HomeMy WebLinkAbout2013-01-08 TranscriptionJanuary 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session I Page 1
Council Present: Champion, Dickens, Dobyns, Hayek, Mims, Payne, Throgmorton
Staff Present: Markus, Fruin, Bentley, Dilkes, Karr, Davidson, Ackerson, Yapp, Moran,
Fosse
UISG: Bramel
Agenda Items•
Hayek/ Okay, well we'll start the work session. I want to welcome everyone, uh, to the January
8 work session. Um, I think what we'll do is ... if, with Council's permission, rearrange
these a little bit and get everything out of the way and then take up the College - Gilbert
items. If that makes sense to folks. (several responding) All right, so uh ... first item is
questions regarding agenda items.
ITEM 8. COLOR SCHEME TAXICABS - CONSIDER AN ORDINANCE
AMENDING TITLE 5, ENTITLED "BUSINESS AND LICENSE
REGULATIONS," CHAPTER 2, ENTITLED "TAXICABS" TO REQUIRE
A DISTINCTIVE FOR ALL VEHICLES DRIVEN BY A COMPANY.
(PASS AND ADOPT)
Dobyns/ (unable to hear) (noises on mic) Um, I forget (mumbled) about the color of taxi, uh,
taxicabs that's on the agenda item.
Karr/ Nine!
Dobyns/ Nine? Okay.
Hayek/ Eight!
Dobyns/ Eight?
Karr/ Eight?
Dobyns/ All right. Yeah, nine's the (both talking)
Karr/ I'm sorry, yes it is!
Dobyns/ ...um, my understanding was that the color scheme, um, are we voting actually on it
today to sit there and pass it with the color scheme intact?
Karr/ The ordinance provides for companies to have a color scheme and that's on for a vote, yes.
Dobyns/ Okay. My understanding is that we were going to ...I must have misunderstood it.
That we were going to pull and then deliberate if we were going to reinclude (both
talking)
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 2
Karr/ You certainly can, but (noises on mic) deferred to this meeting, so you certainly can
continue to deliberate...
Dobyns/ I guess I'd like to do that now.
Karr/ ...defer it again or whatever you ... it's up to you.
Dobyns/ Okay.
Throgmorton/ I was thinking we might, uh, might amend the proposal by providing an
exemption for a certain period of time, which is something we talked about last, uh,
during our last meeting. I... I sent Eleanor a... an email about that, but I don't think
Eleanor's had ... had time to look at it, cause I sent it to you like an hour and a half ago.
Dilkes/ No, I ... I did and I responded (both talking) Um, yeah, I think the exception for
independent owner occu ... independent owner- operators is problematic because in the
whole scheme, neither by code or by practice do we regulate independent owner-
operators. We ... we regulate and license businesses and we regulate and license drivers,
and those are the entities that can be held accountable for, you know, in terms of a
business — not providing the insurance, not having their vehicles inspected, those kinds of
things. So if we're going to go to a ... if we're going to make an ex ... exception for
independent owner- operators, we're going to have to give that more thought in terms of
how the rest ... how they fit into the entire scheme.
Payne/ Would ... would it be possible or have we ever thought about, talked about having
something in there talking about the independent owner- operators so that they are spelled
out that, you know, we recognize there is this other group of people out there.
Dilkes/ That ... that's certainly something you could do. I don't recall it being discussed. You're
certainly ... but it ... but it's going to take ... some significant discussion about how you
want them to be regulated, I mean, the insurance requirements, the inspection
requirements (several talking) I mean it's just...it...it involves a lot more than just the
color scheme.
Payne / Right, right. It would be big, not little.
Dilkes/ Right. I don't think we just want to slip in an exception for them into the current
scheme ... for the color (both talking)
Payne/ Without having something spelled out for what it actually means even.
Dilkes/ Right.
Champion/ Oh for crying out loud!
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 3
Dobyns/ Okay. I thought we weren't even going to have any sort of color, homogenous color
requirement at all ... for anyone.
Karr/ Okay, the ... the ordinance itself was deferred til January 8`h so we put it on based on that
deferral. If you would like to defer it indefinitely, you certainly can. You can vote it
down. You can ... this provision is put on now, uh, because it was deferred til January 8h
So ... and it doesn't go into effect until the June 1 licensing year. What we want to do is if
we want to pursue it, we want to give ample notice to all of the companies of this change.
If you wish to defer it, then it ... my ... my suggestion would be we defer it indefinitely and
not take effect this licensing year.
Dobyns/ Well I ... there were elements of it that were fairly good, except the color scheme was...
Karr/ The elements of it you passed December 18th. The only thing remaining is the color
scheme (both talking)
Dobyns/ Oh, I got it! All right.
Karr/ You deferred... you deferred the color scheme to January 8th and you passed the other
items.
Hayek/ Yeah, and there's a ... there's a typo in the title. It's to require a distinctive color. It just
says to require a distinctive, and that may have been part of the confusion.
Dobyns/ Okay.
Throgmorton/ Yeah, I ... I'd support the idea of deferring that, as well.
Dobyns/ Yes, I would too.
Payne/ I would too.
Karr/ Deferring indefinitely?
