HomeMy WebLinkAbout2012-09-04 TranscriptionSeptember 4, 2012 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 1
Council Present: Champion, Dickens, Dobyns, Hayek, Mims, Payne, Throgmorton
Staff Present: Markus, Dilkes, Laverman, Karr, Fruin, Davidson, Fosse, Moran, Bentley,
Hargadine, O'Brien, Dulek, Sandberg
Others Present: Uttermark, UISG
Planning and Zoning Items:
Hayek/ Go ahead and get started with the work session. Welcome, everyone, uh, to the
September 4 work session. First item is questions from Council regarding Planning and
Zoning items. Does anybody have any questions (noises on mic) or anything other than it
looks like 4c or 4e.
Throgmorton/ Don't know.
Hayek/ Okay.
Throgmorton/ Which one — 4c and what?
Hayek/ Well, um ... 4c is the ... the two acre rezoning on, uh, Highway 1 and Shirken Drive.
Throgmorton/ Uh -huh.
Hayek/ If there are any questions about that, that's gotta wait until the formal. Likewise the, um,
rezoning of the land on Benton, between George and Streb, that's the...
Throgmorton/ (mic feedback) Okay. (noises on mic)
Hayek/ But anything else is fair game for questions at this time. I ... I've been asked specifically
by staff if I could inquire if there are specific questions on the ... on the, uh, small wind
energy conversion item.
Champion/ I don't have any.
Hayek/ Depending on your questions, if any, there may be things they want to look into before
the formal.
Mims/ My question was only where the ... all the information came from and that was answered
in the memo so ... (laughing)
Champion/ Does anybody have a (mumbled) bring a pen.
Hayek/ Okay!
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Throgmorton/ Well, so, uh, with regard to the wind turbine thing.
Hayek/ Sure.
Throgmorton/ I just overheard Jeff saying one of the reasons he wanted to do that was because
he's conscious that there are other people who are more expert in wind turbine
technology, etc., than ... than he is, uh ... and so that just makes me want to know who
...who our staff has been connecting with and, um, you know, what kind of advice were
you getting from people who are expert in that kind of thing.
Davidson/ Yeah, the main ... the main source of information we used was the Des Moines area
metro ordinance, um, it...it includes several municipalities in the Des Moines metro area.
That was our main source, uh, of information and a lot of the information we used was
from that model.
Throgmorton/ Okay!
Hayek/ Any other questions for Jeff on that item? Any other P &Z questions? Okay. Uh, the
balance of the agenda, any questions regarding those items?
Agenda Items•
Champion/ Well I just have a question about the Historic Preservation designation of 518
Bowery. I couldn't find it!
Karr/ We're just setting a public hearing. Or you couldn't find 518?
Champion/ No!
Dickens / Where is it?
Champion/ That's my question!
Davidson/ Yeah, we're just setting the hearing, Connie, so there's no information.
Dickens/ (several talking) ...where's the house?
Karr/ The property.
Davidson/ Oh, where's the property? It's the ... it's the original, um, New Pioneer Co -Op.
Champion/ Oh, that's what I thought! Okay. All right.
Davidson/ (both talking)
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Champion/ I got it!
Dickens/ (mumbled)
Davidson/ Uh, is it between Dodge and...
Champion/ Gilbert!
Davidson/ Dodge and Gilbert. (several talking)
Dickens/ ...between Johnson and...
Champion/ Right, right, but I mean it's closer to ... closer to Gilbert than it is to ... okay. That
answers my question. Thank you.
Hayek/ Okay, balance of the agenda.
ITEM 8. CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE AMENDING TITLE 8, ENTITLED
"POLICE REGULATIONS," CHAPTER 5, ENTITLED
"MISCELLANEOUS OFFENSES," TO PROVIDE THAT "KEEPING A
DISORDERLY HOUSE" IS A MUNICIPAL INFRACTION AND TITLE
17, ENTITLED "BUILDING AND HOUSING," CHAPTER 5, ENTITLED
"HOUSING CODE," TO ADD ANOTHER BASIS FOR A RENTAL
PERMIT SANCTION. (FIRST CONSIDERATION
Throgmorton/ Yeah, I think I've a question about the disorderly house stuff.
Hayek/ It's Item 8.
Throgmorton/ Yeah, excuse me I ... get to my notes so I can see (mumbled) questions were. Uh,
let's see ... yeah, I ... I guess I want to, uh, admit that I, uh, have difficulty really tracking
the ... the core, uh, the essence of this particular ordinance. And it's because I don't know
the police terminology, and I ... I don't know the Housing Inspection terminology well
enough. So when I read, uh, the proposed sections 8(5) (person coughing) 8(5)c having
to do with simple misdemeanor, uh, and a municipal infraction punishable by a civil
penalty, I don't understand the difference. So I ... I need help there, and ... and a second
thing really isn't about me needing help. It's that I'm wondering if staff has considered,
um, initiating some kind of, um, public information effort. Maybe it's already happened
and I don't know about it. So that, uh ... this, uh, the process can be explained clearly and
in ordinary language, not legalese, so that, uh, renters understand what will happen if... if
they have a disorderly house and a police officer knocks on the door. You know, I ... I,
maybe that's already happened, but I think it's really important to be able to do that,
rather than rely on the news media or rely on people watching this show. So...
Hargadine/ On the first question, on simple, uh, misdemeanor, and Eleanor, jump in here if I'm
need correcting, but... the... that's the criminal citation and I think we left off with both
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the fines are about the same, you know, and we've checked into that and that's not
correct. It is the same if the maximum fine is asked for on the criminal side. Then
they're about the same. But, um, if you were to get the minimum fine from a judge, I
believe that's $50.
Dilkes/ 65.
Hargadine/ 65. Um, on the criminal side. The ... on the ... on the civil infraction side, it...it jumps
to $750.
Throgmorton/ So let's say that I happen to, uh, be a renter in a house along with several other
people and I'm having a party... somebody knocks at the door ... and we don't want to let
`em in. So ... I think we ... I need to be clear about what will happen then and also what
happens if in fact they open the door and find... see a police officer, and the police officer
...thinks, you know, believes that it ... there's this disorderly house, and maybe something
criminal is taking place inside it. Am I ... am I being dense? I ... I'm just trying to
understand how this works.
Dilkes/ Before... before you get to (several talking) I just want to do one more clarification on the
fine. Um, the criminal charge, um, is what we call an unscheduled charge and so it's up
to the discretion of the judge as to what they impose, and that can be between, uh, $65
and $625, okay? And that's a charge against an individual. The civil fine, the first time,
would be $750, but as the memo from Doug and Sue explains, at least as a matter of
course, the initial civil charge is going to be against all the tenants, not one against each
tenant. So the $750 would ... be against the wh ... the group.
Hargadine/ I believe you back to wh ... what if they knock on the door and don't want to answer
it. You know, in a best ... in a perfect world they'd say, `Who is it?' `It's the police,
please open the door.' And if they did ... if that were the case, you could, you know, be
uh ... uh, you could be issued a warning at that point. Uh, that happens all the time. The
factors that go into whether or not you get a warning or whether an arrest is going to be
made or the time of day. Did we find the noise or was there a complaint called in? If
there is a complaint, somethin's already been kept up, someone's already angry. That
typically is going to result in a citation. If we're driving down the middle of the street
and we hear it, and it's ... on a Friday or Saturday and it's still well before midnight, odds
...we could issue a ... a warning. There is ... it's totally within the discretion of the officer
and there are a lot of factors that go into is there a citation. It's not unlike being pulled
over for speed. There's discretion there as well. You can get a warning or you can get a
ticket. If they don't, um, open the door, if we knock — police — and they decide ... we're
not gonna open it, and we can hear giggling going on inside and `Be quiet, the police are
here!' Uh, at that point ... our intention is to leave a notice on the door that, um, we were
here; we had a complaint; urn ... the ... we would encourage the occupants to contact the
police, uh, hopefully that night. If we can't, if we don't get that call and, urn ... we don't
...we don't resolve the issue with a criminal citation, at that point we're going to turn it
over to Stan's office, uh, and Stan's office will be the one that issues the civil citation,
not ... not us, not the officer there that night.
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Dilkes/ I'd really urge you to look at the memo August 29, 2012, that's in your packet and the
bullet points ... the bullet points there. Chief has shortened the one about the HIS, turning
it over to HIS but it's more laid out in the memo.
Throgmorton/ Well of course I did read the memo, uh, I ... I just find it difficult to understand
exactly what happens, uh, that a ... when a police officer knocks on the door and when
...when the, uh, activities within the building constitute a criminal ... um, offense versus
something that would be a municipal infraction. Cause the consequences seem to be
quite different, as best I can tell.
Dilkes/ Right, and ... and there's really a very simple question... answer to that, and that is that
you cannot charge a group of people with a criminal offense. You have to identify an
individual, and so if the police cannot identify an individual, they cannot make a criminal
charge. The problem has been that that identification of an individual has been a pre-
requisite to getting the nuisance process started. And we don't want that to be a ... to be
an impediment any longer. And so we've got these two other mechanisms, by which we
can get the process started.
Throgmorton/ Okay. All right, so I ... I still think it'd be really good to have ... very clear,
ordinary language, uh ... um, messages sent out to inform, uh, the affected, likely affected
public how this will work.
Mims/ (several talking)
Hayek/ Go ahead!
Mims/ I was going to say I think the best way to do that is trying to coordinate with the
University through their, I mean, they can do mass emails to their students and stuff, and
through the Daily Iowan. A lot of the students read that. Those are...
Markus/ We'll take it up among staff (several talking)
Champion/ ...Daily Iowan ... was pretty incorrect in their editorial about the policy so it might be
good to write a letter from the City...
