HomeMy WebLinkAbout2018-10-23 Transcription Page 1
Council Present: Cole, Mims, Salih, Taylor, Teague, Thomas,Throgmorton
Staff Present: Fruin, Andrew, Mikes, Fruehling, Hightshoe, Russett, Bristow
Downtown Historic Survey Presentation:
Throgmorton/All right, now we're gonna shift to our work session for....Tuesday, October the
23`d, 2018. We have one topic to discuss, which is the downtown historic survey
presentation by Alexa, our very fine consultant, and Ann.
Russett/Yeah, good morning, Mayor and Council (both talking)
Throgmorton/ So, uh, I wanna say, uh, our main purpose here is to hear from Alexa and....and
Ann, uh, and other staff members about what con...is contained in the report that Alexa
put together; to ask all sorts of questions, whatever comes to mind about that report; and
to have some discussion about it, but we're not gonna make a vote. Uh, we're....we're
just gonna try to move this project along. All right? So that's the main purpose. So...
Ann?
Russett/Okay. Good morning, uh, Ann Russett with Neighborhood and Development Services.
Um, as the Mayor mentioned, Alexa McDowell is here this morning to give you a
presentation on the update that she did to the 2001 Downtown Historic Survey. The City
has been working with Alexa for the past 15 months and she's finalized the survey and is
here to present her findings and recommendations, and Alexa did present this same
presentation in a public meeting last night at the Old Capitol and we had about 45 people
in attendance. So we were able to get some feedback and comments, um, at that meeting
as well. So with that I'll turn it over to Alexa.
Throgmorton/Good morning, Alexa. It's nice to see you.
McDowell/ Good morning! So glad to be here! Urn, we're just gonna walk through this
and...and I wanna spend as much time as we need to providing the background so we
understand, um, the intent of the process and the findings that resulted from it. Uh....so
we started by, urn, reviewing....the presentation will go through, uh,the review of the
project, some discussion about what the National Register is and isn't, urn, a discussion
about landmark....local landmark status, and a summary of the findings and
recommendations, and of course all of these pieces....are included in the written report
that's been submitted to, urn, to the....Neighborhood Development. I always use the....I
always go back to the Planning Department and I can never get it straight in my head. So
I apologize for that. Um (clears throat) the project started, um, with community
engagement,um, last fall, and um, we have over the course of the project we've had
multiple, urn, opportunities to engage the public. Last September we started with a
presentation at the Englert Theater,um, and we had I would say 60 to 75 people there.
Um, that November then we had a meeting with the,um, local businessmen, urn, and
property owners as a way to kind of address specific issues from, urn,to their....specific
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to their positions. Urn, then of course we had our meeting last night and then during the
course of that period I had a chance to talk to about 15 different people,representative of
a variety of, urn,perspectives -historic preservationists, City Councilpeople, urn, I talked
to some downtown, urn,business owners. I talked to,urn, a contact person at the
University. So we had a nice variety of perspectives to,urn, kind of inform my thinking
as I walked through this process,because obviously Iowa City as a university town, it is
more complicated than many other communities and it was important for me to have
those perspectives. It was important for me personally, but it was also important from the
perspective of the City because they wanted to make sure that I understood,urn, or had at
least a sense of the different issues that were at play. So....the project began as a...
essentially an update of the survey and evaluation project that was completed in 2001.
Um, I think there are a couple important things to keep in mind about that, and that is
over the course of 15 years, a lot of things have changed, and not just the composition of
the downtown, but also, urn, as historic preservationists and, um, people who are
interested in keeping our communities vital, how we approach those things—there's
many factors that have changed. The filters about understanding historic preservation and
its value in maintaining a vital community have evolved as those...as those issues have
evolved, and so, um, in many ways my perspective was different than Marlys Svendsen
who created that initial survey and evaluation, and....and not in any way to denigrate the
work she did because if you've looked in any historic preservation documents in this
community, her hand is on everything, urn, and she, urn, really created a foundation for
our understanding of the historic,um, context and resources that are in this community.
Urn, but....time passes and our understanding of things changes. So I want you to
understand that the filters changed a little bit. So the....the, um,the....the basic
components of the project were to review what she...the documents she had created,
which is called a Multiple Property document. That's an official document that is used
by the State Historic Preservation Office and the National Parks Service to identify, urn,
historic resources and to create a system of evaluating those resources. So it's a
standardization of evaluating historic significance, okay? For the purpose of National
Register nomination. Urn, the other thing is that she looked at a defined survey area and
examined the buildings within that survey area, and on the image that you have in front
of you,the....the,urn, map where you see the hatched outline in white, that was the
survey area that Marlys examined. When, um, the project was,uh, resurrected last year,
the survey area was, uh, downsized. So we had a nine-block survey area that is
illustrated there in the highlighted area. So that area is bound by Iowa Avenue on the....
on the north, Gilbert on the east, Burlington on the south, and Clinton on the west. So,
nine....square blocks. Uh, the reason that the area was, um, diminished was because,
primarily because of loss of historic fabric in the....those outlying areas. I talked through
this. This is, uh,just an overview of the community engagement. So the Multiple
Property document, as I stated, urn, Marlys created a context, and context is about what
was going on in history at the time, um, these buildings, which are the physical
representation of history, right, how those were constructed and what does that have to do
with being significant or important. So she created basically a historical,um, background
of the establishment of Iowa City and its growth over time, and then she laid into that the
physical representations of specific eras being the buildings, and she talked about how
those changes, why they changed, you know, things like national....natural disaster, um,
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establishment of the, urn, State Capitol here, loss of the State Capitol here, establishment
of the University,urn, growth of population, changes in,urn, who was doing business
here and how that impacted what the downtown looked like and how it functioned for the
community. That's what the historic context was about. It was a big piece of the
Multiple Property document. The other thing is is that she outlined the standards. So if
we're looking at a building in the downtown,how do we decide whether it in and of itself
is significant to the level that would establish it as being something that's eligible for the
National Register. And she created an outline that said we look at this,we look at this,
we look at this, and I'll talk more specifically about that when I have an example to have
in front of you,but that was an important part of the document and is part of,urn, what
was updated this time around. So my, uh, responsibility was to review her work, to
update it, and to do that, I,um....I do wanna say that that...that there's a significant
amount of the language that is Marlys' language and you need to understand that I did not
erase that work because it was already done and it was well done. So,my job was to
update any references that have changed. So if there was a photograph of a building that
she inserted there, I'd put a refreshed photograph in it. If there was a change in, urn,the
description of that building, I changed the description. (clears throat) so I updated the
language. I, uh, I addressed, urn(clears throat)the numbers of building counts. So she
referred to there are X number of buildings in the survey area from this period. If that
number had changed, I updated that number. I also inserted,um, a number of supporting
documents, like historic photographs for reference so we have some comparison to the
current condition relative to the historical condition. I added Sanborn maps, anything
else that I felt would,urn, would flush that story out. Um (clears throat) and then the
other thing that I did was I expanded the historical context to include the period from
1960 to 1985, which represents the urban renewal period,um, across the nation,but in
Iowa City specifically. Um, I reference here that I did include Marlys', um, intact
Multiple Property document as an appendix of the,uh, current report project. Project
report rather. So, since the survey was completed in 2001, there are 15 buildings that
have been razed, in the existing survey area, not...that does not include that....the area
outside the boundary that was included in the previous survey area. Urn, there were 13
new buildings constructed and that's important to point out because what it does is it
starts to shift the balance of, um, proportion of new buildings to historic buildings, and
when that balance shifts, you don't have a historic downtown any more, you have a
contemporary downtown. Um,we also lost one National Register listed building,um, the
Van Patten House, as you know, was razed after a fire that da...damaged it significantly,
and one,um, independent resource or individually listed resource was added to the
National Register and that's the Iowa State Bank and Trust or Johnson County Savings
Bank,which was also historically rehabilitated beautiful building. Um, one of the things
Mar...Marlys did that I thought was interesting is that she counted the number of
buildings that remain in the downtown by era to give us kind of a sense of how long that
built history is. And....in the 2001 survey, for that, uh, two-decade period of 1860 to
1880, there were 24 buildings built in that era and there remain 24 buildings constructed
during that timeframe. From 1880 to 1900 there were 20, and now we only have 13, and
this note here indicates that....that sometimes an apples-to-apples comparison was
difficult because of the language that she used and the fact that the....that the survey area
had changed. Um, but to clarify in....in the current survey area today,47 of 115
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buildings were constructed during the period of 1880 to 1900. From 1900 to 1920,20
buildings remain in the survey area, or did in 20 and now we haye 19. From 20 to 40,
there were 12, now we have seven. Um, from 1940 to 60, there were seven buildings and
now we have three that representative of that construction period, and from 1960 to 1985,
Marlys didn't count those,but today we have 14 resources representative of that
construction era. The thing that I want to point out is that it's important to understand
that we have buildings that are very old. Um, and we have a number of buildings that
were constructed,urn, during,uh,prior to 1900,but I think you need to understand that
the date of construction is not representative of what the buildings look like. So here we
have the Airliner,which everybody knows and has been world famous for many decades
now. Urn,but there is a building that was constructed prior to 1900,but it has...for a very
long time, not looked like a building that was constructed pri....prior to 1900. In 1950 it
got a brand new facade and that's it. And so....the, I did not separate the...the buildings
that still look like they're built in 1980 from those that have been changed to give you a
number,but this is more commonly,uh, what we're finding. So we have a building that
was constructed early,but it's not representative of the character. So my point is is that if
half our buildings were constructed bet....before 1900,the visual character of the
downtown is not that half of the buildings were constructed before 1900. I do want you
to see some of the buildings that represent those eras however. The Franklin Printing
building is a National Register listed resource. It's the building here on the left with the,
um, pink storefront, and it's, uh, partner adjacent to it was constructed within a couple
years after it. These are both early,um,two of the earliest buildings in the downtown,
and certainly the ones,uh,that....that are most indicative of that visual character. These
are the three,um, Italianate-era buildings. They represent the largest intact block of
Italianate-era, Italianate-style buildings retained in the downtown. The Stillwell building
is on the left and then the two other large bays are actually a remnant of a larger building
that was called the IXL Block,um, and so those are..now function,urn, autonomously but
they were part of a larger unit. From 1920, the Englert is a very solid and important
representation of that construction era in terms of its style and it's a National Register
listed building. Uh,the Kresge building, which is adjacent to the....the, um....six-story
Hotel Jefferson and the Younkers building there next to each other, those were
constructed in that period between 1920 and 1940. Um,they're important because they
represent a....a shift in commercial, retail practices. So the rise of the department store
and the five-and-dime,which is very indicative of this period in time across the country.
