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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2001-10-08 Transcription October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 1 October 8, 2001 Special Work Session 5:00 PM Council: Lehman, Champion, O'Donnell, Vanderhoef, Wilbum, Pfab, Karmer Staff: Atkins, Helling, Karr, Dilkes, Franklin, Davidson, Mollenhauer, Boothroy TAPES: 01-91 BOTH SIDES Lehman/The work session, the first item is our zoning items, Ms. Franklin. Franklin/Yes. O'Donnell/Perfect timing. Lehman/Your entry is perfect. Franklin/Good. Plannin~ & Zonin~ A. CONSIDER A MOTION SETTING A PUBLIC HEARING FOR OCTOBER 23 ON AN ORDINANCE TO REZONE APPROXIMATELY 3.07 ACRE FROM MEDIUM DENSITY MULTI~AMILY, RM-20, TO MED1UM DENSITY SINGLE FAMILY, RS-8, LOCATED AT 747 W. BENTON STREET. (REZ01- 00013) Franklin/It's a lot of setting public hearings. Wilburn/Is that your executive summary or? Franklin/That's, yes that's the executive summary. Okay, for the 23rd to rezone approximately 3 acres from RM-20 to RS-8 at 747 W. Benton Street, that's to set a public hearing. I'm just going to run through these quickly unless you guys stop me. B. CONSIDER A MOTION SETTING A PUBLIC HEARING FOR OCTOBER 23 ON AN ORDINANCE TO REZONE APPROXIMATELY 6.15 ACRES FROM INTENSIVE COMMERCIAL, CI-1, TO COMMUNITY COMMERCIAL, CC-2, LOCATED AT COMMERCE DRIVE AND LIBERTY DRIVE. (REZ01-00015) Franklin/To set a public hearing on an ordinance to rezone approximately 6 acres from Intensive Commercial to Community Commercial at Commerce Drive and Liberty Drive, that' s in Scott Six Industrial Park, that's what' s ~known as the Fareway Rezoning. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 2 C. CONSDER A MOTION SETTING A PUBLIC HEARING FOR OCTOBER 23 ON AN ORDNANCE TO REZONE APPROXIMATELY 24.12 ACRES FROM INTERIM DEVELOPMENT SINGLE-FAMILY, D-RS, TO SENSITIVE AREAS OVERLAY LOW DENSITY SINGLE-FAMILY, SAO-5, LOCATED EAST OF HICKORY TRAIL. (REZ01-00012) Franklin/Item C is the setting a public hearing to rezone 24 acres from DRS Interim Development to the Sensitive Areas Ove~ay density of 5 units per acre, that' s First and Rochester Developments at the end of Hickory Trail. D. CONSDER A MOTION SETTING A PUBLIC HEARING FOR OCTOBER 23 ON A REZONING ORDINANCE TO AMEND THE OPDH PLAN FOR VILLAGE GREEN PART XVIII TO PERMIT NINE ADDITIONAL RESIDENTIAL UNITS ON 4.33 ACRES OF PROPERTY LOCATED WEST OF SCOTT BOULEVARD AND SOUTH OF WELLINGTON DRIVE. (REZ01-00018) Franklin/The next is to set a public hearing again October 23 for a portion of Village Green part 18 and this is for 4 acres for condominium development along Scott Boulevard. E. CONSIDER A MOTION SETTING A PUBLIC HEARING FOR NOVEMBER 13 ON AN ORDINANCE TO REZONE 1.38 ACRES FROM HIGH DENSITY MULTI-FAMILY RESIDENTIAL, RM-44, TO MEDIUM DENSITY MULTI- FAMILY RESIDENTIAL, RM-20 FOR PROPERTY LOCATED AT 1045-1075 W. BENTON STREET. (REZ01-00020) Franklin/Item E is to set a public hearing for November 13 and this is for the rezoning of 1.38 acres on Benton Street at 1045-1075 West Benton from RM-44 to RM-20, this is the item that' s on the work session agenda separately, what would you prefer Ernie do you want to talk about that now or later? Lehman/What's your pleasure? We're there go ahead. Franklin/Okay, basically what' s in your packet was a memorandum from me regarding this proposed rezoning that was proposed by Robynn Schrader at your September 25 meeting on behalf of the neighborhood in the Weeber-Harlocke area. And in that memorandum I just outlined a schedule, by setting a public hearing tonight that would begin a moratorium or suspension of building permits that were not in compliance with both the existing zoning and the proposed zoning of RM-20 so it does not mean that no building permits could be issued but those building permits would have to be for a project that would comply with either zone. The 60 days is up on December 7 and so for the moratorium to have any affect that is for you to have time to consider the rezoning of this property you would have to complete that by December 7. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8,2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 3 Lehman/Karin this would also go through the regular Planning & Zoning process. Franklin/Yes it definitely would go through the regular Planning & Zoning process. Lehman/Recommend and get back to us, okay. Franklin/And that is scheduled for October 18 and November 1st Planning & Zoning Commission. That follows just their regular two meetings that they usually do with the rezoning and that's the assumption that I make and that schedule I put together for you. Kanner/Karin have you heard from the proposed buyers of the property who wish to increase the density from the present state there? Franklin/Yes. Kanner/What have they said so far regards to (can't hear)? Franklin/They prefer that this didn't happen I mean obviously, they have a plan that would maximize the density of the property and so they are not in favor of this moratorium being set or the down zoning being considered but that' s what one would expect. Kanner/Did they say it would cause any (can't hear) financial harm if we didn't proceed as soon as possible? Franklin/I have not heard that statement from them, I wouldn't put those words in their mouth or not put those words in their mouth. Kanner/Thank you. Franklin/So that' s basically it on that particular rezoning that has been requested for you to set the public hearing. The only difference that's being asked is that you set the public hearing earlier than what you normally would with the Planning & Zoning Commission recommendation, typically you wouldn't set the public hearing until after you got that recommendation just so you understand. F. AN ORDiNANCE TO REZONE APPROXIMATELY 14.07 ACRES OF PROPERTY FROM LOW DENSITY SiNGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL, RS-5, AND PEANED DEVELOPMENT OVERLAY - LOW DENSITY SiNGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL, OPDH-5, TO OPDH-5, FOR APPROXIMATELY 14.07 ACRES OF PROPERTY LOCATED SOUTH OF VILLAGE ROAD AND NORTH OF WiNTERGREEN DRIVE. (REZ01-00014) This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 4 Franklin/Okay, I'm going back to the agenda Item F is, it's also, it's actually setting a public heating, what happened is there was a mess up on getting the notice in the paper and so the public heating that you set at your meeting the last time, basically you do not open that public hearing, you reset a public hearing for October 23 on this same issue. Lehman/So the appropriate action on F is to set a public heating for October 23. Franklin/Yes, yes. Lehman/Okay. G. CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE AMENDING THE ZONING CODE, ARTICLE 9, SIGN REGULATIONS, TO PERMIT CANOPY ROOF SIGNS. (SECOND CONSIDERATION) Franklin/Item G is second consideration on canopy roof signs. H. CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE TO REZONE APPROXIMATELY 30.11 ACRES OF PROPERTY FROM RURAL RESIDENTIAL, RR-1, TO SENSITIVE AREAS OVERLAY - LOW DENSITY SINGLE FAMiLY RESIDENTIAL, OSA-5, LOCATED AT THE WEST END OF BRISTOL DRIVE. (REZ01-00011) (PASS AND ADOPT) Franklin/Item H pass and adopt on the Bristol Drive OSA rezoning. I. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION APPROVING THE FINAL PLAT OF A RESUBDIVISION OF LOT 236, WASHINGTON PARK ADDITION, PART 11 (ARBOR HiLL), AN 8.02 ACRE, 2-LOT RESIDENTIAL SUBDIVISION LOCATED NORTH OF WASHINGTON STREET, EAST OF GREEN MOUNTAIN DRIVE. (SUB01-00017) Franklin/Item I, there is a request to defer this again to October 23 while the Attomey's for the applicant can get the legal papers together. J. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION APPROVING THE PRELIMINARY AND FINAL PLAT OF SALTZMAN SUBDIVISION, A 2.8-ACRE, 3-LOT COMMERCIAL SUBDIVISION LOCATED EAST OF RIVERSIDE DRIVE SOUTH OF BENTON STREET. (SUB01-00011) Franklin/And Item J similarly to defer again to October 23 while they get their legal papers again. Karr/Excuse me Karin I had deferred to 11-13 on J. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 5 Franklin/Oh, okay. I will defer to what you have. O' Donnell/That' s November 13. Dilkes/We'll let you know before you get there. Franklin/Yea. Lehman/Fair. Franklin/That' s it. Lehman/All right great. Al~enda Items 3e(1). CONSIDER A RESOLUTION ACCEPTiNG THE WORK FOR THE IOWA AVENUE STREETSCAPE PHASE II PROJECT. Vanderhoef/I'll just give you a heads up on the consent calendar I have a conflict on 3e. Karr/Excuse me, yea we're going to have to wear the microphone, I can't. Lehman/Oh the mic, I'm sorry. Vanderhoef/Okay I have a conflict of interest on the consent calendar 3 e( 1 ) so I' 11 be asking for that to be pulled tomorrow night. Lehman/That' s tonight. Vanderhoef/Tonight, don't let me forget. Lehman/All right. O'Donnell/3e(1). Vanderhoef/Yes. Lehman/It's at the bottom of page 2. 3b(1) BOARD OF APPEALS - SEPTEMBER 10. Kanner/Under 3b(1) Board of Appeals 9/10 can I get? There' s the minutes of the vote on Sycamore Mall wanted an exception for building code, and there was a 3~2 vote to This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8,2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 6 deny but it did not list who voted which way, could I get that information by tonight? Steve or Marian. Atkins/I don't know. Karr/Well it's after 5:00, ifI would have known about it I could have gotten staff, I don't know we could try I don't know. Kanner/Okay well the earliest you could get that would be good. Atkins/Is that the one on the fire code? Lehman/Right. Vanderhoef/Yes, it is on the door ways and. Karmer/Well actually no this is with an automatic pipe, a water pipe. Dilkes/It dealt with the fire code. Lehman/The fire code. Kanner/Yea the door way, so the doorway (can't hear) something else. Vanderhoef/Well that' s what triggered it was that with the new doorway they had to change into a different code. Kanner/Yea so that was kind of interesting. Champion/I just want to ask Eleanor if there is a conflict of interest on 3e( 1 ) because it's really just accepting the work it has nothing to do with awarding it or doing it. Dilkes/Well I think Dee has excused herself from that discussion all the way along and we might as well be consistent about that. Lehman/Right. 