HomeMy WebLinkAbout2015-10-06 TranscriptionOctober 6, 2015 Iowa City City Council Work Session Page 1
Council Present: Botchway, Dickens, Dobyns, Hayek, Mims, Payne, Throgmorton
Staff Present: Markus, Fruin, Dilkes, Knoche, Havel, O'Brien, Yapp, Ralston, Laverman,
Bockenstedt, Weinard, Bowers, Hightshoe, Boothroy, Kelsey,
Voparil
Others Present: Neal (UISG)
Questions from Council re: Agenda Items:
(starts mid recordin.)
Hayek/ ...15 work session. Uh, we'll jump right in. First bullet point is questions from Council
regarding agenda items. (people yelling from audience)
ITEM 4f(6) Sean Dixon: Thank you [Staff response included]
Throgmorton/ 4f(6), Matt (people yelling from audience 'raise the wage')
Hayek/ Okay! Want to welcome everyone to the October 6, 2015, City Council work session.
Uh, we will jump right into the bullet points, and the first one is questions from the
Council regarding agenda items.
ITEM 4f(4) Jerry Hansen: PIN Grant
Throgmorton/ Well, Matt, I had just mentioned, or started mentioning, Item 4f(4) uh, which is an
email from Jerry Hansen. So I don't think I want to talk about the email itself, uh, but I
do want to praise Chief Hargadine ... for his really forthright response to Jerry Hansen.
Chief Hargadine's response appears as, uh, in the late handout. Yeah.
Hayek/ Yeah.
Throgmorton/ And I don't know if we really want to talk through the detail, but I think there's
really an important issue embedded in the email and the Chiefs response, and I simply
want to praise Chief Hargadine, uh, for what he writes.
ITEM 9. (EXTENSION OF IOWA CITY DOWNTOWN SELF -SUPPORTED
MUNICIPAL IMPROVEMENT DISTRICT (SSMID) A/K/A IOWA CITY
DOWNTOWN DISTRICT) - MOTION SETTING A PUBLIC HEARING FOR
NOVEMBER 10, 2015, ON AN ORDINANCE TO RE-ESTABLISH THE IOWA
CITY DOWNTOWN SELF -SUPPORTED MUNICIPAL IMPROVEMENT
DISTRICT FOR A PERIOD OF TEN YEARS IN ACCORDANCE WITH IOWA
CODE CHAPTER 386.
Hayek/ I would concur, Jim. Uh, Item 9 is the motion setting public hearing on the SMID.
Terry, you and I are not going to vote on that.
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Dickens/ Right!
Hayek/ Susan, you'll take over on that item.
Mims/ Okay.
ITEM 12. HOUSING CODE - ORDINANCE AMENDING TITLE 17, ENTITLED
"BUILDING AND HOUSING," CHAPTER 5, ENTITLED "HOUSING CODE,"
TO SUPPORT NEIGHBORHOOD STABILIZATION BY PROHIBITING
FURNITURE ON ROOFS, ADDING STANDARDS FOR EXTERIOR BUILDING
AND FENCE SURFACES, REQUIRING SCREENING OF DUMPSTERS ON
MULTI -FAMILY DWELLINGS AND UNDER CERTAIN DECKS/PORCHES,
LIMITING THE STORAGE OF LANDSCAPING/CONSTRUCTION
MATERIAL, AND REQUIRING GFCI PROTECTED OUTLETS AND CARBON
MONOXIDE DETECTORS. (FIRST CONSIDERATION)
Botchway/ Um, I had a question on Item ... 12. Didn't necessarily get ... we were looking for this
particular ordinance to only apply to the campus area that we talked about (mumbled)
yeah, that's... that's my question. I mean, I'm okay with it because I think I've talked
about, that it'd be great if it happened throughout Iowa City, but ... I thought we were
really restricting in our conversation about it at that time.
Throgmorton/ Yeah, I think we need to have Tracy or Stan ... talk to us about how it ... this differs
from what we received back in August, and what we discussed back in August.
Laverman/ Yeah, it's not different from what you received in August. Um ... the code
amendments were always what we were talking about doing. The enforcement is where
the policy change will come, in that we will do systematic inspections in our University
impact areas. These are just the changes to the housing code that we talked about to help
our enforcement.
Botchway/ That would (both talking)
Laverman/ So our policy is still going to be, um, to treat the city the same as we always have,
except we're going to target the University impact area to start with. Uh, and these were
some of the changes we were making to the housing code to address the issues that we
were seeing as we move forward.
Botchway/ But this affects all areas.
Laverman/ It does (both talking)
Botchway/ Okay. But the enforcement piece is...
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Laverman/ (both talking) Right. The enforcement... where we were changing up our
enforcement is we were going to do systematic exterior inspections in the University
impact area.
Botchway/ Okay.
Laverman/ And that's just a .... internal policy change. That's not an ordinance change.
Hayek/ So that's the ... the proactive...
Laverman/ That's the proactive (both talking) Correct!
Hayek/ What if somebody outside of that area...
Laverman/ Like always (both talking)
Hayek/ ...complains about (both talking)
Laverman/ Sure! We respond to ... we ... we respond to owner -occupied properties now, but it's on
a complaint basis and we would continue to do that.
Mims/ And I think it's important to remember that the City does have programs for people who
are financially challenged, to apply for assistance in a lot of different areas in terms of
how maintenance and (both talking)
Laverman/ Sure!
Mims/ ....I would assume these would fall under that, as well.
Laverman/ Housing rehab money, yes. Yeah.
Hayek/ And how ... how does the policy, the enforcement policy, come out? Is that something
you keep internally or does that come back before us?
Laverman/ Oh, we ... we kind of received guidance last, uh, when we brought it to the work
session, that that was the direction we wanted to go to. We'll put it into a policy form and
bring it back.
Botchway/ Um, Item 4f(6) (both talking)
Throgmorton/ Wait, wait (several talking) I ... if I'm repeating something (mumbled) please
excuse me, cause I was trying to change one thing here. I should have been paying
attention to you, Matt. Uh, but with regard to, um, this particular ordinance, uh... is it
designed to be enforced for all residences, whether they're owner -occupied or rental
occu... renter occupied? (both talking) With ... within that area.
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Laverman/ Yes. Our housing code reads that way right now. We have a housing code. We
don't have a rental housing code. The difference is, we're saying that in ... in the next year,
we're going to be systematically going through the University impact areas, looking at the
exteriors of properties, to verify that they're in compliance with the housing code.
Throgmorton/ Okay, so I ... I ... I'm sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt.
Laverman/ Yeah, in the past, we would wait ... on ... on rental properties, they're inspected every
two years. On an owner -occupied property, we would wait until we had a complaint.
Uh, in our University impact areas, we will not wait anymore, uh, we will... proactively,
uh, go through the neighborhoods to look for housing code issues.
Throgmorton/ Okay, good. That I understand. So, uh.... on a point, um, related to what Susan
just said, with regard to owner -occupied units, I ... I said this when we discussed this in
August. I'm aware of several, many maybe, uh, units are owned by elderly or older
people ... uh, in ... in the northside in particular, uh, in ... and they live in houses that are
valued, I don't know, between 100,000 and $150,000, or assessed at between 100,000 and
150,000, and my sense is they don't have a whole lot of cash to throw around. So, I'm
concerned that the ... the amount of money and the means by which... the... the amount of
money that the City can make available to households like that when they're cited for
some kind of code violation, having to do with the exterior, that that'll place 'em in
difficult financial circumstances, and I'm concerned that the, uh, the mechanisms that the
City currently provides, uh, may not be sufficient so ... I ... I know I brought this up last
time and there was no discussion of that in what we received for tonight. So ... that
concerns me — the people like that, and the situation they face.
Laverman/ Sure. And as we discussed, that ... there's housing rehab funds available. Uh, there is
money in the budget, uh, set aside for... programming, um ... uh, for the University housing
and then there was additional funds for, uh, exterior facade improvement plan, um,
that ... and that money hasn't been allocated to that. So there's money available, uh, I don't
anticipate we're gonna, uh... move forward with a heavy hand. Uh, we will work with
people and make sure that they have resources available to them.
Payne/ Are they loans or grants?
Laverman/ It depends.
Payne/ Either or?
Laverman/ It can be either or, and Tracy would be a better resource for that, to answer that.
Hayek/ (mumbled) Tracy.
Hightshoe/ Um, most (mumbled) programs that we do for owner -occupied rehab is based not on
the assessed value of the home, but the income of the homeowner. So we go through a
verification of income and then based on if they're already paying more than 30% of their
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income on housing, it's a ... what we call a conditional occupancy loan. We put a
mortgage on the property and we get the money back when it sells. If they can afford a
housing payment, then we do a staggered... but we don't make them pay more than 30% of
their income on housing costs. So if we do rehab, we're looking at incomes. That answer
your question?
Mims/ Yeah, I think the really important thing about this is ... is we kind of started out, and Matt
had kind of brought it up, and he and I went around with some of the staff. In that
University impact area where we have a lot of rentals, but you do have a mix of...of
owner -occupied, you know, the whole neighborhood stabilization issue, which we've
talked about and is one of our goals and ... and priorities on the City's strategic plan and so
it was, you know, how can we ... you know, put some criteria there so we don't get some of
these run-down houses that are impacting the neighborhoods and making it, you know,
more difficult for other people to want to invest in their properties, and stay in the area.
Um, and we talked about the fact, you know, do you do a rental housing code or
a ... whatever, but ... the City currently has a housing code and so to start from scratch
would be very, very time consuming, very cumbersome. (mumbled) was ... was what we
were told and so this was kind of the start, and I think ... I feel that staff understands
and ... and we need to stay involved probably that what we're trying to do is improve the
neighborhoods. The last thing we want to do is put somebody in a financial situation that
forces them out of their home and then we end up with another large rental property
where we did have a nice home, you know, an owner -occupied who maybe needed some
assistance, and so ... I think with that as our goal, and staff understanding that as our goal,
then hopefully this'll work well going forward and as they're doing those inspections or
following up on complaints, uh, really working with people to let 'em know there's
money available if they need it and qualify for it.
Hightshoe/ As Stan mentioned, if we find a homeowner that has difficulty paying, we would go
through that ... as long as they're willing to verify income with us, um, we do have a
targeted program where we forgive half of the rehab assistance, so we'd work with the
homeowner, if that situation arises.
Hayek/ And one of the ... when I went to that conference on aging, um, and talked about some of
the things Iowa City does, that the ... the, um .... the assistance programs we have to
provide... minor funding, uh, to individuals, uh, for spot projects, the rehab program, etc.,
um, and, uh... the ... the ex ... the degree to which we can extend the ... the years they stay in
that home, um, and the impact that has on the rest of the community and on that
neighborhood, it really resonated, um, and I think, uh... you know, our programs are good
in that respect. As we go forward with this, we're gonna have to watch ... the enforcement
and we're gonna need to watch the budgeting to make sure that they are, you know,
meshing well.
