HomeMy WebLinkAbout2001-02-06 Transcription#2 Page 1
ITEM NO. 2. SPECIAL PRESENTATION: OUTSTANDING STUDENT
CITIZENSHIP AWARDS- Lucas Elementary
Lehman: So if these young folks would come forward please. If you would like to
give your name and then why you were nominated.
Sara Nobbs: My name is Sara Nobbs. I am receiving the award for several reasons. I
am a self-motivated student. I almost always get my homework done. My
Girl Scout troop and I sometimes do service projects. I am in patrol. Last
year I was part of my school's student council. I am part of Techxperts,
which is a program at my school where we learn how to use programs on
the computers and then help other people.
Eliza Briggs: My name is Eliza Briggs. Thank you for presenting me with this award
tonight. When I was asked to write about what makes a good citizen it
was easy. I enjoy helping my grandparents by mowing their grass and
helping them to bake cookies. My grandma calls me when she has a
problem with her computer and I try to help them. Sometimes I go with
them to the Senior Center. For classwork I use my assignment notebook.
It keeps the due date of the assignment, the subject, and what it is that I am
supposed to be accomplishing. At school I was chosen to help with the
preschool PE class. I am a substitute helper with the adaptive PE class
also for disability students. I usually have a full week. I attend two
church youth groups and always go to church on Sunday. I am also on the
basketball tean~ and practice or have games three to four times each week.
Like I said at the begiuning, when I was asked to write about being a good
citizen it was easy because these are all things that I love to do.
Matthew Brummond: My name is Matt Brummond and I am a sixth grader at Lucas
School. There are many outstanding citizens at Lucas School so I am very
pleased to receive this award. At school I participate in Techxperts. This
is a program where the students learn about computers. Before school
starts I go in early and help set up the computers and turn on the
computers. Also, I help with projects in the media center and help the
librarians. I am a crossing guard helping the other students cross the street
before and after school. Often I substitute for other crossing guards as
needed. Also I am a tutor for a first grade student where I help him with
his reading. Outside of school my other activities include playing soccer,
football, basketball and baseball and attending religion class. Thank you
very much for this award.
Lehman: That part about helping grandma and grandpa was really cool. I really like
that. I was stopped this week by- I guess it is another grandpa- but a
person who watched the council meeting and told me that one of the
things they enjoy the very most about our council meetings is this first part
of the meeting where we recognize outstanding students. And I have to
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admit, this is probably one of the most fun things that we do. I have got
some awards for you. And I will read one of them, (reads award). Thank
you very much.
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ITEM NO. 3. MAYOR'S PROCLAMATIONS- Iowa Valley Habitat Week- Feb 4-
10.
Lehman: (Reads Proclamation).
Karr: Here to accept is the president of the Iowa Valley Habitat Kelly Hayworth.
Lehman: You are accustomed to council meetings aren't you?
Hayworth: I would just briefly like to thank you for this proclamation this evening
and note that Joan Jehle and Vivian Jacobs, a current board and past board
member of our Iowa Valley Habitat for Humanity is here tonight. I would
just like to reemphasize that the Iowa Valley Habitat for Humanity has
served 21 families including 67 children. And we are very proud of that
fact. One of the things that we have as a goal is that we would like to
build more homes in Iowa City. We feel that the need is here and the
services are here thanks to the City of Iowa City. And so we encourage
folks that might be viewing tonight or in the audience to help us with that
task primarily through finding lots. That is the single most difficult thing
that we have. We have the people to build the homes and we have the
families that need the homes but obtaining the lots is the biggest problem
that we have. We appreciate the efforts that you have assisted us in the
past. Through CDBG funds we have been able to purchase lots and we
hope that we can continue that partnership into the future. Thank you
again.
Champion: Thank you Kelly.
Lehman: Thank you Kelly. We are going to skip the next proclamation for a few
minutes. The recipients are not here yet.
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ITEM NO. 4. CONSIDER ADOPTION OF THE CONSENT CALENDAR AS
PRESENTED OR AMENDED.
Champion: Move adoption.
Vanderhoef: Second.
Lehman: Moved by Champion, seconded by Vanderhoef. Discussion?
Kanner: Yes, I have some discussion. Thank you.
Lehman: Okay.
Kanner: I would like to present the renewals of licensees for alcohol. There are a
number of possessions under the legal age in the renewal applicants.
Brother' s had 56 visits in the past year- this is through December to date,
year to date- 50 charged for an arrest to visit rate of .89. John's Grocery
was not listed. Bo James had 44 visits to 26 charged for a .59 arrests per
visit. Quentin's had 12 visits and 0 arrests. RT's had 12 visits- these are
by the police again- 4 were charged with possession under the legal age
for a .33 rate. Ranchero's was not listed. The Fieldhouse had 89 visits
and 117 were charged for 1.31 arrests per visit. The total for the city is a
.94 arrests per visit. And again, the purpose that I am reading this is to say
that I believe the city council needs to take a closer look at some bars and
licensees that are certainly above the average and hold them responsible
for being good citizens. And with this in mind and with the City
Attomey's continual advice saying that it is not legal to deny licenses
based solely on their possession under the legal age record, I would like to
take a closer look at these applicants to see if they are being good citizens
and look at a number of different issues. I would like to remove two of
the applicants from the consent calendar who have above average rates.
One would be Brother's and one will be the Fieldhouse. And when we
consider them I will be moving for deferral to our next meeting.
Lehman: Steven, do you know of those folks who were issued sumn~ons do you
know how many of those were issued summons at the request of the bar?
Kanner: No I don~t.
Lehman: Do you realize that the bars do call police and ask them to enforce
ordinances within their bar so that the number of arrests could be
indicative of how well they are enforcing our regulations in the bar?
Kanner: I think that is a good point and that is why we should discuss it- we should
look at these as just possible indicators of some other problems and we
should take a little more time besides putting them in the consent calendar.
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Most people don't realize a consent calendar usually means no discussion.
I think we need to have a little more discussion and bring up some of these
items that you are mentioning Ernie.
Lehman: Okay. Any other discussion? I need to point out that we are setting a
public hearing for February 20 to consider the proposed fiscal budget for
FY02. That will be on February 20. That public hearing is being set in
the consent calendar. Other discussion?
Kanner: Also there is a heating being set for March 20 for the Iowa Department of
Transportation Consolidated Transit Funding Application. That is a quite
a bit of money having to do with our transit system that comes through our
Johnson County Council of Govermnents.
Lehman: Okay. We will be voting on the consent calendar with the exception of
numbers 2a and 2i, which will be considered separately. Roll call.
Motion carries. Do we have a motion to act on 2a and 2i?
Champion: Move on 2- on the remaining.
Lehman: Pardon?
Champion: Move 2a and 2i.
Lehman: All right, is there a second?
Vanderhoef: Second.
Lehman: Moved by Champion and seconded by Vanderhoef. Discussion?
Kanner: I would like to postpone consideration until our next council meeting.
Champion: I am not in favor of that because there really is nothing legal we can do
about it. So I think it is a waste of our time and a waste of their time to
postpone it.
Kanner: I think there is legally. But this is something that needs a second to be
considered and then to be voted on.
Lehman: Do we have a second?
Karr: Is that a motion to defer?
Champion: Is that a motion?
Kanner: Yeah, I am moving to postpone until our next meeting.
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Lehman: We have a motion to defer until the next meeting. Is there a second?
Pfab: I will go along for a second just for discussion.
Lehman: We have a second by Mr. Pfab. Discussion of the amendment to defer?
Dilkes: It is not an amendment to defer, it is just a motion to defer.
Lehman: Motion to defer, I am sorry.
Kanner: Ernie, Ithinkasyoumentionedbeforethereisalotofdifferentsides. I
think this is just one indicator- one possible indicator of things that might
not be healthy. And we have a responsibility to take a closer look and to
examine some of the other criteria that go into receiving a license. It is not
a right in this state. It is something that we as an agent of the state give
out. And I think we should put some care into it and take another week to
look at these two with high numbers of arrests per visit as a possible
indicator of some other problems.
Letunan: Irvin?
Pfab: I believe that from what you- Ernie from what you had stated earlier here,
there may be some positive things and this might be a good time to bring
them up if there are extenuating circumstances or people are doing a good
job. I think it is- it gives us a chance just to discuss this and allow the
public and the owners to be aware that people are interested in what is
going on.
Lehman: Other discussion? I personally am not interested in separating these and
acting on them separately until such time as we develop a policy that
indicates that we will be looking at these things and making a
determination on those. I think this is inappropriate procedure.
Wilbum: And part of that policy is we are having a public hearing on (can't hear)
and we will have three readings of those. Last time this was brought up
this will be the starting point in my mind for me.
Lehman: All in favor of the motion to defer say "aye". Opposed? The motion is
defeated 1-
Dilkes: We need to- we don't have Mr. Pfab's vote.
Lehman: Mr. Pfab are you going to vote to defer that or not?
Pfab: No.
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Lehman: No you are not going to vote or you are not going to vote to defer it or
what are you 'no'-ing about?
Pfab: I am going to vote not to defer it.
Lehman: All right. The motion is defeated 1-6, Kanner voting in the affirmative.
Do we roll call on those two items?
Karr: No, this is just a motion to approve the two items now.
Lehman: The motion to approve the two items- all in favor? Opposed? Motion
carries unanimously.
Kanner: I have a point of information.
Lehman: Yes?
Kanner: Will the City Attorney be helping us in the future with division of roll
calls and votes? Because I have not heard that before and there are other
times when we have not had people voting- I was wondering if that is the
obligation of the City Council members to call for a division?
Karr: Mr. Mayor, ifI may answer that?
Lehman: Anyone can do that, Go ahead.
Karr: I simply did not catch the vote. I turned to the City Attorney and asked if
she had caught it and she then just asked. It would have been normally my
response to just clarify it.
Dilkes: We like to have a record of who votes how and we didn't have that.
Lehman: And member of the Council can request a division of (can't hear).
Kanner: That is what I was wondering. That is what I thought. I was wanting to
know if other people can do that because often times we have people that
aren't voting and I think it is good to clarify how to record that.
Sometimes we don't have the City Attorney asking fi3r a clarification.
Champion: (Can't hear).
Dilkes: Any time the City Clerk cannot record the vote of each Council Member
we would clarify that before moving on.
Lehman: I think we always (can't hear).
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Dilkes: We always have a record of what the votes are.
Lehman: I don't know of a time we don't have Council Members voting.
Kanner: Well actually I can give you an example of one. And the newspaper
reported differently than the clerk because there was no- it was an
abstention with Mr. O'Donnell on the sidewalk votes. There was no vote
from Mr. O'Donnell that I saw on that. So that was the case and it was an
abstention and there was no clarification asked for at that time.
Lelunan: Well, it is something that any Council person can ask for at any time.
O'Donnell: 1 don't recall that.
Champion: I don't either.
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ITEM NO. 5. PUBLIC DISCUSSION (ITEMS NOT ON THE AGENDA).
[UNTIL 8 PM].
Lehman: This is a time reserved on the agenda for those folks who would like to
address the council on items that do not otherwise appear on the agenda.
If you wish to address the council please sign in, give your name, your
address and limit your comments to five minutes or less.
Hora: Jay has taught me well, I jumped fast. My name is Joanne Hora. I live at
5475 Herbert Hoover Highway Northeast West Branch. I am on the
Senior Center Commission and the chair of the Skywalk Fundraising
Committee. And I an~ here tonight to tell you that we have successfully
completed our commitment to the fund drive and have raised $120,000,
which you know. And I am here on behalf of the Senior Center
Commission to ask that you consider awarding the bid for the completion
of the skywalk which we feel will be a huge asset to the Senior Center and
to the entire community.
Lehman: It is on the agenda for tonight.
Hora: Thank you.
Champion: I commend the Senior Center for raising that much money. That is a lot of
money.
O'Dormell: Great job.
Hora: Thank you. We had huge support from the community.
Champion: Great.
Hora: Thank you.
Walters: Jim Walters. I live at 1033 E. Washington. I have come to address the
Council on press reports about the confusion over the construction process
on First Avenue. I have to say that I have felt no confusion this issue. I
have in the past year felt a lot of frustration and frustration bordering on
anger about this matter. And the reasons I do is because the terrain, as
someone who has been intimately trying to deal with this issue, I feel the
terrain constantly shift under my feet. And it is difficult to get my
bearings when I can't get the facts and when we can't come to a common
agreement on what the facts are about this matter. In the run up to this
election we had some public disagreements about traffic counts, about
validity of traffic counts. We had public disagreements about the location
of a future fire station and the reasons for that location at sites unnamed.
And all of these things impinged on an election that took place last
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November in regard to taking this project out of the city budget. One of
the things that also impinged on that election was the contention on the
part of the city that construction of the First Avenue extension was
something that had to take part along with the construction of Captain
Irish Boulevard to Scott- Captain Irish Parkway to Scott Boulevard. And
it was presented to the public in such a way that this was the reason for
supporting the extension. And I am sure that that impacted on many
peoples' understanding and vote in that election last November. People
who would vote for the economy, the efficiency, and their understanding
of what the city was proposing with that construction schedule on First
Avenue. Now ~ve are told that this was not the case. We are being told by
parties within city staff that in fact it is not only perfectly acceptable to
construct the extension separate from Captain Irish Parkway, it is in fact
desirable to do it. And I have to say that that is a shifting terrain and it is
very difficult to stand on that terrain.
Lehman: Jim, I need to interrupt you for just a moment. You are talking about
paving and not constructing and there is quite a difference.
Walters: That is right.
Lehman: Okay. Because the construction is an integral part of Captain Irish.
Walters: We were told- we were told that the paving of these roads would be done
synchronously. We were told that in fact the construction of Captain Irish
Parkway necessitated removal of fill dirt from the First Avenue extension
to be used on the construction of Captain Irish Parkway. Now we are
being told that- and I don't quite understand how if you are going to
remove dirt for the construction of the extension where are you going to
put that dirt if you are not going to be putting it in the construction of
Captain Irish Parkway?
Lehman: You are aware- you were at the meeting last night. No-
Walters: I was at the meeting last night.
Lehmm~: And you know this is going to be clarified to your satisfaction along with
everybody else' s at the next work session.
Walters: I am concerned that there are- there are public reports that have been made
in the paper that are false and misleading and I am here to try to correct
those reports.
Lehman: And we will correct those at the next work session.
Walters: I want them con'ected tonight. I want them corrected for the record.
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Lehmm~: Well, you have got about 2 more minutes to correct them.
Walters: Well then I would like to have my 2 minutes to do that.
Lehman: I am sorry, go right ahead.
Walters: Now, when you put something on the table- when you put something on
the table- and let's go back to the contention from March 5 that this was
the compromise that this Council voted on. You seven people at the table
voted on this on March 5 and we saw it last night in the public record.
That we were going to do the paving in the two thousand- or the grading
in the 2001 construction season-
Kanner: Fiscal year 02.
Walters: Fiscal year 02, construction season 2001.
Kanner: Right.
Walters: And that the paving would take place in fiscal year 2003, construction
season 2002. That is a matter of incontrovertible fact. It is on the public
record. The reports in the paper- the reports in the paper say to the
contrary. And city staff now is expressing opinions to the contrary. And
that is shifting terrain. You have shifted the terrain on the voters of Iowa
City and you have shifted the terrain on the people who fought hard in the
last election to get these facts to the public and to make a public
presentation of our case. It is not a fair situation.
Lehman: If you sat here last night Jim you know full well Council has shifted
nothing. Don't you?
Walters: No. not at all.
Lehman: Well'-
Waiters: As a matter of fact after the meeting you expressed confusion about what
you had done Mr. Mayor.
Lehman: But we all know exactly where we are and we are going to get it for the
record. And I think we all know precisely where we are including you.
Walters: I don't think that is true.
Lehman: Come to the next work session and we will straighten it out for you. And
for us.
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Waiters: Well straighten it out with the paper. Straighten it out with the paper too.
Make some communication with the paper about it and straighten it out
with Mr. Davidson your assistant planning manager.
Lehman: Okay. Thank you.
Karmer: Ernie, I would like to say that there was no one coming forward with the
March 7th resolution by Council until I brought that up at the meeting last
night and (can't hear).
Lehman: We will work on this at the next work session.
Kanner: -to make that clear that that resolution was past last year. That was the last
sign of what the Council wanted to do.
Lehman: And this is on a work session for- is it on for two weeks from last night?
Right. Okay.
Finley: Good evening. My name is Mike Finley and I am a resident of First
Avenue at 715 South First Avenue. I have appeared before this Council
on several occasions concerning the extension of North First Avenue.
With the latest developments that have come to light I feel as concerned
now as ever before about things that Ernie and I spoke about way back in
'97/'98. We stood out front Ernie and discussed these things. And you
told me at that time that you would do ever~hing in your power to see to
it that Captain Irish Parkway and Scott Avenue are opened first so that
traffic patterns develop and will best enhance the safety of the school
children at Hoover Elementary and the other schools in our area. With the
recent editorial in the Iowa City- I like to refer to it now as the Depressed
Citizen- it seems like they are chiding you the city council members. And
I am a little amazed because I kind of thought that after this past election
they were your friends. But none the less after reading the editorial I was
very concerned that not only would the agreements that were drawn upon
on the 5th of March be thrown out the window but that the dirt that you so
covet that will block North First Avenue will also be removed. I
understand perfectly well why the Press Citizen would like to see this so
as their property will be impacted in a most positive and financial way.
And their editorial was incredibly self-serving. But we have other
considerations besides the fiscal health of the Io~va City Press Citizen.
