HomeMy WebLinkAbout1999-06-15 Transcription# 1 a Page 1
ITEM NO. la. Proclamations. - Home Ownership Week - June 5-12.
Emie Lehman/(Reads proclamation) Now, therefore I, Ernest W. Lehman, Mayor of
Iowa City, Iowa do hereby proclaim June 5-12, 1999 as Home Ownership Week
in Iowa City and ask all citizens to observe this week with appropriate ceremonies
and activities to celebrate home ownership as the American dream.
Marian Karr/Here to accept is Larry Schnittjer.
Larry Schnittj er/On behalf of the Home Builders Association of Iowa City I'm proud to
accept this proclamation and for the information to the public the home, the
Parade of Homes is this weekend, I need to double check that, seen all the
information on it. And the Home builders in Iowa City is one of the largest small
industries in the Iowa City area.
Kubby/Larry do you know what the range, the price range of homes on the parade of
homes, is there a variety or are they kind of a show home?
Schnittj er/I, there's some variety but I'm not real well informed on that, I'm not a
member of the parade of homes committee.
Kubby/OK, thank you.
Lehman/Thanks Larry. You know back in the early 70' s I was on the Planning &
Zoning Commission, and Larry was laying out subdivisions and helping in Home
Builders for a lot of years and he's still down here at council meetings and
certainly have been very very involved. Next item is a special presentation.
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ITEM lb. Proclamations.
Lehman/John F. Else President of the Institute for Social and Economic Development
1901 Broadway, Suite 313, Iowa City. John Else, Ph.D. is from Brandeis
University founded the Institute for Social and Economic Development in 1987
who helped low income and unemployed Iowa residents become economically
self-sufficient through self-employment. The ISED has assisted more than 1,200
businesses to start to expand. Has helped them to obtain 6 million in business
financing of the businesses ISED has assisted since it's inception 63 percent are
still in operation. At a White House ceremony in February 1999, President
Clinton awarded ISED the Presidential Award for Excellence in micro-enterprise
development in poverty alleviation. John was on the faculty of the University of
Iowa from 1976 through 1989 and on the staff of the National Association of non-
governmental organizations in Harare, Zimbabwe from 1985 through 1987.
Karr/Here to accept is John Else. And also Jim Thompson who is regional director of
SBA.
Lehman/I'll read what it said. This is a Small Business Administration 1999 Iowa
Welfare to Work Advocate of the Year presented to John Else presented by the
US Small Business Administration.
John Else/Thank you. All I can tell you is that this is really an award for a large group of
people who've done tremendous work with people throughout our state and here
in Johnson County and I want to express my appreciation to them and to all the
people of Johnson County who have made this a welcome place for the institute to
grow. Thank you.
Champion/Thank you.
Lehman/Thank you.
Kubby/It's really sad that we don't have John Else as a citizen of Iowa City anymore,
we're very proud to have you in our community.
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ITEM NO. 3. PUBLIC HEARING ON PROPOSED ROUTE CHANGES FOR
IOWA CITY TRANSIT.
Lehman/Item number 3 is a public hearing on proposed route changes for Iowa City
transit, we're doing this a little out of order from our custom meeting so the folks
who ride the bus will be able to attend this public hearing. I declare the public
hearing reopened and I would like Joe Fowler to explain some of the changes that
have occurred since the last public discussion which may answer a lot of the
questions to the folks in the audience so, Joe if you would bring us up to date as to
what you presented to us last night.
Joe Fowler/OK. This is a result of a long process that we've been through, starting with
the directive from council to look at the routes, meeting with drivers, holding
public input sessions, drawing the initial maps, holding more public input
sessions, presentations to council and then public hearings. And as a result of
those we've gone back and we've looked at the routes that were drawn up and
presented to council initially and we've made some changes that we wanted to
recommend at this time. And I'll just go through a brief summary of these, we
don't have a detailed maps drawn because we haven't really received an OK to go
ahead and do this. We get the detailed, or the deal OK and we'll go ahead and get
the detailed maps prepared. On the east side routes in Iowa City which is
basically the Rochester, Court Hill, Towncrest, 7th Avenue. The only change that
we propose would be to change the 7th Avenue route to the new proposed route
which would extend it out to First Avenue up by the HyVee and then bring it back
in on D Street. And the other routes would remain the same.
Norton/I want to make sure you mean change it from the present situation.
Fowler/From the present system, from the present system yes. Cause they go through
these changes would be from the present system not from the proposed. On the
north side which would be the Noah Dodge route and the Manville route. We
would propose extending the Noah Dodge route to NCS and continuing to do the
Kimball-Caroline loop on the way back into town. The bus would not pull into
HyVee but would stop on the highway, we would put a shelter out there on the
highway and put a pad to get a more accessible stop than we currently have. It
would not go down Church Street to Gilbert, we feel that area is covered by the
shuttle bus. So the bus would continue down until it came to Market and then
take Market back into town. The Manville would remain as it currently is except
for the change of going up o Ferson and coming in on Ferson instead of going
Riverside and turning by the church and coming in that way so it's a change of
one block over to get a through street and that's because of the congestion from
the soccer fields, band practices and church services so we're just trying to avoid a
little bit of congestion in that area. On the south side which would be the
Broadway, the Lakeside and the mall routes. The mall route would remain the
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same, the Lakeside would remain the same, outbound as it currently is. The
inbound route would go down Bums which we cover an area that's currently
covered by the Broadway that we would recommend changing. So that would be
basically the same route except for in route on Bums for a couple blocks and then
it would join back to the current route. The Broadway we would recommend
taking it down Gilbert Street, tuming it on Southgate and then taking it over to the
Broadway area and this would return service back to all the grocery store, Hilltop
Trailer Court, MECCA, some areas that lost service will be rerouted to Lakeside
earlier. Then that bus would come inbound on Highland and would take Highland
all the way to Gilbert and then back downtown on Gilbert Street, yea on Gilbert
Street excuse me. On the west side we're proposed changing the Westwinds to
the new route that was in the packet, it would go straight out Melrose and then go
into Pheasant Ridge, the main advantage we see of this when the bus leaves
Pheasant Ridge it makes a right turn onto Mormon Trek rather than trying to
make a left tum across four lanes right over the crest of a hill. The bus would not
serve Emerald Street, it would go on Westgate, it would still do the Denbigh area
and all the areas that are currently covered by the bus other than Emerald Street.
The night Westwinds we would propose changing to the proposed route because
the way it's currently run it goes through the Denbigh area then it takes Benton
Street to Mormon Trek, Mormon Trek out to West High Drive and then West
High Drive back Mormon or back from West High to Mormon Trek to Pheasant
Ridge instead of going to backtracking we would propose that it go out Sunset to
the highway and take the highway up to West side and then run the same route it
does now inbound. We think that would same some time for the drivers on that
route. And then we would propose the addition of the West side loop bus for
West High students, this would cover the residential area along Rohret Road and
also cover part of the area that's covered by the Plaen View now. This bus would
make one trip in the moming before school and one trip in the aftemoon after
school. This would add service and to do that we have to cut somewhere. Our
proposal would be to cut the morning Saturday from a start time of approximately
6:00 AM to a start time of approximately 7:00 AM. Those hours of service would
then be put onto the west side loop and then in the afternoon the mall route
instead of starting half hour service at 3:00 we'd recommend starting it at 4:00
and that first split bus that would be on the mall route would take the West High
students home. The other thing that we'd like to do would be it will take us a
couple weeks to put this together look at the arrival and departure times
downtown, we would like to have the buses as many as possible, we can't get all
of them as many as possible come in before 8:00 9:00 so they line up on the start
time rather than arrive at 8:00 so it's difficult to get to a job. Then at one point
during the day we'd like to let the buses sit for 10 minutes or so move it back so
that their leaving right after 5:00 4:00 so that we're leaving at 5 and 10 after the
hour so it's easier to get home. We think that that would encourage rider ship
because your able to get to your job by the start time and you can stay until the
end of the day.
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Lehman/Thank you. Joe there's one other item that you and I visited about briefly, I
think you probably should address at least for the public's benefit as well. I think
council probably understands that there has been some comment about the shuttle
bus and I think I would like for you to explain the value that you feel it is to the
city and to the bus system.
Fowler/The purpose of the shuttle bus when we initially put it in was to cut down the
number of cars that were being driven into the central business district. And
survey's that we've taken show between 22 and 25 percent of the people even
though they live close to downtown would drive a car downtown if the shuttle bus
wasn't available and that bus this year will carry 190,000 riders. So we're
keeping a lot of cars out of the central business district and especially at a time
when we're coming up to construction in the downtown we need to encourage
those cars to stay out the central business district and people close by to be taking
the bus.
Norton/Joe do you want to comment on that one point we talked about I think last night
about investigating exact situation of those people who do use the bus at 6:00 AM
or between 6:00 and 7:00 on Saturday to see what we can figure out.
Fowler/We have seen that there's one route in particular that has heavy rider ship at that
time of day, heavy heaviest, it's maybe 6 people a trip and that's the Lakeside bus
and we'll be looking at that and the other routes, trying to see if there's
alternatives to getting people to work that time of day.
Lehman/I think to the benefit of the public this public hearing will be continued to the
291h so that we will have an opportunity to visit with the folks who do ride that
bus at 7:00 in the morning and perhaps a little more input so, Joe I'd like for you
to stay handy because if there are questions as we go through the hearing I think
that basically there have been significant changes than what was proposed two
weeks ago and many many of those questions that were proposed to us two weeks
ago have been addressed by the changes that your proposing right now so if you
would just stay handy we'd be happy to answer whatever questions we can so the
public hearing is open.
Irene E. Murphy/My name is Irene Murphy. I've jotted down some notes I'll try to read
them as quickly as possible. I'm not as prepared as I had hoped to be and after
spending over a good hour at the Iowa City Public Library hunting up the report
of the November 4 initial meeting to solicit input from riders about route changes
the Iowa City Transit it puts a whole new perspective on one (can't hear). This is
my fourth attempt to reiterate my opinion to let it be, let it be. The last time I was
here I had commented on the skateboard park at Terrell Mill, Mr. Thornberry said
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it wasn't settled on the location at that time but last week an article in the Press
Citizen gives the impression that it is going ahead. Which raises suspension that
insures us that it wasn't already a done deal pertaining to the proposed route
changes might not have been valid. That would be served by the Manville
Heights route where what are the hours it will be available for you between 6:00
and 9:00 and 3:00 and 6:30 PM. I'd like more information about where the free
shuttle bus is shown in the 1999-2000 physical year budget, it was news to me
that transit changes were going to be contingent upon passage of the local option
tax. Were you counting your chickens before they were hatched? Would the
cutback on the routes that would only provide service during peak hours there
would be no use for someone who some who are issued a disabled pass free. I
have one (can't hear) pass issued 2/7/98 expiration date 3/1/2000, I have a
daughter who has a disabled pass at age 47, not in the (can't hear). She has been
supplied with one of the new magnetic passes already so far I have not received
one that I could take advantage of during those hours. Between the two of us I
accumulate a bus 'n shop pass mostly through purchase of medicine and every
third or fourth month I can get by by not buying a regular monthly pass to use the
the (can't hear) van to save non-peak hours and happen to have a regular pass for
the regular hours and it is my future to in be in vision as a hermit and becoming a
couch potato.
Lehman/Irene I think if you heard Joe what Joe just told us that we're not changing the
route. That' s the proposal is not to change your route.
Murphy/I didn't know whether he had mentioned anything about.
Lehman/But that he did say that tonight and so the proposal is not to change that rotue.
Champion/You won.
Joe Kendell/Hi my name is Joe Kendell, I'm owner of A & A Towing and J & J Towing
and I'd like to bring up a proposal for the rotation of the city towing contract.
Lehman/I'm sorry this is a public hearing on the buses only.
Kendell/On the buses only OK.
Lehman/We will have an opportunity as soon as the hearing is over there will be public
discussion.
Kendell/OK.
Lehman/This is a public hearing on the proposed changes to the bus system anyone who
would like to speak to that please come forward.
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Terri Byers/Hi I'm Terri Byers and I live on Nevada Avenue in Iowa City. It sounds
great but I want to see something before I comment publicly about it. I'm glad
that transit has been able to find a way to meet all of our needs and our wishes,
there are some other things that I would think that we need to discuss. I don't
think the downtown shuttle should be off the table of discussion, I would like to
see a .25 cent charge to ride the downtown shuttle. I would like to have that in
some form of ongoing discussion. That's one of the things I want to talk about
tonight is some form so that when we're on the bus we're not hit with a new map
with a change of our route. We need to have a citizen input into transit and I've
found from talking to a number of you and talking to a lot of the people out here
and our bus drivers and transit people everybody's cooperative with one another
but we seem to be talking in our own little groups and we haven't really gotten
together as a big group and a public hearing such as this is good but an informal
semiformal kind of meeting such as a commission or a board that a public input
into transit changes and I think it's going to be vital in the next century that public
transit is either going to be something that we keep we build on, we cherish or it's
going to be something we just cut off at the knees and say good-bye we can't
afford it it's really a drain on our system and I think if we can work together we
see there's an interest by the citizens in Iowa City and of interest by transit to do
the best thing. I've never in one of the nameless editorials by one of our local
newspapers we didn't attack the transit system when we came here, we weren't
attacking the transit system in fact they've bent over backwards to call us at home
to find where we work to get a hold of us, send us letters, I've had nothing but
positive relations with transit and I think if we can keep this up we can have a
better transit system for everybody and so we don't see empty buses riding around
the streets of Iowa City at night but we see people in the buses and I think we can
all work together and form that. And so my proposal is some form of committee
or group that would get together twice a year about transit issues with public
input, with the transit system, with city people so that we can set up a system that
would work and be effective. That's all I wanted to say.
Lehman/Thank you.
Loft Bears/My name is Loft, I live at Bon-Aire I also with agree I also agree with Terri
Byers about having a citizens committee and I'm looking, I apologize for looking
at Steve Atkins but I asked, I want to ask him how supportive would you be in
having a transit committee we're almost getting into a new century I think it is
time that we put our money down and look at what the services are and for transit,
it's a vital service for me and many self advocates.
Lehman/Loft, I think that really is a question that the council would address. I Steve
obviously if we felt that was an important committee Steve would certainly do
that but that's something I think the council would need to address.
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Jamie Jeppson/OK my name is Jamie Jeppson and I guess I was just asking a while I
heard that they were going to combine the Rochester and Court Hill route and I
don't know are they going to continue to do that?
Kubby/Well part of the change is to keep it as is.
Jeppson/Even that all that. But I also wanted to make a comment on how the transit
system it doesn't run very late. The Court Hill bus the last bus is at a quarter to
nine, but it's really hard for me because I'm a university student and I take
evening classes and a lot of the classes don't end until 9:00 or 9:30. And then
there's also a lot of stores that don't close until 10:00 so it's really inconvenient
there's no way to get home because I live on the far east side of Iowa City almost
out to Scott Boulevard so.
Lehman/What stores are open after 9:00?
Jeppson/A lot of the stores downtown at the mall.
Lehman/The mall closes at 9:00 at night.
Jeppson/Oh, well we I work at the Coral Ridge Mall and there's places down there that
close at 10:00 but we like Sears that's where I work we close at 9:00 but I have to
catch the Coralville transit and then by the time I get downtown I have no way of
catching an Iowa City bus so somebody has to come and get me and that's really
inconvenient and I think it would be very useful if they would consider going later
into the evening for people so that's it.
Kubby/Thanks.
Mike O'Donnell/Have we done any study on the ridership after 9:007
Lehman/Joe you'll have to answer that at the mic.
Fowler/We have the numbers I don't have them with me Mike but the routes that are
rtmning pretty heavy probably 20 people a trip.
Kubby/That was part of our latest transit cuts was cutting off that last hour of transit?
Fowler/Yes.
Kubby/System wise.
Lehman/Are there others who would like to speak to this before we continue it?
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Joe Daringer/My name is Joe Daringer and I live at Lakeside Manor. What they
proposed this latest proposal was very good and I'm very happy with it. There
was some talk of at the last time they were going to do something with the college
students picking them up and taking them out to HyVee, Kinart, Walmart and I
didn't hear anything.
Champion/We did talk about that, Joe talked about a business shuttle that would,
whatever happened to that discussion?
Daringer/I'm not a college student but.
Champion/Well you could be.
Lehman/Joe will answer that for us.
Fowler/No we had some shopper routes in our proposal which would circulate among
densely populated neighbors and go to the shopping areas, that's dropped, it's not
possible to do without cutting service in another area.
Lehman/OK.
Daringer/Well what I'm trying to say is I think we should have some kind of incentive
for people to ride the transit system and I really don't know what it is.
Thornberry/Well said.
Champion/When you find out let us know.
Kubby/The incentive is frequent service and low fares.
Norton/Park and shop is an incentive.
Sam Brannian/Sam Brannian and I'm over at 1123 Denbigh. My question would be how
soon will these changes take affect and when will they have the routes, will there
be a time when the routes will be published and then voted on or are they going to
be fixed, is the council going to just put them out and this is the changes?
Lehman/Let Joe answer that I think he can probably tell you pretty accurately on that.
Fowler/If we have a consensus from council that they'd like us to proceed with these
recommendations we would have the maps prepared in a couple days, have them
on the buses, have them on public display and then the next council meeting we
would hope to get final action to either go ahead with these changes or go ahead
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with other changes. We're getting to a point where it's kind of critical because
we'd like to implement them by the beginning of the fall semester and we need to
get the maps published and the new schedules out and so our goal would be mid-
August late August to have the changes in place.
Kubby/Because we have to change all the signs where we have the maps at each stop for
the ones that do have changes we'll have to change those as well.
Fowler/Right we'll have to change those as well and we'll have to change some bus stop
signs not very many due to this proposal. Try and get some more shelters set up.
Lehman/Joe if this if we end the public heating two weeks from tonight this does not
require free readings as a regular motion ticket because it doesn't affect 20 percent
of the routes is that correct? But we decide to do this it does not require three
readings is that true?
Dilkes/It's not an ordinance so it's not a.
Fowler/Right.
Lehman/It would just be.
Fowler/Requirement is just to have a public hearing prior to the change if it's over.
Lehman/A simple approval.
Fowler/Right.
Lehman/So if we have the public include the public hearing two weeks from tonight
decide that your proposal is one that we can live with you then would start to
implement that and hopefully have it in place by the middle of August.
Fowler/Yes.
Lehman/OK.
Norton/But there will be no I want to make clear there won't be any other public vote on
it though we would just have to make that decision, council make that two weeks
from.
Lehman/From tonight.
Norton/From tonight presumably yea.
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Kubby/Unless their are other changes, once they are published and we have other input
there could be changes.
Norton/Yes. Yea but we'll make actions following that hearing next time yea.
O'Donnell/But I think Joe and his staff have done a tremendous job with this plan and
it's come a long way it's a tremendous plan Joe.
Fowler/Well there' s been a lot of people involved with this from the very beginning
there's been a lot of public input, there's been a lot of driver input, there's been a
lot of management input, this is not one person can't take the credit for this this is
something that I would have to say is community effort to get to this point.
Kubby/So can, I guess I want to try to cause it's hard with a narrative to understand the
whole system. It seems that we're not making very many changes at this point,
that we're tweaking some routes to try to make them a little more time efficient.
We're going to change some of the times that people end up arriving and leaving
from downtown and we're going to add the west side loop.
Fowler/Right and we're going to return service back to the Hilltop, Aldi foods, MECCA
area will extend, bus service out to NCS which not only affects NCS but that
whole commercial area out there the Seabury & Smith the ACT so we'll be given
more opportunities for people to get to work out there.
Kubby/OK so there's are the, are those the three increases in services NCS back to
Hilltop and the west side loop will stay?
Fowler/Yes, that's what we ended up for increases in services.
Kubby/OK and then the decrease in services would be that Saturday morning hour from
6-7 and what else?
Fowler/There are a couple Keokuk Street you know from Highland to Kirkwood there's
a couple block area there that the bus isn't going to go up anymore. There's a
small area on 7th area route that's going to be a block either way to get to a bus.
The Church Street area there will be there will be a couple block walk for people
who've had a bus in front of their bus now to get to a bus.
Kubby/OK that's helpful to me thank you.
Champion/You've done a terrific job.
Thornberry/One of the real neat points of this change Joe I think is that you mentioned
getting to the getting to the downtown area like quarter till 8:00 instead of 8:00 to
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get people to work on time and leaving at 5:15 or 5:20 whatever 5:10 5:15 so that
they don't have to leave work early, they can leave work at 5:00 and still make the
bus I think that you know that's a tweak that really makes a lot of sense.
Fowler/Yea, we won't be able to do that on every route we'll be close to every route and
we think that will make it a lot more attractive form of transportation.
Kubby/OK the thing that's going to be challenging for riders is when there's that shift in
the middle of the day you just can't remember oh quarter of and quarter after.
Which is really easy to know when to be at a certain comer to catch your bus or I
know when to be by the Walgreens to catch my bus and that's going to shift. I'll
have to remember four numbers instead of two.
Fowler/Well the way we had it, the way we had it.