This building, which everyone knows,urn, as Gabe's,was constructed in the 1950s as the
Eldon Miller Company and it was a trucking company. And this is the Meacham Travel,
uh, Service building, which was constructed by the Meachams, so they were responsible
for this. It was designed, um, during....it was constructed during the urban renewal era
and it was designed to accommodate two additional stories which were never
constructed. Urn, there have been some alterations of the, um,the window glazing for
the storefronts,but otherwise it looks like its historic photograph. So,urban renewal.
Um, I'll tell you that in the conversations that I've had with people,urban renewal
remains a painful episode in Iowa City to lots of people. Urn, for those, urn, who...who
haven't studied the history of urban renewal, um,you know, it was a period,um,with a
....a motivation that was sound. You know,there were a lot of communities all over the
country with,um,neighborhoods that were severely deteriorated and old buildings that,
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um, communities didn't know what to do about, and this idea about removing them and
building something new caught on and large swaths of buildings in communities of many
different sizes....I live in Minneapolis now and...and, you know, some of the most
important buildings downtown were demolished as a part of the urban renewal. In Iowa
City, that is also the case. Um,where the Capitol Theater is, the blocks that came down,
there were close to 200 buildings that were demolished to accommodate that. Urn, the...
the positive thing about ur...urban renewal, there is this....this painful piece of it, you
know, a loss, you know, and change and you know, things....that are difficult sometimes.
One of the best things that came out of the urban renewal was the ped mall, and urn, the
...the introduction of a ped mall in communities was a relatively common tool that was
used in urban renewal projects, and a colleague sent me a great study, uh,just yesterday,
and uh,which I'll take a closer look at, but it was completed by Fresno State University
in 2013, and they did a survey of pedestrian malls,urn, that were constructed as part of
the urban renewal,um, programs across the country and they identified 200 pedestrian
malls and of those 89% are gone. They've been returned to a vehicular roadway. So I've
always....felt without the statistics to back it up that Iowa City is unusual in that their
pedestrian mall is very successful space. Remains a very successful space, as....as a way,
as a gathering place, as a support to retail, as a....pedestrian transit, all of those things
remain vital and vibrant in the downtown because the ped mall is a big piece of that. Um,
if you look at the image here, we're on, uh, College Street standing near Wells Fargo
where ICDD is at Clinton, looking to the northeast, and....I apologize, I don't know how
to use my red arrow here, but, um, toward the corner we're looking towards where Plaza
Center One is. So you get a sense of in the 1940s what this space felt like, and....I mean
if you imagine yourself walkin' in the ped mall now, all of these cars, I mean it's a
completely different....it's different in...in the level of activity, it's the (mumbled)
different in the sense of connection to the businesses, it's different in the sense of,
um....um, intimacy, you know, when you're in the ped mall and you're walkin' through
the ped mall and....and there's a tree canopy and the....the restaurants have their, urn,
decks out with the lights on 'em—it's a lovely gathering place. Very different than this
space. This is the, um, standing in front of; um, the hotel, which has recently been
renu...renamed The Graduate,right? Looking due west, and so we have Plaza Center
One on the right and the College block,which is on the National Register of Historic
Places, on the left. This is,uh, taken as the work for constructing the pedestrian mall was
underway. And we're standing in the same position today. Well not today—a few
months ago. I peaked down there yesterday, urn, and lots of changes underway. So...the
pedestrian mall was....was kind of the, it came near the end of the urban renewal work
here in Iowa City, but it was the anchor. It was the thing that tied these....these, uh,
different elements of revitalization together. And it remains a cohec...cohesive, urn,part
of that. Just to....to summarize the issue,uh, urban renewal as a context,urban renewal
was a nationwide,urn,phenomenon, right, and so when we think about historic context in
evaluating resources, um, for significance, we want to see how it fits in the larger picture.
So how does Iowa City and their experience in urban renewal fit within that larger
context, and usually the context are big. So if we're talking about a commercial context,
con....commerce across the country occurred, right, and....and it had,urn,patterns of
growth and change. But the urban renewal as a concentrated, urn, intensely focused
period in time that created enormous change, I can't think of a single event. Civil rights
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perhaps or....or, urn, construction of roadways would be, urn, other equivalents, but
something that made such a....an enormous focal impact that changed the way people
think about things and the way they functioned in their communities. Urn, and of course
it was a defining moment here. It, uh, impacted the character of the downtown. In...in
Iowa City I have identified that the period of,urn, significance for the urban renewal
context begins with...in 1977, which is Things &Things &Things was constructed,
placed in service in December of that year. Things &Things &Things was actually
constructed as the result of a fire, as opposed to some of the other projects that were
pick...hand-picked and said we're gonna build the new building for the Hawkeye
Barbershop, for example. Urn, or Hil...Bill Hill Music was, um,they had identified as...
that as part of the planned urban renewal project, but the building that Things &Things
&Things in, um, had been in for many years,burned, and the timing of the burn resulted
in new construction that happened to be completed before anything else was done and it
was touted as the first successful, urn, product of the urban renewal,urn,program in Iowa
City, which had been under discussion for almost 15 years by then. So that's when the
urban renewal program in terms of its manifestation in the downtown begins here, and it
ends in 1985 with the completion of the Holiday Inn. The next piece of,urn,the project
after the,um,review of the....the, um, the Multiple Property document and the
development of the context was to take a look at the site inventory forms. So, site
inventory forms are a,um....a reporting, um, document that's created by the State
Historic Preservation Office, and the State monitors, um, and re....um, controls, I guess,
um....reports and National Register nominations and evaluations of properties that
happen in Iowa. So, for every building that's reviewed, we fill out this form.....we send
it to the State,the State takes the data and enters it in the computer so that it's a
searchable, um, resource, and for every building that...that was completed during the
2001 survey, Marlys completed a....a site form. So my responsibility was to review all
of those site forms for accuracy, update the photographs, and to complete new site forms
for properties that,um, have been constructed. So even the ones that are new got a site
form and the advantage of the work today, I said that about things having changed in 15
years, when Marlys did those site forms, she was workin' from paper. You know, I had
the extreme advantage that I could go online and search for Sanborn Fire Insurance maps
and newspapers clips and historic images, which are boundless in this community
because of the historians that have done so much work at the....the Public Library and the
State Historic Society, the collections of historic information about this community is
mind blowing. Um, and....and so I had the advantage. So...so what we have now are site
forms that are updated,uh, additional information provided so there's a lot more images
and, urn, in addition to having the site forms that will then go to the State and then be
searchable, then....then all of the support documents that I,urn,that I found. So if I
downloaded and, uh, a....uh, a Sanborn Fire Insurance map to record the history of a
building,there have been then provided to your, urn, the City staff, so that people who are
interested in their buildings, they can come and get information about whatever, urn,
newspaper I downloaded,whatever City directory I downloaded, whatever historic image
I attached to that building, so it's a very, um, now a very deep and useful tool, I think.