And that is the safety concerns of the citizens like myself who live on First
Avenue. And not only do I live on First Avenue, I am very fortunate to
have two jobs that I have worked in my neighborhood for 15 years. And
consequently I walk to work and I see the traffic. When you are in a car
driving on First Avenue you don't see the traffic like you do on foot. And
honestly we need- and this is very important and I am talking to all 7 of
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you- we genuinely need, we that live on First Avenue, your very conscious
consideration as to how people like myself will cross the street with the
proper traffic restraints so that this can be achieved. I mean, I came to you
back in '97 with stories of school children almost being hit. I mean,
specific eyewitness accounts that I gave you from when I was walking my
own kids to school at Hoover. And before First Avenue extension is open
1 would really ask you to stick to your guns. Don't let the Press Citizen
strong-arm you and do as you have obligated yourselves. And 1 would
really appreciate if you do just that much. Thank you.
Lehman: Thank you Mike.
Kanner: Just a point of clarification. People have been saying March 5- the
resolution was on March 7, 2000.
Brown: Hi, I am Randy Brown. I live at 1811 ½ High Street. I also would like to
encourage you to stick to your 5-2 vote from last March to extend Scott
Boulevard before we extend First Avenue. I am not sure why some people
want to rush to extend First Avenue. When I told a co-worker about this
possible change my co-worker said talking about you the City Council and
they wonder why no one ever believes them. I am not that pessimistic.
We have gone through a lengthy process of debating, petitioning, and
voting and we have arrived at a decision about what we are going to do.
And I think it would be a mistake to say that all of that work was a bunch
of meaningless words and that we can just tear those words up and do
whatever. So please stick to the schedule and put Scott Boulevard ahead
of First Avenue. Thank you.
Lehman: Thank you.
Ross: Hi, I am Brandon Ross. I am from Iowa City. Three years ago First
Avenue was voted out of the Capital Improvements Program and I only
bring this up because some people probably could use some reminding. It
was unpopular. It was put back on the agenda by just several members of
the Council who decided to ignore the vote and decide to go ahead with it.
Okay? Well, there was a successful petition again and this time around
there was a decision to go ahead and put it on the Capital Improvements
Program. And promises were made. Well, if the Council is to be believed
and if there is faith to be in the Council as a Council that believes in
community well-being then I strongly suggest that the council stick to its
word and do not have the grading of First Avenue extension until the
proposed 2002. And do it that way as it was said and go ahead with the
paving in 2003. Is there a reason why the Council right now after having
put it on the Capital Improvements to have us vote on it again in the
referendum, is there a reason why there should be a rush? The only reason
I can think about why we should be rushing is that three members of the
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City Council are coming up for reelection this year. And if only one of
them maybe is not replaced with a pro-road Council Member that it is
possible that First Avenue may be taken off the Capital Improvements
Program. Well, it was voted once to be off and then it was voted again to
be on. So let's say go two out of three you know? We will try it again.
Given this, we have noted a lot of road planning. A lot of money is being
slated to put in new roads. To have roads widened. But in lieu of things
that have to be done about public transportation about accessibility,
bicycle transportation accessibility, and other things I think that we should
be thinking more along different lines and be building around the
community. And looking at those things instead of putting up more roads,
more parking garages, laying more concrete and subsuming us under all of
this. So again, I say stick to the plan and do not grade First Avenue
extension in 2001.
Kanner: Just another point of clarification for Randy- the 5-2 vote did not mention
the opening of Captain Irish. That was not included in that vote on March
7.
Brown: (Can't hear).
Lehman: I am sorry- sir, if you want to speak you really have to speak in the mic.
Brown: Okay.
Lehman: Othersvise it won't be picked for the transcription.
Brown: Right. The wording may not have been that one was going through but
the intent clearly was that Scott Boulevard or Captain Irish or whatever it
is going to be called- that it was going to be extended- traffic patterns were
going to be established and that that was going to ameliorate any possible
negative side effects to extending First Avenue. So apart from the
technicality of the wording the conversation surrounding that- that was the
point that if we were going to extend both of them- extending Scott
Boulevard and getting traffic established on that street was far preferable
to extending First Avenue and then doing Scott the following year. Thank
you.
Lehman: We are going to have a quick interruption of public discussion-
Karr: We are rescheduling.
Lehman: Oh, I am sorry. I misread that. Okay, we have a proclamation that will be
done next week. All fight. Thank you.
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Dieterie: I am only- I was hesitant to step up because I didn't know whether
anybody else wanted to go on about First Avenue. I totally agree with
everything that has been said by the public about First Avenue but I would
like to talk about something else. I have listened to the Council
discussions and I am equally puzzled as Jim and the others. I think there
is something going on here that I don't understand and if everybody up
there thinks it is awfully clear to everyone then I think they should re-
explain it carefully because it looks pretty bad. Now, I want to talk to you
about the Police Department budget. And I noted that there is a letter
from me asking that it be put on an agenda that is in your packet. I have
been told since I wrote that letter that in order for a council person to put
an item on the agenda there must be a motion to do so voted upon and
supported by the majority of the council. And I wonder how many
citizens know that because it is a very convenient way for the majority to
keep controversial items off the agenda. I spoke to you earlier and
mentioned that the Police Department budget was proposed to go up by
$657,000. I have your letter that goes on about this at some length and 1
~von't bother to read the whole thing. But this is a 9.73% increase over
last year. I attended the informal Council discussions when the budget
was being presented by the City Manager. I listened to the entire meeting
about the General Fund. I heard a great deal about how poor we are and
how we need to protect our Aaa bond rating. And how we didn't have
enough money. And then I heard people nickel and diming various
projects looking for $1000 here and $1000 there. After an awful lot of
talk the total funding for the Human Service agency- all of it- will not be
increased at all. 0%. And the rationale for this was that last year it was
that they were increased by 6.6% which is double the inflation rate and
therefore it is okay for us not to give them anything more. The princely
sum to be divided amongst all these worthwhile agencies is $455,500. We
are talking about people like ARC, Big Brothers and Sister, Crisis Center,
DVIP, Elderly Services, Free Medical Clinic, Mayor's Youth Employment
Program, MECCA- which certainly bears upon our discussions on
substance abuse and I think you should be reading the papers and note that
there have been several articles in recent weeks that point out that on the
state and national level they have concluded that education and treatment
is more effective than imprisomment. But we are not giving MECCA a
nickel. I also heard the discussion of the funding for commtmity events.
This includes the Friday Night Concert Series, Disability Day Awareness,
Johnson County Historical Society, Jazz Festival, Jaycees Fourth of July
Celebration and so on. There are others. These also get 0% increase.
Zero. And the total amount for these community enhancing efforts is
$63,222. Crocodile tears are shed by the council over their supposed
inability to fund a quarter time Historical Preservation position, a half time
new position for the Animal Shelter, and one full time Natural Areas
Manager for Parks and Rec. And the Cmmcil told the City Manager to
write letters refusing those requests and basically saying do the best you
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can with what you have got. It was acknowledged that the Animal Shelter
really needs the extra position but that the funding of it was up to RJ
because it falls under the Police Budget. That is the closest you came to
discussing the Police Budget. Particularly distasteful were the discussions
of the Family Resource Center. Leave it to the School Board was the
bottom line despite the fact that it provides basic assistance, food, clothes,
and after school activities to needy children. And what better place would
there be to put the money that formally went to the DARE program, which
is being discontinued at the initiative of the School Board and the
superintendent. The Jaycees request for the contribution to the July Fourth
Fireworks Fund was actually reduced by $2000 from last year. So,
$455,600 plus $63,222 is a grand total of $518,822. This is the proposed
total city spending for all of these worthy community events and human
services, which I think would benefit the population as a whole and bring
people downtown and generally improve the reputation of the Iowa City
area all over the place. But the proposed budget gives more than $657,000
to the Police, a 9.73% increase and it has gotten no discussion. The
Johnson County Sheriff and his staff provide law enforcement for the
entire county, which contains 900 miles of roads. An area of 620 square
miles. They do water rescues, supervise the haz-mat team and the county
civil defense, maintain a civil office for tax sales and eminent domain
hearings, and run the county jail. And their proposed budget for next year
is $5.4 million. What does the ICPD need $7,412,283 for? Including 10
new vehicles and 16 new radios. I would like each one of you to tell us
why you have not considered making any changes to the proposed fiscal
year to police budget. Thank you.
Karr: Can we have a motion to accept correspondence?
Vanderhoef: So moved.
Kanner: Second.
Lehman: Moved by Vanderhoef, seconded by Kanner. All in favor? Motion
carries. Other public discussion?
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ITEM NO. 6d. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION APPROVING THE
PRELIMINARY PLAT AND MANUFACTURE HOUSING SITE
PLAN OF SADDLEBROOK ADDITION, PART 2, A 201.2 ACRE, 6-
LOT RESIDENTIAL SUBDIVISION AND 290-UNIT
MANUFACTURED HOUSING SITE PLAN LOCATED AT THE
SOUTHERN TERMINUS OF HEINZ ROAD. (SUB00-00015).
Vanderhoef: Move adoption of the resolution.
O'Donnell: Second.
Lehman: Moved by Vanderhoefand seconded by O'Donnell. Discussion? I
understand everything is in order. Irvin?
Pfab: Okay, that was my question.
Lehman: Okay, discussion? Roll call. Motion carries.
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ITEM ]NO. 7. PUBLIC DISCUSSIO]N ON PROPOSED ALCOHOL
ORDINANCES.
Lehman: We are going to handle this this evening much the same as we would a
public hearing althoug~ this is not technically a public hearing. If you
wish to address the Council please sign in and give your name and limit
your comments to five minutes or less. Discussion is open.
Blizek: Hello there. My name is Matt Blizek and I am the President and founder
of the University of Iowa group Students for Local Politics. And I am
coming here tonight- just in general, thank you for having the first open
forum to discuss this with you all. To begin with, this issue obviously
deals with pretty much basically just college students. I mean, the rest of
the Iowa City population at large would be largely unaffected by this
ordinance. So I think it is important for you to all when thinking and
discussing this to consider the student' s point of view that they have when
seeing city council present these ordinances. What you see is out of
control, irresponsible college kids, most of them underage, behaving in an
illegal behavior, running amuck, and being generally disruptive. College
kids, we see and hear our friends- we are going to go out and have a good
time and are largely responsible, but a few people are irresponsible about
it, but for the most part all college kids are responsible when they go out
and have a good time. You see this ordinance as a necessary step to
discourage irresponsible behavior. We see, as students, seven people who
know the issue largely through stats and figures attacking what is our
primary social and leisure activities. I guess from here on I had some
specific questions about the ordinances. First off, Section 4-5-4 regulation
of persons under the legal age. My question being this, if a person was
arrested and cited for possession of alcohol under the legal age would the
ticket- if this ordinance passes- would that ticket be increased over the
$145 fine that it is now? Would there be civil penalties tacked on top of
that or (changed tape sides)
Dilkes: No.
Blizek: No as in-
Dilkes: It doesn't change the law.
Blizek: It doesn't change that at all? Okay, thank you. The second issue on this-
it is not- I don't think it is mentioned specifically in the ordinance but
there has been some discussion of nndercover police officers in the Iowa
City bars to help administrate civil penalties if need be. This as far as
students go is almost unacceptable. I mean, you cannot expect students to
go out and have- be able to socialize with their friends and have a good
time all the while knowing that the person in plain clothes over there could
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#7 Page 19
be a police officer waiting to arrest them or listen to their conversations or
whatever. And it is- Iowa City should not resemble a police state in this
matter. We shouldn't have to look over our shoulders for police officers.
And it is also just a waste of resources. It was said earlier and I thought it
was right on the money about the $7 million for the City budget for the
police. I think that is quite extraordinary. The third item I would like to
address specifically are the out of sight sales and sales of pitchers. I can
understand your rationale on the 2 for l's if you want to cut down on
binge drinking. And I can understand the rationale on cutting down out of
sight sales to reduce the sales to minors. My question is why apply this to
all bars? Why not just apply this rule eliminating out of sight sales to bars
that only allow minors inside? If the bar is 21 only what is logic in
applying this to those bars? And furthermore, I think the main problem
that the city deals with and the main worry most people have comes down
to alcoholism. More than social or binge drinking or underage drinking,
alcoholism is probably the core problem- the most serious problem
addressed by this issue. But alcoholism is a personal problem and it can
only be solved personally by that person. Passing laws, you know, no
matter how comprehensive they may be will not solve any one person's
alcoholism. A question I had to ask further is why in this entire ordinance
about the alcohol problem is there not a single mention of treatment or any
treatment programs that could be installed? You mentioned of more
money going to MECCA or more to Alcohol Anonymous- I had a
question, why was none of that involved in this and why was all of it
administrative penalties only? Any in closing I would just like to point
out that as students who make up half the population of this town we are
the large part of the tax base. We make up a large part of the workforce
and contribute millions annually to the local economy. And I would just
like the city council to keep this in mind when discussing this. It is my
hope that the council will be willing to negotiate these things with students
and work out these things together instead of just listening to our
comments and then voting none the less. Thank you.
Kanner: Hold on, I had a question for Eleanor. Can we selectively apply these
ordinances as was suggested?
Dilkes: I think the suggestion was that why do the out of sight sales regulation in
bars that don't let those under 21 in, is that was the suggestion.
Kanner: Yes, why not have a separate one for the-?
Dilkes: Well, I think you all need to think about what the purpose behind that
legislation is. Are you wanting to address just underage drinkers or are
you wanting to address all drinkers? I mean, that is really a question for
you all.
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Karmer: I think the question is is that allowed under state code in your opinion?
That we could-
Dilkes: I think you might be able to do that. We would have to take a look at it.
but again, I think that the first question is from a policy perspective. What
are you all trying to accomplish with that legislation and does it make
sense then given your goals to apply it to one set of bars and not another?
Blizek: Yeah, the logic I was pointing out behind this is out of sight sales mean-
for example, me going up and buying four drinks for me and my three
friends if we were all 21 and all in a bar that only allows 21 year olds in
there I see no harm in that.
Lehman: Except that it also- the law prohibits serving people who are inebriated.
And that is another-
Blizek: Yes but what does that have to do with it?
Lehman: Out of sight sales? It has a lot to do with it.
Blizek: With being inebriated? How?
Lehman: It is against the law to serve someone who is drunk.
Blizek: Yes, I know that but I mean, if we have just gotten to a bar and me and my
three friends sit at a table why can I not go up there and order four beers
for me and my three friends?
Lehman: If you follow the logic of that one you will figure it out. Two hours later
you could still be going up and asking tbr four so that isn't going to work.
Blizek: Okay, I don't see your logic in that at all.
Pfab: I have a question for you. I think you xnade a very good comment that
drinking is a personal problem. Unfortunately every person that has a
problem doesn't know that they have a problem. That is why the legal and
the enforcement law- that is one way to get those people to admit it and to
get their attention.
Blizek: I believe that a person who is forced into treatment they have a much,
much less chance than a person who has volunteered themselves to go into
treatment and admits their problem to themselves and is not being told that
you have a problem and we are going to fix it for you.
Pfab: So what you are saying is that everybody that has a drinking problem
knows it and chooses to keep doing it that way and there is no denial?
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Blizek: I think if it is pretty obvious- yeah, if you have a drinking problem I think
that you probably know it. Yes. Deep down you know it. You may not
choose to admit it.
Pfab: I don't know if I can agree with you. I wish it was so.
Blizek: I think we probably have varying opinions to what a drinking problem is
maybe.
Pfab: But you bring up a good point. I think that was a point well made.
Lehman: Thank you.
Blizek: Thank you.
Patterson: Good evening ladies and gentleman, representatives of the community,
University, City Council. My name is Dan Patterson. I am a
representative ofthe University oflowa Student Government. lama
Senator with UISG and I am also the co-chair for the University of Iowa
Student Government Task Force on Responsible Drinking. We come here
tonight- this is Andy Stoll and Chris Linn, President and Vice President of
the student body. We come here tonight to present you, the City Council,
with the results of our online survey that we have just completed taking on
responsible drinking. We represent the opinion of 1300 students who have
taken this survey for two weeks that ran from January 17 to February 4-
February 1, excuse me. And we just wanted to distribute the survey. We
are giving each one of you a generalized packet of the survey results. But
we are also giving you one copy of the 300 pages of written comments
that students gave to us. What I wanted to point out to you, as Andy and
Chris are distributing the packets, two specific questions that most directly
affect what we are here to talk about tonight. And that is the limited of out
of sight sales and the limiting of price specials in the city ordinance. I
would just like to make everyone aware that the students believe- the
question was however, the effectiveness of the ordinance and not do you
agree or disagree with the ordinance that is being proposed. And we just
want to let you all know that it is limiting out of sight sales that 87% of the
students who took the survey- 1133 students believe that it would not be
effective and that 1115 students or 86% did not believe that limiting price
specials would be effective of this. We just also want to call to your
attention towards the end of the survey on question probably about 11 or
12- it was about the different options of things- one of the highest was the
extra options or the extra late night activities that students felt would be
most effective and also holding bar owners more accountable, which also
directly affects this. 1 am going to turn the microphone over to Andy
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#7 Page 22
Stoll, Student Body Vice President, to explain more about the details of
the survey. Thank you.
Stoll: Thank you very much Council for hearing us tonight. Mayor Lehman, we
gave you also a copy of all the comments. It is about 330 page so we
decided in the essence of saving Iowa City's trees etc. we would give you
one page or one copy. The gold sheets am kind of a summary of the
comments. If Ross or anybody else wants to paruse through those they
can feel free. We will also have additional copies available on our
website, which is www.uiowa.edu/-uisg, and you can download all 330
pages if anybody is interested in reading through that. I have a long two
days, so let's kind of bring up the points. I think Dan sort of summarized
some of the survey but I am going to talk and speak specifically to a
number of points that tie into it and some of the understanding that the UI
Student Government and the student body take away from the survey that
we performed. First of all if you note on question number 4 the students
note the response to the survey- the question was why do you choose to
drink? 67% of students said they drink because they want to socialize.
And right now the predominate social activity in downtown Iowa City,
which I think is the area most in question in terms of these ordinances are
bars. So students are going to pay attention to that. In order to change
that to affect the idea that the social activity in downtown Iowa City is the
bars is you are going to have to change the atmosphere of downtown.