Kubby/I mean well I mean it's.
Fowler/You had to remember the peak schedule, an off hours schedule, the night time
schedule and a Saturday schedule so it's an improvement, you only got to
remember two instead four. I mean one of the things one of the things that came
to us from drivers was that people need to know that they can get a bus and where
the bus is going to go and if the routes change midday, if the routes change at
night if the routes change on Saturday there's a question in their mind as to
whether or not if I get on this bus am I going to be able to get where I want to go.
And they thought it was very important to the transit riders to have a consistency
and that was one of the main reasons that we went back to this was so that we
could have consistency throughout the system as instead of many changes as we
had.
Kubby/That really works that way I agree.
Norton/Joe I have one more, are the Rohret Road people getting less than was in the
earlier than was proposed in the earlier draft of this?
Fowler/Yes in the earlier draft it was the West High loop bus and.
Norton/(can't hear).
Fowler/There was the tripper bus and there was also peak hour service moming and
afternoon.
Norton/So their now going to have to jump on the student bus and transfer to get into
town I take it in the morning?
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Fowler/Yes, they can take that bus and then transfer to another bus.
Kubby/Let's be clear it's not a student bus.
Norton/What?
Kubby/There is no student bus.
Norton/No, I understand that but I mean they get on the bus that's going to the high
school yea yea I understand.
Champion/The tripper.
Norton/The tripper's we call it yea.
Lehman/OK.
O'Donnell/Thank you Joe.
Paul Show/Paul Show I'm actually the vice president of the AFSCME local 183
employee's union also. I'd like to say that I'm very pleased with this new plan.
The only thing that jumps out at me is a possible problem for the drivers is the
North Dodge route which I had a brief discussion with Ron about, it appears to be
pretty tight on time, I'll continue to work with Ron and he has some ideas that
might help in that direction otherwise I'd like to say I think for the bus riding
public this is an excellent plan there's some good ideas and I'd like to thank the
council and the management for putting this forth.
Lehman/Thank you.
Champion/The idea with that route though was that we would try it for six months or a
year to see how the timing on it works cause that's the difficult part of it.
Show/The North Dodge route?
Champion/Yea. It may have to be looked at.
Show/
I mean you have to remember where I work now there' s bad weather, there are or
there are problems and or else it's going to be running behind I realize there is a
need to go out to the NCS area and I realize we want to continue to cover that
Crescent area I've even had a comments directed to me that it would be good to
go out to the NCS area and I know NCS is a is trying to partner with us city
transit. He showed me a letter. And it is a growing area for Iowa City I'm just
concerned about the workload on the employees the rest of the changes seem to
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be good, we're picking up some areas and we're not really cutting anyone out.
You know if it's important to go to this Rohret area you know and I don't I don't
know what the ridership will be out there if we just went out there on the rush
hours. You know the council might want to think about trying that as an
experiment you know for a I don't know 6 months to a year and actually you
know building up the transit system and adding to it rather than cutting back as
we've done over the past years. If this an area that management is important to go
to you know why don't we find a little extra money somewhere and run a bus out
there you know if the ridership isn't there in a year let's you know we can always
cut that back but I didn't want to see that (can't hear) at the expense of other areas
of the city and I'm glad we've changed the plan a little bit thank you.
Lehman/Is there a motion to continue the public hearing until the 291h?
Thomberry/So moved.
Vanderhoef/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Thornberry, seconded by Vanderhoef, all in favor, opposed. Motion
carries. I'm sorry.
Karr/Motion to accept correspondence.
Vanderhoef/So moved.
Kubby/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Vanderhoef, seconded by Kubby all in favor. Motion carries. Thank
you folks and we'll continue this and again I believe we will have it at the
beginning of the council meeting on the 291h.
Kubby/So to see the specifics people will be able to see it on the bus in a little while I
don't know how many days that in time for you to make comment to us in two
weeks and I assume at the Public Library they created some space for all the
routes and I assume that they will we will request that they do that.
Lehman/Very good, thank you.
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ITEM NO. 4. PUBLIC DISCUSSION (ITEMS NOT ON THE AGENDA).
Lehman/Item no. 4 is public discussion for items not listed on the agenda. If you'd like
to address council please come to the microphone, sign your name and limit your
comments to five minutes or less.
Lee McGovern/Good evening my name is Lee McGovem and I belong to the Senior
Center and it's my understanding that a skywalk has been proposed for the new
ramp. And I also understand that the city is looking into building a skywalk. I
understand that the ramp will now be designed with the skywalk as an option and
that once the bids come in the council will decide whether or not to include the
skywalk. I'd like to say that a lot of people at the Senior Center have approached
me about this, all naturally in favor of a ramp and to let you know that I'm
collecting a group of names which just started last week to show you the support
for a new ramp and to also ask you to please keep us informed as to how the
situation is going so that we will be informed and cooperate and try and do as
much as we can to aid you in the decision to build a new skywalk. Along that line
I'd like Bebe Ballantyne who is a commission member to follow-up on my
statement. Thank you.
Lehman/Before you, before she does I would like Dee Norton is on a chairman of a
committee that is working with the county and we're talking about a number of
issues relative to the Senior Center not to at least of which is the skywalk so if you
would tell us how.
Norton/Well I just want to say Counie and I and are working with Jonathan Jordahl and
Carol Thompson and the city attorney and the county attorney and Linda Kopping
from the center and Terri Miller from the commission are looking at a variety of
issues related to the Senior Center Activities and it's relation to the multipurpose
facility and it's relation to the possible skywalk or connection and in fact at our
next session we're focusing particularly on the details of that so that people
understand exactly the physical aspects that are possible there where and that
committee will be at some point I'm sure we'll make a recommendation back to
their respective agencies, us to the council and the county to the county. But
we're certainly well aware of that and the people as I say Linda and Terri are
there all the time so their perfectly aware. It gets down to as you can understand
to a matter of funds and that will be the issues that I'm sure a major consideration.
But everybody needs to understand exactly the connection possibilities.
McGovern/Right and we would just like to continue to be informed and to be able to put
any input along those lines that we can. And can I ask that Bebe Ballantyne
follow-up with my remarks?
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Bebe Ballantyne/Hello I appreciate the opportunity to just make a brief comment I was
thinking about the importance of the skywalk particularly to handicapped people.
We had been accustomed to having some spots in the present lot that are very near
the north entrance which is a slanted ramp that takes people who have ambulatory
difficulties rather easily into the center. There were two spots that were just fight
at the foot of that ramp and I'm aware of that at least two people often parked
there and were able to walk a very short distance to the base or the foot of that
ramp and get into the building. I am also very much aware that those two people
even in bad weather needed a little support if it was windy or they had something
to carry they needed some help so these people are not going to have a way into
the center that they can manage if they have to go from the exit the ambulatory
exit of the ramp around the front on Linn Street and back to that ramp, it's further
than they could walk. So I'm concerned that there be some people that might fall
through the cracks because I know that those people who fide SEATS will be able
to use the Washington Street entrance which is certainly handicapped accessible.
But this other one is a little different and you should maybe be aware that that is
one of the a small concern. Thank you.
Kubby/Dee I'm confused I thought that when we talked about the sidewalk before that it
was from some potential space in the new commercial area of the parking facility
for the Senior Center.
Norton/Yes, fight.
Kubby/That's still what we're talking about.
Norton/Yea, that's still, there's really only one realistic location as I understand it from
looking at the plans in some detail.
Kubby/But you would have to create some kind of hallway from the ramp facility to the
skywalk within that space.
Norton/Yes.
Kubby/If you were doing it without it being Senior Center space.
Norton/Yes, that's fight, there would have to be some kind of.
Kubby/So that conversation is what's taking place.
Norton/Yes. And we're trying to look at those details fight.
Kubby/OK.
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Thornberry/Just one question while were on that point if you wait just a second. What is
the price of that ramp?
Lehman/I don't think we know for sure?
Thornberry/Well there was a figure that we.
Atkins/The estimate is $250,000 construction, approximately $25,000 for architectural.
Thornberry/$275,000 dollars.
Atkins/Approximately.
Champion/And the problem is that's there no straight shot from the ramp to a floor in the
Senior Center, it's just not an easy thing to put in. Your going to have to have an
elevator midway isn't it?
Norton/For various reasons but you know the floor's in the parking structure is 7 or 8
feet I suppose and the one's in the Senior Center are 20 feet I mean things that
don't exactly coordinate so that adds to the difficulties but we'll certainly.
Lehman/These are things that your going to be discussing.
Norton/We'll have, we'll look at the options at best we can, so will the architect of
course but.
Bob Elliott/I was part of the huddled masses in the hall, is this the time when you talk
about things not on the agenda?
Lehman/You got it Bob.
Bob Elliott/I'll try to be as brief as possible I'll try to be as positive as possible. I simply
want to bring to your attention.
Lehman/Tell us who you are and where you live.
Bob Elliott/My name is Bob Elliott and I do live at 1108 Dover. I would hope that you
would reconsider the kinds of things that are happening on Highland Avenue and
College Street as a citizen, as a driver of those streets with great frequency. I can
see almost nothing to be gained from it and a myriad of items that are negative
from it financial, environment, safety anything you can name so I would ask that
you take a look at it, address it. I hope you will see that it is not a good idea. I do
applaud the city staff for being innovative. I think you have to be innovative, you
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have to try some things that don't work. I think this is one of those things that
didn't work. Thank you.
Champion/That was pretty positive actually.
O'Donnell/Better than I thought it would be.
(End of 99-66, Side 1)
Robea
Norris/My name is Robert Norris a Iowa City resident. And I just wanted to
follow-up on what Bebe Ballantyne said. I am physically handicapped and I've
found many times in bad weather in the parking lot trying to get into the building
is very wet at times. When it is snowy and icy I tremble. When the wind blows
exceptionally hard I have to move my front feet in the ground like a tree or I'll go
off and break another hip so I feel that the consideration should be made strongly
for the sky ramp for not only me but for a lot of the other people there that can
end up the way I did. And I'd appreciate your thoughts on that and your
cooperation. Thank you.
Lehman/Thank you.
Joe Kendall/Again here, my name is Joe Kendall from A & A Towing and J & J Towing
in Iowa City and Coralville. I'd like to bring up a proposal on the rotation of the
towing. You have a contract for three years with one specific company with
requirements of having a minimum of a certain amount of vehicles trucks, grain??
semis. It kind of leaves a lot of us, the rest of the people out that are doing the
towing in Iowa City area. Ifthere's a rotation basis with companies that have this
specific equipment just like one ton trucks they could rotate and there would be a
majority of more vehicles or tow trucks available at one time than a company
that's required just to have five and including a one-ton and a flatbed and a
medium duty can count as their five trucks. The contract maybe shouldn't go for
three years, maybe it should only go for a year. But the way Iowa City's growing
now a 20 minute for an ETA on a tow truck can take longer than that especially at
an accident. If there's more companies doing the rotation there's more trucks
available that could get their quicker than another company. Their subcontracting
right now that they can't even keep up with the calls that their doing. And I'd just
might be a consideration for a rotation basis in Iowa City.
Kubby/You know, I couldn't agree.
Lehman/I think.
Kubby/I couldn't agree more, I've been advocating this for years and that I know that we
have certain needs sometimes for bigger equipment that if a bus needs to be towed
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#4 Page 19
or a truck or a some big vehicle that you call the next person on the list that has
the appropriate tool for the job. And I think it would be a great thing for a lot of
small businesses in town and I think we should think about it.
O'Donnell/I agree.
Lehman/Well I'm sure we'll look into it.
Atkins/Well we're about to bid the contract so I think since a number of you were not
involved in some of the earlier debates on towing contract why don't I prepare a
summary memo pros and cons and get that to you and you can answer the
gentleman's question. And I can get that to you in a couple of weeks.
Lehman/OK.
Kubby/OK. Thanks for bringing that up again.
Anna Buss/Hi I'm Anna Buss 525 W. Benton Street and I just wanted to say that I agree
fully with gentleman who was here just a few minutes ago and talked about the
College Street and the Highland Avenue Street. I never knew what it was like to
be one of those little pin ball things in the pin ball game but I will tell you that in
my management business I it takes me over Highland Avenue quite often and I
don't know how I missed this going's on but apparently I did cause I haven't been
on that end of town for a little while but I have in testing it I decided well you
know the speed limit on that streets 25 mph and living on Benton Street you have
a tendency to be kind of dare devilish anyway so after I went on it with my small
mini van I decided that after being almost head on'd twice within a block that that
was maybe a little more than I cared to do so I went and got my motorcycle. And
I decided that I would try it on my motorcycle and that alone was a challenge as
well. Now I'm nearing 50 and I don't mind telling people that I've it's amazing
I've made it that far. The bottom line is I can't imagine with my good vision on a
day when I was coming the other direction having a problem. An elderly woman
who was ahead of me going down the street was having a big problem navigating
the street. I invite everybody who watches the city council proceedings to go out
and drive the street. I also invite everybody to go out and sit in the middle of the
planter is what I'll refer to it as on College Street where Summit intersects. Even
though the city has they meant well to slow the traffic but there is a sign up there
and it tells people how to go around it and it's not being adhered to at all and
people are coming from the different directions and it is really a hazard. I have
talked to a number of you and some of the city staff today and this last week and
everybody seems to recognize the fact that it didn't just quite turn out the way it
should. But maybe it would have been wise when somebody put in that first one
for maybe the second one to go out and take a look and see what had happened.
I'm not sure what the cost on this is and I'm sure that the we're all going to pay
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for that which is fine. Again I agree with the other gentleman that says yea you
have to try something sometimes to see if they work or if they don't work. And
I'm sure hoping that enough people have called you and talked to you about it. I
really don't think it's a very good idea and I really do think it's dangerous. I think
it's an accident waiting for a place to happen and I think when there's snow and
the weather and the minute it gets a little bit wet that there's going to be some
more problems and I'd hate to see that involve the city in another law suit of any
kind. I thank you for your consideration but I do invite everybody out there to go
drive Highland before they made smaller so you can all see just what it's like. It
was a good idea, it just didn't quite work out. There are a lot of other streets.
Maybe have the police sit there, maybe more stop signs, nobody likes stop signs
but I think there would maybe some other suggestions available. Thank you.
Champion/It's actually our campaign to get people to like stop signs.
O'Donnell/I take it it wasn't a very calming trip.
Lehman/Other public discussion.
Steven
Kanner/My name is Steven Kanner I live at 1111 E. Burlington in Iowa City and
I wanted to talk for just a moment about an organization in town but before I do
that as an assido??? I wanted to thank city council, I was looking at these banners
and wanted to thank city council for sponsoring these events. I think they really
add to Iowa City and really make it an even better place to live. The three events
up there, the farmer's market, the Friday night concert series, and the Summer
Saturday specials and in addition I want to thank you for supporting the Iowa Arts
Festival I think those make it really exciting to be in Iowa City for thank for your
support on that. And actually I want to ask for your support for another
organization, it's an organization that does millions of dollars of business in Iowa
City it employees scores of people in Iowa City, it attract thousands of people to
Iowa City from outside of Iowa City and is a property owner inside of Iowa City
and it's an organization that supports local nonprofit organizations throughout the
years. I'm talking about New Pioneer Cooperative, I'm a member of that and I'm
just curious is anyone up here a member of New Pioneer Coop? We've got three,
I think it's an organization that needs to be talked about within the halls of city
council to see how the City of Iowa City can support New Pioneer as much as
possible. Recently most of you have read about the debate that took place about
whether or not to expand into the City of Coralville. I took part in that debate as a
member and I was opposed to the process that took part there and perhaps the
final decision which was a 4-3 vote to expand into Coralville. And while we were
having that debate it was brought up what was done to ask Iowa City for support
and my understanding is that the general manager and a few of the board members
approached Karin Franklin to see what could be done. And I'd like the city
council to explore further what could be done to support New Pioneer Coop in
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Iowa City. I think it's an institution that's only positive for the city. There was
talk that perhaps Van Buren street would be closed off at Washington. There was
also talk that zoning does not allow New Pioneer Coop to expand in any
significant manner to the sides and that structurally it can't really expand upward.
So I would hope that city council would look at seeing if zoning could be changed
to allow expansion and keep this institution going in a positive fashion into the
21 st century and I was wondering if anyone has any comments fight now on it if
they.
Thornberry/I have a question.
Kanner/Sure.
Thornberry/I have shopped at the New Pioneer Coop and I thought it was a for-profit
grocery store?
Kanner/It is a for-profit grocery store in the state sense but there are no, well dividends
do return to members if there is any money left over for instance.
Thornberry/(Can't hear) I've shopped there and I've purchased items there, they've got
some good produce and they've got you know a lot of good stuff but it's a for-
profit grocery store.
Kanner/To answer your question I made $3.00 back in dividends as a member. I think in
essence it operates essentially like a nonprofit organization even though
technically it is a for-profit corporation. It's incorporated as a cooperative which
is different from strictly for-profit cooperation the state of Iowa.
Thornberry/Well it's not a nonprofit organization.
Champion/But that doesn't, even if it's for-profit or nonprofit we would look at zoning
changes to enhance a business.
Norton/Yea.
Kanner/Yea that's that's.
Norton/Look at it the same way we would other businesses.
Kanner/Well that's what I'm asking that like other businesses for-profit or nonprofit, the
City of Iowa City look into supporting something that is a positive thing for the
City of Iowa City that helps it move forward.
Thornberry/I support it, I like shopping there.
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O'Donnell/Well I think we'd have to see a plan.
Lehman/Well I think.
Kubby/Well to know that a JCCOG level we agreed to put that level we agreed to put
that item on a work plan to look at closing Van Buren and what are the pros and
cons of that. But that was approved with some of us that were up here at the
time.
Norton/But it would be like facilitating any business development or others we we like to
see those things happen. For example businesses want to be able to light trees in
front of their stores that we put in electrical outlets and we do a lot of things to try
to stimulate business or facilitate it and I think it would have to be fair to
everybody that's the only point people are trying to make it I don't think their
singled out in any way.
Kanner/And so just to hear you say it if New Pioneer Coop came forward with a plan
you would consider it I would imagine.
Lehman/As we would consider any (can't hear).
Kanner/In a positive way.
Kubby/Right. For example on our agenda tonight we're looking at changing the ability
to have drive through pharmacy in commercial neighborhood zones because a
specific business asked us to look at the whole code about that issue. But it was a
specific that we had to look at it because changing the zoning code wouldn't help
just one business or another but it would change it for anyone in that zone so we'd
have to look at it with that lens as we do are doing later tonight.
Lehman/Yea.
Kanner/Thanks for your time.
Lehman/OK. Thank you. Other public discussion.
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ITEM
NO. 5. PLANNING AND ZONING MATTERS.
b. PUBLIC HEARING ON AN ORDINANCE CONDITIONALLY
CHANGING THE ZONING DESIGNATION OF APPROXIMATELY 7.46
ACRES FROM MEDIUM DENSITY SINGLE-FAMILY RESIDENTIAL
(RS-8) TO PLANNED DEVELOPMENT HOUSING OVERLAY (OPDH-8)
AND THE APPROVAL OF A PRELIMINARY OPDH PLAN FOR 72
RESIDENTIAL DWELLING UNITS ON PROPERTY LOCATED AT THE
EAST TERMINUS OF COURT STREET. (REZ99-0006) (WINDSOR
RIDGE)
Lehman/Public hearing is open and I've asked Karin Franklin to kind of explain the
parameters of what it is that we're trying to do and a little history of this project so
Karin if you can make the electronics work.
Karin Franklin/That' s always the trick. OK first of all just to put this in a context this is
a property that was zoned or was annexed in 1993. It was then zoned in 1995 to
RS-8 and this is a project which is in the Windsor Ridge neighborhood. (Working
with Overhead). This is probably going to be more visible at home than here.
But basically this shows is where we're talking about in terms of the location of
the project, it is at the end of Court Street extended, the extension that we just did
Court Street east of Scott Boulevard. In 1995 there were four areas that were
rezoned from RS-5, the area under consideration, the RS-8 area, an area to the east
of there at the comer of what will be Court Street extended and Taft Avenue
which includes RS-8 which is a residential single-family of 8 dwelling units per
acres. C and One a neighborhood commercial zoning and RM-12 which is a
multifamily zoning at 12 units per acre. When those rezoning's went through
there was a stipulation that before they were developed it would require a planned
development and that's what we're looking at now with the RS-8 area which is at
the end of Court Street is the planned development. The RS-8 zoning is in place
so the density is established at 8 dwelling units per acre. The question now is
what plan would be approved for this particular property. What is proposed is a
series of four 18-plex condominium's and a community center. The issue with
the planned development is one of site plan, how the buildings are laid out, how it
interfaces with the existing development in the area, how the traffic circulation is
managed. The issues with this particular project in the Planning and Zoning
Commission which has recommended approval by a vote of 5-2 related primarily
to the extension of Arlington Street which is the North-South Street in Windsor
Ridge to Court Street and the height of the building. In the conditional zoning
agreement which is before you there is a requirement that Arlington be extended
prior to a building permit issued on the last building in this project, the last 18-
plex. The other issue which relates to the height of the structures that are
proposed there and I'll just show you an overhead of the front of the buildings.