Hightshoe/ But those homeowners that are slightly over our (mumbled) limits, we do have that
GRIP program which we take across to rehab and we amortize it out 20 years so it makes
it affordable for that family and that goes up to 110% of median income. So we have
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different mechanism incentives that we can help homeowners at different stages of
income.
Botchway/ Is that first-come, first -serve?
Hightshoe/ Yes, but for the federal funds we do have like a priority system, you know, um, some
we do emergency rehabs, we do comprehensive (both talking)
Botchway/ Well I guess I'm asking more from a standpoint of...I mean, if you're going through
the University impact area, not ... and I don't want to spend too much time on this, but if
you're going through the University impact area and you're starting at a particular street
or subsection, whatever the case may be, and you're going through it, you know, and
you're having that conversation that you're not being heavy-handed, you're talking with
individuals about what they can afford and what they can fund ... the money could then dry
up before you get to the next area or another area, and is that fair for the entire area?
Hightshoe/ We do have a waiting list, um, but we ... we do based on need too.
Botchway/ Okay, that's what (mumbled)
Throgmorton/ So if I could, a related point has to do with, um, something in your ... in your, the
memo the two of you wrote, having to do with meetings you had with the, uh, the
Neighborhood Council and with the, uh... urn ... uh, the Apartment Owners Association.
So with regard to the Neighborhood Council, were ... were all the neighborhoods
represented? I mean, you know, and how strong was the support? You know, I ask
because there's nothing from any of the neighborhood associations saying we strongly
support this, uh, proposed ordinance. I suspect they do, but ... you know, it ... I'd feel a lot
better if...if there was ... there was clear affirmation and support.
Hightshoe/ Uh, we had about 14...14 folks from the neighborhoods. Now not all neighborhood
associations were represented, um ... they had con ... concerns, same thing with ... about
financial for folks that might not be able to afford making home improvements, but
otherwise it was very positive. And they liked the idea that it applied city-wide. I mean
we're going to concentrate our ... our enforcement on the University impacted
neighborhoods but ... um ... and then they did worry about, um, they thought most neighbors
would do well. They wouldn't just start making complaints all across the board, but I
think they supported it. (mumbled) Yeah, that was surprise we went to the Apartment
Owners Association, um, and Stan gave the same PowerPoint that we gave to you guys
and heard very little resistance, which ... (several talking)
Throgmorton/ Okay.
Hayek/ Okay!
Throgmorton/ Thank you!
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Hayek/ Thanks both of you.
Mims/ Also helps increase the value of the property and not only that property but the ones
around it to, so...
Throgmorton/ Well it's all incremental. Incremental steps toward improvement, instead of
incremental steps toward (further talking) further deterioration.
Hayek/ Any other agenda items?
ITEM 14. TASTING EVENTS - ORDINANCE AMENDING TITLE 4, ALCOHOLIC
BEVERAGES, CHAPTER 5, PROHIBITIONS AND RESTRICTIONS, SECTION
7 LIMITATIONS ON SALES, SUBSECTION B, TO CLARIFY
INAPPLICABILITY TO TASTING EVENTS. (SECOND CONSIDERATION)
Botchway/ I just wanted ... Item 14. I know it sounds silly, but does this affect like the
Oktoberfest that just happened this last weekend? I mean, would it affect those type of
events?
Hayek/ I ... I mean I think that ... we could ask Eleanor, but that would be included.
Botchway/ I was asking, you know, Item 14, does it affect like .... I know we're in second
consideration, so I know we already kind of voted on it, but does it affect events like
Oktoberfest or other events where there's tasting, I mean, that's where...
Dilkes/ It does and it's to make it even clearer that they're not ... they don't fall within the
(mumbled) ordinance.
Botchway/ Okay.
Hayek/ Anything else?
ITEM 8. DEBT MANAGEMENT POLICY — RESOLUTION ADOPTING THE DEBT
MANAGEMENT POLICY FOR THE CITY OF IOWA CITY
Throgmorton/ Um, Item 8, uh, the revised Debt Management Policy. I'd like Dennis to be
prepared to answer a few questions during the formal meeting. I don't want to go into
'em right now, and it'd be better to have 'em in public, but ... um, just you know...
Bockenstedt/ I do have a presentation prepared to cover the policy.
ITEM 4d(3) APPOINTMENT PROCESS FOR CITY BOARDS AND
COMMISSIONS - RESOLUTION ESTABLISHING A POLICY THAT SPOUSES
AND RELATIVES OF CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS, PERSONS ALREADY
SERVING AS BOARD OR COMMISSION MEMBERS, AND MEMBERS OF
COMPARABLE COUNTY BOARDS OR COMMISSIONS SHALL NOT BE
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ELIGIBLE FOR APPOINTMENT TO CITY BOARDS OR COMMISSIONS, AND
ESTABLISHING A REAPPOINTMENT PROCESS FOR CITY BOARDS AND
COMMISSIONS AND REPEALING RESOLUTION 85-354
Throgmorton/ Good! Excellent! Thanks! Oh boy, let's see ... going to ask a question about the,
uh, Item 4d(3), amending the rules for appointments to boards and commissions. This is
going to be nitpicking, I apologize, but as I read ... as I read Item A2 in the resolution,
appears to state that a. current member of a board or commission shall not be eligible for
appointment to that board or a commission. But I think it means ... it's supposed to mean
to any other board or a commission. So I ... I just wonder about the language of A2.
Dilkes/ I'll have to (both talking)
Throgmorton/ Check it out, yeah (both talking)
Dilkes/ ...look at it and if it looks to be ambiguous I'll (both talking)
Throgmorton/ ...during the break or something.
Discuss Johnson County minimum wage ordinance FIP # 3 and 4 Info Packet of 10/11:
Hayek/ Anything else? Okay! Let's move on to the County minimum wage ordinance. Um ... as
you know, we don't have anything on the formal agenda. We're not going to be voting
tonight, but we do have the City Attorney's memo in the Info Packet from ... October 1st
There's two memos actually. Um, and I ... you know, we plan on having a general
discussion about, uh, that and the issue generally. Urn ... Eleanor, you want to start out
with ... (mumbled) synopsis of what you looked at and what you found.
Dilkes/ Um ... the memo's lengthy and it ... I think for the most part speaks for itself. Urn ... I think
it's important to look at the question that I was asked, which was, uh... whether I think the
ordinance, if challenged, will, um, survive that challenge. Um, I ... my opinion is that
it's ... it's not likely to. Um, I ... I agree that an argument can be made as .... an argument
usually can, um ... but I think it's going to be a tough, tough sell ... with the Iowa Supreme
Court. Um, I think if you look, and the conclusions pretty much, you know, summarized,
but the Iowa Supreme Court is not going to care whether a minimum wage is a good idea
ora bad idea. That's not their job. Uh, their job is to determine what the legislature
meant when it used the terms that it did. Um, and I ... I explain in there why that's the
Supreme Court's job. It's a function of, um, you know, separations of powers and the
different roles that our legislature plays and that our Supreme Court plays. Urn ... I think if
you look at the language of the statute that I highlighted on page 5...I think that kind of
makes the clearest kind of explanation. I mean, I got into the... the... the, uh, case law that
you can find in other jurisdictions. It is somewhat limited because there are only eight
states, uh, that in their home rule constitutional or statutory provisions included this
"private law exception," and just so we're clear what I mean by that when I say the
private law exception is that ... cities and counties are granted home rule auth ... authority,
or granted the authority to exercise the police power on behalf of...of their residents. Uh,
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the police power generally is the power to legislate or take actions for the health, safety,
and welfare of the residents of the city. Um, unless the State has said otherwise, and it's
what's called 'legislative home rule,' meaning uh... the home rule authority of a city and
county is constrained by, uh, what the legislature does. If that was the only provision that
we were talking about and we were just doing a basic preemption analysis, which I go
into in some detail here, I think there's a very good argument that the minimum wage
ordinance would survive. But the private law exception, which reads the grant of home
rule powers does not include the power to enact private or civil law governing civil
relationships except as incident to an exercise of an independent power. County power is
where the problem lies. The County has pointed to two ... let me back up for a minute. If
you look at the legislation for both cities and counties, you will see that there is this
general grant of home rule police power, um, but in addition to that, there are a lot of
specific powers, uh, that are provided to cities. Um, the zoning authority, for instance.
The ... the authority to adopt housing codes, which of course we do all the time. So there
are a lot of those specific powers of legislation. The County has not relied on any of
those... powers. Um, what has ... it has relied on is its general police power and ... a
provision in the code that allows cities and counties to enact more stringent... regulation
than the State enacts and not less stringent. So those are the two powers, or independent
powers, they point to. Um, and that's where the main focus of the analysis ... uh, resides.
It is quite clear that an employer, employee relationship is a civil or private relationship.
Even the one case that's cited by the County Attorney in our review and ... and um, my
opinion of...that voted, that held that the, uh, minimum wage ordinance could survive a
challenge based on the private law exception determined that the employer, employee
relationship is a private relationship. So what it really gets down to is whether the
minimum wage ordinance is enacted pursuant to a "independent power." Um, so the
County has relied on its general police power, and it has relied on this provision in the
code that says we ... counties can act more ... more stringent regulations and I go into a
more detailed statutory construction analysis in here. Um ... but my conclusion is that
neither one of those are ... are independent powers.
Hayek/ So I ... I look at those two memos and just to summarize what you're saying, Eleanor
(mumbled) you and the County Attorney have agreed that there's probably not a
preemption problem here and have agreed that, uh... uh... this would be a ... um, a ... a ... a law
regarding, uh, civil relationships.
Dilkes/ I think that's right.
Hayek/ (mumbled) ...the private exception issue. But where the rub is is whether there's an
independent County power ... that makes that private relationship exception okay. And I
was looking at the ... I mean I think what's interesting is ... about ... about the County's
memo, um, isn't so much what it says as ... as what it doesn't say, and I didn't see an
analysis in it of those ... of that so-called independent power, um ... which is, I mean, it's
mentioned. It says that, uh... if...if the ... if the, you know, if the police power or the more
stringent, um ... provision, um ... uh, are in fact exceptions to the private law ... issue, then it's
not an issue. But I didn't see any analysis of that.
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Dilkes/ I ... I don't want to speak for the County Attorney, but the way I read her opinion is that...
if, in looking at case law from other states, you see some that have said the general police
power in and of itself is not an independent power for purposes of this provision, and you
see one case from New Mexico that says... that... the... the general police power is a
sufficient independent power, and you don't have to find anything more... specific than
that. The problem is ... that that in ... in New Mexico they operate under a very different
statutory system than cities and counties in Iowa do. There are home rule cities that have
home rule power and the police power specifically given by the State. And there are
those that just have the specific police power. And so what Santa Fe did and they made a
good argument was they said ... we've got our home rule power and we have this general
police power that has given us independently of our home rule authority. And as one of
the commentators I pointed out in the opinion says that..who is critical of the private law
exception. I ... I think there was a law review article written when the legislature adopted
the private law exception that was very critical of it. And I ... I think those commentators
are right, but that's what we have. And what one commentator says is most cities don't
have the awkward... doctrinal route that New Mexico, that the New Mexico court could
take to uphold Santa Fe's minimum wage ordinance and that's the situation in which we
find ourselves ... in Iowa.
