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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2015-01-06 TranscriptionJanuary 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 1 Council Present: Botchway, Dickens, Dobyns (arrived 5:20), Hayek, Mims, Payne, Throgmorton Staff Present: Markus, Fruin, Rackis, Bramel, Dilkes, Karr, Bowers, Ralston, Yapp, Boothroy, Knoche, Hightshoe, Dulek, Davidson, Howard, Bockenstedt, Andrew, Hargadine Others Present: McCarthy (UISG) Questions from Council re: Agenda Items: ITEM 3d(1) CARTER ESTATE — RESOLUTION APPROVING FINAL PLAT OF CARTER ESTATE Hayek/ Okay! Why don't we, uh, get started. I'd like to welcome everyone to the January 6, 2015, work session. Council Member Dobyns is going to be a little late, but suggested that we go ahead and ... start without him! Uh... first order of business is questions regarding agenda items. Um ... before we start up, there is a, uh... request from ... the applicant, uh... this is the Carter Estate final plat matter under 3d(1) on Consent. Uh, and the request is to defer that until when, the 201h? (response in background) So I'll read the motion to, urn ... reflect that. Um ... I assume but don't know ... that we're re ... we're going to remove the, uh... the rezoning item, uh... on south Dubuque, but I ... throw that out. ITEM 3e(1) REZONING 608, 610 AND 614 S. DUBUQUE STREET LANDMARK DESIGNATION — MOTION SETTING A PUBLIC HEARING FOR JANUARY 20, 2015 ON A REZONING ORDINANCE TO DESIGNATE PROPERTIES LOCATED AT 608, 610 AND 614 S. DUBUQUE STREET AS LOCAL HISTORIC LANDMARKS. (REZ14-00024) Karr/ You have correspondence in front of you this evening that the app ... from the applicant, as well as the property owner. Dilkes/ Well ... yeah, the applicant had previously requested that it be set not on the 20th, but at a later date because he was ... going to be out of town, or not the applicant but the property owner (response in background) um, and that ... that request has been withdrawn. So you'll just set it for the 20th. You don't really have any discretion whether to set it. That's why we put it on the Consent Calendar so ... I don't see the need to remove it. Hayek/ (mumbled) Markus/ So the property owner is in .... isn't objecting to it proceeding as originally intended. Dilkes/ Proceeding on the 201h This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 2 Markus/ Yes. Mims/ Eleanor, can you just explain for our ... benefit and maybe the audience too, why it is that we do not have any cho... before we had a choice about setting a public hearing and now we don't. Just procedurally what that difference is. Dilkes/ The Code says that, um ... once you receive report from, uh, Planning and Zoning, and you receive a report from Historic Preservation, and ... you receive the, um ... comments from the State, all of which you have received, um, you... shall consider it.. . Mims/ Okay! Dilkes/ And in order to consider it, you have to have a public hearing. Mims/ Okay, thank you! Payne/ (several talking) Have we received... have we received it from the State and from... Dilkes/ Yes! Payne/ ... cause we haven't seen it! Karr/ You will at the time of the hearing. Dickens/ Oh, not till then? Mims/ Okay. (talking in background) ITEM 6. LEASE PURCHASE HARRISON STREET PARKING FACILITY — INSTITUTING PROCEEDINGS TO TAKE ADDITIONAL ACTION FOR THE AUTHORIZATION OF A MUNICIPAL PARKING SYSTEM REVENUE LEASE PURCHASE AGREEMENT IN THE PRINCIPAL AMOUNT OF NOT TO EXCEED $16,000,000 FOR THE LEASE PURCHASE ACQUISITION OF THE HARRISON STREET PARKING FACILITY ITEM 7. SABIN TOWNHOMES DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT — RESOLUTION APPROVING A DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT WITH A&M DEVELOPMENT II, LLC FOR THE SABIN TOWNHOMES MULTIFAMILY HOUSING URBAN RENEWAL PROJECT. Hayek/ Okay, and then also, um, Item 6 and 7 regard ... uh, the parking facility and the Sabin Townhomes matter. Um, it's my understanding that there are some details yet to be ironed out, urn ... on at least the Sabin Townhomes portion, and so ... what staff is indicating is that we should open up Item 6, which is the lease purchase, um, open up the public hearing. If there's anyone from the audience who wishes to address Council, take This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 3 that input, but then entertain a motion to continue the hearing and defer action on the resolutions on 6 and 7 until ... the 20th. So if someone can remember to do that. ITEM 3d(4) CPRB EXTENSION - MOTION GRANTING AN EXTENSION TO JANUARY 14, 2015 TO THE CITIZENS POLICE REVIEW BOARD FOR THE FILING OF THE PUBLIC REPORT WITH THE CITY COUNCIL ON COMPLAINT #14-02. Karr/ And then, Mr. Mayor, also be amending the Consent Calendar, removing 3d(4), CPRB extension, and an addition. So it ... as amended. Hayek/ Right! And that was on the agenda addition you sent out. Okay. ITEM 3e(3) SYCAMORE STREET - CITY LIMITS TO SOUTH GILBERT STREET, PHASE 1— RESOLUTION SETTING A PUBLIC HEARING ON JANUARY 20, 2015 ON PLANS, SPECIFICATIONS, FORM OF CONTRACT, AND ESTIMATE OF COST FOR THE CONSTRUCTION OF SYCAMORE STREET - CITY LIMITS TO SOUTH GILBERT STREET, PHASE 1 PROJECT, DIRECTING CITY CLERK TO PUBLISH NOTICE OF SAID HEARING, AND DIRECTING THE CITY ENGINEER TO PLACE SAID PLANS ON FILE FOR PUBLIC INSPECTION. Payne/ I have a question on 3d(3), which is ... it's setting a public hearing for the Sycamore Street, phase 1. My question is more on the design. Can I ask a question on that or should I wait till we actually set the public hearing? (talking in background) 3e(3). Markus/ What ... what's the question? We can... Payne/ I want to know if there's going to be a traffic circle as part of the design. (response from audience) Why? (laughter) Markus/ That you can wait till the (laughter) Payne/ Be prepared! (laughter) ITEM 3d(3) TRANSFER OF DEVELOPMENT RIGHTS TO 912 S. DUBUQUE — RESOLUTION APPROVING A TRANSFER OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION DEVELOPMENT RIGHTS TO 201 E. BENTON AND 912 S. DUBUQUE STREET IN THE RIVERFRONT CROSSINGS — CENTRAL CROSSINGS (RFC -CX) ZONE. Throgmorton/ Matt, with regard to 3d(3), which is the ... transfer of historic preservation development rights for basically the Tate Arms' situation. Uh, I'd like to ask a few questions about it during the discussion of the Consent Calendar, or ... have it separated, I mean, I don't want to vote differently about it, but I'd like to have a few public questions asked about it. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 4 Hayek/ So why don't we ... we have a discussion portion of that vote... Throgmorton/ Right! Hayek/ ... and why (both talking) Throgmorton/ That's what I was thinking. Hayek/ Yeah, sounds good Jim! Throgmorton/ And ... and maybe I should give a heads -up. I'm hoping that the, uh... uh, someone on the staff, John or Karen or somebody could, or Doug, I'm not sure who ... uh, could briefly explain for the public what's involved in a transfer of development rights... situation like this, and es ... especially I asked an email question, Tom, which you... and John are both aware of, about whether those development rights can be sold... to another party at a different property in the district. And ... and, for me that's... that's a pre ... a pretty important question. Markus/ And, Jim, you received a response... Throgmorton/ Yes! Markus/ ...in the affirmative... Throgmorton/ Yes. Markus/ ... so ... do you just want confirmation of that during it, or are you... expecting additional questions regarding it? Throgmorton/ Uh, no, I ... I think I just would pose the question, get an affirmative response, and then maybe I'll say something in response to that but ... but.... Markus/ All right. ITEM 3d(2) PHASE 2 OF THE FIRST AVENUE STORM SEWER IMPROVEMENTS - RESOLUTION ACCEPTING THE WORK FOR THE PHASE 2 OF THE FIRST AVENUE STORM SEWER IMPROVEMENTS PROJECT Payne/ I have a question on ... I think it's 3d(2) ... it's the... acceptance of the work done for phase 2 of the First Avenue storm sewer improvement project. There's an item in the engineer report that says there's a private storm sewer connection for $3,655. Does the City get reimbursed for that? So we make a private connection without reimbursement? Markus/ Ron! This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 5 Knoche/ (response from audience) This was a rebuild of an existing storm sewer system, and in the plans it was missed, and so this was a change order to make the connection back into the new system. Payne/ Okay. Knoche/ So it was a ... it was already existing. Payne/ Thank you! ITEM 3f(7) Johnson County Board of Supervisors: Appreciation for joint meeting and request for 2015 meeting Throgmorton/ I have a question about Item 3f(7), which is just a letter from Supervisor Terrence Neuzil. Uh, and ... and in that letter, Terrence suggests that we arrange another joint meeting sometime in the summer or fall of this year. And I don't know that we need to make any action here, but I think that's a good idea and I would just like to get that on the table. Mims/ I would concur. Payne/ Uh huh. (several responding in background) Botchway/ Maybe not the litany of issues, but I would concur as well. (laughter) Mims/ Little more focused! (laughter) Hayek/ You read those minutes and it's... (laughter) Who's who of issues! (laughter) Other agenda items? ITEM 8. REVISION TO TAXICAB - ORDINANCE AMENDING TITLE 5, ENTITLED "BUSINESS AND LICENSE REGULATIONS," CHAPTER 2, ENTITLED "TAXICABS," IS AMENDED TO PROVIDE FOR THE REGULATION OF RIDE SHARING SERVICES OPERATING VIA A WEB BASED APPLICATION SYSTEM, TO REQUIRE THE CITY TO ISSUE IDENTIFICATION CARDS, TO ELIMINATE THE EXCEPTION FOR DISPATCHING FROM A LOCATION OTHER THAN THE OFFICE FROM MIDNIGHT TO 6:00 AM, TO REQUIRE COLOR SCHEMES, TO REVISE THE DEFINITION OF DESTINATION RATES, AND TO REGULATE SHARED RIDES. (FIRST CONSIDERATION) Botchway/ Item 8. Uh, I think... you made... you were talking about that change on #6 for (mumbled response) Okay! All right, but I ... it was kind of a question I think asked before, but now I can't remember the answer to that, whether or not we made changes that spoke to ... making this applicable for, you know, the web -based application system. Where is ... oh, there you are! Um, but ... I remember that email that said that we This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 6 weren't... based on the current construction of the particular ordinance, we weren't going to be able to ... have Uber or any type ... or that type of ride -sharing program be a part of it and that's okay because we're ... we're just making it for our public safety and our standards first, right? Simon/ Yeah, are you speaking about the, uh, insurance issue? Botchway/ No, no, no! I'm speaking about ... it was the email where there went through each step... Simon/ Oh, sure! Botchway/ ...and said, you know, hey ... if you don't do this or this or this, we're not going to be able to operate our program, and so... Simon/ Yeah, a lot of, uh, the suggestions in that email had to do with, uh, sort of competitive issues between (clears throat) excuse me, between different companies. Uh, and that's something that we didn't feel like we should get involved with. Hayek/ Nice job, Evan, on that. (response in background) Yeah! But ... but (laughter) it was prompted by you and so ... (mumbled) ITEM 7. SABIN TOWNHOMES DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT — RESOLUTION APPROVING A DEVELOPMENT AGREEMENT WITH A&M DEVELOPMENT II, LLC FOR THE SABIN TOWNHOMES MULTIFAMILY HOUSING URBAN RENEWAL PROJECT. Payne/ ...a question on the memo from Tom to Jeff Davidson on IP7, the Sabin Townhomes' agreement. (mumbled) statement in there that says, `If a sale of the units is not possible, it will be the developer's responsibility to rent the units to income -qualified persons.' Markus/ This is ... this is an issue that's going to be, um, continued over, as I understand it, and we're trying to ... um, work out those details. We have a meeting with the developer to try and resolve those issues. Um ... the intent was to ... um, sell the units to a non -for- profit agency and we want ... that has not been consummated yet. So I think ... we're trying to find out the status of that so that that wouldn't even be an issue. Payne/ Okay! Markus/ That's why we decided to continue it. Payne/ Okay! Markus/ To make sure that we could get that locked down. Throgmorton/ It's an impert ... pretty important point, it seems to me! This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 7 Markus/ I think ... the staff of the organization indicated, uh, support for it, but like most organizations, the board at that point had not ratified that decision. Throgmorton/ Uh huh. Dilkes/ Well, and won't by the time we ... we enter into this agreement. So we have to have some contingency in case that doesn't happen. I think we're very optimistic it will happen, but we need a back-up plan. Hayek/ Other agenda questions? Okay! Let's go to the next bullet point, which is, uh, couple of affordable housing items. Turn it over to staff! Affordable Housing: Riverfront Crossing and inclusionaryzoning (IP#3 of 12/31): Markus/ Think, uh, Doug is going to go through his report on this issue and, um ... get into the issue a bit of inclusionary zoning and what our recommendations are for Riverfront Crossing, uh, and then quite frankly this issue kind of spins into the second issue, uh, the letter from the School District, and so we'll continue the conversation into that after we make the break from this item. Boothroy/ Okay, last, uh, June, uh, when you adopted the inclusionary, or excuse me! The form based code for the Riverfront Crossing area the conversation occurred at the Council level about whether or not there should be a, um, a requirement for including affordable housing in this particular area, and as a result of that conversation, staff was, uh, asked to take a look at it, uh, meet with stakeholders, uh, and then come back with recommendations, uh, prior to, uh, drafting any regulations. So ... uh, in late August, September, or early October, uh, I had a number or meetings with for-profit, non for, uh, and non-profit, as well as other stakeholders, uh, to talk about Riverfront Crossings and talk about some of the information that's in the memorandum that you received, and uh, this is the report that I came back with. Now the question before you tonight then is specifically... should Riverfront Crossings' code be amended to require affordable housing as an integral part of any new residential development, and ... I'm talking about residential development here, not commercial development. Um ... one of