Basically this is representative of each of the buildings, the facades are slightly
changed in terms of materials, the issue of the Planning and Zoning Commission
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#5 Page 24
and what resulted in two members voting in opposition to this was the height at
the back of the building. These buildings included parking inside the building as
opposed to a surface parking lot. Which results in the height of the building as we
measure it being 50 feet high. That is higher than the permissible 35 feet in the
RS-8 zone. With planned developments where we cluster the density into
different housing types than single family, that' s what a planned development is
about. With that we are able to vary certain requirements of the code, the height
of the building being one of those requirements. So in this recommendation to
you from the Planning & Zoning Commission it includes varying the height of the
buildings in this particular development from 35 feet to 50 feet. Now the concern
has been the mass of these buildings and what that height would what impact that
height would have on existing development in the area. Last night I showed you
an overhead which was illegible and so to correct on a screen which is not big
enough, what this is showing you at the bottom is the elevation of Court Street
which is that 744.7. As you proceed south the different demarcations the 731.1 is
approximately where the back of the building would be. And then as you proceed
to the creek it's 724.9 you see the topography goes down, we're going from Court
Street down to the stream and then back up the hill of what will be the hill up to
the connection with the present Arlington. It then proceeds up to 727.3 and that
would be the rare lot lines of what will be the closest single family whenever that
is built there. Did that make sense? OK. OK then we get on up to the second
well the most southerly street before you hit the top of the hill of where Arlington
is now. And there your at 760.7 this is to give you an idea of how the topography
relates to the building height and where the buildings are going to placed so that
you can make a judgment about that mass issue yourself. The last thing that I
would like to say is I want to correct a statement that I made last night which
when I was relating to you the process of this in the Planning & Zoning
Commission I had said that the Windsor Ridge Neighborhood Association had
sent a letter supporting this particular project. That was incorrect, there was not a
letter from the neighborhood association, one of the officers of the association
supported the project but it was not on behalf of the association so I wanted to
correct that tonight. Thanks are there any questions for me?
Norton/Karin is I drove that pretty carefully and tried to conceptualize the building there
and found it very difficult and I wonder and then I find this one equally difficult
to get a handle on and because they are pretty good size structures admittedly now
there, and I've looked at those distances and presumed the things that are far away
are smaller so I understand all that but I still wonder if there isn't any way to have
a computerized situation where you put that structure on that hill and look at it
from south which is down and see what it looks like it from various distances
down south of Court Street. Cause your looking up hill kind of there.
Franklin/Does that technology exist? Yes it exists. Do we have it, no we don't.
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Norton/Oh. Oh.
Franklin/We don't have it in the city. There's one engineering firm that I'm aware of in
Iowa City that has that technology.
Norton/But when we were considering medians in Burlington Street remember when we
had pictures suddenly.
Franklin/That was done by.
Norton/We had a visual that shows us exactly what it might look like. I see.
Franklin/Right, that was done by and I always get them mixed up with the sanitation,
NNW Enterprise.
Norton/I must say it would be nice just to have technology because in these cases where
we're making judgments about the visual impact basically we're talking about.
Franklin/Well I certainly would support your funding that technology.
O'Donnell/Karin.
Franklin/Yes.
O'Donnell/Would you say that this project falls within the realm of the comprehensive
plan?
Franklin/Yes.
O'Donnell/And would you say it falls within the realm of the Northeast District Plan that
we're working on now?
Franklin/Yes it does. The principle of the comp. plan and the Northeast District Plan to
build neighborhoods that have a diversity of housing within the neighborhood
along arterial streets and around commercial centers. This project follows those
principles and in fact I believe is the reason that we supported the extension of
Court Street to the Windsor Ridge development as a public project.
Champion/When you had a drawing last night that had roof lines what happened to that?
I was going to ask you about.
Franklin/That had roof lines on it, that may have just been a different elevation Connie.
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#5 Page 26
Champion/It kind of showed, it showed where the roof line would kind of hit the horizon
as the elevation rose, it was just a simple drawing. I mean I thought that's what it
was but maybe I'm wrong.
Franklin/That one. No.
O'Donnell/Different face (can't hear).
Franklin/That's not it is it where.
Atkins/Yes.
Champion/Yes.
Franklin/Is that what you mean? Oh.
Champion/But.
Franklin/OK what is it that your?
Champion/Well can you move it down a little bit?
Franklin/Yep. What are we looking for Connie?
Champion/Well I thought there were but maybe it was just (can't hear). It just dawned
on me last night and then I got sidetracked I never got to ask you about it. But I
thought it showed roof lines. I thought it where the roof line would jet out on the
horizon just some simple little graph considered to the houses that were around it.
Franklin/Just a second.
O'Donnell/Isn't that the front of the building?
Champion/No.
O'Donnell/What she's talking about is.
Champion/Well I might be thinking.
Larry Schnittjer/(can't hear).
Franklin/Oh OK. This does.
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#5 Page 27
Champion/Right. I got side tracked and I couldn't ask you about it, that's what it looks
like to me but I couldn't.
Franklin/I apologize. Here's the apartment building with the roof line of the apartment
building.
Champion/Right.
Franklin/And these are the houses that would be in the development as that proceeds and
then this is the roof line of a house which would be on the street here. So these
are comparable to what you would see on these very streets.
Champion/I (can't hear) on it I don't know why.
Franklin/And this is the apartment building.
Lehman/So you'd catch just the top of the roof line of the apartment building.
Franklin/So these houses that are in the low part, the lowest part of the single-family
portion of Windsor Ridge would be below the roof line of the 18-plex OK. This
house which is starting to go up the hill on Arlington extended that roof line
would be above the roof line of the 18-plex so as you get up into the houses that
already exist they would definitely be above the 18-plex.
Thornberry/Oh those peaks on the left there, their not even built yet.
Franklin/No, no.
Champion/No, none of them, none of them?
Franklin/No.
Vanderhoef/So there are some of those houses that are even more than this is a 3-story
building plus a high roof plus that basement so their still almost like the fifth story
than.
Champion/No it depends on where they sit on the.
Vanderhoef/The closest one's though are that much lower than the building foundation.
Franklin/This is the roof line of the closest single-family, this is the roof line of the 18-
plex.
Vanderhoef/The roof line.
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Franklin/The roof line.
Vanderhoef/OK.
Franklin/There's approximately 370 feet between.
Vanderhoef/Between.
Franklin/That building and the lot line for this building which is a little bit more than a
city block.
Vanderhoef/So those houses have moved up the hill considerably from where the
foundation is of the multi family building?
Franklin/Yea.
Norton/Yea.
Vanderhoef/OK, got it. Thank you.
Lehman/Karin I have just a couple questions before we start taking public input. I guess
I need to know exactly what we're talking about. It's this proposal is consistent
with the zoning that was done in 1995 is that correct?
Franklin/That's right.
Lehman/Is the decision that the council that is to be making, it is not one of zoning as
much as it one of the?
Franklin/The planned development.
Lehman/The planned, in other words.
Franklin/The planned development is what your judging. The process is like rezoning.
Lehman/That's correct well I guess what I'm trying to understand is, if we choose not to
approve this it can still be developed at an RS-8 level.
Franklin/That's correct.
Lehman/Without without staff approval other than meeting zoning requirements. With
this with OPDH it requires staff approval of a design?
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Franklin/Well with an OPDH it requires your approval on the design which is more
important.
Lehman/OK, all right, all right, well I don't know.
Franklin/I do.
Champion/I have a question about green space. Because I know the advantages of the
OPDH.
Franklin/OPDH I know it's all backwards.
Champion/Is green space now because their putting the garage undemeath or inside
which I really like. Is there going to be more green space, or are they allowed to
cover more of that area with building because of that?
Franklin/Did you say are they allowed to cover more of the area with building? Than.
Champion/Than if they were at the exterior parking?
Franklin/The footprint of the building could be exactly the same without if you did not
have parking underneath.
Champion/OK, that answers my question.
Franklin/But you would just have more paved surface for the surface parking.
Champion/No, that's exactly what my question was.
Lehman/And less green space?
Franklin/Right. Right.
Lehman/OK.
Norton/Karin there also would be plenty of options under OPDH for different structures
right, that is there are no particular requirement to go to structure of that size?
Smaller structures would be a reasonable also would they not? But there's no
right on the part of the developer to have so many units in a dwelling in a
building?
Franklin/No that's correct. I mean you start you start with that base density that they can
go up to in this case because it's zoned RS-8 the highest that you can go is to 10
units per acre and that's because of the nature of the RS~8 zone. That doesn't
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mean that in an approved plan development it has to be 10 units per acre, it can be
less than that. This one is 9.65.
Norton/But that' s probably so, would that be higher than you would get if just a straight
RS-8?
Champion/No.
Norton/Number of dwelling units now.
Franklin/Usually with a plan development you can maximize the density because you
don't have to put in streets for access. When you subdivide property space is
taken up with streets with the infrastructure and the planned development allows
you to maximize the density.
Norton/But this seems to be kind of the mild.
Franklin/So conceivably.
Norton/Which surprised the people who are encountering a bit I think the OPDH is in
general entailing somewhat higher number of traits in the same space.
Franklin/Right I'm agreeing with you that you can do that with an OPDH you can
maximize the density, you can get more units on that piece of ground than if you
were doing just the standard subdivision of what you could do by right. And that
is why it goes through the extra scrutiny of public hearings such as this one.
Anything else?
Lehman/Not right now but stay handy.
Franklin/Oh, I'll be handy.
Lehman/Thank you Karin.
Gary Watts/I'm Gary Watts with Arlington L.C. the developer. I just want to make the
statement that I appreciate the city of bringing us Court Street. First of all I
appreciate the effort that all of you did help that become a reality. Also we do
these call these South point Condominiums, we're kind of excited to bring it into
the city, we think it will be a good mix of housing and good for the city. The unit
sizes are 12 - 14,000 feet so it is a luxury condominium, they will have balconies,
screened in porches. And we also feature underground parking. In between the
four buildings, or in between on two on each side we will have a community
center which we would have a place where people can have meals or a gathering
place which we thought would be nice. The site I think is in the 7 ½ to 8 acre
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range, I think the total site there's like 9 acres, when you take the right away it's 7
½ and just behind this piece of real estate is I believe about a 5 acre outlot. So the
four buildings and the community center are pretty well buffered and they sit on
approximately 14 acres or so. So anyway I just thought I'd bring that up and
appreciate your consideration. Thank you.
Champion/Thank you.
Vanderhoef/Gary, that outlot is to be what are you planning to do with the outlot?
Watts/The outlots open space.
Vanderhoef/And it will stay open space?
Watts/Yes mare.
Norton/Does it have storm water?
Watts/No, no, not storm water Dee it's just open space. Yea it's an extension of the park
along that, there's a creek that goes along there and it just follows that all the way
up and down Windsor.
Norton/It looks to me like you were going to have some storm water down that.
Kubby/Oh yea.
Norton/Whether you want it or not.
Atkins/Deb did you want to use that?
Deb Liddell/Technology imperative thank you. My name is Deb Liddell and I live at
4831 Southchase Court which is in Windsor Ridge. This is not very legible but I
do have a copy as I promised of this advertisement. This is the Windsor Ridge
that many of the families who bought lots out in this neighborhood wanted to buy
into. The advertisement which is just a week old refers to open spaces, country
charm, close your eyes and listen it says you didn't hear a thing did you? Or
perhaps you heard a symphony ofbrippling water and a gentle breeze welcome to
Windsor Ridge. Well this is important when this development was planned and I
think that' s an important distinction about Windsor Ridge is that it was planned
on paper and it was sold to the people that lived out there that moved out there on
speculation as a concept and I'm here trying to represent that concept and to make
sure that it's maintained. I'm here to present signatures for a petition that you've
already previewed. Can I give this to you? I've sat through probably 20 hours of
meetings with neighbors about this issue. The reactions about this Dee you'll be
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pleased to know follow-up pretty normal distribution. On the one end there are a
few folks that believe that this issue is not going to affect them at all. On the
other end there are a few folks that want to file suit against the developer for
misrepresentation and fraud. I'm here to speak for most of the folks I think. Most
that I've talked to recognize the reasonableness ofmodem density neighborhoods.
Especially those that are close to busy streets like Court Street. Most folks I've
talked to recognize that mixed density ifit's done well can benefit a larger
community. Most folks feel that these goals can be achieved under the current
RS-8 zoning. Most believe that this 72 unit building from our view is way to
high, way to dense, way to overwhelming to what was this concept plan. From
our view point this is going to be 3 stories high plus a high roof line and a parking
garage. Many people I've talked to feel very surprised by this, even deceived
about this project and if you will refer to the May 20th meeting minutes of the
Planning & Zoning meeting I think perhaps you'll get a flavor of that discussion.
For that reason we believe this request is reasonable. It causes no hardship to the
developer. Specifically we're asking that the petition for rezoning for this
particular project be denied at this time and that city staff, the developers and the
neighbors that are going to be affected by this planning sit down and try to resolve
the issues that have (can't hear) from this development. In Windsor Ridge they
we counted tonight our best count was that there are 116 houses that are currently
occupied or are presold and their under construction right now so we did not count
houses that are being that are spec houses that are not sold. Of those 116 houses
63 of those households are represented on this petition. A few neighboring areas
also sought participation on this action and that's primarily the neighbors up on
Taft Avenue which will be affected as well as the Scott Park Drive area. I think
that it meets the spirit of the state laws I understand it which is if20 percent of the
surrounding neighbors object to a rezoning application, it requires a super
majority of the city council to pass. Now I may have misinterpreted that but that
was my understanding of the state law. We don't own the area directly adjacent
to this the developer does. But I think that you'll find this is petition has huge
support in Windsor Ridge and we urge your action on it and I know some of my
neighbors are here tonight and can speak more specifically to their concerns.
Thornberry/To answer that one question, or that one thing you had about 20 percent I
believe that Eleanor's looking that up now.
Liddell/OK.
Dilkes/It has to be within a certain distance from and I don't know what's the distance.
Franklin/woman in background/200.
Dilkes/200.
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Thornberry/The developer owns property from that distance I don't know if that I don't
know ifthat's going to.
Liddell/Right and that's I mean that's a good point Dean, I guess our feeling was that it
meets the spirit of that state law. He does own the all of the adjacent area or I
believe he does. So it's been rezoned up to this point. Thank you.
Michael Barron/Good evening I'm Michael Barron and I my family reside at 725
Arlington Drive also known as Lot 43 Windsor Ridge, Section 3. I think first I
would take in aside and tell you I would like to thank the developer for having the
vision and the courage to step out on the east side and envision a different future
for that particular parcel of land and for growth in that particular area. I'd also
like to thank the city for having the wisdom to create a master plan that permits
for economic diversity of growth within our community including areas like our
own. We contracted with our builder in December of 1994 to design and
construct a home at 725 Arlington Drive, the excavation began in 1995 April and
we occupied the home in September of 1995. And from the driveway of that
home I can tell you now regardless of the elevations that you've seen. That from
the driveway of this home I can see Court Street and the kids riding their bikes on
it now, so from my perspective I'll see more than the scant roof line that's been
suggested to you by the Planning & Zoning Commission for properties that are
somewhat closer to it as it stands now. Also for and perhaps not particularly
coj en??? I'm a member of the covenant committee of the Windsor Ridge Home
Owner' s Association so I'm very interested in some of the issues that we're
dealing with here. My family and I made the decision to build and to do so in
Windsor Ridge based on what we thought was the master plan I thought was then
and known and developed in advance by the Windsor Ridge Development
Corporation. We walked the prior to it's development, we met with the developer
and his representatives to discuss the initial and the extended concept of the
subdivision in fact we were so sold on Windsor Ridge as it was promoted that my
wife and I appear without renumeration in a 1995 video which is still sometimes
used in television advertising by the developers promoting this development.
Along with Jean and Pat Nesseley???? who are also signers of this petition before
you this evening. We stood on the deck of the model home known as Lot 1
overlooking the pond, laughing and talking and obviously enjoying our decision
to be a part of this new concept in planned suburban living. What I'm saying is
we were drawn to Windsor Ridge because we believed the brochures, the ads, the
actual words of the developers to create a new east side neighborhood, and I quote
"secluded from the world at large, the quite country charm, that offers a gorgeous
view and a serene park like setting" end quote. And I believe up to now for sure
the developer made good on those promises and I like that said for the record.
What concerns me about the matter before you and the Planning & Zoning
Commission when they meet Thursday about additional parts of zoning requests
for Windsor Ridge certainly is described in the petition we filed and I support the
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request to deny the requested zoning, the overlay and direct the city staff to bring
the developer and homeowners together to seek with the city staff a better solution
to the development of this property north of the current RS-5 areas. From my
perspective the current development plans ramp up the population density much
too quickly without adequate buffers and eliminate certain features of the original
Windsor Ridge concept plan. I agree with Planning & Zoning Commission
members Bovbjerg and Ehrhardt that the 72 units are too massive and that the
decision to build them it was too quickly developed and considered while they
may be technically confirm to the city planning code we ask that they be
reconsidered. I note that no continuation of the hike and bike trails into these
areas from the current development and I question the ability of the developer to
do so given the concept plan that I've seen for lots north of the current
development notably those south and south east of the parkway outlots J and K.
Further plans to connect the hike and bike trails to Scott Park which we had
understood was a given seem to have been dropped. I could be wrong on that of
course. I question whether this plan is environmentally sound relative to the
handling of water runoff particularly toward the Scott Park area. The concept of
economically diverse neighborhoods is certainly evident in the master planning
documents adopted by the city and I have no doubt that some sort of increased
population density is perceived by the city staff as desirable for the Windsor
Ridge area. At some level I actually don't disagree with this concept for a
community diversity in a general sense and yet I remain concern about the
proposed zoning changes. With Court Street evidentially becoming an arterial
and the existence of a buffer zone between Court and the RS-5 areas make sense.
But I do not believe that the current plan to be the best we as a planned
community can come up with. From my perspective it does not allow for a
sufficient buffer between the RS-5 area in which I live and the Court Street. The
traffic patterns we believe will be irrevocably altered by bringing more traffic
some of from outside the neighborhood.
(End of 99-66 Side 2)
Michael Barron/That is not desirable for all the reasons in the petition and more. If the
developer is to be permitted and the final analysis by your vote this evening to add
the 72 unit and subsequently get the 38 unit complex approved by Planning &
Zoning in a future meeting as requested I believe the city should require a number
of conditions. These might include but not be limited to more specific building
design prior to approval of the rezoning, Keystones, Boulevards, S-Curves in
Arlington and possibly Huntington as they approach Court and possibly speed
bumps as well. A ban on commercial delivery vehicles through the RS-5 areas
which we anticipate will service the requested CN-1 like commercial area perhaps
should be considered to. The size and price of the individual units in this
proposed area as they've been represented to us perhaps should be rethought and
made more consistent with the cost of the homes in the RS-5 area. Too large a
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gap in individual property values risk the property values of the existing homes.
Many of the individuals living there now were already Iowa City residents when
they built and relocated to Windsor Ridge like for my wife and myself their home
is their largest investment. This area as it was originally conceived has even
drawn new residents to Iowa City who actually work in Cedar Rapids and
Muscatine and other surrounding communities because they saw something
special we had in Iowa City and the quality of life and in part that was the concept
of Windsor Ridge as it was originally developed. Since the long-term value of
these homes was a part of the marketing message originally delivered by the
developer we should not abandon these homeowners just because we can in order
to achieve a higher return on the developer's investment Windsor Ridge obviously
works, it's worked up to now and we would hope that we can continue our good
relationship with our developer to keep doing it right and not give in to other
pressures. We recognize the business climate may change over time. We believe
that the developer with the permission of the city and in concert with the intent of
the city's master plan as a right to subdivide the land, to develop it, and to make a
profit. But we also believe that the planned community we were sold tauted??? as
the first planned community in Iowa City following the approval of it's master
plan is not represented in the plan you see before you today. And I urge you to
remain this effort back to P & Z for a better answer for the use of this property.
Thank you.
Lehman/Thank you.
Champion/Mr. Watts at what point did you first meet with the neighbors I mean started
planning for this area?
Lehman/You'll have to keep going to the mic.
Gary Watts/I'm sorry Connie could you?
Champion/At what point did you first contact the neighbors about this development?
Watts/About the.
Champion/I mean about this new project this.
Watts/The new concept.
Champion/Yes.
Watts/Concept plan that showed parts 12, 13, and 14 which is this area we're talking
about also the CN-1 at the end of Court and Taft I believe was drawn up in the
record of 1995.
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Champion/Oh I understand that.
Watts/Right.
Champion/I mean when you decided to do this the way your going to develop this 8
acres or whatever it is, I mean I totally support what your doing but maybe not
how it's being done.
Watts/Right.
Champion/When did you first contact neighbors, did you contact them at all for an input
on how you might develop this area? At what point?