Throgmorton/ So we're not a court, uh, we're a policy-making body. I'm going to present you
with, uh, three particular suggestions about the course of action I think we ought to take,
and uh... y'all may not agree! And you might, I don't know. So first I think we should do
nothing ... at the moment. That is, let the County's ordinance take effect and see whether it
is contested in court and if it is contested, see how that turns out. I..we've gotten a legal
opinion from Eleanor, but it is just that — an opinion, based on competence and
everything. I mean I'm not questioning the competence of the analysis, but if it is
contested in court, I think given that case law is not definitive, and as an expression of
City policy, we should instruct our City Attorney to intervene as a friend of the County in
any future court case contesting the legality of the County's ordinance. And ... to make the
strongest possible argument, innovatively if necessary, in support of the ordinance. And I
have another suggestion but that's enough for right now.
Mims/ Well I've got a couple, I mean, number one, I support increasing the minimum wage,
okay? I mean I ... it's way long overdue. Um ... I'm uncomfortable with ... kind of speed at
which this has gone without some analysis on ... more detailed analysis. I mean it needs to
be done, but I think there needs to be more detailed analysis and the second thing is I
think that ... I think it's important for employees and employers that this is consistent
across at least the three major cities within the County, and so, um ... we've got a joint
meeting on the 19th. So I think later tonight we'll be talking about the agenda for that and
I think this should definitely be on that agenda.
Hayek/ So we got a, I mean we have a number of issues to talk about but before we leave the
legal issue, and I .... I, my training that causes me to look at it, and I'll admit to ya, I had to
read through both memos multiple times cause they're really hard to follow, but, you
know ... the conclusion I draw is that the ... the County's... the... the County Attorney's memo
basically... says, it says, its conclusion is, and I'm looking at it here, that ... uh, a local
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minimum wage ordinance should survive the private law exception ... if despite the fact
that it is a private or civil law governing civil relationships, it's adopted to one or more
independent County powers. So it...it says that it won't be a problem if it's not a problem,
but ... but, and there's not a ... an analysis of that, and ... and I'll tell you what's also
telling... which is that I don't see an opinion, or even a prediction in there, as to whether it
would be upheld on ... on a ... on a legal challenge. Um, so ... I'm not suggesting we take
action, uh, at...at this time, and I've been consistent about that, but ... it's an issue! Um, and
I ... and I think we, you know, to your point about, uh, consistency, I think we do need to
talk to the others. Um ... the other cities.
Throgmorton/ They're waitin' for us!
Hayek/ They ... they probably are. Some aren't!
Botchway/ Well I mean and I would agree, I mean, to a certain extent with Matt. I mean there's
a substance of difference between, um ... you know, both of the memos. I feel like, you
know, the County's memo focused more into some argument basis and I felt like
Eleanor's memo focused on more of the question that we asked, as far as you know
whether or not this would be upheld in court. I do agree with Jim from the standpoint of,
I mean ... we aren't a court and so I mean there's... that's the question as far as, you know,
leaving it up to the courts to decide and so, you know, my proposal or my thought on that
as well is ... quick question though! From a legality standpoint, how does that play out,
cause I don't necessarily agree to that point as far as a friend of the, um, situation because
I want to know where our liab... I mean, what's the ... how does that play out? If it was
challenged... and we let it pass, we wouldn't be then a party in that suit. It would just be
the County.
Dilkes/ Well that's a lot of questions (laughter)
Botchway/ Sorry! Sorry! (laughter)
Dilkes/ No, that's okay! I'll try and (laughs) um ... first of all, whether we would be a defendant,
um ... against our will is going to depend on the... creativity of the plaintiffs attorney.
Botchway/ Right.
Dilkes/ Um, and ... whether we would chose if we wanted a defendant to intervene is something I
would just ask ... I mean, I think you want to look at that when it comes up. Um ... so ... it
really depends if you opt in with conditions. I think you're more likely to be a ... a
defendant than if you, um ... uh... opt out or don't do anything. So it really depends on
what ... the situation is (both talking)
Hayek/ ...if we take no action, couldn't we be (both talking)
Dilkes/ We could!
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Hayek/ ...become a defendant?
Dilkes/ I think, um ... I'm not sure why a plaintiffs attorney would want two lawyers arguing
against them. Um, and in that respect I have to say, since you brought it up, um, I'm not
sure that I personally could represent the City if...if we intervened. I think we'd probably
have to hire outside counsel because, um, you know ... um, but ... but we certainly could do
that.
Botchway/ So I just wanted to make sure that was clear, but then the ... to that extent, I would
propose we do nothing. Um ... allow the situation to kind of play itself out, um ... I would
say the difference being that I would be interested in convening a task force of, um,
obviously interested groups to talk about this and this is, you know, very layman's kind of
work from a Google standpoint, um, but all the other ordinances that I saw had that
consistent within the ordinance. And I know the County had a different construction
because they wanted to make it as similar to whatever the ... state law is currently now,
but, um ... I do think that's necessary. I ... I think it's an important question, one just
because I want to know, you know, from our standpoint what a livable wage is. I mean I
know that that was currently published in the public policy as being $13 or whatever the
case may be on a ... on a remedial budget, but I mean I have questions about, you know,
the analysis. I want to have, you know, more conversations or ... I want to have ... any
conversation, I guess, with other municipalities and others in the County jurisdiction
because that didn't happen prior to this, and so um ... that's where I would stand. So I
would allow it to, I don't want to say lapse but allow it to continue and pass the
November 1St deadline, convene a council at our next ... I mean we could ... we could do
that now (mumbled) task force at our next, you now, meeting or we could do that now,
whatever the case may be, and then ... you know, have a discussion at the joint meeting,
and I'll be honest with you, I mean ... I think I've expressed my view of the joint meeting,
uh, especially in regards to this particular situation. I mean it's ... we, it's been touted out
from a joint meeting perspective that we need to meet on important issues. This issue,
based on when we met, could have been brought up at that time. It wasn't. For whatever
reason, and I, I mean I don't want to go into the details of that because, you know, that
might change the (mumbled) conversation. I don't necessarily know why we're going to
talk about it at the joint meeting. I mean if we here as a Council think it's okay to move
forward, I think we just move forward. I don't want us to change based on what
Coralville or North Liberty might do. Um, that's just my thoughts on the matter and so...
Hayek/ No, I wouldn't say we would (both talking) but ... but wouldn't we want to know what
they're thinking? I mean...
Botchway/ But we don't need to necessarily have that discussion at the joint meeting (both
talking)
Hayek/ ...be there (both talking)
Botchway/ ...happen before, so we could have a separate meeting with those cities as far as
discussing that with them, and I would actually ... I would prefer to do that that way.
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Hayek/ Outside of the ... I mean the joint meetings are these awkward (both talking) and it's short
where not much happens.
Botchway/ So I would feel like, you know, in order to really have a discussion about it from a ... if
we're really concerned about, you know, just having a discussion from a municipality
standpoint, I'd be interested in meeting with those municipalities and asking them how
they feel about the situation, regardless. I feel like our course of action is to allow it to,
um ... I keep saying lapse but I don't mean to lapse. Allow us to (both talking)
Payne/ Go into effect.
Botchway/ ...go into effect, thank you, November 1St and then convene that task force to kind of
have a better understanding from, you know, an entire livable wage perspective. I mean,
this is in accordance with whatever we're doing with affordable housing, whatever we're
doing with transportation, I mean I'm interested in having all that information. I think
this is a great point to ask that question and have that task force convened.
Hayek/ (mumbled) analysis piece.
Botchway/ Yes!
Hayek/ Um...
Dobyns/ What are we analyzing? I mean, if it's not..if the, um, ordinance is written by the
County, is not broken, analysis I assume is some speculation that can be improved upon,
which is ... another option if you want to change it.
Botchway/ I mean I'm not ... I ... I ... you know I applaud the ... I mean I agree with Susan, you know,
I applaud the fact that I believe the minimum wage should be increased, and so I mean...
we ... we have been given guidelines, I guess, as far as what that should be. Maybe after
talking with the businesses in Iowa City and after talking with, you know, or having a
discussion about things we determine that to be a lot more from a livable wage
perspective. I mean that's... that's the type of analysis I want to have with our businesses
within the community, with our workers within the community, to get to that point.
Dobyns/ So you're thinking about tweaking it. I mean, let it go forward, um, it would go into
effect November I", assuming that Iowa City does not opt out. Um ... my concern is that,
uh ... reading, uh, Eleanor's language, there seems to be some clarity that she thinks it is a
private law issue. Um, I agree that that's her legal opinion to us, which we've respected
quite a bit in the past, but it's eventually a judge who has to decide the matter. Eleanor, I
was wondering, um, not being familiar with these sorts of things, what possibly would
happen November Is. There would be a private entity who would have some issues with
the law and they would seek a court order, or urn ... and would that court order have an
injunction, which would actually stop the ordinance, either before or after it was enacted?
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Botchway/ Or nothing could happen. Nobody could bring it up, as well, on this. Both ways.
Dilkes/ Yeah, I think there's a number of, I mean, nothing could happen. It wouldn't be
challenged. A business could say... could... take the position that they're not, um, that it's
not legal and they're not going to abide by it. Um, and then ... if there's an enforcement
action by the County, um, then at that point there would be a defense based on it not
being legal. Um...
Dobyns/ Okay.
Dilkes/ ...it could, you know, a business, a business entity or, you know, could chose to ... to do
what's called the 'declaratory judgment action,' which is seeking a declaration that it's
illegal and ... and my guess is you would probably see in that case an application for a
temporary injunction (both talking)
Dobyns/ So there's all sorts of, urn ... things to, that could occur, that could cause (both talking)
Dilkes/ Yeah, it's ... (both talking)
Dobyns/ ...and you know, going forward is that during the enforcement phase one might have an
issue with it. Some might actually want to seek a legal opinion and maybe stop it at that
point. I ... you don't necessarily have to seek a legal opinion. You could actually ask any
one of the jurisdictions to please take a look at it, which in that case I think gets to your
idea about a task force. Um, I'm just wondering if it's something that we have to do now.
Um, I think we're anticipating problems. Um, certainly Eleanor's memo suggests it may
be very well a legal one. There may be some problems regarding the, uh, ordinance
itself. I'm just wondering, are you saying convene that like now? Um, cause I have a
sense that perhaps we should wait and see what goes on. I'm not (mumbled) (both
talking)
Throgmorton/ ...jump into that for a second?
Dobyns/ Sure!
Throgmorton/ Um, I ... I think Kingsley has pointed to two possible... con ... convenings. One has
to do with the discussion with other, the other jurisdictions...
Botchway/ Right!
Throgmorton/ And you know something better than a joint cities discussion.