the things that I mentioned in the memorandum is when I met with the stakeholders, uh, there was, uh... uh... no disagreement. In other words, there was agreement that any time, uh, the City provided any kind of financial assistance to, uh, residential development, uh... we should look at requiring some percentage of that, um ... coming back to us in terms of affordable housing, and I ... I threw out the number 10%, which is something we've been working with with some of the, uh, developments that have come before you already. So, the for- profit, the non-for-prof...all the stakeholders I met with, uh, this whole thing about the... if the City's going to finance a residential development, if the City's going to finance a residential development, then it's appropriate and, uh, if we want to require affordable housing as part of that. So there was general agreement to that. Uh, also there was This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 8 general agreement in the meeting with the stakeholders, uh, that ... uh, if we do inclusionary housing, uh, that it be limited, uh, at least initially to the River Crossing's area as a pilot type program. Uh, for a number of reasons that I explain in the, uh, memorandum in terms of ... all the public benefit that's accruing to this area as a result of public actions through land use changes, density bonuses, public infrastructure improvements and ... and things of that nature. Throgmorton/ Doug, could I ... could I ask a quick question... Boothroy/ Yeah! Throgmorton/ ...just for clarification. When you say `residential,' do you also mean mixed-use projects... Boothroy/ Yes, I do mean ... I do mean mixed-use. Anything that has residential in it, uh... Throgmorton/ Yeah, okay! Boothroy/ Uh, the one thing that, uh, there was not agreement on, uh, the challenge I guess is that with regard to the for-profit is that, uh... uh, they're concerned that the up -zonings and the incentives and the stuff that we're doing will not really effectively off -set the cost of the provision of below -market -rate units, and I think that, uh, that's where we get into the details of ... of the regulations, of the incentives, and other things that ... that we do if we go forward looking at, uh.... a set of policies and requirements for inclusionary housing. In other words, when we figure out what the details then we'll be able to answer that question more specifically but that was the major concern, that the below- market -rate housing doesn't, uh, get subsidized by increasing the cost of the for -market - rate housing, you know, to make up that difference. Uh, cause then you're sort of defeating the whole purpose of what you're doing. Um ... this is the River Crossing district, as you remember, it's a large area. Uh, it's ... it's strategically located, uh, to the center of Iowa City. Uh, it's near downtown; it's near the University of Iowa; it's got the Iowa River running through it; it's got a lot of potential for amenities, uh, and growth. Uh... uh, in the sixties it was a residential neighborhood. It had two grocery stores. It had a park where the County office building was. Uh, it functioned as a ... like a ... a near ...a near northside neighborhood. Uh, over the years it ... it's become what it has through urban renewal and through other public, uh, activity, uh, and zoning, and so this is what we're trying to change, as you know, with a... with a comprehensive planning amendment for the River Crossing's area, as well as the ... zoning changes. So in ... in the memorandum I sent to you, uh, I indicated that ... that, uh, this is a neighborhood of opportunity and uh, the goal of the Riverfront Crossing district is to develop a ... a, and I take this out of the plan -- economically vital, high density, mixed-use, mixed -income, pedestrian friendly, sustainable neighborhood, close to downtown and the University of Iowa, uh, campus. Uh, as I explained in the ... in the memorandum, what makes this a neighborhood of opportunity is the commitment, uh... uh, of public resources to, uh, get this neighborhood, to jump-start this neighborhood again to ... to ... to make it a neighborhood again, uh, and to direct our resources in terms of a lot of capital, millions This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 9 of dollars for improvements, as well as ... as other kinds of benefits to local land use. So the River Crossing Master Plan was adopted in 2012, just to give you some context. In... in June 2014 we ... we adopted the form based code, and you see that ... that there is, this is a map that we did, uh, a while back, all those yellow bullets or whatever you want to call it, balloons, that you see up there indicate, uh, areas of interest. There's a high amount of interest, uh, in doing something in this area, whether it's, uh... uh, what we just recently looked at in terms of, uh, Court -Linn, or whether it's the Hanick project on Riverside Drive, or the University projects. There's a lot of buzz. There's a lot of interest, and people want to ... to move forward with ... with development. When we look at the existing zoning, and I wanted to p ... put up a bit of a comparison here. How ... how we're creating this development capacity as I refer to in the memorandum, and it's a significant increase in development capacity, uh, which is ... which goes to the idea of whether or not as a quid pro quo we should have affordable housing. The, uh, existing zoning, uh, has... a number of zones, as you see CC2, CII, so forth, but as you look at ... a quick summary, uh, essentially three-story buildings, uh, approximately, uh... uh, there's some restriction on residential uses in some zones. Uh, sometimes it's only above the first floor in other zones. Uh, there's a ... mixed uses are limited. Uh, there's not a lot of flexibility in the existing zoning. Uh, the CII zoning, for example, is more of a quasi -commercial/ industrial type zoning. So, uh, the character of...we're trying to change that character by the form based code in terms of what we see in this area. So when we look at the development capacity, uh, what we've done through, uh... uh, the zoning is we've made significant changes with regard to bonuses for building heights. Uh, some are by right, some are by bonuses, uh, we've reduced some parking requirements because of the location of this neighborhood — close to downtown — walkable to the University, downtown. Uh, there's a greater mix of uses that's... that's allowed in this area, and also very important, the City is investing a significant amount of money in infrastructure, whether it's street improvements — Capitol Street's going to be extended. Uh, at some point in the future we'd like to see it go from Burlington Street all the way down and connect into ... into, uh, Kirkwood, and it becomes the edge and the frontage to a major, uh, riverfront park, uh, that's being planned in that particular area, which you're going to see more information about as we go forward. So I ... I put these ... these came out of the, uh... uh, the document that you looked at, the form based code, before to kind of give you a feeling, uh, and there was some discussion about this. This is just for illustration purposes, but as you can see, there was some, uh, increase in density as a matter of right. The next slide will show you that through bonuses and stuff like that, you can actually get... get a significant, uh, increase. Remember in the Riverfront Crossings' form based code, affordable housing is available as an alternative, uh, for a density bonus through, uh, height, but it isn't mandatory. So if you can get your density bonus through environment or through, uh, other ... other features, you don't necessarily have to provide affordable housing. That's why we get into this discussion is that there are ways to do, uh... uh, high-rise housing, uh... uh, under the form based code, in the River Crossing area, without providing, uh, affordable housing. And so, uh, what we're talking about tonight is not making that an option any more. Just some pictures to show that ... this is the, looking at, uh, Riverside Drive, uh, west off of Benton Street, looking west on Benton Street. Uh, as ... as you see, Linder Tire along the river there, uh, and down below, uh, just a concept, you know, you have now Bruegger's coming in kind of... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 10 almost exactly like what you see there on this picture. On the corner, across from McDonald's, and the possibility of upgrading and improving that entire, uh, riverscape, as well as, uh, that neighborhood. Then across the road we recently approved the, uh... uh, multi -family development that, uh, Hanick had proposed. I wanted to show this because of the public improvements that we're putting in the area. Again, take a look at this, the sewage treatment plant is south of Kirkwood Avenue, uh, we're talking about millions and millions of dollars that are going into not only the demolition, but the improvement of the park over time. It will be a destination park. It will be a place for people ... that people will want to come, get close to the edge of the river, sit and enjoy that area, and we're not only improving what we already own with ... which is the sewage treatment plant, but we're extending the park along the river, so we're going to improve that whole river, uh, edge, both on the east side and through development on the west side, to make this amenity an attraction and it will give a definition, uh, to Iowa City, uh, that will be very positive. Uh, you have to the north you have the University property and City Park and the entrance through Dubuque Street. On the south you're going to have this area. I think it'll be extremely attractive, uh, to development, uh, and it is a public benefit that is being accrued to the land that's located within that area, along with those density bonuses. This is happening because you're spending money. This is happening because you're rezoning and, uh, the question then becomes at this moment in time, when we're doing these actions and we're adding significant value to the land, should we be looking at inclusionary housing as a, uh, as a way of recapturing some of that public benefit and value that we've added to the land that's in this area. So inclusionary housing, I sort of defined this already, but I'll ... I'll mention it again. The funda... the fundamental purpose is to provide a minimum percentage of affordable housing units as an integral part of new residential development, and also universally, uh... uh, incentives are commonly provided to developers for the inclusionary, uh, affordable housing. Uh, one of the ... this is just one tool that's used by the cities to increase the production of affordable housing, and I emphasize `one' tool. It ... it's, and it's also, uh, used to establish a relatively permanent stock of affordable housing. There's usually a 20- or 30 -year requirement that it remains affordable. Sometimes longer, but typically it's 20 or 30 years, and it's used to promote mixed income neighborhoods. Now all of these goals here are also goals of the River Crossing area. So inclusionary housing policies are most effective ... and this is ... through everything that you read, is they're most effective when they're mandatory, they're combined with meaningful developer incentives, required in areas of the community that have potential for substantial new residential growth, such as River Crossings. Inclusionary housing is driven by growth. It occurs with new development, and it's in areas where you have growth occurring. So... for development... the developer incentives must be meaningful, achievable, and offset the profits lost on below -market -rate affordable units. As I mentioned earlier, if they don't offset those costs effectively, then you... what... what some communities have found is then it...it raises the price of for-profit ... or... or market -rate units. So you have to get those incentives just right. Uh... therefore, do not impact the price and supply of market -rate units. Inclusionary housing is not a panacea for attaining and solving housing challenges. And I think this is a really important point that we should....we want, we should talk about and leads into some of the things that Tom's talking about later. It doesn't guarantee the ... the production of affordable housing. Uh, if you're not This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page I I in a growth area, and people aren't developing, then there is no, uh, percentage that kicks in. All of these ordinances work where if you have a development and you ... you create let's say X number of units, then out of that creation you're supposed to reserve, uh, a certain percentage for affordable housing. If you're not creating residential units or if you're building them someplace else, then you're not going to create, uh, you're not going to meet the demand or you're not going to do what the ordinance was intended to do, and in some communities — Denver and other communities — they've actually, you know, uh, repealed their affordable housing because, uh, inclusionary provisions, because they didn't get that incentive piece correct. It doesn't guarantee the location of affordable housing in any given school attendance area, and the reason it doesn't is that... is that it's ...it's... it's primarily only in growth areas, and even in those new areas of the community where growth isn't occurring, you're not going to have, uh, affordable housing being created to any significant amount. So, where you have a substantial growth, like the river... potential development capacity like River Crossings. Then I think you have a substantial capability of creating ... (coughing, unable to hear speaker) with regard to inclusionary housing. Where you have, uh, a situation like in Iowa City where you're only creating a limited number of residential units in different neighborhoods, you may not have ... see much impact at all and ... and the impact that you might want to see over time, uh, will take a great deal of time, uh, just because growth is so slow. So it really works where growth is occurring and, uh... and ... where you can provide the incentives through des ... through density and so forth, uh, to have it happen. In some existing neighborhoods, for example, to come in and suggest high-rise developments would be, uh, unacceptable. So it ... the ... inclusionary housing would not be acceptable or even politically a ... uh, capable in some areas of the community, just because of the character of the neighborhood. So ... one of the things that ... that I mention in here is that ... that the public benefits through density, through up -zoning, and ... and allowing mixed uses, through the infrastructure that we've created, uh, accrues to the private sector and they recognize that at this moment in time because it's happening this year. It... started happening in June of 2014. It's real. The park planning is real. So this is a really good moment in time to have this conversation, because if we wait five years, it's as if they've always been there. So ... we need to talk while ... while we're in the... the process of actually making these changes happen and we're having this energy to create what we're ... what's being ... what's happening in this area. The quid pro quo then would be ... the public benefit that we give to the private sector should be returned, a portion of it should be returned in the form of affordable housing. So the first ... let's look at the recommendations. The first recommendation is the one that everybody sort of agreed to, and I say effective immediately, any time the City participates financially in residential development, a minimum of 10% of the units must be designated for affordable housing, and I wanted to clarify, I'm using affordable housing broadly. Not necessarily trying to distinguish between ... zero to 80% and workforce. I'm using affordable housing for 80 to 120% at least, you know, that whole ... that whole range of...of low income, uh, families. And then the second sentence is that the City may consider a fee in lieu of provisional housing, uh, for some types of housing developments, such as all student, because there may be situations where it's not appropriate, or we may not think it's appropriate, uh, for affordable housing to be in, uh, in a student housing project. Um, although, you know, it may be too, so I think it's just something we would look at in terms of...of how we This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 12 address that issue. The second recommendation would be, uh, staff would, uh, convene an ad hoc work committee, and I gave you some names of individuals that have already agreed to serve on the committee. Uh, to study and develop, in other words work out the details of what this would look like, for the City Council's consideration, and inclusionary housing up -zoning requirement for only the River Crossing area, as a... a pilot type project. This committee would include the individuals that have a range of housing experience and expertise, and if you read through the list, you ... you'll see that all of these people on here have been involved either, uh, in the private sector ... well, they ...we have a bank, the bank involved. We have ... we have the Trust Fund involved. We have, uh, for-profit developers, non -for-profit developers. We have the Homebuilder's Association involved. We have a number of people that, uh, had been working in the area of housing, uh, on both sides of...of this issue, and a lot of these individuals that have agreed to ... to come together on this committee have worked together before, uh, either, uh, through projects or ... uh, in ... in other committees that we've had over time, and so it's a good group and I think we can ... we can make some good progress in terms of... of some cohesion, as far as the committee is concerned. However, there is a caveat that I ... I put at the end of the memorandum. This is going to be a difficult process. Uh... uh, get the details, that's where it ... it, that's where we really get into some hard discussions. Uh, and I think that we can work through those. Uh, but as the second bullet point indicates, further study of this issue will be worth the investment of the committee and the City Council's time only if there's genuine interest in pursuing an inclusionary requirement. So, out of respect for all, it's critical that the majority of the Council is willing to give serious consideration to the recommendations of the ad hoc committee. So what I'm saying here with this, when we get to talking about recommendation #2, I want to see four of you say that you'll give this serious consideration. Otherwise, uh, we can go on and do other things. Because we've been talking about this for over 20 years and uh... we might as well not spend more time on this if there isn't four of you that want to give it serious consideration. So, two things, I'd like to go back and start with recommendation #1 but I'd also like to answer any questions, uh, and you might go back to that slide, John, any questions you might have about my memorandum and uh... uh, what we're talking about here. Botchway/ So, for recommendation #1, this is across Iowa City? Boothroy/ No, this is only for River Crossing's area (several responding) Botchway/ Okay. Payne/ And would this be similar to what ... they're asking... what... the Sabin site is asking for? Boothroy/ That's 10%. Payne/ So it is ... it's, yeah, 10%. Um... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 13 Boothroy/ And it's similar to what was in the conversation of Linn and Court. Uh... uh, I think it's come up with the Madison Street proposal. It was with Kevin Kan ... Hanick's proposal. What I'm just basically saying is let's make it official. Payne/ So... Boothroy/ Instead of doing it ... (both talking) Payne/ ...they asked for more money because we ... we, than they would have asked for because of the affordable housing, because they were losing money (both talking) Boothroy/ I don't know about that. Markus/ It ... typically what happens is we conduct a gap analysis and ... when you're ... when you're talking about building affordable housing, you're... you're talking about a differential in profits and a return on investment, and that shows up in that gap analysis. So in ... in effect you are, um, encumbering, uh, a larger gap, which is one of the criteria we use in funding. So, yes, that does create a situation where the public is participating to a greater extent, because we are asking for affordable housing. And I would contend, urn ... that that's an appropriate thing. Dickens/ Does that get us closer (both talking) Markus/ ...if you think... Dickens/ ...to net zero then for the developer? Is that what we're working toward then? Markus/ Yes. I ... I think what we're trying to ... what I would say to you is that ... this is the difference between a public policy and what the free market on its own would likely build. And the public here is saying ... you know, at least represented by the staff that you see in front of you, that it's a public policy to provide affordable housing. And as ... as such, it's my belief that the public then should participate in that cost. It's nice to be able to say that our public policy is that we're going to provide 10% housing and shift the burden to the private sector! I don't think that's appropriate! And if...if you're serious about this issue, then I think we have to step up and participate. To what degree, to what level? You know, remains to be seen, but it shows up in the gap analysis, which then is the basis for what we involve ourselves in, in terms of tax increment financing. Boothroy/ And I think also keep ... keep in mind that it's not just the financing that's happening, like on Linn and Court. It's also the density bonuses that they're getting, as well, so they're building a higher level product based on our, uh, change in terms of what they can do on the site. So they ... they've gotten more than just the financing. They've also got... got the development capacity on ... on that site, as well. Payne/ In some cases! Not in the Sabin site (both talking) This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 14 Boothroy/ ...but in most cases in the River Crossing area we've increased development capacity. Payne/ And ... and in addition, to that ... then the ... (noises on mic) the units are not on the tax rolls, so we're not collecting any tax for them. So there's another ... (both talking) Boothroy/ ...if that's... Payne/ At the Sabin site we're not collecting any tax. (both talking) Boothroy/ ... don't know if that's a given. It may be or may not be. Payne/ Okay. Boothroy/ Depending on how they're ... how it's been ... how it's dealt with, yes. Payne/ And it's really ... I'm going to say, you're saying affordable housing but you're really talking about subsidized housing. Boothroy/ The units are, uh ... subsidized through the financing if that's what you're... you're saying, but to some degree it's also through, uh... you know, when you look at the density bonuses. If you go from a ... somebody that can put a four-story building on a site to a 15 - story building, uh, we have given them significant value, and actually you're getting that back a little bit cause they're going to pay you ... pay you for a value that may not have existed there before. Markus/ (both talking) Payne/ But I'm talking about affordable for the end ... the end person, the person that's going to actually live there. Markus/ Yeah, and ... and ... and I think to some degree that depends on whether it's an ownership unit or a rental unit, and who actually owns the unit in terms of whether it's taxable or not. Payne/ But either way, it's subsidized somehow. Because if we're paying mark ... if somebody is paying market rate, somebody that makes $57,000 a year can't afford something that's $200,000. So it's going to have to be subsidized whether they're buying it or renting it. Markus/ And that's what creates that gap! Hayek/ So the part I'm not understanding here has to do with the ... the second recommendation. Would ... would it be the intention of the group to look at a mandatory policy ... that regards the incentive to the developer as these public benefits that accrue from the park, density bonus, etc., or is it your intention to look at an actual financial... Markus/ Yes! This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 15 Hayek/ ... gap. Markus/ Yes it is! Hayek/ Because I'm ... I'm, I hear, Doug, I hear you talk about all these public benefits down there, which I don't disagree with, but I would also say that land values have skyrocketed, and so these developers are paying for that ... added value (both talking) Boothroy/ Yes. Hayek/ And that... doesn't necessarily answer whether they can... or should... shoulder the burden of setting aside a certain percentage for affordable housing (both talking) Boothroy/ This doesn't work without developers involved. This doesn't work unless it (coughing, unable to hear speaker) they can see that balance, and so that's why they're at the table, to ... to bring that reality to ... and frankly, uh, the ... the non-profit, as well as the for-profit, get that in terms of what that balance sheet looks like in terms of providing affordable housing. Uh... that is ... that is part of the details that we have to talk about. How do we create incentives that ... level that playing field, or make that net zero -type of approach, because the ... like you said, the park while it has increased the value, they're not going to see it directly on the ... you know, they ... they don't see it in the same way we see it. You see what I'm saying? But they do see that ... if they've gone from a three- story building to a 15 -story building that they're going to have the ability to provide more units, and to some degree, uh, there may be incentives in terms of (coughing, unable to hear speaker) other things that ... that they can't offset that cost. (mumbled) other words let me say that ... let's take providing parking. Well you... it costs you X dollars to provide every parking space, because it's going to be in some kind of a structure. If you don't have to provide as much parking for affordable housing, for whatever... whatever we come up with, then that's a cost savings that can be worked into coming up with whether that cen... incentive off -balances the cost of providing for ... the market -rate units. That's one op ... that's one example ... of how .... how you can save money, in terms of ... of the development costs. The other ... the other thing that I think is a concern is what is the ...is what's happening in the street, and the infrastructure. Are we improving that? Or are they going to be required to improve `em. We have to have, you know, if...if that's ... if that's infrastructure's upgraded, which you know, we're looking at Clinton Street as being an avenue down to the park. We're looking at Capitol Street, and that has a bearing on the cost of development on that site, because they're not having to make all of those improvements as well. You know, street improvements and things of that nature. So there ... I think there are some areas where they can ... where we can talk about where they can have cost savings. Markus/ Let me ... let me just give you some numbers. Um, in a ... in a report published in 2... 