Hayek/ ...and I, I mean, I think that upfront education does occur. It comes from the City. It
comes from the University.
Champion/ Right.
Hayek/ And it's sent not only to incoming students through the University channels, but also to
the Neighborhood Associations and, um ... I mean, so that educational component is there
now and to the extent we adopt these changes, obviously that would have to be modified
to be consistent with that. You're right. I just think that there is ... it's my understanding
that there is a fair amount of...frontend education on these issues, um...
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Hargadine/ I think the most key part is it occurs between the landlords and the ... and the tenants.
That if you're going to rent from me and this ... and my apartment, these are the rules. If
the police show up and you get one of these, then... you... you're violating part of our
lease. So there is that education on the front end when they sign that lease.
Mims/ I have a couple other questions on that one, as well. One of `em I think is a typo in the
ordinance. It's on page 1...66. It would be, it said Section 1 Amendments and then #1,
goes down through it says, the section says, `Is amended by adding by deleting Section 5
in its entirety.'
Dilkes/ That's a typo.
Mims/ Okay.
Dilkes/ Yes.
Mims/ Then, down on #2, second, well I guess the first full paragraph, after #2, just for
clarification, it says on two or more separate occasions within a 12 -month period of time
there is a founded complaint against a tenant. That is supposed to be the same tenant,
right? I mean...
Dilkes/ No. No.
Mims/ Okay. So ... so you're telling me that if a group of students are in a house and they get a
disorderly charge in May and they move out, and another whole group moves in August
1St, and sometime in October they get a charge, then the charge back in May against a
totally different group is held against them.
Laverman/ No, but if one tenant out of the first group was cited the first time, and in May, and in
July ... at the end of July the second tenant in that first group was cited, that would count
as two offenses. At the ... at the time of a new lease with new tenants, it starts all over.
Mims/ Is that in the ordinance?
Laverman/ That's our policy. I don't know if that is in the ordinance.
Mims/ I guess I would think if we're going to say twice within 12 months that it should be clear
it starts over with a new lease with a new group of people.
Dilkes/ That...
Mims/ I mean...
Dilkes/ ...yeah and we ... we can look back at the ordinance and make sure that's clear, but this
is ... this is the same ... this language is used in multiple places in the ordinance. So it's
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just... Sue's noddin' at me back there. It's ... It's really just a ... we took the existing
language in the ordinance and we mirrored it for this new violation, um, and
because... because the whole purpose of the nuisance regulation is it's about that
relationship between the tenants and the landlords, and ... and the ... and their ability to
remedy the conditions of that property. So I ... I don't think there's been much confusion
about that issue, but we can certainly take a look at the ordinance and make sure.
Mims/ Thank you.
Markus/ Stan, while you're still up there, explain your meeting with landlords and how you (both
talking)
Laverman/ Yeah, right the ... Apartment Owners Association meets on a monthly basis, except
for December, July and August, and I attend those meetings regularly and share
information. Uh, and will be happy to talk about this. They're... they'll be welcomed to
hear that. Uh, I did meet, or attempt to meet, with University students last year in
Schamba Auditorium. Uh, one student showed up, um, so ... uh, it was maybe raining that
night but it was not a... a good turnout at all. Uh, when we go out to targeted
neighborhoods, we do leave flyers about are you ready to party, which covers, uh,
disorderly house, disorderly conduct, um, the information disclosure form, uh, that all
tenants are supposed to be signing at each lease, uh, covers that also, so ... we do get
information out there.
Mims/ Is there a good turnout of...of landlords and their management people at those monthly
meetings?
Laverman/ Uh, it's a select group, um... some of the bigger players are not there, um... some of
the bigger players are pretty good about getting this information out and knowing what
the information is, so, uh, Southgate's there, Keystone, um ... yeah, the mid -range and
then some of the smaller mom - and -pops show up.
Mims/ Thank you!
Dilkes/ Wasn't there also a more recent meeting requested by the Student Government?
Laverman/ Yeah, um ... I think that took place Thursday.
Fruin/ Yeah, we had, um, representatives from the Manager's office, Police, Legal, and HIS
there to meet with the Student Government Association, just to make sure they
understood what was going on here. They had a couple of questions after the first
reading so ... uh, I didn't personally attend that, but I ... I think it was a productive
meeting.
Champion/ So we've done an excellent job of getting information out! That's great!
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Throgmorton/ (mumbled) landlord meetings typically involve owners of what are
colloq... colloquially known as party houses?
Laverman/ Yes. Yes, there's... there's landlords that, um, have houses that, you know, have
disorderly houses, uh, that have had ... come in for the second, uh, citation in the year so
they're familiar with the process, and yes!
Throgmorton/ Excellent!
Hayek/ We have ... let me ... in connection with the rental permit information is provided to the
landlord about the nuisance process, etc. So that information does get to every landlord
who's got a permit.
Laverman/ Yes.
Hayek/ I believe... yeah, so ... okay, any other questions on that item? Thanks, Stan. Any other
questions on other agenda items?
ITEM 7. PLANS, SPECIFICATIONS, FORM OF CONTRACT, AND ESTIMATE
OF COST FOR THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE NORMANDY DRIVE
RESTORATION PROJECT, ESTABLISHING AMOUNT OF BID
SECURITY TO ACCOMPANY EACH BID, DIRECTING THE CITY
CLERK TO PUBLISH NOTICE TO BIDDERS, AND FIXING TIME AND
PLACE FOR RECEIPT OF BIDS.
Dobyns/ A request on Item 8, that's um ... sorry, Item 7, this is regarding extension of Normandy
Drive to Lower City Park. Um, at the point that that comes forth with discussion, um,
I'm just curious. I suppose there'll be some discussion, Geoff, about our... our... you
know, how the roads going to be, you know, what trees will be, um, at risk as the road
goes through. I don't need that (mumbled)
Moran/ Well we'll do an update for you before that, when Matt opens up the public hearing I'll
do an update.
Dobyns/ Okay.
Moran/ And then you can hear from the public and we can go through questions and answers.
Dobyns/ Great! Thank you.
Throgmorton/ Uh, with regard to the outdoor cafe, uh, ordinance and resolution.
Champion/ That's on our... agenda.
Hayek/ Well that's, uh ... that's the next bullet point.
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Throgmorton/ Oh, I'm sorry.
Hayek/ Yeah, let's just see if there's anything else on any other agenda items. It's always
confusing cause we pull one or two off (several talking and laughing) Going once...
going twice, okay. Sidewalk cafes. Um, do we want to get an update before ... or do we
need...
Sidewalk Cafes:
ITEM 10. CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE AMENDING TITLE 10, ENTITLED USE
OF PUBLIC WAYS AND PROPERTY," CHAPTER 3, ENTITLED,
"COMMERCIAL USE OF SIDEWALKS," SECTION 3, ENTITLED "USE
FOR SIDEWALK CAFES," TO REGULATE SIDEWALK CAFES
PRIMARILY BY POLICY AND ADMINISTRATIVE RULES. (PASS AND
ADOPT)
ITEM 11. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION ADOPTING A POLICY FOR USE OF
PUBLIC RIGHT -OF -WAY FOR SIDEWALK CAFES AND RESCINDING
RESOLUTION NO. 07-227.
Fosse/ Yes!
Hayek/ Are you here to give us an update?
Fosse/ Yes, yes I am. We're going to do three things tonight. Uh, first thing we're going to give
you an update on the refinements to the resolution that you have in front of you tonight,
uh, then we'll brief you on the public outreach and feedback that we've got since our last
meeting, and then we'll answer any questions that you have to prepare you for your vote
tonight. So, to lead off, the ... the refinements, uh, are only on the resolution. The
ordinance is exactly the same as the first two readings. Uh, the two changes on the
resolution both relate to the planters, and one has to do with the proximity of the planter
to the property line extended. We've changed them from 8 -feet to 10 -feet, and then also,
uh, has to do with the consent requirement for adjoining property owners, if your use of
the planter extends in front of an adjoining property owner, consent is required. So that's
a ... that's a change that we put in there. Any questions on those two changes? Okay.
Uh, Geoff will give us an update on the outreach and the feedback we've received on
that.
Fruin/ Yes, so what we did, uh, after the last meeting is we put together, uh, a one or two -page
summary of the changes and sent that to the Downtown District, along with the full, uh,
policy that's before you for people to review. The District took that information and sent
out, uh, an email to their membership, which I understand is roughly 250 people. Uh,
they received very few responses to that request for information, so what they did is they
took that, they sent it out, and they had a list of five or six questions and ... and uh,
representatives of the District are here if you want to, uh, hear it straight from them, but
generally speaking the feedback that they received was I think 3 to 4...3 to 4 to 1 in favor
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of the, uh, changes. Uh, however, they only received roughly 5% response rate, so it
wasn't a great response rate. Um, in addition to that, you have a couple of items of
correspondence in your packet, um, from businesses and I think a mobile vending
advocate that, uh ... um, have commented on either changes or ... or recommendations to
the policy as it's currently drafted. So, again, the members of the District are here. They
can come up and speak to it, but um, the ... the feedback they got was positive, which led
them in their full board meeting to vote in favor, uh, of... of this policy before you
tonight.
Fosse/ With that we'll open it up to any questions you have. I think, Jim, you have one?
Throgmorton/ If I could just see what's on my computer it'd be good! I have to keep changing
glasses — sorry! (laughter) Uh, well, I'm really thrilled to hear about the outreach. Uh,
as you know from prior meetings, for me that's very important, and uh, counts a lot. Uh,
I ... I'm wondering whether, uh, staff had a chance to read Anthony Browne and Rodney
Anderson and others' submittals, and think about `em, and consider whether they could
be in some fashion incorporated into the resolution that we'll be considering tonight. In
other words ... well, I'll just leave it at that. So, have they been read and considered?
