HomeMy WebLinkAbout2010-10-25 TranscriptionOctober 25, 2010 City Council Work Session Page 1
Council Present:
Staff Present:
Others Present:
Addition to Agenda:
Bailey, Champion, Dickens, Hayek, Mims, Wilburn, Wright
Helling, Fosse, Goers, Dilkes, Davidson, Karr, Dulek, Long, Rackis,
Boothroy, O'Malley
Higgins, UISG
Hayek/ Now we will take up the special work session. Uh, as an initial matter, there is one
addition.
Karr/ It's the addition of 6.j...
Hayek/ Yeah.
Karr/ ...which is a recommendation to the Johnson County Board of Adjustment for approval of
the Conditional Use permit for S&G Materials to allow asphalt and concrete recycling,
um, at their mining site located west of Iowa River and east of Oak Crest Hill. This will
be a recommendation from staff. You should have received that, um, in your packet; this
evening we'd like permission to go ahead and post it, as a late addition.
Champion/ Okay.
Council Appointments:
Hayek/ Eleanor, or Marian, do you need anything else on that? Okay. Council appointments.
First is, uh, Human Rights Commission. We're fortunate to have 14 applications for that.
Champion/ There were so many good ones! Well, I really liked Orville Townsend. He's got a
tremendous amount of experience, and would be very valuable in that commission.
Mims/ Yeah, lot of experience; been in the community a long time; knows the community well.
Wilburn/ Yes.
Hayek/ (mumbled)
Champion/ (mumbled) I mean I'm open to discussion cause (mumbled) is David Brown who is a
Special Ed teacher at City High.
Bailey/ I liked his application as well (several talking)
Champion/ ...thought he was really very well qualified. (several agreeing)
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Hayek/ Vote for him? (several responding)
Mims/ Sounds good!
Champion/ You all agree with me tonight! I like that! (laughter)
Mims/ You're on a roll!
Bailey/ And then...so, we have another vacancy (several talking)
Wright/ I was really interested in Kenya Badgett.
Bailey/ Well I was going to...um, also speak for Diane Finnerty.
Champion/ I had her.
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Bailey/ ...been encouraging her to apply for this for years, and I was glad to see her application.
She has a vast amount of experience.
Wright/ Yeah, she's a good candidate.
Bailey/ So you agree with me (both talking)
Champion/ ...absolutely. Yes (several talking)
Wilburn/ ...support Diane too.
Hayek/ So is there, uh, majority for Diane? (several responding) Okay. Okay, so we've got
those three. Next, uh, Senior Center Commission.
Champion/ Did we only have two applications?
Bailey/ Parks and Rec.
Champion/ Parks and Rec?
Hayek/ Oh, that's right.
Champion/ They were both good. That makes it dominantly, uh, male, but there aren't any
female applicants.
Bailey/ We can readvertise.
Karr/ We will automatically readvertise.
Champion/ Oh!
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Karr/ This is a gender balance requirement of one female. So we will be unable to appoint a
male for 90 days. They will stay active in the pool.
Hayek/ Okay, so no decision tonight and we (both talking)
Champion/ But we can...we can, uh, appoint one of the males?
Karr/ After 90 days.
Champion/ Oh, but it's two.
Dilkes/ The State Code requires that you make efforts for 90 days to appoint, um, the gender,
the...would create balance on a commission.
Champion/ (mumbled)
Karr/ And you'll notice we have that at the top of the form. This is the first time you've seen it.
The Council appointment date, the first date is the date you could appoint, given the
gender balance, and then after 12/6, which would be the 90 days.
Champion/ Okay, thanks for redefining that for me.
Hayek/ So that brings us to Senior Center Commission.
Champion/ Well, Michael and Jay are both males.
Hayek/ How do we handle that where...one would balance it, but we have two vacancies?
Dilkes/ Well, I think you...
Bailey/ (mumbled) wouldn't we?
Dilkes/ I think you're free to appoint then, as long as you satisfy the gender balance requirement
then you can...appoint a member of either sex.
Hayek/ Well but in this instance we have...it just takes one to balance...
Dilkes/ Right, and then after you balance it then I think you're free to do as you wish.
Champion/ The next time (several talking)
Hayek/ All right.
Champion/ Jay Honohan really likes that commission.
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Wright/ Twelve years if a long time (mumbled)
Champion/ The people really like him!
Hayek/ Is there support for both? (several responding) Okay. Okay.
Karr/ Mr. Mayor, I'm wondering if we could just clarify. We do need to keep both doors open.
We have chairs up here, both up here and here, so rather than expanding further out to the
door we could encourage people to sit up...please.
Hayek/ Thank you.
Wright/ It's easier to keep an eye on us from (laughter)
Hayek/ Okay, agenda items.
Agenda Items:
ITEM 4. CONSIDER ADOPTION OF THE CONSENT CALENDAR AS
PRESENTED OR AMENDED.
g) Correspondence
8. Rev. Rudolph Juarez: Sanctuary City Ordinance
Dickens/ I would like to bring up, uh, in our previous work packet, uh, the Human Rights
Commission brought up, uh, Sanctuary City. I did have a meeting, uh, with the Police
Chief and Diane (mumbled), Father Rudy Juarez (mumbled) like us to consider. We can
put it later into the pending work sessions, but I (noise on mic) I had my reservations
before meeting with the Chief and (mumbled) very strong supporter of it now.
Bailey/ Yes, I would like to add it to a work session (several talking)
Hayek/ Just add it to the work session? (several responding)
Helling/ With what's on your work session, likely it's going to be after the first of the year
before you could do that, just so you know that. You can move it ahead if you want, but
under the normal...
Champion/ That's a short time in city law.
Helling/ It is. (laughter)
Bailey/ Could we have a...a brief discussion about what we might need to...to discuss it, so
when it does come up, we're good to go?
Wilburn/ Well, I think what we need is, um, the draft, um, a draft, um, the draft ordinance.
That's in there, that went through the commission, um, I think any Council Members that
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have done any work on the side or contacted some of the communities that are currently
sanctuary cities, um, feel free to submit something for the Council packet, any thoughts if
anyone wants to do, um, any research that way, um...
Dilkes/ It's my intention to give you a legal opinion before you...um, have your meeting or...
Bailey/ Great! I would also be interested in, um, and maybe you'll work with Sam on this,
on...on his, law enforcement's perspective. I'm sure he's discussed it quite...(several
talking)
Hayek/ We need to not get too much into the merits. It's...
Bailey/ No, I just wanted to (both talking)
Dickens/ ...make sure he's involved.
Bailey/ No, I just wanted to make sure that once...that we can take it up in a sort of a...you
know, expeditious fashion when we finally get it to our work session.
Wilburn/ I was just going to ask Eleanor is...just after the first of the year, is that sufficient time
for you to render your opinion, given what's on the docket? Okay, all right.
Hayek/ Other agenda items?
ITEM 13. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION APPROVING THE PROFESSIONAL
LIGHT AND SOUND SPECIFICATIONS SHEET FOR
ENTERTAINMENT VENUES.
Bailey/ Um...I'm just curious about item number 13 where we have the audio, the checklist
audio production requirements for entertainment venues. Eric came up with these; I'm
assuming it was with continued discussion with...
Dilkes/ He did. He talked to the entertainment venues that he's been dealing with all along
and...uh...came up with these.
Bailey/ So it's not an unusual list, I guess is...it's a rather lengthy list, but okay. Thanks.
Hayek/ He consulted with the industry on that, I believe.
Bailey/ That's what I was...
Hayek/ ...Eric came up with the number of speakers that they use.
ITEM 15. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION AMENDING THE BUDGETED
POSITIONS IN THE ACCOUNTING DIVISION OF THE FINANCE
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DEPARTMENT AND THE AFSCME PAY PLAN BY ADDING ONE
FULL-TIME GRANT ACCOUNTANT POSITION (AFSCME GRADE 13).
Bailey/ Well, I don't know what he does as a hobby. And then I have a question about 15.
Dale? About the grants accountant position. Um, you know, in the time that I've been
on Council, we've gone from a... an organization that doesn't seek grants much to an
organization that has quite a few of them, um, which I think is terrific. Um, but what
would happen, or what will happen to this position when the volume of grant
management, if it should decrease.
Helling/ These types of positions, we have several others that we filled just because of the grants,
uh, flood relief grants, uh, stimulus money and so forth, and we have an agreement with
the union on those, that it would be in the bargaining unit, that uh, they get full wage, or
wages and benefits, as if they were full time, or as if they were permanent employees.
The only difference is they don't accrue seniority, so when the funding runs out, when
the grants expire, uh, and those positions are no longer needed, they will be...their
position will be terminated. They won't have rights to bump within the organization.
That's the only difference.
Bailey/ Okay. I mean, I'm hopeful that we'll continue to be very...pursue grant opportunities
and this will be needed for a long time, but okay.
Helling/ And they...they certainly are eligible to apply as internal applicants for any positions
that are open.
Bailey/ Thanks!
ITEM 9. RENEWAL OF A CLASS E LIQUOR LICENSE FOR SAUCE, INC. DBA
SAUCE, 108 E. COLLEGE STREET.
Dilkes/ On number 9, the Sauce liquor license renewal...my recommendation is that we defer
that indefinitely in order to seek guidance from the bankruptcy court as to our... um,
ability to...to deny the license.
Hayek/ Okay, so we'll need a motion on that tomorrow night. On the, uh, Planning and Zoning
items, I mean, obviously rezoning (mumbled) are we going to get, uh, staff presentations
on each of those? At least one or two are repeats or...
ITEM 6. PLANNING AND ZONING MATTERS.
Helling/ Yeah, you will, and not all of `em have the ex-parte, uh, communication issue, but they
are all tied to other ones that do. They're rezoning and then, like Moss Green for
example, has a rezoning (mumbled) also has a, uh, development agreement and so forth.
So we decided, um, that you should talk about those all, uh, at one time and it seemed to
work better just to do (mumbled)
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Davidson/ Do you want me to go back over anything from two weeks ago, in terms of those...the
industrial park or Moss Green?
Champion/ I don't need (mumbled)
Davidson/ ...have the plats now if you choose to collapse them, you'll have the plats and we can
talk about those (mumbled)
Hayek/ I think just a very brief overview, not in any real depth, it's just that (mumbled) (both
talking)
Davidson/ Okay, that's fine. I'll have the visuals in case anybody wants to look at anything.
Hayek/ Okay. Anything else on the, uh, agenda items? Okay. Next item is location of
affordable housing. Jeff's going to walk us through this.
Location of Affordable Housing:
Davidson/ (unable to hear person away from mic) This will actually be a, uh, team approach, uh;
this evening. Um, by way of introduction, I'm Jeff Davidson the Planning Director for
the City, uh, to my right is Steve Long, the Community Development Coordinator. We
will also be assisted by Tracy...Tracy Hightshoe, who is an Associate Planner, under
Steve. Uh, you have, uh, in your packet of materials, uh, a memorandum from Steve and
myself, uh, summarizing, uh, the task ahead of us. Uh, you should have also received,
Ross, can I hold yours up? This, uh, this map, uh, Tracy's, um, passed them out (noise
on mic) 40 of them. We can always make more if there's any member of the public
or...or the media that didn't get one, um, we can...we can certainly make more of those.
Um...the, uh, materials that you received from Steve and I, we were assisted in the
preparation of those, uh, by Tracy as well as Eleanor and Sue from the City Attorney's
office, and I think, uh, give...gives a nice broad perspective, uh, in terms of the...the task
ahead of us. Uh, what I'm going to do is say a few things just to kind of set up, uh, where
we hope to go this evening, and also will touch on where we hope to end up, at some
point, not necessarily this evening...well, Iwill summarize where we hope to end up this
evening, and then where we hope to end up eventually in terms of resolution of this issue
that's, uh, before us. Um...we receive approximately $2 million annually in entitlement
funds from the, uh, CDBG and Home programs. We periodically, right now being one of
those periods, have funds turned back to us because of certain program things have
occurred. Uh, in addition to those amounts that are available for redistribution, uh, but
the bottom line is that this is an annual activity that we have, and one of the things that
we fund, uh, through these programs is affordable housing and a variety of types of
affordable housing we're going to run through this evening, just, you know, briefly as
possible, uh, what the distinctions are in...in that housing that is, uh, provided. Um, what
we are seeking from you is guidance on where you, uh, as the ultimate policy authority
for the city, want to see that housing located. Uh, this is something that has become an
issue on a variety of fronts, uh, and that we feel would benefit from you indicating to us,
and then we will indicate to the, uh, the folks that are our partners and that we work with
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who provide affordable housing, as well as the Housing and Community Development
Commission, uh, that, uh, makes recommendations to you in, uh, involving the use of the
CDBG and Home funds. Uh, I think everybody can benefit by some additional policy
guidance from you, uh, regarding that. Um, we are...I think it's important to note that we
are starting from a... from a point that the provision of affordable housing in our
community is a good thing, uh, and that is something that we may want to have some
discussion about, but clearly the Comprehensive Plan and the City Steps document both
of which have been, uh, adopted by the City Council do indicate that providing a range of
housing, uh, that fulfills the range of people who live in Iowa City is a positive thing, and
that we should attempt to do that. So, we are starting from that point, that we want to try
and work out a way to provide housing for a range of incomes, uh, in Iowa City. Uh,
what we are going to do this evening is Steve will step through, uh, the memorandum, uh,
there's a lot of really important information, uh, and there may be a variety of levels of
understanding. There's a variety of levels of understanding within the Planning
Department of these concepts. So what we want to do is just, uh, run through quickly
some important things that we think will...you will benefit in terms of your subsequent
discussion, and certainly to answer any questions, have any discussion along the way.