Watts/
In 95 I most of the people that we dealt with or talked to we did discuss concepts
and if they asked we'd provide that and how many people I don't remember that' s
hard, I can't answer that I mean I don't know. You know it's hard to say to
everybody because some people dealt with builders, or other Realtors or whatever
but there are I don't know if I could give you an accurate number of how many
people.
Champion/OK. The only reason I ask is when when the, I can't remember the name of
the builder now, it doesn't make any difference so was going to put a
condominium for that Summit street there was a huge upheaval from people on
Summit Street and Kirkwood in the area because they thought it was going to
overpower the area so and he did meet a lot with neighbors before the actual plan
was provide and came up with a concept that made a profit that pleased the
neighbors that was also very profitable. I just wondered if you did that at all,
that's my question to you really.
Watts/Have we done this in this particular part?
Champion/Right.
Watts/Prior to we presented it?
Champion/Right when your building something that although was zoned to be there it's
not what's there now and so my question to you is did you ever meet with the
neighbors to say this is how this is zoned, this is how I want to develop it?
Watts/About, I am going to say, I can't you know I hate to give you dates but I'll give
you rough?
Champion/No I just mean did you do that?
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Watts/
Six months to a year ago I met with the Windsor Ridge Board and went through
they wanted to know some concepts in what was going on above the ground and
we went through all this. So we did discuss it at that point. As far as when we
actually went in and when we did this through Planning & Zoning this particular
area after the first meeting there were some concerns there were some neighbors
that were concemed I did receive a call from the Homeowners Board, Windsor
Ridge Homeowners Board and they asked me to make a presentation to the people
that had some concerns and also the board and I did that. And that was in the last,
oh I can't give two months.
Champion/So it was way beyond time that their input would make a change on how your
going to plan this?
Watts/Yea, yes.
Champion/OK. Good.
Watts/I mean you know part of our process obviously is with staff and we worked you
know a long time with staff to see what would work and you know so.
Champion/Thank you.
Ken Nelson/I'll be brief, my name is Ken Nelson I live at 42 Kensington Court. My
wife is one of those Muscatineites that was afore mentioned and I connect to what
Mike said we investigated late in 94 this development, we bought in early 95 and
me being an anal builder, or an anal homeowner to be I was out there literally
hundreds of times in 95. I never saw a sign, I never any literature, I never saw
anything and maybe that makes me naive because I didn't know what was going
on, I didn't know any of this rezoning happened in 95. This has been marketed as
purely single family residential utopia. People at a minimum feel mislead, to that
let me say I manage a production operation at a local manufacturing company. I
am the President of a statewide volunteer organization in Davenport, I share in the
household duties and the raising of my daughter, I take for granted that some
things are as stated and if I feel like I have to not trust the developer and not trust
the city and the planning, staff, that's a problem, I don't think that's fair. And
again all act of suggestion, I think there needs to be a representation of our
subdivision, city people, and the developer and get this thing ironed out before we
move forward on anything. Thank you.
Steve Vanderah/Good evening my name is Steve Vanderah and I have a home under
construction at 815 Coventry Court, I have the biggest pile of dirt out there right
now. I would just echo the comments that were made previously here, we bought
into the concept, it's a wonderful concept and the term I've heard among some of
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my soon to be neighbors is bait switch and I have to say that I have a little of that
feeling in my heart at this point. We have signed a covenant there in the
development that is goes on for many many pages of the do's and the don'ts and I
feel that the developer has a covenant with us who put down our life savings to
build a once in a lifetime home if we're lucky enough to do that. And I think that
covenant that goes unwritten to us from the developer is I will do what I said I
was going to do. Thank you.
Nancy
Bonthius/Good evening my name is Nancy Bonthius and I to my house is under
construction currently it is at 43 Invemess Place and I to as well as my husband
and children have bought into the concept of Windsor Ridge that has been sold
over to us over a matter of years we've been looking at the subdivision so it
wasn't an over night decision at all for us. We were a homeowner on Sandusky
the as you go right up Sandusky the newer part of Sandusky most recently and as
of last year we decided to sell our house because we were going to have another
child and we ran out of room in our house. We loved our house that we had over
there but we did need more room. To make a long story short we took a huge hit
in the sale of that house because nobody wanted to buy south of the highway. At
that time you might remember the multiple family dwellings in that area had a lot
of crime associated with them, we took a huge financial hit as I said but we
decided we would still stick with Iowa City in hopes that we would get into a
subdivision that was a planned subdivision that met our needs, we thought we
bought into it and now we're hugely disappointed and we're not in our house yet.
Thank you.
Thornberry/Excuse me could you sign in please?
Lehman/Is there any further public discussion?
John Westefeld/My name' s John Westefeld I live at 4831 Southchase Court. I appreciate
the opportunity to speak tonight. I just have a couple of brief comments. I
basically want to comment on the process, the past process and the opportunity
for the future process that is operating in this situation in my own opinion. It's
my opinion based on many conversations with quite a few neighbors in Windsor
Ridge and based on some of the comments you've heard and based on the petition
that the perception, the perception of a great many people who moved to Windsor
Ridge was that the development would look a certain way and the perception of
many people right now is that's it's going to look a very different way and in my
opinion people feel mislead and I think we can argue whether that perception is
correct or incorrect whether it was over a covert,??? explicit, or implicit. But my
sense is that that' s what people believed and that is now beginning to change. My
other comment has to do with the future process. I think what is being asked for
here is reasonable. As Gary Watts indicated there has been one meeting within
the last number of weeks between the developer and residents and my perception
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is that that was useful meeting, it was a beginning. And I guess what I would like
to ask is that that process be continued. I think that there are many many roles of
an organization like the city council, a parks and rec. commission, a Planning &
Zoning Commission, a library board. I think one of those roles in certain
situations is to step in and try to make the process fight, give people an
opportunity to sit down and try to work out their differences so that we can all
come out on a better place and that's what I'd like to ask you to do. Thank you.
Champion/Gary are you willing, are you willing to do that. For instance, I'm totally
willing to support the OPDH zoning change and I'm not willing to bound??? zone
the area. So whether it's RS-8 or OPDH-8, I don't understand the rezoning I just
know what they mean. Are you willing to kind of go halfway back to the
drawing board with these neighbors and see if you can do your concept in some
way that isn't so aspective to them? I mean I know it works to do it that way.
Watts/I don't know, I you know I don't know if I have an answer righi now. I have to
consider that.
Champion/OK.
Watts/I have met with the neighborhood, I had a sense and I don't want to speak for the
neighborhood but they feel they want it all single family.
Champion/Well I'm not going to support that, I'm not going to support that it all be
single family.
Watts/OK. I've never had a problem meet with anybody.
Champion/But I'm asking you to do is on the premise I mean I mean you don't have to
do it to do because I'm asking you personally because I'm just one person up
here.
Watts/Sure, sure, sure.
Champion/But it seems it would behoove you to meet with the group of neighbors on
what you could do within the RS-8 or the OPDH-8 zoning that would be
profitable for you and fit into the neighborhood and not be so intrusive to them.
Because I support the mixed housing in that area. I support it all over town but as
if I were a young person in their situation I guess I'm not all that young but and
that's what I thought my neighborhood was going to look like I would be upset if
all of a sudden to me it's going to be changed. So I think it would have worked a
lot better if this whole process had started with a neighborhood meeting like I, this
is zoned RS-8 this is what I want to do what can we do to come together to get
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this done. I'm the only person that supports that but that's what I would like to
see done.
Kubby/Well maybe another way to ask the question would be would you be willing to
slow down this particular application to continue meeting with neighbors to see if
you'd be interested in changing your design or not and it would still allow this
one to come to a vote if you choose to continue with your plan.
Watts/
I don't know if I have an answer. I think that I think that I would consider that
Karen. I mean we have approximately 270 single family lots planned at Windsor
Ridge. I think people lose a little bit of focus of how large Windsor Ridge is. It's
approximately a mile of real estate from American Legion to Lower West Branch.
We've worked very hard with staff to put together a proper plan, we've put single
family all the way up to Court Street except for a small pocket of neighbor
commercial and that will be coming before you here down the road. And a buffer
of townhouses which we do have a plan that will be coming out Thursday night
with that. We really felt that you know with the trail system, we required to do
gravel, we put in cement. When we did meet by the way at a neighborhood
meeting Mr. Nelson was there and four or five other residents when this was first
at Planning & Zoning we met with some neighbors and the board members at
Windsor Ridge, Homeowners Association from that meeting we did do a median
on Arlington, we decided to go ahead and do a pond similar to the one coming in
to identify a little more this is Windsor Ridge and I agree with those things and
we're implementing those. In this particular case you know you know I hate to
say that we're unwilling to meet with somebody but I do think that we can
strongly consider that. I would like to have it in a group where we can
accomplish things or if there's ideas or you know can you do this with a building,
will that work for you or you know I hate to say business like manner and try not
to get so personal about it I think that.
Champion/Well that's kind of what I'm.
Watts/Yea I mean.
Champion/That maybe there' s some ideas that can be incorporated without any major
upheaval.
Watts/
Right. Right. I mean what we're trying we felt that' s a good plan obviously we
can't do single family against Court Street, really can't curb cut Court Street. We
felt that, yea, I really feel that some neighborhood inport or neighborhood input is
very important. I don't, you know, then again you know we've got to draw a line
on what we need to go ahead and do and what we feel works is feasible. If there
are some, so far I haven't had a lot of constructive things come out but if there are
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I mean I don't want to commit that you know we don't want this voted on but I
certainly.
Champion/There's still an advantage to doing things the way your doing them as far as I
love the idea of more green space and less concrete and less garage doors and I
mean I like your plans a lot.
Norton/(can't hear).
Watts/
We feel strongly that we have never represented Windsor Ridge to be all single
families, it goes all the way to Lower West Branch. At the inception of Windsor
Ridge we never had Court Street. We never knew we could even get it. The
zones came along once we knew the city would work with us which you did and I
appreciate and Court Street was coming out and I think the city came out to
developers and said would you be willing to have some mixed density and what
not and we agreed to do that. You know as far as the height goes and what not we
feel that on 14 acres that' s really incredible. I don't know of another site I could
be wrong in Iowa City where there' s 14 acres with this kind of number of units on
it.
Kubby/That's where the irony comes in is that the city went out to the development
community and said we want some mixed zoning in areas that are not currently
developed so that neighbors will know ahead of time what their buying into. OK.
Watts/Right, fight.
Kubby/So you were really one of the few if only at that time the only person that came
back to us saying yea I'm interested in this innovation in our community and what
hasn't happened you may have communicated to that but it wasn't communicated.
You may feel like you represented what was there but obviously many people in
the neighborhood didn't get that message that you were putting out for whatever
reason and so that's why I don't have a problem with encouraging you to sit down
and talk with them some more because that communication didn't get across very
well. And I know you and I have talked about making sure that in the future
information that's put out not just the things that are the area that are platted.
Watts/Right.
Kubby/But all the area zoning is very clear in promotional material.
Watts/There are a lot of people there that did see concept plans, their not here for you
tonight but there are people that have seen that, would tell you that that I
personally dealt with. If they ask me I'd be glad to share anything at anytime.
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We feel very very strongly of the resale ability in Windsor Ridge and what we
provided there with our costs of lots.
Champion/Well all right.
Watts/
There are lots in Coralville that go from $80 to $100,000. There's a gated
community coming out the lots are over $100,000. And we provided lots in the
$35,000 to $55,000 range so we really felt strong of an oversized lot and what we
provided. We just feel a little bit of mixed use off Court street as an arterial. We
feel strong that that's not going to affect resale, we feel very strongly and I've
talked to appraisers and the neighborhood may or may not believe that but the key
ingredient is how it's done. And John and I are very strong on how we do things
and how we feel and that things get done in Windsor Ridge. Somebody
mentioned covenants tonight. You wouldn't believe the time and effort that we
spend monitoring those covenants and no matter what we do we can't make
everybody happy. But we spend a lot of time and that enhances values and makes
sure that people know when they are buying it, here's what your buying into the
covenants. And anytime if anybody wanted to call me I'd be more than happy to
sit down with them and show them our concept plans. We really didn't promote it
because soon as you promote it, you don't build it, market changes it puts a
developer kind of in a catch 22 all the time, it's difficult. You know it's hard to
know exactly you know if we have you know our market on this condominium,
it's luxury. And anybody that who knows if your building 12 -14,000 square feet
and their all brick or stucco knows it's luxury. We're targeting toward a
retirement type community. That's why we did the community center, and we
really felt that that would fit in and that would be an (can't hear) of the area. I
don't know, I don't mean to ramble I'm sorry.
Champion/No. I'm happy.
Watts/
I really, I do appreciate the neighborhood, and I appreciate their concerns. I just
feel that I've told them before there's been a couple of projects that John & I have
seen and have approached us that we did not accept in Windsor Ridge because we
felt it wasn't in character of what we wanted to do. So you know, I don't mind
input I mean but I don't want to shut that door but I you know.
Kubby/I would not want to suggest with my comments that I would encourage you to go
to just an RS-8 or ask for a lower zoning or anything.
Champion/No, no.
Kubby/That I really believe especially in newer developed areas that we need to
maximize density or else we're going to be in big trouble in our community, we
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can not handle the infrastructure needs, be it now. We just heard the transit
conversation so I like the idea of maximizing density.
Watts/
I went through all my old concept plans and I have them. And we have we
changed the school site once. And we had two or three areas of future
development we never even, we just put future development. OK. And then we
ended up in a concept plan in 95 which did kind of identify where these 18's are
and it also identifies that at the end of Court and Taft neighborhood commercial
and some RS-8 to buffer into that which is coming up before P & Z here later. So
we have had those concept on plans and I'd be glad I'd share anybody that came
to me and asked me, all you have to do is Gary what are your thoughts over the
hill here. Because it is what's hard to perceive here is that it's a mile,
approximately a mile of real estate folks, it isn't just like some small pocket. And
when we put in 270 single family units. At the neighborhood meeting I did meet
with the people and we are going to record our covenants similar to 7 or 8 which
is progressing on. And that's another I think 130 or 125 more single family and
we really felt from absorption that that was enough that's what we felt as a
developer.
Norton/Gary I still wonder if there isn't a possibility for that. If the neighbors are going
to, under the OPDH are going to halfway sub, there may be something other than
single family I certainly agree with that OPDH conduct.
Watts/Sure.
Norton/The problem is can you achieve that in any other somewhat lighter way that than
the structure you have with 14 acres you think you could spread it out more but
I'm not going to design it but it seems to me that's the kind of thing your trying to
work out with them. They accepted a little more some multifamily and you give
them something that doesn't knock them in the eyes.
Watts/
It's a good point Dee what if you go out on Court Street and stop and look at the
site, we are currently and we have been working for about a year to the north of
Court Street and as you progress up that hill it's very steep and there gets into
another stream corridor and it's a difficult piece to figure out how to develop. We
felt for this type of density and for the retirement thing or the condominium
luxury condominium's that were doing the way it falls to the back that this to get
underground parking and from a site evaluation that that was our best site noah of
or right off Court Street.
Norton/Yea, south or Court.
Watts/Correct fight.
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Lehman/Gary I want to just make a comment, I probably shouldn't but I'm going to. I
don't think you've done a real good job of selling this to the neighborhood.
Champion/Right.
Lehman/I remember the first Planning & Zoning Commission meeting I ever went to
there was a development on West Benton Street and it was for a neighborhood
commercial building like a Quik Trip and I voted for it. And my neighbors were
really upset with me, they said we don't want that. I said would you rather have
that or 250 apartments? We don't want those apartments, and I said but that's
what your going to get. And that's what we got. Now I think what your trying to
do out here has got a lot of thought that's gone into it. I don't think that the
neighbors have heard this. I don't think they realize that at RS~8 you could build
a bunch of duplexes and you could have all kinds of concrete without even
coming to us to get approval.
Watts/Right.
Lehman/So the OPDH zone gives us the opportunity to require you to certain things that
you wouldn't otherwise have to do.
Watts/Right.
Lehman/For example, the garages in the basement and whatever. But see I don't know
that these folks understand and I don't think you've communicated to them what
you could do as oppose to what your proposing to do. I favor what your trying to
do because I know what you can do.
Watts/Right.
Lehman/It certainly is far less attractive than what your proposing. And I do think that
these folks haven't heard this.
Watts/OK.
O'Donnell/More communication is good Gary, we have a project that's blessed by
Planning & Zoning Commission. There's no problem, I've heard four of us here
say now we like the concept. You know, I certainly support more communication
with the neighbors but I'm going to support this which I like I like the concept.
Watts/When we, we just don't think these up ovemight of how to.
O'Donnell/Right.
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Watts/
And we really, we're concerned about the neighborhood, obviously. We have to
be, and we're concemed about resale and how it fits in with integrity, what's
already there, it's wonderful and we have to look at that and then obviously
there' s a what the city is thinking about and how they impact the Vision 2000, a
community neighborhoods, and the Northeast Plan and what not. And then
obviously the feasibility from a development standpoint. So we constantly are
going out, we're juggling all of that and it's difficult.
Champion/Yea, I think.
Lehman/I think we appreciate that Gary I'm just not at all sure that the neighbors
appreciate the process and what all has gone into it I think there is a, I don't think
that there's a communication that probably should be there. I know and I think
council knows, and staff knows and P & Z probably knows. But I'm not sure that
these folks have had the same understanding on what your proposing compared to
what you could propose.
Watts/What is your suggestion or is it?
Lehman/Hey, I have no problem with this one. I think it's up to. First of all what would
you like?
Watts/If you don't mind I'd like to think about that I don't know if I have an answer I.
Lehman/I mean we can continue the public hearing.
Watts/I met I met with.
Lehman/And if you'd like to do that.
Watts/Sure, maybe have some ideas.
Lehman/Visit with some neighbors, I think there's some information that they don't have
that they should have that might change some of their opinions or we can close
the public hearing.
Watts/Sure.
Champion/I would like it if you want to think about it and would do it. I can honestly
tell the neighbors that I'm not going to change this out of that RS-8 or OPDH so if
you can meet with them on that premise that probably a majority of us want that
multifamily.
Watts/You know possibly a representatives from the neighborhood.
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Champion/Right.
Watts/So it doesn't get so emotional and personal, possibly representatives from the
staff, and you know maybe John and I as a developer's could take them through
the process and maybe your fight Ernie maybe they don't quite know the things
we could do and the thought process ofwhat's went into this for the last six years
SO.
Norton/You don't want them to accept this just because there's some more horrible
possibility I mean I think you'd rather work from what can be improved all the
way around.
Lehman/Well I didn't mean it.
Watts/I didn't mean that way.
Lehman/Would you like to do that and continue that until two weeks from tonight?
Watts/Would I be willing to meet with a representatives and staff and yea, I'd be willing,
and I don't know, I don't want to be pinned down exactly I don't know what will
happen. But to answer you yes, there are obviously some concerns and you know
we don't like this either.
Lehman/No, no.
Champion/No of course not.
Watts/I mean it's like attacking one of your kids from when we brought this in from
annexation and I don't want to go into all of that.
O'Donnell/Gary can have his meeting but is it going to change anybody's mind (can't
hear).
Norton/But were not acting, that does public hearing isn't it?
Champion/No not after that anyway.
O'Donnell/If everybody feels it necessary to (can't hear).
Champion/If Gary is willing to meet with them.
Kubby/Change of call.
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Lehman/Change of call.
Norton/I'd like to hear that, I didn't want to predict him out of the future (can't hear).
Kubby/And it won't slow the process down because we'll continue the public hearing
and have the motion to vote on this at the same meeting and we can decide how to
behave in two weeks.
Champion/And I think for the neighbors agree not to just badger him that's now the
whole idea, cause it's not going to, that's not going to help anything.
Lehman/Well we can, I think we can agree to vote at the next meeting.
Champion/Right.
Lehman/Have continue the public hearing, close that heating and vote which would put
us on exactly the same time frame we are now anyway.
Norton/I think that's fine.
Vanderhoef/It wouldn't change your development time.
Norton/You have to be careful though because this is going to get us tangled up with Part
12 and Part 13 and 14 or 13.
Lehman/Well but we have to address this (can't hear).
Norton/I understand but the neighbors have to want to look at that overall package they I
would sure would do that in the same time because their looking at those other
two actions or possible activities too.
Watts/Right.
Norton/I'm sure you'll (can't hear) with them.
Thornberry/REZ99-0007 we have.
Kubby/Move to continue the public hearing to June 29.
Lehman/We have moved by Kubby.
Norton/Second.
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Lehman/Second by Norton to continue the public hearing until June 29 and at that time
we will vote. All in favor. Do I have a motion to accept correspondence.
Thornberry/So moved.
O'Donnell/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Thornberry, seconded by O'Donnell, all in favor. Motion carries.
We will continue the public hearing two weeks from tonight we will vote at that
time.
Watts/Can I say one thing?
Lehman/I would suggest that I think you put a lot of work into this obviously and I
certainly would encourage you to visit with the neighbors and I'm sure that our
staff folks would be very willing to help with you to.
Watts/Is that something that Karin or Scott Kugler or Bob or somebody would set up
you know maybe we could have it in city offices here or whatever. OK.
Norton/Yea.