Throgmorton/ Well, uh, we ... we should set in motion some way of, uh, trying to do what
Eleanor just, uh, described. Seems tome, but ... I suppose that means an indefinite
deferral at this moment any (several talking)
Dilkes/ Well I think probably what's going to have to happen is we do an indefinite deferral and
then staff is going to have to come back to you with some questions to try to flesh out
what your policy position is on this.
Karr/ Totally separate from just the color scheme before you. The other stuff is already done,
already in motion.
Dobyns/ Okay. All right.
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 4
Karr/ So deferring indefinitely, if that's your decision and if you wish to direct staff, we'll have
to come back with a whole ... look at the entire ordinance. (noise on mic)
Hayek/ On this sub - issue.
Dobyns/ Just the, uh...
Champion/ Right!
Dobyns/ ...just the one on the color scheme.
Mims/ No, it doesn't sound to me like color scheme. To me ... what is getting opened up here, if
I'm understanding staff right, is we regulate businesses that are taxi cab businesses and
they must have at least four vehicles and the ... the, where they dispatch from and all those
kinds of issues, and this whole issue of the subcontractors where you don't have
`business' with four cabs is something that's ... is a totally different animal that is getting
opened up by this discussion.
Payne/ This would be two separate things. I mean, the deferral of the color scheme would be just
till somebody wanted to bring it up again. The other thing would be something totally
separate, the ... if we wanted to do anything with independent operators.
Dilkes/ Maybe ... maybe just ... you missed the beginning of my conversation with Jim by email.
Jim's question to me is, or what he was giving me a heads up about perhaps making a ...a
motion to amend to make an exception for independent contractors, and then my reply to
that was, that's not really part of the scheme we have and if we're going to talk about
independent contractors, there's a number of things we have to talk about. Color scheme,
insurance, etc., vehicle... who's responsible for the inspections. Is it the independent
contractor? Is it the business owner? Who's responsible for the insurance? Is it the
independent contractor? Is it the business owner? I mean, all those issues are going to
have to be addressed. The whole issue of do we... do we, by allowing independent
contractors, are we subverting our... our... our... our idea of wanting businesses to have at
least four vehicles and have that significant investment, etc., etc., etc. So there are a lot
of things (several talking) have to be addressed.
Throgmorton/ But these independent owner- operators, as I understand it, work for companies.
They just happen to own their own vehicles, and ... and so that's why the color scheme
becomes particularly crucial for them, cause they would have to bear the cost of... of
either buying a new vehicle or painting their vehicle or doing something like that.
Dilkes/ Well...
Throgmorton/ They're being affected differently than the other ... than the companies as a whole
are being affected. That's the way I understand it.
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 5
Dilkes/ Well I mean that's... that's a polic ... I mean you could take ... make that argument. I think
I could probably argue the other side, as well, and I think Council is going to have to
have a discussion about how you want to treat independent owner occupy. We don't
make, for instance, we don't have an administrative system for ... for classifying vehicles
based on ownership. That ... that's not something the Clerk's office even does. Um, in
fact one of the questions I had when we started talking about this, when I got your
question, Jim, was ... are the business ... the businesses are providing us with a Certificate
of Insurance that lists all the vehicles that are in their company, but apparently they don't
own some of those vehicles, yet they're able to secure insurance, and I have some, you
know, questions about that. To me it just raises a whole lot of issues. (several talking)
Champion/ The other ... the other problem is, although I'm for finding some way to help these
independent contractors. We could have a hundred independent... contractors. Instead of
having cab companies, we could just end up with nothing but independent cab owners
who wouldn't have to adhere to most of our regulations.
Throgmorton/ But there's probably a way to deal with that. Why don't we defer the color and
then (both talking)
Hayek/ Why don't we ... let's do this, let's ... let's defer Item 8 indefinitely and then let's work
session this, and ... and I'm not even sure we want staff to do a whole lot of work before
we sit down and talk (several talking). If you want to provide some basic background so
we go in with better understanding — that'd be fine. (several talking) ...have a
conversation like this at a dedicated time. (several responding)
Dobyns/ I think for those of us to do some, you know, individual reading (mumbled) ask Eleanor
and, uh, Marian some questions.
Hayek/ Okay.
Dobyns/ Yeah.
Hayek/ Other... other agenda items?
ITEM 5b COMPREHENSIVE PLAN DOWNTOWN AND RIVERFRONT
CROSSINGS PLAN - AMENDING THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN TO
INCLUDE THE DOWNTOWN AND RIVERFRONT CROSSINGS PLAN.
[Discussion only at formal meeting]
Throgmorton/ I ... I want to say something about Item 5b, which is, uh, amending the Comp Plan
to include the Downtown Riverfront Crossings Plan. I would suggest that we defer a vote
on that, uh, to our next meeting, two weeks from now. Uh, we can certainly hear what
the staff has to say, uh, and get enlightened by that, but then defer action, because like I
said to you, Matt, I really haven't had time to read it and I feel very uncomfortable about
proceeding without reading it.
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 6
Hayek/ Yeah, and we did talk and ... and staff doesn't have a problem with that. They want to get
the information out there. So I think what we'll do is we'll open the public hearing, get
the staff presentation, and then continue the public hearing. How about that? And then,
so we'll still have an opportunity for public input through the continued public hearing at
the next...
Dobyns/ And the actual vote will be in two weeks?
Hayek/ Correct.
Dobyns/ Okay.