Markus/ I would say yes they have. Uh, the one issue is whether consent, uh, or even moving
beyond the property, um, the property that the restaurant is ... is housed in, moving
beyond the property lines. Um,. consent is built in. The community I came from had
more severe restrictions than that, but ... I think that's a policy decision ultimately as to
what this Council feels is appropriate. I think you started off with the very early versions
of the, uh, outdoor dining on the mall with properties that moved beyond their property
lines, and I think that there seems to be some historic connection to that now to change
that. Um ... personally I would say ... I believe that it should be confined within those
property lines, typically that's ... I think that there's a ... a strong connection for doing that,
uh, with the property, unless there's some unusual extenuating circumstances, and off the
bat I can't think of those right now but ... urn ... so I...that was the issue I contemplated
quite a bit and I think consent is probably, um, we got into that whole consent discussion
and not... and obviously we've extended it into the, uh, planter situation as well so I think
that those are appropriate considerations, um, for the planters, just like they are for the
street cafes. But ... other than that...
Dickens/ Has there been consideration to split the parking, putting it in the parking and the
planters? As a separate... separate issue?
Fosse/ Address one tonight and not the other?
Dickens/ Yes.
Fosse/ That's certainly your discretion this evening.
Champion/ I'm not willing to split them, but I'm willing to vote on them, if we can vote on them
in two stages.
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Payne/ I like that idea too, Terry. I ... I ... the ... the cafes and the planters, I have no qualms about
how that's written. I do have some qualms about how the ones in the street is written. I
just have this idea that we should have more equal opportunity. I do like the property line
extended, and I would like ... I guess personally I would like that to be in there, and I
think that that would provide more equal opportunity to others.
Hayek/ How do you, uh ... I understand the building line extended approach. I think that's the
vernacular for the street cafes. How do you do that with a planter? (several talking)
planters...
Payne/ ...why I wanted to take it apart, so that ... because I don't ... with the planters I don't know
that you could, but with the street — yes.
Hayek/ Yeah. Cause I guess circling back to Tom's, uh, position on it, um ... the ... what's your
feeling on the planters, because those show up in random...
Markus/ You know, I have no prior experience with that planter situation, and ... and so I ... I just
have trouble, you know, having these things too far away, and I think the distance is an
accommodation to the ... the circumstance, again. You know, initially it was 8 -feet
because the initial measurement we took was 8 -feet. We went out and ... and clarified,
and it was 10 -feet, so we changed the number to accommodate it. Um... so it ... there was
nothing scientific about selecting that number, uh, to begin with. It was ... that was the
physical determination of that particular site, and so that's how that number was derived.
And usually I don't ... I wouldn't go about drafting ordinances, uh, to fit circumstances. I
think that there ... there should be some logic as to what those distances are. 10 -feet, 8-
feet, that doesn't make a whole lot of difference. I think there's, no know, when you get
into that street argument, it makes a lot of sense to keep it with the boundaries. Now
that's gonna ... that's going to peeve certain individuals that, you know, want to go
beyond that, but I think it does end up allowing more, um ... opportunities for fellow
business persons to, uh, take advantage of that situation, especially when we're limiting
the amount of those dining opportunities to 30% of the parking, uh, on a particular street.
So...
Hayek/ And I ... I get the logic of that and ... and I agree that there is some appeal to that with
respect to the street cafes. How do you do that though and be consistent with ... with
planters? I mean, it's... there's... it's an apples and oranges set of scenarios.
Markus/ I'm not necessarily recommending that it should be consistent.
Hayek/ Yeah.
Markus/ I think the planters is ... is a very different circumstance.
Payne/ I mean, alls it would take is removing a few words out of the ... out of it. You just leave
`in a planter' there.
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Champion/ I'm not willing to ... I'm willing to have permission of any adjacent properties. I
think that seems logical. I'm not willing to go beyond that. Um ... I just think getting
people to agree to something, like I said before, it's almost impossible. So I'd like to be
able to try both of these things and the only way to try it is to make it possible for it to
happen. And if you're going to limit the cafe to the area of the building, it's not going to
be big enough to be profitable. I mean, these things are not cheap — anywhere from
$20,000 to $30,000. 1 mean, that's a lot of money. Well, it's a lot of money to me! It
might not be to you, but I... it is to me, and I think to make this possible, and to make it
fun and to try something new, you're not going to get everybody to agree. So I just say
let's try it! You can always change it! I mean, these things aren't written in stone.
Payne/ No, but if somebody does spend $30,000 to build something that's big and then we said
no, we're going to narrow it down (both talking)
Champion/ ...they're going to have their three years. Then if we see it's a problem, you can
change the ordinance. But ... I've heard a lot of enthuse... isn't that true?
Markus/ The initial...
Dilkes/ The three years is ... with respect to others who want to use the space. The City can, after
one year, decide we're not going to do this.
Champion/ Oh! Right, we can always say we're not going to do it. Right. Right.
Fosse/ One point I want to throw in on the consent is we've spent a lot of time on the planters,
talking about consent of neighbors. It also requires the consent of the City, and there may
be planters downtown where we don't want to give the consent for a sidewalk cafe cause
we view the value of the planter functioning as a planter, an asset for our downtown.
And since it's an administrative approval, you may hear about those decisions that are
made in the future and I want you to understand that, at this point in the process.
Champion/ So every planter will not become a cafe.
Fosse/ Not necessarily.
Champion/ Right, right! I mean, some of `em... a cafe is going to be a great improvement. Other
ones are actually very nice.
Fosse/ That's... that's accurate!
Throgmorton/ I ... I guess I'd like to say, uh, I'm uncertain about what the consequences of, uh,
adoption of the new policy will be, but I'm comfortable with the uncertainty and I think
it'd be better to, uh, act now, especially since we've reached out, tried to get advice from,
uh, from affected business owners and so on downtown, uh, so I ... I'm not going to sweat
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the details. Uh, I ... I think it could well be; we'll have to revisit this in another year or
two and modify it because certain things aren't workin'. If that's the case, let's do it.
Champion/ (mumbled)
Mims/ I have a question, and again, there was ... there was a lot in here and some of it repeated
and I just want to make sure I'm not missing something, but if we approve this, how are
the first ones going to be issued? Not by lottery, just on a first -come, first -serve basis?
Fosse/ That's the ... that's our plan now, yep. Well, let me take that back! If we get, uh, more
requests than there are for space in a given block, and we're talking about parking spaces
now, we'll probably bring the ... the applicants in and talk it through to see if there are
opportunities for them to work together, uh, for a common solution that's good for them.
That'd be the first thing we'd do.
Mims / And what kind of a timeframe are you thinking that you'd be giving them to get an
application in?
Fosse/ Probably, uh, a week or so after the adoption. You know, we've got some that are ready
to go right now.
Mims / Right.
Fosse/ Others that ... that are talking about it but have not gone very far yet.
Dobyns/ And if they're later than a week, they lose out on the ability to collaborate.
Champion/ No, you can always collaborate! That would be between those two people.
Dobyns/ Well, I'm just ... if they are ... if they get word of it, more than a week after adoption
(both talking) and there's already... there's already more than, you know, like a
streetscape, there's more than 30% that is already taken up by people who have already
jumped in the first week. Then those people are just out of luck. For up to three years,
definitely one year.
Fosse/ Well the words out to everybody now, as... as Geoff pointed out that (both talking)
Dobyns/ ...meeting wasn't many. But...
Hayek/ Hm?
Dobyns/ Uh, what 5 %, Geoff, attended the meeting?
Markus/ No (several talking)
Fruin/ Responded to an email survey.
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Payne / So...so, I mean, is it possible to split them apart so that we vote on the ... ones in the
planters separately from the ones in the street? That was your question, right, Terry?
Dilkes/ (several responding) Yes! You can just, I mean, when the item comes up, you can, um,
put the whole thing on the table, somebody can offer an amendment if they want to
remove the planters and they want to remove the streets and we see how that amendment
goes and ... take it from there.
Hayek/ Well, I think ... I mean, we should ... we should probably get it ... take the temperature of
folks right now.
Champion/ Well I'm going to support both of `em.
Throgmorton/ Me too.
Hayek/ And let me ... let me go, harken back to Susan's question about, uh, process here. If... if
we adopt this, um, does that mean that everybody gets an opportunity for let's just say
seven days to use your figure.
Fosse/ Well, let's agree on that tonight. Let's ... let's decide what we want to give them, because
we have some sets of plans that are already on our desk, waiting for approval, and others
where people have said they're kind of interested in it, but ... but we don't know, so let's
...let's decide that.
Hayek/ And if, to use your scenario, if we give this let's say seven days and multiple parties
come in on a given street, with applications, and you've got more than 30 %, um, you
would then ... bring people together to see if you can work something out, and if we can't
work something out, what next. (noises on mic) (several talking) Do we ... do we draw
straws, you know...
Dickens/ That's your lottery.
Dilkes/ I think at that point we'd have to ... we'd have to go to the lottery, I mean...
Fruin/ Yeah, we certainly could do that. I think, um, although there are some people talking
about it, we certainly haven't had the inquiries like Bo James and Micky's right now.
Those are ... those are two developed plans, at a near- ready -to -go stage, assuming things
...things progress here. There may be some others thinking about it and there's some
others that certainly haven't expressed an interest, but nobody that's come forward with
really design questions or renderings or anything like that, and given the short period left
in this, um, season, I ... I personally I'd be surprised if we got other applications, but if
after the seven days we ... we had reason to, we could do a lottery.