Botchway/ Right.
Throgmorton/ But the ... the other that I think you're pointing to is something that we could
construct within Iowa City as it pertains to Iowa City itself. So there it...it seems to me
that we could be anticipating constructing a, uh, a technically confident and politically
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inclusive set of people to ... carefully look at the effects of the ordinance. Who would be
affected, you know, how many workers are affected. We know Peter Fisher said there
might be as many as 10,000 workers in ... in the city, but how ... how many workers would
be affected in what, um ... in ... in what business sectors are they located, uh, how would the
ordinance play out over time, and then how we can monitor its effect over time, and if
there are specific changes we think should reasonably be made in Iowa City, they could
identify that as well. We've already ... I think we've all had conversations with, uh, with
some, uh, not for profits who are Medicaid providers, among other things, so we know
they have concerns. So are ... are they concerns we should build into an ordinance or not?
I ... I don't know, but...
Dobyns/ So you're anticipating that we may have to tweak it.
Throgmorton/ I think it would be a reasonable thing to consider, uh, depending on what this kind
of, you know, technically competent, politically inclusive group, um, provides us with.
Hayek/ So to ... to that point, and first of all, you know, I think there's ... I think there's general
support for increasing the minimum wage. Uh, at...at this Council. Um, I don't ... and I
don't think this is what ... what the conversations about. Going to the ... going to the
analysis issue, um ... this does, I think ... I share Kingsley's view. I think we do need some
analysis that I don't think has occurred, uh, to date. I mean we ... you know, to your point
about the...the last joint meeting we had was July 20th. No mention made to the local
governments that this was coming. Two days later, at the Board of Supervisor's meeting
and ... uh, as I understand it, three of the five said ... said we're going to go in this direction.
Two of the five Supervisors were surprised by that, didn't know it was coming, and then
later that month, um, a communication out to the cities, this is ... this is what we're doing,
and ... you know ... unlike for example with the community I.D. program which involved a
lot of collaboration and ... and analysis, and ... and months of work, this was put on a pretty
fast track, um ... and uh... and here where we are ... and here's where we are and I, you know,
I fear that the lack of analysis is going to cause unintended, uh, consequences, uh, that
may result in us needing to look at changes to it, at a ... at a minimum, uh, sometime in the
future, and the example I would give is, uh... these non -profits who have come forward,
um, Systems Unlimited, Reach for Your Potential, Mayor's Youth Empowerment
program, the ARC, Successful Living, and ... and others, you know, they approached the
County, in August, um ... uh, with ... with a request to, urn ... to ... to slow down the process a
little bit and look at the impact on them. These are ... these are service providers that ... that
have among other employees hundreds of employees who do overnight service... service
work in, uh, the homes of, uh, of...of disabled, um ... customers or clients, and um ... they
sent this letter, which ... which I just got. I think it's in the late handouts.
Throgmorton/ Yeah!
Hayek/ Um, if...if you've got those, but ... you know, these are non -profits doing incredible work
in our community, um, and they ... they made a request that the Board of Supervisors
reconsider the aggressive timeframe for the minimum wage ordinance. A committee that
includes representation from a Johnson County provider of service to people with
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disabilities should be established to clearly understand and identify the implications of
the mandated increase. Supervisors should take into account the committee
recommendations before voting on any measure that may have unintended negative
consequences to the most vulnerable citizens of our community. And ... my understanding
is that expression of concern by these non -profits was ... was dismissed. Um .... and uh... I
can tell you they are very concerned. Um ... uh, and they came down to the City
and ... and ... and uh, explained to us how they operate. They have these Medicaid
contracts. Their ... their compensation comes through ... fixed Medicaid reimbursement
contracts where the rates are set. And they're set based don State rates and they ... stay in
fact for two or three years of time as I understood it, and ... and they are looking at a
financial impact in the ... in the hundreds and hundreds of thousands, if not millions of
dollars, to ... to their operations. Um, you know... they... they weren't told, uh, in advance
that this was coming and ... and ... and they have serious concerns about it. Um ... and they
are providing important services as non -profits in our community to a vulnerab...
vulnerable population. It seems to me that ... that this is part of the analysis that we want
to do. Um, who is impacted? Does it sweep up non -profits in ways that were not
intended?
Botchway/ Well I mean I think part of it ... I mean I agree. Part of that is that also, you know, the
potential loss of jobs as well. I mean you could see a ... and I wouldn't say based on the
discussion I had, because that's not what the discussion was. It ... it focused more on what
you're talking about, but ... I worry about, you know, people that ... I mean I would consider
friends or people that, you know, the loss of jobs that could come from that...
Hayek/ Yeah.
Botchway/ ...just from a (both talking)
Throgmorton/ ...the not for profit.
Botchway/ In the not for profit, excuse me, yeah. With that particular caveat and focusing on
those particular groups. But...
Dickens/ ....could happen outside that too because I've talked to a lot of business owners that
said that they would be reluctant to hire people if the rates go up.
Botchway/ I think that's ... (several talking) that's my point! That's the conversation (several
talking)
Dickens/ ...that we need to have.
Botchway/ ...afterwards, but I don't think that changes maybe...
Dickens/ (several talking) ...talked with the City Manager (mumbled) they voted for this. It has
not been on their agenda (mumbled) I think there's some questions out there, uh, it hasn't
been on their agenda. They haven't put any ... they haven't decided whether to just let it go
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or not, so ... you have Solon north of us that's already said they're not going to do it. You
have Hills south of us that's been ... been reported that they're for it, and they really haven't
voted on it. So I think there's a lot of misinformation there too that we need to do with
the analysis.
Throgmorton/ All ... all true but the most important (mumbled) in Johnson County is Iowa City.
So we should be clear about what we think.
Mims/ That we need analysis.
Hayek/ But, Jim, these non -profits came to you as well.
Throgmorton/ Absolutely!
Hayek/ (both talking)
Throgmorton/ Kingsley and I ... when we, well, I'll talk about that. Kingsley and I had a very
fruitful conversation with three representatives of not ... uh, of the non -profits. So, I think
we got a very clear sense of how they think they'll be affected by, uh, this ordinance.
And I think those views absolutely need to be taken into account and ... and considered,
and if we get to a point where we want to ... insert some modifications into what the
County has, uh, put into its ordinance, but ... just because they present us with that point of
view is not in itself persuasive to me that there aren't other things that they could do. I
mean, I've had other conversations with people who know the insides of not for profits
and they ... there are plenty of ways that they could adjust. I'm no expert. I don't know.
But ... but I've definitely heard that.
Mims/ But that's why we need the analysis.
Throgmorton/ Well, I'm all for (both talking)
Mims/ Yeah, to me ... I don't know the ins and outs and what adjustments they could or couldn't
make, and I haven't heard directly what the effect is so...
Botchway/ Well, to that conversation, I mean, the issue ... I mean in ... and I don't know if it was
the same one, and help me if I'm misconstruing this a little bit is that, you know, right
now as of November Is', I mean, that's... that's coming up and so there wouldn't be a
question as far as how to look at that but ... the harder bump so to speak from a budgetary
standpoint was the May 1St one, specifically that it would occur... basically you'd have two
jumps within a budget cycle, which ... I mean is ... something that is, I mean, is interesting
from a budgetary standpoint. Um...
Dickens/ ...40% increase over the (both talking)
Mims/ Fourteen months.
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Botchway/ So that's why I'm asking about the analysis and the task force, to really kind of talk
about these things. However, I mean ... they seemed ... I wouldn't say ... they seemed okay.
I'm not saying (mumbled) okay but ... they ... I felt like they weren't... saying that we needed
to not ... or do something to stop where we are currently from the County's ordinance
going into effect November 1St. And that's, I mean, help me if I'm (both talking)
Throgmorton/ Well I definitely think is the May 1St part of it that (both talking) worried them the
most, from the conversation we had. Yeah.
Hayek/ Go ahead!
Payne/ I was just going to say, I ... I agree with doing nothing, letting the ordinance go into effect,
but I do totally agree that we need the analysis so that we can understand better the
ramifications that it's going to have to everyone who lives in the city, not just the people
who will have an increased wage but those non -profits, and businesses too, I mean,
everybody!
Hayek/ But I, I mean, I just ... I have to say it's concerning to me that ... that such prominent and
important non -profits, you know, were ... were not a part of the process. They're gonna
have to be! We've got ... they've got to be part of this analysis, because if...if this
ordinance in fact hits them as significantly as they're predicting, um, you know, their...
their viability is called into question, and certainly the ability to serve, uh, these
populations, uh, that they serve, and we may need through this ... this analysis, uh, to, um,
to modify the ordinance, uh, going forward and certainly if...if there's home rule authority
to do this in the first place, there has to be home rule authority to distinguish between
employers on some rational basis. (several talking)
Botchway/ I would agree!
Hayek/ Um ... uh... and ... and, you know, we may ... we ... I don't know what employers pay less than
a minimum wage, um, probably want to look at that. Why and ... and what is that
population and...
Botchway/ And that's a question I want to know as well, I mean, what employers pay less than
minimum wage ... the greater question is why, I mean ... what can we do. I mean, there's...
there's ... what can we do to possibly support those individuals. I do think that, you know,
having an important piece. I don't want that to be kind of overlooked. Having... because
of the work that has kind of preceded this, I think was important in pushing this to the,
you know, precipice of where we are now and not having them a part of the process
would be foolish on that end, as well, and so I wanted to make sure that there's an
inclusion or a thought of inclusion of workers in that process as well, but I ... I just think
that we need to have ... there's a lot of questions that I ... I think have been unanswered
(several talking)
Mims/ Totally agree!
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Hayek/ (both talking) ...looks at ... looks at it from the perspective of employees, employers and
employers of all stripes (several talking)
Botchway/ And again, cursory Google look and so I'm not even saying that this is any type of
legitimate analysis, but it ... it, there was a lot more detail to the ordinances that, again, this
is ... I mean, and not to ... this is a huge ... and a monumental change that I support, um...
from the standpoint of, you know, tying a possible minimum wage increase to, um, you
now, consumer price index. I mean, but that is a drastic change than what has previously
been the law.
Mims/ Should have been done 20 years ago!
Botchway/ Right, and so I mean (several talking) I want to make sure that there's some
discussion and thoughtful analysis about that, and that's all I'm ... that's all I'm asking for.
Dobyns/ Are you thinking the analysis should be multi jurisdictional or just from Iowa City? I
mean we probably (both talking)
Botchway/ You know, I would say both, to a certain extent. I don't ... I'm ... I'm interested in
having a multi jurisdictional conversation, but I'm also not interested if their not
necessarily (both talking)
Dobyns/ We know what may not happen if we have multi jurisdictional (several talking)
Payne/ Many of the people that you would chose to have on the ... analysis team or task force,
whatever you want to call it...
Dobyns/ Uh huh.