Steve will do that, um...uh, right up front here...where we hope to end up is obviously
with policy guidance from you to staff in terms of where you would like to see affordable
housing provided in our community. Um...you know, that's a daunting task and we
don't intend this evening to get to that point. Where we would like to end up, but...I
think it's important to keep that out in front of us, in terms of that's ultimately what
we...what we want to determine. What we want to make sure we do this evening are see
if we can get you to identify the concerns you have about where affordable housing is
located. We want to...see if we can raise all the questions that you feel like you need to
have answered or...or fleshed out further, uh, so that we can go back and get that
information to bring it back to you for your ultimate decision making. And then
certainly, any other information that you need. We've provided you with, uh, almost four
pages of information here of what we thought, and you know, we really gleamed it down
to what we thought was the important things, uh, but if there is additional information
that you would like to have for your decision making, um, we would like to make sure,
uh, we provide that. We...we do believe it's a good idea for...the decisions you have to
make to be made with the benefit of the most information as possible. For example,
we're all aware that elementary school concerns are one of the concerns that you've
raised when you've discussed affordable housing issues, uh, within the past several years.
We may very well want to go back to the School Board, who has kind of a new
administrative, uh, staff now and...and get their views on that for you, so that you're not
just dealing with conjecture from individually either staff persons or Board of Education
Members, uh, but that...we're dealing with information that represents the...the stated
policy of the School Board. So that's...that's an example of...of where we may want to,
uh, wait for the actual decision-making part of this to a subsequent meeting, but
we' 11... we' 11 just let that be determined by the end of the meeting. Uh, we will if in the
course of your discussions, uh, we just get into kind of an endless loop of debate, we will
try and bring you back to the task so that we can, uh, get... get to those three questions I
just outlined. So, any questions before we move forward? Okay, with that I'll turn it
over to Steve.
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Long/ I'm just going to go through some basic definitions and then go over what the
program...the programs that we operate with the funds that we receive, just kind of get a
baseline, uh, or try to have you learn a new language essentially. Affordable housing is
generally defined... in housing which the participants, or the occupants, are not paying
more than 30% of their income, including utilities. So it's...that's what HUD uses the
definition, and that's what we try to strive for as well. We receive funds from HUD,
multiple funds, but I'm going to focus primarily on Community Development Block
Grants and Home Investment Partnership funds, and touch a little bit on public housing
and Section 8, or housing choice vouchers as well. CDBG, or Community Development
Block Grant funds, they're our most flexible funds that we receive, and they can be used
for everything from economic development. We assist many small businesses in Iowa
City. Public facilities, which is, um, a...annn-profit may need an expansion or an
addition to operational funds, and of course affordable housing, both renter and owner-
occupied. CDBG funds cannot be used to construct affordable housing, but it can be
used for rehabilitation or to purchase land for affordable housing. Home funds are, we
also receive directly from HUD...we're...I'll back up. We're...we're considered an
`entitlement community,' so we receive these funds directly from HUD each year, and
we don't apply for them. We receive them because of a formula that HUD, um, comes
up with that has to do with housing conditions, the level of poverty, and um, basic
general characteristics of the community. Home funds are strictly for affordable housing.
You can use the funds to, uh, purchase land, purchase existing units, build, or rehabilitate
housing. And locally, we use those funds, um, also periodically for tenant-based rent
assistance, which is similar to Section 8. Now to get into types of housing that we assist
with these funds. I'll start with the shelter and transitional. Shelter is basic, generally
people are there because of a crisis situation, um, not...they generally do not have an
income when they enter the shelter. Shelters are typically funded... can only be funded
with CDBG funds. Transitional housing...and it's a temporary...transitional housing can
be funded with CDBG and Home funds, and it's just like it sounds, it's where you're
transitioning out of a homeless shelter, basically trying to get back on your feet, and
move on to more of a permanent housing. So...usually there's a limit of two years where
you can live in transitional housing. Typically the income, and I'm going...I'll give you
both the, um, program income and then generally what we see. Um, so you could...you
could have, well, typically it's 30% of median income, or below, and...when you get to
page 3 there are some charts that show you what that income means. And I think you all
know some of the examples, the Shelter House, uh, Domestic Violence Shelter, HACAP,
uh, those are...for homeless shelter, obviously. HACAP and Successful Living are some
examples of transitional. Now, when we get to rental housing, rental...both CDBG and
Home funds can be used for rental, like I said, and there's different income requirements
depending on which fund you use, and I don't want to get into too much detail, but
essentially, for any affordable rental project, or housing unit, if you use CDBG funds
51 % of the beneficiaries, the people that benefit from the assistance, have to be below
80% of median income. And for Home, 90% have to be below 60%, or
essentially...essentially everyone has to be below 60% of median income. This is just for
rental. And, so then we looked a little bit deeper to see what, um, who is actually
benefitting in Iowa City with these funds, and we looked over the current projects and it's
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primarily under 50% of area median income...being assisted in Iowa City. Then we
looked at how many units, housing units, we've assisted...are currently under our
purview, we have about...we have exactly 351 Home and CDBG assisted units. And
that's out of 16,741 rental units in Iowa City. And of the...of our, just the units that we
assist, 46% or a little less than half are restricted specifically for the elderly and persons
with disabilities. And then I won't get too much into this either, but...there are
stipulations with the...the amount of rent that can be charged by an entity that receives
our funds and that's called the `fair market rent.' And, to give...there are some examples
in the memo. Atwo-bedroom fair market rent, which is set by HUD, is $734, and three-
bedroom is $1,069, so cannot exceed those numbers. Now, so what's important is that
the household is responsible for the entire rent a month (mumbled). Uh, some examples
of, um, CDBG and Home funded projects in Iowa City are the Housing Fellowship,
which is the largest provider of affordable housing in Johnson County, and they, um,
assist a wide range. They're not restricted to any particular...category or...or type of
residence. ISIS Investments, which is a private corporation, and we have Melrose Ridge
which is specifically for persons with disabilities, and then a couple elderly projects on
the west side, Concord Terrace and Lexington Place, and then Aniston Village, which is
again, general. So that's a brief overview of rental. Owner-occupied is a little bit
different, is a little bit higher income guidelines. Both CDBG and Home can go up to
80% of median income, and after doing a review, we typically have been seeing incomes
in the range of 40% to 80%...that have received funding from the City, are the
beneficiaries, and that...that 40% is typically Habitat for Humanity homes and uh, the
rest of the, uh, projects we assisted have been mainly 60 to 80%, if you take away
Habitat. So I talked a little bit about area median income, and that's...that's an important
number that we have to continually keep in mind as we're approving these projects and
then Tracy and I are monitoring these projects, as well. So, and also...what we hear
often at these meetings is the free and reduced lunch numbers, and so what we did is
we...we took the free and reduced lunch numbers from the School District, right from
their web site, and then combined it with the numbers that we use, and I put...just the 30,
50 (mumbled) 30, 50, 60 and 80%, it's a lot of numbers, but we just wanted to give you a
good snapshot of when you're talking about these numbers, what...what they mean,
and...if...if the people that we're assisting, or the households that we're assisting fall
into, I mean I hate to categorize people, but in this industry you kind of have to, fall into
those...those categories. Um (mumbled) give you some examples of what we've been,
uh, when we talk about 50%, 80%, 60%, whatever those numbers, what do those mean.
For a, you know, for instance, for a household size of one, someone at 30% of area
median income is $7.86 an hour. Fifty percent of area median income is $13.10 an hour.
That's someone working full time at $13.10 an hour is considered 50% of median
income. And then we looked at the Iowa Workforce Development site, just to get an idea
of what some of these occupations might be. Um, like a pharmacy technician, a, uh, is
$13.65 an hour so that would be pretty close to our 50% number. And then, a 30%
number, a veterinary assistant is close to that number, so just to give you an idea...what
we're talking about here, um, so that's...the chart right below the income chart...we also
wanted to just kind of put a synopsis of...of the, everything above, the paragraphs above,
and we broke out the type of program, what are the actual federal parameters, and then
who's actually benefitting. And then we always talk about...um, Section 8 vouchers as
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well, so I thought it'd be important to do a brief discussion. I have to admit I'm not an
expert on Section 8 or public housing, however, there are a couple people here, so if you
have specific questions about those two programs, I'll have to call on them. But these are
also funds that come directly to Iowa City, and they're administered by the Iowa City
Housing Authority, and they're used to subsidize the rents paid to private landlords and
we have currently 533 vouchers in use in Iowa City in non-subsidized rental housing, and
786 total if you include what we're calling subsidized or assisted housing, which is on
this map. And the income limit for Section 8 is, again, that 50% number. That's the
maximum. I think...I may be corrected here but...I think it's initial sign up of 75% of
the people enrolled in this program have to be at 30% of median income or below, and
the maximum is 50%. And as of, I think it was last week on the 20th, about half the
participants had incomes below 30% of area median income, and half have incomes
being 30 to 50%, and...65% of those households using Section 8 are elderly persons with
disabilities. Public housing, City...the City owns 81 public housing homes, or homes
that are enrolled in the public housing program, and with public housing, all of the
tenants have to be below 80% of median income. So that's the federal requirement, and
but right now, as of the 20th, 40% of the tenants have incomes greater than 50%, and 60%
have incomes less than 50%. It's a lot of numbers, sorry! Um...another important, or a
different feature about public housing units is that once you qualify, you can stay in, even
if your income goes above 80% of median income. That's something that's a little bit
different than the programs that we run with CDBG and Home funds. So it's a lot of
information...feel free to ask any questions, um...(mumbled) lots of facts.
Dickens/ What's the, uh, what percentage of the, uh, CDBG funds do you...goes to housing, as
compared to other things within the City, and maybe over the past few years, has it stayed
pretty constant?
Long/ It's...it's low, for CDBG.
Hightshoe/ In our previous (mumbled) in our previous City Steps plan we used to break down,
um, a percentage goal for number of dollars spent (mumbled) economic development,
public service, and public facilities. With this new five-year plan, we no longer do that.
Um...
Long/ We could get that number for you. It's...yeah, I'm guessing it's 15 or 20%.
Hightshoe/ We can verify that.
Davidson/ We did refer then to the location map, that you should have, um...you know, we
were...we were trying to anticipate what type of information that you would be interested
in having in order to have your discussion, and it does seem like when we've discussed
issues in the past, the location of existing affordable housing was one of the things that at
least some of you had as a concern, the notion there being that it may not be desirable to
concentrate, uh, affordable housing in particular areas, uh, hopefully what this map does
is clarify where in fact the housing from the programs that Steve just, uh, outlined for
you, where that housing is located, and I think this map does a pretty good, uh, job of
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this. You know, when we...when we get into discussing the criteria that you would like
to have used for the location of housing, we've also tried to add a little bit more
information to this map, uh, one that you can see clearly is the elementary school
attendance districts, uh, and that's called out in red, and I think we've also called out
where the elementary schools are for, or what...what district is for each, uh, for each area
that's outlined in red. And then the census boundaries are also in gray, um...you know
we're not sure that's...we think maybe now we have some more sophisticated ways of,
uh, of outlining things, rather than using census boundaries, which tend to, well, they
don't always serve the purpose that we'd like them to serve. So, but nevertheless we
did...we did call those out and we can...we can talk about that as well, and you can see
the different, uh, types of housing is...is coded there so that you can see clearly, uh,
what's...what's located where basically. So, um...I guess the first thing we would like
to, uh, in terms of your discussion, is we'd like to know is it possible for you to identify
the concerns that you have about affordable housing projects in general?
Hayek/ I think one of the initial things we're going to want to talk about is, um, relates to the
schools, because that was what...the central focus of what the task force and Council
went through five years ago, um, and uh...that...that Ithink might be one place to start,
and we're...and you've already I think referenced this, or alluded to it, but...but our data,
uh, there are old. (mumbled) and there have also been changes and...and you know with
(mumbled) ability for us (mumbled) informationally to learn I think about the School
District, and we don't even know where the...where the District is right now.
Davidson/ Yeah, and in terms of where the District is, it might be helpful if any of you have any
perceptions that the District can either confirm or deny one way or another, I mean, let's
get it out on the table right now in terms of what some of those perceptions might be.