Watts/Thank you.
Lehman/We're going to take five minutes so.
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ITEM 5e. PUBLIC HEARING ON A RESOLUTION ADOPTING AND
INCORPORATING THE NORTHEAST DISTRICT PLAN INTO THE
IOWA CITY COMPREHENSIVE PLAN. (continued from March 30, April
6, April 20, and May 18)
Lehman/This is a continuation from May 18 was the last continuation, the public hearing
is open, I might say that we would expect that the public hearing to be continued
to the 291h at which time we will take our first vote. So anyone who would like to
speak to this please do, the council discussed it last night for about an hour and a
half, we think we've answered a lot of the questions that we had on them. I would
like to address Dennis, you wrote us a letter and if you'd like to come to the
podium as a. You brought up four items which we did discuss last night in your
letter. One was adding language recognizing conventional development as a
viable choice, that we believe we've done, there will be a separate section in the
plan that will recognize that. You asked for a detailed list of available incentives,
there are incentives listed in the plan but I think the feeling on the part of council
and I really believe staff is that incentives may be specific to the certain projects.
In other words there may be incentives available for some projects and not others
but there certainly within the plan fight now are incentives are listed. Density
tradeoffs, narrower streets and this sort of thing so we feel that. Now if you don't
feel we've answered these you know please tell us.
Kubby/Be clear, but those things are outlined in the comp. plan so we felt we didn't need
to keep them in the Noaheast District Plan.
Lehman/Yea, the Northeast District Plan is part of a larger complex. You know this is
not doesn't stand on it's own, it's part of a larger plan. You had asked us to add
photographs illustrating conventional developments there is a photograph in the
plan as you have received it that is conventional I don't know how important that
was we did we kept that photograph, did not add any others.
Dennis Spencer/We didn't take any others out either.
Lehman/Take any out that's right. And the last one was add language explicitly stating
that alleys are available as an option. In some instances but are not required and
according to our interpretation the staffs interpretation that the plan does not say
that alley's are required anywhere, but they are an option.
Spencer/(can't hear).
Lehman/Now we feel that we've addressed those, if you don't feel we have tell us.
Dilkes/I think, I'm sorry if I can just, I think there was going to be a language change
regarding alleys as well.
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Lehman/Yes, and we did change a little bit of language regarding conventional
development, we added a section.
Champion/We have a copy of that.
Lehman/We will get those changes to you as soon as we can because we really would
like to move along on it two weeks from tonight.
Spencer/As would we yes.
Lehman/Yes. OK.
Spencer/OK. I've just got a couple of things I'd like to say tonight.
Lehman/Sure.
Spencer/The Home Builders Association of Iowa City was publicly criticized for not
taking part in the initial planning of the Noaheast District Plan. The association
agrees that we were not initially represented at the initial public input sessions but
since that time we have spent a great deal of time and resources to research the
issues that were brought up. What was actually gained by the meeting with the
city staff and the city council is yet to be determined, your going to determine
that. Conventional design is a viable way of building not only for the community
but also for the entire nation. Our association will remain optimistic and rely on
the good faith assurances of council and staff. That the intent of the plan is to be
inclusive and not exclusive of conventional housing. HBA of Iowa City wants to
remove barriers that interfere with the American Dream of Home Ownership and
we hope that the city also supports our goals, which it sounds like in some form
that you are.
Lehman/I think we are, we also hope you support our vision. I think it's very important
some of the things that we're trying to vision for this areas. And obviously we're
not dictating those things but we would appreciate your considering that (can't
hear).
Spencer/Right, right. And I think, I hope we've been on somewhat evident that we do
support portions of this. However, tonight's conversation that you just finished
should really drive home also our point about the expectations that are created
when this type of plan goes through with this type of detail in it of the
neighborhood that you have with the various different areas of what is as we're
heating right now not necessarily cast in stone but the perception can be there.
It's certainly there that this is what's going to happen and what you see before
you tonight should really drive that home I think.
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Lehman/Well and we also talked last night about including the comments from the home
builders along with the answers from the staff as a part of a plan and that was
rejected for I think good legal reasons. However, all of the conversations that
have taken place at these public hearings are is in effect part of that plan. So
anytime in the future that anybody wants to refer back they can every all of the
business during these public hearings is a matter of public record.
Spencer/Right. And that's our, you know somewhat of our comfort zone here too that
we have so. OK.
Champion/Well I think tonight really changed my rigid view of it.
Thornberry/In what way Connie, in what way?
O'Donnell/People that (can't hear) Northeast District Plan.
Champion/The expectations and not everybody envisions what I envision as being the
ideal so I'm glad we made the wording changes so. I didn't support the idea of
making them in the beginning I supported making them in the end but I think now
it's really important that we make those wording changes.
Kubby/Cause it, well from my perspective, there's no change in the meaning of the plan
because and the wording that we agreed to all the development whether it's
conventional, traditional, or conservation design has to meet the principles of the
plan and so that's really what we're emphasizing is the principles of the plan
instead of whatever people come in with has to meet those principles and if they
don't then it won't be approved no matter what's category of development it is.
Spencer/Right.
Kubby/And so that's the strength of the plan so these wording changes I don't have a
problem with. Cause the alley thing you know I don't think there's any change in
meaning, if it makes people more comfortable and it makes it more clear then I
think those are good changes.
Spencer/OK. I also would like to thank you for this and apologize for not being here I
didn't realize your were going to do this. First thing I could have certainly been
here but this the Home Ownership Week proclamation I'd like to thank you all
very much for that and remind you all.
Lehman/Larry (can't hear) very graciously.
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Spencer/I'm sure he probably did, better job than I would have done so. Our parade of
homes is coming up, we do have a booklet for each one of you, we'd like very
much for you to join us. It starts this weekend and.
Thornberry/(can't hear) Do they have any I mean we don't have to buy any?
Kubby/I had a.
Spencer/Well except (can't hear).
Vanderhoef/Thanks Larry.
Kubby/I had a question about the range of prices of the homes because part of the
proclamation is saying you want a range and I know the Parade of Homes
sometimes is perceived as being upper level but I think it's much more broad now
than it used to be.
Spencer/Yes it is. In fact, I'm sorry I was told that you asked that question and we did
look. The entry level here is $104,900 and they would go up to an unnamed value
which is (can't hear).
Norton/Some large number.
Spencer/It's some very large number I think.
Kubby/And I think that's great because it allows all of us to participate and maybe have
a chance at getting one of those parade homes rather than just drooling over a few
beautiful ones.
Spencer/Yea.
Champion/I think we ought to thank you for working with us and coming to I hope a
happy ending.
Spencer/Also the public is invited to the parade to, that's what it's all about (can't hear).
See how good I do at this.
O'Donnell/I think everybody wanted a comfort level with this plan and builders and I
think we've really come a long way in reaching that and I do think there's a
difference in the way we have worded alley' s and that. And I do think it's
important to pursue conventional homes rather than the neo-traditional. I'm not in
favor of any pictures in this thing but if we do it has to be an even divided
conventional traditional but I want to thank you cause you've helped a lot.
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Spencer/Thank you. And that's actually our position too but you know it's the whole
process is compromise and that's what we've tried to do is you know make it
work for everybody so.
Vanderhoef/Would you tell the public also what nonprofit organization you support
through your Parade of Homes?
Spencer/The Variety of Club of Iowa.
Joan Tiemeyer/Youth project.
Spencer/Youth project, it's all youth project oriented but the Variety Club is we've built
a couple of houses and shared in the sale of the profits of the sale went largely to
the Variety Club.
Vanderhoef/And the admission.
Spencer/The admissions here are
Joan Tiemeyer/$5.00.
Spencer/$5.00 but for the parade there's a different organizations this year that are but
it's all youth oriented yes.
Vanderhoef/Good. Thank you.
Thornberry/Very good.
Lehman/Thank you Dennis.
Thomberry/Karin Franklin, when Emie was saying was paraphrasing the changes in the
Northeast District Plan I saw a squirm or two, did you have any problem with any
of the paraphrased which she has no problem with that?
O'Donnell/Did a good job.
Lehman/You just thought you saw a squirm.
Thomberry/I saw a squirm, I saw a squirm.
Norton/You wouldn't know a squirm if you saw one.
Lehman/All right are those others who would like to speak on this plan?
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I'm walking a squirm right now.
Thomberry/Or was that a (can't hear) I don't know.
Larry Schnittjer/You get Dennis and I up there together and we make a pretty good
blocking team. I'm Larry Schnittjer from MMS Consultants. I'd like to say that
I'm happy with the plan but I'm not really. I'd like to see changes in the plan but
I think we need to get on with the program. As long as we all understand that this
is a flexible dynamic plan it is subject to maybe a molitude??? of changes maybe
major, maybe minor. We all know that this is not a engineer plan and there are
parts of it that probably won't work as well as everybody had hoped it would. But
there may be parts that we could make work. The other thing about the plan there
are some new ideas in there that we all need to look at. But there are ideas out
there that none of us have come up with yet and I would like to go to work into
that plan. Brave little if any plan development shown in this area and I think the
planned developments as much as we sometimes get frustrated over them are a
good process and it gives us the opportunity to have some innovative designs and
some newer types of housing. I was encouraged about the initially I was very
concerned about the flexibility of this plan but this afternoon we had a meeting
with staff on an area that' s included in this plan and I was encouraged by the
flexibility I saw that we might have with the staff on that so hopefully we can
make this thing work.
Lehman/Thank you. Is there anyone else who would like to speak to the Northeast Plan?
Doug Sirnkin/My name's Doug Simkin I live at 3131 Noah Dubuque Road. I'm curious
as to how much of a done deal this is. I guess I'm getting on board late but I may
have some input to offer if public input is still welcome.
Lehman/Absolutely.
Kubby/It's a public heating.
Sirnkin/OK. I don't have plans today, I have not seen the plans I need.
(End of 99-67 Side 1)
Simkin/How I can look at them so I can offer input at there one will be one more public
heating is that correct?
Lehman/Yea but I might add that we have we have at least tentatively decided that the
next public heating that will be the final hearing which is two weeks from tonight
on the 291h. It would be very very helpful if you have significant input on this
plan to let council know about it prior to that meeting and by prior to that meeting
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I'm thinking you know a week or so so we've got time to look it over and
certainly staff is going to want any changes that you might have in mind because
as you say you are coming in it isn't a done deal but we're starting to wrap up the
package.
Kubby/Right, it's almost been a two-year process with a lot of front end large group
community input.
Simkin/I Yea, I recall that now that that's brought up. I wasn't interested at that time but
now I am. Your plan is available at the library is that fight?
Vanderhoef/In fact fight here's one if you'd like to step up here and you may have this.
Simkin/Thank you.
Norton/I, oh pardon me. I would urge you or anybody else whose interested also ask the
staff for a copy of this memo we got from last night from Karin that summarizes
some of the highlights of the plan that particularly has a related to one of the
developments as current in from of the P & Z because it talks about the increased
the neighborhood density and how to try to achieve that appropriately for both the
developer and the neighbors. It talks about the role of neighborhood commercial
centers and those are and how those are to work and what kind of diversity we're
looking for in the housing those are some of the principles and this articulates I
think very appropriately you might want to ask for a copy of this memo that was
handed out last night I think Karin can get you one.
Sirnkin/Sure, thank you.
Lehman/Well I also think that Karin of course is very familiar with this. Melody
Rockwell worked very hard on putting this together and there's several staff folks
who could answer questions for you that have been with this far longer than the
council has. I mean they've been working with the neighbors and whatever for a
long long time so feel free to contact those folks.
Sirnkin/Thank you.
Lehman/Any other comments from the public?
Sharon Hunter/My name's Sharon Hunter I live 4788 3401h Street. I've been watching
tapes about this project. I've seen the Home Builders very unhappy and I just
want to know why are they happy now? What have they done what's different,
the alleys? Are can be or can't be?
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Lehman/I think more than anything else I think it's really a matter of understanding what
the plan is and what the plan isn't. I think it needed to be explained and I think it
has been, we've gone through it rather carefully, the Home Builders have too.
Hunter/And their comfortable with it?
(All talking).
Champion/I think their OK.
Kubby/Now we'll see them squirm.
Norton/Larry said not everything.
Champion/I don't think their happy with it.
Hunter/Because their going to be the backbone of it, and I don't want it to be an
experiment.
Thornberry/They could probably answer that better than we could so if you would.
Hunter/But, but, you have the power.
Kubby/That's right and that's why I think it's really great that we're doing this is that we
are beginning to say that we want things to go in a slightly different direction and
we want to guide that in a flexible way that gives the development community
choices on how it happens but it's based on some principles that are guided by the
community.
Hunter/And you want it to move and it will be good for the city to have a profitable
project there.
Kubby/Yea.
O'Donnell/Well I think there's been some compromises made and.
Hunter/And what are those compromises?
O'Donnell/Well the compromises is I believe that the Home Builders thought the plan
was too detailed. And I think these four items right here for example of that
tonight and I think that has that's it's been resolved somewhat I think their more
comfortable. Or at least have agreed to it.
Champion/So they haven't (can't hear).
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Thornberry/Well I'm not sure if they've.
Norton/I don't think so.
Thornberry/Necessarily agreed to it and necessarily even think that it is as broad as they
would like to see it and I would be the last one to say that the staff, city staff and
the city council should micro manage a development, any development such as
the Southeast, the Northeast District Plan to the extent that I originally thought
this plan did. It did for me is still very very detailed. A lot more detailed than I
would like to see. If in fact they have to abide by every single word in that
Northeast District Plan but I'm under the impression and I hope I'm right that this
is a guideline for that area not etched in stone, it's saying what what some people
would like to see in a developed area. People who are buying houses and the
Home Builders, etc. know better than we do, or at least I do, what people are
going to buy and what they want. The home builders that's their business. And
so to be as detailed as I thought this particular plan was when I first read it for
example, I don't want to see a garage from the street. That was what I envisioned
this plan saying but it really doesn't. It mixes garages infrequently and it's still
possible to build a house with a garage in front. The plan doesn't say you can't
do that but I like the home builders thought that that's what they were wanting to
see and if I put a plan before the planning and building department they were
going to accept it because it had a garage in front but I don't think that that plan
says that. When it mentioned alleys my god you think that you know that every
street's got to have an alley behind the houses but it really doesn't, you know.
And so going through it and the meetings that we've had with the home builders
since this plan' s come out I'm a lot more comfortable with it and the home
builders can speak for themselves, I'm not going to speak for the home builders.
But I'm more comfortable with it and I hope they are too but we can speak for
that at a representative of a home builder.
Norton/It's important not to say that it's opened everything. I think in principle this does
say we would prefer not to see a street of garages. I think it's perfectly clear.
Now there will be an occasional garage on the street I'm sure but a whole row of
them is not preferred. I think that's where we be clear. If we don't aren't clear
about those things you don't have anything any guidance at all ifit's totally open.
Lehman/Dee that's right it's not preferred but it's also not prohibited.
Norton/I understand that but I'm trying to say it expresses some preferences and it says
we're interested in housing diversity. We're interested in mixed variety of
housing so come on it's clear that it has some principles that I have teeth and
observed by both the development community, the P & Z, the subsequent council.
Without that there's no vision the thing just becomes everybody's wish.
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Hunter/I just want you to give the home builders leeway they know what they are doing
to and you are professionals also but so are they. I don't want it to be an
experiment but I talked to someone from the city and who knows what she's
talking about and she said it's not an experiment that this kind of building has
gone on in other places in Iowa City and it's been successful, fight.
Vanderhoef/I think the idea of what threw a lot of people right off the bat was that map
that showed a planned community. And people took that immediately and said
we have to make that work. Well it was only an idea, it was a guideline, it offered
you some possibilities of what you might be able to do there. Recognizing that
there are now more planned communities, the city is involved in exploring doing
one of those out on Winslow right now and that happens to be on city land. But
we recognize that this whole Northeast Planning District is a multitude of owners
who probably will sell to developers as it goes along.
Hunter/But that isn't.
Vanderhoef/So these things have, pardon me.
Hunter/It really Dee is a multitude of owners there.
Vanderhoef/Yes, that's fight so the vision is there to look at and what individual
developers do still has much flexibility so you don't take that picture in there of
that planned community and it's got to happen.
Hunter/Flexibility wouldn't be the answer. Now the plan that (can't hear) as a layman is
very detailed.
Vanderhoef/Yes it is and that that was real scary for a lot of people including myself
when I looked at that but it was far too much. And if the wording is such as you
go through the plan to say this does not have to happen in that specific way then it
gives them that flexibility.
Hunter/As it should be.
Vanderhoef/As it should be.
Hunter/Thank you.
Vanderhoef/Your welcome.
Ross Wilburn/Hi I'm Ross Wilburn I live at 1917 Taylor Drive in Iowa City. I wanted to
support the plan as written. I think that Dee you struck a cord with me when you
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talked about vision. I think its' important for all of us to remember that this has to
do with vision and we don't want to get to the point 10-15-20 years from now
where we sit and say what happened to Iowa City. I think the guidelines are, they
do represent a compromise and I congratulate and thank the home builders being
able to sit down and meet with city staff and try and come to some type of
understanding. I think we the earlier discussion I think we as resident's of Iowa
City also need to be willing to come and compromise as well if some type of
development occurs that does meet these guidelines we need to be willing to
accept those and recognize that this was give and take and part of a vision.
Because not just with the aesthetics but what the community's going to look like I
think there's certain infrastructure type of things that will be affected by you
know how the community's put together Karen I think your fight talking about
how some of the transportation issues bussing is going to be affected by the dense
of the size of our community, how it's packed together. So beyond what the
community's going to look like there's going to be some real infrastructure things
that this will this will affect so I encourage you to pass this the next time. Thank
you.
Kubby/Thanks for watching and coming on down.
Lehman/Other comments from the public.
Dean Hunter/My name's Dean Hunter I live at 517 Amhurst and I'm representing a
couple families who have property. I guess our main concern has been and it's
been somewhat addressed tonight is the flexibility of this plan. And earlier we
listened to people from Windsor Ridge who are concerned about the potential
value of their property. And you know that not being our sole problem this is our
property, it's been our property for close to 100 years. And the people of Windsor
Ridge are having you know something come in on them. This is huge huge to us,
very huge to us. I guess it's my personal opinion you know Iowa City's doing
great the way things are going right now and I'm just concerned that the North I
don't want the Northeast side to become an experiment that doesn't work out and
if things don't work out they can be changed in the future. I would like to see the
final plan and I'll get that on my own and I think flexibility is going to be major
here, really major and I think that really needs to be spelled out in a final plan too.
Thank you very much.
Lehman/Thank you.
O'Donnell/I think it's been said that there are items that are preferred but not mandatory
and you know I've the home builders have been building homes in Iowa City for a
long period of time, they know what's successful and I do believe in giving them
a certain freedom of expression if you wish to term it that way. But I think it's
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important that people know about this plan that it's a concept, it's mandatory and
or that's how I read it and that's how I'll support it.
Kubby/And I know that for a long time people have been using the word experimental.
Now the peninsula may seem like more of an experiment because on any one
block we're mixing densities, we're mixing types of housing. And the Northeast
District Plan we're not talking about that, we're still talking about kind of
segregated housing types that closer together than usual and so I don't see this
really as an experiment at all. I think it's bringing it's a natural evolutionist
happening all over the country and it's been happening in Iowa City here and
there and now we're just kind of putting kind of all those elements all together
and putting it out there with some principles behind it to help guide (can't hear).
Champion/Well there's a reason that these neighbor or neighborhood works that are
more mixed and rather that infused segregated expanses. When you mix income
levels and when you mix education levels you generally provide safer
neighborhoods and better schools so there's a lot of reasons why this kind of
development is becoming successful because people function better if their mixed.
And that' s true of children and that' s true of adults so I think what we're heading
for is very positive I think getting there is going to be a little rougher that I
thought it would be.
Vanderhoef/But I'd like to point out that maybe hasn't been said in so many words we
had a lot of citizens put a lot of time in on this project and it is possible that they
took ownership of the plan as they developed it and the things that were most dear
to them that they saw come around. The home builders are now seeing the
flexibility is there, I hope that those people who spent their time working on the
project also recognize that because of their pet idea that went into that it might not
happen just the way they visioned it and that's that's the same kind of thing that
we saw in that previous public heating but even though that was a one ownership
there were still some people who took ownership in that and expected certain
things to happen so I suspect that in some point in time we will have some of the
people who worked on the project who will come down to council and say that
isn't what we meant, that isn't what we wanted but their going to have to
remember that this a guideline, this is the flexible plan and it may not happen
exactly like they visioned it and put it into the plan.
O'Donnell/Good said.
Thomberry/I don't know if I'd want to live in a house or a neighborhood that was
designed by a committee. I know I wouldn't want a pet designed by a committee
so I think the flexibility has got to be in this plan, yes it's a vision, but it's not
hard and fast I don't think that. If I were to buy a lot from one of the developer's
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I don't want my neighbors to design that house. And if I want my garage in front
by god that's what I'm going to have.
Norton/Nobody's suggesting they design the house.
Thornberry/So that's, You know I think that that plan has got to got to show that.