This sort of ties in with what is the overarching understanding we took
from the survey that students would really like to see alternate activities.
And I know you have all heard this and just to reiterate a little bit more-
just activities that students can do instead of going to the bars. There has
been a number of items proposed and I am sure you have heard of those.
In regards to the ordinance the truth of the matter is even if these
ordinances pass- or without alternate activities these ordinances are not
going to affect much because as one respondent on the survey said, if
students want to drink they are going to drink. And I think you will hear
that continually throughout the survey in all the different questions. So
the idea is changing the atmosphere from encouraging or that emphasizes
students drinking. And as another student said, and I think Matt from the
previous speaker said, the only thing that can truly stop a student from
binge drinking is him or herself. So those are just some points to keep in
mind. But in order- back to my main point- in order to create effective
change here in the city, the City Council and the community, we believe,
really needs to work to change the atmosphere of the downtown area. Our
opinion is the community leaders really need to work to evaluate the way
they promote the downtown area. Right now the perception being
promoted of the downtown area is that it is sort of a haven for student
drinking. If you read the papers- if you are from outside of Iowa City that
is the perception of downtown Iowa City. But it doesn't have to be that.
It doesn't have to be seen as a haven for drinking. The opportunity as you
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#7 Page 23
know is immense for the development of downtown Iowa City with a
major hotel, a mall, a large number of restaurants and a huge number of
opportunities to expand cultural entertainment- the Englert being a huge
example. So I guess I am going to stand up- what this has become for this
promotion of this drinking haven is sort of somewhat of a self-fulfilling
prophecy in terms of as long as you promote it that way that is how it is
going to be perceived and businesses that move in here or choose not to
move in here are going to base that on that perception. So I am going to
stand up here and I am going to challenge the City Council and members
of the community to find ways to promote and change the atmosphere of
downtown Iowa City or promote a changed atmosphere in this area. I am
not quite sure what it is going to take but it is going to take you as leaders
of our community to possibly fom~ a coalition to look into ways of
expanding Iowa City and to remove that sort of stigma that it is a haven
for drinking. One thing that- the last point I do want to emphasize is this
idea of a downtown with many different activities for people to partake in.
it is not just a vision of the students and it is not just a vision of me. I
kno~v it is a vision of yours and saying what the City Council has done-
the amazing things and just in my 3 ½ years here and how this Ped Mall
and the downtown area has changed. Really this change affects not just
the students and not just the University but all community members across
Iowa City and those who come from all over the country and the world to
visit.
Kanner: I am sorry Andy- I didn't catch that- what has changed and in which
direction in the last 3 ½ years that you have been here?
Stoll: Well, I think in reference to just the look of the Ped Mall. When I came in
they still had the railroad ties and they were replaced with cement barriers.
And just some of the- I think the increase in festivals and whatnot over the
summer periods, personally for me. As an example, some increase in
other activities that are going on and sort of the festival atmosphere that
goes on Thursday, Friday and Saturday nights with just the different
activities. Back when the Englert was open over the summer many times
with the WOW festival or the Jazz Festival- things of that nature. I think
that Iowa City has a great opportunity to expand its downtown area to the
liking of both the students and the community.
Kanner: So you are saying it has moved in a positive direction in the 3 ½ years that
you were here?
Stoll: I think with some of the actions of the City Council, yes.
Kanner: Thank you.
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Stoll: Other questions for us or in reference to the survey or anything else I can
answer for you? Thank you.
Lehman: Thank you.
Carol de Prosse: My name is Carol de Prosse. Could I just ask the- what stage in
the process is the Council at with this adoption or none adoption of this
ordinance?
Lehman: We are talking about it. We visited briefly at a work session for probably
45 minutes and decided to have public discussion on it before we discuss
it any further.
Carol de Prosse: So it is not scheduled then for- okay. Well, other than probably
just saying that I agree with everything that has been said before or the
speakers that have gone before me, I would like the council then when it
looks at this proposed ordinance that I have in front of me more closely- I
hope that you will consider some of the points that I want to make about it
tonight. I noticed that in the first whereas underage drinking, binge
drinking and the over consumption of alcohol in Iowa City have a
significant negative impact on the health, welfare and morals of its citizens
and results in increased burdens on Iowa City' s criminal justice system
and social service agencies. I would like to have you look at that later line
particularly with increased burdens on Iowa City's criminal justice system
because I believe the enforcement of this ordinance alone will necessitate
more overtime on behalf of the police department thus increasing their
budget even greater. And I also think that that then will have
corresponding effects on the criminal justice system. Obviously you are
hoping to increase arrests with this or you wouldn't be doing it because
simply passing a law isn't going to stop people from doing any of the
things that they are doing. And then I would also like you to consider the
increased burdens on social service agencies and get the social service
agencies to please document to you the number of University of Iowa
students that they see because I think that until you know that that it is
unfair to base a premise in the ordinance on something that you don't
know anything about, unless you know more than I do. Which very well
could be the case. So I would like to just jump to a couple parts of the- it
does seem to me that when I read the ordinance- and I just picked it up I
think yesterday that being Monday, and read it this afternoon for the first
time- that it seems in my opinion to be very anti-student oriented. And I
say that because when I look at the convictions for people who are the
proprietors of business that the first penalty is $500 and the second one is
a suspension of 30 days and $1500. And if they have a third conviction
then they have 60 days of suspension and $1500 fine and it is not until a
fourth conviction within a period of three years that they lose their liquor
license and that is I guess that is it for them. And when you look at the
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#7 Page 25
penalties imposed upon the students who are in doing the drinking
underage it is like the first time it is a simple misdemeanor and after that
they are losing their drivers license for up to a year or for a year. And I
would ask you to please seriously consider the consequences of pulling a
license of someone- a driving license of someone who has done the
horrible crime of having a drink underage in a bar downtown. I hope you
would not do that. And I also noticed that you totally let bar owners off
the hook by saying that if I go- if I am a student and I go in with a false ID
and the owner says "well hey, you know, is that your real ID" and I go
"yeah" and they go "well, yeah I guess that looks you" and blah, blah,
blah and it is a totally false ID that as long as he or she has made some
effort to determine that it is me and it is not or that the age is not anyway
then the owner of the bar is off the hook and it is the student who is guilty
for using the false ID. So I think again that makes it anti-student oriented
in my mind and focusing in the wrong direction because I don't believe
that laws are going to change people's behavior. And then I ~vould like
you to look please at some of the provisions under limitations on sales. I
noticed that one them makes it against the law to sell, offer to sell,
dispense or serve for on premises consumption two or more servings of
any alcoholic liquor, wine or beer to any one person for the price of one
such drink. And so I guess that means I would ask you to look at it that if
you were previously selling 2 for 50 cents you could now sell one for a
quarter and you would be achieving the same thing. So if you are going to
keep that provision you had better find some way to deal with somebody
who cuts the price in half and is still accomplishing the same end. I would
like you to look at this idea of making it against the law to sell, offer to
sell, dispense or serve for on premises consumption more than one serving
of any alcoholic liquor, wine or beer at any one time to any one person.
That means that no one can buy a round. That used to be a favorite thing
that we engaged in when we were in college. It did mean that someone
was flee to go to a bar and buy drinks for his or her friends. And I
certainly would get to the point I think of the first speaker about how this
has- impacts bars where they have both underage or underage drinkers and
legal age drinkers. And that also prevents me now at my age of 59 not
being able to go to the bar I guess and buy a beer for myself and whoever
is with me. And so I think that I would ask you to consider that. And I
also do believe that obviously I think we should be honest. There will be
selective enforcement- I think as I have written to you folks on email I
drive all over this town during the daytime and I make it a habit to drive
by the bars to see what is going on. And there are lots and lots and lots of
automobiles outside of these bars all day long. And most of these bars are
not in the downtown area. They are in all of- First Avenue, they are on
Maiden Lane, they are on Gilbert Street- they are every place that you
want to go. Please drive by the bars and you know that people aren't in
there just eating a hamburger. They are in there drinking. So one thing is
that I don't see a lot of arrests for drunken driving occurring in lots of
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#7 Page 26
these places. Most of these arrests for drunken driving are occurring in 4
and 5 block areas of downtown Iowa City. So the downtown is being
targeted and that is where the students hang out. So again, I see the
ordinances being very anti-student and I don't think it accomplishes
anything because I don't think you can change human behavior by passing
a law. And so I would like you to ask some questions of yourself when
you get to discuss this please. Who is actually asking for this? I keep
reading that the community is screaming for you to pass this ordinance but
I haven't read a single letter to the editor in the paper of anybody asking
you to do this. I haven't had anybody call me up and tell me I am wet and
out to lunch except one person. I haven't heard anybody stand up here
before you and beg for this and yet it is repeated over and over and over
again that somebody apparently really wants this big time.
Lehman: You need to wrap it up Carol.
Carol de Prosse: I will. How are you going to enforce this please? And I do think
the issue of undercover cops is a very serious one. I don't see how it
could be done without undercover cops because as soon as a cop comes in
in a uniform the place will shut down. What is the cost of enforcing this
ordinance? Do you believe it is actually going to make a difference? And
please then consider and set up before you pass it if you are going to how
you will measure your results. Thank you.
Kanner: I had a question in regard to some things that Carol asked for Eleanor. My
understanding is that people that- if they are at a table where they can be
ID-ed then one person can buy for everyone. It is just that there can't be
an out of sight sale. Is that correct?
Lehman: Correct. I am sure that is right.
Kanner: Unless we put in exceptions to that.
Dilkes: I think that is probably right. The idea is not to let someone go to the bar
and buy three drinks and you don't know who you are selling to. As long
as you know who you are selling to I think that is the intent.
Kanner: So if a server comes to a table and she or he ascertains that they are the
proper age, one person can buy for all of them? It is just that that one
person can't go to the bar.
Dilkes: It is not the issue of who is giving the money. It is the issue of whether it
is an out of sight sale.
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Kanner: And I just need some clarification- my understanding is that under the
civil penalties that are being proposed against the licensees that it is
possible to revoke the license with the first penalty?
Dilkes: Let me just- I wanted to clarify that. The penalties that Ms. de Prosse
talked about are set by state law. You really don't have authority with
respect to those. The penalties established for possession of alcohol under
legal age first offense is $100, second offense is $200, and then effect on
your license are set by state law. We can't change that. The civil
penalties that she was outlining which kick in after or upon conviction for
sales to minors or one of your employees selling to minors are set by state
law as well. As are the criminal penalties for sales to minors. And again,
as I explained in the memo, the criminal penalty for an employee at a bar
selling to a minor is $500. That is set by state law.
Kanner: Can I follow up on that?
Wilbum: Go ahead.
Kanner: I just wanted to clarify, the civil penalty though that we can bring against
someone that we- that a bar owner that we feel or licensee that we feel is
violating the law that hasn't reached criminal charges- we have the
capability of suspending their license at the first civil offense?
Dilkes: Yes, it is not- it is only the penalties that you would impose because there
has been a conviction for sale are established. You would have more
leeway if that were not the case. If you were administering a penalty for
another reason.
Kanner: And just to clarify- someone had said the penalty was $145 for someone
under the legal age. You are saying it is $1007
Dilkes: I assume that that person was talking about the court costs and surcharge
that are added to the $100 fine.
Kanner: Okay.
Wilburn: The effect of delineating- including the city ordinance- about the state's
progression against the liquor license holder- isn't the effect of that setting
forth the hearing process in front of City Council? Is that the reason why
that is included in there?
Dilkes: That is part of the reason. I think in drafting the ordinance I had two
choices- one was to just incorporate a lot- I mean, as I have told you
repeatedly, the administrative penalties are authorized by state law
already. You are not making these up. And so in drafting it we could
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#7 Page 28
have just incorporated by reference or we could have put it all in here. I
chose to put it all in here because I think it is just easier that way to look at
one piece of paper.
Champion: I have a comment too about the speakers that have spoken. Everybody has
mentioned that this ordinance is against students. I guess I really resent
that because not all underage drinkers in Iowa City are students. And not
all people who abuse alcohol and are creating problems downtown that are
alcohoI related are underage. So we are dealing with a much broader
problem here than just students. And I wish people wouldn't refer to this
as the students are the underage drinkers downtown. I think Iowa City is a
weekend entertainment center. And there are also young people living in
Iowa City who are not students. And I kind of resent the fact that it has
become a student-oriented ordinance. It is an alcohol problem related
ordinance and has nothing to do with students.
Phye: My name is Julie Phye and I am the coordinator of the Stepping Up
Project. And tonight I want to applaud you for your proposed
amendments because research from communities throughout the nation
have shown that measures restricting price specials and holding bars
accountable for illegal sales are effective. The results these communities
have seen have been reduced problems for the people who are drinking but
more importantly for the harm that is caused to the public both socially
and economically. The civil penalties have been shown to be selective
and effective. Imposing civil penalties for a code violation impacts only
those businesses that break the law. It has no punitive effect on
responsible bars. Just as a student and all drinkers need to be responsible
for their actions so do those who market, sell and serve the alcohol. It is a
two way street. Those I don't believe that this city is responsible at all for
providing entertainment to any sector of the public, I feel that as long as
alcohol is cheap and easy to get there is little incentive for entrepreneurs to
provide anything else for profitable entertainment. And I know that you
are tired of hearing statistics but there are three things that I hope that you
will remember. 8 out of 10 of our underage students report that they do
drink once inside a bar. 6 out of 10 of the University students drink to get
dnmk. And often they do this, they report, through price specials. Now,
this is called my fuzzy math but to me that adds up to 9 out of 10 of our
students who report that they have been harmed by someone else' s
irresponsible drinking. And that doesn't even begin to measure the costs
that the community incurs. Thank you.
Cavitt: Mayor, Council Members, I am Carolyn Cavitt. I am the chairperson of
the Stepping Up Coalition. I am a downtown businessperson and I have
worked downtown in business for 20 years. I became interested in the
coalition because I have experienced and continue to experience the
second hand effects of high risk drinking. I do not like to come to work in
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the morning and step over vomit in the Ped Mall, but I do. I don't like to
see the vandalism that occurs downtown when people drink too much, but
I do. We have had a plate glass window broken in our office building with
a beer glass that thrown through it, as well as a fire outside of my building.
It was in the alley and the cost of the repair to my business following that
fire was about $5000. So I certainly have experienced the second hand
effects of high risk drinking. And I think you can traderstand why I have
an interest in promoting an environment that does not include high risk
drinking opportunities. The Stepping Up Coalition is made up of about 35
individuals who represent the greater Iowa City community, the Iowa City
Comnmnity School District, law enforcement officials, University of Iowa
students and University of Iowa administrators. We are operating under a
grant from the Robert Wood Johnson foundation. And that grant is
administered by the AMA. We have been around for about four years
now and our focus is on high risk drinking. We want to reduce high
drinking because of the harm that can happen to others as well as to the
person who is involved in the high risk drinking. We are working to
provide an environment that makes it easier for students to act responsibly.
When people drink too much they can hurt themselves and others. These
measures proposed by you compliment education efforts and social
activities by addressing the issues of access. We support the proposals of
the city council and view this move as a step toward creating a healthier
environment for our students and for the community. Thank you.
Kanner: Carolyn, I had a question for you. In your research of other cities that
enact ordinances similar to this- someone mentioned about this lacking
any connection to social services. Are there any ordinances that bring that
aspect into the equation that you are familiar with in any way or any
shape?
Cavitt: Not that I am, no. There may be, I don't know.
Kanner: Thank you.
Brown: My name is Marquez Brown. I am a University of Iowa senior political
science pre law major. And first I would like to tell you that I am totally
opposed to this ordinance. And I think that it gives the police officers I
guess an opportunity to go into bars and harass students. A couple of
weeks ago when they had the big bar sting me and my friends were
harassed several times by police officers and we are all of age. One of my
friends received a possession ticket and he wasn't even drinking alcohol.
There happened to be a glass on the table on the other side of him that he
did not touch but he received a ticket. I think the answer to the perceived
problem that you see is not restriction but alternative programming. And I
can share with you a letter that I was going to send to the city council but i
decided to read it here to you today. Dear Council Members, students of
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the University of Iowa, including myself, would like to express our
disappointment of the city deciding not to support the students once again.
I feel this is a poor message to send out especially when students are a
large portion of this town and our money helps operate this city. It really
hurt me that the Mayor voted no to give River Fest funding because it
seemed like an annual commitment. In my opinion this is a poor excuse.
Recently there has been much debate on drinking ordinances in Iowa City.
The City Council wanted students to be responsible drinkers and underage
students to seek alternatives to going to the bar. When students came to
you for your help to expand this vision and goal you denied the request.
The past week I have viewed several newspaper articles and saw some of
the responses from the City Council Members. To my surprise, the
repeated response was we know what the problem is however we need to
find a solution. The University of Iowa students gave you a solution to
this perceived problem. We asked you to help fund a University
sponsored event. So I pose this question to you- are you really looking for
solutions to what you perceive to be a problem? Another reason for
denying the request was the city did not want to increase programs and
funding. Once again, this reason is unacceptable. The 23rd Annual River
Fest that costs approximately $75,000 to put on is organized and
implemented by 14 students in this community. The money the city and
the community will receive from revenue and taxes will be far above that
amount. These actions have shown students how hypocritical the council
Members can be. The students are asked to give more and more each and
every year, especially with property taxes. I received a letter from my
landlord saying my rent is going up $50 extra per month. And a lot of my
other friends have also. During the past City Council election students
were viewed as apathetic to voting. Some reasons are because they felt
the city doesn't care about the students unless they are issuing a
possession ticket. In the past week I have seen this notion to have some
merit and some troth. However, with this new election approaching in
November I guarantee you that the University of Iowa students will have
their voice heard. We are looking for some reciprocity here.
Kanner: Before you go- it is Marquez?
Brown: Yes it is.
Kanner: I had a question. You mentioned that them was harassment that you felt
was not justified? Can you tell me again what happened?