Payne/ ...would represent more than just Iowa City. They would... they're multi jurisdictional
anyway, so you would get some kind of a overlying multi jurisdictional (both talking)
Dobyns/ That would be my lean, though I recognize possibility for ... you know, as we've seen in
multi jurisdictional meetings that it may bog down. I'd also want the, um, participants in
this realize that there is a parallel... there may be a parallel ongoing legal evaluation. Um,
and so ... you know, if a judge all of a sudden says this isn't legal under the code of Iowa,
those people are going to be meeting for not, and I think there's a lot of people that
are ... very willing to go into and participate in the analysis, but they have to know that
there's a parallel judicial, um ... uh, evaluation going on that all of a sudden may ... you
know, put that ... what they're... whatever they're doing to an end.
Throgmorton/ Could I spin off on that and ask Eleanor a legal question, even though we're not at
court? (laughs) Uh, and, Eleanor, my question has to do with the private law exception.
All right, so ... I mean I get it that that's an important point that you're drawing our
attention to. Uh, but this is a ... what the ... the kind of case that's called a first...
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Dilkes/ First impression?
Throgmorton/ First impression kind of case, so they'll be making de novo law. If...if the case
gets to them and the question is in the State of Iowa can a county, uh, adopt this kind of
ordinance, right?
Dilkes/ I think what you're asking is has the Iowa Supreme Court spec... addressed this specific
issue. No, they've not.
Throgmorton/ Yeah, right. Okay. Thank you. Um, so ... what it makes me wonder is if in fact
this, um ... if...if the case goes on, goes forward, and is contested, I don't know, to the
Supreme Court in Iowa and they rule that this private law exception says... counties, and
therefore cities, cannot do this kind of thing, what else would that effect? In other words,
would it affect, uh, landlord/tenant relations? Would it affect, uh, let's see, what's some
other words, um ... um, rent ... rent control, which we don't have here but, you know...
Dilkes/ (both talking) I think some of the cases (both talking)
Throgmorton/ ...what else?
Dilkes/ I think from some of the cases from other jurisdictions have dealt with rent control. Um,
I think when you look at the cases, they don't have any trouble finding in ... independent
power or a ... not indirect impact on a civil relationship when you're talking about a health
and safety code, um ... uh, a issue. Um, there've been some challenges based on that that
have been pretty weak challenges, that... the... where you're going to see it is when it's
really direct legislation with respect to a ... private relationship, an employer/employee
relationship, a landlord/tenant relationship. I gave you the example of the judge in Cedar
Rapids who had determined that because of this provision the, uh, the Cedar Rapids'
ordinance that said there must be a crime -free lease addendum in every lease, uh, in
Cedar Rapids. The court in that case, the district court said, uh, that violates the private
law exception. Frankly in that case, they had a better argument, um, because they were at
least trying to bootstrap it in with the health and safety... argument.
Throgmorton/ Yeah, so this gets to why I, uh... I ... I think we should instruct our City Attorney
or ... or an outside representative, um, to represent the City in the court case because if...if
the court, if the case goes on to the Supreme Court and the County loses, we may find
that we are prohibited from doing all sorts of things that we might, or a Council in the
future, might want to do. And ... and it's ... it's a .... a de novo case or whatever, right? So...
Dilkes/ A case of first impression.
Throgmorton/ Case of first impression.
Mims/ It seems to me, and I think Eleanor mentioned this earlier, it seems to me that's a really
premature decision to make. I mean ... we don't know what kind of case. We don't know
if there's going to be a case, and we don't know what kind of case it's going to be. So I
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think to me we look at it at that time. It's not something I'd be willing to ... make a
decision on at this point because (several talking)
Dilkes/ Remember this (both talking)
Throgmorton/ ...I think that we ought to be looking at (both talking)
Dilkes/ ...there's a ... there's a legislative fix, obviously, too (both talking)
Mims/ Right. Yeah! (laughs)
Hayek/ Yeah, the legislature could come in and (several talking)
Dilkes/ ...legislature can...
Hayek/ Preempt!
Dilkes/ ...the private law exception.
Throgmorton/ On that point, it seems to me we could also instruct our City staff to lobby the
State legislature to remove the private law exemption sentence from the State code.
Botchway/ Or ... increase the minimum wage (laughter) I mean they could do that too!
Throgmorton/ Better yet (laughter and several talking)
Botchway/ I mean that ... and I don't know (both talking)
Hayek/ And we talked to them about that. Yeah.
Mims/ Yeah, we'll be looking at legislative priorities pretty soon so ... (several talking)
Hayek/ You know, but... but... and what keeps... bugging me (laughs) on this ... on this legal
analysis is, this whole thing comes down to this private law exception. (several
responding) And it ... and the ... the opinion from the County Attorney does not analyze
that. Um ... doesn't offer an opinion about the likelihood of...of surviving a legal
challenge, and I wonder whether was even asked to ... to do that. Um, Eleanor, your ... your
memo was, uh, hard to read. Um, but...
Botchway/ I told her that (both talking)
Hayek/ ...um...
Dobyns/ And you guys went to law school! (laughter)
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Hayek/ But, uh, I think I understand it, but you know, I think we're ... we're going into this with
eyes wide open ... as ... as to the risk.
Throgmorton/ If we had chosen to ask a different question, we would have gotten a different
answer. And ... and here's what I mean by that. If we had chosen to ask, and I'm part of
this too, if we had chosen to ask Eleanor... please tell us ... give us your sense of the
strongest possible case that we could make on behalf of the County's ordinance. I think
Eleanor would have done that. And ... and it may not have been a very strong argument, I
don't know, but ... but she would have done that.
Hayek/ Right but we ... sure! But we (both talking) but we routinely ask our counsel do you think
such -and -such is ... legal or likely to be construed as legal. And that's a ... that's a natural
thing, I think, for a local government to ask of its legal counsel.
Payne/ So my question is, to piggyback on ... on Kingsley, is how do we go about putting together
this group?
Botchway/ I don't think it necessarily needs to be decided right now.
Hayek/ No, I'd like to (both talking)
Payne/ ...or do we wait ... after we have our meetings with the ... with the other cities or do we wait
until after November 1St or what ... what is the thought on ... pro ... on timing.
Dobyns/ Timing?
Botchway/ I mean I think it's ... Tom, you want to weigh in here? I mean I think this is a
discussion that we can have, I mean, we can ... basically ask staff to ... convene a group of
individuals to look at this. I mean... there's... you know, you have the Public Policy
Project. You have, um ... CWJ. You have, um, multiple businesses — the Chamber, I
mean you could convene a group of interested constituents for a task force. I mean I can
go back to my Googling and ... and look and see what other ordinances have done as well,
I mean, that's kind of where it came from.
Dobyns/ Yeah. I think we need to stay more strategic as a council. Um, I'm just interested
what ... I ... I know what we've said, but what is the City Manager's office, I mean, when we
talk about forming a multi jurisdictional analysis group, I'm just wondering what
you ... what's the take -away, Tom, um...
Markus/ I'm not sure that ... that involving all the other cities is the right thing to do at this point.
Um ... my take is is that we have the capability to evaluate it ourselves, for our city,
involving some of the people in the community.
Payne/ And when I made the mention that it's ... it would end up being multi ... being multi -
jurisdictional, I didn't mean there would be representatives from the other cities. I meant
that other people from other groups would... overarching over the region.
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Mims/ Business community (both talking) Non -profits (both talking)
Payne/ ...that's what I meant.
Dobyns/ And decisions that ... an analysis that we may make may be transferable to other
jurisdictions, should they so decide.
Payne/ Yeah, that ... that's what I meant.
Dobyns/ Okay. Yeah.
Markus/ I agree with that. (clears throat) I agree with that.
Throgmorton/ The key question that, at the moment, I ... I think, is ... do, uh... a majority of us agree
that at the moment we should do nothing.
Hayek/ Well I think everyone agrees (several talking) should do nothing. Um...
Mims/ I mean I think everybody agrees ... I've gotten the sense everybody agrees we need some
analysis. That...
Dobyns/ That too!
Mims/ ...that wasn't done be ... you know, that should have been done before this was passed
and ... before we can make a decision, we need that analysis.
Hayek/ I think it should ... I think it should be discussed to some degree at the next joint meeting.
It's going to be the elephant in the room, right, and ... and uh.... uh, if nothing else, just to
say where we are, you know, and... and... indicate (several talking)
Mims/ But ... but I agree, we can have the one-on-one conversations, whether it's between the
mayors or between a couple council members from different jurisdictions.
Botchway/ I mean I, and again I don't want to be a, you know...
Payne/ Nay sayer?
Botchway/ Nay sayer (laughter) having these, you know, discussions between jurisdictions
because you know I ran on that. I thought it was very important to do, but you know
there's... there's a lot of backdoor type of stuff that happens that isn't known, that isn't
public knowledge, that makes these joint meetings...
Payne/ Seem superficial?
Botchway/ Yes!
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Payne/ (laughs)
Hayek/ Listen, I ... I completely agree with you, with respect to the utility of these joint meetings.
Um ... uh... but they're what we have presently and I think we should at least... mention it.
Payne/ (mumbled)
Hayek/ But I don't have any ... any illusions that we're gonna, you know, solve the ... this or any
other issue through that venue particularly.
Dobyns/ But it's an opportunity (both talking)
Hayek/ ...so big, it's so big and kind of unwieldy and...
Dobyns/ ...everybody's in the room, and everybody hears the same thing at the same time. Um,
and so there's some value to that, nominal value, but...
Payne/ I didn't mean to put words in your mouth (mumbled)
Botchway/ Oh, you didn't! That was perfect!
Hayek/ Good word! (laughter) Okay!
Throgmorton/ I'd like to thank Eleanor for IP #4, which is a memo about exceptions and special
certificates, pertaining to the minimum wage ordinance. For me, it's very helpful to see
what workers are exempted and what business categories or whatever, yeah! From the
State law and therefore from the County... ordinance. Yeah.
Aizenda items for ioint meeting 11P # 5 Info Packet of 10/11:
Hayek/ All right. Let's move on to the next bullet point, which we've actually touched upon —
agenda items for joint meeting. Anything ... (both talking)
Throgmorton/ (mumbled) (laughs)
Information Packet Discussion [September 17, 24. October 11:
Hayek/ ...anything else? Have we heard from other jurisdictions what they're putting on the
agenda? Do you know, Julie? Oka. All right. Uh, we have three Info Packets. Oh,
man, did I delete my September 17 ?
Throgmorton/ Oh oh!
Payne/ Oh no! (laughter)
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Hayek/ Hold on!
Botchway/ So, I mean ... I'm not going. Yeah. Never mind!
Hayek/ (mumbled)
Botchway/ Well I know where we're going on the September 17th. This kind of falls in line with
joint meeting discussion, communication protocol. I mean I see my notes here that says
can we not just then do a communication protocol with North Liberty, um, you know...
Mims/ They don't seem interested anymore.
Botchway/ Well and I think that comes with just ... if everybody's not doing it, why ... then why
would we do it. You know, I mean, I ... I just don't get it. I mean...