2007, affordable housing market analysis commissioned by, uh, Iowa City. The total affordable housing need for 2007 through 2012, uh, for the metro area was estimated at 2,739 units. There's no doubt, uh, in the staff mind that deals with these issues all the This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 16 time that that ... that number has grown, um, continuously, and then for Iowa City alone, um, the ... total, uh, Iowa City affordable housing demand by, uh, through 2000, uh, 2000 to 2012, all other households, um ... I think the total with, uh, over 80% was close to 1,900 units, as well. And so we've been, you know, um ... when I get into my discussion in response to the Iowa City, um, School District's letter, um, you can see where we have been talking about this, uh, for well over a decade and ... uh, we get caught up in this issue of ... well what's the whole region doing, what are our neighbors doing, why is this burden left to Iowa City, and so ... that ... the, kind of the plan, the thought process here is to take a look at this, um ... uh, River Crossing's ... Riverfront Crossing's area and kind of treat it as a pilot. We don't have all the answers tonight. We don't know exactly how all of the details would work out in this, but we thought i ... initially the first step would be to requite anybody that received, uh, TIF financing, uh, for them to, uh, meet the requirement of about 10%, and then to put this, uh, task force together, um, that would include non -for-profit housing providers, um ... um, private developers, um, City staff, and... and others interested in... in providing this housing stock, and seeing if we couldn't come up with, um, ordinances, uh, rules and regulations, likely financial models that would make sense to you and to the public that would end up with 10%, um, housing. My personal opinion is that 10% housing almost disappears within the neighborhoods and if you want to integrate, um, persons that are eligible for this type of housing, scattered site in my opinion is the best way to go about this. So ... our, I know the reluctance of ... of ... of, uh, some of the public not to get into this issue, because our neighbors haven't stepped up to it or the region hasn't stepped up to it, but quite frankly you're going to be here 10 years from now talking about this very issue, unless you take a bold step and jump into this type of, uh, program, and ... and we haven't fleshed out all the details. We acknowledge that; we admit that. But I think at the end of the day it's the right thing to do. There is a demand. It's a documented demand that we need this kind of housing, and I don't want to see it all concentrated in one area, so that develops a stereotype, and I think scattered site is the way to go about doing this, and I think this is a good area to pilot this type of issue. Throgmorton/ So I'd like .... I'd like to toss in two -cents worth, uh, here. Uh, first to answer Doug's question, I support the second recommendation and I personally would give very strong consideration to the recommendations that come from that committee. So, just to be clear about that. Uh, secondly, uh, Matt, you used the term'skyrocketing' uh, land values in the area. Uh, I think that's true. I don't ... I don't personally have evidence about that, but I think that's true, but if it's true ... then somebody's making a windfall profit, and that windfall profit is coming from investments the City has made. It's coming from the adoption of the Riverfront Crossing's plan. It's coming from adoption of the form based code, and it's coming from the density bonuses embedded in the code. That ... that's where it's coming from! It's not coming from investments that those landowners have made up to this point in time. So it's a windfall profit going for them, and we are subsidizing their windfall profit! So it...it seems to me that it's completely reasonable... in that context, completely reasonable that we recoup some of that by expecting some portion, 10%'s a reasonable number, uh, some portion of that, of their ... of new developments to contain affordable housing. That said, so... support the second recommendation. I ... I'm a little bit surprised to hear, Doug, you refer to `up to 120%' of This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 17 area median income. Because that's not been the issue as far as I know, in terms of affordable housing in the Iowa City area over the past 20 years. It's been more a ... about, say at 80% or below. Boothroy/ And (both talking) the committee would work through. I ... what I was trying to say is that when I was talking about affordable housing, I was going back to the memorandum that you got last fall, I think they talked about it being defined as between, you know, 80 and 120%. Uh, I was trying to clarify that I wasn't talking about only just the 80 ... up to 80%, uh, part of it. So, uh... a lot of this detail has to be worked out, and ... and the ad hoc committee, with the developers on there, uh, as I said, they have to be involved and it has to make financial sense if it's going to work. Uh, and you know we're going to have to work through that... that... that's a challenge, and it's going to be difficult one to work through, but it's going to ... it's ... if it doesn't make any financial sense to anybody, then it ... then we're not going to make it ... make it go. And that's one of the things that they're going to have to ... to wrestle with. Dobyns/ One of the things to make it more (clears throat) make more financial sense, they could ask for a height or density bonus, but my sense is they could also come to us for a TIF request. Boothroy/ For a what? Dobyns/ A TIF ... request. Boothroy/ Or both! Dobyns/ Or both! Um, so my sense is, thinking about what Jim was saying, is that when we take a look at the gap analysis for such a TIF request, um ... we take a look at it fairly and say, okay, the developer should make a fair profit. But we take a look at it fairly. I ... I think we analyze it to make sure that they don't get an inordinate profit, even if there are skyrocketing costs to contend with. I think that's part of what a gap analysis is. Payne/ But ... from Jim ... from what Jim's saying you have a landowner that's selling a piece of property and you have a developer that's buying it. So the landowner is who's making the profit from the developer that's buying it. The developer is who we have to incent to ... put in the affordable housing. They're the one that's paying the ... increase in costs. The landowner that's selling the land, they're just making a profit and running away, or whatever they're doing with their profit. So ... saying that the developer has to take the brunt of it isn't the ... isn't the answer, because that's not the person that made the money. The landowner who sold them the land is who's making the money. Throgmorton/ Seems to me Doug's addressing that. He ... he's telling us that ... we want to create ... he's recommending that we create a committee so that developers, landowners, non -profits, etc., will have a ... a, be able to jointly develop proposals that work from their point of view ... their points of view. And that they can recommend to us unanimously, I mean, I think that's ... your ambition, right? This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 18 Boothroy/ Yes. Throgmorton/ So in that case... they... they wouldn't, the developers wouldn't be bearing a brunt of anything. They will ... would have... acknowledged what's going on (both talking) Payne/ I understand what the committee's doing, but what I'm ... I'm addressing what you said... is, the developer isn't the one that's necessarily making the huge profit on the sale of the land. The person that owns the land (both talking) Throgmorton/ ...the landowner's making the profit on the sale of the land, but I'm pretty confident the developer will not be ... not making a profit. Payne/ Right! Right! Dobyns/ Doug, is this, um, it says affordable housing up there. Is this ... if this committee is approved by us, does this committee go into these meetings having no specific definition of affordable housing? Boothroy/ Well I would use the memorandum that ... l, okay, there ... there are... Dobyns/ You said it's a broad, you mentioned (both talking) Boothroy/ ...one of the things that we'll talk about is ... is, uh... uh... you know, what percent of that affordable housing should be either workforce or... or lower income, and... and in some communities they ... they split out the incentives based on, you know, if it's at 80% or ... or higher, uh, and they get ... we have to wrestle with that number, uh, to be honest with you. I think that in my conversations with the for-profit people, when we were talking about homeownership, they were looking at... it has to be at least at 120% in order to make homeownership work, and that was that conversation. When it was ... we were talking about rental housing, we were talking 80%. So ... you know, that's... that's... we'll have to work through that in terms of what that looks like. Dobyns/ I ... I'm supportive of this but I know there are some members of the committee where TIF is always a bad three -letter word, no matter what it's used for, and I think they could look at this as a Trojan horse, is that it brings in needed affordable housing, yet really what it is, it's more opportunities for developers to ask for a TIF request. From my point of view, that's fine with me, cause I think that's okay, um, if that's sort of a ... I mean, I think where you should anticipate if this committee comes through is that there ... that might be a consequence. I'm okay with that, cause I think this is in the public good. Hayek/ What I ... what I would say is, I mean, Jim, your point is fair that the increasing values in that area are ... to some degree the result of public investment. Um, I don't disagree with that, but I would say the same argument can be made throughout the community. When we invested in the park near your home, uh, next to Horace Mann, that didn't hurt home This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 19 values in that area. When we built a fire station somewhere, when we improve a road (both talking) you know, we make public investments all the time in the community. Throgmorton/ Yeah. Hayek/ That's one of our five... strategic priorities is to invest in our neighborhoods, and the point is to ... to benefit, uh, the people who ... who live there. Um ... to ... to ... to answer your question, Doug, I... it seems to me, I think we can agree that affordable housing is a public good. It's ... it's a ... it's a ... it's a public good. Um, and if...if the intent of the committee would be to come to the Council with a recommendation ... that the public... through a ... that the public pay for this public good and not ... place it on the developers to provide, then I can give its due consideration, but I ... I've been ... I've been involved with this since 2000...4. Well, before that when I was on HCDC (both talking) Boothroy/ ... go back a decade on you (both talking and laughing) Hayek/ Yeah, I know it's ... hate looking at those old, uh ... (several talking and laughing) but I've been consistent about this, that... that... that the...the problem for me with ... with mandatory inclusionary zoning is that people often talk about it in terms of making it a requirement that the private sector provide what I regard as a public good, and it seems to me that just like with, uh ... environmental concerns or the other things that we've identified through our planning process as important for the public, if ... if housing is important to the public, uh, and we want to take steps to provide it, then we as a community should pay for it. Markus/ And ... and I would add to that comment, and that is ... if Iowa City does it, in terms of imposing the requirement and the expectation is that the private sector's going to do it without public participation and your neighbors don't, the consequence is going to be that you're going to shift development demand to the jurisdictions that don't have it, which is why I think it's essential that the public here participate in it, and I think we also have to find pressure points, okay, to make sure that our neighbors are doing this as well. And that kind of rolls into the ... this school discussion. Because if you're not providing affordable housing in ... across the entire school district, then you're going to burden schools just in Iowa City with, um, you know, a... affordable housing and more of the, uh, the poverty concerns in one area, and you're going to have a ... an entirely set of cir... different set of circumstances, where they're not providing affordable housing, and the whole point is is to have it dispersed so that your schools have a balance in the diverse population of students across all socio-economic, uh, strata. And... and if you don't get that imposed in the other jurisdictions, you're not going to accomplish that! So... Hayek/ I agree. Payne/ So...(both talking) This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 20 Markus/ That's why we're not recommending at this particular time that this be spread across, universally across the entire city. We want to show how this can work, and we want to use this as a model and find out how to influence these same types of actions to occur in other jurisdictions. Throgmorton/ So we (both talking) Markus/ ...hasn't happened! Throgmorton/ So we should be clear. This is a major step that the staff is recommending to us. It's a major step that actually moves us in the direction of providing affordable housing, within Iowa City, and Tom's letter addresses a ... proposes a way of trying to move forward at a regional level. So we ... we can make that major step and actually respond to the, uh, concerns that have been expressed for decades here, or ... we can, you know, close the books and walk away from it. That ... that's the choice we have right now, and I think not closing the books and walking away is the ... what we should do. We should be responding to the staff's recommendations ... very positively (both talking) Boothroy/ ...get back to you (mumbled) on ... is that ... it's critical that this makes financial sense. As I mentioned earlier, if it doesn't make any financial sense, then it won't succeed. And we're not ... at least I'm not about proposing anything that isn't going to be ... that's not going to be able to work, and ... or have negative externalities that ... that push, uh, development someplace else or raise the ... the price of for -market rate, uh, units. So, that's one of the challenges that the committee has is how to come up with a set of, uh, policies or re ... requirements or incentives, uh, that make sense. That are practical and make sense in terms of the development world. That ... and that's a challenge! Hayek/ (several talking) Let me just say one thing before... cause it's directly relevant. I ... I appreciate that, and I think, you know ... going to ... going to the sort of 30,000 -foot, uh, view, I... you know, I think for decades Iowa City, um, suffered in the area of development, for a variety of reasons. I ... I think our... our processes were either by... by virtue of perception or ... were actually, uh, more burdensome to the development community. There were more restrictions and ... and whether that was true or just ... that ...that was the perception, I think we ... we suffered for ... for a period of time, and that's one of the reasons we have imbalance. Um, I think we've made very good progress over the last several years to bridge those gaps and... and promote the kind of growth that I think we need to provide for the services we as a community want. I don't want us to take a step backwards in a very important, strategically important area of the community. I think we're on the same page. Boothroy/ Well we're not gonna do that! Hayek/ Yeah! Boothroy/ Yeah. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 21 Hayek/ What's ... what schools does this ... does RFC feed into? Elementary and... secondary? Throgmorton/ Twain? Boothroy/ Uh, I didn't look that up. I don't know! Um... Payne/ That was my question that I was going to ask. Is it more than one school? Elementary school district, or is it all in one? Boothroy/ I don't think there are many students in this district right now at all so... Payne/ But it still has to be in some district (both talking) Boothroy/ ...don't know the answer to (response from audience) Yeah, Roosevelt no longer exists. Do ... does anybody know? Dobyns/ But I would think the kind of affordable housing that would populate this area, if this goes forward, wouldn't necessarily be families. I mean, would be my sense. Boothroy/ Yeah (several talking) Might not be. Dobyns/ This is basically a model that hopefully we could potentially carry to other elementary school footprints that do have low ... or FRLS (mumbled) the best. Botchway/ So I mean ... the reason I was asking whether or not this was for the entire Iowa City before, you know, I was ... kind of a long-winded question and answer session back and forth, but my issue with this is kind of going back to ... if this is a pilot, how long is this pilot going to be? I mean, we don't have an answer for that. It could be ... five years... 10 years. Boothroy/ Well I don't even know if we're going to have regulations yet until we get through the committee, but (both talking) Botchway/ Well and basically what (both talking) Boothroy/ ...I think it has to have time to breathe, and uh... uh, what I can tell you is what I said earlier is when I met with the stakeholders is that, you know, they saw it ... this neighborhood, because of everything that we're doing, as an opportunity to actually consider experimenting with inclusionary housing if we can come up with a financially, uh... uh, practical plan to ... to make that happen. Um ... whether or not it would apply to other parts of the community, we'll ... we'll have to wait and see. Uh, I ... we don't have an answer for that at this point. (several talking) Markus/ And ... and I would suggest to you that it needs to be strategic ... to just blanketly pass an ordinance that applies universally across this entire community to me... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 22 Boothroy/ It won't work. Markus/ ...to me is ... is not going to work and here's why. Because there are certain school districts that are disproportionately, um ... of lower socio-economic, um, means and then to impose a requirement on those areas (difficult to hear) exacerbate the problem. I think what I would say to you is ... we ... elected officials need to get engaged with their fellow elected officials in the other jurisdictions, and the School Board, to get them on the same page ... in this discussion in those other jurisdictions. Because I can tell you where these new schools are occurring in some of the suburban environments, the ... the strata of socio -economics is going to be at the higher end, and quite frankly those places are going to (coughing, unable to hear speaker) 10%, you know, affordable criteria to even have any diversity in those schools. So, my hope is is that by creating the pilot, stepping ahead ...I can tell ya, Kingsley, for years the discussion has been in ... in our community and other places, well, if the region doesn't do it, we're not doing it. Well, you know what? You're not going to get anything done if that attitude prevails! So this is an attempt to at least start the process, to get people down that path, to show that it can work, that it's not, you know, it's not a negative. It's actually a positive! But I think it has to be used strategically. I think you want to use it when you (away from mic) Okay? Maybe that's the next step that you use it in in Iowa City. I think ... I think you need to figure out how to create pressure points on these other jurisdictions. I'll give you an example. Grade schools, middle schools, and high schools all have walkable areas. When these school siting decisions are being made, what I think needs to happen is they need to look at those site conditions to determine if certain densities can be accrued there. I've been told by staff that we have a school here in town that has 400 housing units within the half mile radius for a... for a primary school, and you can go to a school north of here and there's 70 housing units in that area. So ... there's a sustainability issue. Now if you layer on top of that issue a 10% affordable criteria, I think you've actually accomplished something by at least introducing the socio-economic strata that belongs in those places. But all of us, okay, local elected officials, our State representatives need to get on all of us, okay, and our neighbors, to push this issue so that affordable housing is scattered throughout. And I'm a firm believer that scattered is the right way to do it, rather than concentrated, cause I think it gets identified in a negative way when it's entirely concentrated! So, I don't see us just blanketly coming out of this, passing ordinances across the entire community! I think it has to be strategic. Well, and I'm not disagreeing with that. I just want us to give some strong consideration behind the fact that ... say this ... say this works, and it sounds like, you know, from a... from the standpoint of we would be giving, I mean, and this is ... kind of using your thoughts, we'd be giving money to developers to give us affordable housing. I mean, from a simplistic equation standpoint it sounded like, you know, that would be something that me as a developer would want to do and especially if the City was going to give me money to do that. So I al .... almost feel... I wouldn't say certain, but I feel pretty good about the fact that this could work in this particular area. My issue is with the timeframe, because while we are looking at this pilot project, and I'm glad that we're doing it. I'm in support of the recommendations. I'm also worried about all the other developments that are going up, knowing that we don't believe, and I think this was in the memo as well, that we can have affordable housing once ... we can't put in affordable housing or infuse affordable housing into the areas after This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 23 they're already developed, and so while I think this was a great start and I ... I mean, I echo Jim's point as far as it being a small step ... I just feel like we still need to consider... the outward ... the moving outward of Iowa City, and ... the la ... still lack of affordable housing. When you ... you quoted off the numbers yourself. I mean, it's ... it's a huge issue, and I just feel like this is just a dent. Dobyns/ Uh huh. Markus/ Okay, let ... let me ... let me just divert for a second here. I think the letter from the School (several talking in background; speaker is away from mic) into the area of housing when in fact... the... the issue that drove us, or drove the School into the discussion of housing is the diversity policy of the School District (several talking in background; speaker is away from mic) ... and I would say to you that housing is a very long-term issue in dealing with the diversity (unable to hear speaker) and I think there's ...there's issues that quite frankly that's a long-term proposition to try and balance the equity of the schools, but the problem is current ... the problem is (unable to hear speaker) they need to deal with catchment areas for these schools, and I think they need to deal with, um, distribution of resources (unable to hear speaker) but teachers and maybe class sizes and some of those, and I think quite frankly we can get diverted in this real conversation because it's not just a conversation about housing. This came from the Schools, and I think this is an issue about diversity in the schools, and among the schools, and how they're all being dealt with, and so ... I don't want to lose momentum on the diversity policy, which has kind of taken a bit of a set -back, at the School District, but I think at the same time that needs to be dealt with on a more immediate basis. Anything we do in terms of inclusionary zoning and addressing the housing issues is a longer term process. It may be decades long before it affects the actual, um, diversity make-up of a particular school. But we have schools right now that have a preponderance of ... of ... of, uh, more lower income strata in the socio-economic wave that need to be dealt with right now. And I don't want all of our attention diverted away from that, because it's a housing issue. There's certain things that need to be dealt with at the schools right now. Botchway/ And, Tom, I don't disagree with it from a ... one more point, I don't disagree from a School District standpoint, but I also ... am thinking about it from a young professional standpoint as well. I mean, graduating as a student, people moving back here I think we had a recent, um ... uh... uh, report or analysis on, you know, elderly people that want to move back or elderly people w ho want to downsize and move closer to the downtown, I mean, so ... while the schoo... I mean I'm not poo-pooing on the School District and wanting that to be a part of it, but ... you know, again, for 20 years we've talked about this issue as far as, you know, from a lot of different facets and from my particular personal perspective, I mean, as a young professional, and as a minority young professional, I would be ... affordable housing makes sense, and I just, again, I'm just trying to make sure that we ... don't ... sink our teeth into just this little morsel and forget about all the other issues or all the other places where we need affordable housing, I guess that's all I'm trying to say. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 24 Payne/ And ... and what I was going to say, Kingsley, is ... when he said pilot project, to me it's a pilot project, but if in three years it's working, it doesn't mean we couldn't... expand it out to someplace else. Pilot project just means we're gonna start here! It doesn't mean it's a ... it's gonna have to last 30 years before we do it someplace else. It's just ... if it works here, in three years maybe we can take some of those ideas and tweak them or in ...18 months maybe we can. I mean, pilot doesn't mean it has to end before you implement it. Botchway/ I ... I agree. Throgmorton/ Yeah, I agree with Michelle. Thanks for bringing up that particular point. I ... I wanted to reinforce something Tom has said. I think what (several talking) Mims/ I mean, Doug needs a head count. Okay? He's (several talking) okay, I think we need to move on here. Okay? (several talking) Hayek/ Go ahead. McCarthy/ Yeah, I wasn't following the rationale for the... student housing not being included in that. Boothroy/ No, it's an option (both talking) McCarthy/ Okay, why is it not an option for any other development? Boothroy/ Oh it could be, I mean, it ... you could have it, uh... uh, fee in lieu of for all developments. McCarthy/ Okay. Boothroy/ Uh, that was just, uh... you know, I think when we ... when the committee looks at this, we're gonna look at the whole area (both talking) McCarthy/ So the details of ... (both talking) Boothroy/ ...one of the prop ... one of the things that I think is important for inclusionary housing is that there is a fee in lieu of, uh, where it may not be the right mix. McCarthy/ So the details of that would be up to the committee then. Boothroy/ Yeah. McCarthy/ Okay, that's all I wanted. Thanks. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 25 Hayek/ So let's do this. I think there's a majority that supports #1 and #2. And ... as to #2, subject to those caveats we've talked about, and that mutual understanding, but correct me if I'm wrong. Mims/ Yes, I'm supportive! Hayek/ Okay. Botchway/ I don't understand what you mean by the caveats. Hayek/ Well my caveat being (several talking) give it fair consideration with ... with the (several talking) Boothroy/ ... serious consideration so if this committee comes together unanimously and comes back with a recommendation, you'd give it... Mims/ Serious ... (both talking) serious consideration. Yeah. Hayek/ Let's switch to the hou... to the ICCSD issue. Now we're probably going to run out of time during our work session. Markus/ I'll be quick! Hayek/ And, well (laughter) It's okay if we do. I think ... we've got a short agenda tonight. We can always... Mims/ Come back. Hayek/ ... go back to the work session post -formal (several talking) ICCSD Housing Letter (IP4 of 12/31 Info PkL Markus/ So we got a letter from, uh, the Iowa City, uh, Community School District. It was dated October 13, 2014. It was sent to Iowa City, North Liberty, Hills, Coralville, University Heights, and the County Board of Supervisors. And in essence what this letter says is that they want each municipality and the County to codify policies regarding inclusionary zoning. So, that's why we're setting up here in this transition because we just had this whole conversation about inclusionary zoning, and I think you're moving forward in that particular direction based on what I just heard the Council say. Reinvest in areas of our community where there is socio-economic isolation. What I would say to you is that's one of our, uh, strategic plan goals, and um, I can list a whole thing ... a number of things that we are currently investing in in our neighborhoods, um, in fact if you want to hear `em, let me see if I can ... pull them out. Um ... there's UniverCity, there's the GRIP program, there's park improvements that we've made, um, just the initiative to bring the ... the two new elementary schools into the community, and at the same time upgrading the existing schools that ... that we already have, um, so I ... I'd say that we are This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 26 meeting that terminology and if you want to get into the actual details you can ... you can read through the report, and then finally ... it was to place restrictions on rental units and rental density. And in fact we, uh, passed that, uh, scattered site map and have controlled where we will invest in public ... I think it's rental housing exclusively. Um, in certain areas in the community so that we don't over -dominate some of those areas, and I can tell you that we get push -back about that! We have some of the non-profit housing providers that are kind of perturbed with us that they can't purchase properties in those areas because quite frankly the values in those areas are lower and therefore they feel like they're missing opportunities to get into those areas, to develop more housing. Which kind of goes to my same argument about you have to be strategic about inclusionary zoning and not push it into areas possibly where you already have a preponderance of, um, the lower strata of socio -economics in a particular school district. So, without going into a lot of ... of detail about the ... the report itself, um, we responded to all those issues. This issue's been going on here since, uh, I think it's 