3b(5). PARKS AND RECREATION COMMISSION - SEPTEMBER 5 Kanner/And number 3b(5) Parks and Recs. minutes, they were talking about the County Farm and what to do with the County Farm from a Parks and Rec. perspective and if they had some say so and one thing that struck me is people have been talking about library, not library cemetery expansion and that' s something that we might throw out there to look at perhaps in conjunction with Coralville. My understanding is their cemetery space is near almost near the limit, and people This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8,2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 7 talked about the possibility of, we're talking about cemetery in Hickory Hill, some people through out the idea of a west side cemetery, this might be a good space that perhaps could be incorporated with historical aspects that other people are concerned with, so I don't know is there any interest in that from any of the Council? Vanderhoef/When the discussion happened earlier it was do we go into Hickory Hill or do we go look at land to the west and now that we have proceeded with this to the east I frankly don't have any interest in one on the west at this point. Kanner/Well we're tied up for 50 years supposedly for cemetery and now' s maybe the time to look past that 50 years while that land is still available and so that' s out there and maybe Parks and Rec. people will pick it up and bring it back to us if there's an interest. 3e. RESOLUTION. Kanner/And I had a question on resolutions number 3e, we have letters of acceptances from Rick Fosse on all of them except for number 2 on the Highway 6 pedestrian overpass, I was wondering why we don't have a letter on with Rick's signature on that. We have a letter from the contractor apparently but not from Rick and it seemed a little unusual. Atkins/It's probably unusual, if I recall that project, that's the pass through funding. Lehman/University (can't hear). Arkins/And the University would have to accept it Steven not us that's. Kanner/Well we might want to then take away that item from acceptance because we're formally accepting that work and I don't know who we're accepting it from if not from our own folk or someone from the University, we're responsible for that as the fiscal overseer. Atkins/We were not the fiscal overseer's, we were the grant pass through, but I understand your point. Dilkes/I think if there's been another contractor, another oversight who has been dealing with assuring that this contract complies then we want that letter from them and we want to be able to rely on that letter in our acceptance of the work. Atkins/But how do we answer Steven's question in the sense that Rick did not accept. Dilkes/I think you're right, it has to do with, it's an unusual relationship between us and the contractor and the University. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 8 Atkins/Because the owner of the project is the University. Dilkes/I'm going to have to go back and look at those documents if you want. Jeff Davidson/One correction to something that Steven said the letter that' s in the packet is the firm that the University hired to oversee the project, not the designer of the project, the designer was a firm out of Des Moines, Shive was hired to inspect the project for the University so they would be the ones to say whether or not it should be accepted. Atkins/The Shive Hattery letter would be as if we were getting a Rick letter. Davidson/Yea, exactly, they were the over sight of the construction not the designer or the contractor obviously. Lehman/All right thank you. 3f(1). CORRESPONDENCE. JOHN NEFF: JOHNSON COUNTY JAIL STATISTICS. Karmer/And in correspondence we got some jail stats. and so who is John Neff?. Who submitted that, do we know. Vanderhoef/I asked the same question. Atkins/I know John Neff. Lehman/I know John. Atkins/Occasionally sends letters to the Council about a number of issues. Lehman/He's (can't hear) from work and I, boy I hate to say for sure but I think he's been doing some consulting work with the county on the jail. Atkins/He has. Lehman/I think so. Atkins/I thought John was a retired Professor of Education. Lehman/He is a retired professor and he has apparently done a lot of work in this area and not just here. And I don't, I mean the same information we got I think went to the (can't hear)jail committee. Atkins/Oh. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 9 Lehman/I mean that wasn't prepared for us, that was prepared for the jail committee and he sent me a copy of that information and 1 requested that it go in the packet so that everybody got the same information. Kanner/Yea it's good to have those they look like comprehensive, there's quite a bit of validity to them I guess that we could attach to that. Lehman/Other agenda items. Everything else on the agenda is ready for tonight is that correct? ITEM 7. APPROV1NG AND AUTHORIZING EXECUTION OF AN AGREEMENT FOR PRIVATE REDEVELOPMENT BY AND BETWEEN THE CITY OF IOWA CITY AD SEABURY & SMITH, INC. AND SOUTHGATE DEVELOPMENT COMPANY, INC. O'Donnell/Did I see Seabury & Smith on? Atkins/Yes. Lehman/Yes, that' s here. Atkins/That came in a few minutes ago. Seabury and Smith had not finished their paper work, it just came in. Lehman/We got that tonight. Atkins/It was a indemnification document that they had not signed that they corporately were reviewing it, it was the only outstanding piece of paper. Dilkes/Well no, the entire, the indemnification agreement is part of the agreement, the larger agreement, and we passed you out the pages that showed changes to the agreement that's in your packet. Atkins/They had accepted everything but that element that's what I thought. Dilkes/As I understood it the corporate counsel for them has not seen it but we have told Southgate's attorney that your, that you can proceed tonight if you wish. Lehman/Okay. Okay, if there are no other agenda items, the next item is the Lot 64-1A, I think we asked at the last meeting for some information which we received. Franklin/Ernie before you go to that. Lehman/Yes go ahead. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 10 Benton Zonin~ Petition and Moratorium Franklin/There were two parts to that Benton Zoning Petition item, it was the Benton Zoning petition and the moratorium pending the southwest district plan, we need some direction from the Council as to whether you wish to pursue that in any way. If you recall when Ms. Schrader came to you at the 251h, there were two requests, one was to set the public hearing on the rezoning from R1Vi-44 to RM-20 on 1045- 1075 West Benton Street. The other request was that the Council look at a broader moratorium in the area basically between Miller and the Hatlocke Weebet area Benton Street to Highway One or something like that. Lehman/That' s not part of this. Franklin/No, it's not part of the Benton Street Rezoning Petition, that your setting the public heating on the Benton Street Rezoning Petition is a separate thing, but what we need from you is direction on whether you wish to pursue this larger moratorium as the Southwest District Plan as being gone through and I guess Eleanor if you just want to inform them as to what your staff found as far as moratoria is concerned. Dilkes/I think temporary moratorium can be done in a way that is defensible, there needs to be appropriate findings as to why there's a necessity for it which I think we probably can make in this situation and then there has to be a definite time when it ends and we, if that's something you want us to pursue then we need to prepare the appropriate legislation to make that happen. Vanderhoef/Would that then necessarily even though perhaps we put a 60 day one on the Benton Street one, would that hold that Benton Street property into that? Dilkes/No it would not. Lehman/This would be separate. Dilkes/This is the one moratorium that will (can't hear). Vanderhoef/Yea it is but because that Benton Street is in the south. Franklin/No. Dilkes/No because. Franklin/Go ahead. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8,2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 11 Dilkes/We have a code provision that says you can only apply a moratorium for a period of 12, 24, I can't remember what the, once you do one you can't do another one for a period of time. Vanderhoef/For a year. Franklin/12 months, yea. Vanderhoeff Okay. Dilkes/So it would not include that property. Vanderhoef/Okay and can you give us an update on where we are with the Southwest Plan. Franklin/Yes, we have scheduled the neighborhood meetings, the first round for neighborhood meetings for the beginning of November, well I don't have the dates in front of me but it's the very first couple of weeks of November. I would anticipate that the Southwest District Plan in terms of it being adopted by the City Council would be sometime next spring. We would then in terms of a moratorium want to consider a time period in which we could look at any potential rezonings that would happen as a consequence of the district plan which you would then want to add at least three months to whatever it was, the date was, let's say we set that, the plan was going to be finished in April that then you want to have May, June and July complete any rezonings because the plan itself does not actually do anything. Okay so with that information there's another piece of information I need to pass onto you and that is that we have had a concept plan submitted by the owners of a major portion of the property in this area, the Ruppert's and their attorney has notified us that they would certainly take the position that they do not want to have this moratorium, this general moratorium put in place while the Southwest District Plan is being considered. I guess what I would advise is if you, if you have an inclination to consider this at all that we put together the necessary documents for you because I don't think that they will be particularly onerous in terms of work load and that you have an opportunity then for there to be some debate on this subject as to whether a moratorium is put in place or not in which all the parties wl~o are interested will have an opportunity to speak to you about it. Kanner/Tell me again what the proposed moratorium is on. Franklin/Well just roughly I think we would be looking at the area between Miller Street and the east boundary of the RS-5 zoning which is basically the RS-5 zoning goes along Weeber Street. So it would be from the back lot lines of the properties on the east side of Weeber Street east to Miller and then probably from Benton to Highway One excluding the Cox property which is the subject of the public This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8,2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 12 heating you would be setting later on and also excluding the Southgate property which has been the subject of a rezoning petition this year also, and the SAO. Kanner/And again it would be for no build, what is the moratorium (can't hear)? Franklin/The moratorium would be, well we would have to work that out, but one of the possibilities is that it is a moratorium on any rezoning considerations or any building permits, other than those four say remodeling of a single family house or something like that. And that's something we would have to work through and would be in the documentation you would be considering. Dilkes/The idea is to preserve the status quo and we would have to work on the language as to the best way to do that. Pfab/I have a question, what is not in the exception? It looks like the biggest part of the property is an excepted from the moratorium. Franklin/No, actually the largest part of the undeveloped property that is there is right now is the property that's owned by the Ruppert's. Pfab/Right so but that they want that excluded. Franklin/Well they do but that would be up to you to decide whether, if you decided to exclude the Ruppert property, yes there wouldn't be any sense in doing this. What I'm saying that technically, legally, you should not, can not include is the Cox property which you will be considering setting a public heating on or considering setting the public hearing on later this evening and the Southgate property which already has been subject to a public hearing is in litigation right now so those two small properties could not be part of the overall moratorium area. The Ruppert property could even though they would argue they do not want it to be. Pfab/What about the Buss property? Franklin/The Buss property likewise because that has been subject to. Pfab/(can't hear). Franklin/But that's down zoned to RS the proposed down zone to (can't hear). Pfab/So it appears to me all we're really going to cover is the Ruppert property. Franklin/Largely yes, yes, there may be some properties on the west side of Harlocke Street that are not fully developed to the RM-44. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 13 Pfab/So I mean if they, if they motrot a vigorous attack on our moratorium we may have some problems. Lehman/Well it's still our choice. Franklin/Yes. Pfab/I mean is it, is it legal that we can do this? Ditkes/Yes. Franklin/Yes you can institute a moratorium. Pfab/All right let's do it. Lehman/Is there an interest in pursuing the moratorium? Dilkes/I think what Karin was suggesting is that we get the legislation drafted, put it in front of you and then you can have that policy debate. Lehman/I think that's a good suggestion because I really don't think that we're. Vanderhoef/I'm not prepared to make that (can't hear). Lehman/No but I do think that we that the arguments both pro and con should be presented and at that point we can decide whether or not we wish to have a moratorium. I don't know my suspicion is that that would, time wise, how long would it take to prepare those sorts of?. Dilkes/Well I think we'll get it on your next agenda. Lehman/Okay that' s fine so we could expect that then in two weeks. Dilkes/We may want to do an ordinance for them, we've not completely worked through that, what form we want to do it in, but if we do do an ordinance for them there may be a need for special meetings to get through it but we'll get back to you on that. Lehman/So I hear a saying proceed, we'll debate that. Franklin/Okay. Lehman/Lot 64-1A. Franklin/Lot 64-1A This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 14 Preferred Developer Selection for 64-1A (Item #12). CONSIDER A RESOLUTION SELECTING A PREFERRED DEVELOPER FOR THE REDEVELOPMENT OF URBAN RENEWAL PARCEL 64-1A. Franklin/I guess at this point you have the memorandum from us with I hope the information that you were after. The one thing that I do wish to stress is that all of the tax information is an estimate, please do not take those as absolute numbers. When the actual assessment is done of this project as to what the value is whichever one is built it may not be the construction value, it may be, it is likely to be less than the construction value, but what we did for purposes of this for comparison is to use those construction numbers which are the only numbers we really have right now to work with. But please pay careful attention to the assumptions that are here and to the fact that this is just an estimate. Pfab/Karin, assumptions were the same for all across (can't hear). Franklin/Yes, well, they were generally the same across the board except I will point out in a highlighting or bolding the assumptions for each group we went by what they told us that is that the Moen Group said that the residential component would be rental and that the Executive Hotel Group said that the residential component would be condominiumized. Okay, and we have found from talking to Dan Hudson that even if you rent a condominium it is still assessed as residential not as commercial so the notion of the time share, time share I'm just using that terminology of renting out the condo's would not likely change that tax profile. Pfab/So what, I'm going to ask, this is a question to you. In other words if no matter if they're condominiums whether they're rental and owned by the developer and rented out or owned by an individual person that may occupy them. Franklin/Or owned by an individual person or rented out. Pfab/Right okay, that the tax, the assessment that we're trying to gain on but still only come out to 54 percent as of (can't hear) time. Franklin/Right. Pfab/So in other words that reduces the amount of our tax base by 46 percent of those units. Champion/Correct. Franklin/That's right, that's the difference. Lehman/That's right. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8,2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 15 Kanner/One other question on assumptions, the, in the Moen proposal for the luxury suites, you do not assume that people would stay there for more than 30 days is that correct? If they do my assumption is. Franklin/Right, I mean. Kanner/My assumption is they don't pay hotel/motel tax. Franklin/Right, there' s a number of things that we didn't do, we didn't do variations in the occupancy, basically if they were going to be used as hotel rooms that it was 65 percent occupancy for both projects. You know whether that is true or not is an argument that I think in the Moen figures are trying to make some kind of argument about occupancy which I will let them explain during the formal meeting if they wish to. But we just went 65 percent occupancy because you can go through a probably infinite number of permutations with all of this and make yourself dizzy trying to figure it out so we kind of had to land on some numbers that we felt comfortable with and that we tried to treat both projects fairly. The rate per night is what we were given by the proposers, that obviously is another thing that could potentially vary and then could have an impact on occupancy so. Pfab/I have another, have the individual developers felt comfortable with the numbers that their fellow developers brought to the table as that? Franklin/You'll need to ask them that. Pfab/Okay. Vanderhoef/Was there any attempt to get information similar to what is on the first page of the memorandum, we have a list of potential businesses that might choose to come in for a conference but what seems to be a glaring absence to me is anything to do with the University of University Hospital. Franklin/With the University, we tried, basically the response that we got from the University was that they needed more conference space but they couldn't exactly say how much or for what conferences. It was a micro response which is why we didn't include it. Vanderhoef/And nothing about continuing education and new opportunities within the University setting? Franklin/They couldn't give us any specifics Dee. Vanderhoef/Okay then I'll just put out what I have heard, thank you. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8,2001 Special Work Session Page 16 Franklin/That' s fine. Lehman/Are there questions for Karin relative to this? Is the Council comfortable then with taking this up at that formal meeting which will occur at 7:00? Champion/Yes. Wilburn/Yes. Pfab/I'm not comfortable but I probably won't have enough votes to make that any different. Lehman/Well I mean if there are questions that you want to ask now. Kanner/Yea what are you not comfortable with Irvin? Pfab/Pardon, well it's, my point is what are our benefits when you take, if you don't get paid for the lot and a big percentage of this is subject to the reduction of rental, or residential property, what do we give up for what do we get? I mean I have trouble making that work? Vanderhoef/So your looking at two different projects and one' s more rental that will turn up at (can't hear). Pfab/Well I'm looking at them all across the board, I mean I think we have. Franklin/What we get for the lot, it's a really difficult one to get a hold of at this stage of the game because what we have been given by both proposers is the same thing. Pfab/But there are four proposers. Champion/We narrowed it down to two. Lehman/We're only discussing two of them. Franklin/Yea you narrowed it to two at your last meeting. Lehman/Right. Pfab/But if that means that somebody wants to buy the land for $250,000 versus $1 and 3/4 million I think that that's going to go into CDBG funds I think that is a very important fact. Champion/We've already made the decision to narrow it down to two Irvin. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8,2001. October 8,2001 Special Work Session Page 17 Pfab/Without any public input. Champion/Well. Pfab/The public has had no chances to discuss this. Lehman/Irvin from the. Vanderhoef/They did at the last meeting. Pfab/No there was no discussion. Vanderhoef/We. Franklin/Yea there was. Vanderhoef/It was on the agenda and we deferred it so anybody that had wanted to come and talk about it as an agenda item last meeting could have. Lehman/And still can tonight. Vanderhoef/Certainly. Franklin/We did have input at the last meeting. Lehman/Right. Wilbum/Wasn't the? Franklin/I don't think you were here Irvin. Pfab/Yes I was. Wilbung The thing about the RFP was a, that was an item back when that was put out for public discussion, the criteria, and I'll go back again to the statement I made last time. If the over ride, if the number one criteria, or if the only criteria were anyone of the, you know those criteria laid out then that probably should have said then and that was a point where there was room for input from the public. Kanner/Well it was said Ross but I think I get your point. Wilburn/Yea I mean you know what I'm saying, what was passed, yea you got my point. Lehman/Well we'll take that up a little later tonight. Next item. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 18 Nei~,hborhood Council Rental Housin~ Enforcement Proposal (IP 1 of 10/4/info. packet) Lehman/At our last work session, unknown to myself and I think the rest of the Council we had Jerry was prepared to speak with us, we did not hear from him then, there' s been a meeting since then between some of our staff folks and whatever and I think Jerry's here tonight to give us some sort of report on what happened there and I think we need then to discuss what we would like to do and what direction we'd like to go and how we'd like to do it, Jerry. Jerry Hansen/Mr. Mayor, because this is a multifaceted thing that we're proposing to you and there are many neighborhood associations involved in this, I'd like to split my time with Tim Walker tonight so he can present their views on this. Lehman/Okay. Tim Walker/Should I sign in for the work session? Kanner/Yea. Walker/Well what we didn't get a chance to do at the last work session was describe the breadth and depth of the problem or problems in our neighborhoods so I can speak more to the problems in a campus bounding neighborhood. We are fortunate that we don't have the extreme problems that Jerry will talk about from his neighborhood but we are not able to sleep with our windows open in the summer time, or in the spring time, if it's nice out it's usually fairly loud outside. We have properties that are grossly under maintained by their owners, they're rented out to large numbers of people, they're frequently overlet and city staff is finds it very difficult to prove overletting. So we have on our streets, six parking spaces taken by one house which does not have off street parking and therefore should not have more than three unrelated adults you know, there are six cars. So that's the kind of problem that we're facing and it's largely a poor enforcement problem, another effect of that overletting and of the poor enforcement of code and civil law is that we have family owned homes that the family moves out, they have given up on the neighborhood, they have left and it's very difficult for us to sell those homes to other families. Families that would like to rent in neighborhoods near campus find it difficult because the rents are so high, the rents are higher than a house payment by far. Granted the landlords need to make a profit on their investments but there are two ways to make that profit, one is to maintain the property so that it holds it's value and grows in value along with the rest of the neighborhood, that of course is what the rest of us as homeowners would like to see happen to the neighborhood at large and it can't happen if properties are allowed to just be run into the ground and mind of all their value. The reason families can't rent is that the rents again are so high, I think they're so high because the landlords are accustomed to being able to overlet their properties with impunity it's easy to not This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 19 be detected so we need to give the city some tools that make that a detectable and enforceable offense because it is really, it's at the core of many of the problems in the neighborhoods, there' s just too many people there and it's a critical mass of people that can get very loud for those of us who want to send our kids to school well rested or go to work real rested. That's really all I have to say without repeating myself. Lehman/Okay. Walker/Do you have any questions? Champion/I guess I want to ask a question, you probably don't have the answer to. You are assuming that landlords are overletting, it is difficult to prove, but it could be that people who renting who are actually on the lease are letting other people to stay there too. Walker/The landlords should be aware of that, if they,re not aware of what's going on in their properties who else can be aware of it? You know it shouldn't be the neighbors job to call all the time. Champion/No it shouldn't be. Walker/There should be something, there should be realistic meaningful enforcement's so that if a landlord gets caught at this, it's expensive enough for them that they will never want to do it again. That's why we would like to see us you know for a repeat offense eventually just loss of that rental permit. Pfab/I think also that should be part of the agreement between the landlord and a tenant, if the tenant is going to disobey the law the landlord has that built in or else he's. Walker/Yes, that's. Pfab/(can't hear) so to speak. Walker/Another of the things we're calling for in our proposal is modeled on East Lansing Michigan it's a big campus town, and they've addressed many of these problems. What they do is they require a lease addendure, that the landlord and the tenants have each signed that states among other things we realize that there are only three legal occupants for this property, or whatever that number is so we know they've signed it, the city has a copy on record, if they have more in there then we know that they know they're on the wrong side ofthat issue. Sothat's, yea we are asking for that. Pfab/Very good. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 20 Karmer/Tim. Walker/Yes. Kanner/I like some of what your saying holding the landlord responsible for something. My question is have you talked to, well in this state of Iowa it's way towards the landlord versus the tenant, the tenant' s don't have rights that they have in other states so there's certain things that only the state can do but perhaps in Iowa City we can do some things, some power tenants and encourage tenant associations perhaps. Has your group talked about those kind of things of how we can empower tenants in the long term because I think that' s how we have to look at it. Walker/Right. Kanner/For a long term solution. Walker/I agree and I would love to see the quality of life of tenants go up in this town, I was a tenant for a lot of years and I lived in a lot of scurvy places, you know they were what passed for apartments. We, yes we'd like to address that as part of this too without making this so complex that it doesn't fly, we don't want to drag this town. Is that an answer to the question you asked? Karmer/Well I think you answered it, personally I would like to see stronger concern about that issue of tenants. Walker/Okay. Kanner/And that's something that wasn't really addressed at the last meeting, tenant involvement. Walker/The concern you see reflected here is largely concern of people who come to the neighborhood association meetings and you know it's a matter of representation and numbers, and we have more homeowners that are up in arms than tenants who are up in arms. And tenants unfortunately really don't have, as you say don't have as much power, they may not want to stick their necks out, so yea if we can stick our necks out for them that would be helpful too. Kanner/Well let' s think of how we can do that maybe in this process. Walker/Sure, okay, thank you. Lehman/Thank you Tim. Jerry Hansen/Steven one