Markus/ Which argues against extending the time much further because they're all trying to get
in and take advantage (mumbled) good weather and football season we have left, so ... if
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you're contemplating extending that period, I wouldn't recommend that. We ought to
give them the seven days (mumbled)
Hayek/ Yeah, and I mean, I know that ... that the Downtown District is ... is, has its sea legs, it's
operational, and it...it gets the information out to its member, uh, membership, um, so
I'm not worried about people, uh, downtown knowing about this opportunity.
Champion/ They know about it! (laughing)
Hayek/ Um ... but I think the one question we need to resolve separate and apart from the
ext ... you know, can you go beyond your property line, is this front -end equity, the ... the,
a lottery from the get -go, if... if that's required.
Fosse/ Uh -huh.
Hayek/ Because of the volume of... of applications.
Dilkes/ Another option would be, and I'm just putting this on the table, would be to say we're
not going to do this this fall. And ... and that we're going ... we're going to start that
application process in the spring. (several responding) I know that ... that would be
upsetting to some people, but I ... that would be another way to do it, if...if your primary
concern is the equity issue. (several talking)
Hayek/ Well, mine isn't if we have that kind of approach that we just discussed.
Mims/ Yeah, my only concern with that is seven days, I mean, people have been hearing about it,
but a lot of people aren't necessarily in a position to put all the time and money investing
in, even in the plans, until they're sure this is there and then seven days sure isn't much to
get something in a format that they might feel comfortable going to the City, so ... I mean.
Dilkes/ I mean, frankly staff has not spent a lot of time talking about this equity issue at the
beginning of the process. We have had two proposals — one for a planter, one for the
street. We assumed those were going to go forward, if you allowed them to, and then
... and we drafted it thinking of what happens next year.
Mims / Right. Okay, and I think that would be fine, except for the issue that you've got people
that are, in doing this, are going to be investing a lot of money, so they're doing it with
the anticipation that if they don't make some huge mistakes, they're going to have that
for three years. I mean, to get their investment back, which means then people who are
...weren't in on the front -end of this idea and already have their kind of plans put
together, in a way have a ... the potential to be locked out for three years, and I'm not
comfortable with that.
Champion/ It doesn't bother me because these ideas came from these particular people, who had
the idea, and I also think it takes longer than, I don't know how long it takes to get an
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architect and drawings and get things approved but it's probably quite a while. You can't
just say this is what I'm going to do. I don't know.
Hayek/ Perhaps, but we're not talking about plans for, you know, an Apollo mission here.
Champion/ Well, I don't know! We might be!
Hayek/ Uh... some outdoor seating, you know.
Champion/ Well, I'm going to support the ordinance as it's written, then I think we (both talking)
Throgmorton/ ...grander horizons! (laughter)
Dickens/ Well, and then there's the case of there's a loading zones on the other side, and those
...and any place on that side is blocked out because of the loading zone. I ... thought we
had talked about possibly the loading zones having some options but that never came to
fruition so ... and why is the loading zone on that side? Why isn't it on the other side?
And ... it becomes a matter of fairness there too.
Fosse/ We ... we ... (both talking)
Champion/ Well life is not fair!
Dickens/ Oh I know that!
Champion/I mean there are (several talking) that have great outdoor seating behind their
building. We don't say you can't have it because nobody else has it! You know, or
people have built in sidewalk cafes in their building. We don't say you can't do that
(both talking)
Dickens/ ...discussion about ... it seems like the whole block of Washington, Dubuque, Iowa —
that whole block is almost 80% loading zone.
Fosse/ Yeah.
Dickens / And it sits empty after the morning. I don't know if there's... some way to get parking
back in there.
Fosse/ Well, the first part of the question is why do we allow the cafes in regular parking and not
loading zones, and the answer to that is that there's an alternative to parking — you can go
into the ramp and park there, where as the loading zone, you really don't have any other
alternatives. Uh, as ... as far as how the loading zones evolved to where they're at, Chris
is here tonight to talk about that. I know it's been a ... a long process to get there, and if
you'd like those details, he's ready!
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Dickens/ Well, I just want to know, is ... since the road has changed, the directional change, has
that affected how the ... the loading zones are used?
O'Brien/ With reference to the changing Washington Street, we, you know, that hasn't exactly
been ... it hasn't been a long enough term for us to decide what ... what's changed there.
What we did do is displace even more, uh, commercial loading areas than we had prior,
without adding any zones, which was the primary reason why, I believe it was a little
over two years ago, we ... we changed Dubuque Street. One to remove all of the vehicles
from the center lane. That was, I know, a big sticking point with a lot of people. The
second was to, if you're going to remove them from certain areas, you have to have a
place for the commercial vehicles to go, and ... and the determination was to, uh, place
them there. Now there have been discussions of different alternatives to possibly, uh,
open up those spaces into something else, and that's something we're still in ... that are
still potentially in the works, but right now due to the scarcity of the ... the amount of
loading zones we have in downtown, and especially commercial, as we try to balance the
15- minute loading zone for the person coming downtown to do, you know, really short-
term business that ... that do not want to park at a meter, or for those doing commercial
business, uh, deliveries of food, beverage, other goods, um ... they're scarce as far as the
number of...of spaces that we have.
Dickens/ Cause I hear from a lot of the, you know, FedEx, UPS, those guys that are always
trying to find a commercial and they're always filled with cars, 15- minute (both talking)
Champion/ ...they're not just for commercial.
Dickens/ (both talking) ...some that are just (both talking)
O'Brien/ Yeah, we have some that are designated specifically and ... and some that are open to
either, um, and maintaining that mix we felt is, uh, essential..to having that balance of
different opportunities for people downtown.
Champion/ Chris, the 15- minute ones, there's one over by ... MidWest One Bank. That's a, is
that ... that's a 15- minute free, kind of (both talking)
O'Brien/ So is the one across the street.
Champion/ That one across the street, and then the one on Dubuque Street.
O'Brien/ Correct.
Champion/ And is there one also on...
O'Brien/ Clinton Street.
Champion/ ... Clinton Street?
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O'Brien/ That's correct.
Champion/ Those are all kind of 15- minute, anybody can park, and the turnover is really rapid.
O'Brien/ Correct. Those are chalked, just like alleys is, as far as how often we chalk those and...
Dickens/ One other question that's...
O'Brien/ Yep!
Dickens/ ...kind of related to it. We've lost four other spaces because of the Zipcars. Now is
there a reason they're on the street, taking metered parking out, that they couldn't be put
in the ramps, right in the front there, or was there...
O'Brien/ I think initially what we wanted to do was make sure they were in high profile spaces
so they're highly visible to get the program going. Think that will be reevaluated as we
get further into the program.
Dickens/ Okay. That's ... I've had people ask me.
Payne/ Like in a week! (laughter)
Markus/ But remember, those Zipcars take a lot of pressure off parking.
O'Brien/ Yeah, the... ultimately if it's successful what you hope is that those will replace the
need for ... for vehicles on the street and for, urn ... for those needing parking places and,
like I said, Zipcar's done a study of one of...one Zipcar for 15 cars on the street and
hopefully we get to that point.
Payne/ But the Zipcar isn't taking the parking pressure away from where they're parked.
They're taking it away from probably the neighborhood, because somebody isn't
bringing their car to town cause they can use a Zipcar. I mean, I wouldn't... somebody
isn't going to use a Zipcar to drive downtown!
O'Brien/ No, but somebody might take transit, who prior to took a ... brought their car downtown.
Dickens/ I've just heard people, you know, you hear complaints (both talking)
O'Brien/ It's a change. We knew ... we knew that there would be ... that those would come up and
we felt for the short -term while we try to launch this program that making sure they're
highly visible and out where everyone could see them was, uh, a critical part of us
launching that program.
Dickens/ Okay. Thanks!
O'Brien/ Uh -huh.
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Dobyns/ Susan, I had a clarification question with what you said, is ... what you said, would that
recommend any change in language in the proposed resolution?
Mims / Am I recommending any (both talking)
Dobyns/ No, no, I mean in terms of what, uh, what you were saying, in terms of, A ... being
concerned about, making sure everybody was on board with it, I mean ... were you
recommending any language changes to the ordinance as far as separating the, uh,
planters from the on- street cafe?
Mims/ Well I think ... I'm in favor of going with building (several talking) lines.
Dobyns/ Right. Okay.
Mims/ Um ... which obviously is for the parking, and I'm ... I'm concerned with the short
timeframe other businesses have to ... to put plans out there for approval, if we start this
this fall.
Dobyns/ Cause I'm concerned too because there's a difference between talking about it, but
when it really becomes law ... then all of a sudden people start to pay attention, um... and
you know as soon as we adopt it, that's when the clock starts, and I'm just concerned that
people will lose out on the ability, because that 30 %, uh, I mean once you ... let's say
everybody jumps in and you're a week late, I mean, you could be out for three years and
there are other people who, I mean, just because of where they're establishment is, they
didn't really have a ... their property line doesn't give them an opportunity, um, like if
they're on a corner. But there's an opportunity to collaborate with somebody else down
the street, possibly. Um, you know, with that $20,000 to $30,000, and I'm just, you
know, it is kind of complicated.
Mims/ Uh -huh.
Dobyns/ Um ... and, but I don't want to, you know, just because it's ... you know, I don't want to
make it the Apollo mission, but I'd like to adopt it, but I'm a little bit concerned about the
time. When I was listening to you I didn't hear any specific recommendations about...
other than staff, I mean, you just threw out a week.
Fosse/ Eleanor's very accurate when she said that we've not spent a lot of time contemplating
this, because we have ... we have two firm proposals on the table. We ... we don't have a
sense from anybody else that they want to move yet this fall. So that's really how we've
been proceeding. So whatever direction you give us tonight we'll go with ... there.
Mims/ I'll tell you what my inclination is. Connie's not going to like me!