And then the other piece of that was,um, to evaluate those buildings today, to see how
much historic integrity—and we'll talk about that a second—is retained, and then decide
whether or not they're, urn, eligible for the National Register of Historic Places, and if so
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how they're categorized, and we'll talk about that too. Historic integrity,the National
Park Service requires when we discuss historic integrity that we deal with all seven of
these, urn, items on the list here. In the downtown basically it came down to is the design
of the historic building, do we recognize it when we look at it and have the materials
changed to a degree that makes it unrecognizable, or makes it, um....some buildings are
reconstructed, so they might look kind of historic but there's nothing about them that's
historic because all of the brick, all of the windows, all of the details are from 20, you
know, 2015, and that's a breach of integrity. So that impacts how we think about them in
terms of their ability to contribute to historic significance. So I evaluated,urn, the, all of
the buildings that were urban renewal era or older than 50 years. Um, the new ones
would not be evaluated for historic integrity. I put this in here because you have a local
historian, Jan Full, who is, um, has, um, is among the most, urn,prolific and, um, skilled
historians,professional historians, in your state, in our state. And she wrote, um, the
Multiple Property listing, which is like an umbrella document that when a person looks
at, um, evaluating downtowns for their eligibility to the National Register, this is the
document that we use, and it's called Iowa's Main Street Commercial Architecture. She
wrote it in 20....in 2002, and....and the gist of this is that....that, um, downtown
commercial buildings are different than say if I evaluated a church or a school or a house,
because of their inherent function as retail, which retail changes and changes and
changes. We have to allow for that reality. So when we evaluate historic integrity of a
commercial building, we....we....we think about the fact that those changes that have
been made are part of the story of a commercial building. Change is inherent, and so
the....the lens that we use is different for a commercial building than other resources. So
this is a good example of, um, evaluating historic character. So the image on the right,
does everybody know this building? Okay. I hoped I picked one that no one would not
know what this building is. When I looked at this, I went, `Ook!' Right? I...and I went
`Ook!' because my eyes don't like that aesthetic. Right? And, um, and....I was
distracted by the sign. So my initial response to this building was 'This cannot be a
contributing building.' Um, it has to have been changed, in a way that impacts its
integrity. And I confess to my own shortsightedness as....as a tool for learning in that
you don't judge a book by its cover, right? It's a simple...well my mom taught me that
how many years ago. Um, once I started reading about the history and found a historic
photograph, what I realized was that this building, which again is a remnant of a larger
building, which was three bays and now it's two bays, was remodeled with a whole new
face-lift in the 1930s. That was a really common thing because people wanted their
buildings not to look like these old Victorian, you know, things with big fancy hoods and
all of that, um....um, applied ornament that is indicative of Victorian, and at this point,
old fashioned. They didn't want it to look that way. They stripped all of that off and
they created this very modem facade. And what I realized by looking past the awning is
that this, um....cubicle form is still in place on the right hand...of, right hand side of the
facade. The recessed entrance, which is very boxy, is still there. The box on the left, a
display window, is still there. The brick facade, flat, no applied ornament, only a change
in the...they call it corbeling around the edge. It creates kind of this frame around the
upper story, is still there. The glass block is still there. The three punched windows, the
bottom one has been altered but the other ones look like they did. So in evaluating a
historic integrity, it's important to find either descriptive, urn,text in a....in a newspaper
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that talks about any changes, or an image,that helps us place it in the context of its time,
both when it was constructed and when it was changed. So,this building,um, is a
contributing resource to the historic district,because it represents a specific period in
time, and helps us understand what was going on at that time in this community. So,the
• National Register of Historic Places, excuse me one sec.....I'll start by saying that we
have two....we have two parallel paths here. There's the National Register of Historic
Places and there's local landmark, and it's important to understand how those things...
relate. Um,but to begin with, they are two separate paths,right? The National Register
really is about,um, a listing by the National Park Service,that's recognized by the State
Historic Preservation Office, that's recognized locally. It's an honorific designation,
which means is it's....it's used as a tool by many com...communities to say 'We
recognize that what we have here is important. We recognize that our buildings say
something about our history and we want people to understand that that's important. We
want people who come to visit our communities to....to, urn, see that we hold up the
things that we think are important, um, and....and invite them to study them,to
understand them.' So having information about the fact that you have historic,National
Register historic resources, is important. People come to communities because they're
interested in history. They stay longer, statistically it's been proven that when people
travel and they go some place, they stay longer at places that have history and that
celebrate their history and have information about their history that's available to
travelers. So folks who would stay for a day to do business, stay for three days to look at
the community,when....when that is, urn, promoted and marketed. So,the National
Register does that. The National Register is a no-strings undertaking. So what that
means is that if it's a building, if it's a bridge, if it's a school, if it's a district, if it's on the
National Register the property owners retain their rights, and the buildings are
unprotected. So from a....from the perspective of a property owner who might be
concerned about maintaining their rights, the National Register does not,um, impede that
position. At the same time,the National Register doesn't provide any protections, so for
individuals,um, or communities that want to protect their historic resources,the National
Register won't do that in and of itself. Urn(clears throat) the National Register does
open up, urn, some possibilities for financial assistance, which let's face it, with historic
buildings,people need, commonly need assistance to be able to rehabilitate the buildings.
Both the State and the federal historic tax credit programs have been phenomenally
successful. State of Iowa has been the leader in the midwest on using state historic tax
credits to revitalize communities. You can look at Davenport, which is....was on the,
urn,has been undergoing a miraculous sort of rehavit...revitalization using historic tax
credits. Fort Dodge has used them. Sioux City has used them. Des Moines has used
them remarkably. Dubuque has used them. Um, there are....three or four....historic tax
credit rehabs in Iowa City. It's astonishing to me! The bank that was just completed is a
remarkable example. The Englert Theater. The glove,uh, the Hawthorne Glove
Factory. Urn,but....but why is that? That's an answer to me....to me,that's a question
to be answered. So, fabulous tool. Urn, and it remains,um.....in a....in an era when tax
credit programs of all kinds are being scrutinized for their viability and their ability to
benefit the economy, one of the ones that survived is the historic tax...historic tax credit.
So,that should tell you that it's,um....that it is successful, it's recognized as being
successful. An important tool—if a building is not on the National Register, it's a tool
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that's not available to them. The, um....the issue about the National Register and
controls is that if a property owner takes federal money in the form of a grant or historic
tax credits,they do have to follow the Secretary's standards and guidelines, and....in my
view, that's a reasonable thing. If you're gonna take money to historically rehabilitate a
building, then you should historically rehabilitate a building. Um, and so that is the case,
you take money, you follow the guidelines. You don't take the money, you don't have
to. Okay? The National Register of Historic Places typically, um, it is the....the, kind of
general guideline is we look at buildings that are 50 years of age or older. Urn, there are
criteria that are used to filter and evaluate whether or not a building is significant.
Usually what we're talking about is criterion A, which is are these...is this building or
buildings associated with a significant, um, era or pattern in history. I pointed out urban
renewal as a logical one, specific to that particular era. Commerce in a downtown is
typically the criterion or the context that's, urn, focused on for commercial buildings for
obvious reasons, and then criterion C really relates to the architecture. So does it
represent a specific era of architectural style, is it representative of an important architect.
Sometimes in buildings that, um, in...in modern buildings, sometimes there'll be some
sort of a change in how a building is constructed that might have been revolutionary at
the time. Those sorts of things that are related to the structure. So in evaluating,uh, all
of the buildings downtown, these are the two criteria that I looked at,with the exception
of the, um,urban renewal period because many of those,most of those resources are not
50 years of age. They....they will be in a couple years, but...so we're close to, uh,that
tipping point. Urn, a case for special consideration would have to be made,which means
that, urn, developing a,uh, systematic comparative analysis to other, um, comparable
communities that underwent,um,historic, um....urban revi...revitalization efforts would
have to be done in order to say 'This is a really special case.' Local landmarks,urn....
because the National Register of Historic Places doesn't have any teeth, it's honorific,
communities like this one have a local landmark ordinance, for the purpose of protecting
their historic resources, and typically a local landmark also has a design and review
component. So, in the case that a buil...uh, there's a,uh, district in the downtown. The
....the district can exist without local landmarks, but there will be no protection for any of
the buildings. So,um, the local landmark, and....and you do this in your residential
districts. So I'm sure you're familiar with it. Urn, but by the use of the local landmark
ordinance, that is the layer, the overlay, that....that would provide the protection to the
resources that are in a district, or individual resources. Okay? Urn, properties can be on
the National Register and not landmarked, as I said, and the....these two things often
happen at the same time, mostly because once the significance is established for the
National Register, um, and we....and we know what boundaries are or what individual
resources are, the local landmark,urn, follows the same criteria for evaluation and so all
of that work is in place. So it's a matter of looking at the best application of the local
landmark ordinance, given the circumstances of the community. Urn, the other....big
difference is that the local landmark evaluates exteriors only. National Register,
individually eligible resources in particular, also consider retention of character on the
interior, um, and the local landmark(mumbled) in review process, also only reviews the
exteriors. So the project report has been submitted. It's been online and there's also a
hard copy of it. Urn, it includes a summary of findings, recommendations, and then an
appendices that includes...everything I could think of that you might use. So....in the
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summary of findings I used a couple visual, um....tables and maps to help you
understand,urn, how these things have been evaluated and how they're designated. So
there's a long table, urn, with some thumbnails in it that....that I'll show you so you can
see what it is. But, urn, each one of the resources in the district have been identified as,
urn, either currently listed on the National Register of Historic Places, considered
individually eligible for a listing on the National Register,key contributing resources
which means that they're considered, um....to....to have....that perhaps their historic
integrity does not allow them to be individually eligible,but because of a local significant
factor,they need to be called out separately, um, or they are called out separately because
their significance is somewhat elevated. Then there are,um....uh, contributing resources
and non-contributing resources. So.....non-contributing resources are those that are not
associated with the urban renewal proj...uh,program and are less than 50 years old. So,
any of the new construction is...are counted as non-contributing automatically. The other
remaining buildings that are counted as non-contributing resources are those that do not
maintain a sense of historic integrity, either because they have been,um, covered up so
that you can't see what's behind 'em, for example on Washington Street we have a
building that has the white metal facade. That....that's a non-contributing resource. Um,
or a building, as I mentioned, that's been rehabbed and it might look like it's old, but it's
new. It's a new face. Um, and there....Bo James is an example of that and then there's
another one,um,right adjacent to that building. So, um, by....by the level of a loss of
integrity,those are non-contributing. This is an example of the resource table so that you
just see what you're looking at. The number on the left is the site form number, so that's
the number that the State Historic Preservation Office uses in their database. Here's a
little thumbnail, urn,the address,the historic name, and urn, I'll just say that everybody
argues about what a historic name is because it can be very complicated about how that's
done. I tried to maintain those....the names that, um,Marlys had landed on when she did
the evaluations in 2001,unless I found that there was a really significant association
that....that would,urn,warrant changing that. Construction date and then there's status
in terms of whether they contribute to a potential historic district or not. So in this case,
these three buildings are contributing resources. They're considered key resources, in
large part because,um, this block of Clinton between, urn, Iowa Avenue on the north and
Washington Street on the south, faces the Pentacrest. It is the anchor on that side. It's
the....it is the streetscape that is the most intact. It's the streetscape that, urn, directly
relates to a national,um, landmark site, the Old Capitol and the Pentacrest, and so the
mere fact that that facade, that that streetscape remains intact, elevates its significance. In
addition to that there are a number of,urn,representations of,uh, evolution of facades
over time, including the Airliner and Ewers,which was a Victorian era building that was
changed in 23.