Payne/ Good. Yeah, it was a lot of stuff to digest (several talking) (noises on mic) Um, I did ... I
did have one question about that. On, um, and maybe this is just something that can be
answered during the public hearing. On page ... 252, it talks about form -based code.
When you give your presentation can you just explain what that means? You don't have
to do it right now if you don't...
Davidson/ We will do that!
Payne/ Thank you!
Hayek/ Other agenda items?
ITEM 3d(5) COMPLAINT #12 -05 POLICE CITIZENS REVIEW BOARD EXTENSION
- MOTION GRANTING A 30 -DAY EXTENSION TO THE POLICE
CITIZENS REVIEW BOARD FOR THE FILING OF THE PUBLIC
REPORT WITH THE CITY COUNCIL ON COMPLAINT #12 -05.
Payne/ Um, I have one on, uh, 3d(5). The request of the PCRB for an extension. Think... it
seems like every time they ask for an extension.
Karr/ Yeah, and I understand that and let me just refresh your memory. It did go back to them.
PCRB has recommended a change. It is now before Diversity Committee and (mumbled)
the Diversity Committee until the recommendations come out. So again, this is a
procedure thing until the recommendations come out. PCRB will be requesting that
change in the future, and they have requested it. We just haven't brought it before
Council because we're combining it with all the other recommendations.
Payne/ Okay, I just don't ever remember seeing it in their meeting minutes that they even.
Karr/ It'd be executive session.
Payne/ Oh! Okay. (laughs) Um...
Karr/ It would ratify at the end of the meeting with it, so it would be at the very end.
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 7
Payne/ Okay.
Karr/ I'm sorry! I misled you. I'm sorry — I misled you! I believe your response is you didn't
see it in the minutes, meaning you haven't seen the discussion?
Payne / Right.
Karr/ It's several weeks ago, months ago, and it's been before Diversity. It was one of the items.
Payne/ Okay, and why would it go before the Diversity Committee?
Karr/ Because it's all hooked together with possible changes in the PCRB ordinance. So we
thought rather than changing it multiple times, it would be easier to change it once.
Payne/ Okay.
Markus/ It's one of the tasks assigned to the Diversity Committee (several talking)
Payne / Right.
Karr/ The law enforcement, police.
Dobyns/ The buses and the police.
Karr/ So we were just going to combine it all at once.
ITEM 3f(3) Keri Hornbuckle; Becky Soglin: Gun Control.
Throgmorton/ Uh, I'd like to say something about Item 3f(3). Uh, which is an email from Becky
Soglin and in that email Becky urges us to join Mayors Against Illegal Guns. I don't
know if... if you are a member of that or not.
Hayek/ We are. I..I'm glad you brought that up, Jim. Um, last month I signed Iowa City up
as ... this initiative from, uh, that Mayor Bloomberg's office, um, has spearheaded
nationally, and there are hundreds of cities throughout the country that have, um, that
have joined, including some in Iowa. Um, and in light of recent circumstances
(mumbled) I usually take a pretty conservative view on our joiner of national
organizations. There's an endless supply of...of groups we could join, but this one
seemed appropriate. Um, and uh, I think it's a strong organization and ... and it makes
sense. So it's all, uh...
Payne/ So does that mean that if you didn't join that you would be for illegal guns? I mean that
just doesn't make sense. You're saying... you're making a stance against something
illegal? Why would you have a law...
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 8
Hayek/ Yeah, yeah.
Payne/ (laughs) I don't get it!
Hayek/ It's, I mean, it's an advocacy organization and that's the name it, uh, it...it gave itself,
but I mean, there's a lot of explanation on its web page, uh, thorough information on, uh,
on a variety of subjects related to this issue. So...
Payne/ Just seems like an oxymoron that you have to be for something illegal! (laughs)
Hayek/ Yeah!
Payne/ Okay.
INFORMATION PACKETS:
Hayek/ So, anyway, to answer your question, uh, we are a member. I think, uh ... uh, I think Des
Moines, Waterloo, uh... someone in the Quad Cities (noises on mic) (mumbled) ... several
others have ... have already joined. So ... um, okay. Other, uh, agenda items? Okay. So
then let's switch to, um, come on — it's going real slow here! Well, I can't pull it up.
Information, uh, packets. Um ... yeah, so the ... there are four, but two of them are the
budget documents so ... we don't need to talk about the 20th, or the ones from December
20 or 21, unless people need to. We had a lengthy discussion about that over the
weekend (mumbled)
Mims/ Actually the 20th is not financial (mumbled)
Hayek/ (mumbled)
Mims/ Just opened it — I thought I was.
Hayek/ (mumbled)
Karr/ The 21St was... yeah.
Mims/ The 21 st and then the 2 ,d.
Karr/ 28th. Second.
Mims/ There wasn't much in the 201h
Hayek/ Yeah. Well, that ... yeah, that's the financial plan but that's ... what we took up yesterday
and then, uh, capital improvements the 21St. So ... anything on December, uh, 27th
Mims/ There wasn't a packet.
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 9
Throgmorton/ There wasn't a packet!
Mims/ No.
Karr/ January 3rd
Mims/ He's a little confused tonight! (laughter)
Hayek/ I'm just reading the list here!
Dobyns/ Yeah, it says 27th. There wasn't a packet. (several talking)
Mims/ There was no packet, yeah.
Hayek/ So ... let's go through this.
Karr/ That was a budget.
