scott .... This is going to be used when it is congested over here... or primarily by the people in the independent living units .... Norton/How is the grade at that point? .... Franklin/ Larry Schnittjer/Either 8 or 10% .... Norton/ Schnittjer/ Franklin/It is about a 8 -10 % grade and no, people won't be hanging on the hill .... Vanderhoef/Sight distance is okay? Franklin/Yes, sight distance is not an issue there. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 3 Kubby/I thought we were having a problem having access onto Scott .... Franklin/We were concerned about two access points onto Scott, not any access point .... Kubby/When will we have to make a decision about which strategy to use for the sewer? Franklin/That is still being negotiated and you will need to continue the p.h. tomorrow night while that is being worked out. The preferred option.. working with Village Green South and it having it come down Scott Blvd .... We don't have the agreements in hand and all of the easements taken care of. Lehman/Do we continue both the p.h.s? .... Franklin/You don't need to but just to keep everything together, why not? .... I would keep them together. Kubby/I guess I would need rationale as to why that is the preferred option. Franklin/This is something the developer, the Dial Company, is working on .... Question would come to you is if the only option that could be worked out were ones in which it required the city to participate financially and obviously the one to the east ....More expensive but served the larger area ....My understanding is Dial and Prieval have not come together satisfactorily ....So that is not even an option unless the council wanted to take a more aggressive role in that. The drainage issues .... (Refers to map) .... Shows how the drainage works here... going into a pipe that comes down Scott Blvd. When we installed the pipe along Scott Blvd. It went into a ditch for a period of time and was picked up farther south ..... What has happened is that Mr. Wolf put in this diversion, a pipe, to serve the drainage for Modem Manor ..... Conflict between Mr. Prieval and Mr. Wolf.... When the storm water detention basin is put in on this property, what storm water detention does is it holds the water so the flow isn't as great. The volume over time may be the same or greater but what is going at any point in time is going to be less .... Won't have the rush in this pipe that you would have not during a storm... This whole problem here should be alleviated by this development project .... Because of the detention basin and holding it back, it comes through more in a trickle than a flow .... Okay, any questions on that one? e. Public hearing on an ordinance changing the zoning designation of 21.53 acres from Low Density Single Family Residential (RS-5), County A1, Rural, and County CH, Highway Commercial, to Planned Development Housing Overlay (OPDH-12), located at the southeast corner of Scott Boulevard and American Legion Road. (REZ98-0004) This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 4 f. Consider an ordinance vacating the Madison Street right-of-way south of Prentiss Street, the Des Moines Street right-of-way west of Capitol Street and the 20-foot wide alley south of Prentiss Street and west of Capitol Street. (VAC98-0005) (First consideration) Franklin/First consideration on the vacation of Madison and the other streets down on the south side. g. Consider an ordinance changing the zoning designation of approximately 22 acres from Medium Density Single-Family Residential (RS-8) to Low Density Single-Family Residential (RS-5) for property located in the Summit Street Historic District. (REZ98-0010). (Pass and adopt) Franklin/Pass and adopt .... h. Consider a resolution approving a preliminary plat of Country Club Estates First Addition, a 10.4 acre 21-lot residential subdivision located at the west terminus of Phoenix Drive. (SUB98-0011) Franklin/Country Club Estates which we are going to ask you to defer again. Lehman/Indefinitely? Franklin/Yes because then we can always put it on if it gets cleared up. Let me just quickly tell you what has occurred here ....This is the new configuration of Country Club Estates (refers to map) .... Issue is fight down in this comer here. Some years ago there was a concept plan... for this area... platting to create this line... plans for a lot at the end of a cul de sac .... The property owner over here bought this lot from probably Frank Eicher. When the current owner originally platted this, he evidently did not know that it was not squared off here and went ahead and platted as if it was squared off. Then comes to find out .... this piece is owned by the property owner to the east .... Access questions because now this piece is landlocked by this plat .... We need to get this all straightened out to the satisfaction of everybody before we go ahead with this preliminary plat. Kubby/There is quite a bit of RS-5 land that is currently zoned ..... What prevents them from platting that other RS-5 land without coming in with a whole concept plan for the whole area? Franklin/Only our advice that we would look very frowningly on that. Kubby/Is that enough? This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 5 Franklin/Yeah, I think it is enough ....It is in the staff report putting the developer on notice that that is a concem .... There is a couple of issues that we will hang onto and one is the sewer capacity. The other one is the access ..... Rohret Road north on this so there isn't so much traffic on Phoenix... Developer... seems to want to work with us on this .... Kubby/...could we require this as part of a ....OPDH? Franklin/...if you did it as part of a CZA. Remember, this is a subdivision ..... Thornberry/ Franklin/Zoning changes. Kubby/Is that recreational facility in the area that would need to be rezoned? Franklin/No, it is in this subdivision. Norton/ Franklin/ .... As you get to the west and south of here we are talking about rezoning from RD-RS to .... Part of a planned development .... We know that we can serve the 20 or 21 lots on this subdivision .... If it is more constrained .... Special requirements as far as the pool goes .... One piece of leverage that we have .... Vanderhoef/... lift station? Franklin/No, that has to do with capacity in the lines .... West side trunk and also whether a line within the Southwest Estates... has sufficient capacity... i. Consider a resolution approving an extraterritorial final plat of Prairie Meadow, Part 2, a 16.52 acre, 7-1or residential subdivision located in the Suburban Residential, County ItS, zone for property located in Johnson County on the east and south sides of Prairie du Chien Road, north of its intersection with Linder Road. (SUB98-0025) Franklin/...seven lot residential subdivision ....Legal papers should be done tomorrow so you can go ahead with this one. Lehman/Thank you. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 6 Review Aeenda Items 98-119 S2 1. (Agenda #7 - PUBLIC DISCUSSION ON THE PROPOSED BALLOT LANGUAGE AND POLICY STATEMENT REGARDING THE IMPOSITION OF A LOCAL SALES TAX. Atkins/(Refers to flipchart). You asked the other evening about the fare revenue .... What we did...calculate the impact of providing $500,000 in sales tax revenues to the transit system .... Issue of the reduction of the fare box. We made the estimate of reducing the fare to 50 cents and in doing that it would need to have another $167,000 of sales tax revenue to offset that loss. You would require us under our SEATS contract.. owe the county .... We made the assumption .... Ideas on additional service ....We would have a route serving the west side .... Then have a second route which would be a deviated fixed route focusing on the Senior Center .... not locked into those .... We can have one deviated fixed route and a new fixed route... cost of that service is $136,500 .... Rough estimates .... We did have some capital outlay to buy a smaller bus up front .... 