Throgmorton/Alexa, I hate to interrupt,but can you go back to previous slide. There's one
small question I have.
McDowell Yeah, sure!
Throgmorton/The third item, eligible as a contributing resource. I'm looking at the maps that
you have and....and you don't have anything labeled literally as eligible as contributing
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resource, but what you do have is contributing resource. Is that....does that (both talking)
to the buildings that are eligible as contributing resource(both talking)
McDowell/I don't even know why I said that, eligible as! I could...it should just say
contributing resource. So there's no differentiation there.
Throgmorton/Thank you.
McDowell/Yes. Uh huh. Urn, here is, urn, a map which is, urn, the sur....the entire survey area
and the light gray are all the non-contributing resources and as I noted, the vast majority
of those are non-contributing because they're new. Um, many of those date to just
before, urn, 2001 and then the 15 inter...years that are intervening. Urn, the black
indicates contributing resources. The, urn, course I don't have my....let me put my
glasses on so I can remember for sure. It's so small I can't see it. Royal blue is...are the
National Register listed resources. The,um, yellow is the key contributing, and red are
considered individually eligible. So you can see that there's a concentration of, um,
resources that whatever their static...status designation are they contribute, either as
individually key contributing or contributing resources, urn, to a National Register district
and those, urn, in the...in the upper left hand corner, so that is the block that I just spoke
about,the one to the south of that,running along, uh, Washington and continuing to the
east. So we have some very good concentrations including those around College Street,
urn, and south Dubuque, facing the pedestrian mall, and the pedestrian mall is also
counted as contributing resource. So,the recommendations, uh, that I made, number one,
are to proceed with placing the...a proposed district on the National Register of Historic
Places. That district,urn, is....is indicated here by the green boundary. Urn....some
discussion at the meeting last night, urn, suggested that we look at pushing the boundary,
urn, on east College Street to include the Carnegie Library. So the Carnegie is that red
island in the middle of the non-contributing new construction. And, um....so that would
be something that, um....that....that I would be willing, or.....that you should be willing
(laughs)pardon me, to look at as, urn, the....as this proceeds, to be able to to pull that
out and to include the Carnegie. And the point made last night was a good one. Carnegie
Library, urn, is significant in the fact that it was a part of the.....the philanthropy of
Andrew Carnegie. Um, Carnegie's story is very rich for lots of different reasons, urn,the
good and then the bad,but he was a central person to the development and the
dissemination of knowledge in the early....early 20th century. Urn, in Iowa there were
100 Carnegie libraries that were constructed. I believe that that's the most in any state in
the union. Urn, and so his impact,urn, in funding the construction of public libraries is
just, uh,really critical to the history of, uh, the state and this community. So getting it
listed would be important and sometimes it's easier to include it in a historic district than
it is to undertake an individual National Register nomination. So, the idea of a....of
modifying that. Urn,but as you can see, it includes, urn, most of that area. Urn, it would
also include, as noted,the ped mall,uh, Black Hawk Park,urn, the other idea that was
presented last night is that....that the alleys in Iowa City have a life of their own, urn, and
I overlooked the alleys,but the alleys certainly, um, should be considered. And one of
the points that were made was that, you know, the back doors to lots of the bars and
entertainment places, people use that. They go out the back and there's always a lot more
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life in the alleys in Iowa City,just because of, urn, the....the conditions here, urn, and the
activity here, and so those would also be evaluated and considered. Urn, so here the...
that's the potential boundaries. So....what....what would a process about a National
Register nomination involve? So the....the primary thing would be to, urn, do any
additional refinement of the context that had been developed, in particular the National...
or the urban renewal project, urn, revitaliza...revitalization era would have to be looked at
in a lot more detail, and as I noted there would have to be some comparative analysis
to...to place the...the story in Iowa City against other experiences in communities in Iowa,
and perhaps across the country,um, in order to be really able to elevate that case, in part
because it's a special case for significance. So, urn, additional time would be made to do
that. Urn.....the.....the idea of going back and looking at things like the alleys, whether
or not to change the boundary to include the Carnegie building,urn, any re-evaluation of
resources that were designated as not individually eligible but people think, you know, I
really think that's eligible. There should be time spent to make sure that those nuances
are properly addressed. Urn, there's just the process of photography, uh,refreshing the
photography, creating a form that has all of the maps, all of, you know, all of the stuff
that goes with that, and the writing, and then....it's a formal process. Urn, this is a
process that is established and, urn, dictated by the State Historic Preservation Office that
rev...involves a, urn, an individual preparing a National Register nomination, sending it to
the State Historic Preservation Office. The....the historians there review it. They
provide their comments in a conversation by phone or in person. The person that's
preparing the nomination, um, does those revisions and adds information. They send it
back to the State Historic Preservation Office who may ask for more information,um, or,
um....details or clarity of thought. It's revised again and....and at the point that the State
reviewers say 'This is completed to the degree that we believe that it's, urn, will be
accepted,' then it goes to the State Nomination Review Committee and that is a volunteer
board made up of, urn, architects and archaeolo....archaeologists and historians and, um,
a....a variety of backgrounds. They read it, um, three times a year they meet and, um,
the.....the nomination preparer presents the nomination and they vote. This board votes
that they believe it is eligible for the National Register, or that they don't. If they believe
it is, then it's forwarded to the National Park Service, and the National Park Service
reviews it. So it is a, um, a process, and a very careful process because it's, uh, it's a, and
it's an important, urn, designation and they take that part very seriously.
Cole/And again, the Register provides no protection. It would just be a (mumbled)then for
future funding opportunities for the business, am I understanding that correctly?
McDowell/Yes!
Cole/ Okay, thank you.
McDowell/Um, the next recommendation is to proceed with local landmark designation for the
purpose of providing the....the protections that the National Register does not provide.
Urn, at....at our,uh, meeting last night, there of course was conversation about this, and I
think that the important point that was made, and then I'll reiterate here, is that...that that
process, while it relies on the National Register in terms of the National Register lays the
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groundwork. (mumbled)they create the...that creates the....the document,urn, and
identifies the resources. It's really up to the City, to the City staff, the Historic
Preservation Commission, and the people in the community to....to figure out how to
nuance....the designations to fit the needs of the community. And that's a process, and in
this community I think it's fair to say that that's a....a delicate and important process.
Um, and so....but I think it's a very important process, and to reiterate, if...if there's no
landmark status, you'll have buildings....but there's a National Register,that's an
important piece,but it does not protect the resources. So....I'll just put this back up here
to reiterate the fact that any....any building that is designated as individually eligible or
key contributing, according to the local ordinance it is then eligible for landmark status.