Wilburn/ I have some concerns about...historically from the Council, uh, and Councils past,
bringing up the subject of free and reduced lunch, and not wanting to allow any of the
affordable housing options to be built in an area, to not burden based on free and reduced
lunch. There are a variety of factors other than one's income and avail...eligibility for
free and reduced lunch that impact a student's ability to learn and...the School District's
ability, uh, the stress that they have in providing supplemental services. Um, Matt, you
brought up the fact about, um, more, uh, nationwide more schools becoming known as a
school in need of assistance or a district in need of assistance, and um, a factor that gets
into that is the opportunity. If you are attending one of those schools, to transfer to
another school. Um, you know (both talking) they came from Hills, Kirkwood,
Roosevelt, Twain, Wood, and you're allowed to go to, uh, this past year I think it was
Hoover, Horn, Garner, Lincoln, and Shimek, I believe. So, um... if your concern is well I
don't want to burden one area, here's a...where some other students are allowed, and
receive a transfer to another school. Some other things that aren't necessarily related, uh,
if I could...cuts across income levels, if you are a student who receives certain type of
programming from the District, there are certain types of programs that are not available
at every school, uh, if you have some type of, uh, learning disability, uh, behavior,
conduct, uh, struggles as a student regardless of income level, uh, there are certain
numbers of schools that you would go to to receive those programs. So again, some of
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the factors that are...sometimes encased within one's income, um, there...there are other
factors that dictate, you know, which schools, uh, you may go to. Also, even just a real
tangible, uh, that I think most people are aware, uh, Steve, you brought up the transitional
housing, if, uh, you know, Shelter House, etc., etc., if someone is, uh, those are
considered homeless situations and, or you know, domestic violence shelter, regardless
of, uh, income, whichever... if you find yourself in that circumstance, uh, as a family and
as a...as a child, um, even if you're at Shelter House or the domestic violence...you can
still go to the school that you were at, so regardless of where the Council decides to allow
housing to occur, or encourage housing to occur, there are other factors, um, other than
free and reduced lunch numbers that are going to...so...so if...if anyone...I...you know,
maybe, uh, you know, five, ten, fifteen years ago, where someone lived in terms of the
impact and warehousing (mumbled) may not necessarily be the case. So I would... if
someone still has that as a concern, I think, uh, a rigid rule of no types of housing to be
allowed in those areas, I would ask you to consider if you're basing it on free and reduced
lunch to perhaps think of some other factors, to have some flexibility. There may be
some other things, um, beyond...beyond that, you know, some of the developers, we
have, uh, at least when I'm talking about the housing vouchers and those things, but just
in terms of building some of the units, and then there's a, um, a finite number of, uh, of,
uh, developers or programs that are willing to build, uh, affordable, certain types of
affordable units, and if it happens to be one who, um, is going to be working with
different services and programs and... and working with our human service agencies, and
with the schools, to...to provide some type of supported services, or get information to
someone, or even in their area to make sure that it's kid-friendly and that ...those types of
things, you know, maybe you might be willing to allow them to building in a certain area,
if they're going to be, uh, running a, um, you know, a series of housing that's going to be
providing supports that we would want someone who is low to moderate income to
receive those type of supports. So, um, I think my...uh, main concern is about trying to
equate free and reduced eligibility (mumbled) with your willingness to allow certain
housing to be built, and then even looking at, if you're more concerned about certain
types of housing, you know, if you're...if it's an elderly housing unit, um, how's that
going to, you know, impact, um, a school that may be going through some challenges,
um, in terms of, uh...the supports that someone is needing if they're attending those
schools. So, that's just one component, comment that I wanted to say, to put out there
right away about that.
Hayek/ You're points are well taken. Um, and... and I doubt we can get at what metrics do or do
not make sense to look at tonight.
Wilburn/ And I wasn't suggesting that, but as we...as we move forward, I...I would, um, I think
the conversations need to happen with, um, the School Board and staff, uh...but
recognize that there's some...there's some nuances to it, besides that rule, and some
things that the School Board is going to have to make some decisions, and staff are going
to have to make some decisions, um...in the...in, uh, in policies, uh, and even if they...if
the Council were to ask them for a recommendation, a formal recommendation, or just
factors that we should consider in terms of housing. I think it needs to be a more broad
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discussion than free and reduced numbers. That's all...and so I would like that on the
plate as we move forward.
Davidson/ That's clearly something that we've intended to address with schools, Ross, is...is the
free and reduced lunch criteria that really the appropriate thing to use. There is, if you
look at the elementary schools, uh, there's a wide variety of... of percentages of free and
reduced lunch. It's one of those...it varies greatly! But is that significant, uh, we...we
need to get better input from the School District on that.
Dickens/ And that will change once Roosevelt closes in 18 months or so. Those students are
going to be shifting (mumbled)
Wilburn/ And other changes as other buildings come on line.
Champion/ Well, I think it's a factor that I want to seriously look at, uh, I'm willing to concede
what you're saying, I understand what you were saying, cause (mumbled) programs that
are available to them because you can't (mumbled) but I think it's more than just how it
affects schools. I think it also affects, um, also affects neighborhoods, uh, for instance,
when parents can move their kid out of the school because the school's in need of
assistance. What'd you call that other thing, s...
Wilburn/ (mumbled) need of assistance, and (mumbled)
Champion/ So, then parents can move the kid out, and it's probably going to be the parents who
are not in that low income, who have the ability to still get across town to this other
school that their child's going to be attending. I mean, the School District has the option
to transfer, provide transportation for them, isn't that true?
Wilburn/ Well, the, um...there, that's an area that there may be some changing, a different
interpretation as to who and what the school is required to do, you know, and as, um, no
child left behind, um, comes up for another decision and reauthorization, you know, there
may be some changes there too, that uh...so...again, if...if impact on school is a factor, I
think that there...there are some other external factors, a policy on the School District
that they're...that the School Board is going to have to struggle with and...and, as we all
move forward.
Champion/ So if you have, let's just take...let's just use Mark Twain as an example. So, if their
free and reduced lunch, 1 can't remember what it is, but it's quite high. Let's just say it's
50%. I think it's actually higher than that, or do you know?
Wilburn/ I don't...I don't have (both talking)
Champion/ Well let's just say it's 50%. I'm not sure what it is. That's a figure I'm just throwing
out there. And, so if...20% or if even 10 or 20 kids decide, the parents decide they don't
want that kid to go to school there because the kids aren't doing real well, and then that
starts a rumor around town that it's not a good school, and then you affect the
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neighborhood that's around the school, cause well, I don't want to buy a house because I
can't send my kid to Mark Twain. And...and that's, that's the problem with this whole
insurgence we have going around this community now. Now I know kids who go to
Mark Twain who are getting a great education. It has nothing to do with what income
you're in, but it is a perceived thing in neighborhoods, and I think we're...where we have
neighborhoods like Mark Twain, and Grant Wood, and Longfellow to some extent, where
we have houses that a lot of people can afford to buy, and then they get into a quandary
about, well, do I want to live in that neighborhood. So I think the issue is much broader
than free and reduced lunch. I think it's much broader than that, and I don't want to
destroy our neighborhoods, that offer what I consider affordable housing to the
policemen, the baker, and the candlestick maker, so to speak, and I think we're starting to
respect that. I really do. But that's my concern. It's mul...my multi-level concerns.
Mims/ What...I think what Connie's saying is kind of what was next on my list, I mean, one just
the general effect on the schools, and you know, as Ross has started with, and we...I
think all agreed, we need a lot more information from the School District on a lot of
levels, besides, um, just free and reduced. To me the second one is kind of where
Connie's going is just...what concentration of poverty can do to a neighborhood, and you
know, I think under the Fair Housing Act that is something that...that we can look at in
terms of, as we set policy, to not have it too concentrated, and so...you know, what is,
that is a concern of mine, that you get too much concentration and then possibility the
negative effects in terms of the general deterioration of a neighborhood, again, whether
it's a reality or a perception, of what people think is going on in that neighborhood.
Champion/ It happens!
Mims/ It happens, and so...um, making that effort to, um, not have all, so much housing
concentrated in one area.
Davidson/ What do you consider a concentration? Can you give us any more feedback on that?
Mims/ Well, you know, that's interesting cause as I was going through some of this stuff today,
that was one of the things that came to my mind is, okay, if...if we say, if we identify that
as one of our concerns, how do we then define what...what is too much of a
concentration. I don't know. I don't know if... if the federal housing act has anything in
it. I don't know if any of the case law, you know, from stuff that's been in the courts
prior to this would give us any guidance. I don't know.
Davidson/ We...we can, I just...I was interested in hearing what your perceptions might be. We
can...we can figure out some metrics to...determine that, you know, whether it's by a
percentage of units at a certain...you know, that have received assistance or something.
We'll...we'll work up something.
Champion/ And I think that's (mumbled) to come up with, because when you have a town like
Iowa City where we do have a lot of concentration, you compare that to areas that have
none or very little? I mean so then what is your percentage? I mean, it can't be some
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standard percentage. But I think it's something we need to address seriously, uh, and I
know it's going to be difficult to come down to the right number, but I think it's also
much more complicated than just throwing a number out there.
Wilburn/ For that piece of it, I think...again, looking ahead and not that we're going to resolve
this tonight...but if you're...if you're...if the Council wants to say...whatever they
determine, uh, would be too concentrated, that means you're allowing housing to occur in
other areas, which means if there is push-back, whether perceived or real in the
community, then the Council and Councils forward need to be willing and prepared to
say, we are going to allow certain types of house...housing to be, uh, dispersed
throughout the community. You know, I mean, Connie, you were a big supporter of, uh,
Shelter House and continue to be, um, and you know, took a firm stance against, uh,
some of the push-back about where they located, and it's that type of commitment to
supporting affordable types of housing across the community, that the Council and
Councils forward are going to need to have, uh, cause if... again, whatever that magic
number is, um, that means we're going to allow it (both talking)
Champion/ Right! And...but...and see, I also think it's a positive thing. I mean, I grew up, and
I know...my kids and I grew up. I grew up with my kids! (laughter) But one reason I
moved to Longfellow, I think that's a healthy neighborhood. I think it's healthy to have
economically diverse populations, and ethnic and racial diverse populations, and, um, and
that's why I love the Longfellow neighborhood. Um, cause that's what I grew up in and
that's what my kids have grown up in, because that's what I wanted them to grow up in.
And so I have a real strong desire to push that kind of thing. I think it's healthy. It's
healthy for kids. It's healthy for smart kids, and it's healthy for kids who need help,
cause they tend to do better in those environments, and um, so that... if I could have my
ideal thing, that's what I would have. I would have Longfellow neighborhood all over
town! (laughter)
Bailey/ Well, and that...I mean, that leads to my concern. Um, it's not so much what we use as a
measurement and what's too concentrated. I mean, whether it's real or perceived, I grew
up in that Iowa City you're talking about. There was...most of the neighborhoods were
fairly economically diverse, at least as I recall. Um, it...it became later that we had sort
of concentrations of I would say just obscene displays of wealth is what I would say is
more of a problem, to me, um, but that's my concern is as we go this direction, how do
we get...how do we get there, because I'm concerned that we'll go half way, and that our
needs for affordable housing in this community, um, are...are pretty immense. I mean, if
we read our affordable housing study, that's a steep hill to climb, and so...by making
some decisions, are we going to limit actually meeting those needs, and that concerns me
because I believe that people who work in a community should live in a community
because I think that's what makes a vibrant community. If you look at small
town... small communities that ring, you know, large metro areas where people leave
during the day, come home at night, the community engagement is limited, and we don't
want to see that. We want to see people who are working in our community, engaged in
our community. So...I'm concerned on the back end how we actually support the...the
dispersion of affordable housing. Are we really committed, and how can we afford it,
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because we know land in other places, in other neighborhoods just simply costs more.
So...that's one of my concerns that I want to address in this discussion. And not leave it
out.
Davidson/ (several talking) go ahead and state what everybody's thinking but nobody is saying,
and that is that we're talking about inclusionary zoning, potentially, which we have
discussed and for the time being at least, decided not to pursue that being a policy
position of this City Council. I believe it was this City Council or was it the previous
one? Was it this (several talking) Okay. Um...I mean...
Bailey/ (several talking)
Mims/ ...I mean, I think our discussion was we have a lot more work to do before we can even
really get to a serious discussion of that, and I think this is the first of many of those
discussions we have to have.
Davidson/ But certainly if...I think it would probably... should be a group of this Council to raise
that, yes, we want to consider that again. Uh, you know, given your previous position,
uh, certainly out of this discussion can come possibly going in that direction again. If the
diversity that Regenia and Connie are speaking of does not occur naturally, then
that's...that sort of thing is what we're talking about, probably, and of course that's not
unique to this community. That's an issue that communities all over this country
grapple.. .
Hayek/ But doesn't that go to the `how' question, how (both talking) whatever it is this Council
decides...
Davidson/ We don't need you to answer that question this evening.
Mims/ No.
Bailey/ Could another...(several talking) another how I want to put on the...on the list at least
too is, um, our money won't go as far if...if we do this. Our money won't go as far.
Home...Home funds and our CDBG funds, and what additional commitments are we
willing to make, are we willing to make, to make sure we're addressing affordable
housing needs? And I think that's an important discussion, as well.
Davidson/ Yeah, and certainly I wouldn't want to leave anybody with the impression that
inclusionary zoning is the only way to introduce diversity into neighborhoods. Um, the
City becoming...I think Regenia or somebody mentioned that it's, uh, land is more
expensive, uh, in upper income neighborhoods, and so maybe the City gets involved in
making property available, going at zoning it ahead of time for multi-family or duplexes
or the types of units that we more typically see, uh, in affordable housing. Uh, there are
other initiatives that are impossible, short of inclusionary zoning and we'll try and flesh
some of those out for you.
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Wright/ Certainly there are incentives that can be used.