Mims / And then the 3rd is...
Champion/ Why don't you just ask the general question?
Hayek/ Yeah, anyone (laughter and several talking) My machine's not even responding to
(several talking)
Dobyns/ If there was or wasn't an information packet, I have no questions! (laughter)
Hayek/ How bout the, uh, January 3rd? No ... who's on for KXIC tomorrow? (mumbled) Okay.
Throgmorton/ Break a leg!
Dickens/ It'll be exciting!
Hayek/ Anything on that one? Okay. Think that takes care of it.
Mims/ Yeah, it does.
Hayek/ Slow machine today! Okay, uh, Council time.
COUNCIL TIME:
Payne/ Um, how many people ... or do you, have you had any people say they're going to the,
um...
Karr/ Chamber banquet?
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 10
Payne/ Yes.
Karr/ I was ... that's on my list of things to ask! Would you like to go?
Payne/ Well, I ... I just don't want ... I can go for work, so I don't want, you know, I don't ... I'll go
for one or the other.
Karr/ This is on the 17th, um, so please let me know. (several responding) Okay. It doesn't have
to be (several talking) yeah, it's Thursday the 17th of January. So just check your
calendars and let me know.
Payne/ You going to go?
Dobyns/ No.
Payne/ I'll go for the City then. I'll tell `em no at work. (laughs)
Karr/ Okay!
Throgmorton/ Are we still in Council time?
Hayek/ We are still on Council (both talking)
Throgmorton/ Could I say a word about urban chickens policy? I ... I considered asking you all
to, um, authorize a... a reconsideration of our vote because I was aware that I personally
had gotten confused and tired and whatever and voted in a way that was inconsistent with
what I really wanted to do. But after probing this with Sue and thank you, wherever Sue
is for her help. I decided it would be, uh, just a real imposition and kind of self - indulgent
so what I would like to do is, uh, take a little bit of time during the formal meeting,
Council time period, to very briefly explain that I just did not ... I accidentally did not vote
consistently with my own values on that.
Hayek/ Okay. So at Council time at the end of the formal?
Throgmorton/ Yeah, but if anybody's interested, Sue gave me a lot of insight into how to
reconsider a vote if... if any one of us find that we voted in a way that was, you know,
inconsistent with what we wanted to do. (several talking) There's a way to do it.
Dobyns/ I just need to be clear if it'll make you feel better. There may have been a time where I
may have voted on something that I wasn't sure what I was voting on either (laughter)
Hayek/ Join the club! (laughter)
Dobyns/ News flash! (laughter)
Hayek/ Any other Council time items? Okay, uh, next is pending work session topics. It's IP5.
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 11
PENDING WORK SESSION TOPICS:
Champion/ (mumbled) these independent contractors on.
Hayek/ They will — staff will.
Champion/ Okay.
Throgmorton/ It was really pleasing to read about the anti - piracy compact that, uh, Tom has been
involved in, uh, and I know that's now on the list of coming agenda topics, so that's, or
work session topics, so that's... that's a good thing.
Hayek/ Anything else on that bullet item? Okay, next item is meeting schedule.
MEETING SCHEDULE:
Champion/ We took one off!
Karr/ Uh, I will be sending in the packet, uh, at the next time, for the January 22nd meeting the
April, May, June schedule, so I know we have one conflict so if you'd like to be... let me
know ahead of time, that'll save me when I do the proposed agenda. But we'll discuss it
January 22nd
Payne/ Okay.
Hayek/ Okay, next items is upcoming events, Council invitations. Talked about the Chamber
dinner. Anything else?
UPCOMING EVENTS & COUNCIL INVITATIONS:
Dickens/ Ice - skating this weekend.
Champion/ Uh -huh. (several talking)
Hayek/ Literature Festival! (several talking) Okay. I think that's it. Okay. So that takes care of
everything except, uh, the College - Gilbert item, which we will take up now.
DISCUSS PREFERRED COLLEGE /GILBERT DEVELOPER (tLg
Payne/ Can I say one more ... I do have two things that I have to recuse myself from — the College
— Gilbert plus the ... um ... the Linn Street one. So...
Hayek/ All right. See you at 7:00! (noises on mic)
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 12
Davidson/ Ready to go, Mr. Mayor? Uh, good evening, Mr. Mayor and Members of the City
Council. I'm Jeff Davidson, the Director of Planning and Community Development.
With me is, uh, John Yapp and Raquel Favela from the National Development Council,
and our scorekeeper for the evening, uh, Kris Ackerson from the Planning Department.
Um, it's been an interesting process getting us to this point, uh, the solicitation of project
proposals, the receipt of nine proposals, the then narrowing down from nine to five, the
presentation of those five proposals, the subsequent, uh, public comment period that we
had, uh, and then your meeting where you narrowed the proposals further from five to
three. And that's where we sit right now with three proposals under consideration. The
prize in front of us, the task that we need to keep in front of us as we proceed from this
point is that we are trying to select a preferred developer and a first alternate preferred
developer. That is the task that everything we do needs to relate to, uh, in terms of the,
uh, materials that you've received that we're going to go through, um, this evening. Uh,
at your request, we solicited from the three finalist developers, uh, information that
you've received in the form of a matrix, uh, that matrix was assembled by City staff,
including the City Manager. Did want you to know that Tom worked with us in, uh,
putting that matrix together, which has been weighted. The ... the factors, five categories
of factors, have been weighted according to what staff felt was the appropriate weighting.