Okay? Um, the....if a National Register district was, um, created that followed these
boundaries, a National....or a local landmark district could follow these boundaries, or it
could be,uh, representative of a smaller area. So it could target an area. So it is not...it is
not a, urn, apples-to-apples. If we do this with the National Register you have to do this
with landmark. It's a lot of give and take in the middle there. Um....I just stated that so I
won't go back to it. So, you know, I think the other thing that, and to me is in many
ways, um....central to this idea, is that if protecting the historic resources of the
downtown is an important thing, it has to be at the front of the conversation. So if a
developer comes to the City and says, you know, I'm interested in doing this,then part of
the conversation, and it involves historic buildings,part of the conversation has to be,
okay, how can we help you rehabilitate a historic building? What...what,um,
information can we ge....get you? What incentives can we provide you,that's gonna
help you make sense of rehabilitating a historic building, as opposed to demolishing a
historic building to make room for a new building. Um, I heard over and over again in
my conversations that people who need.....this needs to be incentivized. And that's not
just about money. It's about support. It's about providing information. Last night
people were confused, and it's overwhelming in all of this information for people who
have never gone through a historic, uh, National Register designation, let alone people
who haven't gone through, um, doing a historic rehabilitation. Um, it's taken me years to
get my mind wrapped around this, so I'm not at all,um, surprised that people would be
overwhelmed by it. So, in my view, it's the City's,um, is in a position to help ease that,
and if...and if the desire is to protect the historic resources of the downtown,the historic
character of the downtown,um, then the tools that are available need to be made
available to the people who are interested in doing that. Urn....and so part of that is, um,
in a....historic rehabilitation is the number one way, um....it's green building. It's the
best way to be ecologically mindful about construction. You know,we can't get around
the fact that when you demolish a building,that stuff goes someplace. Um, it's a loss of
material and in buildings that are,um,have historic,um,materials inside and out, not
only are you putting all of that in a landfill, but you're losing all of that beautiful
material. So, it's on the front end of ecologically minded development. Environmentally
friendly development. And it can be promoted in that way. Um....many people who are
doing historic rehabilitation are thinking about,boy, I'd like to do my building but it's
old and I know that current zoning codes are not gonna let me do this or this or this. Um,
the idea that the, um, international existing building code allows some flexibility in
applying,urn, zoning or, uh, code requirements to historic buildings, that's important for
people to understand. It allows them to be creative in how they adapt their building for
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the....the use that they're interested in. Urn, and....and then exploring, and I know
there's been some work being done, some creative thinking about how to facilitate
rehabilitation or promoting rehabilitation,but continue to push that about,urn, zoning
issues. I know there's some, uh,parking issues, using TIF, you know, all those kinds of
things. That's your bailiwick and you do it well. But those things have to be,um,
accessible to people who are interested. Urn, pursue and promote financial incentives,
historic tax credits—I won't talk any more about that, but they are very useful and, urn,
having information and someone at hand that can explain this to people that are interested
in them is an important, uh, thing for you to offer. And then I think it's really important
to continue with partnerships. Um, locally the Iowa City Downtown District, of course,
is a central,urn,player in this and it's very important to maintain that relationship, and
conversation about how is it that we maintain economic viability among all of the
challenges that retailers and downtown business people have, especially in historic
buildings. How do we make that work, and...and they're in a position to provide
information that...that, urn, others are not. And the Historic Preservation Office is always
an important partner. They, um, they follow,they're the ones that are processing historic
rehabilitations,National Register nominations. They know what the standards are. They
know other examples to provide that will help you,urn,try to make decisions. And the
Iowa Economic Development Authority has now become kind of the central processing,
um, arm of the government that deals with, you know,work....workforce housing,tax
credits,historic tax credits, community development programs—all of those kind of
things, and so they're also a critical source. Uh, you guys know how to access this,uh,
but Jessica has downloaded the report and all the appendices. The site forms are, you
know, like this thick, urn, and so they're all in digital form and you guys have them, but
they're not on...online yet, but people, urn, are aware that they can contact Jessica and,
urn,have access to the site forms. Maybe...is the site forms online? The support
documentation isn't either. So, at any rate, they are accessible. Um....and, you know, I
do want to point out, um,that....that there were....there are always people who are so
important when you come into a community that...I mean I'm very familiar with Iowa
City,but I hadn't worked here, and urn,that make that...your ability to do a job and do it
well,um, you know, it happens because people are willing to help you. Jessica certainly
was critical to that and so was Bob Miklo, uh, before he, as I said last night, fled. I'm
half afraid that I scared him out of here, but um....(laughs) He....he was very,urn,
passionate and helpful through this process. Ginalie Swaim,uh, was the Acting Chair at
the time, she is also retired,urn, as this project closed out,but she was very thoughtful
and helpful in, uh, guiding me through some of the,urn,the....the processes. The....the
local archives here are fabulous, as I said. The....the local, the Public Library is,urn,has
so much stuff available online, and those things are super helpful. Nancy Bird spoke
with me on multiple occasions, and was helpful in pointing out the issues that, from that
perspective, exist and the challenges of supporting the downtown business people in
historic buildings. Um,there....you also have a lot of local professional historians and
also,um....um, people who pick it up as their avocation,just because they love it, and so
there's a plethora of information about the city. Um, and then, you know, I've had a lot
of people who just spoke to me because they were interested. So, thank you and....and
thank the community for their support for this project. I think it's certainly there.
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Throgmorton/ Super great job, Alexa, uh,you've done a fabulous job of putting this report
together and presenting it to us. So we have an opportunity to ask questions about what
is being recommended and about the facts that have been presented and so on.
Cole/I would like to ask why wasn't, urn, Starbucks and The Mill included on the designation?
Those appear to be historic structures right there on Burlington Street.
McDowell/I (clears throat) pardon me (laughs) I need to go look back at Starbuck's because two
people asked me about it last night. My recollection about that building is is that there
was later work done on it, so that the materials of the facade are not old. So it's one of
those buildings that looks like it's old, that's not old, but I'll double check that because
two people asked about that last night, and the reason that the....that The Mill is counted
as a contributing resource. So it is a contributing resource, but it's outside the
boundaries, and the reason that it's outside the boundaries is that...the...the way that that,
um, defining the boundaries of a potential district are undertaken is that in the end when
you make a list of the resources in a district, those that are in the contributing, which
would be the individually eligible, the already listed in the contributing resources, and
non-contributing. There's a tally. And what you can't have is the weight of the non-
contributing be too heavy. And you also can't gerrymander. So I couldn't make the
boundary go down just to pull in The Mill. So The Mill is a contributing resource,but
because Burlington Street is otherwise gone of historic resources, it's like a....a tooth in a
set of missing teeth. Now, pardon me, if I....I will go back and look at Starbuck's, and I
apologize. I had looked at that one probably nine months ago. Um, if...in the case that
the Starbuck's could be counted as a contributing resource, it might make some sense of
pulling in The Mill in the boundary. So again,that's one of those things in the process of
moving forward with the National Register nomination, we'd look at those issues that
people bring up if they have information or a different understanding.
Teague/The Airliner you say is a key, urn, contributor.
McDowell/Yes!
Teague/Um, and....and this, but earlier I heard you say that visually, urn, it doesn't, it's not
indicative of its, um, era because it was built before 1900,um, but in the 19....but it, it
was changed around the 1950 or somethin' like that.
McDowell/Right.
Teague/ So I....I'm just, if you can give some clarification why this is now considered a key
contributor.
McDowell/ Sure! So, it's....it's....when we looked at it, it's not....it's not visually characteristic
of its construction date. It is visually, uh....um, characterized by its alteration date,
which is more than 50 years old. So in and of itself, the change is considered historic.
So,um, it...it's the same scenario was when we looked at the Deadwood. So the
Deadwood does not look like...it was, that building dates to 1876 or something. Um, and
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it was changed in the 30s, and it looks that way now,but the change is now more than,
well more than 50 years. So if the change occurred more than 50 years ago, it is in and of
itself historic. So that's why the Airliner is.
Teague/Thanks!
McDowell/You're welcome!
Thomas/Did you look at, uh, a couple things that, uh, I haven't heard brought into this
conversation would be the, um, the downtown Riverfront Crossings master plan, which,
you know,had a...its focus was on development opportunities,both in the downtown and
Riverfront Crossings.
McDowell/Uh huh.
Thomas/With an eye toward historic preservation and since it's part of our comprehensive plan,
all the factors that might contribute to....how growth in the downtown is envisioned. Did
....did you have an opportunity to look at that plan in terms of is the surveying....is the
survey you generated, um, consistent with....the.....the way the downtown/Riverfront
Crossings master plan envisions future growth in the downtown?
McDowell/Urn, I looked at that months ago and, um, there were inconsistencies between how
they evaluated the buildings in the survey area with the way that I evaluated the buildings
in the survey area. Um, I did not, um, go into any consideration about how anything
south of Burlington and the plans for that area,how they relate to this, um, the work that I
was doing. But certainly there were inconsistencies in how they evaluated, and they
made some recommendations about how,um, new growth should be introduced in the
downtown that I do not support. From a historic preservation perspective.
Russett/I can add to that a little bit. Staff has begun to look at how that downtown/Riverfront
Crossings master plan relates to what Alexa has done. It looks like in that master plan,
they probably took,um, the resources and what would be historic from Marlys' 2001
survey. I'm assuming that's what they did, since they didn't have a historian on staff.
There are some areas, urn,marked for in-fill development on that master plan that are
included as, uh, contributing resources in Alexa's historic district. Specifically a couple
buildings, like the Kresge and, uh, Younkers on Washington Street, and um....in the
master plan, for instance, for those particular buildings, they talk about having some kind
of, I don't know,parking garage in-fill, but maintaining a street and storefront focus, and
there are things that could be done if a local district happened to maybe maintain the
facade of the historic building, add something more tower-like or new to the back of the
building, and still (noise on mic) sorry....the historic district. There are few
inconsistencies,but....very few.
Thomas/Thanks!
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Salih/I just wanna ask you as, um, I don't know, discussion for you for....or(mumbled) for
Council,but as a new Council Member I really would like to know what does it make
different to make more building historic, or to make that district....the...(mumbled)
boundary, like the whole thing(mumbled) I understand you are saying early our
buildings say something about our history.
McDowell/Uh huh.
Salih/But examples the Airline you said is being built long time ago. It has been change, and
when you look at it it doesn't give you look that this is old building. Why...why does it
make difference? I just don't get this.