Champion/ I won't!
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Mims/ My inclination (both talking and laughing) like my idea. My inclination is to ... defer this
to give us a little more time to work on it, with the idea that we would get it done in the
next month or two with the implementation for the spring.
Dobyns/ Not the planters, but just the on- street.
Mims/ Right! The on- street. I'm fine with the planters, but I ... I do think there's enough issues
with the on- street that I am not comfortable jumping into it so that people can have six
weeks or eight weeks this fall, and possibly to the long -term detriment of other
businesses.
Dobyns/ And that's where I am too.
Mims/ And ... and where I differ a little bit with Connie on part of this is I agree that certain
people came up with the idea, and if you're just talking head -to -head business
competition, I would agree with you, but we're talking about giving them access to public
right -of -way. And I think that takes it to a different level in terms of fairness, uh, that we
have to look at between the businesses.
Dobyns/ Yeah. Thank you, that's what I was kind of...
Hayek/ So let's... let's... and as an aside, it might strike some as funny that we're spending so
much time on an issue like this, but as is always the case, there's a hot - button issue that
seems minor and causes a big blow up and that's ... local politics (laughter) so ... here we
are talking about cafes ad nauseam, but uh, nevertheless, we have a decision to make and
uh, I mean, it strikes me that people are ... seem to be on board with the planters issue,
um, and so we ... we, let's take our temperature, uh, as to the other issue, and I'm sensing
one, two, three, maybe four people against ... who are not comfortable with proceeding at
least with how the on- street is phrased, and potentially at all at this time.
Champion/ Who is that?
Hayek/ One, two, three, four.
Champion/ Oh!
Mims/ I mean, I want to do it, it's not that I (both talking)
Dobyns/ I'm comfortable with the language. I'm just comfortable with the...
Payne/ Yep, I'm totally with you.
Dobyns/ The speed of it!
Hayek/ Okay. So that's four people inter ... who are interested in deferral of...
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Dobyns/ Just deferral, yeah.
Hayek/ ...okay, which ... which means we're not doing this til next spring, if at all.
Throgmorton/ The parking part.
Dobyns/ The parking part.
Hayek/ Right.
Fosse/ If...I'm sorry ... if we proceed with the planters only tonight, do you want that one week
window before we issue our first permit? Or ... go sooner than that if they're ready?
Dickens/ I think you (both talking)
Hayek/ I think you have ... I think the lottery's important, if it's ... if it's triggered!
Fosse/ Uh -huh.
Hayek/ Um, otherwise you start off on this, you know ... you haven't given everyone a fair shake.
I understand that some people may be sitting back and then when this hits the paper,
think, ah -ha, I could do the same thing, and have to scramble to get in within a week but
the fact is if you're downtown you've known about this since mid - summer and ... you
know.
Fosse / Okay.
Hayek/ I don't know, do I speak for others?
Payne/ Yeah, I think it gives people at least some equal opportunity.
Mims/ They're going to have to scramble but...
Dobyns/ One week for the planters.
Throgmorton/ Sounds like the votes are there for ... pulling the parking.
Payne/ So one of us just will need to make a ... a motion to amend to remove the street cafes from
the planters (several talking)
Karr/ Simply delete the ... the parking space cafes because you want to proceed with the sidewalk
cafes and the planters.
Payne/ So can we make, just make a motion — one motion then or would it have to be two?
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Dilkes/ You can make one motion by saying you move the resolution with the removal of the
street cafes and ... a lottery system for the planters if necessary.
Throgmorton/ Where does the deferral part get in?
Mims/ (several talking) ...put it back on our agenda.
Hayek/ Just wouldn't take action on it and put it back on our work session agenda for a future
date.
Champion/ I don't like this.
Mims/ I knew you wouldn't.
Champion/ It's okay. It won't keep me awake. (laughter)
Dobyns/ It'll happen.
Mims/ I agree. I think it'll happen too, Rick, I mean, I want it to happen. I just am not quite
comfortable with where we're at with it, the details.
Hayek/ Okay.
Fosse/ Got what you need?
Hayek/ You clear, Rick?
Fosse/ Yes, thank you! And by the way, that's IP3 from, yeah, from the 23`d.
City Funded Event — Funding Application Process (03 of 8/23/12):
Fruin/ I jump right in; give you a quick overview. Uh, we're getting' ready to, uh, initiate the
budget process again and um, as we do with this every year, we'll look at the process a
little bit and this is an item that we had flagged from ... from last year's process. As you'll
recall, you sit through multiple budget work sessions to ... to go through different aspects
of the budget. One of those work sessions was dedicated solely to City- sponsored events
and board and commission reports. So you'd spend a couple hours on that and ... and
when we look at that kind of in a big picture view, we see the Council dedicating a lot of
time to a very, very small percentage of the budget and we think that, uh, we can do some
retooling here to take some of this to the administrative side, which will allow you more
time and energy to focus on the bigger picture items in the budget and some of the bigger
dollar, um, items in the budget. So uh, we certainly don't want to cut off any of the
public input opportunities. What we're suggesting is that the board and commission
reports would then be combined with the staff, uh, budget reports. So if a board and
commission wants to approach the Council with their thoughts on a budget, they would
so at the same time their counterpart, uh, department. So I think the example I gave was
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Historic Preservation could come and talk during the planning budget, or the parks
commission could come talk during the parks budget, which is already a separately
scheduled work session. For the City- sponsored events, again, last year this was, uh,
roughly $106,000 worth of funding allocation. Uh, we have requests of $168,000. The
vast majority of that goes to two places — Summer of the Arts and the fireworks. So what
we're suggesting is that staff 11, um, work with Summer of the Arts, um, and kind of vet
their proposal and ... and propose to you a specific amount, um, along with all the other
budget recommendations that you can review. We'll do the same with fireworks. That
accoiunts for, again, the most significant percent of these. For the other events that are
seeking funding, we would do one of two things. If it's a larger, uh, I would say cultural
type of event, a music festival, um, something along those lines, we would uh, have them
fill out an application, as they currently do. Staff would vet those through an internal
committee, and we would provide some funding recommend... recommendations, uh, to
you. So the ... this would come to you at two times. First the budget proposal would have
a bottom line amount, say $15420,000 allocated to these cultural problems, or cultural
um ... uh, festivals and events. Uh ... we would then come back at a separate meeting with
our recommendations on how to divvy up that ... that line, so it'd be a resolution on how
to, uh, divvy up those funds. Same process that they go through now, except the sales
pitch would be to staff and not to Council. At that meeting though, those ... those
organizations certainly could come before you and ... and uh, you know, argue for or
against the funding recommendations. And then there's the ... the third category would be
very small sponsorships. We have a number of folks that are just seeking a couple
hundred dollars. The bike to week work, the ADA celebration, those types of events that
just want a couple hundred dollars and we think ... we wouldn't even have them fill out an
application. We would take, uh, requests in our office. You would approve a ... a funding
amount for the ... for the year, and we would use dis ... our own discretion on ... on whether
to sponsor those types of events and ... that's kind of a three- tiered process to, uh, um...
streamlining I supposed the ... the City- sponsored events and again, the ... the big picture
though here is to get your time more focused on ... on other parts of the budget. How do
you folks feel about that?
Dobyns/ I'm very supportive of it. I remember the conversation, I thought it was more tactical,
less strategic level that was unusual, um, for us, plus it keeps us from defending things
randomly, I mean, I recall one of us actually wanted to defend the fireworks, I mean, my
goodness (laughter) We've gotta keep (several talking) I have no idea, Mr. Throgmorton
(laughter) we have to keep those sorts of things from happening (laughing)
Hayek/ No idea but he's wearing a green tie! (laughter)
Mims/ Well I think it makes sense and... and does give us the time to focus on the bigger picture,
but as addressed in the memo, and I agree entirely that it's important that we're not
cutting off the opportunity for these organizations to, you know, come before Council.
Dickens/ Lobby!
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Mims/ Yeah, and lobby if they feel that staff hasn't, you know, heard them the way they would
like to be heard, so we're not ... certainly not, uh, removing that opportunity.
Champion/ I ... I'm also in favor ... I might not be in favor of it if we had a little more money, but
the problem is we're not going to have a whole lot more money, and we already have
major things that we know we have to fund, or we're willing to fund or we want to fund,
however you want to say it. But if it comes a time where there's a lottery, we (mumbled)
a lottery ticket (laughing) this money, then I think when we add new things that need
more money, then I would probably like to have a say in it. I mean, I think there are
some things we've funded that we've ... have really turned out to be great! And they
started out small. Um, but so yeah, I'm in favor of it. I'm willing to concede a little bit
of my power! (laughter)
Hayek/ Well I think this (both talking) I think this addresses a, uh, what I would call a historic
flaw in our budget process, which is we go through this, you know, this ... this massive set
of numbers, big dollar amounts, important projects, and then the process grinds to a halt
over ... over a tiny bucket of...of dollars, that matter greatly to a number of people and ins
...organizations around town, but in the ... but relative to the significance of the budget we
pass, and the priorities we establish, uh, are... are insignificant and so I think this helps
with that and ... and allows us to focus on the bigger issues.
Payne/ Totally agree!
Hayek/ So thanks for ... for bringing that forward, staff. Okay! Uh ... info packet, discussion, we
have two. First is August 23`d.
Throgmorton/ When ... when's the information software being discussed? Isn't that on the work
session?
Agenda Item (cont.):
Hayek/ Well that's ... no, it's an agenda item, so if you want to circle back to that and you have a
question, we can certainly answer that.
Throgmorton/ Sorry!
Markus/ We can address it now. If you'd like.
Hayek/ Sure. Kevin's here.
Throgmorton/ I don't have any big questions to ask. I just ... made an error in entering
information here.