Lehman/Do we have a motion to continue this heating to June 291h?
Thornberry/So moved.
O'Donnell/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Thornberry, seconded by O'Donnell. Discussion. All in favor. The
meeting is continued, did we receive correspondence?
Karr/No but would you like to?
Kubby/Yes so moved.
Vanderhoef/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Kubby, seconded by Vanderhoefto accept correspondence. All in
favor, motion carries.
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ITEM NO. 5h. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION APPROVING A FINAL PLAT OF
COUNTRY CLUB ESTATES FIRST ADDITION, A 10.4 ACRE, 20-LOT
RESIDENTIAL SUBDIVISION LOCATED AT THE WEST TERMINUS
OF PHOENIX DRIVE. (SUB98-0027)
Lehman/Do we have the?
Dilkes/The applicant has request deferral until June 29.
Kubby/So moved.
Thomberry/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Kubby, seconded by Thornberry to defer to June 291h. All in favor.
It' s deferred.
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ITEM NO. 6.(2). A PURCHASE BETWEEN THE CITY OF IOWA CITY AND
LORA M. ALBERHASKY FOR CONDOMINIUM UNIT 1A IN THE TO-
BE-CONSTRUCTED IOWA AVENUE MULTI-USE PARKING FACILITY
AND AUTHORIZING THE MAYOR TO SIGN AND THE CITY CLERK
TO ATTEST ANY DOCUMENT OF CONVEYANCE REQUIRED BY
SAID AGREEMENT.
Lehman/Do I hear a motion of the resolution?
Thomberry/Move adoption of resolution.
O'Donnell/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Thomberry, seconded by O'Donnell. Discussion.
Norton/Is this a first, is this our first for the city?
Thomberry/One A.
Atkins/First.
Norton/I mean obviously it's our first unit but is it the first time we've done this kind of
thing?
Atkins/Oh I thought it was just the first time you had a public hearing.
Norton/Oh no, no, no.
Vanderhoef/First condo unit.
Norton/First condo unit of this structure I know but I mean have we done anything like
this before it's really kind of.
Arkins/It's the first time you sold a condo in one minute.
Norton/Yea it's a really a elaborate process.
Champion/I think it took a little more than a minute.
Atkins/0K.
Norton/I want to the legal staff it must not have been easy to put that together.
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Dilkes/No.
Thornberry/I want to congratulate Ms. Alberhasky.
Norton/Yes.
Thomberry/(can't hear).
Norton/Haven't been able to without her.
Dilkes/Lora Alberhasky and Tom Gillman her attorney were quite pleasant to work with,
worked well.
Kubby/And I'm going to be voting this not because of any particular's in the agreement
but because I disagree with this whole project, the whole facility.
O'Donnell/And I'm going to be voting in favor of it because I think it's a wonderful
thing for Iowa City and it's a needed needed structure downtown.
Lehman/Other discussion. Roll call. Motion carries, Kubby voting no.
Champion/I really totally support this parking ramp but even if I felt like Karen did and
didn't support the whole concept I would almost support anything that went on
that lot, it's so awful look.
Vanderhoef/The bare lot, yes.
Champion/Right.
Vanderhoef/I've been looking at that for years and thinking oh my.
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ITEM NO. 7(2). CONVEYANCE OF 2774 IRVING AVENUE.
Thornberry/Move adoption of the resolution.
Norton/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Thornberry, seconded by Norton. Discussion.
Thornberry/I really think this is a neat program.
Lehman/This is a tenant to ownership program I mean this is.
O'Donnell/I totally agree.
Norton/Do we have others coming along?
Vanderhoef/This is our second one in this particular group and we'll have one more as I
understand it.
Norton/It's our second one yea.
Lehman/Our sixth one I think totally in the last few years.
Vanderhoef/Yes of sales in the total program yes.
Lehman/Other discussion. Motion carries.
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ITEM NO. 8. PLANS, SPECIFICATIONS, FORM OF CONTRACT AND
ESTIMATE OF COST FOR THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE WILLOW
CREEK TRAIL PHASE II IMPROVEMENT PROJECT.
Lehman/Public heating is open.
Fred Dunner / My name is Fred Dunner and I live at 1338 Burry Drive. My neighbor
Tom Muller unfortunately couldn't be here tonight although his kind wife is here.
This and the council to give some neighborhood input and to discuss part of the
new trail on Willow Creek Park. Burry Drive is probably one of the shortest
streets in Iowa City if you haven't been there it's L shaped in configuration and
one part is flat and dead ends into Abby where there will be a told a major access
to the park and then the other part goes up a hill and goes into Cae Drive. At the
curve there's currently a sidewalk that runs between my property and that of Tom
and Barb Muller's. The sidewalk's about 125 feet long that' s between our two
properties and four feet wide. A standard city sidewalk. From that sidewalk then
there' s a asphalt trail that approximately 100 feet and originally was a dead end
loop when they first started building the complex, later that joined the major trail
through the Willow Creek Park to join the access across the bridge over on the
other side on Teg Drive. So where there's a broad bike and walking trail that's
proposed for the park we've been told that to meet ADA standards that are
accessed has to be widened and the sidewalk that' s between our houses. And
since then we've been various information. I'm here for some clarification as to
the extent of the changes that will have to be made and if there are any exceptions
that can be made. We have informally surveyed most of the people who use that
part of the park, it's not the major part of the park which is on Teg Drive and so
it's really kind of a neighborhood access for the people primarily on Cae and
Burry and probably about 25 people during the week, probably double that later
on on the weekends primarily walking, jogging or a few bike riders and most of
these people almost all of them do not see a need to widen that sidewalk part
between our houses. We'd all agree though that there needs to be repair on the
asphalt part which is at the back of our property, it's in disrepair and also water
pipe which sticks out in our front sidewalk that' s an obstacle that's several inches
high. We can give you a petition our neighbors on Burry and Cae and others that
uses the trail if needed. We realize with the addition of the bike trail the usage of
the trail will probably change. I'm told that the project will be done in several
segments and so we're asking the city council to defer any change in the small
access until the major trail is in place. Naturally I have concerns about any major
change in the small access from our neighborhood. I would ask how many, well
there aren't too many people left here but how many people in the room have a
sidewalk running not only on the front of their property but also between their
property and that of their neighbors and how many would be happy to learn that
the sidewalk will be increased anywhere from 50 to 100 percent. We have
estimates different, we've told 5 feet, 6 feet, 8 feet. So we don't really have an
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answer. Probably wide enough that riders and motorized bikes and scooters may
see this as a route which we occasionally have happen and on a less serious note
the Roe??? elephants may be able to use this access. We also have concems.
Champion/(can't hear).
Dunner/About the consequence.
Thornberry/No we didn't.
Champion/(can't hear).
Dunner/Making nay major changes we've been told that to meet ADA standards that
their grading requirements and wonder if significant modifications would have to
be made. We've been told by at least one of the city staff well they could just run
from the bottom near the creek up in a straight path that would run right through a
group of small trees behind our homes. We have concerns about the ecological
impact of this since it's used by birds and other small animals and especially in
the winter as a shelter. We are sensitive to the needs of the others who are
physically handicapped but I'd also like the council to take a common sense
approach. So when like people do this when an ordinary sidewalk and that they
step aside or wait if a two wheeler's are passing or a group of people that there's
not enough room on a four foot sidewalk. We'd ask the council to inquire if there
are any other exceptions to the ADA requirements and that part of the project is
funded differently than does it have to meet these requirements? And also if the
sidewalk portion would have to be widened. We have no problem with it widened
after the end of our property. I'd like to make this kind of brief analogy to driving
on the interstate on a very hot day if you've ever been on 1-80 on July and after a
while you kind of tire of seeing the same things. You want to get off the
interstate, take a smaller road which meanders through the country sides, it's a
little bit cooler and a little bit different change of pace. But this is kind of how we
view our kind of small meandering path that's behind our property. And it should
be noted also that a half a block away there's going to be a major access area at
the end of Abby for access to the park. Include your rest in the council to
consider our input, we hope that you reflect and explore if other options are
available. By waiting till the main trail is in place we can have better idea of the
use and needs of this path. We have a lovely nice sidewalk and a meandering trail
and really hate to see it change into kind of a major highway or major access
point. Especially as I said when there's planned about approximately 7 houses or
half a block away.
Kubby/Is that paid for privately?
Dunner/I'm sorry.
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Kubby/Was the original trail and that section of the access to the paid for by the adjacent
property owners7
Dunner/I.
Kubby/Or was that city?
Lehman/That's city.
Vanderhoef/That's city over the.
Lehman/Easement through there.
Vanderhoef/Easement through there.
Champion/Are you going to leave us a copy of your.
Dunner/I can make one up, change I can get you copies.
Norton/Marian can get you copies.
Lehman/I need to ask you a couple. I realize, I visited with Tom about this, I'm very
familiar with, I've been out there and walked it so I know exactly what your
talking about. And I know there's been conversation that's taken place with some
of the folks here at the city staff level. I have no idea what the response has been.
And I absolutely agree with you, I mean if you've got another major access a half
a block away or 7 houses away what your suggesting may or may not be
necessary. I don't know what the ADA requirements are and I don't know what
conversations have transpired between yourself and Tom and city staff. Where
are you in that?
Dunner/I've actually had no contact with the city staff and I've gotten some of the
information from Tom. Tom saw some people out one day and asked what they
were doing and that's how he kind of found out about this process and I did talk to
our neighborhood Judy Pfohl and our neighborhood association and asked to be
notified and so really I guess my other question was as far as the process because
there was no direct kind of communication with me considering it was right
against my property.
Thornberry/Can I ask, how, approximately how far away from the from your house is the
site now?
Dunner/I'm sorry.
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Thornberry/How far away from your house is the walkway between?
Vanderhoef/10 feet.
Lehman/20 feet probably.
Dunner/Probably 20 feet.
Vanderhoef/20.
Norton/Before we have.
Dunner/My house is on a slope and there's a hedge on my side, on the upper side and
then it's really a sidewalk I mean it's concreted and then there's the asphalt at the
end of our property.
Vanderhoef/It's probably 10 feet up at the front and then it sort of widens out because of
the curve there where your house is when you go on down the sidewalk as you
come (can't hear).
Dunner/Went down the sidewalk in fact someone was just out measuring so our
sidewalk's just 121 feet between our houses and that's another 87 feet until the
kind of loop area.
Vanderhoef/Down below.
Dunner/Right and then down below is where the major access area will be going. Where
the major bike trail will be going through.
Vanderhoef/Which follows the creek it's just that this is the entrance into the area and
it's the grade of it is too steep for ADA requirements so it needs to curl off to the
side and come at an angle to meet with the lower loop.
Lehman/Is that what their suggesting?
Vanderhoef/Yea.
Lehman/For this particular walk, their suggesting making up like a snake going up that
hill when there's a major entrance.
Vanderhoef/It's not a snake, no, they can't go as straight down.
Lehman/I know that.
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Vanderhoef/As it presently is and so what they want to do is take it off at an angle about
half way down.
Norton/Down the shoulder.
Vanderhoef/And head it north and then come on down a more gradual slope.
Lehman/When there's already, when there's a major entrance 7 houses away.
Thornberry/Right. Yea, I don't think it's a good idea.
Lehman/I believe, I think this is something we should put into, I mean I don't know the
process.
Atkins/I really think that you have an obligation under ADA it's an entrance.
Kubby/It's the law.
Lehman/Well I, I that may well be but I do think it's something we should.
Atkins/Whether it's major or minor it has to meet the ADA obligations.
Lehman/But I think it's something we can look into, we should check, we can do that.
Atkins/We can certainly, are suggesting that we may want to try to exempt ourselves
(can't hear)?
Lehman/No, I'm saying that if that is an ADA requirement that may be, but if on the
other hand if we have a major entrance 7 houses a way that may not be it
requirement.
Vanderhoef/But what your saying is maybe we should take this one out because it
doesn't meet.
O'Donnell/This entrance, yes.
Champion/Take it out.
Vanderhoef/Take it out.
Champion/Take it out.
Lehman/I just think we should (can't hear).
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Vanderhoef/I don't know if we've got the other one is it possible.
Norton/I don't understand this is a public hearing and if we're going to do, we have a
resolution coming up and does that resolution bless a particular pattern of
construction?
Kubby/Yes, that's the (can't hear).
Atkins/Sure.
Norton/Then we've got to defer I guess right.
Lehman/Well I don't understand this because I know this is an issue that has been
discussed for some time now.
Vanderhoef/Yes.
Lehman/And I know that Tom has talked to Terry Trueblood about it, he's talked to me
about it, he's probably talked to some other folks down here about it I guess I'm
kind of surprised that.
Vanderhoef/I talked to Terry about it.
Lehman/There's been nothing on it until tonight.
Norton/This is the first I've seen of it, I know, (can't hear).
Atkins/Well I under.
Thornberry/I talked to Tom about it several weeks ago and I was opposed to putting this
highway through there between there houses going into the.
Norton/Where does it come up, wait a minute, where does this come up. I've never seen
this item.
Lehman/Well I think that Tom has called some folks that his neighbors, Tom Muller has
called.
Norton/All I'm saying that no one's presented to the council this particular plan.
Lehman/No.
Norton/I've not seen a draft of this.
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Lehman/That's fight.
Norton/I'm ready to defer it.
Champion/I'm ready to defer it.
Norton/I think we all ought to take a look at it. How does it happen that only three of us
know?
Kubby/There's a I mean I'm OK with deferral, but the bottom line is that there's a law
in place that we need to follow.
Vanderhoef/(can't hear) ADA. Yea.
Kubby/And I'm not quite sure what what will happen with the deferral. What will be
asked to (can't hear).
Champion/Maybe we'll do that (can't hear).
Norton/We want to clarify this.
Kubby/But it's already there, we tear it out, tear out concrete you mean, it takes out
money to tear out concrete.
Thornberry/No, I don't know if the law's specifies that the entrance to this has to be
through between beside his property when we've got one (can't hear) away.
Norton/Ifthere's an alternative.
Thornberry/A good alternative yes.
Norton/But it may be that if there's an entrance for anybody there's got to be an entrance
for everybody. And if that's the law then we're stuck fight?
Vanderhoef/That's fight. Yea.
O'Donnell/It's not going to be used if you have to take it out.
Norton/Yea.
O'Donnell/The sidewalk has got to be wide enough I believe for a wheel chair and a
baby stroller to pass.
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Vanderhoef/And the grade has to be safe for wheel chair and everyone to get in and get
out.
O'Donnell/Well it can't be left there it has to be taken out.
Lehman/All right, am I hearing that we want to defer this?
Champion/Yes.
Lehman/Until the 291h and have it addressed by the parks and recreation.
Atkins/Can I ask Rick if that's any trouble Rick?
Lehman/Is that a problem?
Atkins/Rick's saying no.
Norton/OK.
Lehman/Do I have a motion to move.
Norton/So moved.
Dilkes/To continue.
Lehman/No, we can defer.
Norton/I want to continue.
Kubby/To continue the public hearing.
Norton/To continue the public hearing and defer to June 291h.
Lehman/Moved by Kubby and seconded by Thomberry to continue the public hearing to
June 29. All in favor. Opposed.
Kubby/I'm unclear as for what we're directing staff to do in the meantime?
Lehman/I think that we're directing staff to look at the situation he's talking about, give
us more information and tell us whether or not this is a requirement that this needs
to be done. Whether or not the access point has to stay there. If it has to be, what
the options are.
Norton/Clarify.
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Lehman/Maybe no options at all, but at least (can't hear).
Norton/There might not.
Dunner/Another suggestion is do the major trail and then wait and see what the usage is
and then do this part.
Vanderhoef/But this resolution takes care of both of them.
Dunner/Oh.
Lehman/Ron suggest that we communicate that to, Rick who would he talk to? Terry
Treeblood, talk to Parks & Rec. and I'd do that fight away so that we can have the
information we need two weeks from tonight.
Dunner/OK, thank you.
Lehman/Thank you.
Atkins/Terry's gone for a couple weeks.
Norton/How about John?
Atkins/We'll get somebody out there, we'll take care of it.
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ITEM NO. 9. CONSIDER A ORDINANCE AMENDING TITLE 14 ENTITLED
"UNIFORM DEVELOPMENT CODE," CHAPTER 1 ENTITLED
"STREETS, SIDEWALKS, AND PUBLIC RIGHT-OF-WAY
GENERALLY," ARTICLE E ENTITLED "SIGNS IN PUBLIC PLACES,"
SECTION 4 ENTITLED "EXCEPTIONS" OF THE CITY CODE TO
AMEND SIGNS IN PUBLIC PLACES. (FIRST CONSIDERATION)
Thornberry/Move adoption of the ordinance.
Vanderhoef/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Thomberry, seconded by Vanderhoef. Discussion.
Norton/Is there any clarification?
Atkins/Well.
Norton/I asked last night about you and what is this, who gets to put up a sign in a public
fight of way?
Atkins/I would assume of that since I've been being granted this extraordinary authority.
I would try to memo to file and my thinking was that the it would be a clear
policy on my part that we're going to clutter the fight of way with signing.
Secondly that it would be a major destination point, a hospital, park, and we'll
only have a regional nature, something such as that where you might find these
signs. It would be not for profit and that public safety such as hospitals would
have a priority and really beyond that I don't think I'd approve much.
Lehman/You mean the luggage store's out?
Thornberry/The luggage store's out.
Lehman/Further discussion. Roll call. Motion carries.
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ITEM
NO. 10. CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE AMENDING CITY CODE TITLE 8,
CHAPTER 8, ENTITLED "POLICE CITIZENS' REVIEW BOARD,"
SECTION 7, ENTITLED "DUTIES OF THE BOARD; COMPLAINT
REVIEW AND GENERAL DUTIES," REGARDING THE
IDENTIFICATION OF COMPLAINANT(S) AND/OR POLICE
OFFICER(S) IN THE BOARD'S PUBLIC REPORT OF A SUSTAINED
COMPLAINT TO THE CITY COUNCIL. (FIRST CONSIDERATION)
Norton/Move adoption.
Vanderhoef/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Norton, seconded by Vanderhoef. Discussion.
Kubby/I just had one comment and I like the way that the new section is worded in
talking about the PCRB meeting to weight disclosure with public harm and
privacy interest not just of the complainant but of the officer that both are
mentioned, that their parallel interest involved here in terms of those public
interests and private interests. I think this is a very good way to approach it.
Lehman/Other discussion. Roll call.
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ITEM NO. 16. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION AWARDING CONTRACT AND
AUTHORIZING MAYOR TO SIGN AND CITY CLERK TO ATTEST
CONTRACT FOR THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE WESTMINISTER
SANITARY SEWER IMPROVEMENT PROJECT.
Lehman/Bids were opened on May 25, engineer's estimate was $650,000. The low bid
was $521,344.27 for Metro Pavers. Public works engineering is recommending
the award to Metro Pavers.
Norton/Move adoption to the resolution.
Thornberry/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Norton, seconded by Thornberry. This was a nice surprise after some
of ours has been coming above estimate. Any discussion?
Thomberry/I just hope these are coming not because these are coming in under the
engineer' s estimate hopefully not because engineering estimate is high.
Lehman/Same engineer's.
Thornberry/What I mean to, to get a that away you know all you have to do is raise. But
they do these estimates according to a lot of different structures and so they have
real trouble fudging numbers. If they wanted to they would be in big trouble.
Lehman/I think their very precise.
Thornberry/So there very professional in the way they do these things and sometimes the
pavers are looking for jobs sometimes their not I guess.
Norton/All I want to clear up is, is this going to be the end of our troubles with
Westminister. It seemed to me I voted a 100 different corrections to the sewer
system out on Westminster.
Thornberry/I hope this is not done.
Atkins/I hope so.
Lehman/Rick if you agree shake just shake your head yes.
Arkins/Rick's nodding yes.
Lehman/In any case this will be the end of it.
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Norton/OK good.
Lehman/Roll call. Motion carries.
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ITEM NO. 17. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION AWARDING CONTRACT AND
AUTHORIZING MAYOR TO SIGN AND CITY CLERK TO ATTEST
CONTRACT FOR THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE IOWA CITY CIVIC
CENTER THIRD FLOOR ADDITION AND FIRST FLOOR
RENOVATIONS PROJECT.
Lehman/The engineer's estimate was $1,390,000 the low bid was from Contracting
Corporation of Illinois for $1,286,800 their recommending recommendation from
public works engineering to award the project to Contracting Corporation of
Illinois.
Thornberry/Move adoption of resolution.
O'Donnell/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Thornberry, seconded by O'Donnell.
Norton/Could you clarify just what's in the, I just want to clar, what is the first floor,
how much is the first floor renovation is involved?
Atkins/The first floor renovation involves, the clerk's office, personnel and what is now
public works will become assisted housing.
Lehman/We got a handout from you tonight Steve and I think the handout basically
indicated that this bid is approximately.
(End of 99-67 Side 2).
Lehman/This first bid included the police department
Atkins/Yes.
Lehman/And the total was more than we had anticipated spending.
Atkins/If you recall.