2003. Uh, Mayor Hayek and ... who was not the mayor at the time, headed up a task force in response to a School District letter. Um, not unlike the letter you just recently received about doing some of those things. Um ... two things came out of that report that came out of it. One was the scattered site map that we created, um, as to where we're going to locate, uh, public housing, and a minority report suggested that we, um, consider inclusionary zoning back at that time and ... and we didn't do that. So ... there's ... there is a lot of discussion that's gone on back and forth. I can tell you the amount of housing ... that is subsidized, uh, currently in our community, uh, amounts to about 1,099 units, and uh, that by comparison, we have about 18,000 total rennit ... rental permits in our community. So it's a very small percentage of the housing stock that we're providing on a subsidized basis. Um, I'd be glad to ... I think ... I think the dilemma, um, that we see in the request from the School District is that housing issues are going to take years to change the ... the, uh, socio-economic strata of any particular school. And I think quite frankly that we need to make sure that the School understands that we know that we have a current problem with some of the schools, um, in terms of their dominance of... of, uh, poverty, and that we have ... we have an expectation that the School Board's gonna address those current issues, um, without waiting on school issues. And I don't want our attention diverted to just the housing issue, and I'm kind of looking at you and (laughter) your new role, um, at the School District, um, that that needs to be addressed at the school level, and ... and, you know, we're willing to help; we're willing to assist in that regard, but ... the housing issue is a much longer term fix to these things, and I think we need to step into it, test it, see what makes it work, and then expand it to other parts of our community, and I think what we need to do is we need to probably create some relationships with our neighbors, to start to get them to understand the problem, and ... and raise the expectation by us and others in the community who are concerned about these issues, that they need to join in as well. This School District doesn't stop at our city limits. This School District covers a number of jurisdictions. And the expectation from the School District should be across the entire school district boundary. Now I would say to you, the School District, you know, went out and bought a bunch of sites for new schools. And the School District is now in a position where they're investing in public infrastructure to serve those schools. The School District's in a position where they can use their leverage ... to encourage. I'm saying that nicely. To encourage this very issue in those jurisdictions, as well, and they This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 27 need to step up to that and make those demands and requirements of our other jurisdictions. So ... this letter is to be discussed by you folks, our council, and all the other persons that it was addressed to, and you're going to return on ... the joint meeting... Karr/ (away from mic, unable to hear clearly) Markus/ The 20t11 is it? Hayek/20 ... 6th . (several talking) Markus/ 26th, and you're going to have this discussion amongst yourselves, and I think it's time for everybody to sit down, including the School District, and I think some leadership needs to be shown in dealing with the affordable housing issues and how it impacts our... our, um, education system and how it impacts our labor market, and quite frankly, it's ... it's a need that is way underserved, and we need to deal with it! So, with that I'll be glad to answer any questions. Um, the report goes into a lot of information, some historic. Uh, Eleanor was good enough to provide some of the things that we've already done. We then also talked about different strategies. We wanted to at least offer a solution and our solution is, is that the School maintains a lot of leverage to make some of these things happen, and ... the combi... you know, when you talk about our strategic plan, there's two overriding elements. One is inclusivity, and one is sustainability. And what could be more sustainable than providing a significant concentration within the walking distance of our schools, and then as an overlay on top of that, providing a requirement that those areas have, um, inclusionary zoning to provide affordable housing. Throgmorton/ So I ... I think those two suggestions are really very promising and I want to praise you for even suggesting them. Uh, it does make me wonder whether there's, uh, whether... anyone on staff is aware of other ... uh, small to medium-sized metropolitan areas that have tried such an experiment with regard to the school district. To ... it's a really interesting innovation, it seems to me. Uh, and ... and very promising. So, it'd be worth kinda checkin' it out, in terms of what other communities might, uh, might have done. Markus/ I .... 1, you know, I can tell you, I mean, I've been around a long time, looking at different places and how they do things (laughs) and more on a racial basis, you know, the places like Oak Park, Illinois, and Shaker Heights, um, outside of Cleveland, um, they have constantly been working on diversity issues and trying to diversity populations. This is a little different (both talking) Throgmorton/ Yeah, our ... our place is very different, so I'm won ... I'm wondering mainly about... college towns, somewhere between 50 and 100,000 population that have one school district serving all the man... municipalities. I'm guessing there aren't very many of `em! We might be the only one (laughs) uh... and... and so (both talking) Markus/ ...we may be creating our own best practices. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 28 Throgmorton/ Yeah! Yeah! And ... and bravo! It's, you know, see if we can move in that direction and see how people respond. Mims/ Well, and hopefully what comes out of the committee on the inclusionary zoning is something that we can use strategically around Iowa City. As Tom has said, there may be places where you don't necessarily want to include any more lower income housing, but hopefully it will be something that we can use as a model for our neighbors to... potentially take a look at and see how this can work in a ... in a much less painful way than people think is possible at this point in time. Particularly if we get good buy -in from the developers. Throgmorton/ Yeah, maybe. Markus/ One thing I want to mention, um, Susan, Matt, and I met with the School Administration yesterday, and we had these very conversations, and this issue was on the table, and the other issue that was on the table was 28E agreements. One for infrastructure, so that we can develop some consistency on these new schools, as to the amount of infrastructure and ... and um, the proportionate share, um, that each jurisdiction, uh, would pay for, and that to me creates... some ability to in ... influence on the part of, um, the School District. I know the School District's interested in getting these schools built, but if the School's going to participate in what is traditionally a city obligation for water, sewer, street infrastructure, to me that gives them some leverage to negotiate some of these things, and the other 28E agreement is for the expansion of some of these recreational facilities, which I think is a great idea because you get to, you know, you get to share facilities for both educational purposes and for recreational purposes for the city. So, um, again I think that gives the School District, um, if they choose to ... to get into that leadership role, and exert some, um, changes in zoning and inclusionary and the provision of affordable housing. So... Payne/ I want to (several talking) thank you for a sentence that you put in this, that I've been trying to say for a long time and haven't been able to say it, and you said it very succinctly, and it is this: It is also important to make a distinction between market -rate housing that's inexpensive and subsidized, affordable housing for income qualifying households. It's not the same thing. Totally .... two totally separate things, and we're not probably ever going to have market -rate housing that's inexpensive. We're ... we're not going to achieve that. That's not what we're trying to achieve with all of this. I think that's important to make that distinction. Markus/ There's a ... there's a lot of other meanings that we intended in that conversation (laughs) but I won't go into `em right now. Hayek/ So I ... I commend staff on ... on I think an exceptional memo, and I really encourage... those of us on Council to review it carefully. It gives a ... a comprehensive summary of what we've done over the last 10 years, changes to our Comp Plan, changes to our CDBG /Home application guide, um ... uh, the affordable housing location model, the ... the reinvestment in our neighborhoods, you know, the ... the stuff we've discussed tonight This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 29 and a panoply of other things. Um, much of which ... is already addressing, um, the ... the concerns raised by ... by the School District. Um, and we'll be able to go to the joint meeting, um, and I ... I'll ... I'll be prepared to ... to talk about this, um ... uh, to ... to the group. It'll be interesting to see what, if anything, other communities, uh, have done, but this issue of ... long-term versus short-term ... fixes, uh, is critical as it relates to the school issues. Tom, I think you're absolutely right that anything we might do on the ... on, by way of zoning, is not going to ... whether it's in Iowa City or elsewhere, is not going to have an impact for years to come. What we have now is a ... is a growing, uh, disparity in terms of the numbers between our schools. And, you know, Southeast is now in the mid 40s, and I'm looking at the old scattered site report that I was a part of and helped author in 2005, and the number at Southeast at that point in time was half of...of what it is now. Um, and we ... as we confirmed in our meeting yesterday, I ... I don't know that the District will, uh... change its catchment areas, um, before another two or four years from now, potentially. Uh, and that is very concerning to me, because there is an opportunity, and I think an obligation now to start addressing or correcting, uh, the ... the imbalance in our school system, which I think comes down to equity, uh, for our students. Um, so I, uh, that falls to us, I think, as a council to keep pushing. It falls to our friends in the affordable housing industry. I ... I ... I am told they're doing their part to put pressure on our neighbors. I hope that's occurring. I haven't seen a lot publicly but I may not be paying close enough attention. It is critical that this occur. We are taking action unilaterally, but this remains a regional issue and until, uh, there is buy -in across the school district, uh, we are not going to see an improvement of ... of the imbalances. Payne/ And I think that going back to what you said about the things that we've done already. We haven't seen tons, or maybe if any, changes to the school district diversity issues, and it just goes to show it's going to take a long time. It's not going to be fixed overnight. So, we have to keep doing things, but not say that this isn't working. You can't say it isn't working. It just takes along time. Hayek/ Right, but we ... we've got to keep... the... the focus at the School District, I think, needs to continue to be on ... on the diversity policy or whatever replaces or supplements it. That needs to be a priority of this Council, I believe. Because that's ... that will address issues on a ... on a shorter -term basis. Anything the communities might do by way of zoning or otherwise, uh, while ... while beneficial in the long-term, won't be impactful for years to come. Throgmorton/ Yeah, we ... we need to do both, and ... don't we? We need to be looking at both the short and the long-term (several talking) and the ... they're not two separate things. Markus/ But the ... the problem with not really providing immediate attention to the short-term, is that six-year-old today grows old very quickly. And if...if you do not have... equitable education across the district, um ... you've lost something in that whole process. That student gets moved along and it... Mims/ Well and I think also (both talking) This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 30 Markus/ ...doesn't balance! Mims/ I think also what Matt just said is just in the last few years how much worse that disparity has gotten, and so by not doing those short-term things that can be done now, that disparity is going to continue to get worse and worse and (both talking) Payne/ It ... and it perpetuates! Mims/ Right. Throgmorton/ Yeah. So, I ... I think about being on this Council 21 years ago, uh, sitting right there and ... and had we back then jointly with the emerging development in Coralville, nothing going on in North Liberty, but if... if we had collectively taken up the long-term challenge of figuring out how to have affordable housing throughout the Iowa City area, if we had dealt with it then, we wouldn't have to face the problem now. So, you know, we ... we have to be looking ahead as well as dealing with the present. Hayek/ We can't be Pollyannaish; however, and ... and, you know, I ... I ... remain skeptical that our suburban neighbors will join this conversation in a meaningful way. (both talking) ... hope they do! Throgmorton/ ...Tom's suggestion, uh, about, you know, a couple actions the School District could possibly take is a very interesting one. (several talking) Hayek/ It's coming from the other angle, from the institution that serves everybody. (both talking) Throgmorton/ Yeah! Hayek/ I totally agree! I totally agree. Mims/ They have more power, I think, than they realize they do. Throgmorton/ Yeah! I agree. Mims/ I think Tom was very effective in... sharing some ideas yesterday. Hayek/ So ... thanks, Tom! And ev... Eleanor and everybody! Throgmorton/ Good job, John! (laughter) Hayek/ So it's 32 after. Um ... let's, well we can, obviously we've got another 10 minutes here. Throgmorton/ Yeah, let's do some of this. Information Packets: This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 31 Hayek/ Why don't we talk about the Info Packets. I don't think there's much left of ... substance. Dickens/ 31St we did everything on (mumbled) Hayek/ So the first one was, uh, December 23rd Mims/ I just ... say thank you to Tom for some of the articles in there. I think there was the one on the... school segregation, uh, just ... the Ferguson, just kind of the history of how some people have moved around and things have changed and it, you know, I think it comes back to us being really careful about what we ... allow to happen here by not paying attention. Hayek/ All right. How bout the... December 31 st? (laughter) Payne/ We just pretty much discussed that one! Hayek/ Yeah. Mims/ Yeah, took care of that one! Throgmorton/ Yep. Hayek/ I'm on KXIC in the morning and, Rick, you're next week. Dobyns/ Uh huh. Hayek/ Kingsley, you're the 21St. Think that's it for Info Packets. Um ... do we want to ... I, do we want to give a little more time for discussion of the ... December 13th work session? (several responding) Throgmorton/ Yeah, unless there's a lot of people in the room who want to be present for that conversation, I'd say let's defer it till the end of our meeting. Hayek/ Yeah. Dobyns/ Uh huh. Council Time: Hayek/ Okay. Um, Council Time. I wanted to mention one thing, uh, and that is, uh, the ... the Charter Commission, uh, public meeting tomorrow. Um ... you know, they're going at this from a small group perspective of dividing the can ... dividing the room into small sections and ... and whatnot. Are ... are any Councilors planning to go to that? And if so, I think we should discuss that. I personally have some concerns if we do. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 32 Throgmorton/ I ... I've thought about it, but I ... I think it's obvious that we shouldn't participate in the discussions. If... if in fact we do, and I hadn't decided if I wanted to go either. Hayek/ I mean, I think ... I think we should be free. We're residents just like everybody else to ... to weigh in on things, and I ... I may communicate something in writing to the full group. I haven't made a decision. I haven't certainly done anything, but ... but the format of tomorrow is such that I ... I just think it'd be a little strange if we were as Council Members showing up and... Mims/ Trying to influence a discussion that we're going to end up voting on later. (several responding and laughing) Hayek/ ...or even if that's the perception, I ... (several talking) I just wanted to throw that out there. Dobyns/ The fact I want to go tells me I shouldn't. (laughter and several talking) Throgmorton/ Live and learn! (laughter) Payne/ Yeah, watch it on TV! Mims/ I think send `em a letter, give `em a call, but yeah I ... I don't think any of us should be there tomorrow night really. Meeting Schedule: Hayek/ Any other Council time? Meetings? Payne/ So...February and March we're on the second and ... the ... is it the... Mims/ Second and fourth. Payne/ ... second and fourth Monday (several talking) So if somebody doesn't show up, it's because they're confused. (laughter) Karr/ And if they show up Tuesday, on the first and third, they may be lonely! (laughter) Payne/ And early! Karr/ And early! (laughs) Payne/ At least it's early not late! Hayek/ Okay! Don't forget, uh, Saturday. We're going to spend it together and have a great time! This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 33 Payne/ Can't wait! (several talking and laughing) ... during that Saturday? Mims/ Can we have the heat on? (laughs) Dickens/ It's supposed to warm up! (laughter and several talking) Pending Work Session Topics: Hayek/ Might shorten the budget meeting if we kept it cold! (several talking) So don't forget this Saturday! Uh, pending work session topics? Throgmorton/ I ... I think last meeting I mentioned, uh, expressed considerable concern about the potential impact of, uh, of growth in student enrollments, uh, for ... demand for student - oriented housing and potential effects on core neighborhoods. That ... that's not on the list of pending topics, uh, but I ... I'm hopeful that ... we're going to be focusing some attention on that cause from ... from the point of view of most of the district I live in and serve, that's a big deal! Hayek/ Sure! You know, we're going to be at some point coming to Council with some nuisance -related property management... issues, which by and large effect the University impact area... Throgmorton/ Uh huh. Hayek/ And maybe we could wrap that into that, Jim? Throgmorton/ Uh... Markus/ And maybe we could invite a University representative to kind of talk about (unable to hear, away from mic) I'm getting the impression that they're (away from mic) Throgmorton/ And it's not just enrollment projections. It's dormitory construction and the number of beds, and when they would come online and what gets phased out and so on. Hayek/ It's a remarkably small net increase in beds. Throgmorton/ Yeah! Yeah! Markus/ Maybe get the latest information from the University. We could have somebody come over. Hayek/ Upcoming events? Payne/ Oh ... I have ... I had something on the pending work session topics! We need to get the, um... senior services stuff on a work ... I mean, we asked them to have that done in December, and you know... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 34 Throgmorton/ Good point, yeah! Payne/ ...we need to kind of get that on there. It's not fair to have them have to get that done, and then us not discuss it for three months. Hayek/ Do we have a... anticipated timeframe for that? Throgmorton/ We've already gotten the report. What ... what do you mean? Payne/ To discuss it! Hayek/ To talk about it. Mims/ Put it on the work session. Fruin/ It's open for whenever you want to schedule it. Um, January 20th would be your next option. I believe the first meeting in February we're going to target for the next Gateway work session. So, January 20th or perhaps the second meeting in February. Payne/ Is there anything else big for January 20th, because it's probably going to be quite a discussion, I would think. Fruin/ No, it would just ... unless you choose to pull something else from the pending list. Hayek/ You know the ... isn't the 20th now the ... assuming we pass the Consent Calendar, the public hearing on the cottages' issue (several talking) Payne/ But not at work session, right? Hayek/ True! Payne/ I mean, this is a work session topic. Hayek/ That's true, that's true! (several responding) (unable to hear response away from mic) (several talking and laughing) I'm okay with that! I hadn't thought of that. (several responding) Fruin/ Okay, we'll put it on for January 20th Mims/ Okay! Hayek/ Okay. Anything else on, uh, events or Council invitations? All right, um ... why don't ... so we'll ... we'll, uh... continue the work session after the formal and we'll take up discussion of the format of the January 13th work session. So ... okay! Thanks everyone, that was a good meeting! (BREAK TO FORMAL) This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 35 Discussion of Format of January 13 Work Session: Hayek/ Okay, so the one item we did not take up was the ... fourth bullet point, which is discussion of the format of the January 13th work session, and there's a memo at Item, uh, 5 in the Info Packet. Markus/ If I can summarize ... uh, what li... we would like to suggest is that we start with a traditional work session. Staff will, uh, make a presentation, just a brief summary of where we've been to date, and then make some suggestions based on comments we've heard, and then what we'd like to do kind of, uh, different than a tradis ... traditional work session format is open it up, uh, for the public to make comment, uh, but in a kind of a rare, um, distinction in terms of our policy, uh, potentially have engagement. We don't expect that we may have all the answers to the questions or necessarily responses to the particular comments, but, um, those Councilors who feel like they're willing to engage in the conversation should join into those, and if there's specific information that's asked for that we have, we will respond; and if we don't, we will get back to people, but that's kind of the ... the, uh, program that we had in place. Now, one of the things, and I'll tell you right up front that we're proposing to do is, um, follow a recommendation that, um, I think, uh, Susan and Jim and ... and Matt have talked about in the past, and that is, um, maybe list ... having some listening posts around the city, um, and maybe a different topic for each listening post and ... um, and then have Councilors bring those comments back. We don't want necessarily decisions to be made at the listening post, but ... we want you to listen and take notes and bring back the ideas, and then have a conversation at the Council table to see if there's other things that we can be doing to improve our relationships. So ... we have some other ideas and suggestions, and we hope that the, um, public participation will create some of those, and the dialogue with the City Council will create some of those. So that's ... that, you know, taking off of what you said you wanted to do from the last meeting. We've kind of expanded on that and this is what we're recommending at this time. Hayek/ What we like about this is that at the front end, staff will talk about ... you know, what we've done and... some... some, and where we're going and ... and throw out some ... some more ideas, uh, for the benefit of the audience, but then we can get immediate feedback to that, um, and anything else people want to talk about, but ... then, focus it back at the... at the back end of the, uh, of ... of the work session, uh, for a little bit of additional Council discussion. So... Payne/ I... sorry, Jim, I was just going to say, I ... I agree ... but I think that we need to set a time limit, so that we're not here at midnight with still having public comment. So, I don't know if that's two hours, if that's three hours, if that's a half an hour, which doesn't seem like enough, but ... I think we need to say public comment's going to be from ... 5:30 or whenever staff gets done with their presentation, until 7:00 or 7:30 or something like that. Markus/ So what we contemplated was a 15 to 20 minute work session, and then, uh, up to two hours of public comment and dialogue with the City Council. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 36 Mims/ I think one thing we're going to have to be very careful of with that is that we don't allow a dialogue with one or two audience members to take over the entire evening. Um, I think we, you know, I think we're going to have to set time limits (both talking) Payne/ Yeah, there has to be a time limit (both talking) Mims/ ...time limits per I think audience member, you know, potentially. Payne/ Just ... just like we do with (both talking) Mims/ Right, and ... and I, what I would also like us to ... to kind of keep in the back of our minds is that ... I see this as maybe the first one that we're doing like this, and depending upon, you know, the attendance and how it goes, that, you know, maybe we ultimately, you know, schedule something like the Charter Review Commission is doing, you know, tomorrow night, in terms of something where we would ... you know, we would go and we would meet, you know, maybe not all Council Members but small groups and ... and have a more intimate interaction with people and get ideas and feedback and ... and things like that. Um, so I see this as kind of a... a first step in... in some of that. Markus/ Yeah. What we wanted to do for this particular item is just discuss the format, and the ideas for how you would interact... Mims/ Sure! Markus/ ...would come out of the first meeting. Mims/ Yep. Throgmorton/ Yes, so... Payne/ Go ahead, I interrupted you last time! Throgmorton/ Yeah, I wanted to put a few thoughts into this. Uh, I think it is important to put a pretty clear, pretty short timeframe on the staff's comments. Some of us have a tendency to talk too much. I wonder who they might be? (laughter and several talking) Uh, so, you know, it...it really wouldn't work well for the staff, you know, to talk for 30, 45 minutes (both talking) Markus/ We're not going to ... no, we're ... we're going to contain ourselves to at most 15 minutes. Throgmorton/ Okay, so yeah... good! Uh... (laughter) A second thing I was thinking about has to do with the spatial arrangement. I ... I don't know if anybody was actually thinking through this, but ... where do you ... (noises on mic) sets things up? (mumbled) ...were we imagining that we would be sitting around a horseshoe? And then people would be out in This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 37 the audience or ... something else? Cause ... and I bring it up only to try as much as we can to avoid an `us' versus `them' kind of set-up. Markus/ Well I ... and I agree with that, and I think you get more conversation when you're a little bit lower and we can pull a table up, and people can come up and sit down at the chair and (both talking) have a conversation and they can rotate. Botchway/ Yeah, I would definitely agree with the people coming up and sitting down in a chair. I just know ... from coming up a couple times before being on City Council how intimidating it can be to walk up and I would have loved to have sat down and had a Pepsi or something like that before I spoke, so... Payne/ Kind of like how you were tonight (several talking) Yes! (several responding) Throgmorton/ Another thing has to do with, um ... how ... how we plan to notify people in advance, because not everybody looks at the web site, the City's web site. Not everybody sees the one article in the newspaper. Payne/ You better start calling through the phone book! Throgmorton/ Yeah, so I mean we ... we know of a whole bunch of African-American leaders in town who probably should be directly notified, uh, and ... and then maybe there are other ways that people should be notified. Markus/ We ... we will (both talking) attempt to be expansive in our distribution of notice. And we'll work with some of the associations that ... um, that are engaged. Botchway/ And while I think that's important, and this kind of goes back to Susan's point as being kind of a first initial meeting with the hope that there would be, you know, subsequent meetings with maybe, you know, less Council Members, I'm more, I mean, I'm very interested in the Council discussion, as well. I mean ... (several talking) if we have two hours of public comment and all of a sudden I'm like about to pass out before we can even discuss anything, it's not gonna be, uh... a huge amount of discussion for something that I think is a big issue. So ... I don't know how that's going to play out and I think that might be something that we play out ... as it happens. Maybe there's only five, six, 10 