McDowell/Well, and I...and you're not alone....in not getting it. It's a....to me when I look at,
um.....there, let's see here,there are some places, like Paris, right, okay....so Paris was
demolished and then rebuilt in the 18....what, 1870s, right? So, and since then, there are
areas of Paris there's been very little change. So there's all this uniformity. And that
creates....it's a beautiful space and it all looks alike, and everybody holds it up as a...as a
model. I mean it's an incredible place! In....in the U.S., in small towns, where change
happens....that....(noise on mic) that does not happen. So, our story is about change, in
many ways. It's about how do we adapt the buildings around us to maintain a....a
character, but.....as that happens, if you don't protect the old stuff as it ages, whether it's
frozen in 1870 or it was changed in 1950, it will be obliterated and there will be none of
that. So, urn,the....the part of the story to try to understand and to appreciate is that the
evolution is part of the story. So, going back to the Airliner, so...the Airliner was a
building that had (noises on mic) Victorian stuff on it. Urn, so it had, you know,tall and
narrow windows and big, urn,they called 'em window hoods and big cornice, so it was
very elaborate and decorative, right? And the reason that it was changed was because the
people that owned the Airliner bought that building. They wanted that building to reflect
them, their character. They wanted it to reflect a change in an era, change in thinking.
So....if you look at the building and all you see is a flat building with one window in it,
then you're missing part of the story, which is why does it look the way it does? What
does the way it looked tell me about what was going on in my town at that time? Now,
not everybody's interested in making that intellectual exercise or....or interested in, you
know, I mean that...it's true and there's, that's not a bad thing. It's a fact. But, um, if we
wanna tell the story of the community, then we have to embrace the range of a period of
time, and if we don't protect those, then they'll be gone and all we'll have is....is new
stuff; and I like new stuff. I'm not against new construction. (noises on mic) I'm really
sorry I keep doing that. I have very busy hands! Um, but there is a place for protecting
what tells the story that we've already lived through too.
Throgmorton/(both talking) Could I....could....could I follow up on that in way I think might
help. I...I think you're exactly right in drawing attention to the centrality of urban
renewal, uh, in this,uh, pertaining to this question that we're dealing with. Uh, prior to
World War II,this city just kind of grew very slowly,buildings changed very slowly, it
was a process of evolution.
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McDowell/Uh huh.
Throgmorton/After World War II,there was a piece of federal legislation, uh, enacted in 1949
and amended in 1954 that made urban renewal a big thing, and in city after city all
around the United States, and Europe,ma...for different reasons, major swaths of....of
older neighborhoods in downtowns were obliterated,to use your verb,Alexa,just
completely ob...obliterated and a phrase that was used at the time was 'wipe the slate
clean and make it new.' So that was the idea. There actually was a proposal here in Iowa
City to wipe out the whole core of downtown and replace it with....an enclosed mall.
Surrounded by parking. People here chose not to do that, and it's my understa....I didn't
live here then, but it's my understanding there was a huge battle. (both talking)
McDowell/There was. There was even a booklet that was written about the battle.
Throgmorton/Yeah, and Roberta Linnenkamp still lives here. She helped write that brochure, I
think.
McDowell/Uh huh.
Throgmorton/Uh, and as she tells me she's still doin' work on it. Anyhow,had it not been for
that battle, the downtown would be dramatically different from the way it is now, as an
ensemble of buildings, and spaces! So you're exactly right in drawing attention to the
importance of the ped mall. Instead of having the....the whole downtown wiped out and
replaced with whatever, a mall or whatever, they chose to build a pedestrian mall! And
like you....you said last night, out of the....how.....how(both talking)
McDowell/Two....two hundred....of that study, 89% are gone.
Throgmorton/Yeah, out of 200 other cities that created pedestrian malls, 90% or whatever,uh,
are now gone. So ours and maybe Boulder and maybe Burlington,Vermont,there's just
a few others that remain, because it's so successful. So I think it's really a brilliant stroke
on your part to draw attention to the ped mall as being a contributing resource to the
hysteric.....historic charac...(laughs) Hysteric! (laughter) Historic character of the
downtown. Yeah, so....that's crucial, and then there're individual buildings,that
likewise have changed, but they....they were changed in a way that did not obliterate
their past,but instead sort of,uh, embodied the....the process of change in their
renovation. I think that's true for the Airliner,though I'm not a big fan of its facade, still
it fits into the ensemble on that street. Yeah.
McDowell/You know the other thing (several talking) I'm sorry,the other thing I'll throw out
there is that,um, one of the....the tricks is that whole 20/20, you know, hindsight is...
hindsight gives you a perspective. So at the time that the Airliner was changed, you can
be sure that there were people that were unhappy about it and couldn't figure it out.
When we look back at it historically we see it as part of a piece of the larger story.
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Salih/Okay, that's great. The....the second question is I know that the (mumbled) green
boundary is your recommendation of nomination of historic district, right?
McDowell/Yes.
Salih/Urn,but I see there is gray area where you said is....is non-contributing, right?
McDowell/Right, yes.
Salih/Yeah, and when....when, if the....if this been like really went to the National Register and
become designated as a National....as a historic district, what gonna happen to those gray
areas? Still the people who own those gray areas can change 'em or no or.....
McDowell/The, um, impact to non-contributing resources in terms of controls over them are the
same as the ones that are contributing. The....the, the only reason they're included is
because, you know,the district has to have relatively clearly and....and clean boundaries.
So if you started cuttin' out all of the non-contributing, the boundary would be like this
and it would just be unworkable. So you always have some non-contributing resources in
a historic district. But, the....the impact to them is no different than....than to
contributing resources. But the benefit is not....um, applied to them because they
wouldn't be able to apply for historic tax credits. So the benefit to....there's no benefit
to....to a non-contributing resource,but there's also no controls over a non-contributing
resource.
Salih/But can the owner change the way it look?
McDowell/Yes.
Salih/ Okay.
Cole/I'm curious about, urn, access for the disabled. I think in historic structures, it's my
understanding, that, you know, like you have a, I don't mean to call em out but Micky's
for example, they have a downstairs bathroom and my understanding the reason why they
can do that is that they're grandfathered in, urn, but there are certain triggering points in
terms of the amount of remodeling you do that may then trigger the ADA requirements.
Urn, in terms of that piece, in terms of access for the disabled for the second and third
when someone wants to renovate, are you aware...are there any particular programs that
allow additional tax credits to ensure that if you are doing one of those historic
renovations, um,that that is...that there be additional benefits if you're doing the....the
ADA...or a piece of it?
McDowell/I wouldn't say that there're additional benefits, but in...in the, urn, example that, uh,
National Register listed resource applied for historic State and federal, or State or federal,
one or the other, or both, tax credits, the....expense of adding an elevator or ADA
accessibility would be considered a qualified rehabilitation expense, and so the tax credit
would apply against that as well.
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Cole/Perfect!
McDowell/Urn, the other possibility, which I....I have no experience in, but if...if I was in that
boat or helping someone do that, I would look into see whether or not there were any
programs that would provide additional funding.
Cole/Cause I think that that's a big challenge I think for the Deadwood, from time to time that's
been looked at as there's that beautiful space up above, but I think that the elevator piece
has been (mumbled)time to time so (both talking)
McDowell/I would su....I'm surprised there's not a....a freight elevator in that building. That
could be converted.
Thomas/Do you know if the, urn, international building code has....has any, I know I spoke to
Mark Ginsberg. He owns property on Washington, and he point....he gave me a
wonderful tour of his building. It's a remarkable place, and said, John, you know I've
wanted to put an elevator in but I, you know, it doesn't work to apply the standard,
conventional elevator type.
McDowell/Uh huh.
Thomas/And....and so I checked with some of my sources and didn't get....get anywhere with
that,but, uh, I was...are you familiar with the international building code? Is that
something that might allow a small, basically a smaller elevator....that would
accommodate situations like Mark's?
McDowell/Um, I'm gonna defer that to Jessica, maybe she...and maybe she....she doesn't want
to speak to it,but I am familiar with...with the, um, that the situation with Mark
Ginsberg's building. He attended one of the meetings and we had a little bit of a
discussion about that. Um, and my recommendation to him at that time was that...that
being on the National Register and going through the historic tax credit process is a tool
to help answer some of those questions, because then you're on a path where you're
talkin' to the State Historic Preservation Office, you're talkin' to the National Park
Service, you're presenting the issues that you have, and they will help you, um, with
design solutions, or potential examples. Now I'm not saying that that would have
resolved his issue,but he...he lacked that benefit at the time.
Thomas/Right.
McDowell/So,um, but I don't know if you have (both talking)
Russett/Yeah,the only other thing I would add, it's been a year since I've thought about his
project but I....I thought I remembered that maybe his....the issue with his project was
more related to the State Fire Marshall's requirements more than, um.....things that could
hand...be handled a little bit more easily. So it might have been a larger issue, where
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maybe if he had been, uh, working towards tax credits, that extra assistance of that person
might have helped him in that conversation, but I....I think it was a larger Fire Marshall
issue.
McDowell/And the other, um.....the other thing about....about the existing building code is
change of function also plays into this. So if you go from a retail to a hou....housing,
there are other things at play. So it's one of those...and in any case you have to evaluate a
building for, you know, in....in isolation, to be able to come up with solutions. And
whether there would have been different ones for him, I can't say, but....