Lehman/So we bid only this portion and it is bided about the same price as the first one.
Atkins/Yes, in fact that' s what they used to extrapolate the information is that if you
recall we recommended against the first bid substantially because it was over
budget.
Thornberry/That's right.
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Atkins/And we pulled certain items out. We set a priority and we wanted to make sure
we could use the $200,000 grant. We wanted to get assisted housing in this
building and we made the other decisions for that the other elements can wait.
Lehman/The other thing I find interesting there was a total of 5 bidders on this project.
And they went from a million about three to a million five and they were all very
very close so I have to feel that this was a pretty competitive bidding process.
Atkins/We believe and our architect Don Saw's???? in the audience as well as Rick
when we went over these things that you could pretty much put your thumb over
the first three, I think that tells us that we were pretty close to that.
Champion/You know one thing that really bothers me about these bids is for $12,000
we're awarding this to a company from Moline Illinois.
Lehman/That's.
Atkins/Yep.
Champion/That really does bother me.
Kubby/I wish it weren't $12,000.
Norton/What are your going to do?
Champion/Isn't it?
Lehman/It's $12,000 more than (can't hear).
Kubby/Oh 12,000 more I (can't hear).
(All talking).
Lehman/I don't think we have the latitude to change that Connie. I agree with you but I
think that the state law says that we have to give it to the lowest bidder is that not
correct?
Dilkes/(can't hear).
Lehman/Right.
O'Donnell/(can't hear). That is the law.
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Champion/We did have the option of seeing if somebody local if you can give us
$12,000 dollars less you can have this project?
(All laughing).
Lehman/Eleanor is quivering.
(all talking).
Vanderhoef/Connie says that I should just follow the mouth.
Kubby/If there aren't any changes architecturally to the plans that we saw or the
alternative energy component?
Atkins/No. The natural the energy tower remains, physically the project will look as we
described it to you what is not occurring is substantially remodeling aspects of the
thing. Police, Planning, and HIS.
Kubby/So well planning well that just means that planning will stay as is?
Atkins/Planning is where they are, they will stay there, part of this project made the
assumption that cable would be moving. That was somewhat of a little easier
decision. Secondly Planning & Cable already have a door between the offices,
it's just locked. The Clerk's Office and Personnel are the ones that need to be
moved, and the shift has to go on in order to accommodate their space. And since
we're going to bring assisted housing into where Public Works is, Public Works
goes to the third floor. That's how it all works.
Lehman/Personnel goes where?
Atkins/Personnel stays where they are, Clerk's stay where they we're just more space.
Vanderhoef/Their going to move walls.
Lehman/Move (can't hear).
Vanderhoef/Their going to move over into engineering.
Atkins/Yes, Marian, yes. I don't know where Marian's going. Her office is going to
move a little bit.
Lehman/So she' s not going to move very far?
Atkins/(can't hear).
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Norton/At what point does the Planning get some space?
Atkins/Planning will get some space at the time Cable TV moves out.
Norton/OK.
Vanderhoef/And do they get?
Atkins/But there's no budget for renovation it's just space.
Norton/Well OK.
Atkins/They can assume, they will assume responsibility for it presuming we'll deal with
that when the time comes.
Lehman/And $200,000 of this money is coming is that not correct?
Arkins/Of the $1.286 budget $200,000 is federal grant.
Lehman/OK.
Norton/Can we submit that innovative plan for energy conservation and the artificial
moon and all that for some kind of a financial award?
Arkins/I think you'd probably get a hardy handshake and a pat on the back is about the
best your going to get.
Kubby/I don't think it's that innovative.
Norton/Oh.
Arkins/It's neat but it's not innovative.
Lehman/If we don't vote we're never going to have it. Roll call.
Norton/OK. All right.
Lehman/Motion carries Vanderhoef voting no.
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ITEM NO. 18. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION AWARDING CONTRACT AND
AUTHORIZING MAYOR TO SIGN AND CITY CLERK TO ATTEST
CONTRACT FOR THE CONSTRUCTION OF CONCESSION/
RESTROOM BUILDINGS AT THE IOWA CITY KICKERS SOCCER
PARK.
Lehman/We received five bids and the architect's estimate was $350,000 the low bid
was $394,507 from Moore Construction. It was recommended that the contract be
awarded to Moore Construction for.
Thornberry/Move adoption of the resolution.
O'Donnell/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Thornberry, seconded by O'Donnell. Discussion. Rick you
recommended this? Somebody recommended that we. OK.
Thornberry/The Kickers have (can't hear) $160,000.
Lehman/Well again, whose giving them the money, I mean we're recommending
approval of a contract that is.
Atkins/10 percent high.
Lehman/10, 35.
Norton/34,0350.
Atkins/A little more than that total.
Lehman/All right so approximately but it is recommended. Any discussion.
Atkins/Now what we would intend to do is that with the reward of the contract we feel
free to sit down with the contractor and say are there elements that we might
choose to change and that's my instructions to Terry. We don't believe there' s
going to be a lot because the bottom line it's a cement block building and it's not
too exciting architecturally and we'll do our best.
Champion/How could it cost so much money?
(All talking).
Arkins/There are some things we (can't hear).
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Vanderhoef/(can't hear) work and there's some driveway work all wrapped into this
project that.
Champion/It' s not just the building?
Vanderhoef/No, it's not just the.
Atkins/We'll go after that.
Lehman/Well but the other thing I think is significant here is that the low bid of
$394,000 is only 10 Percent less than the fourth highest bid. I mean these are
very close competitive bids which would indicate to me that the architects
estimate was probably low.
Thomberry/Less than $3,000 between the top two.
Lehman/Yea.
Dilkes/Just to clarify Terry and I have talked about this as well and we can make minor
changes that one might do by change (can't hear) but we can not restructure this
project.
Lehman/Oh no we know that.
Atkins/That's interesting.
Lehman/Roll call. Motion carries.
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ITEM NO. 19. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION APPROVING AND AUTHORIZING
EXECUTION OF AN AGREEMENT BETWEEN THE CITY OF IOWA
CITY AND JOHN F. AND VIRGINIA LEE STAMLER FOR
TEMPORARY USE OF PUBLIC RIGHT-OF-WAY FOR A PORTION OF
MCLEAN STREET IN IOWA CITY, IOWA.
Thornberry/Move adoption of resolution.
Vanderhoef/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Thornberry, seconded by Vanderhoef. Is there discussion?
Kubby/Yea, I'm not quite sure why we wouldn't, I'll get the word, they pay and then you
give it, sell it to the person, anyway, if we're going to allow them to put a, if we
can't think of a use you would need that right of way for now and we're going to
allow them to put a driveway which is a fairly permanent piece of infrastructure
for a house why we wouldn't go that other step with this property. So there must
be some reason.
Thornberry/Rick may know.
Lehman/It says if the city decides to use it that
Vanderhoef/They tear it up.
Lehman/For any reason they have to tear it out and.
Kubby/I know but this kind of seems unusual.
Rick Fosse/Yea I think in this case we really want to keep our options open in that
neighborhood. If you recall we've had so many issues surrounding that Lexington
Dip that if at some point that becomes intolerable this gives us an opportunity to
take Lexington over to Hutchinson.
Lehman/OK.
Fosse/It's very unlikely but I don't want to cut off our ability to do that at some point in
the future.
Lehman/Very good. Thank you.
Kubby/Thank you.
Champion/(can't hear).
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Lehman/OK. Roll call. Motion cardes.
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ITEM NO. 20. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION APPROVING AND AUTHORIZING
EXECUTION OF AN AGREEMENT WITH MICHAEL S., CHRISTINE
M., MONICA B., AND MARC B. MOEN FOR TEMPORARY USE OF
PUBLIC RIGHT-OF-WAY FOR A PORTION OF CLINTON STREET IN
IOWA CITY, IOWA.
Thornberry/Move adoption of resolution.
Norton/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Thornberry, seconded by Norton. This is for authorization to use part
of Clinton Street for the reconstruction of the Whiteway building that burned. Is
there discussion?
Kubby/Well last night I asked the question about the closing of the alley and what that
time ~ame would be. Fm very hesitant to allow long-term closing of an alley. I
don't mind interim closure of an alley for certain parts of a project for a day or
two or a section of a day but to allow an alley to be closed it (can't hear) that a
travel pass around lots of loads of transportation and delivery to businesses I have
a problem. I still need clarification on that.
Lehman/I think that's good, it's not relative to this but I think it's a good question.
Kubby/Is it the next one?
Arkins/It's the next one.
Kubby/Oh sorry, I'll just say dido when the time comes.
Lehman/Is that the next one is the alley?
Atkins/That's what I understand.
Vanderhoef/21.
Thornberry/Well it says.
(All talking).
Kubby/It says close an alley.
(All talking).
Atkins/I'm sorry.
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Vanderhoef/103.
Atkins/Yep. I'm. Yep.
Rick Fosse/One of the issues is the alleys only about 20 feet wide and this building can
be up to seven stories tall and we think for safety reasons it's important that to be
able to close that off. We do have an out you know if we decide that that's an
unworkable situation, we can give them 30 days notice to get out of the alley and
open that up. But again working seven stories high next to that much of a narrow
space is.
Kubby/So this is for that for a year.
Fosse/About 18 months I think.
Kubby/I'm really.
Norton/That's long.
Thornberry/How do you build a seven story building with like a zero lot line? If you
drop the hammer on a car that's going through there or.
Norton/You'd have to cover it.
Lehman/Well but this alley is only. There is access through that parking lot.
Fosse/Yes there is.
Lehman/We're not really talking about any particular inconvenience to people located
there.
Champion/(can't hear).
Lehman/From a delivery standpoint.
Fosse/Yea, the beer trucks will find it tight but I think.
Kubby/Yea it matters what how big a vehicles coming through there.
Lehman/Well that's true but.
Kubby/To make that tum from the middle of the parking lot.
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Lehman/But I can't imagine that' s very many that can't negotiate that turn through that
parking lot.
Champion/Well they can, build a building without (can't hear).
Vanderhoef/The alley's aren't going to be closed back to the parking lot.
Norton/Right.
Lehman/Yea.
Fosse/Just west of there.
Vanderhoef/So the other piece of the alley can be used as a circle or truck coming in,
they can come in one and go out the other, they don't have to turn around.
Norton/But don't you, you think of everything too.
Kubby/Part of the challenges because the alley is so narrow is that it may seem feasible
in speaking about it but in actually doing it I think is harder.
Vanderhoef/It's not an easy turn no I agree.
Norton/Well your going to find out in a hurry.
Fosse/Yea we might need to hood one of those spaces near the end of.
Lehman/Well but that alley has been closed since the fire.
Norton/Yep.
Lehman/It hasn't been open for one day has it?
Kubby/No.
Fosse/You can get through now, it was closed for a number of weeks there.
Kubby/Yea.
Lehman/It was closed for a long time.
Fosse/Yes.
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Kubby/Yea but 18 months is a long time. Is there a way that we can reduce that time to
meet the concerns of safety while that portion of the building is going up?
Fosse/I don't know the answer to that right now.
Thornberry/I think perhaps if if to be serviced from that alley and can't because of the
closure of that portion of the alley again you can give them 30 days and they can
open it up if at all possible.
Kubby/Could we send?
Thornberry/But right now they've been serviced with that portion closed.
Fosse/Right.
Thornberry/So what can happen in the next year that hasn't been done since the fire?
Kubby/I don't know, I mean, I don't what the rhythm of deliveries are for what pool of
vehicles are needed that maybe they understood when the alley was going to be
closed and so they adjusted ordering, I have no idea. I don't know.
Thornberry/Well they haven't needed an order.
man/Needed an order.
Norton/Why do we have to figure this out, have they talked to those owners of those
other buildings that are going to have their access limited?
Kubby/Well I certainly heard from some. I've heard from some.
Norton/Well I've heard from Jim but I don't know.
Lehman/Well let me ask you Rick is it is there any feasible way of building a six story
building without closing the alley? Is there a safe way of doing it?
Fosse/I've not seen it, I don't have a lot of experience in those kinds of things.
Lehman/Is that a no?
Fosse/From my prospective no, I can research it.
Lehman/It's a matter of public safety closing that out.
Fosse/That's the way we view it yes.
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Lehman/OK.
Kubby/I'd like to make a specific suggestion and that we ask staff to send a
correspondence to the owners and the leasee's of those buildings to say if this is a
problem please communicate with us, so that we can see ifthere's some
adjustments that could be made. But if there's going to be two months out of that
18 where it doesn't have to be closed that it could be opened up during that period
of time or so we let them know we're open to hearing about it. There is the 30-
day clause and we're open to trying to figure things out.
NortoW I think we ought to ask them.
Lehman/I think that.
Kubby/That maybe assumed but I think it's good to say's it's (can't hear).
Lehman/I think it's a good point and I Rick once the outside walls are up on that
building and the outside obviously goes up much more quickly than the inside.
When there finishing the inside of that building off there really is not or may not
be a need for that alley to be closed.
Fosse/Right.
Champion/Probably.
Lehman/There's a convenience factor for the builder but certainly not a safety for the
public.
Fosse/Right.
Lehman/So I think we should keep tabs of that so that alley really probably wouldn't
have to be closed for the whole period.
Fosse/OK, would we need to amend the agreement Eleanor or can we just?
Vanderhoef/I would think so.
Kubby/Well it (can't hear) how's it's written because if it's written 18 months and it's
not saying 18 month's for safety concern.
Vanderhoef/We did that for parking spaces on Iowa Avenue that we held it up until we
got the.
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Dilkes/I'm going to have to look at it.
Thornberry/(can't hear) they can change it within 30 days.
O'Donnell/You know there's really no place down there that the park construction truck
is I know their going to be parking in the alley, alley's going to be blocked
anyway and the pedestrian block down the alley is.
Norton/Well the question is how long, I think there ought to be some flexibility in it,
that's what I think if they can shorten it from this or even open it for a month. I
don't know December you know is snow season it may be different than now.
Maybe we could be more flexible, I don't know what you'd have to do.
Vanderhoeff Well my concern actually with is fire again and how we get into the back
side of say the middle of the College Street block and so forth that is much as
possible to keep that open I think is real important.
Fosse/
If you recall when First National Bank was reconstructed a few years ago they did
construction staging during the day and then they moved their equipment out at
night so it was open and available for fire access and that sort of thing. But they
didn't have the issue of the seven stories and their structure was already in place.
Vanderhoef/Yes.
Dilkes/There is the 30 day clause for termination. My preference however would be that
I think there' s going to be an expectation under this agreement that it can be
closed for 18 months and I think that I suspect that their planning their
construction with that expectation and so I think in the best of all worlds and I
don't know when construction is suppose to start so I don't know how important
it is to go forward with this agreement right now but I would think you would
work those things out ahead of time at the beginning and not you know.
Thornberry/They've asked, they've asked to close it or you've asked to have it closed.
Fosse/They've asked.
Thornberry/They've asked.
Dilkes/We're well within our rights in the agreement to give 30 days notice I just don't
think that's probably the ideal way to do it.
Thomberry/What would be a better way of doing it, give them a month to month?
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Dilkes/No I think the ideal way to do it would be figure out up front if there has to be, if
the alley has to be closed for 18 months, if it does then it does, and if it, if there
are other options then those should be specified.
Norton/How can we get to that just defer it?
Kubby/I prefer to defer, I feel uncomfortable doing that not knowing because I want
them to begin rebuilding but I also think that this is important for other people
who are downtown as well as the safety issue.
Vanderhoef/I would be willing to come back per a quick 8:00 AM special meeting to get
it done if it worked out sooner than two weeks.
Champion/It might not affect their construction.
Norton/Well what are we asking them to do? (can't hear).
(All talking)
Kubby/Right, I think it has to be closed that whole time, if there can be intermittent
opening and that one the safety issue is no longer there that it remain open.
Lehman/Well is it not true that that alley has been closed for a period of several weeks
after the fire without authorization from us for a permit to have it closed? So that
if I can't imagine that it would take us two more weeks to do this and they need to
close that alley obviously that I'm aware of complained when that alley was
closed for six weeks or whatever during the time it took them to do the
construction that (can't hear) cleaning.
Kubby/It was also an extenuating circumstance because of the disaster so.
Lehman/Well yea but I don't well I don't.
Dilkes/What I suggest would be the ideal way to do it we're operating without complete
knowledge here so it's hard to make a decision when you could go ahead and
approve the agreement, you could make it known immediately tot he property
owners that you want to know what the other options are if we can close the alley
for not the entire 18 month period
Norton/I move that we defer.
Dilkes/And that we will rely on the 30 day clause if we have to.
Kubby/I second.
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Champion/I would like to defer it but I'm willing to come down for a special meeting if
it's going to affect their construction schedule.
Kubby/So we should defer indefinitely so the date is flexible fight if we want to.
Fosse/What option is if you defer is that if there construction schedule is such they need
to start prior to the next meeting, we can give them a temporary permit through
our office, a long-term permit (can't hear).
Norton/OK, that's good then we can defer and check it out.
Kubby/We'll do the 291h so we don't have to have a special meeting.
Norton/I'm willing to defer to the 291h.
Lehman/Yea, moved by Norton seconded by Champion. All in favor.
Norton/Or had you already moved I?
Lehman/Opposed. We just deferred it till the 291h.
Norton/OK good.
Champion/Yea.
Lehman/Cause that Rick will you work this out with them, I don't know how the
wording could be but I think you understand what we're saying. Their very well
could be during that 18 month period a period of time where that alley could very
well be open and maybe not but I do think it should be presented to them.
Norton/Or looking.
Fosse/Can I follow-up on the Westminister thing for just a second.
Lehman/Yes.
Fosse/The reason that sounds familiar to you is that that project was deferred at least
once if not twice but we've not done any work out there yet so there's not been
any successful.
Norton/He saw this (can't hear) threats.
Fosse/Yes. This summer we'll tear it up.
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Karr/Can we have a motion to accept correspondence on 20? You've got letter there.
Vanderhoef/So moved.
Norton/Second.
Lehman/Moved and seconded to accept correspondence all in favor. Motion carries.
Vanderhoef/Are you staying?
Fosse/Yea.
Vanderhoef/OK, cause I've got a question later.
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ITEM NO. 21. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION APPROVING AN AUTHORIZING
EXECUTION OF AN AGREEMENT WITH THE MOEN GROUP FOR
TEMPORARY USE OF PUBLIC RIGHT-OF-WAY FOR A PORTION OF
CLINTON STREET IN IOWA CITY, IOWA.
Lehman/It's relative to this (can't hear).
Thornberry/Move adoption of resolution.
Lehman/Moved by Thomberry.
Vanderhoef/Second.
Lehman/Seconded by Vanderhoef. This really covers this is the same situation as the
last one is it not?
Kubby/But it does not include the alley.
Thornberry/That's correct. To facilitate the safe reconstruction of a a building now does
that mean to to do that safe reconstruction of a building does that mean that at
times they may close the alley?
Dilkes/This isn't the alley, the one before it would, this property is not adjacent to the
alley.
Lehman/This isn't the alley it's the street but it also provides the (can't hear). But this is
a.
Thornberry/212 South Clinton Street.
Dilkes/No, 103 College Street is the property that we are talking about here. Not the
building being rebuilt but the property owner's who are requesting (can't hear).
Thornberry/OK.
Lehman/And to provide a six foot covered walkway so this is different. Further
discussion. Roll call. Motion carries.
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ITEM NO. 22. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION TEMPORARILY CLOSING A
PORTION OF DUBUQUE STREET RIGHT-OF-WAY AND
AUTHORIZING THE EXECUTION OF AN AGREEMENT FOR
TEMPORARY USE OF PUBLIC RIGHT-OF-WAY BETWEEN THE CITY
OF IOWA CITY AND THE UNIVERSITY OF IOWA.
Lehman/Isn't that adjacent to Mayflower resident' s hall.
Vanderhoef/OK move adoption of the resolution.
Lehman/Moved by Vanderhoef. I hate to see it die for a lack of seconds.
O'Donnell/Second.
Lehman/Seconded by O'Donnell. Discussion.
Vanderhoef/OK last night I asked about where the Cambus was going to stop in this area
and I have a note back from Jeff Davidson. It said that the south two-thirds of that
area where the bus normally pulls in in that loading zone area that's away from
the two lanes of traffic will be open for the bus so their only closing off a third of
that area.
Thornberry/Well it says closure includes the loading and unloading lane adjacent to the
Mayflower Residence Hall.
VanderhoefJ That's why I asked the question last night and Jeff called today to find out
and their only closing a third of that so there's still space for the bus to pull in and
get out of the traffic lanes so I'm OK with it.
Lehman/OK, I'm OK your OK. Any other discussion? Roll call. Motion carries.
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ITEM NO. 23. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION AUTHORIZING THE MAYOR TO
SIGN AND THE CITY CLERK TO ATTEST A RESOURCE
ENHANCEMENT AND PROTECTION FUND GRANT AGREEMENT
WITH THE DEPARTMENT OF NATURAL RESOURCES IN
CONNECTION WITH THE SOUTH SYCAMORE REGIONAL
STORMWATER AND GREENSPACE PROJECT.