Brown: Me and my friends were at a bar- it was a friend's birthday- I walked from
the bar with a drink in my hand and the police officer asked to see all of
my friends' IDs and it happened more than once that night. And it was
just like- they were just in the bar- you can sit at the table and have a drink
in your hand and let me see you ID, let me see your ID. It was like you
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might as well keep your ID on the table so you can just come around and
look at. It gets kind of obnoxious and kind of annoying after a while.
Kanner: You were in the bar and you walked away from the counter you said?
Brown: That is one time it happened that night. It happened several other times
that night as well.
Karmer: And you are saying the police officers-
Brown: Yes.
Karmer: -that were part of the-
Brown: The bar sting, yes.
Kanner: -bar sting were the ones that were doing this and it happened numerous
times?
Brown: Exactly.
Kanner: And you were all over 21 ?
Brown: All over 21. One of my friends received a ticket and he didn't have a
drink in my hand and did not even have a drink of alcohol. They did not
ask him to blow or anything but they gave him a possession ticket. It was
not in his sight- well, it was in his sight but it wasn't within arms reach.
He received a ticket. I think that is unacceptable and I think ordinances
like this that give the police an opportunity to keep going into the bar to
harass students is setting a bad example. It is saying that basically you
don't care about the students. You say that you care about the students
and you want to crack down on the drinking, which you see as a perceived
problem, but I don't see that at all. I think our rights are being infringed
upon of going out and having a good time. Myself, I work 30 hours a
week. I have a full load of classes. And I am involved in extracurricular
activities on campus. But if I want to go out to the bar and have fun with
my friends I shouldn't be harassed every moment by a police officer.
Pfab: I have a question for you. Is there an alternative of not letting people
under 21 in the bar? Would that have solved your problem?
Brown: What was that?
Pfab: Would that have changed the situation that you felt was not comfortable
for you?
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Brown: No, not really. I have friends of mine who are 19 and 20 who go out to the
bar. Their primary function is not going out to the bar to get drunk or
have a drink or two. I mean, where is there to go in Iowa City to have a
good time at other than, you know, if you want to go to the bar and dance.
You don't necessarily have to drink. If you want to go to a movie that is
fine. But after a while things start to close. Iowa City goes dead. I mean,
I work at Village Inn and at that time of night I see more adults come into
Village Inn that are far more intoxicated than any other student could have
ever been. I don't see them getting pulled over in front of my house every
single night with a OWI ticket. I see my friends. They may be leaving the
bar or maybe leaving my apartment and they get pulled over and harassed
by police officers. I think it is a two way street and the police and the city
Council need to stop looking at students. Because like she said before, I
think this is oriented towards the students and if you are trying to solve the
perceived problem of binge drinking I think that is the one thing that is
wrong. I don't think there is a problem. I think when you say there is a
problem and the media picks it up and you keep talking about it you are
creating a problem by saying there is a problem.
P~ab: I can't relate to your situation, I don't drink so that gives me a
disadvantage from your point of view. It appears that the problems in the
community are that there is vandalism and destruction and body fluids and
whatnot left on the street and that seems to be the part that is partly driving
this.
Brown: Then have the police give out tickets for public urination and have them
give out tickets-
Pfab: What about for throwing up?
Brown: Excuse me?
Pfab: For throwing up?
Brown: That is public intoxication and they can give a ticket for that.
Pfab: But it appears that that is the part that is rattling the community the most.
And most of the time those people doing that are students.
Brown: Do you have any facts on that?
Champion: We don't know that for sure.
Pl~b: Or young people.
Brown: I want to see some data on that.
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Pfab: You are talking University of Iowa students but it can be other young
people too.
Brown: There are adults at the bar that are doing things that are far more
obnoxious than students are doing. Like I say, I work at Village Inn and I
work from 4:30 in the aftemoon to 3:00 in the morning. And I see adults
coming in loud and obnoxious and harassing female employees and
harassing female patrons there. I don't see the police giving them an OWi
ticket. I don't see them having their rights infringed yet. But it seems like
you guys are coming after the students. I think that is a really bad position
to take because I think the students are a very viable force in this town and
when we leave over the summer business goes down. I think it is a bad
message to the students to say that we don't support you guys and
anything that you do. We are going to stop you guys from going out and
having a good time because we think there is a problem with you drinking
too much. How do you know what is drinking too much?
Pfab: I just want to say thank you for coming and stating your opinion.
Brown: Thank you.
Dieterie: I would like to heartedly agree with everything that the preceding speaker
said. I see a lot of students in my job and I hear far too many complaints
exactly along the same line as this gentleman's. That people are harassed
for no good reason even if they are legal. I don't think that right and I
think that downtown Iowa City is being targeted. A couple of days ago I
had an occasion to go through the back issues of the Daily Iowan through
all of the police and court reports for the 10 years between 1980 and 1990
on another mission- I was looking for something else. And I really don't
think that things are any worse now then they were then. I really don't.
You know, looking at the headlines of the stories and what was going on I
think that a big mountain is being made out of a very small molehill here.
And I was taught in school that (can't hear) arguments are a big no-no.
But i think that I would like to know how many of the council would
actually admit to ever having been drunk themselves?
Pfab: I guess-
Dieterie: You don't drink.
Pfab: Right.
Dieterie: All right, how about the rest of you? You have been drunk? Have you?
Lehman: Yes.
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Dieterie: All right. So we know then that you are human. You know what it is like
actually to get drunk.
O'Donnell: He is also over 21.
Dieterie: That is right but the thing is- do you think people are magically going to
abstain until they are 21 and then all of a sudden know how to handle
alcohol? I don't. But the way things look- it is even illegal for someone
to give their own children alcohol in their own house. Now, we are only
lucky that the police can't come in our house yet. Maybe they can
actually considering everything. So, I mean, come on. The other thing
about this proposed ordinance here- the part that really grinds me in is the
negative impact on the health, welfare and morals of its citizens. Now,
you cannot really legislate morals. That shouldn't even be in here. Are
you going to try to say that drinking is immoral? I don't think so. Then in
the next whereas is- well, let's see- the fourth whereas down says it is the
intent of the Iowa City Council to hold holders of liquor licenses, wine and
beer permits accountable and responsible. But in the very next whereas it
says the City Council desires to address negative impacts associated with
such activity. So, is holding people responsible the negative impacts of
such activity? I would just say that you might do a little editing on the
thing. Later on in the same page it says the Chief of Police and County
Attorney shall each make an investigation to determine if the applicant is
of good moral character. I also find that offensive.
Lehman: I think that is state law isn't it? That is not our writing. That is state law.
Dieterie: Well then that doesn't mean that it is right. We certainly don't have to
agree with it and put it in our ordinance.
Lehman: But I do think we have to comply with it.
Dieterie: We don't have to state it in this ordinance do we? I don't think we need
this whole ordinance as a matter of fact. But I mean, if we are going to
write it do we have to put that in it?
Lehman: I sense that.
Dieterie: And then down here under Section 4-2-5 Civil Penalties under c it says a
license or permit may be suspended or revoked for any of the follo~ving
causes and number seven is violation of any ordinance or regulation of the
City of Iowa City relating to the purchase, possession, sale, supply,
dispensing or giving of alcohol. So it sounds to me as though at the wish
of the city on this one thing if they want to they can revoke somebody' s
license or suspend it. And it seems to me that the way the thing is written
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going onto e- a criminal conviction is not a prerequisite to a suspension,
revocation or imposition of a civil penalty. That sounds to me as though
this opens you up to selectively closing whomever you want to close. And
I would think that any bar owner downtown would be a little bit
suspicious of this and wondering just exactly who is going to be targeted
to be closed. The other thing is are you saying that these $300 and $500
and $1000 fines have then to be levied in addition to the state penalty? So
that if someone gets a $145 ticket for, you know, with court costs added
for possession under the legal age that that is going to be added to then the
$500 that you are talking about?
Dilkes: No, the $145 is would be the penalty for a first offense possession of
alcohol. That would not be charged twice. It would be charged once.
Dieterie: Okay, we supposing trader the current law- that is a state law apparently?
Dilkes: Uh-huh. It is also a city offense currently. The possession of alcohol
charge although we have- I have included more language in here- does not
change. Nothing in this ordinance changes the penalty or the prosecution
of tmderage possession charges.
Dieterie: So then- but you are levying as a penalty a civil penalty on top of that as
an addition then?
Dilkes: No. Civil penalties are assessed against the license holder and not the
person possessing alcohol underage.
Dieterie: Okay, so you are not saying anything in here then about people who are
drunk? It says here a person who is under legal age who violates this
section regarding purchase or attempt to purchase commits a simple
misdemeanor punishable by a fine of $100. You are just repeating the
state law then and you are not going to add anything more to that?
Dilkes: Currently underage possession charges are prosecuted as both state
offenses and city offenses. Not two different charges for the san~e offense.
Sometimes they are prosecuted as city offenses and sometimes as state
ofl~nses. This ordinance does not change that situation.
Dieterie: Okay, so that a student who is caught with possession and is charged
$145- are they going to be charged anything else?
Dilkes: For a first offense? No.
Dieterie: For a second offense?
Dilkes: The second offense penalty is $200 with an effect on their license.
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Dieterie: And that is a state law?
Dilkes: That is the state law.
Dieterie: All right. Those are simple misdemeanors aren't they? I don't understand
then this other thing you have here- this second ordinance- ordinance
amending Title I-
Kanner: Can you say what page you are on?
Dieterie: This is the separate page that you are considering also where it says here
the City Council desires to increase the maximum penalty to $500.
Dilkes: I think what Ms. Dieterle is referring to is the state code was recently
amended to increase the maximum fine for simple misdemeanors to $500.
We are just mirroring that. That ordinance mirrors that change in the state
law.
Dieterie: Well, all right- does that mean then that when it becomes state law that
then we are going to be seeing people arrested and charged $500?
Dilkes: No, when the fine is otherwise set by code you don't have the authority to
go up to $500. It is only if it is (can't hear).
Dieterie: What is this for then? Who is going to get charged $500?
Dilkes: There are a number of simple misdemeanors in the city code that that
would apply to that are not what are called scheduled or otherwise stated
fines.
Dieterie: All right, can you give us some examples of those please?
Dilkes: One might be a disorderly house.
Dieterie: So if somebody- the police now can come to somebody's house without a
complaint from the neighbor. If they decide that it is too noisy (change
tape) disorderly house charge it can charge them $500? Is that what you
are saying?
Dilkes: I believe that is an unscheduled fine yeah.
Dieterie: I think that is at least as newsworthy as anything that has to do with this
alcohol ordinance. l don't know- I won't take up any more of your time.
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Dilkes: Ms. Dieterle I would be happy to talk to you about it if you want to give
me a call and ask me these questions I would be happy to answer them for
you.
Lehman: And I do think that the affect- and most of this talk tonight is relative- we
are going to take a break until a quarter of anyway but most of- the affect
on underage drinkers under this ordinance is, I think, zero. Is that not
correct Eleanor?
Dilkes: On the underage drinkers themselves yes.
Lehman: There is no effect whatsoever on the students who have been here pleading
their case. It has no effect on them. It is basically an ordinance designed
to make bar owners responsible for what happens in their bars.
Dieterie: Well it does affect them. It does affect them in terms of whether you can
buy a pitcher or not, whether you can go out and celebrate with your
friends or not. It certainly does.
Break
Lehman: We are going to proceed. We will go for probably about another 20
minutes. If you don't get an opportunity to speak tonight you are certainly
welcome to submit your opinions in writing. Obviously, this will be a
topic for Council discussion again at a future meeting. So, go ahead.
Parrott: Hi, I am Steve Parrott. I live in Iowa City and work for the University and
am a member of the Stepping Up Coalition. And also a person who
enjoys coming downtown and taking advantage of the entertainment, the
food and occasionally a glass of wine or a glass of beer. I support this
ordinance, so there are some people out here who do support it. I also
support the idea of trying to change the environment by providing some
other venues that don't concentrate on alcohol. I just want to make three
main points I would ask you to consider tonight. Number one is that the
real problem is not binge drinking itself. The real problem is people who
drink too much and hurt other people. They sexually and physically
assault people. They damage other people's property. And when they
drive drunk they put other people at risk. Nine out often University of
Iowa students say that other students who have had too much to drink
have harmed them. That is just not fair. We can argue about what binge
drinking- how it should be defined. Whether 18-20 year olds should be
able to drink. I don't think there should be any argument that just because
you have something to drink you have the right to harm another person.
Second I want you to beware of conventional wisdom. People who are
opposed to these ordinances and the idea of keeping underage people out
of the bars keep telling us that that will never solve the problem. That
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people will always be able to get alcohol. The funny thing is that nobody
ever actually provides any evidence that that is really true. And I don't
really recall reporters questioning it either. There is some science though
about this argument. Since the 1970's there have been 40 studies on the
minimum legal drinking age and all of that research contradicts the
conventional wisdom. It is true that you will never stop all people
underage from getting beer if you try to restrict access but you will stop
some. And those who do continue to drink according to these studies,
drink less and they experience fewer alcohol related problems. Finally, I
guess I would say we don't have to have a perfect plan to achieve the goal
of reducing the harm that excessive drinkers and their suppliers cause for
other people. You just need to have a good plan. I think these ordinances
fall in that category. They are good ideas that are worth a try. I say we
give them a try and see if they work. If they don't work we can try
something else. Thanks.
Kanner: Steve, I had a question for you. I want to elaborate on this 9 out of 10
students who say that people who drink harm them. Am I getting that
correct?
Parrott: Correct.
Karmer: First off, has drinking gone up over the last say 20 years and has violence
gone up?
Parrott: I don't know if we know if it has gone up over the last 20 years but we
have been doing these Harvard surveys and the intensity of drinking
apparently has gone up.
Kanner: And has violence gone up?
Parrott: I don't know if that is true but I think the last time- the first time we did
one of these surveys- what was it, how many- pardon- 83% of students-
63% of students- no-no, in 1993 how many students say that they had been
harmed by somebody else? From 1993 to 1997 the number of students
who said they had been harmed by somebody else increased.
Kanner: Could you elaborate a bit on that- what that means "harmed"? is it
physical, verbal, threatening?
Parrott: It is all of that.
Kanner: Do you have a breakdown on that?
Parrott: We would have plenty of statistics for you.
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Kanner: Could you just say a couple- what percentage is physical?
Parrott: I don't know that offhand. But we could-
Kanner: That to me is the heart of the matter. If we are finding that there is a
corresponding rise in physical violence or perhaps even verbal violence of
any type along with the drinking there is the evidence that we have to do
something. But- I know you sent some statistics but I need to- I think it
would be good for all of us to hear some of those statistics.
Parrott: I would be glad to supply those for you. I don't know them off the top of
my head. We can give them to you.
Kanner: Okay, but I hear the 9 out of 10 and oftentimes those things get thrown out
and get picked up and that is sort of the mantra.
Parrott: That has never been picked up that I have known of before by the
newspapers. There is a lot of talk about how much people binge drink but
I think it is unfortunate that the coverage of this has never really
emphasized the number of people who are getting hurt.
Lehman: That information has been- we have gotten that as a Council.
Parrott: I think you probably have it. If you don't we can give it to you.
Lehman: We have gotten that. Yeah. Okay, thank you.
Jack Piper: I will make this quick. My name is Jack Piper. I am the co-owner of
Atlas World Grill downtown. I feel any action regarding punishment
should maintain a level of enforcement that avoids placing any undue
penalties on those restaurants, bars and individuals that follow the law in a
responsible and proper manner. Thus, I feel that any course of action that
the city council chooses should include active involvement and
consultation of all parties- students, restaurant and bar owners, and the
residents, to avoid placing any unfair and unwarranted punishment on
those tradeserved such parties. Finally, I adamantly feel that any further
restrictions would at this time be misdirected and tinneeded.
Lehman: Thank you.
Mariam Johnson: Hi. I am really nervous. I have never done this so be kind. My
name is Mariam Johnson. I am 16 years old. I am not here to comment
on the proposals of the bars in the Ped Mall. First of all, I would like to
thank the city council. I am an active member of UAY and I would like to
thank you for your financial support that has been generous. It has
changed a lot of young people' s lives and I am standing here as one of the
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people that is has changed. So thank you City Council. The bar situation-
I feel like it is tinsafe. I have been here- I have lived here just about all of
my life and from the time when I was remembering the Ped Mall all
through that time and to now I feel like it was more of a family spot where
people could come and kind of just talk and be neighbors. I don't know.
And now after a certain hour you just know don't go even by the Ped
Mall. Don't go through it but don't go by it. I am not accusing of college
students or other people. I think that college students have a lot of input
on what the city does but I think that the community is the community and
we are kind of in danger not by just the college students but the- I call
them the "weirdo wannabes" that (can't hear) weirdoes but want to be so
you don" actually know what they are thinking. I mean, just with my
family walking from the coffee shop to the library I have seen people
getting beat up in the alleys and you think hey I am a young girl, this is
scary, I want to get out of here. And I think that that is sad. What is the
Ped Mall going for with all these bars? I feel kind of sad that it is going
on a slow steady downhill slope. And that is my opinion. Thank you.
Lehman: Thank you.