Um, weighting — w- e- i- g -h -t, does everybody know what I'm talking about there? Um,
and certainly if Council would like to entertain discussion on that weighting being
appropriate or not (mumbled) you're welcome to enter into that. Um, I will emphasize
along the way as needed that this ... all of this information is for you to make that decision
on a preferred developer. Um ... we do want to emphasize that the information is not
legally binding. It has not received a great amount of scrutiny in terms of, uh, I mean we
believe it's accurate at the level of...data that we have at this point, but it is not legally
binding, and it's basically what the three developers have said, either that they would like
to have or what they intend to do. And that's the level of accuracy that we have right
now. Things will become legally binding and specific when we enter into a development
agreement with the preferred developer. And there's some frustration in that, but we do
want to not overstate the accuracy of the information now, and ... and again, emphasize
that it is just for your decision - making. Urn ... this process that we're going to step
through this evening is... is what you want it to be. You know, if there was a majority of
Council right now that felt a decision could be made without the use of this information,
you're welcome to go that direction. If there's a majority of Council that wants to, um,
start over, that wants to consider something (mumbled) you ... you're welcome to do all
those things and I'm not trying to complicate the process, but just let you know that we're
not, uh, trying to direct you to do something but rather just facilitate your decision
making. Um, oh, I did want to clarify one thing. And ... with respect to The Chauncey
proposal. There was a letter from Nate Kaeding, uh, endorsing the proposal that ... that
could have been misinterpreted as, uh, indicating that a business he's involved with,
Short's Burgers on Clinton Street, would go into that project. That is not the case. Ka...
uh, Nate is interested in the entrepreneurial opportunities that the building may present,
but not specifically for Short's Burgers.
Champion/ I thought that was pretty clear.
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 13
Davidson/ Hm?
Champion/ I didn't think it meant he was (both talking)
Davidson/ ... some confusion.
Throgmorton/ (mumbled) letter was clear but uh, Short's appeared somewhere (several talking)
Davidson/ Yeah. We did, uh, we ... we wanted to take a dry run at the staff level and so we
actually sat in your places and did a dry run of this process, and one thing I will
emphasize to you is, I mean, we have about an hour, hour and fifteen minutes this
evening. Uh, we ... we can see how far we get, uh, we can either then go to the work
session on the 22 °a. I understand you may have, um, cancelled a budget meeting, so you
could always use that date, uh, for ... for subsequent follow up on this, urn ... but uh ... one
thing that we did find is that as you are asked to score each of the criteria, if each time
you give an explanation of why you are scoring it a particular way it will take forever.
Um, so just a word ... a word of...a word of caution regarding that. Mr. Mayor?
Hayek/ Well you know, and so I ... I think we should ... I think unless you've got more comments,
Jeff, I ... I think we oughta, uh, talk about where we are. I think that was a good, um, lead
up to ... to today's meeting. Urn ... and I ... maybe we should ... you know, and given the
length of the process that, you know, that we're about to embark upon, uh, I ... I think we
should have a discussion just briefly as a Council, sort of take everyone's temperature,
where ... where is everybody on (mumbled) on this?
Throgmorton/ What ... what do you mean by that?
Hayek/ Well...
Throgmorton/ You mean the process?
Hayek / Yeah! I mean, do we ... do we, you know, the ... the matrix and ... and the criteria were
made available to us by staff at... at our request. We've had the benefit of that
information and the consolidation of that information, and... and I think when, you know,
we need to decide as laid out in the staff memo, should we ... should we proceed down
with the scoring and ... and all of that, um, should we go in another direction, so I ... that's
why I'm asking (mumbled) (several talking)
Throgmorton/ As I told Susan last night after our meeting, I found it very productive to go
through, and enlightening, to go through the decision matrix and to ... and to fill out each
of those, uh, blocks. I don't think of myself as merely a calculator who's going to enter
numbers and then come up with a conclusion, uh, but it was instructive. I helped... it
helped me understand, uh, the ... the issues and topics and concerns, all along the way, so
I appreciate what the staff has gone through in... in preparing that and...
Dobyns/ And I don't mind...
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 14
Davidson/ Excuse me, Rick. That was the final point I wanted to make and ... and Jim basically
addressed it, and that is that this scoring of...going through the process of scoring the
projects is not intended to make the decision for you. It's intended to provide you with
one more piece of information, in addition to the public comment that you've received,
the ... the proposals that you ... you've received, the presentations — and your perceptions
are all supposed to be part of you making a decision.
Hayek/ Thank you. That's helpful.
Mims/ I think going back to what ... what Matt said, I mean, I would be interested before we
spend an hour, hour and a half, filling in numbers to possibly get an idea if...if people
have an idea where they're at. I mean, I went through and did the matrix and
it ... confirmed what I ... what my gut and my perception and all the public input had told
me, and ... and so I pretty much know I think where I'm at, and if other people are
somewhat the same, we ... may be wasting our time going through and giving staff all of
these numbers and having it all calculated — we may already be there!
Dobyns/ I think we get bogged down after 10 or 15 minutes of general discussion, cause in the
past in a group, I ... I think we can actually do pretty well in a general discussion. If we
get bogged down then we could always, uh, you know, go back to the matrix.