Bailey/ Land banking. Or whatever you call (several talking)
Wright/ There are lots of things, other than inclusionary zoning, but I think that's something we
do need to keep on the table, um, just, you know, looking at the maps, we need to scatter
the dots a little bit better. (laughter)
Mims/ We've essentially... identified two concerns -the effect on the schools and concentration
of poverty. Are there other (several talking)
Bailey/ ...talk about the effect on the schools a little bit. I...I don't know necessarily how I feel
about that, but it also...with boundary changes, and the ability of the schools to do some
things, I really want to talk with them because that sounds like a moving target to a little
bit of a degree, and we can do some, but we're not...that's not holding our, you know,
our rock to carry up the hill. I mean, we're really going to have to work closely with the
School District, so I want to hear their thoughts because I'm not sure that that's...that has
not concerned me as much. Partially for the kinds of things Ross has said, because the
boundaries are a little bit fluid, depending on a lot of variables. So...
Hayek/ Sorry, I interrupted you before you finished.
Bailey/ No, I mean, it's not...it's not a primary concern. Census tract information might be more
interesting...more of a concern to me.
Hayek/ To add some context, um, my recollection is that the last time we got a... a formal
position from the District on these issues was...was the letter they sent in the summer of
(several talking). I think it's 2003. So a lot has changed since then -federal law, local
policy, etc. - um, and also when we...when we got into that process and were trying to
look at a couple schools, um, the only data available, um, was by and large the free and
reduced data, and this time around there may be other information that we should and
could look at. Um...the other piece in terms of what we went through several years ago
is...was that other than free and reduced data, we looked at census data, which by that
point was already five years old, and these...if you look at the census tracts, you know,
they are not contiguous obviously with our school boundaries and sometimes they're very
large, and other things go into those, so we had...there was an informational deficit, I
think.
Davidson/ (several talking) Excuse me, Ross, I just wanted to address the Mayor's comment
that, uh, we do have, you know, we're still kind of in our infancy in terms of GIS, but
we're...we're getting better, and the County's been very cooperative with us, and we do
have the ability, I think, to generate some information for you. For example, if... if
elementary school boundaries is a more appropriate, uh, definition for us to use, we can
try and generate some...some data based on that category for you, rather than just use
census data, I mean, census data is just...it just falls down for us in some respects.
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Wilburn/ I...I was just going to say, you know, conditions have changed since then and, you
know, that technology that's available is one piece to it, and...and, uh, you know the
School Board put a lot of time, energy, and effort into, um, the boundary work and
they're going to continue to do that, um, I think what would also be helpful...as part of
that discussion with the School Board, as part of the invitation, is specific questions get
specific answers, and so the better, you know, I mean, we've developed a good set of
concerns here, and that will be I think more helpful than a general, you know, I don't
remember the exact nature of the request from the...from the School Board back then,
but again, given what we know now and... and genuinely letting the School Board know
what we are struggling with in terms of, uh, affordable housing issues, I think will help
them, uh, converse amongst themselves to...to give us, you know, some more specific
areas where they can and to outline, you know, here's some information - we just don't
know or we're not going to be able to get our arms around - I think would be helpful for
them in...in providing, uh, setting the table for, you know, some...perhaps even joint
meetings in the future as we go forward with this.
Davidson/ To elaborate a little on some of the concerns that have been raised. Do they cover the
range of affordable housing types that Steve walked through with you? Transitional,
rental, owner-occupied...uh, or is it only certain types that you have concerns about,
because you know we're dealing...Steve and Tracy are dealing with specific projects that
are requested from providers, and if for owner-occupied it's not a concern because we're
dealing with, uh, 60 to 80%, you know, I would point out to you that at 80... at 80% of
area median income you're dealing with people who work in my department who are my
employees. Uh, so if...if 60 to...if owneroccupied at 60 to 80% of area median income
is not a concern, please...please tell us that so that we can focus on the types of housing
that are of concern for you.
Champion/ Well I have personally allowed, when we've had to vote on it, owner-occupied
houses anywhere. Because I think that's...there's astability to that. There's a
stability...there's family stability when you own a house. And that means...the kids are
going to be guided and... it doesn't influence the neighborhood so much. So, I think
owner-occupied and elderly housing and handicap housing, I don't think that's...that's
not a concern of mine. That's just...I'm just speaking for myself.
Wright/ Well, you just hit on something when you mention the elderly housing. If you look at
the number of, um...housing choice vouchers (mumbled) 65% of those folks are elderly
or handicapped. Can we split that data out somehow? So we don't have just a number
that says there are 18 and we...in census district 15?
Long/ You mean split it out like number of persons who are (both talking)
Wright/ Number of elderly, number of handicapped, or...
Long/ We could do it by project location, yeah, we could do that. I mean...
Wright/ Cause that's something we've gotten into in the past and...
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Hightshoe/ We can get that. Or we can do a new map with just...taking...so you want a new.
map with vouchers and assisted housing, minus elderly, disabled or SRO units?
Wright/Not necessarily minus, but uh... alerting to in the total figure. You could even put that
on a... in a separate spread sheet that.. .
Long/ And that would be just for projects that were specifically built for, like for instance on
the...
Wright/ No, I'm talking about the Section 8 vouchers.
Hightshoe/ Only Section 8, yeah, we can break that down.
Long/ (mumbled) okay.
Wright/ Thank you.
Dilkes/ I think, um, Mike's question though raises...kind of illustrates the point here where you
have to identify what the concern is. Or concerns are, because if... if we're talking about
concentration of poverty, and not effect on the schools, then those...the breakdown
between elderly and...and disabled housing and family housing is...is not as significant
as if we're talking about the effect on the schools. And so that's why I really would urge
you to...kind of try and come to some kind of consensus about what your concerns are.
It may be that it's concentration...concentrations of poverty and I don't...there is
no...there's no number anywhere that we can pick and say that's a concentration, and I
think it can be specific to our community. But, it may be that concentrations of poverty,
um, are your concern and you need more information from the School District to see if
the effect on the schools is your concern, and then we have to tease out some of this
information, but I...I think Mike's question raises a good point about unless you're
focused on what your concern is, it's very hard to figure out what kind of information
you need.
Bailey/ Well, and that would go to more my interests, is concentration of poverty, rather than,
um...it's not to say I'm not concerned about impact on schools, but I think concentration
of poverty is (both talking)
Champion/ ...simpler way to deal with it too.
Bailey/ I don't know if it's simpler...it's uh...it's a way to deal with it.
Mims/ Well, and that's what I was trying to get back to asking. I'm hearing the discussion,
we've raised two concerns, and only two. The effect on the schools and concentration of
poverty. Is there something we're missing?
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Dilkes/ I think you have raised another one, and that is the economic diversity of neighborhoods.
Because economic diversity may mean something different than poverty concentration.
Bailey/ Well, and that would be a more interesting way to say it from my perspective.
Hayek/ I interpret it, uh, the point you and someone else made more as concentration of poverty,
under which you have consideration of the schools and consideration of the
neighborhoods. Are they...is the umbrella, essentially, a concentration of poverty? Is
that reflective...
Champion/ Yes, that's perfect. (several talking)
Bailey/ How would you talk about the economic diversity...versus concentration of poverty?
Because that's different...because concentration of poverty would be probably
incorporating perhaps some close-in neighborhoods that didn't have a lot of students who
would be lower income, but economic diversity would incorporate an understanding that
that neighborhood has, that diversity, because you have students who may be, um, very
far below median income. Graduate students or undergraduate students or whatever. So
it might be a... an easier way to approach our community.
Davidson/ And, don't forget in terms of economic diversity of neighborhoods and the impacts on
elementary schools, we don't...we as the City don't control all those variables. The
School District shifts, uh, boundaries, you know, Longfellow's a good example because
of decisions that the School Board has made about where district boundaries are, you
have, uh, relatively high income neighborhoods feeding into Longfellow as well as the
neighborhood where the school is located, but that's a decision that the City's not
involved in. That's a School District decision.
Bailey/ Well, L..go ahead, Matt.
Hayek/ Well, and uh...measuring poverty depend...depends on what you're looking at. I mean,
in a student neighborhood, yes, the student may, uh, objectively show a low personal
income, but may be supported by very affluent parents, um... (both talking)
Bailey/ Yeah, but...
Hayek/ ... it's a temporary poverty... decision to go to college, uh, in that example. So, you have
to tease those things out to have a fuller understanding of...
Bailey/ Well, and that's why I think economic diversity might get more into what we're trying to
see. That phrase that Eleanor provided. That I'm sure she can help define. (laughter)
Mims/ I think Connie, you know, kind of phrased it the best that I've heard tonight in that, you
know, when you start having a large concentration in a...large concentration of poverty
in an area, and then...things just start changing in the neighborhood, whether it's
perception or reality, you know, people start getting a certain perception of the local
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school, and so that... and it just... it starts, it starts becoming a rock rolling down the hill
and you can't stop it.
Champion/ And I think that's a real concern for the City.
Mims/ Right, and so then you get, like you said, you get the perceptions of schools and people
don't want to live in the neighborhood, and the housing prices go down. People can't sell
their houses. The people that are buying them aren't maintaining them. You just kind of
get this momentum that the whole neighborhood starts deteriorating, and it's a
combination of the schools and the perception of the schools, um...it...you know, it's a
huge, it's a very complex thing, and whether just calling it concentration of poverty or
calling it economic diversity of neighborhoods...really captures all of that I'm not sure,
but...I mean, I think that's some of the thing that we've seen that has...has caused so
much problem in our community.
Davidson/ Is there...consensus here that economic diversity in neighborhoods is, I mean, if you
go to the City's Comprehensive Plan it says that that's a positive thing.. Is that something
that you feel is an important criterion for us to...to possibly focus on here in...in terms of
this location of affordable housing policy? (several talking)
Bailey/ ...talking about framing and positive or negative...I think economic diversity is a more
positive framework that involves concen... it involves looking at concentrations of
poverty, but it also looks at, um, the composition of a neighborhood, which I think in this
community comes into play, because of what...what Matt was talking about, you know,
students who present income level, um, you know, low income, but present value-wise as
not.
Mims/ So what...what do we do? Do we draw a circle around student housing and ignore it?
Bailey/ No...
Mims/ No, I'm...I'm just saying (both talking)
Bailey/ ...example, in my neighborhood you will see a different profile for example of the
neighborhood. The northside is a different profile than it would be in, you know, the area
around Hoover... School.
Mims/ But I'm saying if you draw a circle around south Governor, south Johnson, south, I
mean...what are we going to do with that? I mean, I guess my concern is how do
we...and maybe I'm just getting ahead of myself, but as you start looking at these things,
you start taking certain areas within the community...
Bailey/ But aren't we trying to do that with the UniverCity program, I mean, isn't that part of the
objective? It's rental...rental, owner-occupied balance, but part of it gets to economic
diversity...in those neighborhoods (both talking)
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Mims/ ...question is how do you address, or do we accept that there's certain areas which we
can't do much, where you already have all these large apartment buildings that are being
very profitably run by people that are jamming them full of students, and as a city I don't
care what program we have, I don't think there's going to be much you're going to do
with South Governor and South Dodge and maybe South Governor's different, but you
know, South Johnson, South Van Buren, where you've just got apartment building after
apartment building after apartment building. I don't...I don't think there's much in those
areas (several talking)
Davidson/ Yeah, and I think some of our thought in terms of the City's policy has been that those
aren't really great neighborhoods for families and children because they don't have
services, they don't have an elementary school. I think it is possible for us to segregate
out those neighborhoods, Susan, if that's Council's desire because...because of the
University's parking policies, it's basically based on walk-ability to the University
campus. So you go out a half mile, a mile and you know, that's your boundary where
the...the economic incentive is to provide student housing, um...
Bailey/ I think you just see it in two of our neighborhoods. I mean, I can speak for Steve as well
(several talking)
Davidson/ Yeah, and...and just to clarify, Regenia, I'm not saying we should do that. I'm saying
if that's Council's desire I believe we have a mechanism to do it. You all have to decide
if that's a good idea or not.
Bailey/ I think we have policies in place that we're not doing that, don't we, or did I...I mean...I
don't know how you address it, but I think...I think we do have policies in place that are
looking at those. I agree. What are you going to do with what's there.
Mims/ Yeah, I mean, what are you going to do with South Johnson Street?
Wilburn/ Well, we have put into place, for example, um, some of our conservation districts for
example had an impact on those areas that you are mentioning now, it's...uh, it's a little
different format in terms of what we did.
Bailey/ Right.
Wilburn/ But...but uh, matter of fact I remember one builder hurrying up and putting something
in before we got the policy in place, um, but...well, point taken.
Mims/ And I just think that we have to recognize that there's certain areas that regardless of
what, how we define the problem...there's going to be certain areas I think are going to
have to be treated a little differently or...
Bailey/ Oh, I agree with that.
Mims/ Okay. Okay.
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Dilkes/ And I think your question also raises this is that...you...you all really have control over
when it comes to the...the placement of certain types of housing very little. We're really
not talking about South Johnson and South Governor. I mean, we're...that may...we're
identifying a... a concern and then we're going to look at what you have control over and
try and...(several talking) yeah! And, right, and so we're really not talking about
Governor and Johnson and those kinds of things. So I...I really don't think that's an
issue.
Mims/ Okay.
Long/ And also we are talking, I mean, you mentioned families and impact on the schools, but as
of today, 66% of the vouchers on this map have, do not have any minors, any school age
kids living in their... in the homes. So we have to think there's also a huge need for, um,
people without kids, um, elderly, people with disabilities. That's primarily who we're
talking about here. And also...I mean, our downtown does have 20...over 20,000
employees and there are people that want to live close to downtown, so I would
encourage looking broadly, as well, and I do live on South Governor (laughter and
several talking) next door and a 96-year-old across the street.