Dickens / Is there safeguards with this one? (laughter) Compared to the other? That would be
the big question. Is that ... we seem to be hearing about that.
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ITEM 12. CONSIDER A RESOLUTION AUTHORIZING THE AWARD OF A
CONTRACT TO TYLER TECHNOLOGIES, INC., FOR FINANCIAL,
HUMAN RESOURCES, PAYROLL AND UTILITY CUSTOMER
INFORMATION SOFTWARE.
O'Malley/ Good evening! If there are (laughter) there are never any safeguards, but we do have
in this a, uh, performance bond we're purchasing. So the, it's going to cost us $18,000
but it's so essentially we're paying for that in the price and so that'll guarantee the
performance either at the software company ... by the way, this is a publicly traded
software company so it's on the, I believe it's on the New York Stock Exchange. So it's
got many customers, not just municipal customers, but uh, not just municipal software.
They also do police, fire, counties, and state software.
Markus / And the vetting was different this time as well.
O'Malley/ Yes, the vetting ... well, the whole process started out different. Last time we had a...
an RFP that was, uh, created by a consultant, by a former City Manager, from the City
Manager, and we had to, uh, pretty much participate with that, and that left a lot of holes
in our requirements and it got down to after that City Manager left, that got down to, uh,
just a low bid and the low bid was about $450,000 less than the next one so we went
through the process... pretty much the same process of demos, uh, requirement showing,
and uh, unfortunately shortly after we sign a contract, uh, the company ran out of money
so...
Dobyns/ Thank you.
O'Malley / Any other questions?
Hayek/ Um...
Markus/ I don't have any friendships with this (mumbled) (laughter)
Hayek/ I... go ahead, Eleanor.
Dilkes/ I think one significant thing here is that during the negotiations, there was a, um,
significant attempt to avoid paying as much money up front as we could. So the money
for services are always going to be paid in arrears, we get the services, and that's about
60% of the...
O'Malley/ That's correct!
Dilkes/ ...of the contract, and um ... the, uh, remaining, the actual software, um, they started out
by wanting 75% up front and I think we got that down to about 25% so ... um...
O'Malley/ It was a very difficult negotiation because they didn't want to move on that because
this becomes public knowledge, and there're other potential customers hear about it but
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we explained the problems we had with the previous installation so they took that into
consideration and decided to amend their, uh, payout, or ... or their, uh, their request to
our ... to our needs.
Hayek/ I've got a couple questions on that. And the first just regards some of the rec ... some of
the correspondence we got in.
O'Malley/ Sure!
Hayek/ ...lately on, you know, isn't there an on- the -shelf option, etc., uh...
O'Malley/ Uh, did you receive my response to that? (laughter)
Hayek/ I may not have seen that yet so...
Dilkes/ It's in front of you.
Hayek/ Okay, well...
O'Malley/ Essentially there ... there is no off - the... some of this is off - the - shelf, uh, software. We
only have about $65,000 of modifications to this software, um ... the basic amount of...the
issue that is problematic is that cities are not as homogenous as individuals. Uh,
obviously we're political subdivisions of the State. Not all states are the same. Um,
some states require cities to ... allow cities to collect their own taxes versus the state
requires a county to collect taxes. Uh, some states allow cities to collect their own sales
tax; this state does not allow cities to collect. So we're not a homogenous group of
people so essentially we have certain off -the -shelf items that we all report debits and
credits the same (laughing) and we all report utility... we all do utility billings pretty
much the same. We do have different state, uh, utility commissions, but so there are
some parts to this, the payroll process is pretty similar, except state income tax schedules
are different than some states that have no income tax schedules. So there is no true off-
the-shop ... off-the-shelf, but Mu ... or Tyler's product, does come with a base package and
we added to that package, and then we have certain constraints or flexibilities that we
built into our current package that we added ... that we asked for and that amounts to
about $64,000.
Payne / So...we're doing $64,000 worth of customization, or is it configuration?
O'Malley/ Customization. We have ... and one of `em is a bargaining unit issue which is ... which
is more than the HR software that ... the HR software's only $20,000, but this bargaining
unit issue is $24,000 modification. You know, those are the kind of things that, you
know, you scratch your head and say we're the only one that has that. There's two other,
three other cities in the state that use Tyler.
Markus/ Can you explain the modification, Kevin?
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O'Malley/ Well, it's been around for maybe 15 years, and it's a sick leave modification, and if
you, uh, build up enough sick leave, I think it's the AFSCME bargaining unit. You build
up enough sick leave, and you don't use it for two or three years, you can convert it into
vacation, and you do it over any 12 -month period. Now our current Legacy software can
calculate that. That's completely foreign to, uh, this company. They kind of scratched
their head and said, well, we can do it, and later on they gave us a price.
Payne/ So then when they do upgrades to the system, they go from version 1 to version 2 to
version 3, do we have to pay extra every time to go to a new version because of all these
customizations (both talking)
O'Malley/ They won't spell it out that way, but there will be a charge — included in our
maintenance. Our maint ... our maintenance fee is based upon our software costs, and so
you'll have a software cost of about $300,000 and then whatever our modifications are,
and that'll become, uh, an ongoing item.
Hayek/ Um, what was my other question? Oh, my other question was the ... the funding for this,
you identified interest income from the FY07 budget.
O'Malley/ Yes! Now that's got a history of its own! (laughing) Uh, as you know we issue
bonds every year and back in FY07 we issued bonds for half of this project; the other half
is going to come out of our user fees from our utilities. Well, because of the flood
coming, and other CIP projects being pushed around, we ... and ... different management
changes within that time, uh, this ... those, all those funds of $8 or $9 million that I issued
that year and I issued at a time when they actually paid interest rates, that ... over that time
I've earned about $300 ... or $400,000 and it was an ... interest income is always
unallocated. I can use it for any cost overruns on a project, or if a sudden project comes
up, uh, and it's an essential corporate purpose project, I can use those funds for that.
Otherwise I can use it for debt service reduction, and knowing that this pro ... this project
had a problem in the first go -round in 09, I've been banking that interest to the day when
we do go back out, such as today, and uh, finance the project. Is that ... clear?
Hayek/ Yeah, it's a good source, it's available, you've been intending to do this all along.
Champion/ You don't have to bond for it.
O'Malley/ Correct!
Markus/ Kevin, uh, the writer indicated, of the letter, that we were into the previous contract to
the tune of $200,000 but my recollection was somewhat less than that after the payments.
O'Malley/ Well, there's all kinds of ways of looking at that. Um, but uh ... from an actual cost
dollar, we were ... with our cost and their cost, was about $256,000. Some of those costs
that we learned about the system, we learned that the previous RFP written by the
consultant was shoddy, if I can say that off - camera (laughter) was not as ... was not up to
our, uh, expectation. We gave him all of our requirements and he ended up using a
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prepackaged product that he spit out, and then, we had to give it shot -gun approach to
300, um, different, uh, software houses, some even in Europe, and this was just his style
and we couldn't change it because it was the City Manager's pick and so uh, that ended
up, uh, costing us in ... in the evaluation process. So in the interim time, we had a project
manager on board and we told him to go through our utility package because we were
losing programmers all this time, and so I get nervous when I don't have support for our
$25 million, uh, software ... or needs software revenue. So I asked him to go through and
diagram... diagrammatically flow chart the software process. So we built our own
requirements, very tough. I think there's about 340 different requirements, more than we
had the last time. So we ... we're well defined in our concept of buying this software.
Where the first time we had to rely on the RFP that was written by the consultant.
Markus/ But the outlay to the, um ... the vendor that was previously selected, minus the payments
we received, do you have a net number on that?
O'Malley/ I believe it's still around $200,000 net. Yeah, we had 200 ... we actually paid them
$256,000 and when we went through the process, he had ... they substantiated that they
had some of their services, uh, up to about $50,000 so we settled on $196,000 payback.
They made one payment of $10,000. That... after that they were bought by Harris
Computer, uh, Software Company in ... in, uh, Canada. We, uh, negotiated... they also
hired the owner of that company, and subsequently fired him when once they found out
the issues that, uh, that he did not disclose, and uh, Harris, uh, in order to get away from
our litigation, paid us $30,000. So we're down to about $166,000 or something like that.
Markus/ That's the number I was trying to get at.
O'Malley/ That's... that's, yeah, so, um...
Dilkes/ But the $196,000 was a settlement, down from the $250,000.
O'Malley/ Right.
Dilkes/ Originally.
Markus/ And then we ... and then we (several talking)
O'Malley/ ...we got $40,000.
Markus/ And we aren't done pursuing this issue.
O'Malley/ No, we still have active, uh ... (both talking) yeah, we still have an active lawsuit, or
not a lawsuit, but a ... the beginnings of a lawsuit —judgment, confession and judgment
type thing — against this individual, uh, in Colorado. Oh, and by the way, he asked, he
had the gall to ask us if he could work it off! And (laughing) I said no! (laughter) It's
a ... any other questions? I do have a ... our, just to give you a warning or a prelude, I do
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have our project manager has a PowerPoint presentation to go through, uh, the Tyler, uh,
process tonight.
Champion/ Great!
Hayek/ Great. Thanks, Kevin.
O'Malley/ (mumbled) Thank you.
Throgmorton/ Thanks again.
ITEM 203) CONSIDER A RESOLUTION AUTHORIZING THE PROCUREMENT OF
A 2013 PIERCE IMPEL PUC FIRE ENGINE
Hayek/ Just as Jim forgot an agenda item, so did I. I just had a quick question on the ... on the,
uh, fire, uh, department acquisition. It's 2d(3). It's uh ... a budgeted purchase of a new
fire engine. Did ... are we like ... there's been conversation about the age of units, at
what ... at what point in their life span are we cycling them out. I'm just curious what the
details were on this one.