50 cents will generate $498,000. We need $670,000 to make the budget hold... also allow $180,000 in property tax reduction .... Estimated the ridership would increase about 11%. Same scenario except 25 cents would be the new fare .... Have to have $333,000 in sales tax revenue, increase to the county... We would not have any property tax relief... ridership would increase about 22%. Norton/Could you make a copy of that? Atkins/...I can get you a copy of it. Kubby/Will that be presented tomorrow night? Atkins/I understood you wanted something to work with .... Norton/ (All talking). Lehman/Other comments on agenda items? FLIP CHART: (See next page). This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 7 Sales Tax Revenue Options Fare Revenue Sales Tax required to meet current budget Additional transfer to Johnson County Operating cost for new service Reduction in General Fund transfer Current ridership Projected ridership Transit $.50 Fare $.25 Fare $498,250 $332,500 $167,750 $333,500 $15,250 $30,000 $136,500 $136,500 $180,500 0 1,248,814 1,248,814 1,359,890 1,479,790 2. (Agenda #8 - CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE AMENDING TITLE 8, ENTITLED "POLICE REGULATIONS," CHAPTER 4, ENTITLED "PET ANIMAL CONTROL," OF THE CITY CODE TO PROVIDE NEW DEFINITIONS FOR CIRCUSES AND RODEOS. (FIRST CONSIDERATION) & #9 - CONSIDER A RESOLUTION ADOPTING PERMIT RULES AND REGULATIONS FOR CIRCUSES AND RODEOS. Norton/Is everybody prepared to proceed with the issues on the beasties...rodeos? Lehman/My personal preference is to ignore that and do nothing. Champion/ Lehman/I don't see any point in us doing anything .... Norton/Isn't it on the agenda for tomorrow night? .... I still have considerable trouble with it too. Lehman/I personally don't see any point in doing anything with it, period .... Karr/Staff is recommending.. that you defer action on #9... even if you wish to proceed on first consideration of the ordinance. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 8 Kubby/Defer indefinitely. Karr/Defer it until you proceed with the ordinance .... Depends on whether you collapse the readings. But basically that you would pass the resolution the same time you pass the ordinance .... Norton/You say do #8 but not #9? Karr/That is your option. The staff would recommend you not proceed with #9 should you wish to do #8. Thornberry/ Lehman/We can vote #8 down. Karr/#9 would have to be amended if you vote #8 down .... #9 would be revised to include the present code and not the changes in the revised ordinance. Norton/Why not just defer both of them until we get our wits together? Kubby/ Norton/ .... It is inconsistent .... Ban on elephants but not on other large critters .... Caging for certain categories of animals but nothing about caging for snakes .... Inconsistencies... I don't know whether we are comprehensive enough yet .... Gaps .... Kubby/If there are four people who still want to have some regulations then we need to give direction to staff.... Thornberry/Ringling Brothers... has a letter to us here... National Rodeo Association... professionals .... Norton/Suppose the city were to annex the fairgrounds .... Problem... future... I don't want to get ourselves in kind of a weird position .... Lehman/If we decide that rodeos are a imminent danger and circuses .... Probably defer .... If on the other hand we want to wait until such time there is a place to have a rodeo and circus .... Personally I would just vote it down and forget it. O'Donnell/I agree. Thornberry/That is what I think we ought to do .... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 9 Norton/I think we need regulations of this sort .... Nervous about adding another layer of regulations .... I don't know .... Kubby/Misha said she is being consistent in some areas .... Norton/...what about a giraffe cage, where are the dimensions of that? Lehman/Obviously if we are going to do something like this, we are going to have to spend some more time on it. Champion/I am not interested .... Kubby/ Champion/ Kubby/The beauty of having local regs .... See this and they know what the community expectations area .... O'Donnell/I think it is discrimination against the elephants. Norton/We ought to be careful that they are suitably comprehensive and not duplicative ....I thought the video on elephants was a little overdone ....I would rather defer it .... O'Donnell/I think there are already very strict regulations .... Kubby/...see signs of abuse and neglect to the animals .... It is a question to say that the regs are in place and they are working okay .... Was it local regulation that helped make sure that everything was okay and stuff... Vanderhoef/I am not sure what the regulations are that are available... Misha has alluded to and is pointing us back to the rodeo association. Lehman/All fight. Tomorrow night, and we can look at what we got tonight, first thing I would like us to do is to decide whether or not we wish to proceed. If we do wish to proceed, I think it only appropriate we defer it until as such time as we have the oppommity to study it. I think the first question will be are there four people on council who want to proceed with the regulation .... Norton/I am not clear with the question. Lehman/If there are four people on council who feel like circus and rodeo regulations are desirable and that we should in fact have those, then I think the proper procedure This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 10 would then be to defer this and give us time to work on it. If there are not four people who feel that this is- Karr/We already have an ordinance regarding circus and rodeos. Lehman/If we feel the present ordinance is adequate, then we won't move any further. (All talking). Dilkes/We have an ordinance that contemplates rules and regulations that will govern circuses and rodeos. If you don't want to do any rules and regulations that govern circuses and rodeos, we will need to amend the ordinance to change that. So we need more direction that just a deferral. Kubby/Maybe what we need is a memo from Misha explaining what is different between what we currently have on the books and what the new proposal would bring us. Lehman/We don't have any rules. Vanderhoef/...previous ordinances... the council chose to do rodeos and circuses. Now she has brought it back, the rules and regulations, as long as we are going to allow them... then we have to have our rules and regulations. O'Donnell/And if they read the rules and regulations, they are not going to be here anyway .... Norton/ ....We need them but we need to get them straight. Lehman/ Dilkes/I think you need a memo. Thornberry/ .... read the literature .... People from International Professional Rodeo Association who say exactly the same thing .... They have got regulations that are done all over the world. They don't want something that is prohibitive to keep them from performing in this area .... Norton/We need to talk with Misha to make she can explain to our satisfaction why these added rules are unique, different and necessary... Thornberry/...these people work with it every single day .... Kubby/She is our Animal Control officer. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 11 Thornberry/ Lehman/It is a shame to cheat the public out of this conversation ....Tomorrow night. Any other agenda items. 3. (Agenda #10 - CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE AMENDING THE CITY CODE OF THE CITY OF IOWA CITY, IOWA, BY AMENDING SECTION 8-5-5, ENTITLED "KEEPING DISORDERLY HOUSE," TO PROVIDE FOR POLICE INITIATED COMPLAINTS AND TO PROVIDE FOR POLICE AUTHORITY TO RESTORE ORDER AND DISPERSE PERSONS FROM VIOLATING PREMISES. (FIRST CONSIDERATION) Kubby/In thinking about the Disorderly House Amendment, I know that we have all talked about the process of three readings, that we can change our vote .... Once these amendments are voted on... very difficult politically for someone to change their mind. So I am toying with the idea of moving to defer it for just two weeks... student senate forum... to hear that input before we have our first consideration ..... I just thought of this this aftemoon... I think it would be very difficult for me to change my vote once I made one on this particular issue .... I guess I would rather have all the input first and then vote on it. Norton/When are we talking about getting together with the students? Kubby/November 9 .... It would just be two weeks. Vanderhoef/ .... Does that finish up before Christmas? Thornberry/...there is three readings .... Vanderhoef/If there is still three readings before the holidays. I would prefer to have this completed before the holidays. Norton/ ....I want the students to have a chance to say. Thornberry/Use your own judgement. Vanderhoef/I think we can go ahead with the first reading. Lehman/We will discuss that tomorrow night. Kubby/The other thing... I am interested .... Defining the discretion a little better .... I have been thinking about that a lot... I still have a problem with the police officer being the complainant .... I would ask people to think about that ..... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 12 Norton/ Lehman/ Kubby/I am thinking about this. I want you to have ovemight to think about it. I don't need to have a discussion or answer tonight. I just wanted to put it out there. Lehman/Any other agenda items? Thornberry/ Lehman/Next item on the agenda is the housing bond program .... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 13 Housing Bond Program 98-119 S2 Head/The Community Housing Forum recommended a joint obligation bond program to city council. This was one of seven financial strategies in the report. Staff was asked to come back to council and provide more detail information about the program. In your packet you have a summary of the program as well as the criteria .... Our goal tonight is to get council' s input on this program as well as to get some direction from council on program implementation. Steve Nasby will provide the details of this program for you .... Some of the financial details .... Nasby/ .... We have given you a very rough outline on what is possible .... We have talked to a couple of bankers and a private developer to see whether there would be any interest .... We got pretty much the word from both of them they would be interested .... Incentives to developers... Developers were more interested in... real nit picky type things of the program .... I worked out some financials .... Proposing to provide the end loans for a building project .... Lehman/This would be the only mortgage on the property? Nasby/Yes... could be in a two mortgage situation .... Another lender... But we would be the primary lender... Proposing... 80% loan to value... Lehman/...if we get into multi-family apartments, we are not going to be able to do very many. We would be the lender, is that correct? Nasby/Yes. Lehman/2% below market rate .... It would be a wash .... In order for this to be a on- going program... borrow more and more and more every year .... Nasby/..if you want to... keep adding to it, we would. Lehman/It is not a one time shot... Nasby/The money gets repaid by money generated by the project... Lehman/Talking a 20 year period .... Before the funds would perpetuate itself. Nasby/We are talking about getting the bonds and paying them right back off.... Lehman/ .... if you finance the whole thing... you are not going to get much money in the next ten years from me .... Nasby/20 years .... To provide that long term financing for a developer at a fixed rate. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 14 Kubby/ Lehman/If you start putting a pencil to this... You wouldn't have to borrow any more because the repayment .... Nasby/Paying them off with the notes .... 20 years is the maximum... Not more than 20 .... We wouldn't accept anything less than 20 .... Champion/What if somebody is going to build an $8 million multi-family apartment building and they come to you and they say I want to- Nasby/ Champion/What if they say in this apartment building I would like to mix in this big apartment complex five units that will be affordable and those five units would be 1/10 of my $8 million project...? Nasby/...we wouldn't be in the position of being the primary lender and then we wouldn't have the security of the building. Lehman/...we could choose to do it for one year. Norton/.management, would the city have any role in that? Nasby/We want to make this as private as possible .... Rent without Section 8 .... Norton/...below 30% of median income .... Great majority of them had zero income. Head/ Norton/They have got to make enough to pay the rent. Nasby/...I think we figured about 18% could afford it. Lehman/ Nasby/We are becoming the bank. Vanderhoef/...we are passing on the good rates to the developer .... Nasby/...they can't get 5% .... Norton/What is going to accomplish the scattering you speak o~ This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 15 Nasby/What we had in mind... funding a couple of 12-plexes .... Private developers that we have in town are constantly building. Champion/You could really do a duplex at that price .... Thornberry/Got to have a minimum of five units and a maximum of 24 units. Nasby/...we don't want to do a bond issue for $10,000 .... Maximum is $700,000 without a referendum. Lehman/We would have the bond issue as the project would come up? .... Nasby/Talking about having some type of competition .... Then we would make a commitment to some developer... We would then make a written commitment to them, they would move ahead getting their construction loans... When they got about three months from closing, we would start the bond process and then... close .... Lehman/ Nasby/ Lehman/Is there a way to provide incentives... that construction would take place in places not currently in high concentration of multi-family of subsidized income? Nasby/Those are things we can put in the criteria .... Trying to get these scattered .... 80% of the units market rate .... Thomberry/ Nasby/ Thomberry/Some places these units would not be appropriate .... CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 98-122 SIDE 1 Lehman/We are talking about areas of income levels of all levels .... Have an 8-plex where 5 of them are going to be lower income .... Got $200,000 houses and $60,000 row house. Thomberry/That is not what I am talking about. What I am talking about is a developer buying a house on Lexington Road .... Coming to the city council and wanting it rezoned for a 5-plex. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 16 Lehman/That is a land use question, it isn't going to happen. Thomberry/ Norton/Let's take the old Saratoga project on Dubuque Road .... Proposing a 20 unit structure. Kubby/It is a land use issue first .... Norton/...heavy duty land use questions. Franklin/Don't forget in each one of these projects, there is an inherent mix just by the definition and the parameters. Norton/What is the evidence that those situations work? .... Nasby/These are all going to be rental. Kubby/Example... comer of Dubuque and Court Street .... Rental units .... Norton/ Nasby/Risk that we would have if they decided not to put any maintenance into the project and walk away from it, we would own the building .... Kubby/What are the consequences... in the rent range for 20 years, are only there for 10 years .... And we find that rents are too high. What is the recourse? Nasby/We will do something... deed restriction on the loan .... Attached to the real estate ....Parameters ....Repayment ....Penalty ....Can we buy out of it with a penalty? ....work on .... Kubby/ Nasby/ Kubby/ Thornberry/ Nasby/If we foreclosed on them .... Kubby/What is the worst thing that could happen... city owned some property... public housing... sell to the private market .... ? This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 17 Norton/If you can get the lending agencies to buy into this .... Developers that want to do it .... City is being asked to back this .... Head/We have talked to one developer that has expressed some interest .... Vanderhoef/Aren't they putting in 20% of the money? Nasby/That is right ....As we talked to some of these people .... Norton/Seems like a reasonable thing to try .... Lehman/2 points offa 7% loan is more than 25% reduction in the cost of borrowing money .... Subsidy that would make a lot of projects fly .... I don't know that we are really taking a whole lot of risk .... Nasby/We are asking them for that reduction of interest... give back in reduced rents .... Vanderhoef/ Lehman/Who decides whether it is a good loan? Nasby/Our underwriters, bond consultant. Lehman/I don't see where we are taking much risk? Kubby/How did we arrive at the $1.4- as a beginning? Nasby/In the memo it shows there are a couple of options .... Do it as a tack on or we can issue up to $700,000 per project ....We have some big GO bond issues coming up ....We can't always time those ....My preference would be to go with the $700,000 .... Time them as we needed .... Vanderhoef/ Nasby/We would limit the size .... We are trying to scatter these units... Champion/I like this idea... My only problem... It might provide us a small amount of affordable housing that in 20 years may no longer be affordable .... Kubby/ Lehman/I don't think you can look beyond that .... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 18 Thomberry/ .... We are saying to providing new low income housing is the cost of money .... We are solving low income housing problems .... Because of money .... For them to build low income housing for 20 years .... We are saying it is the cost of money. Lehman/We only have 800 and some vouchers... We have a greater demand for vouchers... than we have vouchers. This would replace vouchers .... You enable that to occur because you have got 5% money... lower cost of money replaces vouchers .... Kubby/...within this whole program, it is just one component .... Thomberry/I would like to see the city get out of the housing business as far as being a landlord .... There is no reason for the city to be a landlord... I can see providing housing in our ways, this being one of them .... I cannot believe that anybody thinks that it is a good idea for the city .... To own your house .... I am looking more favorably on this program .... I would like to see the government get out of the housing business .... Kubby/If the private market were doing everything it needed to do, then we wouldn't need public housing programs throughout every community in the country. Thornberry/ Vanderhoef/Since we are providing the loan .... Then would we have a criteria that disallowed using vouchers and certificates for the other units within this building? ... To keep the mix that we are trying to do ..... Dilkes/We may not be able to do that .... Atkins/That is a private contract relationship. We don't have contracts with all the landlords in town .... They have to step up .... Dilkes/I don't know... that we can exclude certain... Nasby/.our goal is to scatter it .... Lehman/...project will contain a mix of income with 20% targeted with afforded housing of households of 30% median income or below. If I am going to build a 10-plex... 20%... two units ....Are below the 30%, are you going to loan me the money for the entire ten plex? Nasby/Yes. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 19 Lehman/We are going to subsidize the other eight units at regular fair market rate? Nasby/Because of the subsidy we are getting on the two targeted ones. Kubby/ Nasby/... renting two units for $225 without rent assistance .... Vanderhoef/ Kubby/If they are fair market rent .... Lehman/If I want to build a 12-plex and put in 20% low income, I would be crazy not to borrow the money from the city .... Nasby/But you are going to experience a reduced revenue stream .... Lehman/On three units .... Kubby/That is the community benefit that we are looking for .... Mixed housing .... Lehman/I am not sure 20% is the right number .... Nasby/We had a CPA put a pencil to paper on this .... Lehman/ Nasby/We want to give it a shot. Kubby/It is a great way to provide an incentive to the private market .... Norton/What happens to the taxes? Do they or do they not pay property taxes? Nasby/Property taxes will be paid or 10% of gross revenue .... One or the other .... Lehman/Target this into areas that do not have .... Kubby/South of Highway 6 .... (All talking). Lehman/You got a go. Nasby/Thank you very much. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 20 Lehman/Thank you. [Council Break] This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 21 Goosetown Traffic Calming 98-122 S1 Davidson/We have a situation to discuss... traffic calming issue .... Spent a lot of time... procedure you wanted us to follow. And we have done that .... With this particular proposal we reached a point that we have not reached .... That is at Step 7 we determined after our survey and discussion of emergency service providers and Public Works providers and Transit system that it was not safe to implement .... Safety hazard created by implementing the proposal that we had worked out with the neighborhood .... Created some hard feelings .... However we do believe that we have followed the process that you have given us to follow... At this point... recommending... system that we had worked out with the neighborhood of some street closures to address a cut through traffic issue .... Creation of some dead-end streets and lack of access into the neighborhood is what concemed the emergency vehicle providers and also our Public Works Department... We are proposing .... Not even to give this to the neighborhood for a survey because we do not support it .... There are some other things that we think can do .... Taking a neighborhood survey ....Putting parking on both sides of the street ....We have made the point... without an arterial system that works like it is suppose to, your traffic calming program is destine for failure .... Example... Creekside Neighborhood .... Intersection works a lot better .... No reason to cut through .... Similarly we feel the arterial street extensions that are proposed in NE Iowa City are what will really alleviate this cut through problem ....1700 vehicles on Bloomington Street... that is cut through traffic .... We have reached our conclusion and you have our recommendations .... Are these secondary things that we can do .... ? Kubby/ .... go back and you have Plan B .... maybe it reduces it to 1200 or 900 .... Traffic diverters .... Is there anything in our process... that you go back and do .... Something that alleviates .... Davidson/...we do have an obligation to be as straight forward with the neighborhood as possible .... Kubby/What is the next level of proposal that you all thought of?. .... Davidson/What I would like to do is go back with the neighborhood .... Have Doug go back to the neighborhood and discuss specifically the proposal for the parking adjustments ....And talk about anything else ....I will tell you that anything that creates a situation like that (refers to map) ....Public Works Department is going to opposed because of the issue of having large Public Works vehicles .... Champion/What about .... Stop sign situation? .... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 22 Davidson/We do have some stop signs in... basketweave program... You did received a report... mixed results ....Stop sign is suppose to stop traffic ....We think it has really bred a lot of disrespect for stop signs ....We do have ....Measurement on the all way stop on Court Street and Oakland and found... people going up the hill were actually going faster when they got a couple of hundred feet down the road .... Perceived to be an unnecessary stop sign .... We have kind of backed off using stop signs .... This is a cut through traffic issue. Kubby/ .... Allowing parking on both sides is a pretty low key way .... Is there something that is in between that might be helpful .... ? Ripley/Unfortunately when you are dealing with volume issues and not speed issues... create a situation that eliminates that need to cut through .... By diverting traffic or blocking off traffic .... Aggressive solution .... Kubby/ ....Something .... That would still reduce volumes .... But not create the safety issues? Davidson/When we are talking about reducing volume, we are not actually reducing volume. We are diverting volume .... Traffic volume is going up all over the city .... 95% of arterial streets are having peak volume .... The way you divert traffic is by doing stuff like that (refers to map). Norton/ Davidson/...refuse pickup is weekly... snow plowing on something like this is a real problem .... Kubby/ Vanderhoef/Has anyone considered putting a right hand tum lane on Market Street at the comer of Market and Govemor? Davidson/Not as far as I know, Dee. Vanderhoef/This is my area of town...people sit there at that light .... Trying to go north on Governor Street .... Put a right turn lane on Market Street which is headed west so that people could turn north on the other arterial which is Governor. Davidson/ ....need to take a look at the traffic situation .... Kubby/I feel like I still haven't gotten an answer to my question ....I certainly support the idea of having Doug go back to the neighborhoods .... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 23 Ripley/ .... no there is not an answer that is going to be nearly as effective .... Speed is a primary concern that we receive .... Volume issues are closures and diverters... those are the two volume issues... Kubby/...question for the neighborhood .... Reducing to some smaller number .... Champion/...get an arterial so people can go from the north part of Iowa City to the east .... Point A to point B .... That is why they go through here. Thornberry/I use Bloomington once or twice a day .... I think what is going to solve the problem is the extension of First Avenue .... There are stop signs there... I use them as yield signs... Champion/...How many cars go down Summit Street each day? Ripley/About 5,000. Champion/So this little street has 1700. Davidson/...That is a high volume. Lehman/I have no problem with having more neighborhood meetings ..... parking on both sides of the street ....Probably is not going to reduce the volume a whole lot .... Davidson/...There are a whole multitude of traffic calming things for cut through type of situations... closures and diverters are what you use... What else can you do? There is no anything that has that level of effectiveness .... Kubby/I would feel okay about reducing it and not alleviating it. Lehman/Try and work it out. Kubby/ ....less than what it is. Lehman/It doesn't hurt to talk about it. (All talking). Lehman/Do we have some sort of consensus that we would like to see Doug meet with the neighbors again and see if he can't work out? ....We are going to have one person speak and you have about two minutes. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 24 Karl Klaus/I lived in Goosetown for 28 years. I am here to register my dismay .... City's refusal to provide traffic calming measures to Goosetown but also to convey the distress and distrusts that I and others on Goosetown's Traffic Calming Committee now feel .... Misleading process we have been through with the city' s traffic planner... Mr. Ripley told us... impressed with the size of the turn out... denies us any remedies .... At our second meeting... Mr. Ripley presented us with several traffic calming options for our discussion and selection .... Now we have discovered that no remedies will be implemented .... Our concerns had been validated by his own observations .... Openly expressed objections to the proposed extension of First Avenue ....Why is it... made us assurances and promises that now have been broken ....Of all of my 35 years of living and working in Iowa City, I have never been so badly mislead by anyone in the University or anyone in city govemment .... We sincerely hope that something can be done to repair that trust as swiffiy as possible. Kubby/...neighborhood is going to have to be open to rebuilding that trust. Klaus/We are open .... We were willing to vote for traffic calming measures .... We felt the serious of the traffic through there .... It is safety .... Kubby/It is going to be real important... that the neighborhood and Doug are going to be able to work together ....Doug is directed to go back and do that... need to work through .... Klaus/We are willing to work .... We don't like to be made promises and assurances .... Lehman/It is pretty clear that this council is not going to consider closing streets ....I do think... I don't know what can be accomplished .... Norton/If you are not willing to make any closures, what are you going to do? Lehman/I don't know... Kubby/Doug said for volume reduction, closing streets and diverters are two of the strategies .... Reduce the volume... Lehman/Doug, see what we can do. Thornberry/Did you say the people of Goosetown were adamantly against the extension of First Avenue? Klaus/The people who came to that first open meeting .... Lehman/I don't know that that is even relevant .... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 25 Norton/...Doug is working under the guidelines establish by this council .... I am not at all happy with him being beaten above the head and shoulders .... Thomberry/ .... I would take First Avenue .... Lehman/ Klaus/ Thomberry/I am just asking about the one sentence .... Klaus/ I simply indicated that the people at that open heating had expressed an objection to the First Avenue extension .... So that then to be told that that is the only way in which it can be solved makes it seem to us... traffic calming program is a Trojan horse .... He told us that he had worked this up with other members of city staff.... He told us he would take our concerns back to staff and that they would develop several alternatives .... We assumed that this was not just Ripley... Then when he told us that .... He told us that there was no doubt that the Fire Department and the Police Department and the public service department would have objections to these .... Nobody had any illusions about how forbidding these measures were .... He told us...they would have to live with it. Lehman/Karl, look, this is going to have to go back to the neighborhood .... Only fair .... Almost always our traffic calming has involved speed... unusual .... I think the options are really limited .... Klaus/ Kubby/Traffic calming is fairly new... Have we talked with other communities who have used traffic calming? .... neighborhood issues .... Volume issues? .... Ripley/There are some groups... constant discussions... can pose... that question .... Norton/Figure out some other way... Not going to get somewhere without some closures. Lehman/I don't think this council is going to close streets. (All talking). Lehman/Hey guys, it is going to go back to the neighbors. Doug, do your best. Champion/Let's look at that policy .... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 26 Lehman/I think you have to get the ideas and then present them .... Davidson/ This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 27 28E Plat Review 98-122 S2 Davidson/This is the third time you have seen this one and we haven't been able to get Coralville to buy it yet. This is the 28E Agreement between Coralville and Iowa City regarding annexation and extraterritorial review of subdivision plat... The state allows the two mile area around a city to be under the review of the city and in an area where there are two cities- CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 98-122 SIDE 2 Davidson/28E Agreement to be executed between the two cities that simply lays out what you want to do and that is what we have got. We have an existing agreement between Coralville and Iowa City and what happened to void that agreement is that Coralville annexed a part of what was in Iowa City's review area, Barrington Heights area. And because of that it basically voids the agreement and makes us renegotiate the agreement and that is what we have been trying to do. The issue has been this overlapping area (refers to map) .... Coralville expanded its growth area into this area and Iowa City its growth area into this area .... What we are left with is this area (refers to map) .... Proposed dividing the review area... unacceptable to you... With the expansion of these growth areas, this is the only thing that is left now. (Refers to map) .... What was suggested and Coralville did not agree to .... They were not completely comfortable. What they have asked is for you to either reconsider this ... or consider joint review. And under joint review... would have to be approved by both Iowa City and Coralville city council, that is what joint review would do. Thomberry/ .... Coralville just annexed a billion acres .... They are wanting to be a big city, folks .... I can see them annexing as much as they can to the north around Iowa City and I am not ready to have that happen. Davidson/According to their existing Comprehensive Plan .... (refers to map) right