Bailey/ And it's a lovely neighborhood! (laughter)
Mims/ It is!
Higgins/ One thing I would like to interject about this is, um, I think I'd warn against
segregating...I mean, not placing affordable housing in student's...student
neighborhoods exclusively. Um, I think that, um... especially for non-traditional
students, this is a problem that they face. A lot of increased financial strain because of
educational costs, um, there's inflated rental costs around downtown, you know, due to
the high student population. So I...I just want to warn against not placing any affordable
housing down there. I understand there's probably areas of greater concern, um, but I
think that, um, it could be beneficial to expand, especially rental units, uh, in the area
near the University.
Davidson/ Yeah, and fortunately we're working on a project, not to get too far off the subject,
we're working on a project, I think you know about it, with the multi-use parking facility
to do exactly that, and...and it's looking more favorable in terms of having somebody
work on a project with us that will do exactly that, and I will tell you that I've had to
resist at least six or eight phone calls from developers who wanted to partner with us and
provide student housing, and I've indicated to them that is not the City Council's desire
right now. It's to provide workforce housing and try and introduce that into the market in
what is otherwise traditionally a student housing area. So we are...working on that
particular issue at your previous direction.
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Long/ And Riverfront Crossings, as well. I just...well, I know you're aware of this, but our next
funding cycle starts in mid-December so it's a rather short time frame to work on this
so...would appreciate having...
Dilkes/ Well, I think we've talked about probably the need for, um, special meetings.
Davidson/ Is there, as you are sitting thinking about this issue, additional information or
additional questions you have that you feel that you need to have answered, or
information provided, before you'll be ready to make decisions about the specific criteria
that you want us to use? Um, anything that...we can make sure we...we bring back for
you?
Wright/ I'm trying to remember from, uh, I think it was information given to JCCOG's
affordable housing task force, or information that was given to Council, uh, about the,
um...basically a chart condensing and the, uh...um, well, shoot (mumbled). Starts with
an `I' ...inclusionary zoning. Thank you. My brain just froze. A chart that could
summarize the inclusionary zoning in different cities across the country. Did Council get
that or did...
Davidson/ Yeah, you have received that, but we can generate that again for you, Michael, if... if
you can't lay your hands on it.
Wright/ I probably could, but I just...couldn't remember which group got it.
Davidson/ Yeah, and you know, I think we've outlined for you that most...most of those places,
almost exclusively are in larger, urban areas, uh, where there's even more of a...more of
an issue. The places that are close to us in...in population have generally that have
adopted an ordinance, most of them have rescinded them, uh, since that time, but they do
remain in place in large...larger, urban areas. Again, if that's a direction that Council
decides ultimately that you'd like to go, we'll try and craft something that would be
appropriate for Iowa City.
Champion/ Well, I think we could look, I mean...I think you're right - it hasn't worked in towns
this size, but I think there's other things we can do, and that's what I'd like (mumbled)
out west and...like when we did at that place out east, that .big housing area (several
talking) we did stuff along the edges, um, we made that part of the plan or whatever you
want to call it, and I think that kind of thing works really well, to put things
around...around the edges, and people don't seem to object to that so much. Uh, so I
think we're (mumbled) done more of that, and that's not inclusionary zoning, that's
just...you can (several talking) voluntary, but you can give incentives to do that, um...
Wright/ ...talking about a little bit earlier.
Champion/ Yeah, right, right.
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Davidson/ Yeah, and one of the ways you can do that is by pre-zoning property. (both talking)
...establishing that in a particular area there will be multi, you know, typically we've all
been through it, some of us more than others, but when we have the big public hearing in
this room where somebody is trying to introduce higher density into a neighborhood,
almost exclusively, and...and it's a lot of...of heated...heated debate. Well, some of
that, I mean, not that we won't have the heated debate, but...but you can be proactive,
more proactive than we have been in terms of your policies, if that's a direction you want
to go.
Hayek/ I'd be interested to know in terms of the, uh, the evolution of technology and what uses
we can put it to, versus the limitations we had five to seven years ago, what our options
are (mumbled), what we can look at. You know...
Long/ Basically anything you ask, um...we can input information into GIS, um, we certainly
could...all this information's already in there. We could...pick a location and draw a
circle quarter mile around it and it could give you all the income information (mumbled)
lot of that's unfortunately based on the 2000 census, um, rental permit information, crime
information, school district information (mumbled) different layers.
Davidson/ Yeah, go a little stream of consciousness on us here if you want, because we've got a
lot of...we've got some really bright young people working for the City that can put this
information together like Steve's indicated and...and hopefully aggregate it, how you'd
like to see it aggregated, so let us...let us know if there's something you'd like to see.
Dilkes/ I...I would urge you to, I know you just got this map tonight, but I would urge you to
spend some time with this map, and...and kind of digest the information that you've got
here. Um, and... cause I think then that raises questions that you might need additional
information about.
Dickens/ Is there a way to find out how much available land is open in these areas? You know,
empty lots and...
Davidson/ When you say open... oh, you mean vacant?
Dickens/ Vacant or haven't been...
Davidson/ Yeah, we keep an inventory of existing platted lots. That's a lot where basically an
owner can go in and get a building permit as long as they comply with the subdivision
ordinance. Um, so we can get you that information, the number of platted lots.
Dickens/ That would be (both talking)
Davidson/ Yeah, the rate of growth right now, as we all know, is pretty slow so that...that
inventory of platted lots hasn't increased much, just lately, because there's so many of
them sitting there.
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Dilkes/ You know, one of the things to think about is that you're not limited by the geographical
areas that we've already got defined, like census tracts or school district boundaries. I
mean, you can...you can create your own areas if that's what you need to do to make
your policy work. So...you know, whether it's neighborhood based or, you know,
whatever. So don't...I don't think you have to get super hung up on, oh, we've got to use
the census tract boundaries or we gotta use the free and, or we gotta use the school
district boundaries, I mean...you can set your boundaries based on what you see on the
map.
Hightshoe/ (mumbled) also been talking about different boundaries, like neighborhood
conglomerations, like by subdivision, or to get to a minimum level of households in
subdivision that you might combine contiguous subdivisions together to find out how
many assisted units are in that...that area and working at a percentage. We don't know
what that percentage is, but that's a concern to the neighborhood level of how many
assisted units are already in that area, um, we can break that down GIS too.
Bailey! That seems to have a little bit more relevance of discussion in this community,
neighborhoods than census tracts, for sure.
Hayek/ When does the new census data come out anyway? Marian?
Karr/ The census figures will...by law they must be done by the end of December, but they will
not be disseminated to jurisdictions until January, and more likely it'll be March before
we get ours.
Davidson/ I think with the 2000 census, Matt, it was 2002 or 3, wasn't it, before we had a lot of
the data.
Karr/ Yeah. They anticipate it being a little bit quicker this time, but again, as we discussed this
evening, it' 11 be coming out in different chunks and different, uh, breakdowns, so we're a
little unsure how it's going to come to us, but no earlier than March.
Dilkes/ But...but it's my understanding and someone who knows better than I can correct me,
that you can update the census tract information. You don't have to wait for ten years
to ... to do it, right?
Bailey/ Can we see this map with, I mean, is anybody else interested in seeing neighborhoods?
(several responding) I mean, that's an identifiable, I mean, people identify with a
neighborhood.
Mims/ Well, if we're doing neighborhoods, can we do the income by neighborhoods? I realize
it's old data, but...(several talking) do it by with...
Long/ You can pick any...you can...down to the block, I mean, it's...any geographic area you
want.
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Mims/ Don't you think having the income distribution (several talking)
Bailey/ I mean, if we're talking about economic diversity, I think it goes to it, right? (several
talking)
Long/ The problem is not the entire community is served by neighborhood associations.
Bailey/ Right, and so...
Wright/ But there are main (mumbled) aren't there?
Davidson/ Yeah, I think we have 33 or 36 neighborhood associations, and as Steve's pointed out,
it doesn't cover the entire city, but those areas that aren't covered by formal
neighborhood associations, we can still probably aggregate data for, I think.
Dilkes/ Yeah, that's what I mean. You don't have to (mumbled) we can create our own
neighborhood.
Bailey/ That might be...meaningful.
Davidson/ Okay, we'll get that for you.
Hayek/ The, um...the housing choice voucher, uh, numbers on this map, I'm trying...is the
number 533, and I'm looking at your memo, it says that there are 533 vouchers
using...used in non-subsidized rental housing. Is the balance, 250 some, that represents
those vouchers used in subsidized rental housing, are they shown on here? There are...
Long/ They're already included, but they're not broken out.
Hayek/ They're already included in what?
Long/ In these numbers, um...(several talking) yeah, either transitional, elderly or...
Hayek/ Okay, so they're in the colored dots.
Long/ Yes. (mumbled) duplication.
Hightshoe/ As of that date...as of October 20, 2010, there was (mumbled)
Dilkes/ Did you understand that? To...to avoid the duplication, okay.
Mims/ Cause there's about 1,200 vouchers total, right?
Long/ I think right now it's a little bit less, but...
Dilkes/ Steve, you're going to have to come up to the table. (several talking)
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Davidson/ Tracy, can you give Steve your microphone?
Mims/ I just remember at one point it was around 1,200.
Rackis/ Our...our HUD approved base line is 1,214.
Mims/ Okay.
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Rackis/ However, um, as of the date of this map, um, there are only 1,108 vouchers currently
being utilized, because we cannot exceed the 1,214 for the calendar year budget cycle.
So there were, if you look back at your March map, there were larger numbers of
vouchers utilized in March than there are now because...
Hightshoe/ You have to average it.. .
Rackis/ ...we have to average over the 12 months and not exceed...HUD counts everything in
unit months. So it's like 14,568 unit months that we cannot go over.
Dilkes/ How many in Iowa City?
Rackis/ Uh, the total vouchers...excuse me, the total vouchers in Iowa City...uh, right now are, I
think it's 786 is the number from the memo, but in... in subtracting out the duplicate
locations, for example, MECCA, the Housing Fellowship, um, the Regency Heights, uh,
those type of structures that are already mapped. The total is 533.
Dilkes/ So in other words, the balance of those vouchers are being used at places that are
identified in the map...
Rackis/ Correct.
Dilkes/ ... as something else.
Rackis/ Yes. And...and, Mike, to answer your question, um, in terms of breaking out elderly,
disabled, and families with children, uh, one of the dynamics that we have is a... a
disabled family is defined as the head of household being disabled. So there are elderly
households with minors. There are disabled households with minors, and then there are
non-disabled households who the minors are now adults and perhaps have moved out, so
um, what Steve referred to is, um, the...the breakdown of what we look at is either
households with minor children, households without minor children, and of the 533 of
that that show up in the census tracts, 66% of those do not have any minor children,
and...and there's also some other data in the annual report that I put out, in...in March,
that showed the breakdown of households with minors, households without minors.
Hightshoe/ I was going to add when looking at the data, I found it interesting that I get calls,
well, periodically that we haven't re...we haven't received a net increase in vouchers
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since 1998, so when we build more CDBG and Home assisted housing, it's not given that
you're going to get more vouchers, because we have the same number from year to year.
We just increase how many units that we have available through the CDBG/Home
programs.
Champion/ I just have some questions before I take this map home and I study it. Uh, this 20 in
the Lucas, in the green 20, is that City owned housing?
Long/ That is public housing, yes.
Champion/ And where...where is that?
Long/ Shamrock? Is that (several talking)
Davidson/ It's right on Scott Boulevard.
Rackis/ That's Shamrock Place.
Champion/ (mumbled)
Davidson/ Now one...one other issue, I think it's maybe the only one that we included in your
materials that no one has raised is crime, um, and you know, I think...I think we'd all
agree that for the last year, crime's not been nearly the issue that it was a year ago, uh,
and certainly I think a year ago people were equating, at least some people were equating
some types of affordable housing with crime.
Champion/ Well, I think that happens all the time.
Davidson/ Yeah, and is that something...again, let us...what concerns you have, what
information would you like to have, in terms of crime statistics, and hopefully we can,
again, try and aggregate this data. If you want crime statistics by neighborhood, crime
statistics by elementary school district, hopefully we could provide that information, if
that's something you want.
Dickens/ I don't think it'll hurt. Maybe we're just not hearing about it as much, because other
things have come up, uh...
Davidson/ Well, I gotta say, Terry, I think there's been some really concerted efforts that people
need some, deserve some congratulations for in terms of the variety of things, not just
from the City but other organizations that have really made a difference, have really
made a difference in some of the neighborhoods that had been associated with high
crime.
Dickens/ It'd be interesting to see what the differences were from year...last year (mumbled)
Long/ ...how you define what type of crime you want to see, what kind of...
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Bailey/ (several talking) don't want to see any crime, Steve!
Dickens/ It just seems it's been much quieter, but I don't know if it's not being reported or...
Davidson/ I think the Chief of Police would tell you it has been quieter.
Champion/ (several talking) a police call, I mean, that would be fine.
Long/ Just police calls?
Davidson/ Police call? Okay.
Wright/ Every fall the Press-Citizen does that issue where they break down crime by
neighborhood, and that's got quite a few different categories on it and that might be...
Davidson/ Yeah, and I think what we would like to do is...is bring some accuracy to the
perceptions (laughter) you know, I think there's been some...some misperceptions in
terms of, uh, the thoughts about crime and what's causing it and where it's focused and
that sort of thing. So let us try and, uh...