of the things we have talked about is posting information inside each building as to who the contact people are if it's a management company or if This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 21 it's the landlord itself. Right now it's very difficult to ascertain in some buildings who actually gets called when there are problems so one of the things we'd like to see is posting of that information in the building. Tim alluded to a few a the problems in his neighborhood and I guess a whole list popped into my head that he didn't mention like the vandalism, the loud houses, the breaking bottles out in the streets, the vomit, I mean there's all kinds of things that have driven people out of these neighborhoods. And you know when I think of Wetherby and the problems that we have in our neighborhood, when we started three years ago with Wetherby we had 30 people that regularly, every time we had a Wetherby meeting man these people were there. You know we're down to six now because of attrition for the same reason that they have moved out of our neighborhood. And how do you replace these good folks that want to get involved? You don't, you know we were treated to diminished property values in the last evaluation, I don't think that's fair. The proposal we put in front of you is, it's not about beating up on landlords, it's not about beating up on tenants, it's not about beating upon the city, it's about personal responsibility for your actions and I guess that' s our bottom line, I mean we have open gang activity going on in Wetherby, we have people standing in the parking lots of some of these buildings smoking dope and nothing is being done, nothing. People with assault rifles in their cars, we got very fortunate a few weeks ago and had one of those incidents stopped. But we've had several that didn't get stopped before that. And I just think that this ordinance is about standing up for the rights of the vast majority of the law abiding citizens in this town and I think we deserve a safe and tranquil place to live and the city needs tools to do this and these tools are in front you. I just don't look at this as being discriminatory in housing, I see this as standing up for the rights of the people who want to follow the rules in this town. Now I'd like to pass a list arotmd of people we would recommend to be on this committee and. Kanner/Jerry is we the Neighborhood Council? Hansen/The Neighborhood Council yes, and I'd like to say this needs to be done sooner rather than later, the faster we can get this committee together and the smaller we can keep this committee, the more we're going to be productive and the quicker the neighborhoods are going to be satisfied. This is decades worth of frustration built up in people that has finally come to a head and we are really willing to fight for this so we would recommend the people on this list, I'm sure since we've proposed this, there' s all kinds of people who are crawling out of the woodwork to have their recommendations now and that's fine, I mean I'm prepared to work with whoever this committee is set up with. But what we need is action now and we need results. Pfab/I think one of the things you mentioned and I think, I'm going to say it in different words than you did but I think the people who are obeying the law in these neighborhoods have a fight to feel safe. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8,2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 22 Walker/Yes and their voice has gone unheard. Pfab/Right, and I mean they're intimidated, a lot of them are intimidated to speak up. Hartsen/Many have moved out of apartment complexes in the Wetherby Friends and Neighbors Area because they are afraid of their life, and this is not a joke, I mean this has happened. Pfab/Well you still have an unsolved murder there. Hansen/Absolutely. Pfab/And that was just a case somebody was, didn't take their intimidation or somebody misunderstood something. Hansen/Yes. Pfab/It was even the wrong, I think it was the case of a totally mistaken identify of who did what but apparently one of the neighbors had something to do with it. Hansen/Well I can't address that Irvin I really don't know. All I know is. Pfab/I'm just saying it's real. Hansen/Yea it is real. Sid Jackson from the police department has told me last week that gang activity is more prevalent in Wetherby than it has ever been. Lehman/Well Jerry I think we hear you and I think what we need to do is set up with a committee that will work with that' s acceptable to everybody and I have some ideas which I'll share with the Council and then we can discuss this but I like, but I think your right it's something that needs to get going as soon as possible. What I would suggest is that the Council contact the Neighborhood Associations by letter, encouraging them, or asking them a person to represent that neighborhood on that committee so that we as a Council will not be making the representation, you as a neighborhood will recommend the person you want to represent yourself which I think is more important than Council picking people. (END OF 01-91 SIDE ONE) Hansen/Excuse me are you talking about after all the neighborhood associations have recommended someone we choose from that or all 28 be on the committee? Lehman/Well no, no, well I don't, my suspicion, and we're just talking here, we've got a couple three neighborhoods or four whatever that seem to be the most, the problems seem to be pretty much centered in those neighbors, if there wants to be This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8,2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 23 more neighborhoods that' s fine but I think the two or three or four are the ones that really want representatives there, I don't think a committee of 28 people from neighborhoods alone is probably going to be a very good working, a very good committee. Hansen/Yea it won't work. Lehman/Right so I guess my suggestion would be that we ask these Neighborhood Associations, three or four to appoint someone to be on that committee and we approach landlords, and ask landlords to appoint someone to that committee so we don't choose that person, they do. Hansen/(can't hear). Lehman/We need someone representing tenants and if there's a tenant association that would recommend a tenant the University of Iowa Housing Department certainly could have a representation on this because I think they do represent most of our tenants are students. I think we need perhaps nonvoting, but we need someone from our legal department, someone from our police department, we need someone from Housing Inspection Services to be there to answer questions but not to necessarily form the ordinance. I believe a committee like that needs to sit down and identify the problems which you've just described, you already have an ordinance from Davenport which may very well work, we also have one from I think Green Bay or not. Vanderhoef/East Lansing. Hansen/East Lansing. Lehman/East Lansing, to me a committee like that has a possibility of working fairly well. Hansen/Well I can save you some time on the neighborhoods, because if myself, Tim Walker and Ann Freerks are on there, that represents three different neighborhoods of the four. Lehman/And my suspicion is that those neighbors would, that would be acceptable to those neighbors. Hansen/If you wanted one more it would be Grantwood and that would probably be Jane Klitzka. Lehman/Well until we want, maybe it is what we want but I think it's going to be all one. Hansen/Yea. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 24 Lehman/Discussion. And I have, you also need a chairman, I've taken the liberty to think of a chairman which I have the tremendous amount of confidence in. Pfab/(can't hear). Can I suggest something first? (can't hear). Wouldn't it be better for that committee to appoint their own chairman? Lehman/Well except wait until who I hear who I think might be a good prospect. Pfab/Well. Lehman/Dee Norton is a former Council person. Champion/Oh he'd be wonderful. Lehman/Who's a very level headed person who I think would be a tremendous mediator, I know when he sat on the Council he was a tremendous person and Dee would do this and I think Dee would do a wonderful job, but that would be just my recommendation though. Council discussion. O'Dounell/Well I want Jerry's opinion on that. Pfab/Yes. Hansen/Well we recommend Hillary Sale or William Buss, neither one are really active in Neighborhood Associations tight now and we feel that their very neutral but they really understand the problems that we're going through, and that' s just our recommendation I mean we will work with whoever is put in place but this is something that needs to move forward and it needs to move forward now. Lehman/I agree with that. O'Donnell/But there's been a substantial amount of work done on this. Lehman/Oh yea. O'Dormell/And a group of Neighborhood Associations have gotten together and recommended these people. Hansen/Well you know this has been a frustrating process because for two years we've been making proposals and yet all the time we keep heating bring something to us that's in place and working and we bring something that' s in place and working and now we're going to tear it apart and make our own anyway. Lehman/You may not. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8,2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 25 Champion/Well we have to tear it apart and make our own. Lehman/Well their going to have that job, they may decide to recommend it exactly the way it (can't hear). Champion/But why we, I don't mean us, I mean we the commtmity. Wilburn/I think that, that I would add that, Jerry and Tim I'm glad that you all recognize the importance of having some different representation on this group you've got. Hansen/It's the only way that things are going to work. Wilburn/Yea and if you'd let me finish please, you know some of the concerns that I share from you, it's important to make sure that the Davenport ordinance and any other ordinance that you look at, those are geared and tailored towards issues and problems in their commtmities and it's important whatever is finally decided upon, it's tailored towards the problems and issues in this community and you know yourselves have identified there's some slight variation between neighborhoods as to what some of the presenting problems are and if it ends up as being some type of ordinance you know that's fine, great, super if it gets at the heart of the problem that we're talking about. Or if the answer is Council giving direction to appropriate staff departments you've got to step up enforcement of what's existing on books, whatever is decided is going to be most effective I would certainly support. Hansen/Well I'm glad to hear the enforcement because without enforcement, without the city being willing to do this it's just so many more words on paper. Wilburn/And that' s why I think it's important to have some of the department representatives there so that if there is an enforcement problem with what we've got on the books, and as you all work through the process, if that's a problem that we need to say do this then I would rather we say do that as opposed to going too far and drafting something which may or may not address the specific problems and give us some a consequence that we wouldn't want to see. Pfab/I think I mentioned to you before and I'll repeat it again Ross, you're right, the object of this is that the people that live in these neighborhoods have a right to be safe and secure, the tenants, not the people that are breaking the law, the other people that live in those neighborhoods, and whatever it takes to do that has to be done I believe. Because there's a lot of people that just get up and move, I've been working on this for quite a while and it's really sad because like Jerry said the problems are there but they're not being enforced. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 26 Wilburn/All I said Irvin was as long as we're not, we don't put something in place that' s going to cause some unforeseen problems for someone who, there' s a range of criteria in the Davenport ordinance that I would want to make sure we are not trampling on some rights and that's all I'm saying, we can discuss and debate it at another time when the committee gets done working on it, you've said twice now what your concerns are so I hear what your saying. Pfab/Okay. Wilburn/Okay. Champion/Ross are you also saying that you think we should have someone from our legal staff on this committee? Hansen/Absolutely. Pfab/A City Attorney. Hansen/Absolutely. Champion/Right, oh right, and well I don't know if it has to be the City Attorney but an appointee of some kind and oh I forgot what else I was going to say. Hansen/Could I just? You know five years ago when Davenport put their ordinance in I used to hear on the news an awful lot about the gang activity going on in Davenport and the murders that they had and things and yet I hardly ever hear about that anymore, I mean. Champion/Maybe everybody' s moved out of Davenport. Hansen/No, I've talked to Mike Ferris in Davenport and he's said that this has worked extremely well. Champion/Jerry just remind me, what happened with your PiN money for the extra police protection. Hansen/It's ongoing. Champion/Is that helping at all during? Hansen/Well, quite frankly it's a little frustrating to me right now because I, we set up a schedule with the police for a two month block of time, and I asked at that time that the officers come back to us and tell us if they feel that the time is being spent in the right places, if they feel that there would be another location that would work better to help us rather than the ones we had laid out. At the end of that first This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 27 block of time I had to go to the police department and get the next schedule because they didn't send it to me, they didn't give me back any input as to what I had asked for, so when I got the second schedule finally because I had to go get it I asked again for that input, I still haven't got that input and now we're at the end of that schedule and I haven't got the one that's coming up to go through the end of October here. I mean it's just like we're not here and that's frustrating to me and I don't know whether that money has been effectively spent or not because I can't get the interaction from the police that I've asked for. Pfab/Jerry, I think there was a large land, a manager over there that had requested a meeting with the police chief and he requested that I be present and the police chief said he didn't want me there but he would report, I got a report from him and the other one, he said that supposedly things were worked out well I just got a call from that person again and they said they wanted another meeting because things aren't moving, the same thing your saying, the cooperation just doesn't seem to be there. Hansen/Well I know that these continuing rumors continue to fly about calling the police and getting police response in our neighborhood. I've heard building managers tell me that they were told by the police not to call unless it's a 911 emergency. And yet they had real issues on their hands, they had people in their parking lots that they needed to have removed and this is the rumor okay not that this has happened but to get that information for me is very difficult and I think that even if it's right or wrong the fact that the rumors floating casts a bad shadow on the whole thing. Pfab/I was told by the people that made those calls that that's true. Dilkes/Can we stick to the topic? Lehman/Yea I was going to say why don't we get this committee set up because these are the kinds of discussion that the committee needs to, what's the pleasure of the Council? Karmer/Well I just want to comment on the composition of the committee, I heard from you and Tim sounds like two problems of groups of people that are causing problems, one would typically describe as college age kids being rowdy and alcohol problems and things with over crowding in one neighborhood. And then in your neighborhood your talking about other people possibly gang related activities, violent activities, it could be some of the same people so I would say that with the first group we definitely need to have a couple people that are college age, one I would recommend Nick Klenske, to ask him to be a representative or for him to pick a representative as the UI (can't hear) president, two look at other college age youth that are renters perhaps, I think we need at least two because it is heavily, it seems to be heavily balanced so far the This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 28 committee that's proposed in favor of home owners and landlords so I think we need that. And then in your neighborhood and it's everywhere but especially in your neighborhood I hear problems of racism and so I think we need to make sure that we include people of color and other minorities into this committee, we have to make an effort, and possibly some gang members, we have to go and get one or two of those people to be involved in this committee and be part of the discussion. Jerry you give a frown, it's not something that' s impossible, it's something that you put resources into and the city might need to put those resources into work and to get rid of gang activity and this is one step in the right direction I believe. Hansen/I do frown at you Steve. Kanner/Right, and Jerry I think the only way we're going to get beyond just having landlords and homeowners talk and really get to a long term solution is to get these people that are affected. You know 1 go into your neighborhood and hear people talking about those people, and code words they're using for minority people and vice versa I hear too and I think we really need to get to the root of it and if we're going to work on the racism and the other problems that are taking place in the city we have to make an effort to get people that are affected and involved and I would ask that we make that effort as a Cotmcil to have them be part of that committee that's going to work on this. O'Donnell/I will forego putting gang members on here and I think you've done a great job here Jerry and I, they've got representatives from police department, city attorney, large apartments, small apartments, University of Iowa tenants and Realtors, and I'm prepared to go with one of your recommendations for chair on this, these are people that are out in the neighborhoods and understand and live with the problem. Champion/I am too. O'Donnell/So let's do this I think it's a good idea. Vanderhoef/I looked at this list, yes and I started looking at categories because I heard a comment that this is mostly homeowners and so forth, if I look at the top I would suggest that we take three members for the neighborhood, three from the city, one from Housing and Inspections, one from the police department and one from the attorney' s office, then I'd go with three with the landlords and one of those could be the Realtor or add the University in there if you want to put it in that category and three tenants. I think that would balance this out pretty well and that would be 3, 6, 9, 12, it would be 13th one there and I really like the idea of Dee Norton for chair. Atkins/Ernie can I comment on? This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 29 Lehman/Yes. Atkins/While I would look forward to active staff involvement, police, city, HIS, I would prefer we sit to the side. Lehman/Oh I don't think they should be voting members, staff. Vanderhoef/No. Atkins/I mean call upon us for resources, call upon us to talk about issues as we see them, I don't believe the staff is shy and I'll certainly offer their comments but I think the committee needs to be made up substantially (can't hear). Champion/I think we all agree with that. Pfab/I think there needs to be some kind of rules and regulations to the committee some kind of a structure here. Champion/They'll take care of it. O'Donnell/That's what they're doing. Pfab/Is that? Hansen/That' s why we wanted an impartial chair? Pfab/Right. Champion/Right. Pfab/So in other words this is starting, it's not from scratch because it's been a long time coming hem but I think if we're going to turn it over to the neighborhood to do it I think we ought to step back and say you've got good suggestions here take it and run with it and maybe report back in a week or two. Hansen/Well yea, but the mason that it hasn't been to you long ago is because we wanted to keep it a neighborhood initiative, I mean we know what' s going on. O'Donnell/We have a good idea. Pfab/We ought to keep our nose out of it for a while until you get organized. O'Donnell/We have to remember that. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8,2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 30 Lehman/Well I really, I really feel and obviously Council can do as they choose but I believe that Mr. Norton would be a tremendous chair for you folks, he's a very even keeled, decent sort of person that I think would represent both the interests of the neighborhood, the neighbors, the tenants, the landlords, we come up, whatever you come up, or whatever you come up with has to work. Hansen/Right. Lehman/And if it's perceived that this committee is set up by an interest group that really wants to get after tenants or after landlords or whatever that' s not going to fly, I mean we need a committee that is even keeled, fair, there's a lot of things to be considered, passing an ordinance that doesn't work is worse than no ordinance, passing an ordinance that we can't enforce is worse than no ordinance. I think this could be a really good committee and I think the framework that you've laid out is an excellent framework, I mean I think it, that' s a total of it appears to be about 12 people which is about as big as a committee can be and still function. And out of those 12 only 9 would be able to vote and you take off the three staff people but I think they would be great resource folks. Hansen/Well we need their input as we discuss. Lehman/Oh absolutely, no I agree, I agree. Vanderhoef/But voting people would be 3 from the neighborhoods, 3 from the landlords, 3 tenants, Board of Realtors and a chair which would be an 11 member committee which is a manageable size committee. Pfab/I have a point here, how long have you been working on this? Hansen/Two years. Pfab/Okay and we just told them that we think they did a good job, I say let's step back and let you go ahead with it and not decide who we're going to put in chair or who else we're going to put on it, let' s give a run, I mean you've put a lot of effort in it you have a lot at stake. Hansen/Well that would be up to you. Pfab/Well that' s point. Lehman/What' s your pleasure folks? Vanderhoef/I liked your idea of letting the landlords choose their own and make it three, I like the neighborhoods choosing their own and that' s three, I like the idea of three tenants, that might be a little tougher to get a handle on how do get those This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 31 chosen. I do like the idea of your Board of Realtors there and a chair and then have the resource people on the outside which then what I total up here is we would have 10 people plus a chair which makes it an uneven number of 11 which I think is a very manageable size committee, I'd take some suggestions on how to choose or get a group together for the tenants. Pfab/I would say that would be something the committee could put together, I would just say give them the authority and let them, even if they have to report back in a month or two and see if it meets with our approval. Karmer/I would think we should do it Irvin, I think it's already waited for homeowners and people landlords and tenants already are in a position of weakness compared to landlords and I think we need to be proactive in finding some strong folks, I think we approach Nick Klenske and others I think that' s willing to do that. Champion/I think your going to have trouble getting three tenants because they're usually the tenants that were having, I hate to say this, probably aren't here long enough to really (can't hear). Kanner/I think I could find three tenants who would want to do this very easily Cormie I think there's a lot of people that are renters that have concerns, including myself as a renter with some of the same problems that Jerry and Tim described. Hansen/Steven who are the homeowners that you see on this list? Vanderhoef/Yea. Kanner/What? Hansen/Who are the homeowners that you see on this list? Kanner/People representing, we're talking about three Realtors. Vanderhoef/No we're not talking 3 Realtors. Kanner/You said Realtors Association. Vanderhoeff I said three from the landlords association. Karmer/Okay that's three there, with a perspective and then you did not say anything about the Realtors. Vanderhoef/I said one for Realtor. Kanner/Four and I know some of you neighborhood people might be renters. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 32 (can't hear). Kanner/And what about the other three. Hansen/There's only two others here, Tim and Ann, Ann owns, Tim do you own? Tim owns. Kanner/William Buss. Vanderhoef/No, that's not, that was a suggestion for chair. Hansen/He's an owner, he's the suggestion yes for chair or Hillary. Kanner/Right, that's what i'm saying it still seems pretty heavily weighed. Vanderhoef/Well only three neighborhoods so out of that top 5 there would only be three of the top five up there, and the chair would stand alone if your looking at this list. And one from each neighborhood. Kanner/That's why I think three is a good idea and we could get three tenants. Vanderhoef/That's what I suggested. Champion/I don't think we need to get those three tenants. Vanderhoef/No we don't. Hansen/I think that you know the homeowners have a real stake in these because they've got their hard earned money invested in that money, I'm thinking seriously right now about buying the building that I live in and I'm wondering how much of a risk I'm taking by buying that piece of propeay. Vanderhoef/You know Jerry we've got people in the managerships of homes but they don't necessarily live in them so they have a different kind of a stake than a regular homeowner so I don't see that we've got an overload of homeowners. Lehman/Well it seems, the question that I seem to be hearing, is how do we find tenants, what's the process we go through to find three tenants to put on this committee? Hansen/I would make a suggestion that we contact the Broadway Neighborhood Center and have them choose the tenant. Champion/And there's a lot of tenants that are on the north side that are probably concerned about some of this too, that's a good idea. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 33 Vanderhoef/And then what about the Pheasant Ridge? Hansen/Pheasant Ridge. Vanderhoef/One from each. Kanner/Why not Nick Klenske. Vanderhoef/I don't know Nick Klenske, I don't. Karmer/He's the president of the UI Student Government. Champion/He might be different than a tenant. Hansen/Does he live in one of these neighborhoods we're talking about? Kanner/Let' s ask, he represents the students at UI who a lot of us are saying that's part of the problem there are students. Hansen/We're not saying that, we're talking about personal responsibility here, whether it be a tenant or God, I mean, this has nothing to do with racism, it has nothing to do with picking out one person, this is about personal responsibility whether it's the tenant, the landlord, the city, whoever is going to be here. Dilkes/Sue Dulek who is the attorney on my staff who will be staff this group has years of experience with tenant landlord law as an attorney at Legal Services, she suggested when we were talking about the makeup of the committee that one place would be student government. Lehman/So we ask for one appointment from Student Senate, that' s pretty simple, okay we've got one, where do we get another, we need two more tenants. Vanderhoef/The neighborhood centers are a good place to start, we have one on the west side of the river and we have one down to the south, that sort of covers a wide geographic. Lehman/All right which two? Champion/Oh there is a tenants association? Anna Buss/Tenants Association through the University of Iowa. Hansen/We have them on the list. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8,2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 34 Lehman/That's UI Tenant Association. Champion/Yea we have it. Lehman/Okay we need more. Pfab/Okay I have a thought here, go ahead if your looking for another tenant but what about the people that do, I'm thinking Greater Iowa City Housing Fellowship or Iowa City Housing whatever, I'm drawing a blank for words, just the office down here. I mean these people work, these people have developed some very good ways on how to make that work. Does that make any sense to you? I mean I think that there was. Hansen/I'm wide open. Pfab/Yea they work all the time with tenant landlord problem and I mean that's everyday that's what they do and it's not confrontational, it's negotiation and mediating, and so I think that would be the only suggestion that I would put here as part of a mix here now I don't know if you take somebody out of them or what but that would be a suggestion that I would have, because of their ongoing everyday interaction with tenants and landlords. Hansen/Okay and the one other thing we would need is a starting date and stuff for this thing. Pfab/It's 6:00. Lehman/Immediately. Champion/As soon as you want to. Lehman/Well we need to find one other as near as I can tell, we need to find one other. Hansend Well I know that the Broadway Neighborhood Center has an advisory committee and I'm sure they could give you a tenant, and there must be something that mirrors that over at Pheasant Ridge. Champion/I'll bet the Northside Neighborhood Association could come up with a tenant from their end of town which would have whole different problems than your end of town would. Pfab/Okay how could we work and still come out here and I'm supposing that you have no problem or you think that the idea either the Greater Iowa City Housing Fellowship or whatever the, I keep forgetting the, they keep changing the name, I can't keep up with it, the City Housing Authority. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8,2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 35 Lehman/That's good. Pfab/Okay if one or them if you get somebody from one of those groups? Hansen/Yea or we can recommend somebody from the Noahside, that' s. Pfab/Yea I mean they wouldn't be tenants but where would you fit them in? Are they landlords? They're not large apartments. Lehman/They would be tenants. Champion/We want to get a tenant, we don't want to get another representative from the city on hem. Kanner/I think with the two neighborhood associations, we've got two organized places that have a lot of people who are tenants but the UISG president, I think those are three good people. Champion/Perfect. Lehman/Is that acceptable? A tenant from the noahside, a tenant from the Broadway area, one from the Student Senate, the three people from the neighborhood association, a small apartment owner, a large and a small and I see Vanderwoude has volunteered, somebody from the Realtors and three people from the city staff that would sit in on an advisory capacity, all you need is a chairman. Pfab/I would make a suggestion and maybe, I'm not sure what the Board of Realtors representative would do there as much as someone from either Greater Iowa City Housing Fellowship or Iowa, I think that' s where one of those people should come, I'm not sure what the Realtors part is here. Walker/The Realtors have a stake. Champion/Oh you've got to talk in the microphone. Walker/The Realtors have both a state and a responsibility, the stake is to maintain the neighborhoods property values, and the responsibility is to do property sales that are within allo~ved uses for those properties. We had a case on the noahside this year where someone tried to sell a property for a completely unallowed use so we believe that the Realtors would have relevant input and we'd like a Realtors representative to come away from this committee and tell the rest of the Realtor community this is going on. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 36 Pfab/All fight, okay, before you go away, is there place for either the Housing Authority or the Housing Fellowship? Champion/It's big enough. Lehman/Well we've got enough on the committee. Champion/We've got enough on the committee. O'Dormell/I think the committee is fine. Lehman/Who do you want to chair this committee? Council, Jerry. O'Donnell/I would like them to decide. Pfab/Let them decide. Hansen/We'll decide. Lehman/All right then I would suggest that you get together with whoever your chairperson is going to be and get this group of folks together as quickly as possible. I mean already we know who some of the folks are going to be, I believe that we would be very happy to assist you with a letter to the student government for example, anything our staff can do to help you fine. You will be able to determine rather together as quickly who the staff people will be here that will sit on that committee. Atkins/Ernie. Lehman/Yes. Atkins/Just a gut reaction that this is a pretty complex undertaking, I'd like the staff at least begin my contacts with talking with Jerry and Tim. I mean we can prepare letters, we can do all of this, we can get a list of names and so forth, but it's got to have some administrative focus, when are we going to call meetings? Lehman/Sit down with Steve, call and make an appointment and get it all set up. Atkins/You can tell, if I have your permission I'll get with Tim and Jerry, I'll staff this and then we'll get the thing going particularly with Sue' s involvement somebody from (can't hear). Dilkes/Should we put a resolution on your October 23 agenda establishing the committee? This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 200I Special Work Session Page 37 Wilbum/That's probably a good idea. Champion/Yes. Atkins/In the meantime we can press ahead with it but just there would be a confirming resolution. Dilkes/If you are formally establishing this committee and if you are asking a recommendation on policy it will be subject to the open meetings law. Lehman/All right. Vanderhoef/Okay. Wilburn/IfI could ask, I just kind of tossed around Ernie's idea about Dee Norton, I hope (can't hear) but I guess I would just thinking of what he might add to the group would be, thinking back he was on Council when you all were wrestling with. Arkins/Disorderly house. Wilbum/Disorderly house thingy and so in terms of any obstacles or strengths you might need to draw upon, if it is an ordinance that you wish to come up with he might have some inside. Hansen/Both chairs that we've recommended for this I believe are constitutional lawyers. Wilburn/Oh, I'm thinking in terms of someone who's had to go through sitting on this side. Hansend Political process. Wilbum/Political process that' s right. Champion/Political process right. Wilburn/Come up with whoever you wish, I'm just throwing that out it might be a good representation. Atkins/Another suggestion might be what about a former council member being a member of the committee. Lehman/Well that's. Atkins/I mean just name a council, a former council member. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 38 Pfab/I tried to put one more on they said there was too many. Lehman/It might be (can't hear). Atkins/Good point. Pfab/Okay now let me ask you this, do we want, is there a, do we want a report in the sense of, is there a way to, for us to know what this committee is doing? Lehman/I think we're going to have a real good idea in a week. Atkins/I will get together with Jerry and Tim, we'll get this all put together, you'll get a summary memo laying out everything you need to know and then you can go. Pfab/Okay that' s fine. Dilkes/The first thing, the first thing we need is we need to know who' s on the committee. Atkins/We understand that. Dilkes/So that we can do the resolution of appointing the committee on the 23rd. Atkins/I'm not real sure, yea I'm not real sure. Dilkes/I understand your, somebody is going to tell us that so we can, your going to tell us that. Atkins/I'll meet with these folks, get that put together, get something to you then you can vote it up or down as you see fit. Dilkes/Okay. Vanderhoef/Okay, I just have a thought, when you talking about doing an ordinance, I want to be real clear that this is an ad hoc committee that has a. Dilkes/I'm talking about doing a resolution. Vanderhoef/Okay your talking about doing a resolution, even so in writing the resolution is that this is a committee established for creating a certain report and then the committee will be dissolved. Dilkes/Right, that's the way I envision it. Vanderhoef/Well I just want to be sure that everyone is understand. This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8,2001. October 8, 2001 Special Work Session Page 39 Hansen/Please. Vanderhoef/(can't hear). Dilkes/All your volunteers might disappear if it's otherwise yea. Kanner/I'm going to throw out two other possible names for chairs that I think would be good, one would be Monique DiCarlo of the Womens Resource and Action Center, she's a great facilitator, I think she's got her head in a lot of different places in the community and would be very valuable, and for former council member Karen Kubby I think is a very good facilitator also and very good at group process. Atkins/Can we consider, or at least I'd like to be able to think you might consider we may wish to hire a facilitator, a non member, I mean someone independent of that' s just there to help steer us through. Lehman/Well I think that's (can't hear). Atkins/I mean your going to need some kind of a small budget but I would think that if we had, the facilitator idea has some merit but usually an effective facilitator can't be part of the discussion and the debate, needs to be removed from it yea. Pfab/I would suggest that see what they come up with for, that would be my suggestion and I would like to take this time to thank you and I know there are other people who worked very hard on this. Hansen/A lot of other people. Pfab/Some of them are not putting their head up. O'Donnell/Good job. Lehman/Thank you guys, appreciate it. Champion/You might need a facilitator along the way. Lehman/If you do let us know. You know folks we're going to reconvene in 27 minutes, and we need to grab a sandwich and so we're going to skip Council Time until after the formal meeting so. Vanderhoef/Good. Lehman/Thank you. Adjoumed 6:24 PM This represents only a reasonable accurate transcription of the Iowa City Council Meeting of October 8, 2001.