Clayton: Good evening, I am Jim Clayton from Iowa City. That was an eloquent
discussion of what second hand effects are. A person that lives in this
community that is afraid to be down here at night. I would challenge this
council to come down at 2:00 in the morning. Get up out of bed- I know
we all go to bed early now as we get older. But get up out of bed, get
dressed and come downtown to the Ped Mall at 2:00 and watch what our
police department has to deal with. Watch where the only thing between
them and a total meltdown in our central business district is the fact that
some of the bouncers come out of the bars to help them. And this doesn't
happen once a year or twice a year. This happens frequently. I have been
downtown for 20 years and there is a lot of people who have been here for
20 minutes or 2 years or 3 years and we forget what we don't know- what
it used to be like. Ernie mentioned on the radio today when he was on the
Talk Iowa show, somebody asked him "why can't we have more
interesting businesses downtown?" And he said the market place
determines what businesses are going to be downtown. And he is
absolutely right. The market place is determining what businesses. The
market place has determined that the highest and best use of downtown
real estate is to open a business to deliver low priced alcohol in huge
quantities to a population that is 60% underage. Most of the people at the
University of Iowa are not of the legal drinking age. Over the years- when
we moved in there were three bars on our block- the Fieldhouse, it was
Maxwell' s then and it is the Union Bar now, and the third one was
Gringo's bar and restaurant. Now we have Brother's where Eby's and
Hardee's used to be. We have Vito's where Osco used to be when they
moved into the new mall. We have the College Street Billiard's Club
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where Jackson's China was years ago. We have Givanni's where the
music store was years ago. We have Martini's where Bushnell's Turtle
was. How many bars do we need in this community? How much alcohol
do we have to pump out there? I support your initiatives because you are
doing something. I am not sure it is going to work. I don't know if any
single measure would work. There is not the magic pill that we can give
that will solve this problem. The thing I like best about your new
initiatives is that, as the City Attorney has said, it doesn't punish the
students any more than they are already punished except in the area of a
couple behaviors like to they get a pitcher or not. Well, excuse me- that is
not really that big a problem. What it does is it transfers some of the
responsibility to the bar owners. We had a bar owner on our Stepping Up
Committee and he said he liked the phrase "follow the money".
Remember (can't hear) told that to Woodward and Bernstein. Follow the
money! These people that sell these products are making money selling it.
If I am underage and I drink a beer, guess what? There was a profit
eamed. If I am of age and I buy 6 beers for my underage friends, guess
what? There were 6 profits earned. So if you are going to enforce these
ordinances that you have in mind we have to make sure that we don't go
out to punish students. We go out to punish people who break the law.
Now, I really think you should pass a 21. That is where I am coming
from. Because I think that- it is a state law, it is no-brainer. You just do
it. If they want to change the state law let them go to Des Moines and
lobby over there. I think you should also do some zoning to stop anymore
bars from opening in downtown Iowa City. We have got at least one or
two under construction right now. If you would set a limit to the number
that you are going to put on a block or in the central business district or so
many feet from a church- I don't care how you do it. But let's stop the
proliferation of bars in the downtown because if we don't do that- if we
don't pass these ordinances and if we don't consider very strongly 21 as
our taking off point for drinking then we need to change some names
downtown. We have got to get the- College Street has got to be Bourbon
Street. And we could call the downtown the Little Easy like New Orleans
is the Big Easy. Washington Street- Budweiser Blvd, why not? That is
the direction we are going now. The Englert Theater group fought hard to
stop the theater from becoming a bar. Do we have to do that with every
building that is left downtown? Thanks.
Kanner: Jim, just a clarifying question. Are you on the Stepping Up?
Clayton: Yes 1 am.
Kanner: You are on the Board of Directors?
Clayton: Yes.
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Kanner: And you said you had been downtown 20 years, is that living or business?
Clayton: I own the Soap Opera.
Kanner: Okay, thank you.
Pfab: Sir, I have a question for you. You brought up the idea offollow the
money. Now, this is something that I have tossed around in my own mind
here and that is it looks to me that the rants that are charged downtown are
so high that there are very few businesses that can make those work and
those are the bars.
Clayton: I would agree with that.
Pfab: And I think- and so that just crowds out everything else.
Clayton: That is a supply and demand market situation. If I am a landlord and I
own a building I am up here choking me to get me out of the room
because I don't want to hear that. I want to rent my building to somebody
who can pay the rent. But when the bar guys get up and whine that they
are not making any money then why are they opening bar after bar? And
why are these bars expensive and put together with first class furnishings
and so forth? This is not a sleaze operation. These are nice looking
businesses. There is just too many of them.
Pfab: I perked up immediately as soon you said follow the money. I think that is
where the answer is. There is no question in my mind.
Clayton: It is our number one industry in downtown Iowa City. If you want to go
see the most deliveries that come into this community every day, day in
and day out, it is the beer trucks. I don't want to go over my time.
Thanks.
Lehman: Thank you Jim. Now, we are going to take about two more speakers and
then we are going to stop for tonight.
Kanner: Well can we see, Ernie, how many want to speak and see if we can (can't
hear)?
Lehman: We can except-
Karmer: People have been waiting a long time for this.
kehman: I am well aware of that but we also have a lot of people waiting for a lot of
other things on the agenda. We will be discussing this again at a future
date. We are not going to spend the entire evening on it.
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Kanner: Maybe we can set then at the next Council meeting if there is that many
people- maybe we can find out how many people want to speak still. How
many people want to speak?
Lehman: Yeah, there is more people than we are going to be taking tonight. We
will be discussing this again.
Fisher: Hi, my name is Steve Fisher and I live here in Iowa City. I find myself
uniquely capable of kind of commenting on this whole thing. I owned a
bar for 5 ½ years in Pella, Iowa. Pella has a 21 ordinance where you have
to be 21 to be allowed to be in the bar. I am currently a student at the
University of Iowa. And I also am a bartender downtown. In your
ordinance you said- you stated a while ago Mayor that the only people that
would be affected by this ordinance would be the bar owners. And that is
not exactly tree.
Lehman: Primarily.
Fisher: Primarily. Because if you pass this ordinance you have a certain effect of
lowering my customers. And one of the biggest reasons why I came back
to go to college and get my degree and I decided what I should do while I
was back in college was bar tend because I have done it for a long time. If
you- right now I have got a high GPA and because I only have to work a
couple of nights a week in order to live. But if you start putting in
ordinances that changes the number of people who can come do~vntown
and things of those nature, then I have to either go get another job or work
more hours and things like that. And my education suffers. And I know
that that is a far cry from the whole thing but I guess I just think that there
is certainly problems that happen when people go downtown when they
drink too much. And much as the previous speaker challenged you to
come downtown at 2:00 1 would like to challenge all of you to come
downtown at 8:00 and 9:00. Come downtown and see the people that are
out just having a good time. There is problems that happen downtown but
I just- come out and come in the Fieldhouse and see the people that are
underage that are just there dancing and dri~ing Pepsi. Ithappens. Not
everybody that goes downtown causes problems. I just- I have a personal-
l don't want you to ruin my income and I don't want to have to go get
another job so it is about as simple as that. But thank you for your time.
Pfab: I have one question for you. From your point ofvie~v what are your
thoughts about over 21 allowing in the bars?
Fisher: I don't think that would be a good idea. If bars want to do that on their
own I think that is fine. And there are bars that do that. But I don't think
that that would be a good thing. I think it would severely cut back on the
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activities that the legal aged students- I mean, even the 18 and 19 year old
students and 20 year old students that want to just go out and dance with
their friends and things like that- I mean, I think you would be taking
away an activity that a lot of people enjoy.
Kanner: Do you think in Pella it had a negative effect on the community?
Fisher: Pella is kind of a different community in a lot of ways.
Kanner: (Can't hear) an example of your experience. Would you say that it is not
relevant then?
Fisher: In Pella there ~vas a 21 ordinance. You had to be 21 to be in the bar at all
times. As a result, being a bar owner, it just gave me another thing that I
had to watch. To make sure that people under the age of 21- it happens. I
mean, people under 21 came in the bar.
Kauner: Were you losing money because of the age requirement?
Fisher: If they ~vould have changed the- well, I didn't have a cover charge and I
didn't have- I probably would have sold more Pepsi if people under 21
could have been able to come in. I guess I don't understand your question.
Was I losing money?
Karmer: Did it affect your bottom line with the law having 21 ?
Fisher: It is an entirely different situation from where I was at and the sized bar I
was in to the bars such as the Fieldhouse and Brothers. And the fact that
they can charge cover- I mean, you are comparing apples and oranges.
Karmer: So it is not relevant that you brought it up then?
Fisher: I brought it up that I have experienced owning a bar for 5 ½ years and that
I have been in the industry and I have seen the problems that it can cause.
And I also know a lot of people that don't necessarily have a problem who
just go out and have a beer because they enjoy it. Thank you.
Lehman: Okay, we are going to take- actually go ahead.
Wilbum: Excuse me Ernie?
Lehman: Yes?
Wilbum: This is at your discretion- what if we limited the time to two minutes and
we allow people to comment and not ask further questions?
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Lehman: That is up to the Council. I don't think we can take- at two minutes apiece
we can still take an awful lot of time. And I don't think we are going to
get through all of these tonight anyway and it is going to be a topic of
discussion at a future meeting. What is the pleasure of the Council?
Pfab: I would say if we could count off and see how many people who are
actually out there that are waiting.
Lehman: We just did that a few minutes ago. It was a significant number of folks
who still wish to speak.
Kanner: About 5 more? Can you raise your hands again?
Lehman: I see 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 more people. Now, at five minutes a piece
that is 50 minutes and ~ve know that we aren't going to keep to it. I will
go until 15 after and that is the end of the discussion.
Pfab: So talk fast.
Kanner: Can we continue this discussion then at (can't hear) our next meeting?
Lehman: We can continue at the end of- or if we wish to bring it up again at the end
of the meeting under public discussion I would be willing to entertain that
again. Other than that we will reschedule for another meeting. Let's go so
we can get as much in as we can before 9:15.
Dempster: My name is Keith and I an~ a licensee. In the current culture I would have
expected to have heard "hello Keith' out of such an admission. I have run
The Mill restaurant for 39 years come next March. I have never spent a
night in jail. I have never been arrested. I have served- I have gotten
caught in one minor scam where on the night of the homecoming parade
an officer brought some kid that looked 30 in in the crush of business at
the end of the parade and finally got us. The other 40 didn't work. We do
folk music and blues bands and we do all sorts of benefits. We hosted
Tipper Gore and we hosted some Bradley meetings and one very small
Republican meeting. And we do Free Medical Clinic benefits and Green
Party benefits. And now I guess I am under the gun because we did a very
successful anti-jail benefit. What was it- 80% of the people downtown
that voted, voted against it? I am probably on the "bad" list for that. But I
think ~vhat we are dealing with right now is how many beers fit on the
head of a pin. And when we think about follow the money I would
suggest that you follow the money and the citizen input too. $700,000
seems to buy a lot of citizen input from people, some of whom may not
have all invested their damn near entire working life in following the law,
putting out good food, getting a 100% on my most recent health
inspection, and having no busts. The last time I called the police was
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1972. And as I have told a couple of officers since who come in and
occasionally annoy 30-year-old customers because you can't bust them, I
will call you ifI need you. The ordinance does have an affect on those
who are responsible above 21 and adult. It makes downtown Iowa City a
user-unfriendly area. Many of my customers now go out to Oxford. They
are now starting folk music in the Amanas. They have concerts out in
Atalissa because nobody hassles them if they have had two beers and
come home. I lost one of my best customers because he was picked up
and jailed after having one beer at the Sanctuary. He of course doesn't
come down anymore either. And the mix becomes younger and younger
and younger as the adults figure out that there are other towns. And they
peel off. And as the mix gets younger and younger you find that there are
less and less stabilizing adults among any given crowd. I do have a
problem with enforcement and I will just take a couple of minutes and
skip some of the rest of this stuff about taking over parental functions so
that you can make sure that the morality of those who happen to fall
within our clutches is A.O.K. And I will forgo saying that when I moved
to Iowa City in 1956 it was known as the Athens of the Midwest. And I
would hate to see it become the Afghanistan of the Midwest. But we do
seem to be deciding how long the veil should be and whom is politically
correct enough to be able to not be stopped for something. I was in the
back room of my restaurant about 6 weeks ago and I heard this
tremendous crash and I stuck my head out my back door. Some car had
hit the grease trap that is in the alley there that looks like a dumpster and
-knocked off my back screen door- storm door- and broken the frame. And
I hurled an expletive at whoever it was and locked the back door. So
about ten minutes later I get a call on the intercom from my bar tender at
the front bar and he says there is a policeman here that wants to see you
and I said fine send him back. I was knee deep in cutting meat. Well, he
didn't come back. About twenty minutes later I get a call from my
bartender and he says there is another policeman in here and he is
demanding that you come forward. So I did. And he says well there was
some problem in the alley. And I said well, yeah. Well, you've got to
sign a report and I said nah. What do you mean no? It is below my
deductible and if you were going to catch him you already would have and
I have no idea of license plates or identification. I just heard a grotesque
bang and found that I had a dented grease trap. It is a waste of time.
Wilburn: Excuse me- respectfully, we have negotiated for a few more minutes with
the Mayor and he had said until 9:15 and respectfully I would just request
for you to wrap it up.
Dempster: Can I have a minute and a half?.
Lehman: Make a point though.
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Dempster: The point was I am back cutting meat and some Sergeant of police breaks
through my locked back door with a scream and I look over and say you
could have knocked. Well there is a problem in the alley and you have to
do a report.
Lehman: How does this relate to this ordinance we are talking about?
Dempster: What it relates to is the intrusiveness that we are currently suffering in a
place who has for 39 years done its best to live up not just to the letter of
the law but to what I believed was the spirit and finds more hoops to go
through and more ways to get caugJnt and more ways to lose whatever
little life savings I have got. And more time to occupy me from not being
able to cut meat by having to be out there again double looking to see
what in the heck they are going to do next. And I will abbreviate from
that. I have more but you will probably not need it.
Lehman: Well, you can come back. Thank you. This is a discussion which will
either continue at the conclusion of tonight's regular agenda or we will
pick up at a future meeting.
Pfab: Do we want to set a date of when next time we would take it up?
Lehman: I am sorry?
Pfab: Do you want to set a date for a future meeting so these people know so
they can-
Dilkes: Can I suggest that if you are going to continue it you consider that now.
Lehman: Well, this is just a public discussion. Do we need- oh, well- does the
Council agree that we will continue this two weeks from tonight?
Kanner: As an agenda item?
Lehman: Yes.
Kanner: Yeah, I agree.
Pfab: That would be fine. Just so the public knows.
Dilkes: Lees make a motion to do that.
Pfab: I move that we continue this discussion at our next formaI meeting. And I
don't 'know- what date is that?
Karr: 20th.
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Lehman: Moved by Pfab.
Kanner: Second.
Lehman: Seconded by Kanner. All in favor? Opposed? Motion carries.
Karr: Could I have a motion to accept correspondence?
O'Donnell: So moved.
Vanderhoef: Second.
Lehman: Moved by O'Donnell, seconded by Vanderhoef. All in favor? Opposed?
Motion carries.
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ITEM NO. 8. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION APPROVING PLANS,
SPECIFICATIONS, FORM OF CONTRACT, AND ESTIMATE OF
COST FOR THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE CITY TRANSIT
INTERCHANGE PROJECT, ESTABLISHING AMOUNT OF BID
SECURITY TO ACCOMPANY EACH BID, DIRECTING CITY
CLERK TO PUBLISH ADVERTISEMENT FOR BIDS, AND
FIXING TIME AND PLACE FOR RECEIPT OF BIDS.
a. Public Hearing
Lehman: The public hearing is open.
Atkins: Ernie, before you close- I don't think there are people in the audience that
heard what you just did. There was so much noise and milling around in
the back I don't think anyone could hear.
Lehman: This is a public hearing for the construction of the city transit interchange
project and setting the plans, specifications, form of contract, estimate of
cost, etc. And the public hearing is open. The public hearing is closed.
b. Consider a Resolution Approving
Lehman: Do we have a resolution?
Kanner: So moved.
O'Donnell: Second.
Lehman: Moved by Kanner, seconded by O'Dormell. Discussion? Estimated cost
is $140,000.
Pfab: This is- are we bidding?
Lehman: It will be funded by the Transit- pardon?
Pfab: This is a re-bidding?
Atkins: Yes.
Lehman: Yes.
Pfab: All right.
Kanner: And the difference is we are extending- one of the major differences is
extending the length of the time for the contract?
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Atkins: Yes. Joe can give you the details.
Fowler: The length of the contract was extended to 61 days- 61 working days. In
addition to that, the re-bidding moved the construction period from mid
winter to early spring. And then it also called for the deletion of two
~vindows on the east side of the building.
Karmer: And what is the disruption on the interchange area there? Will a lane be
closed down?
Fowler: It shouldn't. There will be an area marked off for the contractor but there
should not be any major disruptions in the interchange.
Karmer: Thank you.
Lehman: Further discussion? Roll call. Motion carries.
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ITEM NO. 9. CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE AMENDING CITY CODE TITLE
14, ENTITLED "UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT CODE," CHAPTER 5,
ENTITLED "BUILDING AND HOUSING," BY ADDING A NEW
ARTICLE K ENTITLED "CONDOMINIUM CONVERSION
CODE" TO ESTABLISH PROCEDURES FOR CONVERSION OF
EXISTING STRUCTURES TO HORIZONTAL PROPERTY
REGIMES (CONDOMINIUMS). (FIRST CONSIDERATION).
O'Donnell: Move first.
Vanderhoef: Second.
Lehman: Moved by O'Donnell, seconded by Vanderhoef. My understanding is this
is an ordinance that will enable us to comply with new state legislation. Is
that correct?
Dilkes: Correct.
Lehman: Okay.
Pfab: That is the only reason?
Lehman: (Can't hear).
Pfab: Is that the only reason for the change?
Dilkes: Correct.
Pfab: Okay.
Lehman: Discussion?
Karmer: Just as an aside- this is an example, I think- a of violation of this is a
simple misdemeanor. This is another case where a simple misdemeanor is
a-
Dilkes: No.
Lehman: You can't convert ~vithout doing this.
Dilkes: It would be a municipal infraction. It doesn't- it doesn't have criminal
penalties.
Karmer: Okay, I am sorry. Can you explain the difference then?
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Dilkes: A simple misdemeanor is a crime- a very low-level crime but a crime. As
opposed to a municipal infraction which is a civil penalty.
Kanner: It is a civil. Okay. Excuse me, I am sorry.
Lehman: Further discussion? Roll call. Motion carries.