Dickens/ Just look at it. I don't (both talking)
Bailey/ By neighborhood I'm interested in seeing, I mean, if that's what we're going to look at
(several talking)
Wilburn/ ...direction I was going to say, Jeff, is that I...I would foresee as we get into more
discussions about how to, um...we're providing reality for folks as, um, there's some
push-back in a given direction, uh, because that, you know, that will be helpful for
Council and Councils forward to give that reality as people bring the perception forth, uh,
well, for example, I'm looking at Steve and I recall, uh, you know, a couple Councils
back on all of this, uh, city-owned public housing that was out there and at the time I
think it was around a hundred or so units, and...um, that's, you know, that's down now.
The number of homes that are owned by the City. Um...did you want to...uh, so I think
that type of, um, you know, not that it's going to change if anyone has, uh, if anyone has
bought into a perception, not that that...regardless of their motivation for that perception,
uh, at least helps us inform the public, um, in terms of what's really out there.
Dilkes/ And if I can just add, if you can just...information is a good thing, and asking for
information and having as much information as we can is a good thing. And it doesn't
mean you're forming any conclusions about anything. We're just trying to get the
information that we need.
Wilburn/ I have a general question for...this is more for Council, so if there was something else
you wanted (mumbled). Um...the affordable housing and workforce housing issue has
been bantered in a lot of generations over the years and so, uh, an area where we have
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frequently ended up is our discussions have halted when someone brings up, well, we
need to talk to, or we want to partner or see where the other, um, cities are...um...and
then...it ends up with JCCOG and then the discussion ends up getting lost and, um, so I
guess I'm just curious as to are folks wanting to proceed toward looking at Iowa City,
knowing that in several gyrations we've put out there about that, or not...
Champion/ Well, I'm not interested in looking at Chicago or Coralville. (several talking and
laughing)
Wilburn/ ...cause the image that has come...when, uh, that comes to mind for me. I don't know
if you remember or saw the movie "Raiders of the Lost Ark" but at the end (several
talking) warehouse (laughter) gets...that's the image that comes to mind for me when...
Davidson/ Yeah, and remember after you have been hopefully not deluged with information, I
mean, hopefully we can present it in a way that's going to be useful to you, but once
we...once you have that information, and you are having your discussion, we will circle
you back to the question, where do you want to see projects funded with CDBG and
Home funds located, or not located, in this community, that that's ultimately the question
we're trying to get to.
Champion/ I can answer that!
Davidson/ You can answer right now, Connie? Cause (several talking)
Hayek/ I think it's a good first step that this body is doing this work. You know, it's taken a long
time to get here and you know the last step was creating a commission, um, to...to do a
lot of work, and talk about deluge of information, I mean, you guys are part of that, you
know, several feet of documents, um, that we waded through, and it was (mumbled)
and...and you know, detouring and talking about all sorts of things, and finally came up
with something that, uh, went to Council and...I think...I'm glad that this Council is
taking this issue up and that we will be doing the work to figure something out.
Mims/ I think back to, oh I'm sorry (several talking) I think back to your point, Ross, too that...I
mean, as we've talked about certain things, and certain things have gone to JCCOG like,
you know, is anyone else interested in inclusionary zoning and that sort of thing, as we
get to the how-to, I mean, I think there are certain how-tos that if we were to adopt them,
it would certainly be better if it was done, you know, beyond just our community borders,
and so I think those are things we definitely will have to look at and think about as we
decide on our how-tos, and regardless of how we end up with it, I think whether we bring
other people on or not we have to make decisions that over the whole range of it will be
in the best interest of our community.
Wilburn/ Well, and there are areas where we have gone to our neighbors and have had success
with that, but when it comes to...has come to the housing issue, it stops for a variety of
reasons.
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Davidson/ Well, and remember one, in fairness to the rest of the JCCOG entities, we are unique
in that we're an entitlement community.
Champion/ Right.
Davidson/ And the other...the other entities of JCCOG are not entitlement communities. Now
there has been some discussion, right, of making it a...talk about that just a little...
Long/ Home funds, it's called the home consortium, where we combine, we get agreements from
the contiguous entities or communities, and we can use our Home funds throughout those
communities. That's something which...well I believe JCCOG voted on and...
Hayek/ I was very intrigued by that. That just came out in the last week or two in our packet,
didn't it?
Davidson/ In your JCCOG packet, I think.
Hayek/ Yeah, okay. This concept of...of...creating asort of a super structure or something like
that, that goes beyond the city borders, uh, for funding like this.
Davidson/ But, again to...just to reiterate. The process that we go through of receiving funds
annually, getting...soliciting projects, recommendations from HCDC to you who
ultimately make the decisions, none of the rest of JCCOG goes through that. Just Iowa
City. Are there any other concerns, perceptions, anything you would like to put on the
table, need for additional information, um, what I think we'll do is try and summarize the
discussion and say, okay, here's what we're going to provide you next time we discuss
this, and you can tell us if there's any holes in it, but is there anything else you would like
to put on the table in terms of a concern or an issue regarding what we've been talking
about?
Bailey/ I know we...we've moved away from the school impact, but do we still want to have a
discussion with the School Board?
Mims/ Oh I think so, definitely!
Bailey/ I think that that would be good! So I think we should get that...those wheels in motion.
Or have a conversation with...I don't know how that needs to proceed.
Davidson/ Yeah, we were going to have a staff level discussion with the School District. Do you
want us to organize something with the School Board, and yourselves, to have a
discussion?
Mims/ Maybe we start at staff and see what you come up with (several talking) I mean, for me
impact on the schools is still a huge part of this. I mean, I wouldn't say I backed away
from that at all. I think it's huge because I think... as Cormie said it and, you know,
mentioned before, I think the impact on the schools, reality or perception, then just works
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its way around to impact a neighborhood itself, and the housing, and becomes a huge
issue, and so I think...I think it's a huge, huge issue, but I also recognize, you know, as
Ross has said, it's also not an easy one because of the whole issue of the schools that
need assistance and open enrollment. The boundaries (several talking) but to me it
doesn't mean we ignore it. I think what we're doing has a huge impact on schools, and
we have to do what we can to work with the District and address that.
Dickens/ Cause it does cross borders, as far as Coralville and Iowa City, the School District's
there, cause they can transfer from a Coralville school to an Iowa City school...
Mims/ Or vice versa.
Dickens/ ...students can.
Hayek/ Okay? Anything else? (several talking) Thank you, sir. Very productive discussion.
Why don't we, uh, take afive-minute break and then go back and start talking about
legislative priorities? (BREAK)
Legislative Priorities (IP2 of 10/21 Info Pkt.):
Hayek/ Okay, let's uh...get moving here and try to get out of here. Um, next item is Council
legislative priorities for 2011. Dale, do you want to walk us through this or...
Helling/ Sure!
Hayek/ Okay.
Helling/ In your packet...we'll both find as soon as I find it here....um, memorandum sent
you...the material that you received is largely what you've gotten I think in the past
couple years, for your discussion. One...one thing is the, uh, resolution, uh...setting your
priorities last year. Uh, I think probably you'll find that most of those things are...were
not resolved, in the legislature. Um... so you know those may...be things you want to
carry over again. The other thing that we gave you, I did get the 2011 priorities from the
League, and um, that's...there's apage in there that summarizes that. Again, um, they're
sort of following the trend I think in terms of legislative priorities for many organizations,
the legislators like to have things fairly short in terms of highest priority, and be able to
focus on those. Not that, again, these are not all inclusive. You may have a lot of other
interests, uh, legislative interest going into the session and other things will pop up as
well, uh, during the session that you...you'll need to become interested in (mumbled)
very possibly anyway, and then the third thing we gave...I gave you, I just sort of
outlined where the, uh, Metropolitan Coalition is thus far and they had identified four
kinds of areas of legislative interest, and doing some more detailed work, but outlining
those, uh, those uh...those areas is...is also included in the memo that I sent you. And
that's infrastructure, economic development, uh, alternative revenues, and the 411
pension (mumbled)
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Champion/ Um...I...I think there's one thing we should talk about adding, um, and that
is...some way that cities can affect the liquor licenses of bar owners who are...aren't
obeying the rules. I don't know how to word it, but...
Dickens/ Habitual...
Hayek/ I'm glad you brought that up, because I was thinking about mentioning that as well, I
mean, we've got three sub-items on the alcoholic beverages wish list from last year.
Champion/ Well, I think the important one is...I could eliminate all of these.
Hayek/ But I think...I think maybe what you're getting at is the ability locally to do things.
Essentially home rule on that issue. (both talking) After our experience, and after
Dubuque's experience (several talking)
Dickens/ PAULA been thrown out basically.
Champion/ Cause whether our referendum...whether the referendum passes or fails, it's still
going to be a problem for us. Especially even before 10:00 if our referendum...if our 21
holds firm. And we have no way, and...you know, people are always (mumbled) like,
you know, Nebraska tourists and wherever else, but they actually have a way to take a
liquor license away if the PAULAs are a certain amount. So that's why those bars have
gone to 21, not voluntarily, cause they don't want to pay the fine. But I...I don't know
how we can word that, but it might be something that eventually we can actually get
done.
Hayek/ Maybe (mumbled)
Champion/ Maybe.
Hayek/ (mumbled)
Dickens/ I don't think it's a big deal for the rest of `em cause there's very few that are under 21.
Champion/ But they still have minors in bars.
Bailey/ ... a university city problem. I would say. (several talking)
Hayek/ ...and maybe other communities have (mumbled)
Bailey/ I think more the issue is the home rule issue that is sort of constantly brought up, I
mean...I don't know. (mumbled) to alcohol seems a little narrow given the kinds of
things we don't' control really.
Champion/ We don't control anything.
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Hayek/ But isn't home rule sort of...the...the description that can get applied to a variety of
actual policies. Like for example, the Metro Coalition is advocating for home rule
on... on flood plain management. Topic specific... issue (mumbled) Couldn't we do
that?
Helling/ I think the difference there is...is that, um, the whole concept of, if the State is in
position to make those determinations that apply differently at different localities, with
some of the...the alcohol related, uh, issues and some of the solutions that...that we see,
some of those have actually, you know, been advocated to go to the State and ask for.
For instance, um, price specials for one, uh, to go to the State and ask for State
legislation, like the keg registration.
Hayek/ Yeah.
Helling/ Um... so you know there's kind of a mix there. Some things are probably better done at
the State level, I would think clearly (mumbled)
Hayek/ Yeah.
Helling/ And maybe at the local level have more to do with the, the, uh, enforcement and
suspensions, that type of thing.
Dickens/ Is part of the problem the new, or the alcoholic beverage person? Since he hasn't been
in there or is there...you know, they replaced the old person last spring.
Bailey/ Steve is pretty familiar with him. He's been...
Dickens/ He's been with `em for a while.
Bailey/ He's been in State government for quite some time.
Dilkes/ Well, it was...it was, uh, Lynn Walding who made the initial decision anyway.
Wright/ I don't think the tenure of the alcoholic beverages director had much benefit one way or
the other for us.
Champion/ I don' t know how to word it, but I think it's something we ought to be talking about.
Dilkes/ Well, I think the best approach on... on that issue is the... is to, um, seek a... a... an
amendment to the State Code, which gives us...more authority at the local level to
address, um, licensing issues and... and other alcohol issues, um, it's... it's often the
response you get from the State is, oh, that's your issue when you seek State legislation to
address it statewide and...and uh, well, then the response to that is okay, then give us the
authority to deal with it.
Champion/ Right, right.
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Hayek/ The one thing we could do is add basically a sub `b' to that paragraph, if we wanted to
keep what we had from last year. Under paragraph 8. See what I'm talking about?
Champion/ Uh-huh.
Mims/ (several talking) just to replace all of it with the one, I mean, you know, at what point do
we have a list so long (several talking) they just ignore it.
Bailey/ ...let's focus this a lot. I mean, this...
Wright/ This didn't go over real well last year if you recall.
Hayek/ But we had the same discussion last year, you know, it was just getting to be too big a
list. You look at what the League of Cities does, they have sort of these broad themes.
Wright/ Why don't we just...
Mims/ What does it really mean (several talking)
Wright/ Why don't we just replace the...the three-point alcoholic beverages bullet...
Bailey/ With what?
Wright/ ...with what we've just been talking about. More local control on...
Champion/ On licensing.
Wright/ ...licensing.
Bailey/ Well, and then...I mean, if that's one priority, then I would...I would go, I would look at
what the Metro Coalition is looking at economic development, roll the hotel/motel tax not
into alternative revenue, but call that economic development essentially, I mean, and roll
that all into one and make that a core priority.
Hayek/ Yeah, I think what came out of the Metro Coalition's was good and succinct. There's
four broad categories with specific sub parts.
Bailey/ But I think, you know, even focusing it more narrowly for Iowa City, I mean...would
...would be interest to me, I mean, I understand. I think these are good. Don't get me
wrong, but...and then having a more substantive discussion with the legislators about our
priorities and concerns in those areas. What we're doing, well, with um...TIF programs
and what...what we're doing in those areas. And I know that even when I was on the,
um, Convention and Visitor Bureau Board we were pushing for an increase in hotel/motel
tax. I mean, it's an...it's enabling legislation, it's nothing that they have to do. They
enable us to have a vote.
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Champion/ Right, right, right!
Bailey/ And around here I think that would be beneficial.