Thomas/Right.
Throgmorton/Alexa, in the Q&A last night, after your presentation, someone asked about next
steps. What are the next steps? That....that was the question that was asked. And....it,
there did not seem to be clarity in the response, last night....at the presentation, and I'm
not blaming anybody (laughs) for that. I'm just saying what I think is a fact. So,uh,
instead people said, okay, so the Council's gonna be meeting in a work session this
morning and....and uh.....and then there was still a lack of clarity, but you've been pretty
clear, I think, about your recommendations to us. Maybe you could go back to that one
slide where the....the, you know, the....your set of recommendations. Yeah, right there,
proceed with National Register nomination of proposed district. So....um, like I said
earlier, we're not in a position here today to take a vote or, uh.....make really strong
statements as a Council, uh, but....but I think it's....you're making very clear
'recommendations about how we should proceed, and it....that seems to me, speaking
only as myself here, uh, this indicates that it would be good for the Historic Preservation
Commission to take up your recommendations and to vet them in....in a,to a degree that
they think is appropriate, and then return to us with specific recommendations concerning
.....whether to apply for a National Register nomination and whether to create....initiate
the process of creating an historic landmark district here, uh, local landmark district here.
Uh, is that...would that be consistent with your recommendations?
McDowell/Absolutely!
Throgmorton/Yeah.
McDowell/Yeah.
Throgmorton/Yeah, so uh.....hmmm.....I.....(both talking)
Salih/I still have(both talking) question.
Thomas/Well I would just say that, um....yeah, we're getting back to, I think, what would be the
next steps and....kind of, uh, underlaying that, and from my point....perspective is....is
based on your survey and the sense that we see over time this gradual erosion and....and,
um, diminishment,uh, and reduction in size of the....historic character of the downtown.
And last night, I mean, it....there was, I felt, a real sense of urgency and....you
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were....you're interpretation of what...what those next steps should be, uh,you know,
and you also mentioned today, which you did not mention last night, steps other Iowa
City....cities in the state of Iowa have taken. Urn, you also mentioned the staying power
of historic commercial districts,you know,that they....and that speaks to me of how, you
know, the changes in the commercial district, the nature of commercial districts that we
have now, uh....commercial districts where there's an emphasis on convenience and
there are commercial districts which provide the services but also emphasize the
experience of being in that commercial district and that's where historic districts come
into play. It's a....it's a pleasurable experience. So, without being....taking into account,
and the sense of urgency, you know, I think you know I....I'm very supportive of the
recommendations which are pretty comprehensive. They go beyond the, um....question
of the nomination,both at the local landmark and National Register,but also just as, you
know, as a city and as a community are....putting an emphasis on not only the
preservation but what I see is opening up some of the untapped potential of the
downtown in terms of its alleyways. Uh,we're working on the streets, you know, that's
not part of your survey,but I think improving the streetscapes of the downtown are very
important piece and a reflection of our commitment. Uh, and.....development
opportunities, which I think....haven't received sufficient exploration, you know, the idea
that these deep lots with alley access provide,uh, an opportunity kind of in a way similar
to what we've talked about the missing middle. You know there are ways in which we
can think about development in the downtown that I don't know have been given
sufficient consideration,but I think with coupling it with the,you know, some of these,
the tax incentives and so forth,um,may show....bear fruit as we move forward. So...to
me this has been a wonderful starting point, you know, at the assessment, all the richness
of the history of the six....six eras,you know(laughs) sort of think of it as historic, but
then when you break it down it's like there are these different languages speaking to one
another in an interesting way that embody our living history. So I, you know, and it's
....it's an urgent situation. I....I just, I want to stress that.
Mims/I have a couple questions. I think maybe more for Jessica from staff perspective, and...
and maybe (mumbled) if I'm understanding this correctly, and as you said it's complex,
and if it's not what you do for your livelihood (laughs)um, getting all the nuances
straight. The National Historic District designation,urn, if I'm correct, does nothing
except open up financial opportunities and grant opportunities. It puts no restrictions on
the properties themselves. Is that correct?
McDowell/Correct.
Mims/Okay.
Throgmorton/It's not quite true, given what you just said, because if you give financial
incentives, then(several talking)
Mims/I get that. I get that piece,but just doing the district itself,puts on no restrictions. It
simply opens up those financial (both talking)
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McDowell/ ....it would be honest and comprehensive to say (mumbled) and if you're talking to
your constituency about this, and people who can....who may be potentially concerned
about those, it would be honest....thoroughly honest to say it exactly the way that you
did.
Mims/Okay. If, and this is not necessarily the second step, although it's a little bit vague. You
say proceed with local landmark designation. Okay. If we proceeded with a local
landmark district, then am I correct in understanding that every building in here that....
other than....well.....let me ask the question. What buildings in here, in this district,
would not be subject to review....by Historic Preservation, if they were wanting to make,
uh, changes to the outside of the building?
Bristow/ So the way that would work would depend on what our boundary for our local district
was. If it was the same boundary as the National Register...
Mims/Let's assume that (both talking)
Bristow/Okay, for now we can assume that, then, um....we would also adopt a set of guidelines
for review and we would assume that anything in the district would be in some way
reviewed. Uh, if it's a non-contributing building,just like we do with our residential
areas, there are certain things that they can do that maybe a contributing building would
not be able to do. And that might involve as well demoing new construction. It might,
um....we could, I know that, um, building heights has been something that has been
discussed widely in this city. When we develop our guidelines, we could determine that
we have a height limit or not, and then those things might be reviewed as well. Generally
if you have a local overlay district, anything that's within that space would be subject to
review,with that review conditioned upon what the historic character is,what the status -
contributing, non-contributing, non-historic, you know, what the status was. There'd be
different levels of review.
Mims/ Okay. Third question, am I understanding correctly that we could....either with or
without the National Register district, we could....proceed with local landmark
designations of individual properties, within this area.
Bristow/Yes we could.
Mims/I'm....I'm not adverse necessarily to...to having like the Historic Preservation work on
the....the National Registry, urn, I...I wanna get a lot more input from the public. I
wanna get a lot more input....I didn't have the opportunity to go to the,uh, event last
night. I had a conflict. Um, I will say at this point I would certainly have significant,
significant reservations on a local landmark district, um, because of....the significant
restrictions that could put on the majority of properties in that area, and....and it's not
that I don't wanna see them preserved, but I also when I look at that map, and I look at
how much is yellow and red and blue, which are the key contributing, the contributing,
and the individually eligible, if I'm recalling these all correctly, and at the same time we
talk about, did I not get that right, Geoff? (mumbled)
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Fruin/Black is a contributing(both talking)
Mims/Oh I'm sorry, black(several talking) Yeah, so the blue,the black, oh I'm sorry! Actually
the blue,the black....the red and the yellow. It's four colors. Okay? Those four colors.
Urn, and at the same time, we talk about evolution, and....and I realize, you know, from
what you said, Jim, part of that revolution was maybe in the....further back years, and yes
there was the urban renewal and that did some things that impacted this district, and
mostly actually in a very positive way. We're lucky in terms of this particular district.
But when I look at this and look at the high percentage of buildings that are those four
colors, and the idea of putting a local landmark overlay on this, do we....my concern is
we almost stop the evolution and we kind of freeze these buildings in time, and....and
may really signficant....may significantly limit, um, changes in evolution as we go
forward. Again, I'm not ready to make any decisions, and obviously we'd need a
recommendation, but....I just lay that out there because I would need....I need a lot of
input from the community and from the property owners within this district.
They....they've invested a whole lot of money and I think that is something that also has
to be taken into account. At the same time I wanna give 'em all the tools, um, to renovate
and make changes and....and maintain as much of that as we possibly can.
McDowell/(several talking) I was just going to jump in and say, if you don't mind, that...that
the one misconception I wanna make sure that we get out there is...is that in my mind,
um, the goal of the local overlay would not be to freeze a building in time. It would be to
provide some guidance and controls about how those changes are made. So, it doesn't
mean that a building can't be changed. I think the example that Jessica gave of the
Kresge's and the Younker's building, which have been, you know, a point of
considerable discussion. Many people talked to me about those buildings, um, that...that
is a place that's been looked at very hard about redevelopment. So how is it, urn, the...
the overlay in my mind then, uh, insists upon a discussion about what those look like, and
how is it that we modify a historic building to continue that evolution while maintaining
the historic character that's in keeping with the historic character of the downtown. So I
think it's important to...to state that...that an overlay district is not a....a stop, a complete
stoppage of evolution.
Mims/I think....I think it comes to the details of how it's (both talking) and I think....and....and
staff can correct me if I'm wrong on this, but I'll just give you an example of why I think
a lot of people in this town would not necessarily agree with what you're saying in terms
of how that would be applied (both talking) If I am remembering correctly, we had an
application on....siding on a house in a, I believe a historic district, that I believe, if I
recall correctly, was non-conforming, and there was an issue between the type of siding
that could be allowed, and....I think the property owners very much felt that what they
wanted to do actually fit within the timeframe of when the house was built,but it had
since been changed, and....and I don't remember all the details, but there....there
definitely are different perceptions about how restrictive we are being as a city with our
ordinances and with the application of those guidelines that....make I think a lot of
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people very uncomfortable with allowing the City to have that much oversight on their
property.
McDowelU Understood.