Mims/ I don't either! (several talking)
Botchway/ ...right now just because, you know, you went to a Omaha and Sioux City who would
definitely have competing interests. I mean, if you just see Sioux City (both talking)
Mims/ Oh yeah!
Botchway/ ...you see Omaha. To not have it ... is interesting, um ... some of the comments from the
memo are interesting, um ... you know ... I just ... I don't... there's nothing more to say (both
talking)
Mims/ ...I'd say disappointing.
Botchway/ Yeah. I like to use interesting just because, you know...
Hayek/ You know, I mean this ... this, you know this all came about as a result of the TIF reform
from ... before you even joined the Council several years ago and you know we spent two,
two and a half years working on a document and all of the communities had input, all of
the three communities that were discussing it had ... had input and contributed to the draft.
You know, by the holidays last year we concluded that there just really wasn't genuine
interest so we dropped it! And... and... and early 15, early 2015, ICAD picks it back up,
and its membership includes the city administrators or managers of the ... of the three
cities, and we weren't doing anything! They ... they brought it back up and endorsed it,
and uh... so, uh, and offered to come to our councils. We said we'd vote on it. They did.
Um, and ... and ... and then that, um ... uh, died out. There just wasn't interest at the time, and
then there was this interest in kind of taking another angle at it, which was at the ... at the
political level, um, and ... and that's what I told you we were chewing on.
Botchway/ Right.
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Hayek/ And, yeah, it was ... it was terribly disappointing to find out that that wasn't going to
happen.
Botchway/ We're just not big enough.
Hayek/ I'm ... I'm over it. I mean (both talking) if you had talked to me two or three weeks ago I
would have been ... uh... but (both talking) it's very important.
Botchway/ ...had a longer diatribe to kind of (laughter) follow along with this but ... I just ... I just
wanted to make mention of it because I think it's an important piece. Again,
other ... bigger communities do it. Other areas that I've lived in. I don't necessarily
understand, um ... why, I mean ... even if we were to rework it, I mean, for not having any
type of discussion whatsoever kind of...that's ... that's the part that makes me upset.
Payne/ Right now there's nothing in it that they see positive for them.
Botchway/ (mumbled) discussion as far as what we can change, I mean, that ... I'd like to just have
a discussion, but if it's not going to be discussed (both talking)
Hayek/ I don't think it's going to happen, but I will say, you know, this ... this notion that current
law protects everybody in the same way that this agreement would protect everybody,
that's not true. It ... the current law only speaks to certain forms of economic incentives,
um, and ... I'm not going to spend the time on it, but ... but it ... but this agreement would
have done more than what current law does ... for cities.
Botchway/ Well and I ... and the other reason that I brought this up is that I think that we do, I
know that we talk about it from multi jurisdictional and regional standpoint a lot, but I
know that we're coming up to our strategic planning session and I know you're
(mumbled) on Council, uh, at the time but I think there needs to be a conversation as far
as what Iowa City does moving forward. I mean I think that's something that you always
bring up from a ... me to focus on Iowa City and I ... I totally, you know, I think that's a
important part of this, that we need to start, you know, for our residents, you know,
what's best for Iowa City residents, cause I think we always have a conversation as far as,
you know, what's best for our Iowa City residents but how that affects other jurisdictions
as well and ... you know, it's ... (both talking)
Mims/ I don't think it's so much how it affects other jurisdictions. I think it's that many times
there's things that we ... would really like to do in Iowa City, but if we go it alone, it can
have a negative impact on (both talking)
Botchway/ Right!
Mims/ ...Iowa City. I mean I would say that with like inclusionary zoning. Um, you know ... I
think probably everybody, or most of us, would support of that in some form or another,
but the concern about going it alone, what does that do. So it's not, you know, it's not that
we ... uh... don't want to work with others or not that we aren't looking out for our citizens.
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I think we are. I think we're looking our for our residents, but there's more that we would
like to do, but that lack of cooperation from other municipalities challenges us because
there are some things that if you do them in one municipality and not regionally, they can
backfire on you!
Payne/ It can put us at a disadvantage!
Mims/ It can! Depending on the issue you're talking about, and so ... um, I think...
Botchway/ That's a good point!
Mims/ I think that's what a lot of that concern is, at least from my perspective.
Throgmorton/ I think it may depend on the issue. I wouldn't disagree with that, but beyond that,
in principle, there's no reason why we shouldn't be leading the way instead of letting
ourselves be anchored by what neighboring jurisdictions do. It ... (both talking)
Mims/ I think that gets beyond the context of this.
Hayek/ Yeah!
Mims/ ...in terms of...
Throgmorton/ Well, it just responds exactly what you said. So I don't need to say anything else
but (mumbled) to that.
Hayek/ Well anyway...
Botchway/ (mumbled)
Hayek/ What other, uh, items on that September l7t"?
Payne/ Um, I think ... that there's something (mumbled)
Botchway/ IP5. Just thought it was a great article by, um ... Stacy Walker. I mean (mumbled)
gave a really good perspective. It was very well written, um, way better than I would
have written it, so ... I just wanted to kind of give -just some kudos to that particular
person, obviously the City Manager, for putting it on the packet.
Payne/ And I wanted to say thank you to, uh, Karen Howard. I don't know if she's here. I don't
see her. Um, for IP6, um, I had made a ... a comment about the landscape plan.
Hayek/ Right.
Payne/ And she wrote up a memo and I thought that was a ... that was great, so...
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Hayek/ Yep. September 241h
Botchway/ Um, I don't know if we're going to have a discussion as far as what we're going to do
for next month or wait until, um ... next meeting, um ... for KXIC.
Dobyns/ I had a question about IP3, um ... this is regarding the art (several talking and laughing)
Oh, I'm sorry! (laughter and several talking)
Botchway/ You have yours set already so you don't have to worry about it! (several talking and
laughing)
Dobyns/ I'm sorry! (laughter)
Botchway/ No, I mean let's go to ... I don't know if we had this ... I mean, that's the question. Do
we have this discussion now or later? I mean it doesn't matter to me.
Hayek/ Um...
Dobyns/ I responded to silence by going forward. I heard silence! (laughs)
Hayek/ (several talking)
Botchway/ ...we can wait, I mean...
Hayek/ ...wait to the next meeting (several talking) We're good through ... (several talking)
November (several talking)
Payne/ ...cause there's nobody to prerecord that. (several talking)
Hayek/ Yeah, all right. We're good through the &h.
Botchway/ Okay. So we're good. I mean (several talking) That's fine. Okay.
Dobyns/ When I hear KXIC, Kingsley, I sort of ignore it because I (laughter) cause I never
discuss KXIC cause I'm sort of embedded in there already from years past.
Throgmorton/ KXIDOBYNS.
Dobyns/ Yeah, I just (laughs)
Payne/ IP3? (several talking)
Mims/ Rick, IP3?
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Dobyns/ Yes, um ... how would we go, uh, forming the fundraising committee? Would this be
from the Art Commission, um, do they put it together? I'm just sort of wondering about
how that happens.
Fruin/ There's... there's already a fundraising committee that's assembling right now and it's being
led by the ... the Iowa City Downtown District, uh, but we'll incrue ... include a cross-
section of people beyond their membership, but they're going to lead the charge.
Dobyns/ Okay.
Mims/ I will have to say I was there for the...
Botchway/ I missed it!
Mims/ ...I was there and I think Jim was there for the unveiling, um, I think this thing is
absolutely beautiful. I think it will be a stu... absolutely stunning addition to the (several
talking) downtown. Pardon?
Botchway/ Was it on the (several talking)
Mims/ No, it was down in the theater.
Botchway/ All right, I don't feel as bad but ... (laughter and several talking)
Hayek/ Was it the actual piece or was it like a ... Spinal Tap mini -version (laughter) of you who
know the Spinal Tap reference I'm making, of the same thing! (laughter)
Dickens/ And the artist loved Iowa Nice!
Hayek/ It's feet not inches! (laughter)
Dickens/ Very impressive to talk to and meet actually.
Mims/ Yeah!
Dickens/ Very genuine.
Mims/ Yeah.
Dickens/ Looking forward to (both talking)
Mims/ It was very interesting listening to kind of the thought process that he went through from
the very beginning to the very end of the design, but it's ... it is a beautiful, beautiful piece!
Dobyns/ I wanted to comment on IP4, what may be Mike Moran's last memo, uh, letter to us.
Um, I ... I ... I couldn't pull up this web site, taking a look at which trails were going to be,
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um, cleared of snow (coughing, unable to hear speaker) pull it up for me, and it actually,
it's actually very incremental. The amount of trails all over the city that aren't going to
be, um, you know, de -snowed this winter is actually pretty minimal. I was concerned
about that because as you know you know you ... you ignore it one snowfall and it
becomes icy and treacherous, um, so it was good to see that. I think this is a nice,
incremental... response by the City, trying, you know, cut some costs.
Hayek/ Well remember there was a mayor in Chicago, Blandick I think from like 40 years ago
who flubbed a snow emergency. Got booted! (laughter) He was a one -termer! (several
talking) (mumbled) Somehow ended up on the Illinois Supreme Court but ... (laughter
and several talking) All right. Next packet's October 1St
Botchway/ I was just, you know, commend Eleanor again on the memo. I mean it was ... as Matt
said, it was difficult to read. I had to read it a couple of times, but I think that was
because of the level of detail and analysis that went into it, and so it was ... I ... I was
wanting to see ... what other states with similar provisions, and I saw that, so that was ... I
just ... I have, I just appreciate. I mean, I'm not looking at you, but I appreciate that.
Mims/ Yeah!
Payne/ On IP8, uh, Kent Ralston and Melissa Clow, um ... the Mayflower pedestrian crossing.
Thank you for doing that and explaining to us...it to us again, and I thought it was
interesting in there that, um, one of the things we had talked about last time was where
the ... where we had talked about the speed limit changing, and everybody ... not everybody
cause it ... I didn't, but remember that changing at, um, Foster Road and it really it ... what
we discussed was at the Terrell Mill Park, between Terrell Mill Park and Taft Speedway.
So it's ... it is south of Foster Road, not at Foster Road (several talking) I didn't know if
you caught that, Jim, so I wanted to make sure.
Throgmorton /Yeah.
Hayek/ (mumbled) I think that's slowing it down too soon but that's going to be y'alls problem
(both talking)
Mims/ ...hindsight I think it might be too, but we'll see.
Payne/ ...(several talking) ...change speed limits like, you know, like we change our clothes, it
seems like (laughter) So it's not like it can't be fixed if it's not right later.
Mims/ Yeah! (laughter)
Botchway/ I'm still waiting on that ride -along for, um, for roundabout! Me and you! Telling you
they work! I've seen 'em in Coralville! It works (several talking and laughing)
Payne/ ...round it and around it, cause you can't figure out how to get off of it? (laughter and
several talking)
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Hayek/ You can't figure out how to get (laughter)
Throgmorton/ ...on IP 14, in the October I packet.
Hayek/ Yeah!