Hayek/ Do we want to...I mean, do we want to use the same four categories as the Metro
Coalition and...retro, just do two?
Bailey/ (mumbled) and the economic development. I mean, unless you feel, I mean, you and
Ross have talked about, I mean, we'll support the Metro Coalition, right? I mean, in
these.
Champion/ We could support the Metro Coani...Coalition, and support the Iowa League of
Cities...
Karr/ That's what item 9 on the resolution did last year as far as (several talking)
Champion/ ...focus the two or three things that we've...that are important to us.
Bailey/ And then have...have it to support those positions, and have a more focused discussion
instead of a laundry list.
Hayek/ Okay (both talking) okay, so we can support the League and the Metro Coalition
priorities. What about...what do you want to do with what we submit of items 1 through
8?
Bailey/ I'm looking here.
Wright/ You talking about the resolution, proper?
Hayek/ Yeah, I mean, assume we start with that document.
Bailey/ No, I mean, this is last year's, right?
Karr/ Last year's.
Hayek/ But I mean (several talking) that's fine.
Karr/ You just, basically you'd like the resolution to be three, potentially three bullet points.
One the authority at the local .level to address the alcohol issue.
Champion/ Right.
Karr/ The, um, economic development from the Metro singled out, plus the Metro and the other
League ones? Is that what you're thinking?
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Bailey/ Yeah, the (mumbled) legislative priorities set forth by the Iowa League of Cities and the,
the Iowa Metro Coalition for the 2011 legislative session. That's three points.
Champion/ Yeah, that's all...take everything else off.
Bailey/ And if we could add hotel/motel tax to economic development, I think that would
be... good.
Wilburn/ That's fine. I agree with that, yeah. (both talking)
Bailey/ ...cause that's what we heard last year is...don't bring us a laundry list. We're not going
to...
Wilburn/ Yeah, I agree with that.
Bailey/ And then also maybe as we have that discussion asking them what they think they can
get done.
Hayek/ How much meat do you want to put on the economic development bone? In terms of
specificity?
Bailey/ When it comes to some of our legislators, helping them and underscoring how we've
used TIF incentives and how it's important to defend those. We continue to use those in
that manner (several talking)
Champion/ Especially after our joint meeting with the Board of Supervisors.
Bailey/ Uh-huh!
Champion/ I think that's a really good idea!
Bailey/ And then describing how we've used historic tax credits. I would put the examples as
the meat.
Hayek/ Well, and that's what I'm getting at. Do you want to have economic development and
then under that a reference to TIF or rail or...these other things that are part of our
laundry list from last year?
Bailey/ I think we should do such as. No, I would do it like the Metro Coalition has done it.
Wright/ Just have a bullet point that says economic development includes items such as...
Bailey/ TIF incentives, um, historic tax credits, and I would...I would support continued funding
of CAT and RECAT since we're going in for a... a grant application, brown fields,
appropriation for workforce housing. I mean, think of how we could use that here if we
got some really... great programs.
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Helling/ To clarify, the language from the League is very specific. That's their language.
They're going to use that and I think this week some time they're (mumbled) put it out.
The Metro Coalition is...basically my summary, uh, so that's not necessarily Metro
Coalition language, although some of it is because I tried to get as close as I could.
That's a work in process, as I understand it, but I don't think the Metropolitan Coalition
has really finalized the wording for...for its priorities. At least I haven't seen it.
Wilburn/ I haven't either.
Bailey/ Well, would we disagree with any of these that Dale has put out there? (several
responding)
Helling/ Yeah, I...
Bailey/ I mean, the only thing that...I'm not sure exactly how and where we would use it, but
I'm sure we could come up with something as infill and brown field development. Can't
come (mumbled) example right away, but...
Wright/ Riverfront Crossings.
Bailey/ Yeah. Oh, yeah, right!
Dickens/ That will (mumbled) (several talking)
Champion/ I've always wondered about that lot at... Muscatine and First Avenue. Prime
property, you know, prime property! Great commercial area.
Hayek/ Okay, so I just wanted to make sure under the economic development rubric we're in
agreement that we can add just these references, broad category references. Okay.
Helling/ Okay, so...kind of summarize for me.
Hayek/ Yeah. Okay, so, uh, item 1 would be some sort of, I don't know how we phrase it,
but...but local control on liquor license or alcohol related issues.
Helling/ Yeah, I think...we can get together and...
Hayek/ Work with Eleanor and Marian on this. Item 2 would be economic development. Under
which we reference (both talking) many or most of what was on our list from last year
(mumbled) into a category.
Helling/ Put it together for you that way and then you can (mumbled) (several responding)
Hayek/ And then number 3 is, uh, we support the priorities set forth by the Metro Coalition and
the League.
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Helling/ Um...okay.
Dickens/ Just make it one very long sentence. (laughter)
Bailey/ Bullet points.
Helling/ Arun-on... (several talking) um... one of the things that was mentioned in terms of, um,
alcohol regulation, this whole idea of good moral character and what it means and it's
been (mumbled) for a long time and...
Champion/ Yeah, they need to define it maybe.
Helling/ ... if that can be, maybe we could note that too in terms of (mumbled) (several talking)
Huh?
Wilburn/ That's going to go nowhere!
Helling/ That ain't going nowhere! (laughter)
Dickens/ Now is that a State or is that a...
Helling/ State, yeah. It's...the older terms. And the other one that staff has brought up that I just
wanted to mention, this could work in to, um, you know, as we move into the session. It
doesn't necessarily have to be one of your top priorities but is this notion of street creep.
The streets move and...
Champion/ Yeah, we talked about that once.
Helling/ ...and now other communities are starting to have that too, and so we'd like to work
with the...with Metro Coalition on that, see if they're having problems, and if it's
something the Coalition would want to...
Mims/ Could you explain that more?
Wright/ Yeah, could you refresh my memory on that?
Bailey/ Yeah!
Helling/ Yeah, what happens is the streets...the streets they actually move because the sub-
surface is still, you know, maybe it's clay or you know and it gets slippery. (several
talking) The...the driveway (mumbled) which moves against the sidewalk, which moves
against the driveway, which pushes it up against the...the, yeah, the foundation where it
meets and there are ways to...to avoid that, but the property owners would have to do it,
and that's to cut more expansion joints if the...if things start to tighten up. People really
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(several talking) something that, I mean, it's going to happen from streets (several
talking) for 60, 80 years ago and so...it's a potential liability for cities.
Bailey/ And the role of the State is what?
Dilkes/ It would be essentially an immunity. Additional immunity provision in the, um, State
Code provision about city, municipal liability.
Hayek/ Are you suggesting, Dale, that we consider that for ours, or just you're mentioning it and
we take it up (both talking)
Helling/ I think based on what you're looking at in shortening up your priorities, no, I wouldn't
put it in as a priority. But we would want to...I think we should try to work with the
Metro Coalition cause some other communities are now starting to...and I think it's
basically the, uh, the engineers and public works organizations are starting to pick up on
it and uh, as a... as a statewide problem. (several talking)
Champion/ The dirt roads weren't such a bad idea!
Helling/ They (several talking)
Wright/ How about just (several talking)
Helling/ ...I think it's something that's probably...it's going to be more and more important
(several talking)
Champion/ We had it happen here. We had that...
Wright/ Yeah, we had one a couple years ago.
Karr/ You also have the legislative meeting the end of November to discuss your priorities, but
you also can identify other things not on your priority list that you would want to take the
opportunity to discuss. This could meet that.
Hayek/ Okay. (several talking)
Champion/ I can't say it! It's like I'm...
Mims/ Well, and I, I mean, I don't know if we want it on the priority list, but I think if we have
the opportunity to discuss with them the whole taxation condominiums.
Champion/ Oh, yes! We bring it up every year (several talking)
Mims/ ...on last year's, I know, and I mean...Des Moines had at one point was raising a big deal
about it. I haven't read the Register lately but... you know, they've had big issues over
there in terms of what that's doing to their tax base.
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Bailey/ Is the Metro Coalition taking that up?
Wilburn/ I think last year...
Bailey/ I know with, I mean...with (several talking)
Helling/ Well I think it'll be on the list again. It just (several talking) top priority areas, but also
that may be (several talking) that may be what...what the Metro Co1...Metro Coalition's,
uh, calls a defensive posture sometimes, and we'll see how that happens, or how
that... goes after the election and so forth, but it may be, uh, may be something that we' 11
all be forced to deal with.
Hayek/ Okay. Got what you need? (several talking)
Helling/ What we'll do is get this back to you, draft it up, uh, for the next meeting and uh, there
is still time, and like to get the resolution~assed on the 16th if possible, but there's still
time to have it on your agenda for the 30t and thereby even though it won't be passed
yet, it'll be in the hands of the area legislators before you meet with them on the 29tH
Wilburn/ Okay.
Bailey/ Yep.
Hayek/ Thank you. Okay, Council, uh, info packets.
Info Packets:
Champion/ Oh! Sleepy! (laughter)
Wright/ Um, IPS from uh, this week's packet. The Kirkwood, Summit intersection.
Mims/ Yeah, I had an asterisk next to that one too.
Wright/ Um, you know, the...to use the technical term, that intersection's a real stinker!
Champion/ I use it all the time. I don't mind it at all.
Bailey/ I avoid it.
Mims/ But you're in a car. This is for pedestrians, but I don't...
Champion/ But didn't the staff say there' s just a couple pedestrians a day?
Mims/ Well there were very few during peak times. (several talking)
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Wright/ I think what we're...that's not the only bad intersection along...there is a lot more traffic
going to the community college at certain times of the day. I wonder if what we ought to
do is have a review of the intersections along Kirkwood in general, not just this one, but
have Kirkwood and Dodge, um, that Marcy Street, Dodge Street...that's areal funky
little intersection. Things do snarl up there.
Dickens/ I think it backs up from Dodge Street up to Marcy and then...in both directions (several
talking)
Bailey/ Vehicular traffic, but.. .
Wright/ Pedestrians are having (several talking)
Dickens/ ...getting across there to go down...
Wright/ It's a difficult intersection to cross, as a pedestrian.
Bailey/ I don't see a lot of pedestrian traffic when I'm...
Wright/ Well, it's a neighborhood. We want to support pedestrian traffic.
Bailey/ No, I mean... yeah, I think the pedestrian count might be similar. I don't.. .
Wright/ Even if the count is not breath taking, I would like to see a little more attention paid to
pedestrians in the neighborhood than always to the cars.
Championl Oh I think we've paid a lot of attention to cars there. I mean, there's a lot of stop
signs, I mean, it's been intentionally to divert traffic and to, yeah, so I don't think we've
been (mumbled) cars either.
Bailey/ I think the hardest thing to do through there is bike.
Hayek/ Jeffrey, what do you think we should do? (laughter)
Champion/ Don't ask him; he used to be a traffic planner.
Helling/ I would point out (several talking)
Davidson/ I'm just covering this item for John since he's not here. He sent you the information.
I...I told him I would...
Hayek/ Briefcase full of ideas (mumbled)
Davidson/ Um, no we...there's a long history to this, as Connie's alluded to, and uh, you know,
it's basically been at Council's direction that the traffic control that's there is there, and
so you know we've indicated to the individual who wrote the letter that we would bring it
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to your attention and see if there was any inclination to change what Council's position
is, and that's basically what staff s looking for is just what do you guys want to do here.
It's clearly something John's outlined what you know what we might do if you're
interested in changing, uh, what's there. Uh, it has met warrants for traffic signal
installation, and again, as Connie stated, we've been trying to fulfill a... something that
Council wanted to see by putting the traffic control that you see there in place.
Champion/ I mean, it's a...it's a...it's a neighborhood and it's a viable neighborhood, and I think
if we start signaling it, we're going to destroy that neighborhood also. And the whole
idea was not to do that (mumbled) use the highway. And...I mean, I've been in that
intersection, I mean, I know I feel different about traffic than a lot of people, as Jeff well
knows, um...I've been there at prime time and had to stop at Dodge Street and stop at
whatever the next one is, and what' d it take me, I' m not kidding you, it takes me four
minutes from Gilbert to Summit. Now I'm sorry, four minutes from Gilbert to Summit at
peak time does not warrant destroying our neighborhoods with stoplights.
Wright/ Well, I disagree with you that some kind of signalization would destroy the
neighborhood. It's a very difficult intersection to cross for pedestrians and as Regenia
has mentioned it's not very good for bicyclists. Uh, it's...
Champion/ (mumbled) make Summit and Kirkwood athree-way stop?
Wright/ Well, at the moment I was talking about Dodge and Keokuk, but Summit and Kirkwood
is another one (both talking)
Bailey/ ...Kirkwood and Marcy myself, but...
Wright/ ...we've got a lot more...I meant to say Marcy, excuse me.
Bailey/ Yeah.
Wright/ We've got a lot more traffic going up and down Kirkwood now, I think, probably than
we did in 1993 when this first was discussed. It's a different landscape, but I think we
need to look at some kind of different controls down there.
Champion/ I don't know. I...I use that road constantly. Constantly.
Dickens/ I grew up down there, but I...now I try to avoid that intersection.
Champion/ Good!
Dickens/ That's the idea. (several talking) It's a dangerous corner.
Bailey/ ...is you have a lot of people going to the community college and these were done at the
AM peak hour and the PM peak hour and I don't think that that's perhaps the peak traffic
hour for going to the college, at least that's...I mean, I teach there. That's what I've
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observed. I mean, the traffic is busier, although I still don't see a lot of pedestrian. I see
more bikes.