Champion/ I lost the whole thing. I did have it on here. I actually was able to find the whole
thing for tonight, but now I don't have anything! But I did go through the matrix. Uh, I
thought it was interesting. Um, but I don't need the matrix to make up my mind. And
I ... I really don't want to go through it with numbers. I don't want to number. I don't ..
don't want to play the numbers game. So I'm interested in just having general
discussion.
Dobyns/ If we come to some sort of ambivalence between the six of us, then (several talking)
Hayek/ Where are you?
Dickens/ I'm fine with just... I've... the matrix was very ... very helpful in looking at, uh, all the
figures in one page (mumbled) tax ramifications, the costs, the uh ... what each of `em
provided, but it...it just solidified what I ... I've got it down to my top two.
Throgmorton/ Seems to me the value in going through the matrix is that it would, uh, make it
more clear to the public why we individually came to the conclusions we did.
Champion/ I think we can state our conclusions.
Mims/ Yeah, and I think it's more important to state those in the formal meeting in detail than it
is to do it here, and again, in the formal. And I think spending that time going through
the matrix, like Jeff said — if we start explaining every single number that we're putting in
there and why we ranked...
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 15
Throgmorton/ Right we can't do that.
Mims/ ...we're never going to get done, so ... well ... sounds like we've got a majority to at least
start some general discussion.
Hayek/ yeah, I mean I ... and I can say ... I've got, I scored it myself, uh ... and ... and frankly
confirmed what I was already... where I'm already leaning (noises on mic) (several
talking and laughing) Um ... well, all right. Let's see where people are. Who wants to
start?
Mims/ I'll start! Um, I think we had a number of very good proposals when we started. I think
we narrowed it down to three, um, that were the best of the ones that we started with. I
think a couple of things that, um, as I went through, and I guess I'll try and be brief here
cause I...I think we need to make more of this comment at the public meeting so I came
down to, um, The Chauncey as my first one and Chauncey Gardens as my alternate. And
a lot of it had to do with, um, the things that were in there in terms of drawing more
people downtown, uh, activities for people that would draw more people in terms of the
under -21 crowd, um, new kinds of things, like when it came to sustainability and other
things, I felt that there were enough similarities that, um, that was my choice and to not
belabor it, I'll leave it at that at this point.
Champion/ Well those ... I had the same choices as you. The Chauncey is number one, Chauncey
Gardens is number two. I like the idea, the benefit to the University students and the
University, and the variety of substance in that building. The combination of the
rental/hotel, condos, I just ... I really do love that project, the ... The Chauncey, and then if
we can't make that go then I think Chauncey Gardens also offered a lot of things that
were similar but not the first couple floors.
Dickens/ I'd follow up with that, and most of the younger people that I did talk to were very
excited about the bowling alleys. Having one downtown again, uh, lot of us remember
when Playmore was downtown and uh, we've lost ... we've lost that and it's a long ways
to go up, but uh, lot of younger people, uh, work with and uh, talk to have all been very
excited about that aspect. The film was another. Having the hotel which it's a small
boutique hotel but there's... there's a need for that in downtown. We see that with hotel
Vetro's been very popular (both talking)
Champion/ It's also hotel /motel tax. Plus I love the cocoons.
Dickens/ So that's ... that would be my number one choice and then Chauncey Gardens would be
my second because it offers, you know, almost as much.
Throgmorton/ Well I ... I come up with a very different conclusion. I come up with 4 Zero 4 as
being, uh, my top rank, uh, alternative, with Chauncey Gardens being second and The
Chauncey being third. Uh, the things I like about 4 Zero 4 are it's relatively modest
height and mass. It's unqualified commitment to sustainability. It's linkages to
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 16
important community groups. And it's emphasis on modest income workforce housing.
The least attractive feature, uh, from my point of view is its exterior design, uh, at least as
displayed in the renderings. So that concerns me. With regard to Chauncey Gardens, the
best feature from my point of view is that it ... is the extent to which it has incorporated
publicly accessible green space into the design. I think that's a terrific feature of that
proposal, uh, and its effort to connect the building to the surrounding context in a very
explicit way. It also I think it continues to be easily the best looking in terms of
architectural design of the three alternatives. The worst features in my view are its
height, mass, and the size of its TIF request and one of the things I did when I went
through these was try to relate the ... the amount of money being requested, uh, in terms of
TIF support, uh, relative to the, uh, the features that I value within the ... the buildings. As
far as The Chauncey's concerned, um, what I continue to like most about, uh, it is its
incorporation of FilmScene and its effort to bring other new activities into the downtown
area. I think that's a huge asset. It's least appealing features from my point of view are
that it presumes, uh, users who, uh, are, um, considerably more upscale than, uh, the
wide -range of people who, uh, I would like to see using the downtown. Its overall design
I think, um, is ... is ... to much reflective of one good person's aesthetic judgment about
what good design consists of, and I worry about having too many buildings in the
downtown area that reflect that one view. Uh, it's height and mass are also out of
proportion to the building's context and its TIF request is really large. So those things
concern me a lot, but that's my ranking, and I also ranked, uh, the ... the null alternative,
the baseline alternative against those three, and it ended up being ranked fourth (laughs)
um, but I was aware that, uh, there's a complexity there and that is that the, uh, we were,
uh, all the information contained in the memo from the staff, uh, looked at the baseline
alternative in terms of rezoning it to CB -5 and then making it available to ... to any, um,
willing buyer. Uh, but the staff's memo also says that it will be coming back to us with a
recommend... recommendation that that, uh, area be rezoned to CB -10, and that enhances
the market value of that site. So from my point of view, that really complicates the ... the
thinking about, uh, the ... the merits of the baseline alternative. But anyhow, I've talked
enough. My ranking is 4 Zero 4, Chauncey Gardens, The Chauncey.