Throgmorton/ Council listening posts, Java House, at Mormon Trek. Uh... I ... I think back to the
main purpose, uh, for which we adopted these listening posts and it was to connect with,
uh, with ... parts of our community that do not feel connected with, uh, the community and
with leadership of the community, and to meet with them in places where they would feel
most comfortable, and I don't think the Java House is ... is the kind of place in
which ... uh... (several talking) recent refuges...
Payne/ Not that I know ofl
Throgmorton/ ...sorry, what?
Mims/ I thought it'd been moved! I thought I saw...
Botchway/ That was'Coffee With a Cop,' I saw ... (both talking) that's what got me confused
(several talking)
Dobyns/ ...but you know, I would suggest that anywhere you put on the west side is trying to
appeal to people who aren't really invested in city politics. (laughs) So I...
Throgmorton/ I get the humor! (laughs) Yeah.
Dobyns/ Well it's intentional humor, as someone who lives on the west side, um, you know, I ... I
think I've known for years that there's been more of a disconnect with the west side of
Iowa City on what goes on. So the intention of having the Java House, um, was not that
we wouldn't have it at Pheasant Ridge. By the way, I've visited Pheasant Ridge in my
other job on multiple occasions, um, so I know where it is. I know the people who are,
um, there, but I think the original intention was anything on the west side is a good idea.
Um, I would talk to Michelle, I mean we can move it or we can split it, I mean it's ... it's a
three-minute walk from the Java House to the Pheasant Ridge community room. Um,
and we could have it, um ... you know, at both places. (several talking) ....that meets the,
uh, the wishes of the Council.
Botchway/ I would agree. I mean I would agree with Jim. I think it's ... you know, just based on
what we're trying to do, I think maybe we do it ... maybe we flip it. Maybe we go back to
the Java House later on. At least this time, um ... for this one in particular, go to, uh, the
Pheasant Ridge.
Dobyns/ (mumbled) ...heard this a tad earlier because we're already got the word out there so...
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Botchway/ Well I don't know if we had said it.
Throgmorton/ I meant to bring it up at the last meeting, but (several talking)
Hayek/ ...talk to Marian when she gets back and ... cogitate on this.
Botchway/ And the other piece is if it is ... if we don't decide to change it, then my request would
be is there any way that we can have some communication with the Pheasant Ridge
Neighborhood Center to say, hey, could you hold an event at the Java House?
Dobyns/ Yeah. I ... I, based on the attendance that you all have talked about in other areas, I don't
think changing it at this time is going to be a ... a big problem. I think we know Marian
well enough and when she gets back she will ask the same question I just asked — what is
the will of Council? So ... um, before...
Payne/ And ... and just, I mean, when we had it at Lucky's Market and you moved it from one
room to another room, you couldn't get people to go from this room to that room. So if
we move it a whole blocks away, I think, you know, you're even (laughs)
Dickens/ We couldn't even find the room we were supposed to be in so (laughs)
Botchway/ Speak for yourself, Terry! (laughter and several talking) Just kidding! (laughter)
Payne/ I don't disagree that we should have something in a place where people feel comfortable
coming. That's the whole point.
Mims/ Yeah.
Payne/ Um, but it's ... you know, next week and trying to change something at this late date, I ... I
don't (several talking)
Dobyns/ I'm fine ... I don't care.
Payne/ I don't care.
Dobyns/ Where do you guys want us to go? I mean, I think it probably should be ... we should
make a decision now because... should have made a decision a week ago or two.
Botchway/ I've been trying to make these unilateral decisions for, you know, the last year and a
half on Council (laughter and several talking)
Payne/ ...either way.
Mims/ I think given ... I totally agree with Jim, in terms of the kind of location. Um, but I think
given the late date, I think it should stay there, but then maybe we do the next one on the
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west side as well, and try and do it at Pheasant Ridge (several talking) You know,
and ... so we do two over there and then we...
Hayek/ And then maybe a third locale that would work.
Mims/ Yeah. (several talking)
Botchway/ Well and I guess this is also a question, I mean, know we have our round table, uh, or
convene a roundtable. Is this something that is a topic of discussion for the people that
are there, to say you know what are some places for the Council listening posts in the
future, because we said this ... and when you talked about Lucky's Market, we needed to
focus more on, you know, what the actual intent of having (several talking) I don't want
to say that, because I know the intent of listening posts is just to get ... is to listen from a
Council perspective, and anybody's invited, but ... I mean, particularly these were born out
of our discussion from the Ad Hoc Diversity Committee, and so is there any kind of
discussion from the roundtable that's been convened, as far as maybe some places that,
um...
Markus/ We can certainly bring it up!
Botchway/ Okay.
Hayek/ Yeah. You know, I...
Markus/ We have a meeting this week, so...
Hayek/ I wouldn't be adverse to occasionally holding one in someone's home, if that could be
arranged, I mean there ... there may be a community leader whose home would...
Botchway/ Matt!
Hayek/ Yeah! (laughter) Exactly! Um ... uh, who (several talking and laughing)
Dobyns/ ...like to speak to the fact that with the mention about Pheasant Ridge is, Tom, when
was that police, uh, event over at Pheasant...
Markus/ Summer of...at least a summer ago.
Dobyns/ Yeah, it was about 14 months ago, um, the police department, um, had a big summer
party at the Pheasant Ridge Apartments. Uh, Tom and I attended, and I had several
conversations as I was, um, you know -just wondering around for about an hour.
(mumbled) talked about city sort of issues so, um, and ... and as you recall back then there
were some shootings going on in Pheasant Ridge. So there is, uh, no paucity of
discussions between people on Pheasant Ridge and myself and, you know, Tom maybe,
you may have had some as well. So fear not! Pheasant Ridge has not been ignored! Um
by the group here, and so that's why I guess it really wasn't on my radar to go to Pheasant
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Ridge. I think it can wait, because Pheasant Ridge has gotten a significant amount of
attention, which they needed to get, uh, because the context of that time.
Payne/ The question I guess I have is can we take this ... urn ... press release and hang it on their
community board and at least they know we're doing something, you know.
Markus/ We'll take care of that. We'll make sure it gets posted (both talking)
Dobyns/ ...Java House may not be a place where, you know, Pheasant Ridge may feel
comfortable going and I ... (several talking)
Botchway/ ...because one, I don't drink coffee. Two, urn ... it's also ... a place where it's, uh.... I
don't ... I'm not a coffee drinker, so it's a weird space for me, but normally do we ... can
we ... is there a room there? So you'd be talking out in public.
Dobyns/ Well yeah, I sat there one time (mumbled) two years ago (mumbled) we sat out in the
open (both talking)
Botchway/ ...did have like 15 people, I mean, that would be a problem for that space.
Dobyns/ Right. Yeah. We talked to Marian about that, but ... I brought that up myself.
Botchway/ Oh, okay.
Dobyns/ (both talking) ...seemed to think that was, you know, okay.
Botchway/ Okay! Never mind!
Dobyns/ I'll have my .... my quiet voice! (laughter)
Botchway/ I hope so!
Markus/ The Ad Hoc Committee's a good place to have these discussions. Uh, we moved the,
uh, 'Coffee With a Cop' as a result of conversations there. (several talking) ...Center for
Worker Justice.
Botchway/ Yeah, okay. Um, IP7. So, to talk this out, um, basically... had a discussion here and
this is normally the, um, not discussion — the, um ... Jim, what is it you did before you took
it over, when they all asked questions? It's kind of a news conference for the journalism
students, um, from the University (both talking) Yeah, press conference kind of thing.
Well one of the things I did was, you know, put the proverbial foot in my mouth, but how
I was talking about, uh, street harassment, basically, um ... I ... I made it seem, although I
wasn't meaning, um, meaning it by what I was thinking that, you know, it was a non -
issue and more importantly that it was only focused on the student population or student
males that were doing it. Um ... you know, uh... I had already watched a video previously
about how pervasive street harassment is and how problematic it can be, um ... be honest
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with you, I had no knowledge that it was so pervasive in Iowa City, um ... not only based
on the, uh, person's report with male students, but also, you know ... all men. Um, the
question I have is whether or not we can work session this agenda item to talk about a
possible ordinance that can, um ... define ... and set parameters around, um ... street
harassment and it be more enforceable from that perspective, or what we can do from a
Council perspective, to really, you know, boost the police presence, urn ... uh, provide
education, provide some type of ordinance around it, because ... um, again, you know, it's
a lot more pervasive than I was, um, I would even consider the time and, you know, I feel
like I kind of, and again, put the proverbial foot in my mouth when I was talking about it
because of the lack of knowledge, but also, um, because my own implicit bias about the
situation, as well, and so, um ... my response to it is wanting to, you know, make sure that
we have some type of, um ... uh... some type of, you know, response. But response to
their .... their response is that we have some type of response about how we talk about
(mumbled) street harassment. So Tom's going to give me the query... questionable look
(both talking)
Markus/ So is this an unwanted... comment or advance by a male towards a female?
Botchway/ Yeah! Basically. I mean there's also been ... I was told that there has been like, uh,
pictures posted, and I don't know how from the ordinance standpoint, from a housing
ordinance standpoint, pictures posted on, um, in windows that were suggestive and could
be viewed as harassment, as well, and I don't know how, again, I know that Missouri
looked at this a little bit and it was ... they did pass an ord... I don't know if they passed an
ordinance or not, but they were talking about it. I couldn't find where the ordinance was
actually passed, but ... it's becoming a conversation kind of nationally about street
harassment and wanting to do something about it.
Markus/ Are you familiar with it, Eleanor? In terms of the (both talking)
Dilkes/ I read the memo that talked about what's available in Iowa now, and ... and (both talking)
a lot of sense to me.
Botchway/ ...and I gave that because ... I just, you know, I was Googling it and that's the
information as far as ... what we could do possibly right away from an enforceability
standpoint, but I didn't know whether or not there could be more stringent requirements
drafted from an ordinance standpoint, as well.
Hayek/ Should ... go ahead, Eleanor!
Dilkes/ I think it might make sense to look more in terms of enforcement before, you know...
how the police department deals with the existing tools, yeah, and ... and then ... I think we
need to define the problem...
Botchway/ Okay!
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Dilkes/ ...look at how we currently deal with it, and then determine if there are ... ways that we
need to change our enforcement or we need ... there's a new ordinance that we could, um,
put in place that isn't currently available. And it's hard to talk about it globally, you
know, without... without having that background first.
Throgmorton/ I agree!
Botchway/ Okay.
Hayek/ You want to look into that, as an initial matter?
Markus/ I think it's something probably on our side of the fence, but we'll consult with Legal to
get that information. We'll work through the Police Department, as to what we
experience, what we're seeing on the street, um...
Botchway/ That can (both talking)
Markus/ ...what other departments are doing.
Botchway/ (mumbled) contact information of the person that brought it up, because I mean she
was doing a large kind of expose about the situation, as well as I think the, urn ... Women's
Resource Action Center has a lot of knowledge in regards to this, as well, and has talked
about this and RVAP as well, and so there's some ... there's some pretty big groups
involved.