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ITEM NO. 10. CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE AMENDING TITLE 6, CHAPTER
1 (NUISANCES) OF THE CODE OF ORDINANCES OF THE CITY
OF IOWA CITY BY ADDING STANDARDS AND PROCEDURES
TO CONTROL THE NUMBER OF VEHICLES PARKED,
STORED, PLACED OR KEPT OUTSIDE ON PRIVATE
PROPERTY. (SECOND CONSIDERATION).
Vanderhoef: Move second consideration.
O'Donnell: Second.
Lehman: Moved by Vanderhoef, seconded by O'Dormell. Discussion?
Pfab: I guess I would have a question here. Apparently we are talking about one
individual here. And I would like to- if I could get a log of the
interactions that the city had with this gentleman? Could somebody tell
me how many times the city has talked to him or worked with him or the
neighbors?
Karmer: Because of this nuisance?
P fab: Right.
Kanner: In particular? Because he has made complaints on other issues. My
understanding is after talking to the neighborhood coordinator that from
her understanding there was no contact.
Pfab: So is this just a neighborhood grudge?
Lehman: I think this is a situation-
Dilkes: Are you talking about- I am sorry- are you talking about contacts between
the housing department and this individual on First Avenue?
Pfab: Right, however this-
Dilkes: You could get that from the Housing Department.
Pfab: Okay, the- this came out of a dispute so what has the city done to- or what
interaction has been going on to settle that on a one to one basis?
Dilkes: I don't know.
Atkins: First of all, we are not in a position to (can't hear).
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Dilkes: But I think you would find it in the Housing Department and I think Doug
was here a couple of times.
Atkins: We can put together the list of the contacts made. I can't guarantee the
accuracy that that is complete because there may have been informal
telephone conversations and things that simply don't get recorded. We do
have a legal process we took- we are involved in. I can get that for you
also.
Pfab: I guess after talking to the individual and trying to sort things out I become
very uncomfortable with this ordinance. It looks to me like it is an
exercise in futility.
Lehman: Why do you say that?
Pfab: Apparently there is a dispute in the neighborhood- what he is doing is he
has the private property there, he is apparently trying to get along.
Lehman: I think the question is whether or not it is appropriate to store 15 or 18 cars
in your front yard. That is the whole question and that is what the
ordinance addresses. Isn't that correct?
Vanderhoef: Yes.
Champion: We have lots of ordinances that cover things like that. I mean, you know,
you can't park on a sidewalk, you can't do this- I mean, we have lots- this
is not an unusual ordinance I don't think.
Wilburn: As I was- I am sorry, were you done Cormie?
Champion: Yeah, I am done.
Wilbum: I voted for this last time and I am not going to vote in support of this this
time. There may be and there probably are cases where one instance has
driven- not only with nuisance ordinances but other ordinances- have
driven passing an ordinance. But in my mind- I was looking over again-
bet~veen now and last time it gave me a chance to kind of look at what
nuisance ordinances are about and I guess in one case if it were a matter of
safety or health then I would feel better about pursuing that. Since the
vehicles apparently are in working order then I don't see either of those
posing a problem enough to persuade me to support this any further. I
think that, you know, there were other issues that came up and again for
me it just came down to whether or not it is a matter health or safety with
this. I guess the individual, just in driving by again, did make some sort of
effort adding on garage space. And earlier there were complaints about
vehicles being parked in the grass and apparently he did extend his
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driveway. But again, the health and safety issue just didn't push me
enough to support this further. And I guess just in closing whether this
has- what effect this has on- I don't know if someone might use a property
value argument against me- I don't know. But does it make it appear like
there is commercial activity there? Yeah. But that is my personal opinion
and I don't think it is the position of the city to be an arbiter in a case like
this. With that said I will (can't hear).
Lehman: Any other comments?
Kanner: Yeah, I think that certainly we limit private actions in a number of
different ways. And again, I think we have to be careful when we do do it.
I am worried about going too far in a few different ways. One, regulating
what is an aesthetic to a certain extent. And I think Ross stated well that it
is not a safety or health issue. Someone told me that they once had a
complaint filed against them by someone in their neighborhood for too
many chairs on the porch. And we didn't have a code against that and I
don't think we should have a code. Another concern that I have is are we
going to be going in and checking Ids to see how many drivers' licenses
there are? And when is something temporary and when is something
permanent? I think there is a number of problems with this. And again, I
voted against it the first time and I will continue to vote against it. And I
would urge those people who have concerns with this type of ordinance on
the council to vote against it this time.
Lehman: I really do share some of the concerns with the rest of the council.
However, this would not be the first ordinance that this council or many
other councils across the country have used for aesthetic purposes. Much
of our zoning codes are for aesthetic reasons. Our sign ordinance is for
aesthetic reasons because of how signs impact. Much of the discussion
relative to Hickory Hill Park and First Avenue are- we talk about the
vistas and we can't allow this and that and those sorts of things are strictly
aesthetics. And I also find- if you look at most of the ordinances that we
have had in this community or any other community almost all of those
ordinances were precipitated by some sort of action somewhere that
appeared not to be in the best interest of the community. So, I am going to
have to support this. My suspicion is that this ordinance will probably be
enforced on a complaint basis the way many of our other ordinances are.
That we aren't going to run around counting the nmnber of cars in
driveways and checking drivers' licenses. If someone complains we will
have the ability to enforce it. I think it is something we probably need to
do so I will support it. Further discussion? Roll call. Second
consideration passes 4-3, Wilbum, Karmer and Pfab voting no.
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ITEM NO. 11. CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE TO LIMIT THE AMOUNT A
PERSON MAY CONTRIBUTE TO MUNICIPAL ELECTION
CAMPAIGNS. (PASS AND ADOPT).
Wilbum: Move adoption- or move passage- adoption.
Lehman: You got it. Moved by Wilbum.
O'Dormell: Second whatever that was.
Letm~an: Seconded by O'Dormell. This is a limitation of $100 per campaign, which
I think is probably a good resolution. Discussion? Roll call.
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ITEM NO. 13. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION AWARDING CONTRACT AND
AUTHORIZING THE MAYOR TO SIGN AND THE CITY CLERK
TO ATTEST A CONTRACT FOR CONSTRUCTION OF THE
SENIOR CENTER PEDESTRIAN BRIDGE PROJECT.
Lehman: The estimate on that project was $268,000. We received two bids- one
from McComas Lacina and one from Knutson. The low bid was
$311,334. Public Works and Engineering is recommending the awarding
of the contract to McComas Lacina.
Vanderhoef: Move adoption of the resolution.
Lehman: Moved by Vanderhoef.
O'Donnell: Second.
Lehman: Seconded by O'Donnell. Discussion?
Hughes: Yes, my name is Richard Hughes and I am from Bettendorf, Iowa. I have
sat through about 2 ½ hours of beer. I am the head of CAACO-
Concerned African American Citizens Organized. I am asking the City
Council to reject the bids on the grounds that the contractor did not make a
good faith effort to try to subcontract some of this work to minority owned
businesses. I am reading from your own laws project manual on the
Senior Citizen Pedestrian Bridge. I don't have no problem with the Senior
Citizens getting across the street safely. All the little Boy Scouts are
probably in school about that time of day. I do have an issue concerning
two things. One is this overpayment to the contractor who is awarded and
the main thing- well, they are both good issues. I had a chance to get a
copy of the bid documents of each contractor. I got involved with this
because I am a contractor. I thought about it, so ifI go up to Iowa City
and complain about something I am going to have problems with the
people. But if I've got to do it that way it has got to be done. When I start
asking questions I have people trying to look into the book to find, you
know, some kind of way to get around the (can't hear) laws. This law was
put on the books in 1964. Actually, the Civil Rights Law was put on the
books in 1864 to abolish slavery. And if an African American is not given
a chance to work and to market their sales- everybody can't get up there
and run up and do~vn the football field. And I don't play basketball. I
can't jump. I have got a bad knee. So anyway what I am saying- I am
going to read these people's bids, okay? And I am going to bring out a
couple of points, which look like a little tomfoolery going on. A little
copy catting in the situation. This bid is from Knutson Construction
Services. Okay, they got a list here- they got like 14 lines- it says- this is
section 00430 Bidder's Pre-Bid Contracts, Submit This Below The Bid
Form, and they said- they list the certified Iowa Minority Business
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Enterprises available from the Iowa Department of Economic
Development. Evidentially they didn't try to contact very many. They
only contacted two- JR Painting and Decorating, 1-24-2001, Quote
received- left it blank. J&J Reed, don't say what they do, don't have any
address- I would like to get a copy of the address and find out have these
people actually been contacted and look at their bids and find out why
they weren't accepted. It says quote received from J&J Reed, yes. Quote
used in bid, no. Okay, that is one. Now, remember when I said who the
contractor is they are supposed to contact. Okay, low and behold we go
over here to McComas Lacina Construction. I believe that is the one that
got the low bid, right? Okay, J&J Reed- sounds like the same company.
JR Painting- I don't know these companies (can't hear). Maybe so, maybe
not, but I am going to investigate that and I suggest that you all investigate
it yourself and see what you might be getting and what you might not be
getting. Okay, quote received, yes. Quote used in bid, no. And I wonder
why not. Okay, JR Painting- quote received, no. Quote used in bid, no.
Okay, now getting on further do~vn into here into the deep situation at
hand some of the laws that are on the books as I was saying that is in your
possession I presume- Minority business enterprise participation program
discretion in accordance with the Code of Iowa Article 73.15, 73.16,
73.17, 73.18, 73.19, 73.20 and 73.21- the owner seeks to provide
opportunities for a minority business enterprise in award of the
construction contract for this project. (Can't hear) participation target for
this project establishes 2% of base bid price- actually, I think it should be
raised up to at least about 10% because 2% ain't very much money when
you got $311,000 out there. And what we are requesting if you don't go
out and try to hire some token- as we call it ~token black person'- they
could work maybe two days or two weeks or something and then turn
around and fire them to make it look good. No, that is not going to work.
That would be going against the laws that are in this book. I don't 'know if
you all have looked at these laws or whatever. (Changed tapes) section 1 -
(can't hear) policy statement, all vendors requesting to do business with
the city and all city contractors, subcontractors must submit an equal
employment opportunity statement. All city contractors, subcontractors,
(can't hear) $25,000 or more require by another government agency must
abide by the (can't hear) of the city contract compliance program. And
you have this already documented. This comes out with the bid
documents. And actually when the bid is read they, uh, minority bids
contact should be submitted with the bid I was informed by a person who
worked- Tumi, Kumi- I forgot what her name was. No disrespect but I
talk to a lot of people, but I am pretty close. She is sitting right back there.
She said the bid- that information wasn't submitted when the bid was read.
And actually, that should be in rejection- the bid should be in rejection on
that ground. Okay, then it says- project (can't hear) work, the complete
equal opportunity statement (can't hear) must be received and approved by
the city. And getting onto another part of this-
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Lehman: Did you discuss any of this with the City Attorney?
Hughes: I don't even know who the City Attorney is. I was bringing it to the
attention of the whole city council because it is up to you all to award the
contract.
Lehman: I realize that but you are talking about points of law for which I don't
think any of us are probably equipped to answer.
Hughes: Well, you have got your City Attorney right there. If she's got any
questions or a statement I would like to continue by saying that you let the
beer people talk their talk and I want to mine. I come all the way from
Bettendorf. And I am sleepy and I missed Oprah tonight.
Lehman: I am not trying to stop you, I just wondered if you had talked to the City
Attorney.
Hughes: I know you are not. I like your tie, you've got to be a good man to wear a
tie like that. I got one with Dally Duck on it.
Lehman: (Can't hear).
Hughes: Okay. I would just like to kind of get it out to you. EEOC- the equal
employment opportunity commission- a federal agency created by Title
VII to enforce the civil rights act in 1964. It also enforces amendments
passed in the EEO act of 1972. The EEOC does not perform routine
compliance reviews, it generally acts only when a complaint is filed
against an employer by a (can't hear) group employers organizations
otherwise represent a (can't hear) employee. I talked to quite a few young
black men and other black people in the little mall you all have downtown
and I was talking about this opportunity to speak on this issue. Like I said,
I had to wait, you know, quite a bit and I don't back up from a challenge.
Like I said, there are two challenges here- save the taxpayers about
$41,000 extra bucks and then get some African American people out there
to gain something and put something back into the community. When you
have people that want to work and not allowed to work there is something
wrong. And when someone that is not actually doing anything to resolve
that problem there is something wrong with them people. I don't know
who is in here representing this contractor. You know, they probably-
they might know about me because I kind of like to put the word out that I
was going to come in here and say something about it. and so here I am.
If they have got any questions we could talk another time. After I say my
little piece I am going to (can't hear) and go home. I am tired. But to get
on with what I am saying, you have all of these laws and then when
someone come up and try to contradict these laws that person I think
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should be fired because she ain't doing nothing but causing a problem.
She is causing a problem by saying well hey, okay what I am talking about
I will be more specific. Okay, I did not be on the job for two reasons. I
was late getting here and the other reason she said well, you didn't have
this affirmative action piece of paper which whatever it is. I don't need to
carry nothing around with me. I am a free man. I feel like if I got to carry
something around it is like being a slave. Saying, you know, here is my
freedom papers. I was born free and I live flee because I am an American
citizen. And my people fought for this country. I went back to 1776-
Karmer: Richard?
Hughes: Yes?
Kanner: Excuse me, I don't understand what you are saying about the papers.
What papers did you say you were required to carry?
Hughes: It was something about affirmative action. I was just saying- bringing up
a point about how a lot of you people that I run into with dealing with
some people that work at the City of Iowa City- they come up with a
counteraction to whatever is out there already. There was just like another
incident- I wanted to bid on a project and Dave Powers called the woman
and told them, well don't even let this man look at the project. We don't
want him bidding on it. It wasn't because he didn't know nothing about
me because they wanted to narrow it down to two people- to the good old
boys. And that is in this law here. Old Boy (can't hear) says (can't hear)
which referred to (can't hear) by word of mouth which is used by the way
to the good job openings were known only by white males. Therefore it
was only white males who got them. The word old in this use does not
refer to age but to long acquaintances. Affirmative action tries to weaken
this exclusionary effective network by requiring employers to actively
recruit ~n m~nonty and women organized- let's see, I skipped a page-
(can't hear) promotion of minorities. So, my main thing is I strongly
suggest that the City Council get with their lawyers and whoever else they
have to get with and go through this information. You all haven't looked
at it. And say, well hey, can we award this contract to this company
because they are not following government guidelines. As I informed
some people who work with the city, I did not print these laws. They was
already in effect but there was no one enforcing them. They going to keep
on doing that Good Old Boy Network. We write down something and
nobody is going to follow up on it. I have actually found a situation with
the City of Iowa City- with the University of Iowa City where the
contractors were submitting fake information just to get their bid accepted.
And then you turn around and tell me, well, we've got guidelines separate
for you then we have from white people. What they was basically saying-
one gentleman got upset and started cussing. I said, hey, I did not cuss
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you so don't cuss me. What I am saying is someone needs to enforce it
and say, well, hey, we will reject the bids and maybe give you all a chance
to bid again. If you want to do it that way- I haven't got nothing against
these people but I can't let them go on doing this and keep doing it and get
away with it. How many times do you come in the City of Iowa City and
see any black people working out there? Not hardly none. You might be
losing business because a lot of black folks like this are this- hey, some
people are over there working and I could set up a business because there
is a market for it. You know? But if they don't see none they go on and
leave. They ain't going to tell you- they ain't going to the city council
meetings. Hey, I come to your town and I ain't seen black people working
here and you just lost out on such and such business. They are not going
to do that. They are going to go tell somebody else about Iowa City-
going to Iowa City all they are talking about is beer drinking. Is that all
Iowa City is about? You have got to open the market to everybody. Give
us a chance to market ourselves. There are a lot of people out there- like I
said, I know a few people. I have got family here in Iowa City. And I
have met some people I didn't know nothing about and I talked to them
and they said, yeah, we want to work, we heard about it but we are not
getting the opportunity to work. There are millions of dollars as I have
been watching Iowa City the past few years- 10 or 20 years whatever- I
have been over by Iowa City quite a bit. I used to come up here a long
time ago. And I haven't seen any African Americans working on any
major construction projects and I would like to know why. And can we do
something about that? We have to go through here and use these
affirmative action laws to get something done.
Wilburn: Can you help me understand? I am tired tonight too. Were you trying to-
just to clarify something- were you trying to bid for project or subcontract
with one of these two companies?
Hughes: No, I wasn't subcontracting with nobody. I feel like- I tell everybody I am
not a minority. I am a black man and therefore I feel like I shouldn't take
no less than anybody else. Because I know what the business is. I know
how much is given to subcontractors and I know what is done to keep
them from getting anything.
Wilburn: I wasn't accusing you of (can't hear). I was asking were you trying to bid-
Hughes: I was going to try to bid. My bid actually was lower than these other guys
but I didn't get it in so I didn't say nothing about it. I informed somebody
but she said she couldn't accept it anyway because my bid was late. Fair
is fair. I don't say you've got to take my bid even though I was late. No.
I missed it. I missed the boat.
Wilburn: Okay.
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Hughes: If you miss it you ain't- you know, you've got to wait for the next one to
come in. But I want to bid on some more stuff but I don't want to have
everybody trying to come around and say, well, yeah we are going to
change this law. No, you ain't going to change the law on me because I
am going to use the law as I see it should be used and I am going to try to
enforce the law. I am not coming up here trying to say I am going to bully
nobody but on the other hand I don't want anybody bullying me. Okay?
It is like taking food out of my mouth. And that is what I am saying. And
what I see-
Kanner: Richard, I have a question just to summarize the gist of it. You are saying
that possibly that there is some federal or perhaps city ordinances that
were violated in regards to civil rights laws?
Hughes: I will let your lawyer figure that out. I ain't going to get up here and say
nothing because it might come down to it and I might have to get an
attorney. You know? And so it might be a legal situation.
Kanner: What are you (can't hear)?