O'Malley/ Usually we do 14 years; 7 years front line, 7 years reserve. This unit, I think, is
actually 15 ... will be 15 years by the time it's ... it's out, and due to our, or not due to ... in
compliance with our, uh, amended purchasing policy, anything over $150,000, we come
to the Council. Now in the budget process you will authorize the $684,000 to pay for this
unit, but in compliance we need to bring this to you since it's over $150,000.
Markus/ But it's on our radar in terms of life expectancy (mumbled) that we are considering, and
so that's one of the things that we'll be examining during the budget process.
Dickens/ Is that a net price on that, cause they usually get some trade -in on (both talking)
O'Malley/ That's... that's the original price, or the list price. The uh ... we did structure a deal
with a company this year that if we pay 75 ... they had different structures. 25 down, 50
down, 75 down. They would cut percentages. And so I think we took the 75% down;
save us about $15 or $16,000.
Dickens/ Thank you.
O'Malley/ The actual (several talking) the actual, uh, sale of the unit is done on (mumbled)
Information Packets:
08/23/12:
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Hayek/ Thanks, Kevin! Okay, let's uh ... jump to the info packets. Um ... first is August 23rd
Anything on that?
Dobyns/ I had a question on Information Packet the 23rd, Item 6, regarding the Burlington Street
mitigation project and the trip to Charles City. I just took a look at a satellite view. Was
that ... I noticed they had a dam with three series of rapids downstream. Was that the
project that you looked at in Charles City?
Davidson/ Right, it was a similar type project to what we're considering here, where they
basically filled in the back of the dam and created a course. It wouldn't be taking the
dam out, cause the University has some operational things in there that they need to
preserve. So we'd basically be filling in the back of the dam like they did at, uh, Charles
City, and it was kind of encouraging, in spite of the fact that their water was at record low
levels. There were still people out there kayaking (both talking)
Dobyns/ Were they kayaking over the rapids, Jeff, or...
Davidson/ Yeah, in what water there was left so...
Dobyns/ Cool!
Davidson/ Hopefully that was kind of a worst -case situation.
Dobyns/ (several talking) more than just the bike race for us. Kayak race down the (both talking)
Champion/ Oh a kayak, I was going to say would anyone actually get in an inner -tube (several
talking and laughing)
Davidson/ Yeah, I believe it is suitable. There's a specific portion of the course that's where you
negotiate it in a ... in a kayak, but I think it is also suitable, Connie, for less ... for those of
us that would be more likely in an inner -tube.
Champion/ I'm not going on the Iowa River in an inner -tube (laughter) I like going in rivers in
Missouri with an inner -tube.
IP5 Copy of memo to City Manager from Administrative Assistant: DCS /CCIA
AmeriCorps Living Allowance Funding Request
Throgmorton/ IP5 with regard to the west side levee and Backulis Trailer Park. I know there's
been some discussion about possibly scheduling a face -to -face meeting with affected
residents. I wonder if there's been any progress with regard to trying to set such a
meeting up.
Fosse/ Our engineer on that project is ... is looking for a date, probably in the next month, month
and a half to get that done. Uh, typically in the evolution of a project we'll have a
meeting with property owners during the design phase. It's a pre- design meeting. That
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didn't happen here because at the time this design occurred, we had money for design but
not for construction. So we were concerned about creating false expectations of
proceeding with the project when we really thought it was quite a long shot that it would,
uh, so occasionally we get in these situations where essentially we have a pre -
construction meeting, so that's what we're aiming for here.
Throgmorton/ Thanks!
Fosse/ Uh -huh.
Champion/ Can I just backup to the dam again? That could be a major...major safety feature at
that point too, wouldn't it?
Davidson/ We're hoping it'll be a safety improvement feature, yes.
Champion/ Yeah, yeah, that's a big problem. Thank you. Sorry I didn't think about it before.
08/30/12:
Hayek/ Okay, the August 30th info packet?
Throgmorton/ IP10, the annual ICAD meeting. Marian, I'd like to go.
Karr/ Okay, thank you.
Mims/ You've got mine, Marian, right?
Payne /I'm going for work. I'll be there but not at the City table (laughing)
Hayek/ Upgraded the breakfast options for you (mumbled) (laughter)
Throgmorton/ Quick word about the IP11, the City of Literature annual report. Uh, the new
director, the newly appointed director John Kenyon did a superb job of putting that
together... together, and I would encourage all of you to read it. It's a really nice
summary of what the City of Literature is doing.
Mims/ Very good!
Hayek/ He was born within two hours of me! You know that? (several talking) That makes his
report more, uh, compelling to me. (laughter)
Champion/ Is he older or younger?
Hayek/ I can't believe I don't know that, but I think he's younger! (laughter) Anything else on
the 30th info packet?
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Dobyns/ There was an issue on the 23rd, Item 5, um, from Adam regarding AmeriCorps
(mumbled) funding request. I don't know if City staff is looking for some sort of
affirmation.
Champion/ I couldn't understand what you said.
Dobyns/ It's Item 5, um, AmeriCorps living allowance funding request. I don't know if City
staff is looking for some affirmation from Council about (both talking)
Markus/ No, we're just advising Council on that. We do have a representative from the judicial
district here, as well. She was here (laughing) so ... no, we're not looking for affirmation.
Hayek/ This is within your policy discretion anyway.
Dobyns/ So (both talking)
Markus/ ...to make sure you were aware of it.
Dobyns/ It was the FYI. Thank you.
Hayek/ Okay, Counc ... anything else on the 30th before I move on? Okay. Council time?
Council Time:
Payne/ I have two things. The first one is ... I've been contacted by QwikTrip twice to have a
meeting with them. Has anybody else? And I have no ... I haven't been able to do it, and
it's just been via email, so I have no idea ... (several talking) Is it Kum &Go? Okay.
Mims/ I have and I've met with `em. Yeah, it's just they're trying to get contact with Councilors
and ... you know, get their name out there in terms of places they're looking at (both
talking)
Dickens/ Jim and I met with `em already.
Hayek/ I encourage them to talk to staff because then I'm not sure that had occurred yet, or at
least the City Manager's office.
Throgmorton/ Yeah, and I sent an email to Tom... kind of characterizing the essence of our
meeting.
Payne / When they sent an email they don't say what they want to talk about and I've been out of
town ... every time they've asked I've had to go out of town, so it's like what is...
Dobyns/ Yeah, and my concern is that putting, you know, in terms of sequencing, uh, I'm happy
to talk with the public, but you know, I got a sense ... I think I was talking with Geoff
about this like what is this, and if it's a possibility of being a Planning and Zoning item, I
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feel kind of funny as a council person talking with them before our colleagues on P &Z
have a chance to talk with `em. And so I... it's kind of like, you know, the fact that they
talked ... would call us before they talked to City staff, I'm not sure that's appropriate?
Hayek/ I ... I think it ... I think it's always, um, an available option to say, hey, I'm totally
unfamiliar with why you want to meet with me, you know, have you met with staff cause
typically if there's something with the city, it's going to require staff involvement and,
you know, send `em... send `em that way if you have some discomfort with it.
Markus/ You can always refer them to the Manager's office and we'll make sure that the
appropriate staff meet with `em, discuss issues with them, uh, in this particular case I had
the strong impression that they were, uh, talking about specific sites and so, um, I think,
Rick, your comments are apropos to these matters will probably go through the P &Z
issue, or uh, process before...
Dobyns/ I'm just looking on how to, I guess, behave as a council person, not that I care
otherwise, but uh (laughter) in terms of...it just seems is one of fairness. I mean, if
everyone went and gave us a call before it goes to P &Z, I mean, some of us do and some
of us don't and so I guess I'm just confused as to what I'm supposed to do. It seems that
I don't want to undermine our governance process as written. Um, I mean, there's a lot
of good businesses that want to call in and check in, and I think that ... the concern was
are, have they heard from City staff; are things being expedited appropriately through
City staff, is there an adequate sort of pro- business mentality; and is that what they're
concerned about; and I wasn't sure what... obviously I guess some of you have now
talked with them. Were they ... I'm not even sure what they were asking, what the ask
was! Um...
Markus/ I think you can always suggest to them, have you... or ask them, have you spoken with
the City Manager or the staff, and uh, and then based on that, you can say your preference
would be, uh, that you speak with the staff first and that if you're dissatisfied with the
conversation with the staff, please feel free to get back to me. That way you've opened
the door, uh, so that procedurally the process is being followed the way it should. I will
tell you that, um, on occasion we run into situations, and this is ... this is partly this whole
reputation business but in one of the instances here, they're looking at a site and the use is
not consistent with the Comprehensive Plan. So as adopted policy, meaning the
Comprehensive Plan, we will always take the position that is the Comprehensive Plan
and that it's contrary to the Comprehensive Plan in this particular instance. We may
share an opinion that it may be worth pursuing an amendment to the Comprehensive
Plan, based on things that may have occurred subsequent to the adoption of the
Comprehensive Plan but our role is to enforce and support the policies that the Council
adopts, and so I think in this instance they got some feedback from some of us that may
be, you know, they didn't necessarily care for, and ... so they're... they're going to pursue
the options they have to get their point across. Their bottom line is they're doing
business, and uh, quite frankly, you know, if it's in the right location, uh, we're
advocates. We want business to expand in this community. But ... usually when you're
getting' those calls, it's, um ... they're trying to, I think, ingratiate themselves with the
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Council and make their points known. So, you can, you know, always ask `em, have you
talked to the City Manager.
Dobyns/ So in this case they would have said they have, I mean, if any...
Markus/ No, they would have said no, we have not (laughter) because it was the land owner that
talked to us. It was not...