Mims/I'll just leave it at that.
Salih/I just get really confusing one things after Susan said, because you know my
understanding, if we proceed on National like Historic registration for this....the....the
district that you outlined by the green boundary, this is....does not put like any, the
guidelines could be completely different when we do a local landmark designation, right?
McDowell/Yes.
Salih/Because we set our guideline.
McDowell/Yes.
Salih/But, uh, for(unable to understand)National Register, we go by their guideline, which is
National Register and does not(unable to understand) and all this kind of....the thing that
you have it over there, but those could be different. When we do the local landmark
designation, as a local here, right, like our guideline could be different, doesn't have to be
the same.
McDowell/Right.
Salih/Okay. That's good. Just clarification, and here the....my question is really, I know there
is many,many apartment building on that district, that if we wanna do it, and I know the
people who live there must tell them they don't care if the....if they're living in historic
building or not,but they care because they(unable to understand)because they are close
to the University, they like to live in a downtown area, and all this kind of things. Urn, if
we proceed with this, what the....is this gonna affect the price, like if we say this is
historic district, the price of renting or anything, is this going to different from now, and
if we change it....because I know like for example for new building, all the new building
come up here the price will be high. But you know that's why I just....if we make
(unable to understand) will be change or....not or.....I don't know.
McDowell/I don't think that there's any, um.....statistics that say the mere fact of designating a
historic district drives up rent prices.
Salih/Okay.
McDowell/I would say that competition is what drives up prices. Um, and so in the case that a
building owner,because it went on the National Register, did a historic rehabilitation, and
they....so then they have an investment, a fmancial investment that they're gonna want to
recoup, then in that case it could result in higher rent prices. I'd also like to point out that
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in many communities, urn, that there are statistics emerging that millennials are looking
for historic buildings to live in, in downtowns. Now there's a lot of conversation about
how viable, urn, or....or, urn.....can't think of the right word, but downtown living is...in
Iowa City because of the lively, uh, evenings, but certainly, urn....new construction is
imitating many loft-style, urn, they're imitating historic buildings. So I do think that in
some ways that can be a marketing tool for downtown housing,but urn, in terms of
puttin' it on the National Register, I don't have any reason to think that's going to trigger
high prices, renovation....
Salih/Uh huh.
McDowell/ ....might.
Salih/Might.
Russett/I would like to add to that because actually if you had a historic building and you did
remodeling, things that you needed to do and it's not on the National Register, you can't
use tax credits, you as an owner take in that cost and then you probably raise your rents.
If you have a historic building in a National Register district and you take advantage of
the tax credits and some of the other exemptions that you can get,that reduces your cost
so then maybe you don't need to add your remodeling cost to your rents. So it might
actually keep rents stable in a remodeled building, uh,but I don't know.
Salih/Sure! Thanks.
Throgmorton/ Seems to me there's no downside whatsoever to pursuing the National Register
designation. The....the boundaries need some vetting and some thought,but I....I just
don't see a downside to proceeding with that. But my guess is that, uh,the....the
Commission, the Historic Preservation Commission, needs some guidance from us
about.....whether they should proceed with doing the kind of vetting that Susan rightly
points to, with regard to the historic landmark designation. Or local landmark
designation. There's a lot that needs to be done on that. A lot of stakeholders need to be
talked to. There....some careful thought need to be put on, into the boundaries of such a
district and so on, uh, but it would seem to me that....we should signal to the
Commission that we want them to proceed with both,but be really cautious with the
historic, with the local landmark part so that the kind of vetting that....that is needed
actually takes place. So, I'm....I'm wonderin' if the rest of you agree or disagree with
that.
Mims/ Is that again the most efficient way to do it, is to do the two at the same time or would
you more naturally do the National first and then approach the local landmark second?
Russett/Our community has tended to do the National Register nomination first because that
nomination can then be the historic document we use to, um, say that our local area is
eligible. They could also be done at the same time. The National Register process is
probably a year-long process. Our local process would involve so many public meetings
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that it would also be lengthy. Urn, I don't know if it would be a....a year long or not or
something. It could be done concurrently. Urn, or consecutively, either one really.
McDowell/If I could jump in, the thing I would....that occurs to me is that because we have, urn,
a solid recommendation about what we think the boundary will be, it may be nuanced.
They have the foundation to start that process, cause I agree. It's....there's a lot of
consideration, a lot of communication, um, that needs to be....to be done. So they
already have in their hand, without the National Register being completed, I think, the
foundation that they need to begin those discussions. That doesn't mean that they're
going to dovetail and end at the same time. Urn, but....but the National Register process
is certainly a full year. So, urn, my money would be on getting that conversation started,
especially since we're at a point now where it's in people's thinking. People are aware
that the process is going on. There is a sense of urgency. I certainly feel that and have
communicated that, um, so I think it's important to strike while the iron is hot, while
people are having these conversations. So, I would recommend that that conversation
starts.
Cole/My sense is too is that I thought at the beginning of this we said that we weren't going to
provide any affirmative direction. We were just going to ask questions. Um...uh, to the
extent that we do want to provide any....I mean I think that we've had a two-hour
presentation. It'd be nice if we could have some more time to give the direction, but
certainly I would agree with you, Jim. There seems to be no downside whatsoever in
terms of the National Register. Since we're talking about buildings I'd sort of like to use
the building concept of phasing, or staging perhaps. It seems like to me the Register is the
foundation of what we want to do, and that's likely going to be the least politically
sensitive. So I'd like to start with that,to provide our foundation, urn, and maybe not
wait till the end of the National Register historic process but in staffs discretion, start the
landmark, the more complicated thing,maybe six moths in or something like that, urn,
but staff would decide, subject to our review and input, urn, cause it seems like to me I...
we've had a nice thoughtful discussion. I think a lot of people confuse this landmark and
registration. We've been able to sit here for two hours and understand all that nuance,
but I'm a really afraid in this historic discussion this landmark piece is gonna....is gonna
drive so much of the controversy that we won't address the simple, I think, pretty much I
think everybody would want, register....National Register nomination,unless they think
somehow in the end it will make it more likely that you would have a landmark process.
So that's what I would like to do to the extend we wanna make register first and then at
some point in the future, subject to staffs assessment of conditions and their own time,
the landmark discussion could begin.
Throgmorton/What do the rest of you think about that?
Salih/I....I also agree with the National Register first, you know, this is...but you know I really
(unable to understand) we here as a Council do not, uh, do what the best for the public
actually, and not....and the best for the public cannot be decide by ask only, uh, without
them being like,uh, a voice on this. My understanding that you have many meetings,
you reach out to lot people that you listed out, which is great,but you know I still
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encourage....I just add my voice to what our Mayor and Susan Mims said, you know,
reach out to more people at the Downtown District. I encourage the Historic Preservation
Commission also to do the same thing and let us really figure this out, come to common
ground where we can (unable to understand) like the...where we, our vision is as a city
and also the people who are owner of this, you know,buildings and historic area and the
Downtown District and everyone, you know, on this. I....I really wanna see those kind
of things being like happening and people start coming to common ground for what we
need to do at the local, uh, you know, landmark designation. But registration, National
Register, I'm for it. Yeah.
Taylor/I agree with that too and....and, uh, Susan's comments about hearing more from the
downtown businesses. I see Nan...Nancy's in the audience here and, uh....we didn't
really hear from....from the business perspective. Yous aid there were about 45 people
there last night. I don't know what percentage of that were from the downtown
businesses, the owners or was it general public? (several talking) Oh, okay. Cause I
think it would be good to hear a little more from....from those owners and those
businesses (mumbled) I mean the basic National Register nomination but as far as, uh,
proceeding with the local landmark designation, it would be good to hear from some of
the businesses.
Mims/I would only say, Pauline, I think we need to hear from 'em on the National designation
as well. I mean I....they, if they don't buy in and understand, it's gonna make any
continued process, I think, even harder and so I....I think they should be involved and
have some input as well.
McDowell/And I'll say that there....that part of the process in order for it to be registered is
that...that we do have to have their approval. Um, you know, if there's a....is it 51, I'm
blankin' on what the percentage is,but...but....but people can lodge their, um, opposition
to being included in the National Register, but we....we do need their support. So
however that's done, urn, you know, I certainly think that people need to be brought in
from the beginning, urn, and I think, Rockne, the....the point that you made about any
opposition to the National Register, I do think that it...it's, once they understand that
there, that it's a no-string thing, the only....the only potential that I see is that they see it
as a wedge that's going to push them into something that they don't want. So I do think
it's important to allay that fear from the front, from the beginning. Um....you know,
because I do think that still lays out there.
Throgmorton/Okay! Uh, I think we've probably covered enough territory for the day. Anybody
else wants to say anything else....okay. Alexa, thank you so much(both talking)
McDowell/Thank you. I appreciate it!
Throgmorton/And....yeah, and staff will have to....we'll have to have some conversations one
way or another.
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council special
work session of October 23, 2018.
Page 29
Fruin/ So we'll take this to the Historic Preservation Commission. The Chairman's in the
audience here. He heard your discussion and....and they'll just go through each of her
recommendations and, uh, eventually report back to you with either a process or their
own thoughts on each one of those items.
Throgmorton/Okay.
This represents only a reasonably accurate transcription of the Iowa City City Council special
work session of October 23, 2018.