Hughes: What I am actually going to do in a peaceful way so it won't have to go to
a legal level is to say hey, take into consideration what I said, look over it
and look through your documents. If you have only got (can't hear) and
get a copy of this and say what he said it goes with what is in here. These
people do not really try to contact somebody and if they did why didn't
they accept these people's bids? That is what I am saying and I feel like
this is a problem. I look at the situation like this- it seems like it is okay if
a black man can run up and down a football field. He can sign a million-
dollar contract real quick. But a black man coming in to try to get some
construction business where the money is at to build that football field,
they give him all kinds of hell. So everybody ain't out here able to play
football or play basketball. We should be given a change to market
ourselves in a different way. And like I said, I am the head of CAACO, a
new black organization called Concerned African American Citizen
Organized and that is one situation I am concerned about. And if anybody
wants to send me a letter don't send me no bad stuff Send me something
with a reply saying yes, this is what we are going to do. And I would like
to get a copy- I will probably contact this contractor tomorrow and see if
we can get a copy under the Freedom of Information Act. This document-
why this company (can't hear) contact them and ask them why they didn't
accept the bids. I have talked to other African American contractors out in
Iowa City tonight and found out that they didn't even know anything
about it. And like I said, there is more than just two- I am going to say
that these are real people because I don't know right now at this point-
there is more than two African American contractors in the City of Iowa
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City and definitely in the state of Iowa. There is a whole lot more. And
they should be given a chance to come in here and as simple as this- make
some of this money and do something in the community.
Wilburn: I agree beyond- excuse me (can't hear)- because I am still trying to
understand- beyond your bid being late are you saying that you had a
problem with someone in the- do these bids go to the Engineering Staff or
do they go to the Clerk's office?
Atkins: Engineering- well, they go through the Clerk's office.
Wilburn: Did you have a problem with someone on the Engineering Staff with this
bid? Or are you saying that you did with other bids?
Hughes: No, what I had a problem with- another situation I had a problem with was
I came in town and I just recently tried to get on the mailing list as a
contractor- okay- I went to different levels of city goven'tment because
they've got different (can't hear) right, and it is all construction. Yeah, the
little office there, downstairs and one up on the second and one on the
third. So I went to all of them right? And one of the people said- I left an
application to be on the mailing list and I come back a week later and it is
still sitting on the desk. He hadn't done nothing with it. I said, do you
have anything to bid on? He said, yeah, I've got one project but I wasn't
going to tell you about it because them are already two guys looking at. I
said, well, I would like to take a look at. So he gives me the lady's name
and I won't publicly say nothing about here because she probably don't
want nobody to know who she is. So I give the lady a call and she said
yeah, you can come out and get the bid packet. So I go over there and she
had a dog tied on the front porch and she finally let Rover back in the
house. And then I came back a week later and I called the lady and said I
want to set up a time that I could come over and go through the house and
look on the outside and look at the job so I can give a good bid and she
said well, Mr. Powers told me that I don't have to let anybody else come
in my house (can't hear). I don't have to accept any more bids. And I
said ~vhy is that? And she said because he told me I didn't have to. And
so I go in Mr. Power's office the next day and I said sir, I would like to
ask you a question. This lady informed me that you tell her that she didn't
even have to accept anything from me. And I said I think that is kind of
wrong. He said, no, she twisted it around. I looked the man in the eye and
he told me that she twisted it around. I don't think she did. She wouldn't
have said it if he hadn't- she wouldn't have said that he said it if he hadn't
said it to her.
Wilbum: I an~ sorry- this is someone on staff here?
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Hughes: Not the city council. But I am saying he works for the City of Iowa City-
Dave Powers. I give his name because he is a city employee. I will talk
about him like I talk about myself. (Can't hear).
Wilbum: (Can't hear).
Atkins: (Can't hear) rehab.
Hughes: That is that rehab thing.
Wilburn: (Can't hear) take up too much more of your time. You are hitting us with
a lot of stuff here.
Hughes: I am just hitting you with two points. These two different jobs (can't hear)
I wanted to bring in how I got involved with coming up here complaining
about this awarding of contract.
Kanner: I would recommend that maybe we wrap it up and see if we want to
continue this at another time and see if we can get a handle of how to
approach it in a constructive way because I think we are keeping going on-
Wilbum: I was just going to ask if he has had a problem with the process that-
Hughes: No, the problem I got basically is like I said, I don't think you should
award this contract to this contractor reason being because I don't feel like
that they made a good faith effort to try to subcontract some of this out to
minority owned businesses. And to let everybody know this is like- it is
all here- there is even a description of what they call a minority business.
And it is black, Hispanic, and a few other people of dark races. That is
what it amounts to. And you have some qualifying- I know some African
American contractors in Iowa City and Des Moines and other places in the
Quad Cities because I contacted them. As far as speaking on the issue of
saving taxpayers money I am a former politician. One thing I was talking
about was cutting back on kickbacks for certain contractors. I ain't saying
that you all are doing that but you know, we are going to try to put a stop
to any possible slip by and letting- when it looks suspicious here- I mean, I
think you all should look at what you got in front of you. Two contractors
using the same people- which there is nothing wrong with it. But it looks
a little suspicious to me. So I amjust-
Wilburn: I was just going to ask for- if you could write something down that- I
mean, you have really- you have mentioned the two points about this but
you have brought up a lot of issues and without having something written
down or-
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Hughes: I don't need anything written down. It is already written down. I just
want you to read it and get your lawyer over here that you are all paying-
Wilburn: About your experience with-
Hughes: I am going to hold that back right now. Like I told the lady, I've got a
civil rights complaint form already. I am not going to file a civil rights
complaint against the man if I don't -know he is actually doing anything
intentionally. I am not going to jump up and say hey, you are
discriminating against me because you called this woman. I think it is
wrong. I told him that. But I don't think it is to a point that I would file
civil rights complaint against him.
Lehman: lrvin, you have a question?
Pfab: Yeah, Richard, before you came I was just going to speak and I didn't
know that a good looking gentleman was going to come and talk to us, but
I was going to suggest that there is enough differences in the bid here I am
uncomfortable. I followed this through the process and I worked with
Pumi and looked at it. Kumi- I said Pumi and that is wrong. And I am a
little uncomfortable for two reasons. One is the discrepancy in the
estimation of the cost of it and the fact that it is high. And I believe that
the city employees are doing a very good job of doing the estimation. And
also I think there has been a lot of changes both on state and national level
that the economy is slowing. It may be a time- this is one that we should
go out and get re-bid. Just because of the difference in the estimation and
the bid and the fact that things have changed. And I didn't know anything
about Richard here. I didn't even know he existed.
Hughes: My question is on that is-
Kanner: Can we- I have some other questions too and I was wondering if we could
(can't hear).
Lehman: I think the question really is- Eleanor, we have received a couple of bids.
We have received the recommendation from the staff that we accept these
bids. We are having a member of the public, another contractor, telling us
that there may be a reason why we shouldn't accept those bids. Would
you care to comment?
Dilkes: I can't- I mean, it is hard for me to do that. I haven't looked at the bids. I
mean, I haven't looked at the things that the gentleman is pointing out. I
haven't reviewed them.
Lehman: What would your recommendation be?
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Dilkes: Do you want to hear from Kumi? I mean, Kumi have you reviewed the
bids and do you think they are in compliance with-?
Morris: (Can't hear).
Karr: Kumi, I am sorry-
Lehman: Come up to the microphone please Kumi.
Hughes: I will get my stuffoffthere.
Morris: Yes I have reviewed the bids and they do seem to be in compliance. There
are- the two subcontractors that have submitted that are listed as minority
subcontractors were JR Painting which is considered a minority contractor
within the community as well as-
Hughes: Is he black?
Morris: No, JR Painting is Mr. John Rios.
Hughes: What is he?
Morris: He is Hispanic as far as I understand. But I am taking a good stab in the
dark I guess with that one.
Hughes: (Can't hear) find out for sure?
Morris: I believe so. And the second contractor is JJ Acoustical. And that is a
company that I haven't worked with in the past but has worked on other
projects.
Lehman: Do we routinely check this sort of thing before we recommend that an
award- a contract be awarded?
Morris: Um, no we don't. Basically what we do during the bid award process is
we make sure first of all that the contractors have a bid bond. Which in
this case both contractors who are both local contractors and have bid
projects in the past- both had bid bonds in place. Also that the rest of their
documentation was in place. And from that we review the bids and review
it with our consulting- in this case it was consulting architect Newman
Munson as ~vell as the city staff and make- and from the information that
we have make the best possible recommendation to the council.
Lehman: So in your opinion these bids are valid bids?
Morris: In my opinion these bids are valid bids.
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Wilbum: And you said Rios was one of the-
Morris: Rios was one of the bids that was submitted to the contractors. However,
in my understanding he wasn't accepted by the contractor because the bid
was higher.
Hughes: Their bid was higher to the city (can't hear).
Morris: However, Mr. Rios is a contractor that has done- a subcontractor rather-
that has done a lot of work for the city. For example, the Civic Center
additions and renovations he was the primary on that project.
Karmer: Kumi, to the best of your knowledge- and you might say that you don't
have this legal expertise so if you don't want to answer that- what are the
legal requirements Richard Hayworth was bringing up-
Hughes: Hughes, not Hayworth. H-u-g-h-e-s.
Kanner: And could you comment on how they affect the contract bidding process
and what was awarded and how we are in compliance? If that is what you
believe?
Morris: Mr. Hughes is commenting on the compliance contract, which is not a
compulsory contract as far as I understand. It is a voluntary contract.
Dilkes: I don't think Kumi can respond to legalities of this. And I don't know that
I can respond in detail to this one not having looked at the bids. But we do
have a contract compliance program that was adopted as I understand it by
resolution of the city council some time ago. And it is a document that has
to be filled out and is typically filled out by the successful bidder. And I
think Dale typically reviews those and see that they have an EEO
statement and that kind of thing. Now, in terms of what you might
consider quotas or affirmative action the case law I think since that
contract compliance program was enacted has severely limited the ability
of the city to do much else than require that there be an EEO statement.
The law is very severely limited when you can require quotas so to speak.
So I think- we have been- actually we have looked that contract
compliance program and I think one of the things that is on our list is
taking a look at that and figuring out what we need to do with it. But that
is kind of where things stand. I don't know that I can give you a better
analysis of the specifics here without looking at the (can't hear). Dale
might want to respond and tell you what his history has been with the
contract compliance program.
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Helling: The way we look at those is that we try to encourage the contractor as
much as possible for people submitting bids to seek out target business
enterprises. But as Eleanor said, from a legal standpoint we think that in a
case going back to the '80s- a Richmond case- pretty well restricted or
precluded us from having any kind of quotas. And the case law since then
as we have kind of reviewed it would indicate that. The only other thing
that I would say about this particular one and I haven't seen it yet either-
but as far as an EEO statement, remember McComas Lacina the successful
bidder here is the general contractor for the ramp and so we would have
one of those on file already as part of this larger project.
Hughes: Well I think- I disagree with you. There is something in this book that
goes against what they call quotas because quotas still bring it down to we
can have one or two and it is kind of like what we call- African American
people call it as tokens. You know? They don't- I don't even know the
people but I bet you- I would say that 99% (can't hear) that they don't
even have any African Americans working for them nowhere. And as far
as having something already on file, that is what is on file now. It is just a
piece of paper and it is nobody enforcing it. Like I said, that is why I
come from Bettendorfwhere I live. I could have been home watching my
TV set and flicking channels. But I come in here to help you all to enforce
these laws. I strongly protest the awarding of this contract to these people
because they are not doing what is already in the books and you all know
is in the books. Your lawyer is getting paid to know what is in the these
books. You know? That is what the city pays her for, to know what is in
these books. And the assistant City Manager over here- he is talking about
yeah I think they complied all the way back to 1980. I have been looking
at Iowa City from 1976- I haven't seen not one African American person
working on any jobs. That is like what 24, 28 years or something.
Lehman: I don't know but there is-
Hughes: My point is-
Lehman: Richard, there are African American folks who work on jobs in Iowa City.
Hughes: Where?
Lehman: There have been for years.
Hughes: I know you have got a gentleman there. I was surprised you know when I
seen his picture in the thing there. I said, well at least you got one man
and I don't believe he is no token because, you know, that man is serious
about what he is doing. What I am saying is I am strongly speaking for
the African American people and feel like this contract shouldn't be
awarded to people- and the Hispanic guy his bid was rejected Ms. Kumi
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said because his bid was too high to the contractor. And I think that these
people's bid was too high to the taxpayers and Iowa City so on those two
points you all should reject these people's bid.
Lehman: What is the pleasure of the Council?
Dilkes: I should give you another little piece of information too. And that is that
under state law there is also some pretty- at least by case law- there is a
case in Des Moines where Des Moines required the prevailing wage rate
to be complied with by a contractor as part of their bid specifications.
Hughes: (Can't hear) goes in effect when it is federal funds.
Dilkes: No, it wasn't a-
Hughes: It wasn't (can't hear)?
Dilkes: It was a bid specification put in place by I believe the city of Des Moines.
And the City Council- I mean, the Supreme Court found that that was
contrary to the state law which requires award to the lowest responsible
bidder. So we are somewhat restricted in that sense.
Hughes: Former President Lyndon Baines Johnson signed this Civil Rights Act in
1964 and if you don't enforce this law you are probably going to have
continued problems with the situation of all white people working on
construction projects and African Americans not getting anything and they
pay taxes just like everybody else and go to war just like anybody else for
this country.
Lehman: Richard, I really appreciate your coming but I also think there is a time
and a place for this.
Hughes: Well, I thought this was the time and place to do it.
Lehman: Just let me finish please.
Hughes: Yes, sir, go ahead.
Lehman: If you have a concern about this, which you obviously do, and I think that
we share your concern- but I think the time to express that concern is
before bids come in. When the bids are in and the game is over don't try
to change the rules. I don't appreciate that but I appreciate where you are
coming from. And I do think that if you have a point it is something that
we might very well like to address.
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Hughes: Question- why do you think I am trying to change the rules? I ain't trying
to change nothing. I am trying to get you all to go by the rules.
Lehman: Why don't you make yourself heard before the bids come in?
Hughes: I just recently found out about this information and like I said, this is a
public meeting and the constitutional amendment guarantees me the right
to freedom of speech and that is what I am doing.
Lehman: We have public meetings every two weeks.
Hughes: Well i don't want to come back here and sit through two and a half hours
about the beer. You all didn't get on them and I don't feel like you should
get on me. But my point should be accepted just like anybody else. Leave
the beer people out and let's talk about this situation. I am not trying to
change the laws. The laws are there and you are not enforcing them.
Kanner: Excuse me, I had a question. Is there any federal money in this ramp
project?
Lehman: No.
Kanner: So we are not subject to any of the federal provisions on this?
Dilkes: We can take-
Lehman: Probably no state either. This is strictly local.
Hughes: Well it looks like it needs to go to court because from what he is saying he
is trying to look like- that is what I am saying- it looks like everybody is
trying to find laws to go around the laws and I mean if we've got to go to
court we've got to go to court. I strongly suggest that you consider what I
have said and what this gentleman said here is he was against the
overpayment. But I want you also to consider the possibility that these
contractors are not doing what they (can't hear). I am like this- I am a
contractor and I would hire any white person in here as long as they work.
Do you know why? If they are working they are making me money. And
I tell people like this- my brother said something I didn't like and I fired
him. So if you are working for me and you are making me money fine,
you can work for me. But if you say something I don't like I fire you. I
don't care who you are.
Champion: The reason-
Lehman: What is the pleasure of the Council?
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Champion: I just have to clarify this. The reason your bid wasn't accepted was
because it was late.
Hughes: Say ~vhat? I didn't even submit it. I am here talking about the white
contractors that did submit a bid and did not follow the state and federal
guidelines to contact and accept bids from minority businesses. It is the
law. And I will enforce it. Thank you.
Lehman: Thank you Richard.
Pfab: I have found a number of bids here that the city does and I am very
favorably impressed with the way that I see things being done. I do- I am
uncomfortable approving this because of- like I said- two reasons. One is
there is quite a bit of difference in it and also conditions have changed.
The economy has slowed up a lot. Maybe people were cotrating on a lot
of other bids that they were going to get or weren't going to get and
because of the difference in cost and the change in the economy I would
suggest that this be re-bid. That would be my motion.
Lehman: Other discussion?
Wilburn: I think because the bids were close and I do know that Rios has been on
other contracts I am comfortable going ahead and supporting this. Now,
do we not have enough minority owned-
Hughes: Could you speak up a little bit please?
Wilburn: Do we not have enough minority owned contractors bidding? And maybe
we need to do a better job of getting the word out. I don't know how you
found out about this bid but-
Hughes: I was at the right place at the right time. (Can't hear)
Wilbum: I invite you-
Karr: Mr. Hughes? I am sorry- I can't get you for the record. If you wouldn't
mind-
Hughes: What I was saying to him- he said like it looked like you don't have
enough minorities but if (can't hear) attention, there is a list with the state
of Iowa and it has always been there. I know you all should know about
it. If you don't you can contact Iowa Economic Development like I have
advised Ms. Tumi to do and you can get that list. And you will find out it
is a whole bunch of qualified African American contractors that can get
the job done. You know? (Can't hear) bring somebody in myself. I have
been talking to some people now. I am like this, if they are working they
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should get paid. If they ain't working they should get fired. I don't care
what color you are if you ain't doing your job get the heck out of Dodge
the way I look at it. I don't care (can't hear).
Wilbum: Well, I invite you to apply for future bids. But like I said with who is here
I am comfortable going ahead and supporting this bid. But I invite you to
apply for future contracts.
Dilkes: We can review- if you would like we can review the contract
specifications that deal with those issues and the contract compliance
program and report back to you on those.
Hughes: I would like to get a written response from you guys. You all sit up here
and tell me what you are going to do and stuff but I would like to get a
written response and then that way I will respond to you in writing. And
then I will tell you straight out if it comes to a point that we have to go to
court we will go to court. I ain't threatening nobody, I am just saying you
have got your lawyer and I can get one myself. There has got to be a
change. And it has got to be today and it can't wait until years down the
road. It just ain't going to happen no more. And brother, you should
check yourself when you go and pray.