Hayek/ Um, I used the, uh, mat ... as I mentioned five minutes ago, used the matrix, um, and it
was helpful, and it helped me, uh, keep my eyes on the criteria, the RFP, um, and the
factors, uh, that we've, uh, decided to, uh, to ... to apply to this process. And, um, where
I'm coming down is ... is with, uh, what appears to be two or three of the others, um, on
...on this issue. I'm ... but I ... but I want to back up and ... and indicate a couple of, uh,
concerns I had initially with my own process that, uh, with respect to the process I follow
that I ... I needed to resolve and one is, I'm acutely aware that, um, we ... we, uh, could be
criticized if we, um, do another, uh, or pursue another project with someone who's done
projects with the City, uh, before. Um, and ... and I anticipate if we go in that direction, at
least tentatively, through this process, we will face that criticism, but I... at the end of the
day for me I think we ... we have an obligation to, um, gauge the proposals on the merits.
Um, and so that ... that political factor, uh, was something I was able to, uh ... um,
compartmentalize because I think it should, um, not dictate the outcome of our process,
and the second thing, um, I'm, uh ... very sensitive to is ... is, uh, the issue that ... or the
concept that ... that one, uh, use or another should go into a particular building. Um, and
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 17
uh ... and ... and you know, the big issue in the room, of course, given where we are and
the ... the number of, uh, applicants that they align themselves with is ... is the Co -op, of
which I'm a member and have great respect for and was in twice yesterday. Um ... uh,
and although I'd love to find a ... other ways to work with that incredibly valued asset, uh,
in this community, I think we can't ... I think we would make a mistake to look at any one
particular, um ... uh, occupant of a building, whether it's the Co -op or ... or ... or FilmScene
or the Bike Library or a bowling alley or anything else, um, singled out and ... and
separated out as, um, as a ... as a strong reason to go with one or another. We are looking
at a building that will hopefully last a century. Will have somewhere between let's say
10 and 20 stories, uh, and will have a multitude of uses over time. That may change, and
I just don't think we can make a decision based on one, uh, particular use. I understand
why that's interesting to people and a lot of the correspondence we got from the public
would ... would focus on one use that was relevant to that person's perspective. I ... I get
that, but I think we have to take a very broad, uh, look at this, and so ... those were two
big struggles I dealt with as I deliberated, uh, by ... you know, by myself and ... and came
up with where I stand and I think at the end of my analysis The Chauncey is the strongest
one, um, in terms of the things we're ... we're attempting to meet. I think it has the
strongest design. I think it has the best mix of...of uses. I think it's uh ... uh, I think
it's ... I think it has the best approach to the residential components we ... we've talked
about, uh, I just think it's the most impactf it across the various categories that we have
discussed. Um, including the financial! Um, and ... and now that ... but having said that,
as we deal with the financial considerations, if that's ... if this is the route we take as a
council, um, you know, I think we need to be very tough on... on, uh, the incentives
discussion, um, with this or any other developer we ... we end up, uh, crafting a deal with.
Um ... and I, you know, we may need to, uh, tweak things, uh ... uh, and time will tell
where that ends up but um... in the entirety, I think, uh, that applicant is the strongest and
has the most potential to do something really positive, uh, for this part of town. So...
Bramel/ I would say ... if you don't mind!
Champion/ No! (several talking)
Bramel/ I would say thank you for all your comments concerning the student, uh, student input
that you've heard. Um, I would ... I completely agree my favorite sits with The
Chauncey, uh, and that is because of the favorite, uh, I talked to so many students about
and they are so much in favor of it. Um, the Student Government collaboration with
FilmScene, uh, it's still finding a place. I think this ... I think FilmScene you could utilize
a theater like this, um, in an excellent way ... that would benefit them and the theater
itself. Um, concerning bowling alleys. It's something we had in the IMU till it got
flooded, of course, 2008 so ... that would be excellent, and a cafe, and I think really what
it comes down to is that this is a perfect opportunity to create a thriving student
alternative to the downtown bars. I think that's really what I like about it the most. So,
my favorite is with The Chauncey.