Dobyns/ I see! Okay.
Markus / And the land owner was told exactly, uh, that it was inconsistent with the
Comprehensive Plan.
Payne/ A lot of times though we do change the Comp Plan because of somebody wanting to put
something in a certain spot.
Markus/ Sure.
Payne / So...even if it was contrary to the ... I ... I'm just asking a hypothetical question here.
Markus/ Sure.
Payne/ If something was contrary to the Comprehensive Plan, and it required a change to the
plan, and... staff was against it, would we still allow the applicant to take it to Planning
and Zoning, and Council, if ..with a ... with a recommendation...
Markus/ ...request?
Payne/ Yes.
Markus/ I don't think we can preclude somebody requesting anything from our governmental
body, uh, but we would give them our advice and we would give them our views on it,
and that's exactly what we did in this particular case, urn ... I think there was a gap in the
communication. Let me say it as nicely as I can, that...
Hayek/ You know what, let's ... let's ,uh, we're kind of going beyond the scope of...of what
Council time is for and I think if there are (several talking) handle inquiries, Planning and
Zoning items, whatever, we either get direct answers to questions outside of the Council
meeting or ... or set it for a work session, so...
Dobyns/ But I think this has been helpful in terms of what actually ... had a reply. So (both
talking)
Markus/ ... feel free to ask if they've talked to the staff.
Dobyns/ Okay.
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Hayek/ You had another item.
Payne/ I ... the other item that I had was I talked to Tom about this earlier, and I see it again in the
Human Rights Commission meeting minutes. It seems like they think they expect, well,
they expect something from us from something they have sent to us in the past, in their
meeting minutes, and I don't know that we have something from them to give back to
them. It's like they think they asked us a question that we're supposed to be advising
them on and we haven't. Remember when we talked about this a couple weeks ago?
Markus / And .... and see my recollection of that issue is we had, um, discussion with the
commission and I think the Council, and Marian, you're probably best to speak to the
history of this, but my recollection is that this Council referred those issues back to them
and asked them to study the issues and come back with recommendations to the Council.
And I think that...
Champion/ That was with the City thing, the ... you know what I mean.
Hayek/ Sanctuary City?
Champion/ Yes! (several talking)
Payne / And in their minutes they don't actually say what they're referring to. Alls they say is we
sent that to Council and they haven't responded to us yet.
Dilkes/ It ... it's hard for, I mean, I ... I don't know what subject you're talking about. So...
Payne / And it doesn't say...
Markus/ It's hard to discern from that...
Payne/ It is hard to discern from their meeting minutes even what they're talking about.
Dilkes/ I mean, we ... we may have, I mean, there have been things that you have received from
the Human Rights Commission since that, since you sent it back to them but without
knowing what the subject matter is, it's hard (several talking)
Hayek/ ... have staff look into it and (both talking)
Markus/ (mumbled)
Hayek/ ...whose side of the net the ball currently rests.
Payne/ That would be ... cause every time they send out their minutes, it's in there, and it's like
what do they want? (laughing) So that'd be great. Thank you, Tom!
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Hayek/ Any other Council time items?
Uttermark/ Um, I have a few things I'd just like to talk about quickly, if that's okay.
Hayek/ Yeah!
Uttermark/ Um, first thing I'd like to discuss is over the summer, um, University of Iowa Student
Government has been working on, uh, legislation and support of the interstate rail project
between Chicago and Council Bluffs, Iowa, and I'm happy to report that we have our
resolution fully in writing and with our Senate convening on the 11th of this month, um,
we should have a resolution passed. So on paper at least Student Government and the
University of Iowa students will be supporting you, um, and I'd like to thank Geoff
specifically for really being a big help in us getting that ready. Um, the other thing, and I
apologize for my tardiness in this and not being able to bring this up earlier but I had a
question in Item 8. (several talking) Yeah, there's been, uh, quite a bit of meetings and
just debate on this issue overall from our end, and uh, the one question Student
Government as a whole really has on this is, um, with this change from criminal law to a
municipal infraction, um, there's a concern over the $750 fine, even though we ... we've
been told that it's only being applied to each apartment. There's a concern that this could
still be applied per resident.
Champion/ It can't be.
Uttermark/ It can't be, in any case?
Hayek/ Eleanor can (several talking) of that.
Dilkes/ No, it could be. You could issue a municipal infraction to an individual rather than one
to a group of individuals. I think, um, HIS has indicated that that's not their, um,
intention. But... in the general course of things, um, one can imagine a situation, for
instance, you know, you're not getting cooperation, the problem at the house continues,
um ... there are more parties, unable to make a criminal citation, uh, etc., that you ... that
they might chose to issue a ... an infraction against per individual, but that is not, um, as
the memo reflects is not the way they intend to start off anyway.
Uttermark/ Um, you know, and uh, you know from our end, we understand that's what the
Housing Board is looking to do, is not to be applying this individually; however, uh,
the ... the ideas and thoughts of Student Government and other associated bodies at the
University is that this is simply too stiff and prejudicial a fine on a college student, you
know, this is a learning experience for us. This is usually the first time we're out on our
own. We understand that we're not going to be perfect, but we do feel that, you know,
anything over $100 is obviously going to get our attention and is going to be some form
of financial burden on us, and we personally feel that a $750 fine is just too extreme for
us, individually. We can understand it on the apartment by apartment level. We can't
really understand it on the personal level.
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Hayek/ I think I would just to clarify what you said at the beginning of your ... your comments.
This isn't a change from criminal to a civil infraction. It's an expansion beyond simply a
criminal response to essentially encompass three options. One would be criminal; one
would be the civil infraction; and a third would just be fin ... a founded complaint and the
triggering of the nuisance process, which might not lead to either a criminal or a civil, uh,
application. So, just so that that's... that's there.
Dobyns/ So what's your ask, specifically (both talking)
Uttermark/ I mean, it's complicated. Everyone's all over the place on this, but we're just
concerned with this founded complaint, that if a founded complaint is issued, and there is,
you know, a... a police presence, at you know... in an apartment, let's say, you know, they
go to this apartment; they leave this apartment building without having talked to the
residents because they haven't opened the door; is it still possible for the $750 fine to be
issued on the individual basis off that alone.
Dilkes/ Is it possible?
Uttermark/ Yes.
Dilkes/ Yes. Is it likely? No.
Uttermark/ Okay, I mean, from our standpoint, we're just against it being an option personally,
but we understand where you're coming from, as well.
Dobyns/ It's only $750; that's how it's written. It's not, um, maybe if it was against a group,
$750 would be diluted 20 ways, but I guess the concern here is that if there is one person
who was particularly harassable and whose behavior was compelling to the police as a
single individual, I guess in that scenario, and what we're suggesting is rare, that 750
would be a whopping fine for that one person. (several talking)
Payne/ But it couldn't be diluted 20 ways. Only by the people's names that are on the lease.
Champion/ Right. But that's...
Dobyns/ Yeah, that's too many people. Okay. (laughter)
Champion/ Yeah, I thought that if they didn't answer the door (several talking) you can't issue
an individual citation, cause that goes to an individual. Oh, never mind. I thought I
understood it. Might have to go through it all again!
Throgmorton/ This is precisely why it's important to have clarification in ordinary language, so
that everybody understands how the process is going to work.
Dilkes/ I'm happy to provide whatever clarification I can, but I have to have the question, and all
I can do is answer it to the best of my... ability.
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Uttermark/ ...we understand, you know, it's sort of been all over the place with us too because,
you know...
Dickens/Is the $750 mandated by the City, or is that a State...
Dilkes/ You could set that ... you could set the municipal infraction fine at a lower amount.
Hayek/ Okay. Other Council time items? Thanks for those... for... for expressing the UISG
concerns, Matt.
Throgmorton/ I'd like to mention one item very quickly. Um, on ... on August 24tH, um,
Professor Victor Regnier from the University of Southern California made a presentation
sponsored by the Center on Aging about housing opportunities for older people who live
near universities. I know Tom talked to Victor Regnier, Jeff was there, uh, Bob Miklo
was there, Karen Howard was there, other people, uh, and it was a terrific presentation,
and I think there's a lot that really needs to be attended to in there, and I think Tom would
agree about that. We don't need to talk about it a lot, but it was a really moving ... and
effective presentation.
Hayek/ Thanks, Jim. Okay, next item is pending work session topics, which is, uh, IP2.
Anything to add or subtract from that?
Throgmorton/ I'd like to say one thing about the flood recovery thing, very briefly. I understand
it's next on the list so we'll talk about that, what, two weeks from now — is that the idea?
Yeah, I think it's terrific, uh, with regard to the Taft, uh, Speedway, potential Taft
Speedway levee and floodwall, I'm going to be sending Tom a few suggestions, and
there's no need to go into `em right now, but uh, you should expect those in another
couple days and I'd ask the staff at least consider them as you're putting that together.
Markus/ Okay.
UpcominE Council Invitations/Events/Etc.:
Hayek/ (several talking) ...correction, actually this is at IP4. It says IP2 but it's at IP4 if you're
having trouble finding it. Any other work session discussion? Okay. Uh, upcoming, uh,
events, meeting schedule, etc. The meeting schedule is at IPI ... on the August 30tH Any
issues with that? Any upcoming events or Council invitations?
Payne/ The Northside ... um ... trying to find it in my email (several talking) it's on Sunday, yeah.
Throgmorton/ It's September 9th, 2:00 to 5:00 P.M.
Payne/ 2:00 to 5:00 on Sunday.
Hayek/ That park's gorgeous! (several responding)
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Throgmorton/ Bravo to Mark and the Parks Dept folks and John Thomas.
Hayek/ Okay, I think that's it. We'll end the work session and start up at 7:00 for the formal.
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