Markus/ Any contacts or resources, just email 'em to me.
Botchway/ Okay!
Markus/ We'll come back with some report (several talking)
Council Time / Meeting Schedule:
Hayek/ Anything else from that October 1St Info Packet? Okay, Council time.
Payne/ (mumbled)
Hayek/ Which? (both talking) Yeah, it's the second half of that bullet point.
Payne/ Okay!
Throgmorton/ Matt, I ... I want to praise John Kenyon and others involved in the Book Festival,
which I think went beautifully, but especially when ... what especially beautiful were the
presentations by Robert Reich, uh, and Brian Stevenson. They were phenomenal, and
Reich was so good and he got trumped, he got topped by Stevenson! It was just really
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impressive, and it was done here and it was organized by the ... by the City of Literature,
John Kenyon, and the ... and the Book Festival people.
Dobyns/ It was a very impressive weekend for those opportunities.
Markus/ Susan and, uh, Craig brought, uh, copies of the book, uh..."Just Mercy" (several talking)
by Brian Stevenson, and I had the chance to read it as ... as did a number of other staffers.
It's really an impressive book and I think (several talking) in the context of what's going
on in the country right now, it's really important, I think, for all of you to read it as
(mumbled) to really get ... get the context of what we're dealing with in terms of how be...
people view our justice system, so...
Throgmorton/ Absolutely!
Markus/ I think it's ... it's, um ... I think it's things that we know, but when you read that book, in
the context of all of it put together, and how the justice system works, and I don't mean,
you know, the police department, although it certainly, the police departments in certain
parts of the community certainly had an impact on the justice center, but ... I ... it's really an
impressive read and it's ... it's really worth the time for everybody to read that.
Mims/ Yeah, I ... I haven't finished it; I've read most of it, but I think one of the most interesting,
um, there's a lot of...there's a lot of frustrating and disheartening things in that book.
There's... there's no question about it, urn ... but his presentation on Sunday, he talked about
being in a court room, not very far from here, in the state of Iowa, and a lot of the stuff he
talked about on Sunday actually was from the book. It was similar kinds of events, and
I'm not ... and maybe this is in the end of the book where I haven't gotten to, but ... urn ... he
was in the court and nobody else was in there and he was sitting at the defense table and
the ... I guess prosecutor had come in and was sitting down and the judge came in,
and ... said I don't allow defendants to be, you know, in my court room without their
attorney. And he said, oh excuse me, I didn't introduce myself. I'm Brian Stevenson. I
am the attorney for the defense. And the judge just kind of (laughs) did not expect to see
a black lawyer sitting there at the defense table, assumed he was the defendant and...
Markus/ That's a passage in the book, as well.
Mims/ Is it? I, okay, like I said I haven't finished and so ... um...
Dickens/ Right when you walk into Prairie Lights it's sitting there, so you don't have to look for
it very hard (several talking)
Mims/ I've got the book that Susan Craig brought. I just haven't finished reading (several
talking) but um ... you know it's just ... another example of that kind of bias that ... is so
incredibly invasive.
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Dobyns/ ...unbelievable stories, but I think the (mumbled) between Reich's presentation on
Saturday night and uh, Stevenson's on Sunday was the misuse and misunderstanding of
power, um, but I was pretty touched by how those both (mumbled)
Botchway/ (mumbled) say that I unfortunately missed both presentations, cause I was availing
myself of the other opportunities in Iowa City, and so um (laughter and several talking)
um, kudos (several talking) Iowa City in general. I mean I think Geoff actually
(mumbled) my tweet, so I appreciate that. I always pay attention! I appreciate it! Um,
but uh, we ... we do a lot. I mean there's a lot of activities. Actually I'm .... I think I'm
leaving this weekend or next weekend for a conference, and like Matt I'm missing things
and I want to get back for the weekend cause there's a Iowa, uh, black and red fashion
thing that's coming up the 17th, and I mean there's just literally stuff that I forget that I've
tweeted out that there's stuff to do and .... I don't know how else to ... tweet it out! (laughs)
Mims/ Lot of stuff going on in this city!
Botchway/ Anyway (several talking and laughing) It's a lot of good stuff to do and
so ... appreciate all the work that's going on (several talking)
Markus/ ...bring up (both talking)
Hayek/ Yeah!
Markus/ ....if you go to your late additions in terms of what was handed out, um, Item 4d(18),
the three-month lease for ICAD...
Hayek/ Yeah!
Markus/ ...on there. I want you to understand kind of the context that this was brought about.
Um ... a, uh.... community member, let me say that way, um, raised the issue of a conflict
of interest that I might have, uh, regarding my role with ICAD and as the City Manager,
and leases like this typically I can sign off on. So in discussing this issue with Eleanor, it
was our decision that we would place this on the agenda so that the Council was
approving this, uh, rather than myself. So, that's why that appears on there. Um, clearly,
uh, I ... I serve on their board. I'm the City Manager. Um, in part very early on we had
Geoff, uh, handle this issue because... because of the perception that there could be
perceived a conflict with me ... han ... handling the negotiation for the lease, so that's why
this is on there, so that you're voting on it, not just myself signing off on it. Okay?
Dilkes/ And I ... the same community member has suggested that Terry has a conflict as well
cause he serves on the ICAD board. I ... I don't believe that to be the case and so I ... told
Terry that I think (several talking)
Hayek/ ...for that. Uh, meeting schedule.
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Payne/ Um, unfortunately ... I don't know if I'm going to make it to the ... um, joint meeting on
October 19th. I have to be in Des Moines that day, and my meeting doesn't get over till
4:00, so it might be hard to be back here by 4:30 (several talking) So, unless my meeting
gets over early ... I will not be there.
Dobyns/ I'll be a little late myself, so...
Botchway/ I'll be late as well. I've got a meeting at the building, actually, but (mumbled)
(several talking)
Dobyns/ So parking won't be a problem (several talking and laughing)
Hayek/ All right!
Dobyns/ You can just tweet out and (both talking)
Botchway/ Can't tweet at work!
Pending Work Session Topics RP # 6 Info Packet of 10/11:
Hayek/ Pending work session topics.
Throgmorton/ Uh, I'd like to suggest a ... a new topic which actually came up I think in our
previous meeting but ... uh, Eleanor rightly reminded me it'd be better to get support for it,
so um, I ... I'd like to see if there's support for discussing amending the City's annexation
policy to state that any new residential annexation should be required as a ... as a condition
of annexation to ... I can't ... to contain a specified minimum percentage of housing units
that are affordable to households at or below, I don't know, 80% of area median income.
Something like that.
Payne/ I'm not ready to go that far yet. I think that we need more ... if we do that, I'm afraid we're
going to thwart... development. So we need to figure out if we need to provide some
incentives to do that, or something like that, so I don't (both talking)
Mims/ ...willing to have the discussion, that's what he's (several talking)
Throgmorton/ Yeah, so ... so, and I ... I'm not saying put it at the top of the list (several talking) and
I'm not saying there aren't ways to do this. Yeah.
Payne/ So I agree with you that we need to talk about it, but not necessarily in-depth as what
you're ... what you just said.
Dickens/ That seemed to be really specific (several talking) whether it should ... it's going to be
inclusionary zoning, basically, isn't it? We should have some (several talking)
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Throgmorton/ My proposal is to amend the annexation policy, which currently says three
conditions have to be met, and I'm saying there ought to be another condition, and that
other condition is that it include affordability, and I suggested a particular language for
that. That's the topic I'm hoping we will discuss.
Payne/ I agree that we should talk about it and figure it out but ... I ... I would like it to be pretty
generalized how we talk about it.
Botchway/ I would agree as well. Not you, but with you! (laughter) I mean I would agree
but ... sorry! I would agree but, you know what I mean.
Dilkes/ All we need right now is (several talking and laughing)
Hayek/ All right! (several talking)
Neal/ Speaking of housing, I'm wondering when we're going to review the University of Iowa
enrollment and the impact it will have on housing and potentially rent.
Hayek/ Yeah.
Botchway/ The largest class this last year (several talking)
Fruin/ We don't' have it scheduled but if...um... you all would like, we can try to put that on the
next agenda. Obviously it's going to depend on the University's, um, availability,
but ... we can try. (several responding)
Throgmorton/ ...get a handle on it myself, to the extent that it's possible to get a handle on it.
Botchway/ The other, um (several talking) Oh, go ahead!
Markus/ ...same conversation for a second. I think the University would like to have, uh, a joint
undertaking of a study, um ... have to tell you I think that is a responsibility of the
University, not necessarily of the City, in terms of the study of their future enrollment
and predictions associated with that. They have the ability to require, uh, students to
participate or live in their facilities, and I think their proposal really went around what
impact it would have on these ... private facilities that are being built, off campus
(mumbled) (clears throat) I just ... when I start to look at the economic equation of what
their funding is versus ours, I think quite frankly, and this conversation may come up
when University officials come to have this conversation with you, I want you to
understand that ... I have said that I think that is their responsibility for the payment of that,
so ... when that conversation comes, understand that. And we'll have more discussion at
that point.
Dobyns/ (mumbled) did you have any chance to discuss this at the UISG, the same request?
Neal/ We haven't yet, but um, I can bring it up and...
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Dobyns/ I assume Vice President Rockland attends some of those meetings, or a member of his
office? I'm just ... I just think a parallel petition, based on what Tom just said.
Neal/ Okay.
Dobyns/ ...sounds very relevant to ask them.
Neal/ Great! Yeah, we can work on that for the next meeting.
Hayek/ (mumbled) question. We'll get that scheduled. Okay.
Botchway/ Last but not least, because we discussed ... I know we're almost...
Hayek/ Crank it up!
Botchway/ ...is the bus shelters and benches. Can we have some type of conversation or some
type of report or memo, whatever the case may be, um, about bus shelters and benches. I
was at the, uh...
Payne/ Forum!
Botchway/ ...forum and it was brought up by, um...
Payne/ Mary.
Mims/ Mary.
Botchway/ ...(several talking) Thank you!
Mims/ You're not that old yet! (laughter)
Botchway/ Urn ... and uh (several talking and laughing)
Markus/ Kingsley, you mean above and beyond Chris' response?
Botchway/ I didn't see a response.
Markus/ I think Chris responded...
Payne/ A couple weeks ago.
Markus/ Every one of these suggestions...
Botchway/ Oh, let me go back...
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Markus/ ...and they were, I think, every one was (mumbled) but there is an explanation of that.
Botchway/ Okay! I'll go back.
Markus/ So after you've looked at that, let us know if you think you want additional information.
Botchway/ Okay.
Upcoming Community Events / Council Invitations:
Hayek/ Let's finish this up. Any upcoming events or invites we need to touch upon quickly.
Botchway/ My birthday passed and none of you were there.
Hayek/ It's all about you, Kingsley! (laughter) Um ... all right. (mumbled) work session. See
you in 18 minutes!
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