Dobyns/ I would concur with that! Um, for all, you know, student alternatives. I think that's
important for those of us who, uh, have worked on these issues in the past, um, it would
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 18
be very consistent for me. I too would rate the, uh, The Chauncey as my number one,
with the Chauncey Gardens, uh, being a number two, and 4 Zero 4 as a three. Uh, I'm
very comfortable with the size of the building. I might try a little discussion about The
Chauncey, and there are some options regarding if there should be scaled back a tad or
so. It's only a difference in four. You know, recognizing that this is on the edge of the
central building district, my sense of what the CBD is going to be is it's different from,
you know, the Northside; it's different from the Riverfront Crossing. Um, this is a part
that I think should evolve to some taller buildings, you know, to speak against a
horizontal sprawl. Um, so I'm very comfortable with the size of the building. Um, I
appreciated the shadow concepts. I looked at it and I think that, uh, you know, in
particular for, uh, Trinity Episcopal Church, um, you know, the most important times for
light is on Sunday mornings, and we took a look at that. I think there was a significant
amount of light. I mean there ... there ain't no light in Iowa City at 7:00 A.M. anyway
(laughter) um, but you know for, um ... you know, worship that's after 8:00, I think there
was, you know, significant enough light. So I appreciate it. I don't think there was a
problem even with the taller buildings. I think the problem is that small building looks
diminutive, um, next to a taller building, and you know that's a bit of a concern but I
think that both, uh, of the two towers, um, I think speak to that, um, you know, pretty
well. A concern I had was in the TIF. I think what pushed it for me for The Chauncey
was that development has a track record of very responsible use of tax increment
financing. I think City staff rightly so told us that that would be ... we should weigh that
the heaviest and I think that's ... if that is indeed the case, I think that's probably what
tipped it for me. I agree. I'm very concerned ... the thing I like about the Co -op is that
you get traffic from 8:00 in the morning until 10:00 at night, and we want downtown to
be a walking community where there are lots of people. You know, the Co -op does bring
that, whereas the Film Scene and the bowling alley, um, I did have a chance to talk to
some University colleagues. You know, it's not going to have a whole lot of activity
during the day. It's mainly going to be in the evening hours. I struggled with that and so
for me that was ... what was in the, you know, the two bottom floors of both Chauncey
Gardens and The Chauncey for me was sort of a toss -up. But at the end day I thought it
was a pattern of responsible and established use of tax increment financing, uh, for Iowa
City.
Champion/ I do think that the, um ... the first floor will probably be used a lot during the day as it
progresses with ... with the film students and students at the University. I think it'll be
used a lot.
Dobyns/ It's just hard to know. I mean, it's still speculative.
Hayek/ Well... sorry to exclude you but uh ... uh, looks like five out of the six are ... are consistent.
Mims / And while we didn't go through the matrix here, I would like to say thank you to staff for
the time and effort you put into it, because I think for all of us (several talking) helped,
um, helped kind of a logical... reaffirmation of, you know, maybe a conclusion we'd
come to as we'd listen to public input and had some discussion. Um, and looked at all
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 19
the proposals and relooked at them so I thought it was very helpful, um, even though we
didn't plug all the numbers in here tonight in public.
Champion/Well this is very exciting. This is a big step.
Hayek/ Yeah I ... I echo the thanks to..to staff and ... and those helping us, um, the ... the
information we got in December, uh, was complemented by this. They both served to
consolidate the numbers that came from the various applications and so was handy to
look at this and then go back through the voluminous material we received from the
applicants, as well as the public, um, and have a consolidated set of information that...
that could help at least inform me. So...
Mims/ The only other thing I would like to add is, um ... you know, when you have to select a
preferred developer and you've got two others sitting out here who are obviously very
disappointed that they weren't the ones selected, we had a number of great projects, and
we have a lot more land as we look south of Burlington and other areas and I would
certainly encourage, uh, the two of you that are here tonight that were not selected as
preferred developers, uh, and any others who were part of this original process to, you
know, keep looking at those properties as ... as that process moves forward (coughing,
unable to hear) we had some great applicants here and we'd like to see you back, at least
that'd be my perception.
Hayek/ Yeah, absolutely, and, uh, and...
Mims / And we haven't signed a contract yet with (both talking)
Hayek/ No, we have not! And ... and so, and that's the direction, you know, from ... from staff,
that we need to have a backup in case the ... the preferred scenario does not work out and
that ... that's how we will proceed, and you know, I think one of the things that was really
exciting about this process is the level of interest, um, locally and out of town, um... and
uh, I ... I commend all of the applicants who put the time and the resource... resources into
submitting something, um, and then once again, put more time and resources into this last
round of information requests, um, it's not an easy thing to ... to narrow the list. Um, I
think it's good for Iowa City because it shows a level of interest in our downtown and
redevelopment, but it's hard to ... to look out into the audience and ... and announce a
preference, but that's what we have to do.
Dobyns/ Well I think I ... I'd like to see something very similar to what 4 Zero 4 (mumbled)
Riverfront Crossing, uh, in the future. I think there were some elements there that I'd
like to, you know, I'd be very excited to see that proposal come forth in the future.
Champion/ Yeah, don't throw `em away! (several talking and laughing)
Hayek/ Oh, God, no!
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.
January 8, 2013 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 20
Throgmorton/ I ... I guess I should say I certainly respect the will of the majority. Uh, but I think
it's a mistake.
Dobyns/ Just because of the ... the size, the height, the scope?
Throgmorton/ Well I ... I pretty much identified the things I think about (both talking)
Dobyns/ Okay.
Throgmorton/ I'll reiterate them... reiterate them during the formal.
Dobyns/ At public? Okay.
Hayek/ Okay. Well, what we need to do is, uh, when we get to that item on the agenda, um, I
think this is a motion... a voice vote motion so if someone can tee that up, that would be
good. That's Item 9.
Mims/ Okay.
Hayek/ Okay, I think that's it for the work session. So thank you to everyone, and thank you to
staff and our consultants. We'll come back in an hour and ten minutes for the formal.
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work
session of January 8, 2013.