Champion/ I'm always amazed at the lack of pedestrians.
Bailey/ Well everybody drives to Kirkwood because it's, I mean, a lot of the kids have...or the
students have jobs and other things.
Wright/ The original intent of all that was really to, ]zll...divert some of the traffic away from
Summit Street, make it difficult to turn left from Summit to Kirkwood, and discouraging
motorists from using Summit Street. Um...
Bailey/ (mumbled)
Wright/ ...I don't know if that really keeps motorists from using Summit Street or not.
Davidson/ Yeah, this actually goes back, Mike, to when the Summit Street bridge was
reconstructed, and we...we looked at other alternatives to putting the bridge on Summit
Street, at the request of the, uh, I can't remember if it was the neighborhood association,
Connie, or if it was just a group...group of neighbors on Summit Street, but uh, as you
just stated, the decision was made to try and put traffic control in place to discourage
people from using Summit Street as kind of, sort of to placate the fact that we were going
to put the bridge back on Summit Street and keep the arterial on...on Summit.
Bailey/ Can we...what would it take to get a sense of what the traffic is in this area, vehicular,
bicyclists, and pedestrian for a period of time?
Davidson/ Well we can certainly get that information.
Bailey/ That would help...I mean, that would...
Wright/ Yeah, I'd like to (mumbled) if we had comps from 1993 and see what the difference is.
Davidson/ Yeah, the vehicular counts are...are pretty simple. It's a little more involved to get
the ped and the bike counts, but we can get them.
Bailey/ I mean...down to Marcy and down, maybe even to Dodge, along that corridor?
Davidson/ ...corridor, both the Summit and the...and the Kirkwood corridor (several talking)
Bailey/ If we do anything in one intersection, don't we impact the corridor?
Wright/ Yeah.
Davidson/ I'm sorry, Regenia, would you say that again?
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Bailey/ If we do anything with one intersection, don't we impact the corridor?
Davidson/ Well, sure, sure, I mean, those three intersections are really the key to the whole
corridor, are those three intersections. You either get those working better or worse, and
I mean, you effect everything and...
Bailey/ And do we have a sense of what the change down near the college, the change in the
street is, I mean, how that will affect the corridor?
Davidson/ Well, it'll clearly affect the class change periods, and of course that project, I wasn't
reminding people, that project is going to improve the sidewalk system drastically in the
area as well so, um, you know it'll have some improvement. I don't know in terms of, by
the time you get clear up onto, uh, Kirkwood if...if that project's going to influence it all
that much. Let's put it this way, you're manipulating these three intersections will have a
much greater effect than anything we're going to be doing down on Lower Muscatine.
Wright/ I think these three intersections really need to be (mumbled)
Champion/ I don't.
Mims/ I mean, I think the intersection where Dodge comes in, and where Keokuk comes in, I
mean, I used to work down there and I mean I think those work fine. I...I mean, I.. .
Wright/ Keokuk works fine. The Dodge, Marcy one is kind of...is problematic. Especially if
you're trying to get on to Keokuk from Marcy.
Champion /That's because people are rude. (laughter) No, that's why!
Hayek/ I think the decision for us tonight is whether or not to conduct some sort of analysis or do
nothing.
Bailey/ Well, I think Eleanor said earlier information is good. Let's get an analysis.
Champion/ How much information do you need? I've given you a lot of information tonight.
Bailey/ I drive it too so...
Wright/ Yours is prejudice. You live on Summit!
Champion/ I also fought against the Gilbert, moving those businesses. No. I'm (mumbled) I'm
not about moving traffic. I...I just...in this town, we have no traffic. I'm sorry.
Wright/ You won't get an argument out of me.
Bailey/ This was motivated by a pedestrian. That's a concern, and I think that that is...
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Wright/ I still think the pedestrian angle is a legitimate concern on these intersections.
Mims/ If you're trying to cross...Kirkwood down by Summit. That's...I can see where that's a
tough place to get across the street.
Wright/ It's tough to do it on a bicycle. I've done it.
Bailey/ I would like to get more information before we decide whether we're doing nothing or
doing something.
Davidson/ I mean if all you're interested in is a pedestrian study, we generally do that by
measuring gaps in the traffic stream. There's actually some criteria for measuring the
adequacy of gaps in the traffic stream, if that's all you're interested in. If it's...if it's
getting vehicular traffic moving...more efficiently. I won't use the term better or worse,
but more efficiently, um, then that's a different study. So, clarify exactly what you'd like
us to look at, if anything.
Champion/ Just remember (mumbled) northside, I fought against (mumbled) for Church Street
too. I mean, I really think you have to look at neighborhoods and not just moving traffic.
Hayek/ I'd like a stop sign in front of my house (several talking)
Bailey/ ...how well it functions as a complete street is how I would define what I'm interested in.
Davidson/ Well, you know when Council made the decision not to increase the geometry of
Kirkwood when, and Rick and I both remember that very well, um, you know what was
way before anybody was talking about complete streets, but it did as you point out. It
kept the street narrow and it's not particularly pleasant for bicyclists. The decision was
made not to put an 8-foot sidewalk on one side, so I mean, these are real...real conscious
policy direction by the City Council at that time.
Wright/ I think I would like to see the data gathered in terms of making it, uh, could it be made
better for bicycles and pedestrians.
Davidson/ Is there a majority of Council'd like to do that?
Mims/ I mean, that's fine with me. I think the traffic itself flows fine. I mean, yeah, there's two
minutes here and there that it gets backed up, five minutes, but I think the traffic itself
flows just fine, but...
Bailey/ So looking at pedestrian, bicycle...
Mims/ Yeah, and so there all you're looking at is gaps in the traffic then, to look at pedestrians...
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Davidson/ Yeah, I'm not sure...I'm not entirely sure about it. I'll have to get some input on the
bicycle angle of it, but yeah, for pedestrians we look at gaps in the traffic stream for
crossing the arterial.
Champion/ You talked about crossing Kirkwood. Is that the problem? (several responding)
Hayek/ Are there four who would like to look at bicycle, pedestrian traffic in that area?
Bailey/ Yeah, that's a neighborhood thing, Connie. (several talking and laughing)
Hayek/ Yeah?
Mims/ I'm willing to.
Hayek/ Regenia?
Bailey/ Oh, yeah! I like information.
Hayek/ That's fine. All right, so let's look at that.
Davidson/ Ped and bike in that Kirkwood corridor, okay.
Helling/ Just a question, I guess for Jeff, um... given the season, is that likely to happen until
spring?
Davidson/ Well it certainly can. It's just a matter of you know you have fewer pedestrians once
the weather gets cooler (both talking) um, I guess what's Council's thought about that.
Would you like us to do that yet this spring, or excuse me, yet this fall or wait till spring?
Bailey/ Do you know what the workload is up there?
Davidson/ I'd have to talk to John about that, Regenia, I'm not certain.
Dickens/ Weather's still supposed to be good for weeks here.
Davidson/ Yeah, I mean, it is something they'd have to get to in the next couple of weeks
(several talking)
Wright/ It might be something we'll have to wait on till spring to get (noise on mic)
Davidson/ You want us to wait till spring on it?
Champion/ I think you should do it tomorrow! (laughter)
Dickens/ Chance of rain tomorrow.
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Helling/ Well I think it's important...
Mims/ I say it's at the discretion of staff.
Bailey/ I do too (several talking) I'd go to...
Davidson/ I'll talk to John and I'll have him send you a memo on when it's going to be done.
Okay. Thanks!
Helling/ Wanted you to be aware that it might take (several talking)
Hayek/ I'm going to escape this topic before anybody brings anything else up on it. Anything
else on the October 14th info packet? Okay. 21St? Okay. Hearing nothing, Council time.
Council Time:
Dickens/ Just a quick review on the Roosevelt. I sent the minutes out from our meeting on
Monday night. I'll be meeting with Jeff and Marcia Bollinger tomorrow morning at
10:30, with the Planning, to see if the City has any more interest. I did meet with Dale
and he didn't think we had any interest in...City having interest in the building itself. So,
I'll have more information after tomorrow morning. Our next meeting is November...
first or second week of November...that we'll be meeting again.
Hayek/ Thank you. Any other Council time? Budget?
Budget:
Helling/ (mumbled) but you won't (mumbled) bit yet.
Karr/ We'll have the schedule in your next packet, a proposed draft.
Champion/ Oh!
Hayek/ Okay. Pending work session issues?
Pending Work Session Issues:
Helling/ Maybe, um...a couple of things there. I will be adding, obviously Sanctuary City, um,
the urban renewal plan for the near-southside, that may not be in December. That may go
over to the first of the year, uh, so if you see it the next time with that date missing, you' 11
know that it's coming up and it might be after the first of the year, and uh, then the other
thing that we'll do is take a look at it at a staff meeting and see if there's anything we can
shift around, if you want us to try to make more time for... for discussing housing.
Champion/ We'd probably need to.
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Helling/ We'll take a look and see...there's some stuff we can move around.
Hayek/ And Marian said she was going to contact us individually to look at possibly scheduling
that.
Champion/ Can we start early? How early can we start... start a meeting (mumbled)
Bailey/ (mumbled)
Hayek/ I would like to see us look at the brick streets issue before we go into the funding round,
because that seems to me to be something we'd want to know before we talked about
CIP.
Bailey/ Well, and I was going to ask about the single-stream recycling, as well, are we going to
talk about that in conjunction with funding? Cause it always comes down to a funding
issue.
Champion/ I thought...the recommendation, wasn't there a recommendation that we do the, um,
multiple family... (several talking)
Dickens/ He's been waiting all night for this! (laughter)
Fosse/ When that came up a couple weeks ago, we...we floated that idea out there about
focusing on multi-family, but then you brought up that you'd like to see us continue to
look at single-stream, and...and we are doing that. So we're...we've got some more staff
meetings, researching it. As far as scheduling it with budget, um, it's...it's the type of
thing where it'll...it'll effect rates, uh, but...but not necessarily the general budget. So if
we...if we try and make a change (both talking)
Bailey/ Right, but in the past when we've...we've looked at rate changes, or potential rate
changes, Council's indicated...I think we've discussed that we want to kind of talk about
those together, instead of getting a resolution after approving a budget, you know, a
resolution for an increased rate.
Fosse/ Yes.
Bailey/ Yeah.
Fosse/ It's best to package it all together.
Bailey/ Yeah. Yeah. So is that possible? Timing wise?
Fosse/ I'll know more after our next meeting.
Bailey/ Okay.
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Fosse/ That's coming up in about two weeks.
Dickens/ Whether there'd be start-up costs for switching over from one to the other (mumbled)
Fosse/ Well, we've looked at that and we can, at least initially, make that change with our
existing trucks, but over time it would become (mumbled) trucks. Uh, the biggest cost
we're looking at is...is getting rid of the material. Once it's co-mingled it takes between
50 and 75 dollars per ton to dispose of it, which is more than it costs to get rid of just
regular garbage, which is 38 dollars a ton. Right now, uh, because it's pre-sorted we get
rid of it at no cost, and in fact, sometimes we make some money on it.
Dickens/ The recycling.
Fosse/ The recycling, yes. And...and we'll get into all that in more detail when we talk about it
again.
Hayek/ Okay. Anything else on the pending issues? Okay, upcoming events, Council
invitations?
Upcomin Events/Council Invitations:
Bailey/ I just wanted to point out y'all got this Corridor Welcome reception email, right? It's at
ACT? (several talking)
Mims/ Oh, you know, I haven't checked my City email lately. (several talking) It's on
November Stn. It's from 6:00 to 8:00 P.M. and you know...I thought about it because I
thought we had a meeting, but our meeting's the next week, but I figured most members
would probably want to attend. (several talking) It's at ACT, and but...looks like the
Chamber is sponsoring it, um...with, uh...ICAD and P-1. So I can...if I still have this
email I can forward it to Marian to make sure she gets everybody a copy.
Hayek/ Any other Council invites, community events?
Higgins/ Um, Jeff Shipley contacted me earlier this evening and he wanted me to pass along this
invitation, um, Ron Paul will be speaking at the IMU, main lounge, Friday, October 29tH
Doors open at 7:15 and he begins speaking at 7:45. So, he wanted to encourage you to
attend.
Bailey/ And so isn't the Governor here tomorrow? (several talking) Are you going to that?
Hayek/ Yeah I was...but before we do that, is Jeff working for the Paul campaign?
Higgins/ Um, I kind of got that impression. I'm not exactly sure.
Hayek/ They sent him to Kentucky.
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Higgins/ Is that right?
Bailey/ Well I thought he wanted to...yeah, he said he wanted to.
Higgins/ He's very enthusiastic.
Champion/ He is about everything he's in favor of! Tell him thank you!
Hayek/ We got, I assume you've all heard the news about rail (several talking) uh, I got a call
from (mumbled) this afternoon (mumbled) tomorrow morning, will be at the Chamber at
10:00 with (mumbled) and others, um, and Council's welcome to attend that. It's sort of
a press conference (mumbled) rail announcement.
Bailey/ Seems like we need to get (mumbled) (several talking)
Hayek/ Anything else? Okay, upcoming or...uh, meeting schedule?
Meetin;; Schedule:
Bailey/ We'll have one in our next packet.
Hayek/ Okay. Thank you. Good discussion; I'll see you tomorrow.
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