Wilburn: I appreciate your comments.
Lehman: Eleanor, are you recommending that we-
Hughes: Good night (can't hear).
Wilbum: Good night.
Lehman: Good night. -look at these issues prior to approving this contract or are
you saying-
Dilkes: No.
Lehman: -approve the contract and then look into it to make sure?
Dilkes: I think you can make that decision.
Lehman: Is there further discussion relative to the recommendation that we award
the contract?
Champion: [ think we should award the contract and ask Eleanor if she will look into
those questions.
O'Donnell: I agree.
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Champion: I think we need an answer.
Dilkes: 1 am talking about looking at the issues generally in terms of the
specifications and the contract compliance program. I think- I do think the
contract compliance programs which I think was adopted by resolution a
long time ago may create some unreasonable expectations on the part of
some bidders because we don't have a whole lot of enforcement authority
and the law has really restricted affirmative action requirements since that
time.
Lehman: Further discussion?
Kanner: Yeah, I have a couple of things.
Lehman: Yes?
Kanner: One I think we should be assertive in saying that we want a work session
on this issue. I think that is what I am hearing us say. That includes our
ordinance in specific but the general issue of minority contractors. I have
a feeling that would be a part of it anyhow but ~ve should lay that out that
we want a work session. And I would like to know if there is agreement
with that.
Pfab: It looks like that that is probably what Eleanor is saying. I would support
that at a work session later.
Kanner: Is that what the majority is thinking?
Pfab: But it is separate I think from this bid.
Karmer: Right, but I just want to- we had someone speak (can't hear).
Pfab: I think that would be a great idea.
Kanner: Is there a majority that wants to have that?
Lehman: I would suggest that we wait to get Eleanor's report and based on her
report we decide whether or not it is necessary to have a work session. At
this point I am not willing to say we devote a work session to something
that we don't even have a report on.
Karmer: My understanding is-
Pfab: But you will check it out?
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Dilkes: Yeah, I will do that. I am assuming the Council wants me to do before.
Lehman: I think that is accurate.
Pfab: But my point- I didn't know this gentleman existed so I didn't know
anything about this. But that my point is that things have changed and at
different times it has been brought up if the bids come in too high-
Lehman: We got your point Irvin.
Pfab: Okay- no more, no less.
Lehman: Any other discussion?
Kanner: I am with Irvin and I think that I supported it after not supporting it
previously because the costs have come down substantially now it is going
back up. And I think we should re-bid this. I think Irvin makes some
good points. And as much as my friends in Senior Dining and at the
Senior Center-
Pfab: I hate to see that too.
Kanner: -might not like this I think we can get it at a lower cost. And I think we
owe it to the city to do that to try for that lower cost.
Champion: I think it will only get more expensive.
Lehman: This has never been one of my favorite projects but in due of the two
contractors and their relative closeness of the bids I am going to support
the awarding o f the contract. Further discussion?
Champion: I am going to also support it. I don't think it will get cheaper. I think it
will get more expensive as the ramp gets further along. IT is going to be
more and more difficult to do this project. I think the fact that the Senior
Center raised $120,000 is absolutely incredible and I am not about now to
tell them I am not going to build their ramp. I am going to build this ramp
and that is all there is to it.
Kanner: Co~mie, just to clarify. Half of the $120,000 ~vas not raised for the ramp,
it was raised from general donations that weren't specified for the ramp. It
was an endowment.
Champion: I don*t care where they've got it. They got it.
Pfab: Okay-
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Champion: As long as it was legal.
Kanner: That leads me to believe you don't care about (can't hear) other things.
Pfab: I would counter what you are saying Cormie in good spirits here. I want to
see it built and I am not saying we shouldn't build it. But to me it is-
economic conditions have changed a lot in the last 3 or 4 months. And the
place is saved there in the construction part. You don't have to cut a new
hole in it. And if you walk through it things are not going to change other
than the fact you can get a chance maybe to come up at a lower bid.
O'Donnell: I have supported this since day one and I do agree that the bids coming in
are within $13,000 or $14,000 so I will support it.
Pfab: I look at it from a little different point of view. That there is what-
$30,000 or $40,000- percentage wise it is quite a bit of difference there.
On a market that is- on a market in economic conditions that are going
downhill.
Champion: But we also get architect' s estimates are way over and way under. I mean,
this is not unusual and I am going to call the question on this.
Lehman: All right, is there a second?
O'Donnell: Second.
Lehman: The question has been moved- to call the question has been moved and
seconded. All in favor?
Dilkes: It is a motion.
Lehman: It is amotion right. Do we need aroll call orjust avote? All in favor of
calling the question say "aye". Opposed? Okay, all in favor of the motion
to award the contract to McComas Lacina- this is a roll call on this one.
Roll call on the (can't hear). Motion carries 5-2, Kanner and Pfab voting
Champion: I think 5 hours yesterday and 5 hours tonight is how we are going to do
our (can't hear).
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ITEM NO. 15. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION APPROVING THE PROPERTY
TAX EXEMPTION APPLICATION FOR PROPERTY LOCATED
AT 210-212 SOUTH CLINTON STREET, IOWA CITY~ IOWA.
Lehman: This is under the Central Business District Urban Revitalization Plan.
Champion: Move the resolution.
O'Donnell: Second.
Lehman: Moved by Champion, seconded by O'Donnell. Discussion?
Kanner: I had a question. We have financial assistance eligibility guidelines and it
doesn't look like that we put this project to the test of our financial
assistance eligibility guidelines for when we give some sort of tax
abatement such as this. And was there anything done to your knowledge
Steve? Dave? Looking at higher points are awarded for such things as
high paying jobs, long term jobs, and things like that? Higher wage rates,
full time long term non-seasonal positions.
Schoon: No, when we established the urban revitalization plan as a whole we
looked at those guidelines in terms of using property tax abatement as a
tool in the downtown area and at that point the council determined to use it
as a tool for commercial redevelopment in the downtown. So that is when
we looked at those guidelines.
Kanner: Okay. Well, I am going to vote against this because it seems that
overriding- even though we had this proposal out there- overriding that is
that we continue to as a council majority override the financial assistance
eligibility guidelines. And we did that at the Sycamore Mall project. We
do it with the downtown. And I don't think it is in the best interest of
Iowa Citians. And I think it is in our interest and the citizen's of Iowa
City for us to vote against this ordinance for this tax abatement.
Lehman: Steven, I have got to respond to that.
Vanderhoef: So do I.
Lehman: Because I think from a fiscally responsible standpoint- and we are after all
here to represent the best interest of this community- and the best interest
of this conununity includes the financial well being of the community.
That property that burned down had a value of about a million dollars.
We were told by the person who owned that that with tax abatement he
would build a building that turns out to be worth $3,680,000. We continue
to collect the taxes on the one million-dollar valuation of a building that
bumed down, for three years. At the end of three years we collect it on
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$3,680,000. Tell me what a bad investment it is to give him three years
abatement on the difference?
Kanner: It is $200,000 that are greatly needed in-
Lehman: It is $200,000 that would not be here.
Kanner: I don't believe that Ernie.
Lehman: We were told that when he came here.
Kanner: Of course, that is the requirement. And we were told that with Sycamore
Mall-
Lehman: No we weren't told that with Sycamore Mall.
Karmer: We are going to be told with other places too. And I think that trickle
down theory to benefit individuals is not the way to go. I think if we are
going to give relief we should do it in forms of (can't hear) that do
infrastructure around the area. But to go back into the pocket of these
developers is not in the best interest of Iowa City. And I don't think it
helps us in our long-term development or short-term development. I think
there are better ways to do that.
Lehman: Well, I think the taxes on $2,130,000 to provide funds for Human Service
agencies, fire protection, police protection and whatever are very, very
important monies to this contmunity. And if we can do something to
encourage that- I mean, that kind of an investment would make Wall
Street people happier than all get out. So I will support it.
Vanderhoef: I will too. And I will point out once again that we have a city policy to
grow our tax base. Our tax base is where we get our revenue dollars that
come into our general fund that we need to address all of the services for
all of the citizens of this city. The other thing that strikes me is talking
about wages when we are talking about a building in this case. This is a
building that will be occupied by a business later on. That business is not
what is asking for abatement fight now. This is for the construction of this
building. We will deal with any kind of requests from the business owner
who chooses to go in and lease that space. But in the meantime this is
absolutely meeting our city policy that I believe we all supported.
Lehman: I also think it meets the guidelines that we set down at the time. And I
view this very similar to a final plat for a subdivision. If we approve the
preliminary you are almost bound to approve the final.
Vanderhoef: Absolutely.
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Pfab: I will make one comment on this. I think that this was a case where a
person was upfront and said this is what I will do and this is what I won't.
I like that and for that I have no trouble supporting it. He set out the
parameters and he said here is my deal, if you don't like it that is fine.
Take it or leave it.
Lehman: That is right.
Pfab: And we took it.
Lehman: Any further discussion?
Champion: I love the project.
Lehman: Roll call. Motion passes 6-1, Kanner voting "no".
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ITEM NO. 16. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION FIXING THE DATE OF
FEBRUARY 20 FOR A MEETING ON THE PROPOSITION OF
THE ISSUANCE OF $15,115,000 SEWER REVENUE BONDS OF
IOWA CITY, IOWA AND PROVIDING FOR PUBLICATION OF
NOTICE THEREOF.
Vanderhoef: Move adoption of the resolution.
Lehman: Moved by Vanderhoef.
Wilbum: Second.
Lehman: Seconded by Wilbum. Discussion?
Pfab: I was just going to check again and see if there was going to be bids on the
Intemet. But I think I got my answer last night.
Lehman: Okay, roll call.
Kanner: Just to let folks know, this is a possible savings of $600,000 from what
were paying for previous bonds. That is what we are looking for.
Lehman: To get a lower bond rating. Roll call.
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ITEM NO. 17. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION FIXING THE DATE OF
FEBRUARY 20 FOR A MEETING ON THE PROPOSITION OF
THE ISSUANCE OF $9,825,000 GENERAL OBLIGATION BONDS
(FOR AN ESSENTIAL CORPORATE PURPOSE) OF IOWA CITY,
IOWA, AND PROVIDING FOR PUBLICATION OF NOTICE
THEREOF.
Pfab: Move the resolution.
Lehman: Moved by Pfab.
Vanderhoef: Second.
Lehman: Seconded by Vanderhoef. Discussion?
Kanner: With this one we are looking at a potential savings of $200,000.
O'Donnell: It is a good deal.
Lehman: Roll call.
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ITEM NO. 19. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION ESTABLISHING A REVISED
SCHEDULE OF FEES AND CHARGES FOR PARKS AND
RECREATION SERVICES AND PROGRAMS.
Vanderhoef: Move adoption.
O'Donnell: Second.
Lehman: Moved by Vanderhoef, seconded by O'Donnell. Discussion?
Vanderhoef: I think the city has done a very good job over the years of keeping the
charges for recreation activities at a reasonable price and addressing the
needs of low and medium income folks. Just to be clear with the folks,
these revenues still are only meeting 40% of the total budget of these
programs and I think that is very, very good. And I strongly support it.
Pfab: 1 don't think this is directly related to this but maybe eventually it is. And
that is I hope there is enough money there so we can buy a- hire a part
time Naturalist. AhalftimeNaturalist.
Lehman: Any further discussion?
Kanner: I think- I am going to vote for this because I think that Parks and Rec is
doing a good job within the parameters. But I think that we can find
money to lower that 40% rate. And I think that fees are going up 5 to 10%
(change tapes) in the future will consider that.
Lehman: Roll call. Motion carries.
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ITEM NO. 20. PUBLIC DISCUSSION [IF NECESSARYI (ITEMS NOT ON THE
AGENDA).
Waiters: I will take a shot at the alcohol ordinance.
Lehman: Why not?
Walters: Do you want to give me a couple of minutes?
Lehman: Not really, but I will.
Walters: Okay, thanks. I have been sitting here patiently.
Karmer: Emie, just because some folks went first we didn't necessarily say that
that is it for other discussion.
Lehman: I 'know. Let me point out that the only reason public discussion appears at
the end of the agenda is to take care of anyone for the folks who are
unable to speak during the regular public discussion time. And we utilize
that time only when we have to stop at 8:00.
Kanner: And that is what I am saying.
Lehman: We didn't stop it at 8:00. We started talking about the alcohol issue at 20
minutes to 8:00 because there was no one interested in discussing at the
public discussion any longer. Which is why I skipped over it. But go
ahead.
Walters: I am one of those people that as you know- one of those citizens who do
think we have an alcohol problem in Iowa City. But I don't think it has
anything to do with the age of the people who drink. I think we have a
problem that has to do with the responsibility of the people who drink. I
don't care frankly whether they are 15 or 16 and go to the bars as long as
they drink responsibly. It doesn't make a bit of difference to me. And I
am concerned that you are sending- as you are well aware tonight you are
sending a message to a whole bunch ofpeople who are drinking
responsibly that in fact they are a target of your ordinance. And they
pemeive it that way. And I think that we should delay their fears. I don
~vant to say one thing. I think that you are on the fight track in terms of
dealing with drink specials. I think that is a really good idea. And I think
you ought to pursue that as strongly as possible. And I will give you an
example of how well I think it works. I am a long time Cedar Rapid
Kernels fan. When 1 first started going to Kernel's games they used to
have- two or three times a summer we had quarter beer nights, which were
just awful. Virtually you just couldn't stand to be there because of the
abuse. And they finally decided to get rid of it. They raised the prices
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significantly and cleaned the situation up completely. And we haven't had
a problem since. And I think you could do the same thing in Iowa City.
Level the playing field by keeping the prices- if all the bartenders have to
compete on a level playing field for price then I think your market
situation in Iowa City that Jim Clayton was eluding to will change
dramatically once you do that. Once you establish that level playing field
for pricing of alcohol. I work with a lot of young people from the
University and trust me they spend a lot of time looking for those drink
specials. They spend days reading the paper and planning their itinerary
for the night going bar to bar based on those drink specials. And when
they get done a lot them can't stand up. And I am all for responsible
drinking. I try to do it a little bit every day.
Lehman: Thank you Jim.
Pfab: Get your fair share.
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ITEM NO. 21. ANNOUNCEMENT OF VACANCIES.
Lehman: Okay, the Planning and Zoning Commission has two vacancies- one
unexpired term ending May 1, 2001 in addition to a five-year term ending
May 1, 2001. Or a term May 1,2001 through May 1, 2006. (Can't hear) a
five-year term beginning May 1, 2001. So an unexpired term plus a full
term. There are two vacancies. The Public Art Advisory Committee, one
vacancy for an unexpired term from January 1, 1999 to January 1, 2002.
The deadline for these applications is 5:00 Wednesday March 14.
Kanner: Ernie? I had a question. Were we going to talk about combining some
districts as far as representation?
Lehman: We had talked about it because of the difficulty of getting applicants.
Kanner: Is anything happening with that?
Karr: Sir, are you on Historic Preservation now?
Kanner: Well, yeah, about Historic Preservation.
Karr: You are on Historic Preservation now correct?
Kanner: That was my intent to my question.
Karr: Okay.
Dilkes: I don't think the Council can just combine the districts. I think it is set by
ordinance so you would have to find out from your commission what they
are-
Karr: A staff was researching with the state because there were some state
parameters that were affected by individual districts. Each time you
designate a district there was a requirement that that district be
represented. And the last I had heard the staff member was investing that.
Atkins: I think you are right.
Kanner: I am sorry, the last you heard what?
Karr: The last I heard the staff was investigating and waiting for an
interpretation of that.
Atkins: What I recall is that you had to have a representative from each district or
something like that. We owe you a memo. And i will get you that.
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Karmer: So we will hear something soon then?
Atkins: Sure.
Kanner: Okay, thank you.
Lehman: Previously announced vacancies- Historic Preservation has two vacancies
for three-year terms ending March 29, 2004. The Civil Service
Commission has one vacancy for a four-year term ending April 4, 2005.
Deadline for this application is 5:00 Wednesday February 28.
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ITEM NO. 23. CITY COUNCIL INFORMATION.
Pfab: I have said everything I can think of.
Lehman: Cormie?
Champion: My brain is gone.
Lehman: Mine is too. Mike?
O'Donnell: I am tired.
Lehman: Dee?
Vanderhoef: Nothing.
Lehman: Ross?
Wilburn: My brain is gone too.
Lehman: Steven?
Karmer: One thing-
Atkins: Your brain is still good.
Karmer: I don't know if it is good. There might be some (can't hear) vote.
Atkins: I apologize for that comment.
Kanner: We got an email in our packet about the DEA, which I believe is the Drug
Enforcement Agency looking to ban hemp seeds. And I bring that up
because we have the Iowa State Legislature Agricultural Committee which
has recommended that hemp be allowed to be grown in this state. And I
think it is something that we as a Council ought to applaud if not at least
formally. We have a couple of stores that sell hemp products and I think it
is the wave of the future and I think it is a way for Iowa to increase its
economic activity. It is a matter of time until it happens and I think it is
something that will explode in Iowa City as a great way to do economic
development. So I would urge people to contact the DEA and tell them
we don't want to ban hemp seed, which have great nutritional value and
cooking value and other value. Thank you.
Lehman: I have only one thing. I know it is late but I need to bring it up as a
responsible grandfather. The Johnson County SAFE Kids Coalition will
be sponsoring a clinic March 31 on the proper use of child safety seats. It
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meeting of February 6, 2001.
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will be at Hargrave McEleney at 3760 Highway 1 West in Iowa City from
1-3 p.m. Appointments are required. They can be obtained from calling
Mercy On-Call at 358-2767. And that seems minor but there are so many
people who do not know how to buckle kids in safely. So March 31 at
Hargrave McEleney.
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City council
meeting of February 6, 2001.