Lehman/This is a grant in the amount of $200,000 to assist the city in the acquisition and
development of that wetlands project.
Norton/Move adoption.
Vanderhoef/Second.
Lehman/Moved by Norton, seconded by Vanderhoef. Discussion.
Vanderhoef/I would like to know what the cities obligation is with this grant. Do we
have matching funds or what do we have?
Fosse/Our obligation is to proceed with the project in order to get the money.
Lehman/Which we're doing anyway.
Fosse/Right, right. And if we don't proceed certainly the money goes back to them.
Vanderhoef/But it isn't a match or anything else?
Fosse/No. They this grant doesn't come with as many strings attached as like the corp
permit for the same project. That' s what's really got the strings attached to it.
Vanderhoef/OK. And will we be eligible for more of these as we go into the other
phases?
Fosse/That's our hope is this is a multi-year project and we're going to score perhaps
more one or more two grants on this project.
Vanderhoef/Good.
Norton/Where do we stand on this project? Have we started or when?
Fosse/We're working with the property owners right now to get the property that we
need for it and construction would begin next summer on it.
Norton/Next summer.
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Fosse/Yes.
Lehman/Other discussion. Roll call. Motion carries.
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ITEM NO. 30. CITY COUNCIL INFORMATION.
Thornberry/Well I've got two things.
Lehman/Your first go.
Thornberry/The first thing is I would like to let my mom know I'm thinking about her,
she' s in the hospital again at Mercy Hospital and she' s I talked to her this
evening and she's feeling much better and hurry up and get well mom and come
on home.
Thornberry/The second this is the three C's. But you all know what those are. The
circles, the chokers and the chicanes. Highland's Highland Avenue you know we
tried these chokers and these chicanes on Highland Street and we're not always
fight on everything we do and nobody is always right all the time. And I really
really would like to write a wrong by eliminating the chicanes on Highland Street.
I really do, these are streets that are been paid for by taxpayers throughout the
city, it's not a private street. I think their dangerous, at least the ones on Highland
I think are quite dangerous during a rainstorm, late afternoon when there is some
sun some shade it's kind of camouflaged. I noticed that they put reflectors on the
curbs but it's on the top of the curbs and you can't see them from the front but
that's neither here nor there. There are already tire tracks across the tops of them
where the dirt is that will soon be a weed bed or a flower bed. I don't know if
these are going to be mini parks and whose going to take care them. Whose going
to take care of the weeds, I don't know. But I think their dangerous, I think their
expensive and I think we made a mistake. And I think they should be eliminated
as soon as possible, not a year from now, a day from now, we've given them a
chance, they don't work. Already people have driven over them, there are tire
tracks in them. I don't want to see somebody hurt on these things. It's not a
private street, it's a public street, we all pay for our streets in our town.
Champion/You know Dean you could be right.
Norton/Well I want to admit but when
Champion/Especially when (can't hear).
Norton/This is an implementation of a policy that we adopted in good faith we I think
there's some modifications certainly ought to be made. I think the staff is
prepared to do so but to not give this a reasonable reasonable shake and imply that
we suddenly did something and suddenly want to take it out. A good deal of
thought of policy everything was followed, everything the people that live there
are into it but I think it's absolutely essential that we give it a decent interval and
partly markings for safety. And I thing there are poles on the ones on College
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Street and I agree it's too tight as it stands and I think we need to try it civilizely
with a little bit of modifications. I think it would just be a mistake to suggest that
we put these in without any forethought, we with a great deal of forethought.
Champion/Oh we did put a lot of thought.
Thomberry/I don't think we knew what it was going to look like Dee before we voted on
it.
Norton/I understand perfectly.
Thornberry/We didn't have a picture of a street showing half of the street taken up by a
chicane by a.
Norton/People who looked at Portland have driven around in circles, and in Portland are
much more severe than the ones we have on College.
Thornberry/I'm not crazy about those either.
O'Donnell/I agree with Dean these are very very severe severe.
Norton/Yea, I'm willing to cut them back but I think it would be a mistake to go all the
way.
O'Donnell/When you can't travel the street thought at a posted speed limit you have a
big problem.
Norton/I agree with that but these people are going remember 85 percent of them are
going more than 5 miles an hour that was the evidence that we had. People are
speeding on that street, we are obliged also not just to provide streets but to
provide safe streets and that's our effort to do so. We are not here just trying to
interrupt people we're trying to get people to slow down.
Thornberry/I don't think you should block the streets off with blacktop Dee just because
their speeding, that's what they write speeding tickets for. You don't put
blockades in the streets to keep people from speeding. You give them speeding
tickets.
Lehman/If I remember correctly last night we did talk about this with traffic engineer
Jeff Davidson. As I recall the one the thing we kind of at least well I thought we
kind of agreed to is having those modified certainly I think we all agree they are
all too severe and I something and Dean you may be right, they may come out
totally. But I do think that for us to take them out totally without modifying them
and giving them an oppommity obviously what's there right now is not working it
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is not good, it's got to be changed. There may be something in between that is a
good idea and I guess I'm willing to give those folks an opportunity to see to
show us what they can do.
Thornberry/If they if they think the traffic is too fast on that request the speed sign that
says how fast their going and start giving tickets down there. We target certain
areas for tickets and if another street were easier to travel than another one then
you shouldn't blockade the one and force people offof it. Make the other one
easier to travel so people will do it voluntarily.
Norton/(can't hear).
Lehman/A larger question.
Thornberry/And but I think that parking on both sides of the street on Highland will slow
traffic to a certain degree, there's nobody that I'm familiar with that tries to hit
other cars that are parked alongside the road, so they do leave some leeway
between those cars so that does slow traffic down. The fire department is not
crazy about it, they've resisted speed humps and chicanes and everything else for
safety purposes and I just don't think that they belong there, I think we ought to
try parking on both sides of the street first. And target that area for speeders if
that' s the problem. Any through street such as Highland is going to have speeders
and every street in town that is a through street has speeders but it only goes from
Gilbert Street up to Yewell Street. Because after Yewell Street there are such
drastic dips in that street.
Norton/Oh their called traffic calmers.
Thomberry/No their not, actually for water but.
Norton/I understand.
Thornberry/But they do definitely slow traffic, but I think it's way way way to severe. I
think parking on both sides of the street ought to be done first. Now, I don't know
what these things cost to put in, they've already dug up the street underneath them
and put dirt in and I asked why it was dug up underneath those things when it was
a temporary measure to begin with, and they said it was for drainage. Well they
could have had them there without the dirt in there and put little drains in those
things.
Champion/That whole thing wasn't dug up.
Thornberry/No no but there are holes all the way through the concrete and blocked out
the concrete down there for drainage in there and I just think they went overboard
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and I think they should be taken out and tried something else. Parked cars on both
sides if need be, do other things, but those chicanes are dangerous, their just they
just shouldn't be there.
Vanderhoef/Well I'm going to agree with you Dean. I wasn't in favor of putting these
chicanes in there begin with, I like them even less now to be real honest. I do
think they are unsafe when I listened tonight and when we were talking about
having our bus route coming down Highland Avenue and I'm thinking about
people trying to meet the bus there. I know it's slowing our emergency vehicle
response time whether it be police or ambulance or fire I'm not in favor of them
I'm willing to take them out. I'm also willing to to look at moving traffic through
that neighborhood via some stoplights up on Kirkwood to have a flow of traffic in
there that will handle the needs of the citizens of Iowa City who must travel
across that area. Oh and the cost I was given some information and check me if
I'm incorrect Jeff Davidson told me that the expenditure so far on Highland and
College Washington area traffic calming was someplace in the neighborhood of
$12 to $13,000. And I had a caller today who said the rumor on the street was
that it cost $80,000 so I did want to really get this out.
Champion/Isn't that the total budget we have for traffic calming?
Vanderhoef/No, there's $25,000, $25,000 is our budget and they had expected this one I
think to be just about double is what Jeff said so they had expected it to be around
that $24,000 to $25,000 instead it has come in between $12,000 and $13,000 so
it's not as expensive a mistake as we thought it might be.
Champion/No, I thought the total budget for traffic calming was (can't hear).
Lehman/It's $25,000.
Champion/Oh it's only 25.
Vanderhoef/Yea, and they requested they said we might have to look at 50 for next year,
that was in the packet so that might be what your thinking of Connie.
Lehman/We asked Jeff last night and our traffic engineer looked at those and I really
believe this needs to, I know that the out in the front of Senior Center took us two
years to get taken out.
Thomberry/And that was temporary.
Lehman/And these can't wait that long, but I really believe we need to modify them if
we modify them very quickly and Dean I didn't favor putting them in on the other
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hand we've got them there right now and I think to not to modify them and see if
they will work probably would be a mistake. And I if.
Thornberry/It was a mistake to put them in and I to rectify the mistake and to do
something else it's still a public street, it's not a private street.
Lehman/I realize that.
Thornberry/And take them out of my portion of my deck.
Lehman/But I do think we need to do that very quickly Steve I mean I think that needs to
be done (can't hear).
Norton/You can just as soon do it tomorrow.
Atkins/I have the crews were out today.
Lehman/Oh good.
Atkins/Well I'm not done yet.
Thornberry/Well they didn't do anything.
Atkins/No they had to measure them you know they have to be measured.
Thornberry/A day to measure them.
Atkins/Yea.
Norton/(can't hear).
Atkins/In fact they went out at 2:00 this afternoon and I would hope to have the folks out
in the next day or say to get.
Kubby/There is a letter in our packet from Doug who people in the area saying what are
the decision was from last night. Because make the lanes a little wider and it said
in the next few days that it would be done.
Karr/It's in front of you tonight, it's a Xerox of this colored card but it's in front of you.
Lehman/OK.
Norton/I understand (can't hear) can do it tomorrow.
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O'Donnell/We can modify these things.
Lehman/If we can't we take them out but we try that first.
O'Donnell/We're going to be back a week later (can't hear) once again.
Norton/Well then take them out.
(All talking).
Thomberry/I think we ought to modify them back to them.
O'Donnell/It's time to admit that we made a mistake on this thing I don't see any
purpose in prolonging the agony of these things.
Champion/I think we made a mistake too but I'm not sure that I'm not willing to prolong
the agony.
Kubby/Cause I don't think I think these this kind of method of slowing traffic down is
very new for our community and I think there's a period of adjustments and so
we're going to cut back on it and I don't think a week is a long enough time for
people to get used to them. I wouldn't be in favor of even if there was a big
outcry in one week to remove them let's give it a chance for a longer period of
time.
Lehman/You do agree that they should be modified?
Kubby/Yea.
Thomberry/We were told last night and I asked where else were chicanes put in and
there 's no other city in the state of Iowa that has chicanes.
Norton/That's all right there's lots of thing.
Champion/Iowa doesn't have a lot of cities.
Kubby/But there's a lot of places around the country and there are places (can't hear).
Lehman/Let's not belabor this, are there four people who want those removed?
Thornberry/I do.
Vanderhoef/Yes.
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Lehman/Last night we agreed that we wanted to try them and modify them.
Thornberry/Well modify them back to the curve then.
Lehman/Well OK but the decision last night was not to modify them back to the curb it
was to.
Thornberry/Well you voted against it in the first place.
Lehman/That's correct. But at the same time when we spend $12,000 trying it I'm
willing to have it modified and see if it will work if it won't take them out, but
let's give them a shot.
Champion/Right.
Thornberry/Well and I think we've given them a shot and I think it's dangerous and I
don't know and I don't know what your going to wait for.
Kubby/You've articulately made your argument.
Thornberry/I don't know what your going to wait for. Are your going to wait for an
accident, your going to wait for what?
Norton/I drive through them four or five times a day and I manage them even the way
they are.
Lehman/Well I think their terrible the way they are now, can we have them modified?
Champion/Can we move on?
Lehman/All right. Now Dean did you have anything else?
Thornberry/No.
Champion/You can't call for a vote, it's obviously a vote.
Lehman/Dee.
Vanderhoef/All righty. Thursday June 17 4-6 we are recognizing one of our community
development projects in the Torras Technology in their new building out at 3007
Sierra Court, come on out and see this it's a real interesting project they have a the
company that makes the very large mirrors and glass for telescopes.
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Vanderhoef/And the Heritage Tree group is looking for volunteers for tree identification
and survey they will be having a training session on June 11 at 7:00 PM or
Sunday aftemoon June 13 at 2:00 PM at St. Thomas More Church, 405 N.
Riverside Drive.
Vanderhoef/And my last thing was Rick still got a way before I got him asked.
Lehman/It is five after 11:00.
Vanderhoef/Well I understand that I looked down after we went through that last issue
and you started talking about appointments and he had already stepped out. I
would like to find out what we know about the backup of the sewers that
happened about a week and a half ago on Grant Street.
Atkins/Grant.
Vanderhoef/Yea, about half a block north of Sheridan.
Atkins/About a week ago.
Vanderhoef/It was that big rain it was like on a Wednesday or Thursday.
Atkins/OK, I'll find out for you, I'll get back to you.
Lehman/Mr. Norton.
Norton/Well a couple of quick one. You'll all appreciate this, I've been out with my car
again. Crandic tracks are getting pretty bad on south, come on this is important,
South Clinton, South Dubuque are pretty bad. South Dubuque, South Clinton
and.
Lehman/South Capitol.
Norton/And South Capitol, they're all are getting down there need to take a look at them.
Norton/I also wanted to mention that in my address and I mentioned it last night that we
do something serious about this truck loading downtown.
Atkins/I'd already started.
Norton/You know I had two calls again today about it of the we need to try to figure a
way to keep some of the trucks, I don't want to swing what kind of trucks. But
somehow to manage that a little bit better on it may be exasperated by all the
construction going on downtown now.
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Atkins/I don't believe so.
Norton/But we ought to see about it.
Champion/Their not all beer trucks.
Norton/Right.
Norton/And (can't hear) I wanted to tell you that some of our distinguished colleagues
and Dean and Mike and I participated in the Coralville Golf Tournament at
Brown Deer, not a tournament, it was a best ball affair celebrating Coralville's
acquisition of a golf course. Dean was very distinguished, Mike and I were less
distinguished but we had a good time.
Thornberry/Had a great time.
Norton/And there' s another big event all four of the gentleman on the cotmcil are going
to.
Thornberry/Ernie can't go so Dee's going to.
Norton/Oh your in it oh good.
Vanderhoef/I'm playing with you guys.
Norton/Oh goodness gracious. That's on the 271h of June.
Vanderhoef/He's going to be there I can tell.
Norton/I can see a disaster enacted 2:00 isn't it? Where's it Fairview.
Thornberry/Fairview at 2:00.
O'Donnell/Fairview at 2:00.
Vanderhoef/Our tee time is 2:00.
Norton/2:00 on the 271h.
Atkins/Employee golf game.
Thornberry/It is, city employee golf outing.
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Norton/I wanted to comment or congratulate the chamber on the community leadership
program. They had their graduation last week and I think that's a really excellent
who were interested in the community leadership program which really gives
people a chance to over a period of a year to really get familiar with what goes on
in very many aspects of the city and I think they should be congratulated and the
people interested should contact the chamber.
Lehman/Well and I also think we need, our staff needs to be congratulated we've had
several people from the employees of the City of Iowa City have gone through
that program. It's not a program that everybody gets into.
Vanderhoef/David Schoon was in the class this year and so was Hinsman from the
Atkins/From the fire department.
Vanderhoef/Hinsman from the fire department.
Vanderhoef/Something else that was real interesting to watch I went to that banquet and
they had sort of like reunion time with their previous classes and the commoratory
and the can do and the stories of how they keep interacting through out the city
and the projects that their working on and doing is just an extension of the things
that they did as class members and it might have been five years ago. So it's a
real community building activity as well as an educational, it's a great program.
Lehman/Mike.
O'Donnell/I have just a couple things. Iowa City in particular the Iowa City High
School has turned into a real mecca for state champions.
Norton/They've got a lot.
O'Donnell/Their are so many state champions and it's hard to keep up with them but the
most recent is the boys tennis team at City High. And I was very glad to see that
the neighborhood and the school board worked out the.
Norton/Light problem.
O'Donnell/They got that resolved, there's going to be shields on there and I was going to
also mention the chicanes but Dean beat me to it. I think we I think it's time we
admit we made a mistake, these are not proper. Anytime you can't travel a street
going the posted speed limit you've done something wrong.
Lehman/That' s why we're going to modify it.
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O'Donnell/We're going to modify them Emie and we'll be back two weeks to modify
them again, we're going to just keep modifying them.
Lehman/Oh no.
Champion/And you can gloat that you were right.
O'Donnell/I don't gloat, but I will be happy.
Thornberry/Yea.
O'Donnell/That's all I have.
Lehman/OK Connie
Champion/I just want to go home.
Lehman/OK Karen.
Kubby/But I have a few things, I'll try to be fast. I want to remind June 291h is an
election state wide constitutional changes that could have huge effects, but
negative effects if trickle down to city if those things pass so I on a personal level
believe that people should not support this constitutional amendments and to
remind people there's a board of supervisors race on that ballot as well.
Kubby/Big congratulations to the Iowa Arts Festival for a grand many days of activities
downtown it was really nice. I had a great time, the weather was kind of weird at
the end of the day and everyone thought it went pretty well.
Kubby/This fall we're going to have some changes to our recycling program and so I
want to make sure people know about it ahead of time. We're going to add two
items to our curb side recycling, mixed paper and magazines. And that will really
increase the amount of volume and tonnage that no longer goes into the landfill
but because.
(End of 99-68 Side 1)
Kubby/Sections on the truck to put the separated materials in we can't continue all the
current things that we collect and so when looking at the volume of things glass is
the item that has the least amount of volume that we collect residentially and so
we're going to discontinue picking up glass which may seem like a hardship but
when you think about the goal of the program is to decrease the volume of the
landfill and we have to choose between paper and glass, paper is really really the
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thing we need to be collecting so look for that this fall there will be lots of
information coming to you household by household.
Kubby/And lastly it's about my T-shirt. Dean asked about it, to see it I guess I have to
stand up and it's Save the IWP. The International Writing Program and this is the
web site that's on the bottom of my T-shirt. And the reason I bring it up here is
because for me it's a real tragedy that the university is chosen a route of
reevaluating this program by essentially dismantling it while they reevaluate it.
And the affects on the community I think are much more than we realize. It's a
program that brings in 35 people every year from all over the world to do writing,
to do community supported events. And the advantages that brings to our
children and to us as adults to interact with people from all over the world. When
I travel around the country doing art fairs people see my sign Iowa City and
they'll say the International Writer's Program as well as the Writer's Workshop
it's something people know about. So I think it's a huge economic boost for our
community to have the Intemational Writing Program and I think we're going to
lose a lot. It's also kind of a bigger issue of countries like Nigeria who are just
kind of trying out democracy, being able to come to the United States through this
program but leam a lot of other things besides working on their writing to take
back to their countries. It's a way that we contribute globally and so I think this is
a real loss and when I think about us as a city when we reevaluate a program we
don't dismantle it to reevaluate it, we might cut down on something and lessen
our investment and do some evaluation and create some criteria and so I'm really
disturbed on how this was done and hope that the university administration sees
the value of the program not just academically but how it affects the whole
community and affects global relations and issues of democracy so help save IWP
go to the web site see all the information, write letters, make calls. Maybe we can
make things happen differently. Thank you.
Lehman/Two things. You mentioned the tennis court situation been resolved. It's been
resolved through the cooperation of the City of Iowa City that is paying for half of
the cost of doing those lights. We paid $10,000 for lights, the public paid $15,000
to put them in and the school board's going to pay $500.00 to help correct them
we're going to pay the other $500.00.
Lehman/This most people received in the mail today or delivered to their homes. Parade
of Homes starts this weekend goes through the following weekend. Should be a
great time, a great opportunity for folks to see what the builders are doing within
the community so certainly would encourage everyone to take advantage of that.
There's a small fee for those homes and it goes to very worth while causes. Steve.
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council
meeting of June 15, 1999.
#31 Page 112
ITEM NO. 31. REPORT ON ITEMS FROM THE CITY MANAGER AND CITY
ATTORNEY.
Atkins/Interesting. No. 1 to remind you we have a good neighbor policy that we have
found that developers from out of the area will use but our local people don't.
Lehman/Really.
Atkins/It's a very deep and you all recall it.
Kubby/Right.
Atkins/It's really got lots of good suggestions in it and I was thinking about it tonight.
And secondly I only mention this in passing on occasion to you. The Windsor
Ridge people can't get enough detail and I made a note Noaheast Planning
District want it spelled out specifically that we won't accept too much detail. No
wonder the conflicts that you have to go through in trying to satisfy those things.
That's all I have.
Lehman/All right. Eleanor.
Dilkes/(can't hear).
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council
meeting of June 15, 1999.
#32 Page 113
ITEM NO. 32. ADJOURNMENT
Lehman/Can we have a motion to adjourn?
O'Donnell/So moved.
Thornberry/Second.
Lehman/Moved and seconded, all in favor. We are adjourned.
11:15 PM
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council
meeting of June 15, 1999.