there is as far as they are going for the next 25 years. Kubby/So process-wise .... Where do we sit? Davidson/I believe, under state law, it goes halfway, right, between the two cities .... Draw a line halfway .... Approximately where we have got this line ..... Norton/...Their action nullifies our agreement .... Vanderhoef/ Norton/The Barrington Heights annexation, how come that slipped by us? This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 28 Lehman/...there is nothing we can do to stop them .... Davidson/ Thomberry/I don't know if Coralville .... I think they can go out and annex whatever and wherever they want to. Davidson/Barrington was a voluntary annexation. Thomberry/ Norton/Can you interpret paragraph 2 of their letter for me? .... Davidson/I think what Coralville is saying is that they feel that type of land use is inappropriate for that area. It should be more dense. Kubby/Basically our decision is to agree to the agreement and split it up or agree to joint review .... I think joint review is silly .... Vanderhoef/What would happen if we split the land on an east west line .... We took the south part? Lehman/ Davidson/Remember an annexation implies that you are going to extend municipal services of that area .... Norton/What would happen if we were to change the 28E agreement with respect to the lot sizes? Davidson/...do you want to amend the Fringe Area agreement? Vanderhoeff No .... Norton/They can always be modified but not in total... Why do we want large lot residential there? Vanderhoef/It is because of the nature of the land in that area .... Davidson/And Iowa City's intention to provide municipal services which is not to go beyond the growth area in 25 years. Thomberry/ This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 29 Davidson/It does appear that if you decide to do nothing, that this is sort of the de facto arrangement that will result. Kubby/I think we should agree to not do joint review and to take that clause out of the agreement that nullifies it .... Davidson/That is out already. (All talking). Kubby/If they don't want to do that and we don't want to do this, this is what happens. Vanderhoeff What alternatives do we have? They didn't give at all when we said this is what we would like .... Davidson/They offered two counter proposals which were joint review or go back to this .... Vanderhoef/I don't call those proposals .... Kubby/Maybe we need a couple of city council members to sit down with some Coralville members .... Thornberry/I tried with one council member .... They are saying there is a lot of property already built up .... They want River Heights .... Vanderhoef/That is a lot property taxes .... (All talking). Davidson/What Dee is referring to is the West Coralville Land Use Plan .... Hear all about tomorrow at the JCCOG meeting ..... also some issues between Tiffin and Coralville .... Their corporate lines are up against each other now .... Lehman/We have two choices... joint review .... Or accept what we are looking at. Davidson/You also have the option of trying to sit down and work something else out with Coralville .... Lehman/Do we have a couple of people .... Mike O'Donnell .... ? Vanderhoef/Dean .... You two can handle it. Lehman/ .... Next work session we are going to talk about this ..... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 30 Davidson/So you will bend some arms before the 16th work session and you will let us know .... Lehman/ (All talking). Norton/I don't understand why something might not be done with paragraph 2 .... O'Donnell/Do you think it does any good whatsoever to go out and talk with this people .... ? Dilkes/We can't get any of this on tape... We can't understand it. Franklin/They don't like the idea of large lots and that Iowa City isn't considering annexing it. I don't know what they are thinking there ..... Lehman/We have our coercion committee going out. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 31 2003 & 2004 BudEet 98-122 S2 Atkins/We have schedules '03 and '04 this evening. I thought we would continue the process .... Move through the projects .... F Street Bridge. They are old, they got to be fixed. Meadow Street Bridge Landfill Cell GIS Computer Improvements Mormon Trek- Abbey Lane to Highway 1. As you recall, you pushed that up and I will take care of that when I rewrite this for you. Sycamore - Burns to City Limits. Norton/Can they wait that long? I know... I can't believe that is going to wait that long .... Kubby/What are you going to not do to move it up? Norton/ Lehman/There may be some things... I share Dee's concerns. Kubby/If Saddlebrook were moving faster than it is, I am not sure... It is not moving as fast .... Vanderhoef/But with this project- Fosse/One of the things we need to get done before we do this project is the South Sycamore Regional Storm Water .... Don't have a good place to outlet the storm sewer .... Norton/2003 is the best we can do.'? Fosse/Given the other things that are on the agenda, I would say yes. Norton/Thank you. Atkins/Park Road - Riverside Drive - Left Turn Lane. O'Donnell/I don't understand that one at all .... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 32 Davidson/This is left turn lanes on all of the approaches of that intersection fight by the Levitt Center .... Pretty reasonable priority .... Going to be an issue when traffic gets more congested there .... You would have to widen all of the approaches .... Norton/Would there be a left turn lane at Hancher? Davidson/No, this project would not include that .... Kubby/If you bike to Hancher .... Home way before anybody else. O'Donnell/Is this going to increase traffic on Park Road? .... Davidson/Park Road is an arterial and would not be eligible for traffic calming. Atkins/Riverside Redevelopmerit Project (Old DPW) .... A lot of work to do .... Kubby/Is that necessary to market that piece of property? Atkins/Likely to be necessary... we will get back to you on that .... Kubby/ Atkins/Can we do the methane abatement? .... I don't know the answers .... Kubby/ Atkins/I don't know how big the grant is .... $400,000 ....We will be back. Norton/Where did we move Mormon Trek/Abbey Lane? To what year? Kubby/We put it on a list to talk about. O'Donnell/I thought we moved it to 2000. Norton/ Atkins/Scott Park Development and Basin Excavation North Branel, Basin Excavation. Fosse/Something that we learned when we are doing the floodplain mapping was both of our north and south basins have experienced a fair amount of sedimentation... We need to go in and get some soil out of there .... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 33 Kubby/Does that correspond with a project that we would need soil for? Norton/Public Works site. Fosse/We haven't matched them up yet .... Atkins/Laura Drive Reconstruction Kubby/What is driving that? Davidson/Developer driven .... Collector street... provide secondary access .... Lehman/This is basically a maybe .... Kubby/ Atkins/...We may end up just paying the overwidth on the thing .... Kubby/Because we have it in here... put the word out... Maybe we should actual let them drive it. Davidson/...it is the reconstruction .... Atkins/Makes more sense. Kubby/So I don't find the need to have this in there .... Atkins/Do you want it on the list to talk about it? Franklin/We may need this to develop a number of properties in that north peninsula area and it is going to be part of a system that works with that whole loop ....It is not something that a private individual can do... It will be a link in allowing development .... Kubby/Why do we have it in our plan? .... Franklin/They are already talking to us about development there .... It is going to spur them on. Kubby/I wish we had a big city map .... Atkins/As soon as ... We are going to prepare something .... We intend to do that .... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 34 Lower Muscatine - DeForest to Spruce Burlington Bridge over Ralston creek Fosse/The bridge is in poor condition .... Lehman/ Vanderhoef/I understand that we wait for money from the DOT for bridges and how soon do we have to get a request in to get on the list? Fosse/In this instance, the DOT is going to be a primary player on this project and they are putting it in their budget for 2003. VanderhoefJ Fosse/Two situations, those that are actually bridges ....We have some old ones that are out there... culverts .... Kubby/ Vanderhoef/Do we have any of our bridges that are real shaky or need to be moved up? Fosse/Summit Street. Champion/ Atkins/Iowa Avenue Bridge Repair Fire Station #4. This was put on simply at my request .... Kubby/ Atkins/It wasn't much of a fire study... Andy .... We have got some ideas ..... Norton/Did you put a plan in the North East Plan? Atkins/No. Franklin/Yes. Atkins/That was '03. '04. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 35 South Gilbert Improvements .... Project that has received most of the attention .... Lehman/This also says '04 or longer ..... Atkins/The only thing... probably a number of projects in here .... Gilbert Street has a couple of projects pending .... If you are going to do this, we have already received a request from a property owner about an acquisition .... Norton/We will never make it to the year 2004 leaving S. Gilbert the way it is .... Vanderhoef/It has got to move up. Norton/It is getting to be a total disaster .... Vanderhoeff Lehman/Twice a day there is a little problem .... O'Donnell/I understand that there is something we are going to have to do down there eventually but there is many things that could happen .... Lighting changes .... Norton/...nobody is talking about a second left turn lane onto Highway 6 .... O 'Donnell/ Vanderhoeff No .... Lehman/...We could do the Gilbert Street/Highway 6 intersection... find that the rest of it functions rather well .... Kubby/Look at the map .... Norton/I still think you can get a 5th lane in there .... Kubby/... to say are we going to do something on Gilbert Street sooner than 2000? Norton/ Lehman/You can do that intersection... with that taper, you end up doing a substantial piece of the project .... Lehman/Other thing I noticed... number of accidents involved on Gilbert Street .... Boyrum Street and Hwy 6 has a higher incident of accidents .... We all wait .... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 36 Champion/The highest accident comer was Keokuk and Hollywood .... Lehman/I sure would like to hear what Mr. Davidson thinks about this one. Davidson/Keokuk/Hollywood intersection, you have to distinguish between the number of accidents and accident rate .... Gilbert Street has loads of volume so the accident rate may not be as high as a lower volume street .... As a corridor, Gilbert Street is one of our highest traffic accident corridors in the city. Thomberry/ .... after the light signalization has been changed on Gilbert and Kirkwood .... Davidson/I will have to ask Doug ..... Thornberry/When they changed that light structure .... That helped a lot. Vanderhoef/Have you gone forward at all with any discussion on the Gilbert Street, south ofHwy 6 .... median and so forth? .... Norton/I think we need to look at some kind of modified modest improvement to the South Gilbert intersection, both north and south on Hwy 6 .... Thornberry/I agree with you. Vanderhoef/ Norton/ Thornberry/ O'Donnell/On the other side of 6. Vanderhoef/The property owners have said something about working with your folks .... Davidson/What our intention is is to try and work out a solution involving all of the property owners... two way access .... We will start to do that depending on when you prioritize the project .... We won't do a lot of real specific design work until it is a year or two prior to when you want to do the project. Vanderhoef/...we are delaying a problem .... I really hate to see us wait longer .... Have more and more business owners disrupted four years from now ..... Kubby/I think it should be sped up. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 37 Norton/ O'Donnell/I don't think this should be moved up. Kubby/ Davidson/When we went through the alternatives with you, we indicated that it really is a very legitimate political decision for you guys to decide how bad the problem is .... It is something that you have to decide how critical it is .... Accident rate... We would like to do that... impact the property owners .... Dual left turn lane... median... Working with the property owners to get a solution .... Kubby/The longer we wait, the more property owners that are going to be affected by that ..... O'Donnell/How to you figure that more property owners are going to be affected? There aren't going to be any new buildings ..... The area, we can't grow. It is full now. Norton/ Kubby/I am talking south of 6 .... Lot of land to be developed there .... Thornberry/How far south of 6 are we talking about7 Davidson/The study went down to Stevens .... median... about down to the Aldi driveway .... Thornberry/How wide does a median need to be? Davidson/ Fosse/Has to do with driver's expectations and be able to see something .... It has to be substantial enough .... Thomberry/...temporary things .... Norton/ Davidson/That is something that we really define... at the time we design the project exactly. What we got now is a concept plan .... Norton/ This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 38 Thornberry/ .... We are talking about taking a lot of Gasby's land .... Do that narrower .... I still want to have cuts in there .... I think it only needs to be back to the noah as far as past the intersection of Highland .... Gaps .... Lehman/Don't gaps defeat the whole idea of medians? Kubby/ Atkins/I think if you are going to design it, we ought to get some maps out here .... Norton/Some of us are saying it ought to be moved up .... Atkins/Maybe there is a project that is acceptable to all of you .... O 'Donnell/ Thornberry/ Norton/We are trying to do something more modest that what has been proposed to us .... Lehman/Are there folks who want to move it sooner than 2004? I see three .... For the time being, are we happy with leaving it in 2004? We got three .... Arkins/Ernie, it is getting close to 10:00 ....We can bring this back .... Kubby/ Arkins/Leave it in 2004. I am also hearing that there is some general acceptance that there may be some improvements that we can do .... We need to bring it in and show it to you. Lehman/Capital is done... Fosse/We do have the EPA final report now on Burlington Street bridge .... (All talking). This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 39 North End Parking 98-122 S2 Fowler/It is a subject that we have discussed several times with council .... What we are talking about now would be the area west ofDubuque... North Clinton Street and then Davenport and Fairchild, Bloomington streets. A recent development... contacted today by the University of Iowa and they have expressed an interest in having parking meters put on Noah Clinton Street .... Expanded all the way to Church .... Lack of short term parking in the immediate area around the dorms .... What we had in the past... were two hour term limits. The University would like to see short term meters in that area .... Part of what compound this problem .... Meters... Jefferson Street... block of North Clinton... are ten hours in time length... Kubby/There are people who are parking there long term .... Where will they go? .... Fowler/The immediate area .... Talking about ten hour meters would be the block of Noah Clinton by Papa John's .... Ten hour meters along Jefferson Street .... Down to Gilbea .... Vanderhoef/Show us where the ten hour ones are? Fowler/(Refers to map). (All talking). Davidson/We know that some of them will go into the Northside Neighborhood .... CHANGE TAPE TO REEL 98-123 SIDE 1 Norton/ Fowler/The shorter term 30 minute, 1 hour, 2 hour mixture would be up in the northern part next to the dorms ..... They wouldn't want a long term meter that would become all day parking in that area. When I talked with the University today, what I suggested to them that the city and the University work together on a proposal for putting meters in that area and then bring that back to you... time limits on it... Basically trying to serve their buildings and if we work together... meets the needs of both. Vanderhoef/I would like to see some two hour meters moved down there... all the way down on Clinton instead often hour... What are you suggesting then on Fairchild and Davenport and Bloomington .... Side streets that head into the dorms. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 40 Fowler/If they are metered at all, I would probably recommend a shoa term meter, not an all day meter .... If you choose not to meter them, they would stay at the altemate day parking as they are now. Kubby/I don't think we should meter those... older properties .... Don't have enough off street parking... O'Donnell/We are a kind of justifying the need for the new parking ramp. Thornberry/Heard some stories of people parking on the noah side and on the west side... bike rack on the back of their car .... Park in the no metered area .... And bike in .... How many requests do you have for parking in the ramps that you have not been able to- Fowler/The last count I have is about 180 on the waiting list .... Thomberry/ Vanderhoef/Joe, I am curious... University policy... the commuter lots at Hancher, is that available to both faculty and to students? .... What is the cost? Fowler/The last I knew I think the cost was $7.00 .... out of town commuters .... On Noah Clinton Street there may be a lot of student storage of vehicles... by dorm residents... Adequate storage... mostly at Hawkeye .... Vehicles... moved... out to Hawkeye storage lots .... O'Donnell/How is the parking up there? Fowler/In the noah end, the closer you are to campus, the more congested it is .... Full... quite a bit of cars on the wrong side of the street even. Noaon/ .... Your plans are to go to them and develop some kind of plan .... Two elements... shorter some time limits and add some meters. Fowler/ Right. .. it would be with the University Administration ....Dorm Services, Parking, Facility Services and Public Safety. Lehman/When would they like to see this done? Fowler/The sooner the better ....Getting a lot of abuse in that service drive... making it hard for deliveries... Lehman/Is holiday break time too late? This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 41 Fowler/No. Lehman/Suggest... we get a map indicating where we are going to add meters and the length and time of those meters... along with .... Showing which street to have meters, how long the meters are, where we intend to add meters and the length of time of those meters .... The way it is now and what you are proposing .... I do think we need to work at it .... Norton/We are shortening time and adding meters .... Vanderhoef/...combination with the University .... Lehman/...put it on paper... Davidson/So you are going to have another discussion of this, Emie? .... Champion/Put it on the Consent Calendar. Lehman/...if we have a problem with it, we can certainly bring it to your attention .... Kubby/Give the dorm residents some forewarning .... Some prenotification so they know to get a permit to be at the Hawkeye lot .... Time to deal with that .... Vanderhoef/They can do that when they register. Fowler/Dorm Services is part of the group from the University that is making this request. They can coordinate with their resident advisors .... Kubby/... in time for them to act on it. Norton/ .... Student Senate... make sure somebody does .... Joe... what is the parking demand... utilization of parking structures downtown? .... Can you get those. Fowler/Year to date we are about 9% below. Norton/They want to know since September 1st. Fowler/Since September 1 it is probably less than 9 below. We were a little bit off in July and August. When Coral Ridge opened we had kind of a drop but year to date we have recovered enough. Our on-street meters are at 100% of what they were a year ago. Norton/Some facts of that kind would be very reassuring to certain business persons. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 42 O'Donnell/Are we not up in two parking ramps? Fowler/No, I think Chauncey Swan is up .... In permits and usage. Capital Street is down just a little bit and Dubuque Street is down just a little bit. Lehman/Okay .... Kubby/ Fowler/Both of them are off just about 9% .... One of the things that we have noticed this year .... Football Saturdays .... Haven't been full .... We have been off. Lehman/Thank you, Joe .... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 43 Appointments 989-123 S1 Board of Adjustment: Readvertise Board of Appeals: Anna Buss-public; Readvertise-mechanic Human Rights Commission: Mary Larew; Janice Simmons-Weibum; Jane Holland Parks and Recreation: Rex Pmess; Judith Klink; Craig Gustaveson Planning and Zoning Commission: Marilyn Schintler Public Art Committee: Deborah Galbraith Riverfront and Natural Areas Commission: Jeff Gillitzer; Readvertise Senior Center Commission: Jay Honohan; William Kelly This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 44 Council Time 98-123 S1 Kubby/For this November 9 thing about the disorderly house amendment, the City Attorney suggested that she would feel most comfortable if there was a majority of council that directed her or ask to be to at this. I thought it was really important to have someone from the City Attorney's office there to explain what this amendment will do and what they don't do .... Captain Harney and Captain Witmet would both like to be there. Champion/I think that is a real intrusion of her time. Karr/...talked about November 9 but we haven't finned it up. It is a work session November 97 Is there more than four of you going? (All talking). Kubby/It is an off week and I am talking about the November 9 meeting with Student Senate Forum on the Disorderly House Amendment ..... Vanderhoef/Are they expecting the whole council7 Kubby/ ....I don't know what their expectations for format or who else would be there .... I thought it would be a good idea to have someone from the attomey's office there .... O'Donnell/We are going to have the police there .... Norton/ Thornberry/...you can ask all the students... I am satisfied .... Champion/...I also think we already had a public presentation by our attorney on what this ordinance does... imposition on her time to go to this meeting .... Lehman/How many of us will be at that meeting on the 9tn? Champion/I would like to go. Lehman/ .... I said I would be more than happy .... Norton/We have a memo from the attomey... Kubby/You don't have four votes directing you to come. Thornberry/ ....I will be out of town. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 45 Lehman/Eleanor, you are welcome to attend. O'Donnell/But it is not necessary. Norton/I think it would be wise. Karr/Are we going to post this as a work session? Lehman/I am going to be there... there is going to be four of us there at least. Karr/Where is there? Kubby/I don't know the location. Karr/I reserved here not knowing. Kubby/I think we should go to them. Karr/I will need to know where. Lehman/As soon as I know .... Champion/ O'Donnell/Downtown the benches are being tom up by these skateboarders .... I am going to suggest that we put an ann rest on the center of each bench .... To stop the skateboards. Lehman/I think that is probably a hell of a good idea. Those things have got black marks from one end to the other ....They are new .... We can't have skateboarders going up and down those benches. O'Donnell/A simple arm rest in the center of the bench will eliminate that action. Norton/ O'Donnell/I will bring it up tomorrow night. Karr/Two issues .... Your holiday schedule as soon as you know of any absences. Secondly, you will probably want to think fairly soon about setting aside some time for budget. Lehman/We will talk about that tomorrow night. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298 November 2, 1998 Council Work Session Page 46 Kubby/What about the Fringe Area discussion? Karr/The Fringe Area discussion on November 16 .... They wanted about 1 - 11/2 hour ....16th or 17th? Vanderhoef/16th iS my choice. Lehman/All right. Karr/16th at 5:00? Lehman/Are you going to bring a box lunch? Karr/ Lehman/Let's go from 5:00 to 6:00, break off and come back at 7:00 PM. Kubby/5:00 to 6:00 and take a ½ hour break. Karr/ Lehman/ .... I don't think we are going to get out to eat .... Karr/5:00 to 6:00 on the 16th. Champion/Don't forget to feed me. Adjoumed: 10:40 PM This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council meeting of November 2, 1998 WSl10298