people here and it's not a big deal, um, but maybe we need to have that discussion if there's like 50 people here that we might not be able to talk, or we might not get that discussion that I think is (both talking) Mims/ Well I think it comes back to what Michelle said is, you know, we may need to decide how late we're going to stay and if... if we do have a huge number of people who want to talk, we may have to say, you know, we're only going to take public discussion till ... such and such a time, and then allow half hour, 45 minutes, whatever for Council. Markus/ And ... and remember that part of what we're recommending is that you go out and do listening posts to begin with... This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 38 Mims/ Right. Markus/ ...where some of that engagement... can be more expansive. Dobyns/ (several talking) ...cause I'm worried about passing out, as well, because I think the interaction between us is important. I would recommend like after ... what is it, it's 5 (several talking) after 60 minutes it's sort of like a warning shot. Okay, the first 60 minutes, five minutes, but subsequently like three minutes in terms of just trying to decrease it, because I think you've got to work toward an end point of this. I think two hours is mind -numbing ... for us. Markus/ I think Eleanor's trying to signal to me that she wants you to stick to the format, not actually what's going to come out of the ... the meeting itself. Payne/ I think we're (both talking) Dilkes/ No ... no, what I ... what I'm confused about is, we're going to have staff recomm ... staff kind of brief recommendations, a... a public kind of conversation, but ... I don't see where the time is for Council to have a discussion about whether they agree with staff's recommendations, whether they disagree with staff's recommendations. That's what I'm not seeing (both talking) Markus/ Okay, and ... and the reason that we went the direction that we did is because they're just staff recommendations, and so what we ... the way it was set up, and the way it was discussed amongst, um, the staff was ... the public should react to what the staff recommendations are and maybe they would embellish them as part of the discourse with the City Council. So that it isn't just a staff -dominated process and we're creating the only outcomes. So that's why we would lay it out, and if people support it, they can tell Council. If they want to enhance it, they can tell Council, and then Council can deliberate on how they're going to proceed. Dilkes/ As long as there's that Council deliberation time at the end. Payne/ I guess what I don't understand is the way I read the memo is it wasn't recommendations. It's things that we've already done. Here's what we've already done. Now you tell us what else we could do. Markus/ That's exactly right, but... as I've observed, different, uh, portions our citizenry come forward, it's clear to me that not everybody has the same base of knowledge about what's already been done, and we felt that that was important to ... in a minimal way, describe some of the things that are currently going on, so that that doesn't become a redundant part of the conversation. Payne/ But to me that's not a recommendation. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 39 Markus/ But ... that's part of it, and then there is in addition to that, recommendations that we're going to make to you, based on what we've heard the public comment, um, heretofore make. Payne/ And ... my second, I mean, I'm okay with the two things that we've talked about so far — the staff presentation, public input with engagement, but then I think we need a time after that where we have Council discussion that's just us (several talking) Dilkes/ ...Tom's memo says that. Payne/ Yes! Dilkes/ Following that dialogue with ... the Council can wrap up with your own discussion and discuss plans for any future actions. Payne/ So... so if we started at 5:00, 15 minutes of staff presentation, two hours of public input. That makes it 7:15. Then we have about 45 minutes to an hour of... Council discussion. That puts it at about 8:15. Hayek/ I think that's pushing it for... Payne/ I do too! Hayek/ ...for Council meeting. I ... I'd be interested in a ... (clears throat) Sorry, my voice is just failing me. A shorter period of time. We ... we're only going to be able to accomplish to much in any... setting or ... or venue in which the full Council is trying to engage with the full community, and that's one of the reasons we need to... get out there and... and, you know, in groups of two, or you know, some sub -set of the Council and ... and go to where the people are and... and listen to them, um, and have that more intimate engagement with citizens. Payne/ So maybe only an hour and a half of public input or an hour? I mean I think we need to set it up ... we need to let people know up front ... that we're gonna have public input until this time, and then the Council is going to discuss the input. Botchway/ So then my ... so then my question is, is based on what Matt and Susan just said. If we're going to have these listening posts, and we're going to engage in the community in that way, is it necessary for us to have ... I'm not saying we shouldn't have public input, but is it necessary for us to have the public input that we ... or, Tom, you talked about in the memo, because ... I ... you know, we just have ... we need to have a discussion. I mean, I want ... there's point that I think we, I mean, Jim had brought up, I had brought up, there's things, um, that we didn't even get a chance to ask questions about from the equity report. Um ... and I guess after talking to some community members, there's just this thought ... as far as, and I say some — like two — um, there's just this thought — what exactly ... what information will be gleamed from this discussion and basically it sounds like not much. I mean, we're not going to be making any decisions at all. Basic ... the This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 40 only thing that we'll be talking about is the recommendations that Stefanie put forth, that staff had put forth, as far as whether or not we're interested in going through ... or following through with those, but I don't know ... I... Mims/ I think ... I think what we should ... I like Tom's recommendation that's come from staff for the structure. Payne/ Uh huh. Mims/ I think we should go with that. If we end up with 30 people here, or two people here, who say we don't really want to give you input tonight; we want to hear what you think of... of how this is going to work and how you're going to react to ... staff s recommendations and how this is going to move forward, then fine! They can sit there and we can spend the two hours having more of that discussion. But ... we keep getting criticized all the time that we don't listen to people, that we don't, you know, take enough input and so to set aside one full meeting to say the bulk of this is for you to come and give us your input, this is the first time — it's not the only time. We're going to start trying to do these listening posts. Let's give people that opportunity. Have staff and... anybody else who's here or listening, well, I guess we're not on TV now, but ... you know, get the information out about the meeting, and let's see who shows up and wants to give us input! And ... I don't think that the discussion that we have as a council afterwards, whether it's a half hour a ... or an hour is the end all -be all by any means. It's simply the first one, at t his point in time. We've got to keep revisiting this over and over and over. I think as we ... as we continue to look at income disparity and racial issues in this country, this is not going away, folks. It is not going away! We have to keep coming back at this. Payne/ And I don't disagree with that at all, but we have to have ... it always seems like to me that we never get enough time to discuss. Or somebody talks too much. (several talking and laughing) Mims/ But my point is (laughs) if people come to talk to us, I think we need ... I think we need to listen to them and if it means that we need to take then... some discussion for ourselves that night and then on another work session... Payne/ Yes! Mims/ ...block out time for more... straight Council discussion... Payne/ Yes! Mims/ ...then we do that. Payne/ Correct! So we need to have an end point, you know... Mims/ That night! This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 41 Payne/ ...that, for that night, and a time where the ... where the public input also ends. Mims/ Yeah! And then... Hayek/ Well if we're shooting for like a two-hour span, we could have the staff comments for 15 minutes, an hour of...uh, community engagement. If...if the audience is there to do that! And that would still give us a long... a 45 -minute period of time for Council discussion, um... Mims/ And I think we have to play it by ear. Hayek/ And play it by ear... Throgmorton/ ... exactly what I was going to suggest, Matt. You and I are just... (several talking) Payne/ ...till midnight if we're going to play it by ear. (several responding) Hayek/ No, no, no, no! Mims/ Where we divide the ... where we divide the public input versus the Council time. Payne/ What I'm saying is, max of this much public input. If it lasts ... if there's still people out the door, after an hour ... that's still the end. Hayek/ I think that's what we're saying. That's... that's what we're saying. Mims/ I'd say a maximum of (coughing, unable to hear speaker) public input. Payne/ Hour and a half? Mims/ I would. I mean ... an hour's not a whole lot of time, I mean, if...if people take (several talking) that's only 12 people, and if you're trying to have a dialogue... Hayek/ Yeah. Mims/ I'd go an hour and a half, and even if that ... means we have to cut down our discussion, then we schedule ours for our next work session. Throgmorton/ No, I'm not going to agree with that, be ... because, Susan, we ... we listen for about an hour and a half to a really informative presentation by Stefanie, and had about three minutes to discuss what she said, and then Kingsley and I both submitted written recommendations about how we should respond. We've not had any discussion about those ... those recommendations. Here's an opportunity for us to do both simultaneously. So I like Matt's suggestion. A two-hour timeframe, 15 minutes for the opening presentation by staff. Uh, the next hour, uh, for, uh, comments from whoever attends, uh, playing that by ear because it could be there won't be an hour full of presentation. If This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 42 there is though, okay, we stop that after an hour. Then we spend the last 45 minutes discussing, uh, taking our responsibilities, as we do, taking them seriously. It's us ... for us to figure out how to ... how to respond. So that we can at least engage, uh, you know, differing points of view about how we should be responding. That's what I think! Hayek/ It's just a suggestion. I... Payne/ I ... I agree with that, I mean, an hour doesn't seem like very much time, but... if this is the first of many, you know, we can ... play it by ear. I just don't still want to be here at midnight and that's when we start our discussion, because there could be that many people here! I mean, we saw how many people were here ... last week to talk. Or last (both talking) Hayek/ I think it's a challenge no matter how we approach it or slice it to engage the full Council and ... the community, in ... in a given setting. And I think that's where the listening posts ... will really be helpful. It just shrinks it down to a more manageable environment.. that I think will promote a better dialogue. Mims/ If people show up! Hayek/ You have to do both, you know (both talking) but uh.... I think we are. Throgmorton/ Well here's one of the challenges! You know, we're ... we're asking, inviting people to come here, you know, and... and to a very great extent, that's about turf. So, if they're coming here, they know we're on our terrain, and it's this very formal kind of setting, even if we're sittin' around in a horseshoe down there. It's ... the listening posts are good. I ... I like that, because then we're going out to ... to their home ground, whoever they are. I mean, there's a whole bunch of different kinds of people in town. So, and then the feeling's very different when (both talking) Hayek/ (mumbled) Throgmorton/ ...did it fall off? Dobyns/ Jim, what did you ... what did you recommend after City staff report? (several talking) (mumbled) Jim recommend 60 minutes, is that ... (several talking) Mims/ But see that ... but I mean to me following, you know, on what Jim just said, we're inviting people here, and if we have a big crowd show up ... and we cut `em off after an hour ... I think that sends the wrong message. I think that says that we're really not willing to sit here and listen to `em. Markus/ Except then you know when you ... when you see the size of the crowd (both talking) and there's a collective... reaction by the City Council that maybe you should give `em more time, you have the ability amongst yourselves to extend more time. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015. January 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 43 Mims/ That's where I think we have to play it by ear. Throgmorton/ I agree! I agree! Mims/ I'm not comfortable setting a hard and fast time limit. Dobyns/ I'd hope for 60 but if we have to go to 90 that's fine but I ... I agree. The turf thing is very important. That sends a very strong message that, okay, maybe we're in a hurry. We're cutting you off, but you know after this, we're gonna come to your turf, we're gonna come to your place. Markus/ And we can identify it in the agenda as kind of tentative timeframes. Botchway/ But ... but quick caveat. I agree with everything that's said and it sounds like we have a plan. In the event that people, I mean a large number of people don't show up, I don't think we should make, urn ... any type of thought or feeling that that means that it's not important or people, I mean, it could just be cold (several responding) and people not show up or I mean, there could be a lot of different reasons (several talking) so I just want to make sure ... right. So, that's all I wanted to say. Hayek/ Okay. We ... we're on board with this. Thank you, staff! Um (mumbled) or no, see you Saturday morning, my friends! (laughter) Read your budgets! And so we'll stop the work session now. This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council work session of January 6, 2015.